Thermaltake Copied Noctua?
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- Опубліковано 4 лют 2021
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Noctua NF-A12x25 PWM: geni.us/qFEyqR
Arctic P12 PWM: geni.us/Xdy5e
Thermaltake Toughfan 12: geni.us/hptSSpL
NZXT Kraken X53: geni.us/XDtJh
What happens when you copy the best PC fan design in the world?
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I mean "take" is written in their name 🤷♂️
They ripped off Lian Li, Corsair, and Caselabs so.
i mean they have manufacturing facilities in China, its expected of them to copy
@@c.m.7692 racist is a strong accusation, just take a look a how china companies copy german etc car designs. I'm stating based on facts thats proven, i have no intention of being racist. And i did not state any race except "China".
@@dgyk9453 You tell em
@@dgyk9453 Wow, can't believe you're geting heat for that comment, LMFAO! It might be the mildest statement I've seen in a while.
Fingers crossed , noctua rushes to release black Noctua A12x25
Don't noctua have a press release about they releasing a fully black cooler or something last month or something
I don't think so, probably Noctua will delay the release until November...because holiday$ 😂😂
Noctua released their road map a while ago. Black a12x25 is scheduled for 2nd quarter.
Probably a Thermaltake employee stole a black Noctua fan from CES 2019. If you watch optimum Tech's video , it's exactly the same !
got 8 pieces in my pc, it would look boring if they were black 😁
In Taiwan, there’s a saying that “buying from TT (thermaltake) will cause you to T.T (resembles a crying emoji)”. Sums up how infamous thermaltake is
their products are great though, their AIO has one of the greatest performance, and their hard tube kit is really good too
@@falsecatalyst3936 im using TT since the past years and hardly recommend their products.
why? well like 75% of their products are shit, so you would have to know the good ones
@@vanqy. that is true, it’s important to see which ones are worth buying, I had a TT iris hatsune miku mouse which the scroll wheel broke off only after 1 year of moderate use
The biggest thing that stands out is the difference in expected lifetime and the warranty. Whereas the Toughfan is only rated to last 40,000 hours, Noctua’s spinner is rated to almost a four-fold of that, and it comes with an impressive six-year warranty. It’s clearly a fan that’s intended to last a few builds.
Yeah Noctua is amazing when it comes to warranty. One of my old P12's (new at the time) had a rattle. It took only a week before I received a brand new fan from Noctua, and as you already mentioned, they have a 6 year no questions asked warranty.
@@vBDKvI almost thought you were talking about arctic fans, but it’s the redux version
@@dagameboy Noctua NF-P12. Old fan :)
@@vBDKv oh damn, didn’t know that existed
@@dagameboy One came with my ancient NH-D14 cooler - I just purchased more back then as intake fans. These days I have 2x NF-A14 PWM as intake and one NF-S12A PWM as exhaust. Works great, can barely hear the fans :)
Maybe Thermaltake can take another page out of Noctua's book and copy their good QC and customer service as well as copying their products.
That won’t happen that’s one of the reason’s their products are cheaper. They don’t care about their customers unlike noctua to they skimp the warranty.
@@SilverDoobie I can confirm their customer service is actually very good
@@rip.tear. Are you talking about Thermaltake or Noctua?
Are you saying you’d rather pay double for essentially the same product?
Noctua's CS got hold of their engineering department to find the operating temp range for the heatpipes in their coolers for me. Doubt a lot of other companies had bothered.
I mean if ur gonna copy someone's homework pick the smartest kid in the class
It's hard to not agree
Well noctua isn't the first and only with that blade design... They just improved it and I bet they still get more quality
@@ismaelyu5 it’s not the same as the gentle typhoon at all, it just had the same amount of blades
@@JAY-wl6qq doesn't matter. There are 3 things you can alter to change a wing, airfoil, angle of attack and sweep to set it basic behavior. Since the motor and size of rotor set some performance figures you are left with not many variables to alter for the wingblades.
It's like blaming a ship engineer to copy the propeller from a similar ship
They have been doing this for about 6 years now
I really like that he puts background information for testing in the top left corner of the screen! so good my friend!
i actually remember commenting on their FB post when they revealed this and said hey if you can't beat em copy them lmao
the admin didn't bother replying but people knew what i was talking about lol
thank you, i can now not have to use brown fans
Thermaltake: can I copy your homework?
Noctua: yeah just change it up a bit so it doesn't look obvious you copied
Thermaltake:
Noctua: already copied from the gentle typhoon anyways
@SmashStomp Inc you gotta understand that noctua is the closest thing too artesanal cooling company as it gets there products need to think and rethink the application in the market and the quality standards they want to achieve, they dont have the money to make big changes or release products with over marketed under delivered, if I buy a noctua fan, I know it will last, simple that.
Literally changing the color of the pen
ThermalFake
Can we copystrike thermal take?
So noctua can be a king of cooling
thermalTake designs from other companies
Thanks to your previous fans comparison video I went for the arctic p12 and p14 for my PC and they works like a charm!!! Thank you!
As we Dutch say: "Better to properly steal something than to design it badly."
_"(Beter goed gejat dan slecht bedacht)"_
Yeah that makes sense. Might as well copy something that's good haha.
Gekoloniseerd
In Germany we say the same thing! „Besser gut geklaut, statt schlecht gebaut“
Considering the fan specs, they´ve stolen the design properly, but made it much worse.
they can make theirs look like noctua, but the frame and the bearing, way beyond their limit
Now watch Noctua release a black color fan in span of weeks after mauling over it for years :)
you might be onto something here
It's scheduled for Q2 2021 atm. But they have also delayed this several times.
I think that's my argument for why someone might buy the TT version, and why it's not as "evil" as it might seem. People want a black fan, and Noctua just seemingly refuses to produce it. So, if they refuse to, and someone else actually wants to produce that, even if the design is basically just a straight copy, that's Noctua's loss.
I think this is literally the only reason why Noctua shouldn't sue the shit out of TT.
already on the roadmap lol
thermaltake doing what they do best
Yeah LL120 and Riing too LOL
thermalfake beeing thermalfake
yeah I really hate them
😂🤣😂
3:25 Yeah, that rattle is a no go for me. That might as well be a AIO pump noise.
I was curious about this! And atlast someone made a video on this ! Nais
Dude, I like your content very much because of short, but very informative content and top notch production value from the visual point of view. But now I like it even more when I see that you are serious about ethics of tech industry as well. Great job, kudos!
Thermal take your design, first caselabs, now this. Oh well, at least it's a clear brand image :P
you forgot the fractal design r5 case look alike tt Suppressor F51
It goes way back. One of their first successful product lines were Chieftec Dragon / Antec SX clones.
Also they stole swiftteks block design for cpus
RIP Caselabs
actually as gamer nexus steve put it thermaltake's issue is they do come up with innovative but flawed ideas rushed to market, someone else takes the idea does it better then by the time thermaltake fixes the issues and release a improved version no one remembers they did it first and get accused of copying.
Did not know these existed. Tks.. I picked up the Artic P12 and 14s for my First ITX build, moving my Back and Blue build into the ITX relm, this move was motivated due to your videos and I thank you for that! Now I am running CTR and getting really good performance but need to manage the fan noise better.. It i really a process with these ITX builds... Oh yah almost forgot, I would go with Thermaltake because of the two positive points performance and price and not, that little bit of noise should not be a big deal.
I saw these fans by pure chance and decided to try them out for my latest build. At least in my case there was no diference in performance between my noctuas and these toughfans. They push lots of air and are whisper quiet. Have them in push/pull set up. Definetly reccomend them for people who cant stomach the noctua color scheme.
Thermaltake has a VERY long history of copying other people's products. It's the reason i refuse to buy anything from TT.
Who cares to be honest, if the products are good I don't care if another company had a similar product first. It's not like Noctua invented the PC fan
Haha these people have never had something intellectual stolen from them. I’m sure they’d have a different opinion if they had an actual monetary interest in a product.
@@froot2912 Depends a bit on why you avoid a brand. If you do it because you believe they currently have bad business practices then I don't see any issue with that. Just buying the cheapest results in reducing production costs at all costs. I'd rather reward a company that put their profit into R&D and actually innovated in a way, which is what Noctua did here. If everyone only buys from brands who copy others homework then there will be no innovation left.
You could argue with "but patents" but that system is half broken anyway, by the time a lawsuit comes to and end it is no longer relevant. I can see for myself that this is a blatant copy and thus I will avoid it.
In the end nearly every brand will do the same bad things, the only thing we can do is vote with our wallets and steer them in the right direction.
@@froot2912 Yeah I guess avoiding a brand is in this case not the right wording. If I need a wall mounted case Id consider buying a core p3/5. It's just that this product doesn't offer anything new. If it were half the price you could argue they innovated in that way, but they're 24 euros vs 27 for a Noctua. All that's left is a different colour but that's just not enough input imo.
They've been doing that since day one, too. It's a shame, because they do make products that are actually unique and innovative alongside those blatant clones.
Thermaltake's entire business model is stealing designs
If it aint broke dont fix it and there is so much u can do to make a diferent design fan and make it perform better like at one point or another if there isnt a breakthough every fan on the market is gonna be the same design
which is better for us consumers. same performance but lower price? hell ya TT i'm buying!
hm so???
I am a consumer ...all I care about is better price to performance ...I have no intention , whatsoever knowing what's copy or not..I just want better performance for little price
@@MegadetH666ksa Dude you have the IQ of a gold fish man. Noctuas only buy them why? For one because they will last 3x as long the fakefans have a 40,000 hr motor and the real noctuas have 150,000 hr motor meaning it will basically last 3x as long as a single fakefan. Also noctua has better customer service than thermalfake. That with any form of common sense will tell you for 3$ more noctua is the way better deal. Plus its Austrian engineering compared to the shitty rip off that fake Taiwanese company gives you.
You forgot the part where TT steals the design, yet somehow makes it shittier.
Ah! The 3:24 motor noise on the Toughfan 12 @ 1000rpm is the exact noise my PS5 Digital fan makes when operating. I knew it wasn't coil whine, but I couldn't term it correctly. Thanks Ali!
They are both just copies of Nidec's Gentle Typhoons.
Nidec is so underrated
Noctua were quite defensive about that in the past, saying their fan is a new design from the ground up. They even mention the Gentle Typhoon in this interview : noctua.at/en/nf-a12x25-interview-lars-stromback
All the Noctua fanboys will turn a blind eye to this... or maybe they are all too young to remember.
@@SteelSkin667 that was a very interesting interview on r&d for an apparently simple product.
@@lucas_vlanc Maybe their fans would be more popular if one could really buy them in store.
I feel like some dude bought a NF A12, scanned it, re-built it in cad and gave it to the TT engineering team.
That's exactly what many companies do when reverse-engineering competitors' products.
@@oscarruorochmolinacansino5907 kinda sad that TT had to copy noctua to make a good product.
Thermaltake have a C&D department instead of an R&D department.
they have R&D.. it's research and duplicate.
In case of Thermaltake R&D stands for Reverse engineering & Disassembly.
nah they have the C&P, copy and paste department
As always thank to you Ali, and we all see you in the next video
personally Noctua has been keeping their prices too high. So I am pleased to see another fan option whether it is a copy-cat or not.
ye they are over priced but thats because they are the best. but ye. nice to see them get a bloody nose.
Arctic fan user here by the way so i have no iron in this fire. but competition is good.
that said. thermal take are a shit company so wouldn't buy anything from them personally.
@@DAGATHire Thermaltake fans are better. The ones in the video are only the standard version... but there's a TURBO version. Also Noctua copied their design first so they're also a copy-cat themselves.
@@dazeen9591 Well that's nonsense mate. You are clearly playing a favorits game.
real tech savvy people don't play favourite kid. we buy based on price to performance and quality.
And we are not idiots about what we buy.
you should watch the video again.
@@DAGATHire Playing favourites? Lmao go look at the statistics! Objective factual statiatics! Thermaltake Turbo fans have 72.69 CFM whilst the Noctua's have 60.1 CFM. They're clearly beat. You're the one here playing favourites by calling Thermaltake a sh*t company you hypocrite.
@@DAGATHire "You should watch the video again" you absolute muppet THE GUY IN THE VIDEO USED THE WRONG THERMALTAKE FANS. He used the standard ones! He's supposed to benchmark the Turbo 14's that achieve 2500rpm!!!
That small difference at 1000rpm is actually what kills these thermaltakes. That rattling is what annoys people way more than anything.
Same annoying rattle as the F12
That’s why I returned Artic P12 fans, the weird resonance or pulsing noise at certain frequencies stood out and annoyed me even though I wasn’t actively listening for it and my computer was under my desk
@@nathanboal same here with the sound, but in my country they weren´t even worth returning, so i destroyed them to make more fan shrouds 🤣
What people dont realize is noctua is i think the only fans on the market with noise cancelers at low rpms.
I have two of these TT fans and mine don't rattle. It honestly sounds like a hair or something touching a blade.
I'm still going to wait for Noctua's
Noctua has been promising it for years, no joke since like 2018 if I recall they demoed it at CES. 2018!!! Where is the fan Noctua?! If you look at their roadmap they haven't done anything all year in 2020, they pushed the entire roadmap to this year, and some of the things on their roadmap aren't even innovating like a redux line cooler is just slapping a redux fan on one of their existing coolers. The ugly truth is that Noctua has not done anything for years because they feel they are at the top and lack any incentive to innovate even the slightest.
@@ronakparikh i mean, completely copying their fan isnt Innovation either
@@PLPlolol1 it's not but noctua deserves this
I ended up getting S12A Chromax instead, for exhaust fans. Haven't seen much benchmarks comparing A12x25 vs S12A for exhaust only. No radiator use I mean, as A12x25 with it's higher static pressure would obviously be better for that. The S12A has better airflow though. Noctua has this comparison chart: noctua.at/en/nf-a12x25-performance-comparison-to-nf-f12-and-nf-s12a
@@PLPlolol1 making it black is “:D”
Great video as always. What's the model of the support you used to hold the mic while recording the noise?
There's some value in the accessories noctua includes with their fans: an extension cable, a splitter cable, and a low noise adapter. Depending of course on your individual needs, that can justify some of the price difference.
I think I would go for the P12... I really like the look and as the performance is very close I prefer to not support a copycat. Also my current Arctic Freezer 33 eSports One CPU cooler does make me slightly biased towards anything Arctic.
Since we are back to fans: Would love to see Arctics P12 Slim vs. Noctuas NF A12x15, especially on radiators.
Nice video. Thanks always interesting stuff you bring on the channel. About fans, have you already tested the EK Vardar. For me I haven’t seen any better even from Noctua especially when it comes to rad
This is what happens when Noctua doesn't respond to the market in time, someone will come along and eat your very well made lunch.
What if they have a new fan ready to launch?
@@grlmgor then they need to fucking release it sometime in the next decade
There's no point defending a trademark color NO ONE wants. at least make the black ones along side the brown ones. Now a noctua RGB fan...... No one would believe it was real.
Agreed. So stubborn about the most horrible color scheme ever created has been beyond stupid.
@@shaolin95 Customers being so entitled that they think their opinions matter ethically than just the the fact that that they sell out their NFA1225 in droves. They don’t need to hurry and worry about their sell throughput. They know the horrid stupid idea of brown fan is going to make them fat profits.
That high pitched squeak at lower RPM is either the fan tips or bearing rubbing. It implies that the TT fan won’t be as durable. Any rub will cause the motor to work harder and the bearing to wear and start wobbling.
It may look the same outside but inside it is probably not as high quality.
I mean, the a12x25 looks pretty similar to the gentle typhoon which has been around for ages at this point. For some reason Noctua though that it was a good idea to basically charge double for that fan here in Oz. If I can get 2 toughfans for 1 nf-a12, that's an easy choice.
Oh that's awesome. I love my noctua fans, but I always welcome competition. I won't be switching out the noctua fans I have now, but it's awesome to know that we are getting more options
Right back to ThermalFake. Would never give the company my money LOL.
@Aum Patel Read.
@Aum Patel All they do is copy the products of other companies.
It's probably legal, but it's not exactly cool
@@DenGuleBalje Noctua NF-A12x25 copied from the NIDEC Gentle Typhoons, nice try buddy
@@ChicaneMedia I love how the more uninformed people tend to be the most confident!
It never was a copy even at first glance you can discern changes. And thing is even if it was a copy how come one design improves on the other when it comes to noctua vs scythe and just a flat drop in perceived quality and overall performance coupled with a higher audio signature when it comes to thermaltake?
And before you start to write your reply take the time to read through this : noctua.at/en/nf-a12x25-interview-lars-stromback
It isn’t perfect but certainly enough tu put your advances to sleep.
@@DenGuleBalje bruh I don’t care if these companies copy each other I don’t hold shares in any of them so I don’t care, the fans delivers comparable performance for cheaper and they are black lol
And I thought about old school Gentle Typhoons when Noctua first came up with NF-A12x25's.
At the end of the day all that matters is price & performance.
This
Nope. I love how the DIY PC community is pro theft.
i love the colour of them now because it's the noctua color. and their badges. omg i love their badges
honestly they just should've made a cream/brown case which focused solely on airflow/noise, no expensive tempered glass nonsense.
@@remy7663 instead of tempered glass it could have a mesh similar to the mesh on the formd t1
A12x25 Chromax Black will be released in Q2, I will wait for that instead of original color
Badges? What badges?
Same here. Went for the brown instead of the black. Its like a feature to me
Would love to see the toughfan 12 vs toughfan 14! Looking at the specs online the 14 has almost double the air flow but it's a bit louder so I would love to see your test for effeciency at a constant noise level. Maybe the bigger fan can move more air at a lower noise level?
what about the Lian Li Unifans? could you do a comparision of them as well? I know they are out of stock everywhere and pretty hard to get.. would be nice though C:
Noctua = Quality. 6 year warranty with unparalleled customer service. No space for copies in my SFF build.
These should last the same
@@MiGujack3 seeing how they rattle out of the box at 1000 rpm I doubt so. I know I wouldn't last anyway.
Thank you for actually showing the difference at 1000rpm. More people need to do this. This rattling would drive me absolutely nuts as I'm specifically trying to remove distracting noises from my PC.
Maybe you should take a look at the Arctic P12 that you praised in the intro again. I bought 13 of those since they were supposed to be "amazing" for the price. However, the high pitched pulsating whine they emit around 900-1100rpm, and the weird grindy motor noise at around 750rpm made me return them.
I mean to be fair they're a $5 fan... they are pretty good for the price and they put the smack down on any other $5 fan. In regards to their Static Pressure and CFM at least they are much better than any other fan at that price. Don't know what you expected when 5 of them costs less than a single noctua...
Take a look at the Cooler Master MasterFan sf120m. It's like a mix between an Eloop fan and an A12. I bought them instead of the A12 and am pretty pleased with the noise levels and performance.
Your thumbnails are aesthetically satisfying!
Will need lian li to do their version together with the unifan connection standard
3:24 that rattling noise would make an OCD person like me break his PC.
True.
Ha, joke's on you! I already broke my PC because of D5 pump resonances at certain rpm. Na-naa-na-na-naaa!!!
In one of your next videos can you test the Noctua NF-F12 PWM Chromax? I've seen tests where it beats the NF-A12x25 PWM as a radiator & case fan.
이분 깔끔하게 필요한 것만 잘 뽑아서 리뷰하시네👍
Maybe you've covered this in another video, but Major Hardware found that a fan called, the "gentle typhoon" had a nearly identical fan design before noctua.
I will wait for Noctua to release their Chromax version of A12x25. Not going to support companies that just copy something and sell it as their own
Agreed, and they do sound a touch better at 1000rpm
@@kristian77ful they aren’t
How do the new tt stack up next to the noctua nf-f12? Going to be purchasing one or the other. Wish I knew what was better on a 360 rad.
Any chance of a review of the c14s in the ncase? Trying to decide before my ncase arrives, running a 3700x and a 3070fe.
I don't think anything will ever convince me to buy a Thermaltake product.
Don't. Lousy internals. Sleeve bearing.
@recycleBinLaden Bruh most products aren’t carbon copies of each other
Some of their cheaper cases are fine, but otherwise you'd be better off buying something else.
@recycleBinLaden I don't buy Thermaltake products because they are low quality, unattractive and generally awful.
@recycleBinLaden Bruh of course products are going to be quite similar to each other, but an exact same copy is something different. Even Chinese phone manufacturers that copy Apple's design philosophy don't copy the iPhone down to every chasis kink, material, and screw. Thermaltake is a new low.
Welp, if you can’t beat them, Join them!
And then beat them in the inside.
If you can't beat them. Try to copy them.
@@swizzler8053 same as noctua copied gentle typhoon
@@riba2233 Correct!
I am curious what you think of the noiseblocker b12-ps, the specs look very promising in my mind
The couple of degrees difference in performance might be caused by the frame design that leave some gaps between the radiator and fan frame edge, so air may escaped and lose some static pressure
That's a real nice grinding sound you pointed out. I'm sure the motors will last just as long in the TT vs the Noctua /s
They're still pretty expensive. Arctic P12 FTW
I'm curious about the 140mm version of this copy-fan (since Noctua has not released a 140mm sterrox fan themselves yet). Have you tested the 140mm version against Arctic and NF-A14?
Cheaper? It cost almost the same in Sweden and i want to know how much extras do they add and how long warranty, extras and warranty are strong with Noctua.
Here's a list of Thermaltakes original designs:
The end
True
Color, microchip, material, blade surface design. All different.
@@sujimayne that's like copy + paste and then changing the font
In the last 10 years for sure.. but I do remember their big typhoon cooler being innovative and one of the best coolers for those really hot pentium 4's when they came out. They also had some pretty cool unique cases 15-20yrs ago.
H17 and H18?
NF-A12x25 black is on Noctua's 2021 roadmap
hm hm i think it was back in 2017 too so.. seeing is believing
theyre like 5 years too late lol
@@Rem_NL truly
Hey, I wanted to ask how the thermaltake toughfan 12 fans are doing I'm considering buying them as well. Greetings from Germany
What is this fan best used for? Like is it good for a radiator or just a standard case fan for intake?
As a designer, I absolutely hate how Thermaltake's designers have no shame when it comes to ripping off other company's products. They're not contributing any good ideas to the market - only stealing ideas that other people have put R&D into, and changing them just enough to avoid being sued. It's actually shameful.
"designers"
I mean they could at least have had the decency to try and disguise the fake. Like a resemblance of integrity. "Yeah, we did a similar thing, but look it's not a copy". Nope, none of that. Why not also call them "Mocktua 25x12A" at this point?
Fuck it who cares lol issa fan. If noctua will lower their prices to compete then I'm for it
@@Thai.H that will make them sell less, to put less money into r&d and eventually stopping the innovation. thats bad for the entire system and its shameful.
@@hughlevantjames905 don't care just want a black fan rn lol
From a design standpoint, I can’t stand that it’s a copy. ThermalTake has done this quite historically. Usually this bites them though because their QC isn’t as good so their products don’t turn out as well in the long run.
On the other hand, if it means more people will buy these in place of the Noctuas, it means more opportunity for me to buy the black Noctuas when they are released.
@@gnestakommunfullmaktige9131 Bruh this isn’t competition, it’s plagiarism. I mean imagine if instead of creating Ryzen, AMD went ahead and just made carbon copies of Intel CPUs. Consumers wouldn’t benefit, and there wouldn’t be innovation either. Plus Thermaltake has had a history of copying other successful products; they’re literally a parasite.
@@gnestakommunfullmaktige9131 But this isn't fair competition. Noctua has invested a lot of money into perfecting the design of their fans. The reason Thermaltake's fans are cheaper is because they didn't need to invest as much money into their research.
Yes, in the short term it's good for consumers that they can buy cheaper fans that are almost as good as genuine noctuas. This isn't good for consumers in the long run. Why would Noctua invest money into designing a new fan? The design is going to get stolen anyway by a company that doesn't need to recoup the design costs and can therefore out-compete noctua in the market.
Designing new, better stuff needs to be profitable.
@@danielhu6485 Copying is still competition, kid. If I can make a product like yours but cheaper it's driving prices down. Also, you cannot steal or own an idea, a thought. But logic and economics are beyond you, clearly.
@@joeyverliesharen
You can spend days polishing a turd, but that doesn't mean anyone will pay you for your time and effort. Not saying Noctua's products are bad, that's quite the opposite, but we're paying for a product, not how much R&D and QA they've spent on it, they can communicate that via price.
Others can make similar products, or identical, with lower prices and drive prices down for consumers. Even if a company decide to completely copy a product from another or reverse-engineer it, they still have to make replica designs, test it and manufacture it, this is especially hard when some things, like exact material used, are not publicly available information.
Copyright laws, IP laws and patents are nothing but government protectionism and cronyism. If the world was ruled with an iron fist about these issues we wouldn't have AMD, we wouldn't have the internet either, we wouldn't have many cult classic movies and video games.
Be thankful TT gets to make a product like this and be thankful they did.
@@sujimayne You can own a design though, that's what a patent is. That's not going to drive prices down, it's simply undercutting and stealing revenue from an established company; it's what monopolies did back in the day to drive smaller companies bankrupt. And I probably know more about economics than you chump.
Did you put it next to your Gentle Typhoon, which is an older product/same design design than the NF-A12
There are only a handful of comments on here pointing out that Noctua ripped off NIDEC (the original NIDEC GTs) in the first place.
Have you compared any of SilverStone offerings to Noctua? I use both, like both but used SilverStone for long time & heatsinks. They’re often overlooked but have amazing fan technology and I believe design their own. I’d like to see more side by side’s. (:
TT doesn't have 3 air-flow grooves on each blade- pretty minor difference.
2°C temp diff-not really sure why?
There's no way to know if that's what caused it lol
This is very legal, yup. No issues here.
How would it not be legal? Do you think Noctua has a patent on fans with a certain number of blades or something? Do you think they can sue for making a product that looks like theirs?
They all look like gentle typhoons anyways. Not even originally a Noctua design.
@@ffwast its a joke detective anal god
@@ffwast Yes, they can.
@@TheHalfGlassFullGuy No lmao they cant
DIdn't TT work on this with the makers of the Gentle Typhoon? Or am I thinking of another fan that's coming out soon?
@optimum-Tech, what plug-in you use to plot graph
Arctic just released their new 120x15mm fans at 1/2 the price of the noctua's
Maybe worth to have a look at them.
Ooh that is worth a look. A12x15 had essentially zero competition.
I think I would stick with noctua
1. because it's "their" product (design, engineering etc)
2. because the 6 year warranty kinda justifies a price hike in my opinion
I think noctua just needs to bring a pc case with their colors to the market and then nobody would complain about the fan color anymore xDD
Yea every Thermaltake product I've ever died fast, like really fast. The biggest point here not mentioned is reliability, that's where Noctua shines.
The fan motors have a difference of 110,000 hrs of runtime. Plus Noctua has better QC and Customer service. 3$ difference in price is justified for noctuas own product vs a cheap knockoff sold near noctuas price. The colors arent bad i like the brown and beige it means i have the best fans out there.
Look up Nidec d1225c it's the original from many years ago
Just 3 months ago I finally replaced my old i7 2600K build that I had since 2011 which runs a giant Noctua HSF combination. That fan has been working for the past 9 years and still works. That desktop is now passed down to my dad who can play F1 2020.That's 9 years & counting of operation in my main rig. When i upgraded 3 months ago I splurged on my mini ITX build to get 4 noctua fans in my NR200P. 2 case, 2 on the NZXT AIO (which default fans are loud AF) Yes it hurt spending around 110 euro's "just" on 4 fans. But i know I will have peace of mind for maximum performance to noise ratio, and longevity. Also love the anti-vibration mounting options that come with the Noctua fans.
@@NL0Gwenster Thank you for having a brain man like if youre spending hundreds or thousands already whats a hundred for fans if you have a job. Its like you wont have to replace these fans for over a decade but people just dont think anymore they want cheap trash that they can easily throwaway and buy cheap again if it breaks. There is a reason noctua hasn’t changed the prices because they know they are the best so why should they and i mean they are sorta a good deal when you think about everything in general plus there life expectancy.
can you test the cooler master SF120M too? its similar on paper and at least its original
Could you do a review of the Turbo model of this that goes to 2500rpm? Looks to have some insane specs but I cant find any reviews of it.
Lol, classic thermaltake. Remember the case thing in 2015?
Also one last thing here the iconic noctua color scheme is amazing
Haha, my case is full of them and while I wasn’t a fan (boom boom) of the colour scheme initially, I bought them for their performance over aesthetics but I have to admit they’ve grown on me.
I was in need of a high speed 140mm fan and bought the Noctua industrial 2000rpm fan which is black and it actually looks boring with all the regular Noctua’s in the case, might actually replace it if Noctua ever bring out a 140mm version of the NF-A12x25
Have you tested the Cougar orange 120mm fans (CF-V12HP)?
The arctic fan version of the one you mention with ball bearings is the one that I'd like to see tested. In my experience fans don't last being mounted horizontally (top and bottom of case) and the traditional fan with an oiled bush for me at least, seem to last only a year or so before becoming quite loud in operation due to vibration. Corsair maglev fans seem to be the only other mainstream fan with a different bearing design and are ok so far but are loud af at reasonable to high rpm.
For horizontal fans use a Gentle Typhoon.
It would be interesting to see review on Toughfan 14 and try to understand why Noctua didn't choose to enlarge A12x25 and call it a day.
Well they are making a new nf-a14. The a12x25 is the new nf-f12. They must have a reason to why the f12 and a14 are different designs
Noctua said early on they could do exactly that, but the performance didn't scale with the larger diameter - I think they weren't satisfied with static pressure performance.
@@waffle911 Noctua also suggested use NF-A12x25+140mm adapter instead. Like to see that against Toughfan 14.
@@evl619 that was more as a suggestion the A12 had better static pressure than the average 140mm
"There's only so many ways you can design a fan". Take a look at Major Hardware's 'Fan Showdown'-series where viewers design fans and Major Hardware prints and tests them. There are so many (weird) ways to design a fan :D
yeah but theres only so many ways to design a _good_ fan
@@ventilate4267 Someone designed one on that show that matched the Noctua, called the Acceleron. No fancy materials like Noctua, just a printed fan. A company contacted the designer for possible licensing etc. Strange looking thing it was too. I like how some of the weird designs work far better than you would think.
@@Berserkism edit: hmm i see quiet impressive
@@Berserkism or shovel fan, that one isn't the best, but for a meme it does well enough
thanks for the info! I'll buy these TT as a consumer!
Still holding out for the black A12's coming out later this year. Also can't wait to see what the white ones will look like!
There is also similar fan like Gentle Typhoon/A12x25 from Scythe, called "Wonder Snail". Worth checking out imo
I just took a look at the fans you mentioned. He will have a field day with that, it has the same mounting rubbers as noctua. The youtube clip i watched was released 31/1/21. Noctuas patent might have expired.
Review for artic p12 slims!
Didn't realise there was one, I'd be keen to see this also!
I think the temp difference is from the loss of static pressure from not having a squared off frame like the noctua. So the air leaks out from the sides.
The thermal difference might be due to the frame design. The TT fans have a circular shape to them, which I believe is worse for maintaining static pressure on a radiator than a full squared off frame like the Noctua's.
Speaking of copying, there are the Nidec gentle typhoons that were around way before Noctua nf-a12x25s. Just saying 🙂.
When Noctua is your free R&D...
LCP is a "common" hi-tech hi-performance polymer, but mostly widespread where cheaper plastics don''t cut it and the market for the application supports the elevated cost. I have in the past helped develop root-canal probes for dental x-ray photography, where contrast material were infused in LCP - simply because it was the only material fulfilling the property demands.
Regarding similarity of fan design; it could just be the result of CFD simulations set with same or similar boundary parameters. Jet engine turbines, for example, all looks very alike with minor design differences that makes each unique, and sometimes, but always, with huge differences in performance.
Would be nice to see a comparison for the slimmer version of the A12 from noctua.
Who knows who copied who. What about the
Nidec Servo Gentle Typhoon. This I believe was out before Noctua NF A12x25 and the Thermal take tough fan and it is a very similar if not the same type fan. Great video 👍
100% This is a rip off of a rip off.
You could say... this is a hot take.
David Caruso would be proud.
I think everyone is blowing this out of proportion.
This joke is a breath of fresh air
nice pun but I m not a fan of it
im such a fan of this thread its soo funny
I purchased the thermaltake tough fan 12. Is the maximum RPM supposed to be 1750 rpm? I can see both Noctua and Thermaltake both advertise them as 2000 rpm fans. The maximum I could get was 1750 RPM out of the Thermaltakes. So I am confused with the marketing here.
Figured it out defective fan I can hear the bearing is bad. Seeing if it can be RMAed now
Love when i see you still holding on the Logitech g305 🤩 i bought it cuz of you 😁 tnx man