This was my exact thought after watching this video!! It makes sense that each dragonseed has a deeper connection with the dragon they end up claiming. With Hugh, it’s poetic that he claimed Vermithor because Saera was the bane of Jaehaerys’ life. Saera truly ended up having the last laugh. It’s a bit more complicated with Addam - my best bet is that Corlys has more dragon blood than he thinks plus Addam is Laenor’s half-brother so it makes sense that his dragon chose him. There’s no better choice for Ulf than Gael. She was the daughter Alysanne spent every waking moment with after so many tragedies occurred in her life. Dragons and their riders are often said to be one and the same and it makes sense that Alysanne’s dragon has a soft spot for her youngest daughter’s child. It’s a shame that they’re probably gonna stick with “I’m the son of Baelon the Brave” because this is such a missed opportunity…
Baelon actually being Ulf's real father would echo back to Tywin secretly visiting the brothels after Joanna's death. I wouldn't be surprised if it was true at all, but like many things we will never truly know
@@warlordofbritannia George doesn't put his characters on pedestals though others in Westeros definitely do. How can you expect someone to never have needs and desires when their partner passes?
@@warlordofbritannia No I was just riffing off of your comment, I'm in total agreement. Apologies if my reply came off as confrontational, there's way more too much of that online right now
There's one candidate you missed: Jaehaerys himself. The First Quarrel with Alysanne occurred in 88-89. Maybe he dishonored himself and arranged to have it all swept away. I think this could be possible in the show universe with the age fudging. That's the only way it could work IMO. Interestingly, I wonder if Baelon was part of this plot --- Jaehaerys named him Hand in 100. Maybe Baelon agreed to be the interloper and tell the family that the son was his and Jaehaerys rewarded him with it.
@@QuinnTheGM @QuinnTheGM I also just realized that the Second Quarrel was from 92-94, so Ulf's age would work for that too. I doubt he's Ulf's father but who knows...
@@QuinnTheGM at the council of 101 a man came claiming to be jaehaerys son could ulf or hugh be a child of this bastard, the only reason we say he isnt a bastard is jaehaerys his word in a public setting in front of a 1000+ lords so him denying would be normal and why would george put in that random claiment
@@QuinnTheGM We do all know that Fire and Blood is highly biased, and that Jaehaerys was probably actually human, like ever other king, rather than being the King Arthur type of figure that he's portrayed as. He might be my favourite candidate!
Wow you really called it with Saera’s bastards returning, even if it was for Ulf and not Hugh. I love the idea of the daughters having the bastards when we would typically expect it to be one of their brothers. Plus having just watched Ulf claim Silverwing she’s acting very motherly while protecting her clutch of eggs and if Alysanne’s last moments were in regret over what happened to Gael then it would make sense why Silverwing would be drawn to Ulf if he was Gael’s son, almost like Silverwing is doing what Alysanne regretted not doing before she died if this theory is correct. It’s very poetic and I absolutely love it!
In the World of Ice and Fire - Too drunk like Robert: Get betrayed - Too naive like Ned: Get betrayed - Too driven by emotions like Robb: Get betrayed - Too reckless like Jon: Get betrayed - Too evil like Aerys: Get betrayed - Too driven to be good like Jaime: Get betrayed - Too marginalized like Tyrion: Get betrayed - Too smug like Joffrey: Still get betrayed - Too paranoid like Cersei: Still get betrayed - Too abusive, calculated and ruthless like Tywin: Still get betrayed - Too cold and unpredictable like Roose: Still still get betrayed - Too rigid like Stannis: Still still get betrayed - Too angry like Aegon II: Still still get betrayed - Too confused like Rhaenyra: Still still get betrayed - Too obedient like Dontos: Still still still get betrayed - Too good at his job like Kevan: Still still still get betrayed In what condition that will protect any character from betrayal in this story?
There is none. But the key is to survive/defeat the betrayal. Depending on the situation, be ruthless, strong, cunning, kind & compassionate, or honorable. Basically, be Jaehaerys the Conciliator.
Being as far away from the Iron Throne as physically possible will save you. Honestly, I'd rather throw myself to the goddamn Ice Zombies than spend one minute near that damn throne.
Ulf the White was a chemistry teacher with terminal lung cancer who had 2 years left to live. With the concern for his family’s financial status and wanting to feel alive after living a boring life for so long, he broke bad and became a drug kingpin named “Heisenberg”.
Saw the Gael's son theory in Facebook once and never thought it'd make it into something serious. But it could make sense, in the books Ulf was a man-at-arms at Dragonstone and there isn't any mention of him ever living or being in KL, so I can definitely see Jaehaerys/Alysanne giving him to one of the villagers nearby or some member of the castle-staff to raise him to be one of their servants/courtiers. . . It'd also make sure that he had some relatively decent life (we see castle staff having better living conditions than many of the common smallfolk in the Dunk & Egg stories) while keeping him close enough to be watched and taken care of if need be (his true parentage would be easier to conceal in Dragonstone where he could juts pass as a random dragon-seed from 2 or more generations)
She fled to Essos, which was when Jaehaerys disowned her. She wouldn't have been allowed back to Westeros if she wanted to. Huge was probably born in Lys, then moved to Westeros at some point, somehow.
For the sake of my own sanity, I explained Ulf's heritage as him being a Celtigar bastard who invented the Targaryen bastard backstory because it's more sexy (since everyone kinda forgets about House Celtigar being Valyrian). I like your explanation better Quinn. Nice video.
Good theory, but as you said Ulf seems a bit older than someone born in 99 (but again I don’t think the black soup is very good for you skin). I don’t think we’ll ever get an answers to who are the parents of Hugh and Ulf, but as Varys said “power resides where men believe it resides”, so if Ulf manages to make others believe he’s truly the son of Baelon the Brave that’s all that matters
I randomly got the idea that maybe him (or Hugh for that matter) were descended from that one knight who claimed to be a bastard of old king Joe at the great council of 101. Granted, king Joe denies the allegation, but it would be on theme for him to have hypocritically dabbled in extramarital affairs during one of his quarrels with his queen.
That knight was arrested after he made the claim. On the other hand, there was a hedge knight who claimed to be the product of Maegor raping his innkeeper mother. He brought his mother as a witness to the council too. Maybe he could be the father?
@@loandbaxhuku9617 I had forgotten the knight was imprisoned, but it’s possible he got out eventually, they don’t say he was executed or died. Regardless I just thought it was a potential cute connection. I know the guy claiming to be Maegor’s kid is usually discounted because Maegor was believed to be sterile. That being said, there would be a deep irony to him accidentally fathering a child he never intended or knew about.
I hope he is Baelon's because it would be a fun dynamic with Daemon, it would be fun to see how he would react to his brother after the character arc he is going through right now
After watching the latest episode of HOTD, I have to say that I REALLY like this theory. We just got confirmation that Saera is the mother of Hugh, therefore Ulf being the son of a different Targaryen princess who had a bastard fits perfectly. Like Aelor and Aelora, Gael is a very mysterious figure in Targaryen history. Her true fate was revealed long after she died meaning Jaehaerys went through many lengths to ensure that her death was as vague as possible. If her son lived - what better way to hide a bastard than say he was stillborn? Maybe some peasants were paid off to raise him as their own and they told him that he’s a Targaryen bastard. Of course, he didn’t know “which” Targaryen so he just picked the most famous one rather than the 13th elusive child of Jaehaerys I. Thank you for making this theory because I’m all for it and I’m genuinely surprised no one thought of it before you. Keep it up!
Tbh fire and blood always gave me the impression that the dragon seeds are children of other dragon seeds, F&B does mention that the small folk on dragonstone saw it as an honour and not a disgrace to be a Targ bastard, maybe there are entire bastard lines stemming from the Targs
I think it makes sense if Queen Alyssanne made arrangements for a Half Targaryen child to be raised, that child and those raising him wouldn't precisely know his heritage and maybe just assumed it was the Targaryen they heard most about, the young male Heir, not the reclusive and sick younger daughter.
I love the Gael theory! But I don’t think the show will use it, because I don’t think they’ve mentioned Gael at all and I’ve think they’ll make Ulf’s parent a known Targaryen. I also don’t think it’s Baelon because he seems so faithful to Alyssa and he did refuse Viserra who was supposedly the most beautiful of his sisters (my gods this family is a f*cking mess). I also like the Jaehaerys option, he was briefly separated from Alysanne and it would explain why he is so adamant against Targaryen’s having bastards. My personal head cannon is he’s Daemon’s son and Hugh is Viserys’s son, and the two of them show what it would have been like if Viserys and Daemon were truly united. Side tangent: it really annoys me, Hugh and Ulf have not interacted yet, given how interconnected they are
He could have had sex after Alyssa died with someone that comforted him in his grief. We dont know. This is based on romantized records, so its certainly very possible even though he loved his wife.
There seems to be a misunderstanding, Sera Targeryen was sent to the faith in old town. It was stayed in fire and blood that this was meant to be a temporary punishment. Sera choose to escape, and instead of going to kings landing, she went to Essos on her own volition. Where she sold herself as a tail I’m a brothel in Lys. Her father did no banish her to become a prostitute, he sent her to the faith and she choose to become a prostitute.
quinn has done other videos about sera, this is definitely a misunderstanding from this video. quinn knows jaehaerys wanted to just banish her to old town for a while
Reminds me a bit of Esther from Bleak House, who’s mother was informed that Esther had been born stillborn but was then secreted away to be raised by her aunt.
My theory is that Ulf is descended from Baelon, just not his son. The biggest issue I have with him being Baelon's son is he probably would've been present at the Great Council. We know Targaryen bastards put forth what little claim they had and I don't see any scenario where a mother to one of Baelon's bastards would not push his claim. Unless, of course, Ulf was born AFTER the council or too close to it to push the claim. It's possible the mother couldn't afford to make it to Harrenhall, but considering revealing Ulf could potentially (or hopefully in a peasants) eyes give a better life for her son it's still worth considering. So Ulf isn't a son of Baelon, but he could be a son of Viserys or Daemon. It'd mean Ulf is probably around 10-20 years younger than we think but I could see him looking older than his age granted he grew up in King's Landing. His mother would've obviously told him of his parentage, but she could've easily mistaken a parent for a child. Targaryens would look the same and the peasants wouldn't know enough to tell them apart. Maybe Ulf's mother just thought it was Baelon. After for whether Viserys or Daemon is the real father is up for debate. Daemon is the most likely candidate given Ulf's personality but Daemon did remark to Viserys about their playboy youth which could be a hint that Viserys has a few unknown bastards running around. I don't 100% agree with this theory but I think it's a lot better than the Baelon theory, or most of the others floating around.
@@QuinnTheGM So did I but anyone can succumb to peer pressure, his brothers _were_ instructed to take him under their wing and make a more acceptable man out of him, so to speak.I could see Baelon or even Alyssa getting frustrated enough with Vaegons recalcitrance to say "maybe he'll be more biddable if he discovers Girls?".
@@awhartig5847 nah uve gotta to remember these arnt real people, and grrm is writing them to align with stereotypes, if he hints that someone is an ace king they defo were an ace king obsessed with books to a fault
good theory, this makes a lot of sense. i hope it gets revealed, would make things more personal and emotional. Also i def think hes made up that he's balons son, i think its very common for people w/ unkown parentage to exagerate their family history to feel more connected to it
Although marriage would be out of the question for Baelon, i dont find it unlikely for him to have some no strings attached fun at a brothel. Ulf was probably raised by his mother and told all about his father Baelon.
I like the idea that Ulf is Gael's son and Hugh is Saera's son. It is deliciously ironic that Saera had a child that would eventually claim his Grandfather's dragon. We've already seen that Aemond claimed Vhagar and Vhagar was Baelon's before Laena's.
Oh damn as soon as you suggested this, my response was "oooooh good one!" That totally seems plausible to me, and it might be my official headcanon now, regeardless of where the show goes.
I always secretly thought that the winter child princess gael's secret child was hugh hammer who has both valyrian and common folk looks and he lived on dragonstone but moved to Kings Landing for employment and I do think its a possibility ulf could actually be the son of baelon Ik that he mourned Alyssa and never loved or remarried ever again but I do think he had sexual urges and maybe secretly knocked someone up and I also thought that Addam in the books could be the son of laenor, who as a Young teen could have been pressured too sleep with women too change his orientation but it didnt work amd corlys took addam as his bastard which is how addam could ride the dragon bc he had dragon blood unlike corlys and I thought that nettles could have been the bastard daughter of daemon in a tragic way or she knew secret valyrian techniques on how too bond with a dragon like what the valyrians did originally to bond with dragons until the shadow binders taught them ancient spells of the empire of the dawn.
!!SHOW SPOILERS!! Leaks say he isn't even a real dragonseed, and he'll reveal that after claiming Silverwing. Another stupid decision by Condal and Hess.
That specific leak has been disproven on other factors, though I could still see that being the case in the show. If so, maybe he wouldn’t know his true origin
@@QuinnTheGM I sure hope it's false, because if they wanted to do the whole "you don't really need Valyrian blood to ride a dragon" thing, they could have just kept Nettles in the story
It's more likely he's Saera's illegitimate son since she opened up a pleasure house in Essos once she left Westeros, and she was very "popular" as a silver-haired foreign princess.
Saera wasn’t sent away to Essos. She was sent to live with her sister Septa Maegelle to “learn a lesson” Saera escaped and was able to get passage to Essos where she chose to work in a brothel house.
There’s a theory that Saera was Hugh Hammers mother on the show. That would check out based on what he said about his mother being a silver haired sex worker. How did he get to Westeros makes that theory harder but it’s still possible.
They made up some random Targaryen princess, married her to a darklyn of all houses and then made a modern day darklyn forget( must be the amnesia juice in westerosi water) even though that would be common knowledge in the house for hundreds of years after. The show is high quality fan fiction. You don’t have to read too much into things. I like the show it’s very entertaining. Just sit back and enjoy the visuals and acting performance.
Well we did get a scene of Allicent walking into water this episode, seems to me like it might be a nod to this.. Since that would also give more to that random scene.
I think the seeds, particularly the two betrayers, are Daemon’s kids. In the book, he’s constantly trying to get Rhaenyra to elevate them to lordships and give them important lands. Plus Ulf and Hugh are supposed to be from Dragonstone which was Daemon’s seat for some time.
He tried to get Rhaenyra to give them lands and titles because a) the blacks had very few dragon riding allies, and b) he understood that if you’re going to give a man a dragon, you need to ENSURE he’s gonna be loyal to you and no one else. And he was right.
I never thought of this before and it definitely seems like something the show would do. I like the idea of it because it gives Gael more importance besides having a cool nickname, being a crutch for Alysanne, and just having a horrific story for assault and suicide. There was always so many questions about this story because of how we knew she was always by Alysanne's side but in this one instance. (And unfortunately it tracks with GRRM's writing pattern of F&B to kill off or just straight up stop mentioning the moms after the kids are born.) And I do like the idea of Alysanne being the one to give up the child. We definitely know Jaehaerys was violently possessive of his daughters virginity, I wouldn't put it past him to be willing to kill a baby in the name of preserving her honor (when in reality it would be about him). Alysanne would know this and in the effort to to protect her daughter and the baby - it looks like bastards and any unwanted kids are given to the Faith or citadel so if Ulf mentions any connection to that it could be help this theory, at the very least it would hint that he was hidden away - it completely backfire as it sends Gael in a depressive spiral. It would certainly follow the theme of Jaehaerys and Alysanne failing their kids so much they either stood by or actively paid a part in the circumstances which got their kids killed.
The theory that Ulf is Rhaenys' brother, the bastard of the older brother of Balon is more probable, he is younger than Rhaenys but close in age and he was most likely born in King's landing, Gael is too young.
@@QuinnTheGM lol. My card/money is on Saera Targaryen because when Hugh said that her mother worked in a pleasure house and said he was just like his brother's sons i instantly clicked for me. I think you have the same as me but who do you think it is? And do you think this will ever be explored futher because him knowing his mother could change his story completely from the books.
at the council of 101 a man came claiming to be jaehaerys son could ulf or hugh be a child of this bastard, the only reason we say he isnt a bastard is jaehaerys his word in a public setting in front of a 1000+ lords so him denying would be normal and why would george put in that random claiment
I just don’t really see the purpose in the story for him to be lying, unless he’s not a dragonseed at all. Like it changes nothing if it’s another Targaryen, and they’ve already made up Aeriana so we know they have no problem just bullshitting something, we should be happy that Baelon’s at least canon.
It can change perception based on which Targ it is. When he says he's a brother of Viserys, that matters if the small folk are currently missing the days of Viserys. That gives him more clout than Gael, who had little impact on the people in comparison.
To be fair baelon passed the better part of his life as a widow, he having a moment of weakness, longing, mourning etc and sleeping with a prostitute or something like that don’t make him necessarily unfaithful or loveless to Alyssa Imo
Especially if said prostitute had dirty blonde hair, green eyes, a crooked nose and a lopsided smile, which, let’s be honest, probably ain’t that rare in fleabottom. It’s not like Alyssa was noted as a great Valyrian beauty, quite the opposite. Her looks were closer to common than Valyrian, so it wouldn’t have been hard to stumble across a prostitute that heavily resembled her
Yeah, maybe. The thing about royal bastards, especially the royal bastards of male children, is that they're pretty easy to sweep under the rug. We know for example that there were long stretches during J and A's marriage where they weren't talking, and Jaehaerys himself could have sired a bastard during that time, and so could have Aemon or Baelon. I don't think you need to resurrect a faked stillbirth to find a logical place for Ulf to fit. He's noteworthy for a few months while he's riding a dragon and soon enough he's dead. The juice ain't worth the squeeze on this one.
Personally, I think Ulf is telling the truth that he is Baelon’s son. Clearly there must have been some connection between the Prince and his mother for everybody to believe it. He is the only one who openly criticises the Royal Family without consequence. It seems like an open secret.
13 children and only two sons made it to adulthood. I feel so bad for Alysanne and Jae Jae. Edit: Vaegon was also a child of Alysanne and Jae. He became a maester
Three. Vaegon is often forgotten because he didn’t make a name for himself like Aemon and Baelon did. He also ended up going to the Citadel at a pretty young age so he didn’t end up marrying unlike his brothers. He’s one of the few kids that didn’t end up dying tragically but his position as maester prevented him from being politically involved.
what are your opinions on the theory that alicents 3 children represent 3 aspects of her personality halaena being her gentleness aegon her abuse and aemond her rage
Gael was younger than viserys and rhaenys and one year older than daemon Ulf seems to be closer to these three than to Rhaenyra so its impossible for him to be her son
Why not both? Maybe Baelon and Gael had an affair.... Ulf would be pureblooded in that case. Combined woth the fact that it seems like baelon was alysannes favorite son and gael her favorite daughter, silverwing might have felt who ulfs parentage is. Since a part of riders remains in their dragons and silverwing was only ridden by alysanne, it might have been tgat emotion of motherly love.... Or he is a descendant of aegon, the Conquerer, anythings possible.
6:40 I think that's a really stupid idea in all honesty. If the guy didn't want a bastard Targaryan, presumeably due to honor and chance of disputing the rightful liege and such.. surely he'd KILL the bastard and not send it off to a brothel literally only a few leagues away from the bloody capital lmao.
@@grigorov1914well Hugh says his mom worked in brothel , had silver hair - assuming it’s Saera. Ulf I think just got lucky , I think he has questionable lineage
I feel like if he was one of Big J’s bastards born during one of his rifts with Alysanne, there’s no way he would have allowed him to stay in kings landing let alone Westeros. J would be so paranoid that his wife would find out about his indiscretion that he’d likely have the child taken to one of the free cities. J-man was so paranoid about Targ bastards that I wouldn’t be entirely shocked if he didn’t let the child live. I doubt he’d intentionally kill it, but a long sea voyage is certainly dangerous for a babe. J realised the danger of letting other people have dragon blood, let alone common people, and his ‘loving’ marriage was part of his PR scheme.
Good call-especially for text. Alyssane and Jaehaerys have 13 children-wana bet only 3 of THOSE 13 are actually theirs together? Alysanne got around...the prophecy of Maggie the Frog to Cersei applies to Jaehaerys and Alysanne as well.
I really like this idea. It especially adds a poetic nature to Ulf getting Silverwing since Gael’s death is so heavily tied into Alysanne
Just as Hugh's, Saera's kid would be tight to the poetic nature of him claiming Jaehaery's dragon.
This was my exact thought after watching this video!! It makes sense that each dragonseed has a deeper connection with the dragon they end up claiming. With Hugh, it’s poetic that he claimed Vermithor because Saera was the bane of Jaehaerys’ life. Saera truly ended up having the last laugh. It’s a bit more complicated with Addam - my best bet is that Corlys has more dragon blood than he thinks plus Addam is Laenor’s half-brother so it makes sense that his dragon chose him. There’s no better choice for Ulf than Gael. She was the daughter Alysanne spent every waking moment with after so many tragedies occurred in her life. Dragons and their riders are often said to be one and the same and it makes sense that Alysanne’s dragon has a soft spot for her youngest daughter’s child. It’s a shame that they’re probably gonna stick with “I’m the son of Baelon the Brave” because this is such a missed opportunity…
Baelon actually being Ulf's real father would echo back to Tywin secretly visiting the brothels after Joanna's death. I wouldn't be surprised if it was true at all, but like many things we will never truly know
I thought about that too
Like Jahaerys’ theorized dragonseeds
@@warlordofbritannia George doesn't put his characters on pedestals though others in Westeros definitely do. How can you expect someone to never have needs and desires when their partner passes?
@@natedogg890
I wasn’t implying otherwise, was I? Anyways, I’m thinking more about the fan theories that he’d been planting seeds throughout his life.
@@warlordofbritannia No I was just riffing off of your comment, I'm in total agreement. Apologies if my reply came off as confrontational, there's way more too much of that online right now
There's one candidate you missed: Jaehaerys himself. The First Quarrel with Alysanne occurred in 88-89. Maybe he dishonored himself and arranged to have it all swept away.
I think this could be possible in the show universe with the age fudging. That's the only way it could work IMO. Interestingly, I wonder if Baelon was part of this plot --- Jaehaerys named him Hand in 100. Maybe Baelon agreed to be the interloper and tell the family that the son was his and Jaehaerys rewarded him with it.
That’s a great point! Wish I’d addressed that
@@QuinnTheGM @QuinnTheGM I also just realized that the Second Quarrel was from 92-94, so Ulf's age would work for that too. I doubt he's Ulf's father but who knows...
@@QuinnTheGM at the council of 101 a man came claiming to be jaehaerys son could ulf or hugh be a child of this bastard, the only reason we say he isnt a bastard is jaehaerys his word in a public setting in front of a 1000+ lords so him denying would be normal and why would george put in that random claiment
@@QuinnTheGM We do all know that Fire and Blood is highly biased, and that Jaehaerys was probably actually human, like ever other king, rather than being the King Arthur type of figure that he's portrayed as. He might be my favourite candidate!
What we know of the great love between Jaehaerys and Allysanne makes him fathering any bastards highly unlikely.
Wow you really called it with Saera’s bastards returning, even if it was for Ulf and not Hugh. I love the idea of the daughters having the bastards when we would typically expect it to be one of their brothers. Plus having just watched Ulf claim Silverwing she’s acting very motherly while protecting her clutch of eggs and if Alysanne’s last moments were in regret over what happened to Gael then it would make sense why Silverwing would be drawn to Ulf if he was Gael’s son, almost like Silverwing is doing what Alysanne regretted not doing before she died if this theory is correct. It’s very poetic and I absolutely love it!
What if he's the son of Hugh Hammer? Really makes you think
Hugh “hammer I barely know er”
Time-traveling hammer impregnated Ulf's mother.
What if he’s your son?
Maybe he is hughs dad
They’re both grown men, close in age. How can Hugh be his father?
In the World of Ice and Fire
- Too drunk like Robert: Get betrayed
- Too naive like Ned: Get betrayed
- Too driven by emotions like Robb: Get betrayed
- Too reckless like Jon: Get betrayed
- Too evil like Aerys: Get betrayed
- Too driven to be good like Jaime: Get betrayed
- Too marginalized like Tyrion: Get betrayed
- Too smug like Joffrey: Still get betrayed
- Too paranoid like Cersei: Still get betrayed
- Too abusive, calculated and ruthless like Tywin: Still get betrayed
- Too cold and unpredictable like Roose: Still still get betrayed
- Too rigid like Stannis: Still still get betrayed
- Too angry like Aegon II: Still still get betrayed
- Too confused like Rhaenyra: Still still get betrayed
- Too obedient like Dontos: Still still still get betrayed
- Too good at his job like Kevan: Still still still get betrayed
In what condition that will protect any character from betrayal in this story?
Maybe the whole system is bad
There is none. But the key is to survive/defeat the betrayal. Depending on the situation, be ruthless, strong, cunning, kind & compassionate, or honorable. Basically, be Jaehaerys the Conciliator.
None.
Being as far away from the Iron Throne as physically possible will save you. Honestly, I'd rather throw myself to the goddamn Ice Zombies than spend one minute near that damn throne.
IRL there is no "protection". Everyone can get betrayed and usually *it's not the victims fault.*
The important thing is how you handle the betrayal.
Ulf the White was a chemistry teacher with terminal lung cancer who had 2 years left to live.
With the concern for his family’s financial status and wanting to feel alive after living a boring life for so long, he broke bad and became a drug kingpin named “Heisenberg”.
Hugh Hammer is going to break bad soon.
Lmao
Bro you spoiled the sequel serie for Hugh Hammer daughter
If we get to witness Hugh say “yo waddup mista White” I will lose my shit
Heisandfireberg
Saw the Gael's son theory in Facebook once and never thought it'd make it into something serious.
But it could make sense, in the books Ulf was a man-at-arms at Dragonstone and there isn't any mention of him ever living or being in KL, so I can definitely see Jaehaerys/Alysanne giving him to one of the villagers nearby or some member of the castle-staff to raise him to be one of their servants/courtiers.
.
.
It'd also make sure that he had some relatively decent life (we see castle staff having better living conditions than many of the common smallfolk in the Dunk & Egg stories) while keeping him close enough to be watched and taken care of if need be (his true parentage would be easier to conceal in Dragonstone where he could juts pass as a random dragon-seed from 2 or more generations)
I always held the idea that Gaels son was a dragon baby.
Saera wasn’t banished, she was just sent to the faith. She escaped to essos on her own.
Yes but that functionally equates to banishment, she certainly wasn’t allowed back
She fled to Essos, which was when Jaehaerys disowned her. She wouldn't have been allowed back to Westeros if she wanted to. Huge was probably born in Lys, then moved to Westeros at some point, somehow.
@@Ghiscari unlikely since Hugh didn't have any money , a son of seara would have been well of and become another bed slave.
She was banished after doing that though
For the sake of my own sanity, I explained Ulf's heritage as him being a Celtigar bastard who invented the Targaryen bastard backstory because it's more sexy (since everyone kinda forgets about House Celtigar being Valyrian). I like your explanation better Quinn. Nice video.
Ulf:*Walks into any bar*
Everyone in the bar simultaneously: "ULF"
Good theory, but as you said Ulf seems a bit older than someone born in 99 (but again I don’t think the black soup is very good for you skin).
I don’t think we’ll ever get an answers to who are the parents of Hugh and Ulf, but as Varys said “power resides where men believe it resides”, so if Ulf manages to make others believe he’s truly the son of Baelon the Brave that’s all that matters
Hugh morther is probaly shera
i want to see daemon’s reaction to ulf calling him a brother
I randomly got the idea that maybe him (or Hugh for that matter) were descended from that one knight who claimed to be a bastard of old king Joe at the great council of 101. Granted, king Joe denies the allegation, but it would be on theme for him to have hypocritically dabbled in extramarital affairs during one of his quarrels with his queen.
That knight was arrested after he made the claim.
On the other hand, there was a hedge knight who claimed to be the product of Maegor raping his innkeeper mother. He brought his mother as a witness to the council too. Maybe he could be the father?
@@loandbaxhuku9617 I had forgotten the knight was imprisoned, but it’s possible he got out eventually, they don’t say he was executed or died. Regardless I just thought it was a potential cute connection.
I know the guy claiming to be Maegor’s kid is usually discounted because Maegor was believed to be sterile. That being said, there would be a deep irony to him accidentally fathering a child he never intended or knew about.
This is genuinely my favourite page on UA-cam 🔥🔥
I hope he is Baelon's because it would be a fun dynamic with Daemon, it would be fun to see how he would react to his brother after the character arc he is going through right now
I believe it would've been better if he was Daemon's bastard, unfortunately he seems a little too old to be
@@jmpabd872 who knows show ages are all over the place
After watching the latest episode of HOTD, I have to say that I REALLY like this theory. We just got confirmation that Saera is the mother of Hugh, therefore Ulf being the son of a different Targaryen princess who had a bastard fits perfectly. Like Aelor and Aelora, Gael is a very mysterious figure in Targaryen history. Her true fate was revealed long after she died meaning Jaehaerys went through many lengths to ensure that her death was as vague as possible. If her son lived - what better way to hide a bastard than say he was stillborn? Maybe some peasants were paid off to raise him as their own and they told him that he’s a Targaryen bastard. Of course, he didn’t know “which” Targaryen so he just picked the most famous one rather than the 13th elusive child of Jaehaerys I. Thank you for making this theory because I’m all for it and I’m genuinely surprised no one thought of it before you. Keep it up!
Tbh fire and blood always gave me the impression that the dragon seeds are children of other dragon seeds, F&B does mention that the small folk on dragonstone saw it as an honour and not a disgrace to be a Targ bastard, maybe there are entire bastard lines stemming from the Targs
Not only was it revealed to Quinn in a dream that the TWOW release date was close, he's also the secret son of a Targaryen prince. TPTWP?
You mean he's Ser Pounce?!?
No, he s secretly a horse
@@TheIonut778 Doesn't that go without saying at this point? (munches straw)
Too many acronims. Cant get what you mean lad.
@@Alejojojo6The Winds of Winter and The Prince That Was Promised are the acronyms.
Ooof you were so close! Great theory and it did come into play on the show even if it was for high and not Ulf. Good for you!
This is the moment Silverwing became the Kwisatz Haderach
I think it makes sense if Queen Alyssanne made arrangements for a Half Targaryen child to be raised, that child and those raising him wouldn't precisely know his heritage and maybe just assumed it was the Targaryen they heard most about, the young male Heir, not the reclusive and sick younger daughter.
I love the Gael theory! But I don’t think the show will use it, because I don’t think they’ve mentioned Gael at all and I’ve think they’ll make Ulf’s parent a known Targaryen. I also don’t think it’s Baelon because he seems so faithful to Alyssa and he did refuse Viserra who was supposedly the most beautiful of his sisters (my gods this family is a f*cking mess). I also like the Jaehaerys option, he was briefly separated from Alysanne and it would explain why he is so adamant against Targaryen’s having bastards. My personal head cannon is he’s Daemon’s son and Hugh is Viserys’s son, and the two of them show what it would have been like if Viserys and Daemon were truly united.
Side tangent: it really annoys me, Hugh and Ulf have not interacted yet, given how interconnected they are
I think they’ll interact tonight
@@QuinnTheGM I hope their bromance is a highlight of Season 3
How old is Ulf in the show?
@@jmpabd872 it isn’t stated he could be in his 30’s or 40’s, but given he claims to Baelon’s Bastard he’s at least 28.
He could have had sex after Alyssa died with someone that comforted him in his grief. We dont know. This is based on romantized records, so its certainly very possible even though he loved his wife.
Ulf the white is barely white
Hugh looks more clean for a blacksmith
There seems to be a misunderstanding, Sera Targeryen was sent to the faith in old town. It was stayed in fire and blood that this was meant to be a temporary punishment. Sera choose to escape, and instead of going to kings landing, she went to Essos on her own volition. Where she sold herself as a tail I’m a brothel in Lys. Her father did no banish her to become a prostitute, he sent her to the faith and she choose to become a prostitute.
quinn has done other videos about sera, this is definitely a misunderstanding from this video. quinn knows jaehaerys wanted to just banish her to old town for a while
I love this channel, but this guys has a massive bias for Saera, though I have no idea why considering how much of a bad person she is
Reminds me a bit of Esther from Bleak House, who’s mother was informed that Esther had been born stillborn but was then secreted away to be raised by her aunt.
My theory is that Ulf is descended from Baelon, just not his son. The biggest issue I have with him being Baelon's son is he probably would've been present at the Great Council. We know Targaryen bastards put forth what little claim they had and I don't see any scenario where a mother to one of Baelon's bastards would not push his claim. Unless, of course, Ulf was born AFTER the council or too close to it to push the claim. It's possible the mother couldn't afford to make it to Harrenhall, but considering revealing Ulf could potentially (or hopefully in a peasants) eyes give a better life for her son it's still worth considering. So Ulf isn't a son of Baelon, but he could be a son of Viserys or Daemon. It'd mean Ulf is probably around 10-20 years younger than we think but I could see him looking older than his age granted he grew up in King's Landing. His mother would've obviously told him of his parentage, but she could've easily mistaken a parent for a child. Targaryens would look the same and the peasants wouldn't know enough to tell them apart. Maybe Ulf's mother just thought it was Baelon. After for whether Viserys or Daemon is the real father is up for debate. Daemon is the most likely candidate given Ulf's personality but Daemon did remark to Viserys about their playboy youth which could be a hint that Viserys has a few unknown bastards running around. I don't 100% agree with this theory but I think it's a lot better than the Baelon theory, or most of the others floating around.
We saw that Ulf wasnt even sure that he had that ancestry plus he could be too young at the time to even push for the claim.
It’s definitely Vaegon. The one time he tried it he made a kid and had to dip to maesterhood.
I think marwin maybe vaegons son.
I read Vaegon as an Ace Chad
@@QuinnTheGMRemember when Saerra tricked Tom the Fool into such a...misadventure? Maybe Vaegon was a trial run.
@@QuinnTheGM So did I but anyone can succumb to peer pressure, his brothers _were_ instructed to take him under their wing and make a more acceptable man out of him, so to speak.I could see Baelon or even Alyssa getting frustrated enough with Vaegons recalcitrance to say "maybe he'll be more biddable if he discovers Girls?".
@@awhartig5847 nah uve gotta to remember these arnt real people, and grrm is writing them to align with stereotypes, if he hints that someone is an ace king they defo were an ace king obsessed with books to a fault
good theory, this makes a lot of sense. i hope it gets revealed, would make things more personal and emotional. Also i def think hes made up that he's balons son, i think its very common for people w/ unkown parentage to exagerate their family history to feel more connected to it
DUDE! YOU WERE SOOO CLOSE!
Ngl I'm more inclined to believe Ulf was a Saera bastard or something.
Although marriage would be out of the question for Baelon, i dont find it unlikely for him to have some no strings attached fun at a brothel. Ulf was probably raised by his mother and told all about his father Baelon.
I like the idea that Ulf is Gael's son and Hugh is Saera's son.
It is deliciously ironic that Saera had a child that would eventually claim his Grandfather's dragon.
We've already seen that Aemond claimed Vhagar and Vhagar was Baelon's before Laena's.
Ulf is a son of the time-traveling Aegon the Unworthy, the Targaryen with the most bastards. /JK
We Want Nettles!!!
If House of Dragon was a DnD campaign, Ulf would be a bard and Hugh a barbarian
Oh damn as soon as you suggested this, my response was "oooooh good one!" That totally seems plausible to me, and it might be my official headcanon now, regeardless of where the show goes.
I love this theory! I can't see him being the son of Baelon either
Ulf is obviously the son Vizzy T kept dreaming about and the true king of Westeros
As far as Ulfs age... alcoholics tend to appear older than they are.
Brilliant theory, you've really sold this one to me!
I always secretly thought that the winter child princess gael's secret child was hugh hammer who has both valyrian and common folk looks and he lived on dragonstone but moved to Kings Landing for employment and I do think its a possibility ulf could actually be the son of baelon Ik that he mourned Alyssa and never loved or remarried ever again but I do think he had sexual urges and maybe secretly knocked someone up and I also thought that Addam in the books could be the son of laenor, who as a Young teen could have been pressured too sleep with women too change his orientation but it didnt work amd corlys took addam as his bastard which is how addam could ride the dragon bc he had dragon blood unlike corlys and I thought that nettles could have been the bastard daughter of daemon in a tragic way or she knew secret valyrian techniques on how too bond with a dragon like what the valyrians did originally to bond with dragons until the shadow binders taught them ancient spells of the empire of the dawn.
It’s been confirmed Ulf is the son of Mushroom
!!SHOW SPOILERS!!
Leaks say he isn't even a real dragonseed, and he'll reveal that after claiming Silverwing. Another stupid decision by Condal and Hess.
That specific leak has been disproven on other factors, though I could still see that being the case in the show. If so, maybe he wouldn’t know his true origin
@@QuinnTheGM I sure hope it's false, because if they wanted to do the whole "you don't really need Valyrian blood to ride a dragon" thing, they could have just kept Nettles in the story
@@merilumit looks like the leaks were half-right. Ulf actually has no idea if the story his mother told him was true or not
@@merilum The thing is, exactly BECAUSE they ditch out Nettles that they probably think of using Ulf for this purpose.
Totally thought the suspected mom in the picture would be Saera!!😅 I don't remember where I heard that but she was a suspect as well!
It's more likely he's Saera's illegitimate son since she opened up a pleasure house in Essos once she left Westeros, and she was very "popular" as a silver-haired foreign princess.
Saera wasn’t sent away to Essos. She was sent to live with her sister Septa Maegelle to “learn a lesson” Saera escaped and was able to get passage to Essos where she chose to work in a brothel house.
There’s a theory that Saera was Hugh Hammers mother on the show. That would check out based on what he said about his mother being a silver haired sex worker. How did he get to Westeros makes that theory harder but it’s still possible.
They made up some random Targaryen princess, married her to a darklyn of all houses and then made a modern day darklyn forget( must be the amnesia juice in westerosi water) even though that would be common knowledge in the house for hundreds of years after. The show is high quality fan fiction. You don’t have to read too much into things. I like the show it’s very entertaining. Just sit back and enjoy the visuals and acting performance.
Well we did get a scene of Allicent walking into water this episode, seems to me like it might be a nod to this.. Since that would also give more to that random scene.
I think the seeds, particularly the two betrayers, are Daemon’s kids. In the book, he’s constantly trying to get Rhaenyra to elevate them to lordships and give them important lands. Plus Ulf and Hugh are supposed to be from Dragonstone which was Daemon’s seat for some time.
He tried to get Rhaenyra to give them lands and titles because a) the blacks had very few dragon riding allies, and b) he understood that if you’re going to give a man a dragon, you need to ENSURE he’s gonna be loyal to you and no one else. And he was right.
he did those things because he knew they needed a reason to be loyal
I never thought of this before and it definitely seems like something the show would do. I like the idea of it because it gives Gael more importance besides having a cool nickname, being a crutch for Alysanne, and just having a horrific story for assault and suicide. There was always so many questions about this story because of how we knew she was always by Alysanne's side but in this one instance. (And unfortunately it tracks with GRRM's writing pattern of F&B to kill off or just straight up stop mentioning the moms after the kids are born.)
And I do like the idea of Alysanne being the one to give up the child. We definitely know Jaehaerys was violently possessive of his daughters virginity, I wouldn't put it past him to be willing to kill a baby in the name of preserving her honor (when in reality it would be about him). Alysanne would know this and in the effort to to protect her daughter and the baby - it looks like bastards and any unwanted kids are given to the Faith or citadel so if Ulf mentions any connection to that it could be help this theory, at the very least it would hint that he was hidden away - it completely backfire as it sends Gael in a depressive spiral. It would certainly follow the theme of Jaehaerys and Alysanne failing their kids so much they either stood by or actively paid a part in the circumstances which got their kids killed.
The theory that Ulf is Rhaenys' brother, the bastard of the older brother of Balon is more probable, he is younger than Rhaenys but close in age and he was most likely born in King's landing, Gael is too young.
Will you do one for Hugh? I think the latest episode got me really thinking that i am almost certain know the targ parent of Hugh
I feel like it’s so clear as to not need a video lol
@@QuinnTheGM lol. My card/money is on Saera Targaryen because when Hugh said that her mother worked in a pleasure house and said he was just like his brother's sons i instantly clicked for me. I think you have the same as me but who do you think it is? And do you think this will ever be explored futher because him knowing his mother could change his story completely from the books.
at the council of 101 a man came claiming to be jaehaerys son could ulf or hugh be a child of this bastard, the only reason we say he isnt a bastard is jaehaerys his word in a public setting in front of a 1000+ lords so him denying would be normal and why would george put in that random claiment
Hugh Hammer! You were close! Hugh makes a bit more sense cause he rides vermithor (his grandfather’s dragon)
I just don’t really see the purpose in the story for him to be lying, unless he’s not a dragonseed at all. Like it changes nothing if it’s another Targaryen, and they’ve already made up Aeriana so we know they have no problem just bullshitting something, we should be happy that Baelon’s at least canon.
It can change perception based on which Targ it is. When he says he's a brother of Viserys, that matters if the small folk are currently missing the days of Viserys. That gives him more clout than Gael, who had little impact on the people in comparison.
He probably doesn´t know who his parents are. He just bluffs.
Love all your videos!
Isnt it kind of weird they gave Ulf grey hair in the tv show but Hugh Silver blonde hair, maybe hes gonna do a gandalf and come back as Ulf the White
To be fair baelon passed the better part of his life as a widow, he having a moment of weakness, longing, mourning etc and sleeping with a prostitute or something like that don’t make him necessarily unfaithful or loveless to Alyssa Imo
True!
Especially if said prostitute had dirty blonde hair, green eyes, a crooked nose and a lopsided smile, which, let’s be honest, probably ain’t that rare in fleabottom. It’s not like Alyssa was noted as a great Valyrian beauty, quite the opposite. Her looks were closer to common than Valyrian, so it wouldn’t have been hard to stumble across a prostitute that heavily resembled her
Yeah, maybe. The thing about royal bastards, especially the royal bastards of male children, is that they're pretty easy to sweep under the rug. We know for example that there were long stretches during J and A's marriage where they weren't talking, and Jaehaerys himself could have sired a bastard during that time, and so could have Aemon or Baelon. I don't think you need to resurrect a faked stillbirth to find a logical place for Ulf to fit. He's noteworthy for a few months while he's riding a dragon and soon enough he's dead. The juice ain't worth the squeeze on this one.
Personally, I think Ulf is telling the truth that he is Baelon’s son. Clearly there must have been some connection between the Prince and his mother for everybody to believe it. He is the only one who openly criticises the Royal Family without consequence. It seems like an open secret.
Saera is Hugh Hammers mother .
Condolences for having to read The Awakening in high school
Them: Team Green or Team Black?
Me: Team Ulf!
He could be an affair during Baelor's matrimony (less toxic doesn't mean that Baelor was allways faithful), he seems older than Daeron
hes actually 18 just looks really bad!!
Ranking all chapters video when?
Sometime after this season of HotD
Ulf the White = Ulf White = Off White = OffWhite = Offset. Ulf the White is the third member of the Migos.
13 children and only two sons made it to adulthood. I feel so bad for Alysanne and Jae Jae.
Edit: Vaegon was also a child of Alysanne and Jae. He became a maester
Three. Vaegon is often forgotten because he didn’t make a name for himself like Aemon and Baelon did. He also ended up going to the Citadel at a pretty young age so he didn’t end up marrying unlike his brothers. He’s one of the few kids that didn’t end up dying tragically but his position as maester prevented him from being politically involved.
@@ivagavrilova2726 oh yeah my bad thanks for pointing that out
I wouldn’t be surprised in the slightest if the show writers managed to incorporate Saera Targaryen into the story somehow.
I'm kind of disappointed that they didn't end up being just a pair of brutes
Whats if Hugh the Hammer is Gael‘s bastard? And she did not really drown herself
what are your opinions on the theory that alicents 3 children represent 3 aspects of her personality halaena being her gentleness aegon her abuse and aemond her rage
Gael was younger than viserys and rhaenys and one year older than daemon
Ulf seems to be closer to these three than to Rhaenyra so its impossible for him to be her son
I miss Rhaenys 😢
Saera's son Hugh the Hammer?
isn't the predominant theory around high that he is searas?
For her to die the year after her daughters death it makes sense for her to of lied caused it n then massivley struggled
Off White is a cooler name than Elmo Tully. 😁
Why not both? Maybe Baelon and Gael had an affair....
Ulf would be pureblooded in that case.
Combined woth the fact that it seems like baelon was alysannes favorite son and gael her favorite daughter, silverwing might have felt who ulfs parentage is.
Since a part of riders remains in their dragons and silverwing was only ridden by alysanne, it might have been tgat emotion of motherly love....
Or he is a descendant of aegon, the Conquerer, anythings possible.
In my headcanon Ulf and maybe Hugh is Vaegon’s sons, he may say he doesn’t like women but boys will be boys during puberty
6:40 I think that's a really stupid idea in all honesty. If the guy didn't want a bastard Targaryan, presumeably due to honor and chance of disputing the rightful liege and such.. surely he'd KILL the bastard and not send it off to a brothel literally only a few leagues away from the bloody capital lmao.
Wasn’t Alyssa alive when Viserra made a move on Baelon?
No
He looks too old to be only around 30, but you know in breeding doesnt typically make you age rough, HOWEVER some Targaryens tend to luck out.
If man say him a ting, him a ting. Newman and black friend Graham
So you're saying that a brother might have passed off his sister's son as his own? Nay, seems completely unlike Martin's writing style.
JEA HEA REUS
GA E LA
SE A RA
you feel me?
Show spoilers!! he is the son of Saera Targaryen
Hugh is Saera's son, not Ulf. The video is about Ulf.
@@grigorov1914well Hugh says his mom worked in brothel , had silver hair - assuming it’s Saera. Ulf I think just got lucky , I think he has questionable lineage
Imagine if instead of being named Ulf the White he was named Ulf the Freak and ... nah, better to stop there
Ulf the sot
I disagree. I feel that ulf is a bastard of probably Jaehaerys' bastard.
I feel like if he was one of Big J’s bastards born during one of his rifts with Alysanne, there’s no way he would have allowed him to stay in kings landing let alone Westeros. J would be so paranoid that his wife would find out about his indiscretion that he’d likely have the child taken to one of the free cities.
J-man was so paranoid about Targ bastards that I wouldn’t be entirely shocked if he didn’t let the child live. I doubt he’d intentionally kill it, but a long sea voyage is certainly dangerous for a babe. J realised the danger of letting other people have dragon blood, let alone common people, and his ‘loving’ marriage was part of his PR scheme.
Yeah jaharys think about politics and what it brings by that scandal of wedlock and more claimants
I dont think the show runners care about any of this
They clearly did… it’s not Ulf it’s Hugh. Haven’t you watched 2x7?
Ulf is lying 🤥 I believe he's a Targaryen bastard but not the son of Baelon
What does Fantasy Haven say? As his higher subscribers count gives his opinion more weight
Nah
Good call-especially for text. Alyssane and Jaehaerys have 13 children-wana bet only 3 of THOSE 13 are actually theirs together? Alysanne got around...the prophecy of Maggie the Frog to Cersei applies to Jaehaerys and Alysanne as well.
First