@@helgemoller5158 well, nobody cares what you use untill you start to talk about it, don't want to shame anyone but i don't think that conflict was one-sided.
out of all of my printers, my Voron 2.4 is my favorite and most used. excited to see where you go from here with the Voron family. Can't say it enough, many thanks to the Voron team for providing such great platforms.
Tom, thank you for sharing your experience with us. On behalf of most of the community that uses Klipper I would like to apologize for the rude behavior of the individuals involved. I appreciate that you took another route of trying something different. It a great opportunity to see how other firmwares work with a Voron as well as other printers.
i builded my voron 2.4 just 2 month ago,or so ..... and i can say, your way of thinking is exactly the same as mine. also it is my favorite printer now - not only because it is awesome - it is also builed by myself and this is something to be proud of and i am happy with it :)
I really hate stepper motors that are directly wired instead of having a connector. It's inconvenient and I'm always convinced the wire will break just inside the motor.
It's easier to solder a new wire on the board than to replace the connector, tho. But both would need opening the stepper, which a lot of people are against of.
@@mechanicallydev4536 That is true, but you'd really have to mistreat the connector to have it fail, where as the wire could fatigue **relatively** easily.
@@_Piers_ It depends on the motor, I have some minibeas that have the shittiest connectors I have ever seen. But agreed, most of the time connectors only get ruined by overcurrent.
@@mechanicallydev4536 It's almost always easier to snip apart the connector with sidecutters and desolder each individual pin. Considering it's probably those cheap JST connectors that would fail
Maybe try building a ratrig core v3 when you want another multi day build. Can buy a kit from ratrig, or source the parts yourself as its also open source. I have the 300 kit on order.
Sorry you had a bad time with the Klipper community. I plan to give their firmware a go in the future, so I appreciate the heads-up about the community. I hope you do give it a shot though at some point, if only to test the efficacy of the accelerometer tuning feature. Thanks for the content!
This was fun to watch in the Livestream and to see how that Black Magic comes together. I would love to see a Project like this again or tuning it for more Printheads etc. would be fun.
This was an awesome series and glad you made this as a final taking point video. I've went back and forth on if I want to build one and it seemed a lot of hassle, but now I see it's really not, just lots of detail. I look forward to building this after my move
To prevent random skips many CNC builders use 4 conductor shielded speaker wire. The 4 color coded wires simplify cable management with stepper motors. I used something like the following from Amazon for an X-Carve build a number of years ago: 18/4 AWG Shielded CNC Wire (50FT) - Flexible Stranded Shielded 18-Gauge 4-Conductor Cable for Stepper Motors, CNC Machines, NEMA Motors, VFD Spindles, CNC Routers, 3D Printers and more!
With it being fully open, I'm hoping there will eventually be distributors of this family of printers willing to assemble, quality check, support & ship these machines, either close to original spec or heavily tweaked -- Kind of like how Prusa became a popular blueprint/template for others. I especially love the clean look of the dragchains!
Awesome voron! I have been planning a 2.4 for a while now! Also, the bed is not supposed to be insolated bc the machine itself is supposed to be enclosed. Insulating the bed will only effect how the chamber heats up.
Gah, this video has triggered a cascading ripple in the time space continuum. I have a small 200x200 bed slinger i3 based printer that I've had for a good amount of time. Now I have the itch to build this beast at 350x350. But there's no logical reason for this. The most valuable thing I've printed with my printer are more printer parts. But alas, my youtube history is now filled with Voron build/configuration videos, and there is only one way this story ends. Must Build Voron. Thanks Tom.
The speed aspect is attractive - I got a taste of that with my Delta and liked it. Can't wait to see the next iterations of this style printer. As far as the printer software, is concerned - it's almost become a "monotheistic religion" for some folks. I like the innovations and improvements that each are introducing and challenging the others to keep up, but everyone should have the right to choose. If there was only one "right" software, we'd likely miss out on many of the innovations and improvements that have been introduced.
Yes. 5 days for a full plate build is a bit much. Especially when it crashes and burns on the 5th day from a slicing error you couldn't see till it printed.
I'm using glass fibre based insulation under silicone heaters. Its normally used in (race/rc) cards and two layers of the material will work just fine. Needs some wrapping with Kapton tape to stop the glass fibres from ending up in your skin on the sides.
The Voron and BLV MGN Cube communities are both great. The open source, group project style printers are truly how we'll advance 3D printing as a whole.
@@Tedlasman Mods that are not available publicly are still in test and constantly changing. It can be very confusing for newcomers, so they are released only when they are done.
I one hundred percent blame you for getting me into this awesome but expensive hobby. I'm still working on getting all the parts for my voron... but you should know that I printed all the parts for it using the Prusa clone I built a few years back following some of your old videos (the one with the plywood frame). While I wasn't expecting to get to follow another one of your guides, I am glad to get the opportunity. Thank you.
As of the release of this video, I can honestly say that yours and Teaching Tech are my top viewing options. I watch quite a bit of different content, and you've continued to both educate and entertain. Thank you Tom. I have never joined a Patreon, but yours may be the first.
Hey Tom! This is way off of what you normally do...but if you got into reviewing CNC routers and machines for home shops, then I would love that. I've followed your channel for years, and I honestly trust your opinions the most for hardware choices.
I am almost done with A formbot kit. For anyone wondering, they include precrimped wires. The steppers are now moons brand. They include triangle labs hotends and sunon maglev fans too.
i would love to see you do a retrobuild, so a RepRap Darwin or something, but with modern components like an SKR board, a V6/Copperheard, a nice PCB bed etc just not skeinforge, I wouldn't ask you to do that
@@MadeWithLayers yeah it wouldnt be fair to go that far back, but a half gen ahead seems fair game. a RepRap made with a printer with decent print quality :P
Putting connectors on the motors is an obvious must-have for me and should be for anyone else considering building one of these. The fact that they are hard-wired is insane to me. Motors go bad, and steppers burn out. When you're troubleshooting you need to be able to quickly swap two of the motors or unplug one entirely to measure the signals on the wires without going under the machine. If you build a machine like this as if it will never break, then you will be in trouble when it does. But if you realize this is a machine that will be tinkered with, upgraded, aligned, and repaired frequently and you design/build it accordingly, you will have a much better time.
I love your video, it's just what I was looking for to convince me to buy a Voron 2.4. Just tell you one more thing: the lower plastic sheet is bending because you have not put the fans at the bottom. Apart from the enclosure the printer is missing many parts from the bottom.
For anyone else looking to build a Voron using Duet 3 electronics, may I suggest using a tool board to drive the hot end instead of the EXP3HC board that Tom used. It costs less, it greatly reduces the number of wires going to the hot end, and version 1.1 has a built-in accelerometer to help calibrate input shaping. But you will need to find a way to mount it on the print head
I have a designed a mount for the Galileo variant of the afterburner as well as an other one for the standard afterburner which works, but needs a bit more love, so that bit is kinda covered. I however use the Mini 5+ with the 2 stepper extension instead of the duet 3 6HC, better suited for a V2 as it also supports the Mini12864.
Great review. I think the big plus is speed. This is worth the cost alone IMO. When doing proto's you want something in your hands ASAP. This very much speeds up the development cycle. Even for a company this would be worth having in the proto lab!
I have a friend with the Voron and the Rat Rig and he prefers the rat rig. Given the glowing review you just gave the Voron I have to ask him why he prefers the Rat Rig.
Not sure if anyone's mentioned it yet or not, but the reason for no insulation under the bed is to help add heat to the build chamber when you have it enclosed. In this case, it's planned "inefficiency" in order to create a better environment to print ABS. That said, you really need to use an ABS or Dibond panel under the bed because of it.
Is that an official statement? Because it sounds wrong to me. Without insulation the heat from the bed would be way too much to keep the chamber warm and most of it had to be vented out to not overheat the chamber.
@@MetalheadAndNerd so you’re saying it seems wrong to you, then also saying it works too well when using it that way? I’m slightly confused which way you’re leaning here…
@@Jared01 Yes. It seems wrong because it wastes energy. A bed with normal insulation on the bottom, together with the heat from the print head, would also be enough to heat the chamber without the need to vent much of the produced heat out.
I've got the Formbot Troodon 400x400x500 version with orbiter direct drive, and honestly, im actually blown away by it, Prusa and Ultimaker are no match for it. The true gantry/bed leveling works like a dream.
I would not hold the Klipper project accountable for some butt heads in the community. It does look super cool, and I personally think it would be silly to not cover the cool stuff that project is doing because of bad actors. I hope you change your mind, because some of the features like input shaper have really sparked my interest in building my Voron.
Thanks for your feedback on your build experience. So sorry for those who ended up harrasing about Klipper, I used it and love it but it is your printer, you do what you want/like with it. I've myself didn't do as everybody in community was saying. The people that say source all parts yourself, and build it stock first where the one that I ditched. The Magistudio kit that I bought was awesome. The 10 mods plus that I have planned before printing everything where also a good thing for me. Happy printing :P
Great take on this printer. Having built a "V0.1" it is definitely a compelling diy project rather than something for business use. The plastic parts for one thing tend to crack, and the "diy" mountings and stuff have been coming loose for me lately, etc. Very sexy when it is running, though, for sure.
Sad to hear but not surprised that a bunch of tw*ts from reddit have ruined your experience with the software. I hope at some point you can give klipper a whirl.
I wanted to build a Voron printer (or the Voron zero) so bad! It seems like such a well-engineered printer that's ahead of its time (and also has a strong community!)
I'd suggest looking at the base printer this was inspired from, Hypercube or Hypercube Evolution. I feel HEVORT (also another mix on the hypercube) would be a good competitor to this. Hypercube was DIY 3-in-1 printer,cnc, laser machine
Would recommend getting drag chains that open to anyone going to build one. Mines still sitting with only the gantry wiring needing to be finished, just about ready to order new drag chains and make a new loom to get it going.
For insulation under the print bed I bought a caulking gun style tube of automotive RTV silicone. I went with the orange high temp which is way overkill of course. The material can be shaped into any shape, adheres to everything, and it is oil and water and should be acetone resistant. There is a lot of acetic acid vented given the relatively huge amount of material being placed. A 300ml tube is around 12 dollars here so it is cheap. Also it bonds to itself after curing. I have a new idea to use it. I was looking to add strain relief for the heated bed wiring. I am going to print a mold that will allow my wiring to be set inside and then flood the RTV into the space to create a rubber type strain relief.
I am slowly working my way up to build one of these. Thanks for your recommendations on what you would do differently and being realistic about the cost and time associated with building a Voron.
Thomas.. I have Trex 3 printer and even though it's not beginners printer.. I love it.. they went a long way .. I love they are there for the community and helping solve issues.. Ada is great .. when people ask me what I have I say I have Formbot Trex 3 and they want to buy it.. I tell them don't because I went through things on it that just didn't work well or failed after while but for large printing at at higher speeds,I absolutely love it.. the fact the printer was around 1700 usd for DUAL extruder setup at 400x400x700.. yeah.. Josef makes great products.. and me being Czech I would love to recommend it but I just can't... just cant justify the prices.. they should have sent you the T3 not the raptor.. I think you would appreciate it
for space, you could build a 250mm, for the money, well you will have to wait I guess, the Voron 1.8 is also cheaper to build and apparently produce the same quality and speed. the 2.4 is just more sexy.
@@_Piers_ and that one also gets a really decent looking kit soon, as Nero3dp showed of on his channel. I think he only disliked a handful of smaller things about that
I am hovering over the but button on the 350 x 350 voron upgrade build, most likely going to buy this today... This video and comments are really pushing me over that edge.
I know this is an old video but I believe that aluminum that came with it is billet because of the machine marks on the other side. They CNCd the one side and the other that looks like a rolled piece is how older billet blocks look. Aluminum isn't the best at showing rolled to billet but it looks billet.
@@3dprintingcave778 … I will make most parts myself, bed, corner plates, t-slot nuts, acme screws, hotend etc. will just buy the 3030 T-Slot extrusion in 6m lengths and buy the linear rails
Ratrig to the US from the UK is almost a $2K machine. I would love to build a Ratrig, but Voron is about 1/2 that cost especially with a Formbot kit. What I don't recommend is self-sourcing for Voron (it is a major PITA).
Before I decided to go fully resin, I very much considered this platform and looked at building one at length. Very nice assembly, Tom, and many happy printings to come!
@@romanmgelman Mostly for the tremendous bump in resolution for the things I like to print; 7" figures and architectural models for metal casting. The inherent speed with MSLA and being able to print either multiple models or all of one figure at one time is really nice too however.
such a shame that happened with klipper, it's such a good firmware for going fast with the input shaper and every optimization, it prints fast and clean, so sad that you won't engage in that because of some annoying people
Personally running Subtle Design Staymag instead of Energetic as it is guaranteed to 150 degrees Celsius. I also had adhesion issues with the Energetic sheet after a few uses.
I can hear it in your voice. The satisfaction, and i cant blame you. I have been following along with he Voron design and the 2.4 is definitely a nice machine. I am glad to see you come to the dark side. Or the right side. Well the CoreXY side. I build a custom coreXY last year using some 3d printed designs from an open source corexy community and i love it. It is however a shadow in the light of the Voron 2.4. no auto bed level and the bed does move rather than the XY chassis design of the Voron. Great build videos on the Voron too. If i do male that jump i will certainly be using your videos for some reference. Sorry about the Trouble the Klipper guys caused you. I have seen the Prusa Trolls do the same to other people and its a shame. More importantly not necessary! Its like little political trolls running around causing havoc for propaganda when all the 3d printing community wants is a nice, friendly supporting community that respects all equally. I also love the content and more importantly your honesty and fairness. At the end of the day it is that that makes me a subscriber and you a great UA-camr. Dont change! You are a part of something great and we appreciate what you do!
@@MadeWithLayers I can't believe you're not curious :) rat rig also has some cool features, in fact all these community projects work together to still improving all stuff.
I think to do a Ratrig V3.0 for your next build and then to do a comparison between the two builds will make for excellent content. You have excellent content and I really appreciate your channel.
I built my Sparklab SparkCube XL several years ago and this reminds me a lot of that project. Printed all the parts on a wooden Printerbot 1405. The self leveling bed design was pretty revolutionary at the time, and still is even when software leveling is standard on most machines. I would be hard pressed to "upgrade" to another printer but this looks like a good project if my SparkCube ever decides to self destruct.
I was a total a-hole about this printer until I saw you demo the thing. Holey shit! I had no idea what this Voron 2.4 Build was all about. Nobody really did it justice, except you Thomas. "Now I'm all in." If ever there was a journey to make, the Voron 2.4 is well worth the adventure. I am dedicated now. Thanks, Thomas Sanladerer, you are the man!
Hey, Thomas! Great video, as usual. How you describe the overall quality of the printed parts by this machine, compared to the commercial printers, like Raise3D, as an example? I also would like to see you building Voron Switchwire. Voron 2.4 is a great performer. But Switchwire, in my opinion is a straight "killer" of Prusa MK3 and any other printer with similar kinematics.
Sorry for the necro on this... I decided to take the big step into the deep end. I went down the core XY rabbit hole on UA-cam and somehow settled on the Voron 2.4. I looked at your build spec and will likely adopt all but the hot end and the main board. the Fystech seems to be overbuilt, which is what I like. I have selected the Volcano at the current winner. My current FDM printers are a Lotmaxx SC-10 and a Flsun qqs pro. To say I am seriously considering being in over my head is an understatement. To say I'm excited by the possibilities would be a massive understatement! I'm not truly interested in insane speeds, but want exceptional accuracy. (All that said, the speed would not make me sad). Am I looking at the wrong project?
What are your goals with the printer? Both are very capable, but the Voron is designed specifically for ABS, which can be a problem with Rat Rig's V-Core 3 PETG parts.
@@brisance Many people don't print ABS for a lot of reasons, warping and delamination being the most common; PETG is just easier to print on a Creality printer, for instance, so it's easier to use it to bootstrap a V-Core 3. Your answer, while true, may not be feasible for everyone.
Ein hervorragendes Video wie immer! Ich träume schon soo lange von einem 3D Drucker. Aber das wird wohl nix mehr. Ich habe jedes Video gesehen. Immer erstklassiger Content. Der Voron ist einfach Wahnsinn!
I'd basically love a Voron made by Prusa Research or someone else who was able to offer great support and lower the barrier to entry for less technical people like me
@@DamienAristodemo yes, prusa already confirmed it will be a CoreXY. But it will not be named the Mk3Xl, instead it will become the Prusa XL, like the Prusa Mini.
Excluding a huge sub community and labeling them as toxic solely because of a bunch of trolling morons that none of us "normal people" want to be associated with seems a tad dramatic to me. I wasn't there to see what happened though. Glad you like your machine, the Voron guys make great stuff! :)
After four years of tuning, caring for and maintaining my printer, I have managed to push it to 85 mm/s (Anet A6) with 0.25mm nozzle. No ringing, stable extrusion, no ghosting, identical prints without issues, just reliable worker. Vorons were shown to achieve 600 mm/s reliably without any trouble whatsoever. I guess that's a call for upgrade - it's like swapping Pentium MMX 200 MHz for an Athlon XP 2500+...
I wish you showed your speeds and prints at those speeds next to it instead of saying 3x the ender because it's very vague! it's very weird but there's rarely any actual print results of prints from the voron community. i try to find them a lot but there's rarely any that showcases the print quality very well.
thats true or show actual speed they printed the piece at i would like to see someone with a 2.4 print a large detailed print at fast speeds and see what it looks like
For reference, the fan shroud I showed was a 2 hour 41 minute print on the 2.4 - 250mm/s, 10kmm/s², 0.6mm nozzle, 0.3mm layers. Basically 100% infill. Slicer estimates for other printers (with default settings) MK3 0.15mm 20h MK3 0.3mm 9h D25 0.2mm 21h (scaled to 96% height to fit) CE-6 SE 0.2mm 26h Neptune 2 0.2mm 23h
but i have not found a good and complete Step-by-Step guide from the Kuaih, ssh into your pi, connecting to the controller .... and so the first time installing klopper is a bit of a hedache😢, once its up and running its awesome
Were those "trolls from the kl*pper community" actually from the community or just causal users that only joined the stream for a few minutes? I ask because I was also a user that loves the new life the software brought to my printers, but I actually heard you explaining why you are not using it so I refrained myself from doing comments that may be seen as toxic. It was from your stream chat that I learned RRF also has those features in or in the works.
he is using Duet, so he doesn't need Klipper. And I know some peoples where really arassing him. I remember during one of his live video that he told one user that he is deciding what to do or not on his printer. He was really fed up. You know him, he is like very calm normally.
While I'm personally not sure either, I've seen comments like "it's not a Voron unless it runs klipper" under the streams in the comments section (not the stream chat). I hate gatekeeping of that sort personally, and while I enjoy klipper myself as well, any other firmware performs comparably in most use cases, so there's no immediate need to use klipper. There's no reason anyone should be entitled to force some other 3d printer tinkerer onto any firmware, and I totally understand that it leaves a sour taste about the whole firmware once multiple people try to do exactly that.
Yeah not sure either, it must be a minority and it's a real shame he got that experience. I use it as well and indeed, like you say, has brought new life to my printer. So I think it's great, but I also side way more to the regular Voron community I guess. Shame as I really would've loved seeing Thom test it.
I lost my mind at visually seeing automatic z-axis tramming, that's absolutely wild and cool
It's essentially an inverted railcore, but with four Z motors instead of three.
Glad the voron designs are finally getting mainstream attention.
Happy to hear you are enjoying the machine! So good to see it working out great for ya!
Minute 14:00 it´s a shame about the Klipper Community. I like Klipper but that´s not a dogma. As it work´s for Thomas who cares !?
It was an awesome build - thanks for hanging around during the streams!
@@MadeWithLayers anytime. Happy to help 👍
@@helgemoller5158 well, nobody cares what you use untill you start to talk about it, don't want to shame anyone but i don't think that conflict was one-sided.
I only wish it was direct drive 😭
out of all of my printers, my Voron 2.4 is my favorite and most used. excited to see where you go from here with the Voron family. Can't say it enough, many thanks to the Voron team for providing such great platforms.
This is currently on my "dream printer" list. I just dont print enough really to justify the "investment" to my wife... but it is SOOOO tempting
Agree. This is kind of a group printer where the team gets to use at full capacity.
If I don't build one of these, the Anycubic Vyper is my next printer.
For the price of the Voron, I could buy a Vyper and a resin printer, hahaha
let me talk to your wife. I can convince her.
Build a Voron 0: it's smaller, cheaper, and can easily outperform their siblings, the only downside being the print volume (120mm cubed).
I'm in the same boat! I want a Voron so bad but it's hard to justify it when I have several crealities.
Tom, thank you for sharing your experience with us. On behalf of most of the community that uses Klipper I would like to apologize for the rude behavior of the individuals involved.
I appreciate that you took another route of trying something different. It a great opportunity to see how other firmwares work with a Voron as well as other printers.
i builded my voron 2.4 just 2 month ago,or so ..... and i can say, your way of thinking is exactly the same as mine. also it is my favorite printer now - not only because it is awesome - it is also builed by myself and this is something to be proud of and i am happy with it :)
I really hate stepper motors that are directly wired instead of having a connector.
It's inconvenient and I'm always convinced the wire will break just inside the motor.
It's easier to solder a new wire on the board than to replace the connector, tho. But both would need opening the stepper, which a lot of people are against of.
@@mechanicallydev4536 That is true, but you'd really have to mistreat the connector to have it fail, where as the wire could fatigue **relatively** easily.
@@_Piers_ It depends on the motor, I have some minibeas that have the shittiest connectors I have ever seen. But agreed, most of the time connectors only get ruined by overcurrent.
@@mechanicallydev4536 It's almost always easier to snip apart the connector with sidecutters and desolder each individual pin. Considering it's probably those cheap JST connectors that would fail
Maybe try building a ratrig core v3 when you want another multi day build. Can buy a kit from ratrig, or source the parts yourself as its also open source. I have the 300 kit on order.
we would love to see more videos involving the voron...! Cant wait for my parts to arrive (350mm cube version)
Sorry you had a bad time with the Klipper community. I plan to give their firmware a go in the future, so I appreciate the heads-up about the community. I hope you do give it a shot though at some point, if only to test the efficacy of the accelerometer tuning feature. Thanks for the content!
The tip about putting insulation on the bed was a great one.
I used golden heat insulating tape and have almost no warping on my 350mm build.
This was fun to watch in the Livestream and to see how that Black Magic comes together.
I would love to see a Project like this again or tuning it for more Printheads etc. would be fun.
i love my voron 2.4, its a beast of printer. if anyone who builds a voron wants to support the voron team for their efforts they do sell merch.
This was an awesome series and glad you made this as a final taking point video. I've went back and forth on if I want to build one and it seemed a lot of hassle, but now I see it's really not, just lots of detail. I look forward to building this after my move
To prevent random skips many CNC builders use 4 conductor shielded speaker wire. The 4 color coded wires simplify cable management with stepper motors. I used something like the following from Amazon for an X-Carve build a number of years ago:
18/4 AWG Shielded CNC Wire (50FT) - Flexible Stranded Shielded 18-Gauge 4-Conductor Cable for Stepper Motors, CNC Machines, NEMA Motors, VFD Spindles, CNC Routers, 3D Printers and more!
You are so tempting me to build one, thank you Thomas I have really enjoyed following this, apart from the idiots that annoyed you of course.
With it being fully open, I'm hoping there will eventually be distributors of this family of printers willing to assemble, quality check, support & ship these machines, either close to original spec or heavily tweaked -- Kind of like how Prusa became a popular blueprint/template for others. I especially love the clean look of the dragchains!
Damn it Thomas, I already wanted to build one I didn't need this video tempting me!
Awesome voron! I have been planning a 2.4 for a while now!
Also, the bed is not supposed to be insolated bc the machine itself is supposed to be enclosed. Insulating the bed will only effect how the chamber heats up.
yea, I think it's a case of low quality formbot panels. My ABS panels have not warped - first I've seen this problem.
Gah, this video has triggered a cascading ripple in the time space continuum. I have a small 200x200 bed slinger i3 based printer that I've had for a good amount of time. Now I have the itch to build this beast at 350x350. But there's no logical reason for this. The most valuable thing I've printed with my printer are more printer parts. But alas, my youtube history is now filled with Voron build/configuration videos, and there is only one way this story ends. Must Build Voron. Thanks Tom.
Just completed my 2.4 build from form bot kit. Thanks to you, nero 3d and vector 3d, it became a fun learning experience 🙏
The speed aspect is attractive - I got a taste of that with my Delta and liked it. Can't wait to see the next iterations of this style printer. As far as the printer software, is concerned - it's almost become a "monotheistic religion" for some folks. I like the innovations and improvements that each are introducing and challenging the others to keep up, but everyone should have the right to choose. If there was only one "right" software, we'd likely miss out on many of the innovations and improvements that have been introduced.
Yes. 5 days for a full plate build is a bit much. Especially when it crashes and burns on the 5th day from a slicing error you couldn't see till it printed.
I'm using glass fibre based insulation under silicone heaters. Its normally used in (race/rc) cards and two layers of the material will work just fine. Needs some wrapping with Kapton tape to stop the glass fibres from ending up in your skin on the sides.
The Voron and BLV MGN Cube communities are both great. The open source, group project style printers are truly how we'll advance 3D printing as a whole.
Not sure if voron can be considered open source since one needs to have a serial to access most of usermods.
@@Tedlasman the voronuser repository is publicly available on GitHub
@@christophmuller3511 there's another one that's not publicly available. Its where that direct drive z mod is, for example.
@@Tedlasman Mods that are not available publicly are still in test and constantly changing. It can be very confusing for newcomers, so they are released only when they are done.
@@vinnycordeiro You are welcome to make any excuses you like, doesn't change anything.
And I'm sure that there are mods that never make it out.
I one hundred percent blame you for getting me into this awesome but expensive hobby. I'm still working on getting all the parts for my voron... but you should know that I printed all the parts for it using the Prusa clone I built a few years back following some of your old videos (the one with the plywood frame). While I wasn't expecting to get to follow another one of your guides, I am glad to get the opportunity. Thank you.
Thanks for the recap! Cant wait to see how this is used in your future projects.
As of the release of this video, I can honestly say that yours and Teaching Tech are my top viewing options. I watch quite a bit of different content, and you've continued to both educate and entertain. Thank you Tom. I have never joined a Patreon, but yours may be the first.
Did you join his patreon?
Hey Tom! This is way off of what you normally do...but if you got into reviewing CNC routers and machines for home shops, then I would love that. I've followed your channel for years, and I honestly trust your opinions the most for hardware choices.
I am almost done with A formbot kit. For anyone wondering, they include precrimped wires. The steppers are now moons brand. They include triangle labs hotends and sunon maglev fans too.
i would love to see you do a retrobuild, so a RepRap Darwin or something, but with modern components like an SKR board, a V6/Copperheard, a nice PCB bed etc
just not skeinforge, I wouldn't ask you to do that
I've thought about that - my first printer was a Sells and that certainly had its... charme.
@@MadeWithLayers yeah it wouldnt be fair to go that far back, but a half gen ahead seems fair game. a RepRap made with a printer with decent print quality :P
Putting connectors on the motors is an obvious must-have for me and should be for anyone else considering building one of these. The fact that they are hard-wired is insane to me. Motors go bad, and steppers burn out. When you're troubleshooting you need to be able to quickly swap two of the motors or unplug one entirely to measure the signals on the wires without going under the machine. If you build a machine like this as if it will never break, then you will be in trouble when it does. But if you realize this is a machine that will be tinkered with, upgraded, aligned, and repaired frequently and you design/build it accordingly, you will have a much better time.
I love your video, it's just what I was looking for to convince me to buy a Voron 2.4. Just tell you one more thing: the lower plastic sheet is bending because you have not put the fans at the bottom. Apart from the enclosure the printer is missing many parts from the bottom.
Great to see Thomas really happy about a printer!!!
You should really print and put on the skirts btw, it makes it look that more finished and pretty immediately!
Also helps with dust if not in use ;)
I prefer the cleaner look without the skirts
You've assembled/built and tested a lot of printers, so your opinion here matters a lot.
Working on a Voron 0.1 now, but a 2.4 is the endgame.
Thanks Tom for your insights as usual. That is definitely a promising design I wish I actually have room for.
For anyone else looking to build a Voron using Duet 3 electronics, may I suggest using a tool board to drive the hot end instead of the EXP3HC board that Tom used. It costs less, it greatly reduces the number of wires going to the hot end, and version 1.1 has a built-in accelerometer to help calibrate input shaping. But you will need to find a way to mount it on the print head
I have a designed a mount for the Galileo variant of the afterburner as well as an other one for the standard afterburner which works, but needs a bit more love, so that bit is kinda covered. I however use the Mini 5+ with the 2 stepper extension instead of the duet 3 6HC, better suited for a V2 as it also supports the Mini12864.
@@christophmuller3511 the tool board works with the Mini5+ too.
@@davidcrocker4285 I know, that’s how I use it :)
Just want to say I’m building a v0.1 thanks to you and Stefan hyping these machines up 😂
I wouldn't recommend getting a kit tho...take your time an source the right parts for you to get a rocksolid printer. Have fun!
I built mine a month ago, fantastic printer, great value for money, and a very fun project to do
I watched the live streams and really enjoyed them and learned a lot from the process too!
Great review. I think the big plus is speed. This is worth the cost alone IMO. When doing proto's you want something in your hands ASAP. This very much speeds up the development cycle. Even for a company this would be worth having in the proto lab!
The build was a lot of fun - which printer should I build from scratch next?
Another voron! Try the v0.
Do another delta build! The last one was cool, but it'd be cool to really watch a live, more in-depth build.
I'd love to see you build a HevORT! Really enjoyed this build
Rat Rig V-Core 3
Rat Rig V-Core 3
Voron is what inspired me to put effort in making my 3D printer mods look good.
"Doesnt take much deskspace"
Meanwhile Voron takes up half a screen xD Its good that its cubic, that is space saving in a long run.
Would love to see an update to this. Even what your thoughts are on the new voron fixes and updates
I love the way that Thomas's thumbnails are almost ironically algorithm friendly
You can hear the excitement and happiness when he talks about this printer. Couldn't happen to a better guy!
This is really cool. I hope the speed will be a common thing in 3D printers in the future.
I’m super interested in the Jubilee tool changer project and would love if it got some coverage.
I have a friend with the Voron and the Rat Rig and he prefers the rat rig. Given the glowing review you just gave the Voron I have to ask him why he prefers the Rat Rig.
Please reply with his answer.. i am wondering the same thing. Great to know for future spendings 😉
Same here.
Not sure if anyone's mentioned it yet or not, but the reason for no insulation under the bed is to help add heat to the build chamber when you have it enclosed. In this case, it's planned "inefficiency" in order to create a better environment to print ABS. That said, you really need to use an ABS or Dibond panel under the bed because of it.
Dibond seems like a good idea if that's the plan, should help reflect heat into the chamber.
Nice!
Is that an official statement? Because it sounds wrong to me. Without insulation the heat from the bed would be way too much to keep the chamber warm and most of it had to be vented out to not overheat the chamber.
@@MetalheadAndNerd so you’re saying it seems wrong to you, then also saying it works too well when using it that way? I’m slightly confused which way you’re leaning here…
And my chamber sits a bit over 60 Celsius when printing, just for the record.
@@Jared01 Yes. It seems wrong because it wastes energy. A bed with normal insulation on the bottom, together with the heat from the print head, would also be enough to heat the chamber without the need to vent much of the produced heat out.
I've got the Formbot Troodon 400x400x500 version with orbiter direct drive, and honestly, im actually blown away by it, Prusa and Ultimaker are no match for it.
The true gantry/bed leveling works like a dream.
This is an AD spam, same comment is no the Formbot Troodon website as well. Gotcha!
@@ChargedPulsar Are you kidding me? I actually ment what i said though... where can i see it?
I would not hold the Klipper project accountable for some butt heads in the community. It does look super cool, and I personally think it would be silly to not cover the cool stuff that project is doing because of bad actors. I hope you change your mind, because some of the features like input shaper have really sparked my interest in building my Voron.
I may get this for my next printer and devote a weekend for putting it together. I love the extra large print beds they have.
That is a hell of a statement. Congrats Voron Design!
Thanks for your feedback on your build experience. So sorry for those who ended up harrasing about Klipper, I used it and love it but it is your printer, you do what you want/like with it. I've myself didn't do as everybody in community was saying. The people that say source all parts yourself, and build it stock first where the one that I ditched. The Magistudio kit that I bought was awesome. The 10 mods plus that I have planned before printing everything where also a good thing for me. Happy printing :P
Excited for that battery project 😜
Great take on this printer. Having built a "V0.1" it is definitely a compelling diy project rather than something for business use. The plastic parts for one thing tend to crack, and the "diy" mountings and stuff have been coming loose for me lately, etc. Very sexy when it is running, though, for sure.
Sad to hear but not surprised that a bunch of tw*ts from reddit have ruined your experience with the software. I hope at some point you can give klipper a whirl.
I wanted to build a Voron printer (or the Voron zero) so bad! It seems like such a well-engineered printer that's ahead of its time (and also has a strong community!)
How does this compare to the RatRig VCore?
I also would like to know this.
Well, there are some powerful features with Klipper, but being open source, you can do what ever you wish, which is what we should all champion.
I'd suggest looking at the base printer this was inspired from, Hypercube or Hypercube Evolution. I feel HEVORT (also another mix on the hypercube) would be a good competitor to this. Hypercube was DIY 3-in-1 printer,cnc, laser machine
Would recommend getting drag chains that open to anyone going to build one. Mines still sitting with only the gantry wiring needing to be finished, just about ready to order new drag chains and make a new loom to get it going.
Nice vid!
I am still quite satisfied with my Prusa MK3S, but I love the static bed and printspace of the voron.
Nice build
For insulation under the print bed I bought a caulking gun style tube of automotive RTV silicone. I went with the orange high temp which is way overkill of course. The material can be shaped into any shape, adheres to everything, and it is oil and water and should be acetone resistant.
There is a lot of acetic acid vented given the relatively huge amount of material being placed.
A 300ml tube is around 12 dollars here so it is cheap.
Also it bonds to itself after curing.
I have a new idea to use it. I was looking to add strain relief for the heated bed wiring. I am going to print a mold that will allow my wiring to be set inside and then flood the RTV into the space to create a rubber type strain relief.
I am slowly working my way up to build one of these. Thanks for your recommendations on what you would do differently and being realistic about the cost and time associated with building a Voron.
Thomas.. I have Trex 3 printer and even though it's not beginners printer.. I love it.. they went a long way .. I love they are there for the community and helping solve issues.. Ada is great .. when people ask me what I have I say I have Formbot Trex 3 and they want to buy it.. I tell them don't because I went through things on it that just didn't work well or failed after while but for large printing at at higher speeds,I absolutely love it.. the fact the printer was around 1700 usd for DUAL extruder setup at 400x400x700.. yeah.. Josef makes great products.. and me being Czech I would love to recommend it but I just can't... just cant justify the prices.. they should have sent you the T3 not the raptor.. I think you would appreciate it
This thing is a dream come true, I'd love to build one one day. Unfortunately I'm still a student so no space and money hahaha
for space, you could build a 250mm, for the money, well you will have to wait I guess, the Voron 1.8 is also cheaper to build and apparently produce the same quality and speed. the 2.4 is just more sexy.
No space?
**Voron 0.1 noises**
:)
@@_Piers_ and that one also gets a really decent looking kit soon, as Nero3dp showed of on his channel. I think he only disliked a handful of smaller things about that
I am hovering over the but button on the 350 x 350 voron upgrade build, most likely going to buy this today... This video and comments are really pushing me over that edge.
I love mine as much as I love my children
Well how much do you love your children?
@@danielr9708 As much as they love their Voron.
I know this is an old video but I believe that aluminum that came with it is billet because of the machine marks on the other side. They CNCd the one side and the other that looks like a rolled piece is how older billet blocks look. Aluminum isn't the best at showing rolled to billet but it looks billet.
I like the Rat Rig V-Core-3. Just started machining parts to make one
same! What size?
500, but am considering maybe 500x750 since I am machining my own parts and can customise
Will decide when I get to that point
what parts are u machining the normally printed parts or something else
@@3dprintingcave778 … I will make most parts myself, bed, corner plates, t-slot nuts, acme screws, hotend etc. will just buy the 3030 T-Slot extrusion in 6m lengths and buy the linear rails
Ratrig to the US from the UK is almost a $2K machine. I would love to build a Ratrig, but Voron is about 1/2 that cost especially with a Formbot kit. What I don't recommend is self-sourcing for Voron (it is a major PITA).
Before I decided to go fully resin, I very much considered this platform and looked at building one at length. Very nice assembly, Tom, and many happy printings to come!
Why did you decide to fully switch to resin?
@@romanmgelman Mostly for the tremendous bump in resolution for the things I like to print; 7" figures and architectural models for metal casting. The inherent speed with MSLA and being able to print either multiple models or all of one figure at one time is really nice too however.
such a shame that happened with klipper, it's such a good firmware for going fast with the input shaper and every optimization, it prints fast and clean, so sad that you won't engage in that because of some annoying people
Personally running Subtle Design Staymag instead of Energetic as it is guaranteed to 150 degrees Celsius. I also had adhesion issues with the Energetic sheet after a few uses.
I can hear it in your voice. The satisfaction, and i cant blame you.
I have been following along with he Voron design and the 2.4 is definitely a nice machine.
I am glad to see you come to the dark side. Or the right side. Well the CoreXY side.
I build a custom coreXY last year using some 3d printed designs from an open source corexy community and i love it. It is however a shadow in the light of the Voron 2.4. no auto bed level and the bed does move rather than the XY chassis design of the Voron.
Great build videos on the Voron too. If i do male that jump i will certainly be using your videos for some reference.
Sorry about the Trouble the Klipper guys caused you. I have seen the Prusa Trolls do the same to other people and its a shame. More importantly not necessary! Its like little political trolls running around causing havoc for propaganda when all the 3d printing community wants is a nice, friendly supporting community that respects all equally.
I also love the content and more importantly your honesty and fairness. At the end of the day it is that that makes me a subscriber and you a great UA-camr. Dont change! You are a part of something great and we appreciate what you do!
The Curie point of the magnetic material is 310 deg C, if your heated bed reaches that you have other issues.
What do you think about the rat rig compared to the voron 2.4?
Haven't looked into the RatRig!
@@MadeWithLayers dude check teaching tech
@@MadeWithLayers I can't believe you're not curious :) rat rig also has some cool features, in fact all these community projects work together to still improving all stuff.
I think to do a Ratrig V3.0 for your next build and then to do a comparison between the two builds will make for excellent content. You have excellent content and I really appreciate your channel.
Must... resist...building....new... printer...
resistance is futile...
Assimilate!
Step 1: Build printer
Step 2: Print new printer
Repeat…
I built my Sparklab SparkCube XL several years ago and this reminds me a lot of that project. Printed all the parts on a wooden Printerbot 1405. The self leveling bed design was pretty revolutionary at the time, and still is even when software leveling is standard on most machines. I would be hard pressed to "upgrade" to another printer but this looks like a good project if my SparkCube ever decides to self destruct.
I would say did you checked hevort its a beast too
*Hevort
The Hevort looks amazing. But as I understand, it's still in fairly early prototype stage.
YES please
I was a total a-hole about this printer until I saw you demo the thing. Holey shit! I had no idea what this Voron 2.4 Build was all about. Nobody really did it justice, except you Thomas. "Now I'm all in." If ever there was a journey to make, the Voron 2.4 is well worth the adventure. I am dedicated now. Thanks, Thomas Sanladerer, you are the man!
Hey, Thomas! Great video, as usual. How you describe the overall quality of the printed parts by this machine, compared to the commercial printers, like Raise3D, as an example? I also would like to see you building Voron Switchwire. Voron 2.4 is a great performer. But Switchwire, in my opinion is a straight "killer" of Prusa MK3 and any other printer with similar kinematics.
Sorry for the necro on this... I decided to take the big step into the deep end. I went down the core XY rabbit hole on UA-cam and somehow settled on the Voron 2.4. I looked at your build spec and will likely adopt all but the hot end and the main board. the Fystech seems to be overbuilt, which is what I like. I have selected the Volcano at the current winner. My current FDM printers are a Lotmaxx SC-10 and a Flsun qqs pro. To say I am seriously considering being in over my head is an understatement. To say I'm excited by the possibilities would be a massive understatement! I'm not truly interested in insane speeds, but want exceptional accuracy. (All that said, the speed would not make me sad). Am I looking at the wrong project?
What is better?
*Voron 2.4*
OR
*RatRig3*
Voron 2.4
@@christophfriedrich5092 Why tho?
What are your goals with the printer? Both are very capable, but the Voron is designed specifically for ABS, which can be a problem with Rat Rig's V-Core 3 PETG parts.
@@vinnycordeiro then print the parts in ABS
@@brisance Many people don't print ABS for a lot of reasons, warping and delamination being the most common; PETG is just easier to print on a Creality printer, for instance, so it's easier to use it to bootstrap a V-Core 3. Your answer, while true, may not be feasible for everyone.
Ein hervorragendes Video wie immer!
Ich träume schon soo lange von einem 3D Drucker. Aber das wird wohl nix mehr.
Ich habe jedes Video gesehen. Immer erstklassiger Content. Der Voron ist einfach Wahnsinn!
I'd basically love a Voron made by Prusa Research or someone else who was able to offer great support and lower the barrier to entry for less technical people like me
The Prusa XL, once finally released, might be what you are looking for then!
not specifically a Voron, and don't quote me on that but, I believe the mk3 XL is rumored to be a coreXY ( but yeah, rumors are rumors )
@@DamienAristodemo yes, prusa already confirmed it will be a CoreXY. But it will not be named the Mk3Xl, instead it will become the Prusa XL, like the Prusa Mini.
The XL better be good for how long it has been teased
@@MadeWithLayers haha it better be, I am also curious about how it's gonna compare to the Voron V2.4 and the Rat Rig V-Core 3
Thank you for finally doing something with the voron this is amazing
Excluding a huge sub community and labeling them as toxic solely because of a bunch of trolling morons that none of us "normal people" want to be associated with seems a tad dramatic to me. I wasn't there to see what happened though.
Glad you like your machine, the Voron guys make great stuff! :)
This. Severs only to increase divisiveness and can ultimately fuel counter-trolling towards those who had no part in the initial provocative.
After four years of tuning, caring for and maintaining my printer, I have managed to push it to 85 mm/s (Anet A6) with 0.25mm nozzle. No ringing, stable extrusion, no ghosting, identical prints without issues, just reliable worker.
Vorons were shown to achieve 600 mm/s reliably without any trouble whatsoever. I guess that's a call for upgrade - it's like swapping Pentium MMX 200 MHz for an Athlon XP 2500+...
Athlon XP? Sounds like Pentium D to Ryzen 7
@@calebdrake3544 Close. But to feel that upgrade, I'll havy to build my own Voron!
Try the HevOrt next ;).
Thank you Thomas so much for all educative journey building it! Hope I will be able to make one as you...
I wish you showed your speeds and prints at those speeds next to it instead of saying 3x the ender because it's very vague!
it's very weird but there's rarely any actual print results of prints from the voron community. i try to find them a lot but there's rarely any that showcases the print quality very well.
Are you part of the discord?
thats true or show actual speed they printed the piece at i would like to see someone with a 2.4 print a large detailed print at fast speeds and see what it looks like
For reference, the fan shroud I showed was a 2 hour 41 minute print on the 2.4 - 250mm/s, 10kmm/s², 0.6mm nozzle, 0.3mm layers. Basically 100% infill.
Slicer estimates for other printers (with default settings)
MK3 0.15mm 20h
MK3 0.3mm 9h
D25 0.2mm 21h (scaled to 96% height to fit)
CE-6 SE 0.2mm 26h
Neptune 2 0.2mm 23h
I will build one soon to upgrade from my ender and I am so looking forward to the build
Klipper is genuinely decent. Please don't let doctrinaire bellends stop you giving it a go (tools are tools etc...).
but i have not found a good and complete Step-by-Step guide from the Kuaih, ssh into your pi, connecting to the controller .... and so the first time installing klopper is a bit of a hedache😢, once its up and running its awesome
Hi Thomas thank you for the streams and waiting for the tune up videos if you are willing to make them :)
Were those "trolls from the kl*pper community" actually from the community or just causal users that only joined the stream for a few minutes? I ask because I was also a user that loves the new life the software brought to my printers, but I actually heard you explaining why you are not using it so I refrained myself from doing comments that may be seen as toxic. It was from your stream chat that I learned RRF also has those features in or in the works.
he is using Duet, so he doesn't need Klipper. And I know some peoples where really arassing him. I remember during one of his live video that he told one user that he is deciding what to do or not on his printer. He was really fed up. You know him, he is like very calm normally.
No one with the attitude he experienced is a part of the 3D printing community. They aren’t welcome unless they check it at the door.
While I'm personally not sure either, I've seen comments like "it's not a Voron unless it runs klipper" under the streams in the comments section (not the stream chat). I hate gatekeeping of that sort personally, and while I enjoy klipper myself as well, any other firmware performs comparably in most use cases, so there's no immediate need to use klipper.
There's no reason anyone should be entitled to force some other 3d printer tinkerer onto any firmware, and I totally understand that it leaves a sour taste about the whole firmware once multiple people try to do exactly that.
Yeah not sure either, it must be a minority and it's a real shame he got that experience. I use it as well and indeed, like you say, has brought new life to my printer. So I think it's great, but I also side way more to the regular Voron community I guess. Shame as I really would've loved seeing Thom test it.
Welp, finally decided to buy my own voron 2.4 (350x350mm). Cant wait for this beast of a printer to arrive