He was perfect in this role. In his typical style, he was loving, but firm and exact. Sorkin's choice of Malden as the priest for this particular episode, given its gravity was brilliant.
@@billboyle5456 I can't believe Mr. Malden was 88 here ... early 70s, maybe, but not late 80s. In many ways, looking back, he reminded me of a maternal Great Aunt whom U met, sadly, the one and only time when she turned 100. I swear, to this day, she acted like a lady in her mid-late 70s, but no more. A sparkling, dry, whit, and clearly had all her marbles. Although I was in my 30s, she made feel like a comparative teenager, such was the vast extent of her memories. Only at 103 did she develop dementia, and passed away at an remarkable 106. If only Mr. Malden lived as long ... ... and this scence was an apt bookend to a remarkable career, using the same Bible he had in 'On The Waterfront' ... the kindly, humble, compassionate priest, but with a rock-like interior that brooked no excuses. Although I'm by no means Catholic, he reminds me not just of Pope Francis, but a Bishop, whom, despite overseeing one of the largest diocese in America, was blunt about what should happen in the horrific part his Church played in the ongoing Child Sexual Abuse scandal. He was utterly scathing, and finished with --- to paraphrase --- "We (the Catholic Church), and especially the dioceses in America, all deserve to be sued for every single cent we have. It is the very _least_ that happen, even though all that money will never, ever, undo the damage done. But having the entire Church sued into literal bankruptcy is the _least_ we deserve ...", which I think went on to say "especially in the light of Christ's own words of Matthew ch18 vv6 ..." ...
that time he wasnt the president, and he wasnt just a priest. as others have said. the priest didnt stand up when the president was on his feet. And the fact that he addressed the president as just a kid from his parrish. the dynamic seems like for that brief time he was his father in a religious way.
@Andrew Arbuckle - I'm record for my appreciation of Martin Sheen, and the roles he chose. And, your comment gives me a chance to salute Karl Malden. Une of the great character actors in cinema history.
As brilliant as the President Bartlett character was in TWW, one of the most brilliant aspects of this show is when he is shown to be weak, outsmarted and defeated. Remarkable television.
The idea is that he was human, and this was one of those moments where his humanity came out in force. It was a moment where his duty towards the office and his humanity were at odds, and he sacrificed a part of his ow humanity...to uphold his oath and duty as president.
It's one of the best parts about Jed Bartlett's character. He isn't perfect, he does mistakes, he says and does things he regrets later. Jed Bartlett might be a fictitious character, an ideal of what the writers want a President to be, but at the end of the day even the best men are still just men.
Was just watching a West Wing roundtable on UA-cam, and Richard Schiff mentioned that he was there when they shot this, and Karl Malden had a small, rather well-worn bible with him to do the scene, he asked Malden where he got the prop and he said it was the same bible he'd used in "On the Waterfront." Just one of the many reasons I love this show so much.
Religion survives because of community and fear of death. There's nothing you or I can do about it, so we may as well relax and accept those who practice it.
tg72211 Depends on what you exactly mean with accepting them. Sure lets not create discriminating laws or something stupid as that. And what people do in the privacy of their homes do not really effect anyone 9/10 times. But i am sure as hell going to call them out when they try and push non nonsensical ideas based on fairy tales for grown ups.
+tg72211 How do you feel about having half the US school system taken over by right-wing religious bigots? Who deny science and try to rewrite history? Because half the textbooks sold to the public schools are now selected and approved by right-wing Christian groups who have taken over the school boards in key states (like Texas). It's easy to say "relax and accept," but that must also mean you are okay with the ideas being pushed on school children who are too young and naive to know they're being fed propaganda. You may not be able to stop religion, but you can do something about religious proselytizers.
No, it doesn't mean that. I didn't say relax and accept fairy tales as textbook substitutes. I said accept the people. They also need to accept us, which means no ten commandments outside the courthouse, and the kids are taught evolution. What I'm talking about is people who can't even watch a TV show, probably the most left-wing show to get a mass following, without whining about how other people think.
*'Parables' tend to obfuscate any true answer and in the instance of a drowned man asking 'Why did you let me die?' he should have asked "Why do You allow the suffering and ailments of all that lives on Earth?"* *"Since I am now dead and cannot reveal anything...TELL ME WHY LIVING CREATURES MUST SUFFER GRIEF AND LOSS AND TORMENT AND THEN DIE AS A 'FINAL REWARD"*
And also ask "why is it a person who lives a good life and helps others but does not believe in you goes to help but a person who led an evil life and harmed others and repents before they die gets into heaven?"
A similar quote is spoken by Kahless in TNG "Rightful Heir": "Long ago, a storm was heading toward the city of Quin'lat. The people sought protection within the walls. All except one man who remained outside. I went to him and asked what he was doing. I am not afraid, he said. I will not hide my face behind stone and mortar. I will stand before the wind and make it respect me. I honoured his choice and went inside. The next day, the storm came and the man was killed. The wind does not respect a fool. Do not stand before the wind, Gowron."
@@gspendlove The world of sci-fi gives us so many lessons for situations like this. I've been thinking about the Terminator a great deal since the pandemic hit. "Listen, and understand. That coronavirus is out there. It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop. Ever. Until you are dead."
@@superslash7254 ....unless you wear one. If people weren't wearing them, it wouldn't be 700,000 dead in this country. It would be more like 5,000,000.
@@retroguy9494 Absolutely ... in fact, if one bookends this with his performance in 'On The Waterfront' --- which is apposite, as the Bible he produced in this scene, was the exact same one he had in that film --- one could say it was a fitting end to an incredible career, that, imho, perfectly encapsulated whom Mr. Malden was, not just as an actor, but his humanity, and dignity, as well ... a rare moment of casting choice in which, I, personally, literally cannot think of anyone else playing that rôle ...
It’s not required to kneel while during confession. It can be something as simple as sitting in the chair next to the priest. Martin Sheen made an actor choice to show Reverence and submission and the plea for forgiveness. Absolute brilliant
While it is not required today to kneel during confession, both Sheen & Jed Bartlett are of an age in which kneeling in a confessional was the norm. So, Sheen kneeling was being true to what would have been Jed Bartlett’s actual experience of growing up in the Roman Catholic church.
@@dorothygale1104 i like that! i guess i just showed my millennial-ness ;) i remember as a kid kneeling in the confessional behind the screen but in my adulthood i've done more of the the sit-down face to face. (i find it more intimate and makes me more remorseful)... now i'm gonna end up going down a rabbit hole about pre-Vatican-II traditions! merry Christmas!
@@robertpadillosandiego2821 Just to be clear, I wasn’t trying to diminish your observation, which I hadn’t thought of before I read your comment. Being of an older vintage, I assumed Bartlett/Sheen knelt for confession because that was what they grew up doing. But kneeling out of reverence and submission and out of the custom they grew up with are not mutually exclusive. Whether kneeling was in the script or an actor’s choice, it was powerful that that act represented both takes.
I'm a lot younger than Sheen and I still kneel while confessing. It is to show God that I humble myself before His presence. I could care less what the modern church allows. I still do it and will do it until age or illness prevents me from doing so. As for face to face, I still prefer the traditional confessional with the screen and sliding door or curtain. The priest only serves as the vessel through which we confess to God. Its based on the power Jesus gave to the apostles. "Whos sins you forgive shall be forgiven. Those you retain shall be retained." The anonymity of the confessional for me helps me to feel closer to God and to confess my sins better and to be more remorseful. Remember, we confess to God, not to the priest as the man.
Many of you may not know Karl Malden, who is playing the priest. He was one of America's great actors, most nobably in the film "On the Waterfront" with Marlon Brando in 1954. You should see it and recognize that the integrity and respect of this character was from Malden himself, as was evident in many of his films. The depth of both these actors in this scene reflect their souls in their performance here and in their private lives as well. I wish we had more actors that this was true.
Karl Malden was wonderful in the 1961 movie "Parrish" with Claudette Colbert and Troy Donahue. He played a ruthless tycoon in Connecticut's shade tobacco industry, a character almost impossible to like. Then when Claudette Colbert's refined character accepted his proposal of marriage, you began to see how he was the catalyst for new beginnings in the Connecticut River Valley. "Parrish" was Claudette Colbert's last movie.
The subtle shifts in tone and body language at the end of this scene were fantastic. From the entire man by the river story to the incredible line "he sent you a priest a rabbi and a quaker...what do you want from him" he's acting as a wise teacher giving an important lesson. The shift to a more angry tone in the delivery of "do you want me to hear your confession" shows that he is a scolding mentor who is upset with his pupil. Specifically showing him pull out the holy symbols of his station as a priest communicates that in the final moments of the scene he was acting as a different person separated from his personal feelings performing his duty. So much can be communicated through so little
Went to catholic school as a child. I remember Sister Kane telling us this exact parable. I understood it as a child then, but 20+ years later.. I understand it as a man. I've lived enough life to know, you are only given so many chances in life to do the right thing and stay on the right path. I write this now, tears in my eyes, knowing how lucky I've been in life. Thank you Sister.
Yep, because he seized to be a president meeting with a priest. He was now a simple man professing his sins to Christ. He also can no longer separate himself from the office of president.
I don't think we will ever see a television show like this again in our lifetimes such beauty, I fall in love with this show more and more with each viewing
@@Millie226 ... and, unfortunately, we are all the lesser for it ... But ratings are ratings, and, unfortunately, the days of cerebral television, which really made you stop, and think about the very possibility of decency, civility, and dignity, especially in poltics, has lost out in favour of 'light entertainment', where --- and this is a massive assumption on my part --- what television executives think their audiences want is mindless entertainment to remove themselves often dreary, nine-to-five, working lives which are, quite likely, making people ill, physically, mentally, and psychologically; so no wonder programs that effectively dulls that pain are so popular ...
@nigelft To be honest Always Sunny is a great satire on the current state of affairs. They act like fools but are only slightly exaggerate our narcissism , arrogance, racism, xenophobia, homophobia, etc. I'm not saying it's West Wing, but it's a lot smarter than people give it credit for. Behind the laughs, it's cutting.
What a powerful powerful moment. No words were spoken about the note. You could tell by his very mood, the music, and the way he acted, what happened, proving one again that Sorkin is one of the greatest TV writers ever. This, along with the Brother's in Arms music at the end of "Two Cathedrals", and the airport scene in "In the Shadow of Two Gunmen" are why I love this show so much.
This was the final television appearance by Karl Malden prior to his death in 2009. As always, he gave his best performance as his final exit from show business, just as he gave his best in all of his roles. In this scene, I did not see Martin Sheen and Karl Malden; I truly saw an anguished President Bartlett seeking solace from Father Thomas Cavanaugh. Great performances by both of them. RIP Mr Malden, my favourite actor! Another Hollywood legend is now amongst the stars. You are missed dearly, but you are alive on both the silver screen and the small screen.
To this day I'm not sure which scene from season one was more powerful... this, or the finale. It's that good. Also, the song at the end is "Hashkiveinu" by Max Helfman for anyone that's curious.
Carl Malden at his best, his swan song... What a powerful scene! HE sent you a priest, a rabi and a quaker... What else do you want from HIM??? Powerful stuff indeed
My two favorite things from the scene is the powerful use of the music and after Bartlet gets the note and the priest whose name I can't remember says instead of "Mr.Preisdent" says "Jed" it A small and discreet way to humble the president and show that no man is above God
RetroGuy76 That's because he wasn't talking to the president of the united states but to one of his parishioners. The presidential office doesn't need absolution but his catholic parishioner did.
A good scene, and good comments too (for a change!) I’d add that Sheen’s change from being Mr President to becoming Jed is subtle and meaningful. Also, the way Father Tom (Carl Maldon) prepares himself to receive Confession reinforces his priestly Office, ready to hear from his humble parishioner Jed. Nicely done.
This episode got me permanently hooked on this show. The dialogue and the brilliance of the casting of Karl Malden made me realize how special this show is
One of so, so many brilliantly written and acted scenes in this incredible show. Sorkin at his absolute best. Every time I watch this scene, it hits me hard. What we know to be "right" juxtaposed with what is practically "right" or "one needs to do." Sometimes one has to make decisions that we know, going in, that we'll regret forever. It's, obviously, a more heightened version of what most of us will experience in our lives. But, the premise is familiar to us all.
This scene hits me in two ways: It is another brilliantly written scene by Sorkin and perfectly acted by Sheen and Malden. On a personal front Karl Malden resembles my late Father-in-Law who used to tell stories exactly the same way Karl does here. He would bend over and look you in the eye and use his finger to emphasize certain points. This episode is one of many that always brings tears to my eyes. One thing that bothered me was Jed saying he wanted to be called "Mr. President" out of respect for the office but he did not return the consideration to the Priest who he should have called "Father" out of the same respect.
Up until the note about the execution came, Bartlet was discussing matters pertaining to his office as President. In that capacity even close friends always call the President by his title -- that's the protocol. But when Malden's character saw that Jed Bartlet the man needed spiritual comfort, he switched to first name.
It was also Jed's way of putting a bit of separation between himself (and personal sense of the guilt) and the decision he was making. When it came to life or death decisions such as this one or military decisions he wanted to think of himself as the President making the decision, not Jed Bartlet.
I understand your replies about the protocol of speaking to the President. My point was that he should have returned the courtesy and referred to the Priest as Father. That is what Catholics do until we are asked by the priest to call him by name.
@@tomsampson8084 I think you make a great point. I’ve always wondered that myself as Jed is always rather formal in the oval, using title and courtesy rather than informality
I'm not a religious man, though I spent my whole academic life in Catholic schools and have studied the Bible cover to cover as a philosophical text. At best, I'm an agnostic. Mostly because of how inadequately adapted we all seem to be to any one faith. But I deeply appreciate this kind of thoughtfulness in any faith. And it's profoundly sad that our current White House occupant, Trump, surely lacks anything close to this kind of depth, gravity, or intelligence. Yep, Jed was a TV president. I know. But we've had leaders in the White House who were leaders who cared, who considered, who wanted to do more than just win adulation from a throng or power from the elites. Obama was a thoughtful man. Clinton, at some level, despite his scheming side. Reagan may have been too, at least in the earlier years. Carter, absolutely. Nixon could have been, if not for his paranoia. Johnson, yes, despite his crassness. Kennedy, at least to some degree, though imperfectly. Eisenhower definitely. Truman too. Both the Roosevelts, Wilson, Lincoln, Jefferson, and Adams. Trump is a stain on history and a big one. But if we survive him, there could be better leaders ahead.
I can only hope and pray.. yes pray.. that there will be enabled to be leaders ahead.. I'll settle for good.. decent.. doesn't have to be remarkable.. just sympathetic.. natural empathy.. true compassion.. ability to admit when they're wrong and ask forgiveness.. to someone.. anyone who matters to them.
Simply one of the best acted scenes in television history. I am not a Catholic, nor am I even Christian, and I BELIEVED these two men on screen. The religious overtones are true to the characters. Toby's Rabbi and the President's Priest brought great wisdom to this debate and yet the decision was right because we live in a democracy. I do not know when the last person who sat in the Oval Office acted like that. My favorite episode of the series.
@@Kathdath Yes, REAGAN! As in 'The Gipper.' As in 'the great communicator.' As in the guy who won the second biggest landslide in history in '84. Only Nixon got more votes in '72.
Perhaps you should try a different Christian denomination. The southern Baptist church was founded as a way to justify slavery. Now it functions to hate other groups. No wonder you turned atheist.
Another testament to The West Wing’s strength was that Jed Bartlett, while a supremely decent character and leader, was also written as having feet of clay. He had a temper, could be arrogant and, as Toby in particular got on him about, could falter on what he knew was right if it was politically unpopular. A lesser show would have made him super-human, but TWW makes a Jed a more complex and relatable character
I've been watching this again because the one we have now is... I wish we had someone like him in the oval office now. For those who are still attending churches amid this pandemic; saying "God will protect me, I won't get the virus." pls don't be the man who drowns. God has sent you many warnings & advice. Listen to him.
I keep America in my thoughts, because of who you have in power I am very worried for you. Of all times, this is one where a true leader with compassion and integrity is deeply needed. Stay safe. Love from Italy.
Powerful scene. A strong lesson taught by many pastors of different faiths using a variety of scenarios. The people who refuse to take the vaccine because they don't believe the science and that God will take care of them, missed the point that it WAS God responsible for the science and the vaccine.
@@christianwestling2019 Uhuh. God also gave the man by the river natural buoyancy but he still drowned. Why are some people so afraid of the idea that God might want people to innovate with the science of the world he created for us, and use it to help each other?
I love this lesson. People always search for a sign when there is either plenty in plain sight or there are none. It is up to us to make the choice. People argue that God is cruel to deny us good actions. If God bailed us out of everything then we would never understand the consequences and we would never have free will because our path would be chosen for us. We have the choice to commit acts of good or bad regardless of his interference. I love Stargate SG1 because they create a literal approach to enlightenment from Buddhism in the form of ascension. You become pure energy with great power on a galactic scale. Only rule is not to interfere in the lower planes. Perhaps God exists and he does not interfere anymore because he learned his lesson. If we chose to kill every bad guy or reverse every bad moment in history then we would never learn of the consequences of our actions. For those who believe or do not, that is the best way to understand the role of God on the basis that he does exist.
Or perhaps the God concept is so far beyond men that they need, desperately, to reduce it and Him to a guy that makes mistakes, rather than accepting that they weren’t there when He created Leviathan … and that He’s always had the right to judge them. Jed understands.
What are you talking about? The episode ended with Jed just about to confess. They didn't actually show it. Its up to us to believe he confessed to allowing a murder to happen.
@@retroguy9494 They shouldn't have shown it. But the form, the lead in, the way the actor playing the priest used the correct prayers, all done well. Confession itself I would hope would never actually be shown.
It is not indicated that the president has told the priest that he met a Rabbi and a Quaker. The fact the priest knows this gives this scene a supernatural feeling which enhances its power.
ROMANG, IIRC, THEY "SHOWEDUP" EARLIER IN THE SHOW-IN ONE CASE TOBY'S RABBI PREACHES A LESSON DIRECTED TO HIM ABOUT CAPITAL PUNISHMENT WHICH HE TELLS BARTLET ABOUT, I FORGET THE GUISE OF THE QUAKER.
I get the message they're trying to convey, I really do. But the idea that we can live in a world where we can pardon notorious criminals who engage in murder and violence on a professional and organized basis is a form of optimism that I unfortunately can't wrap my head around. I don't believe the execution is the answer, far from it! I wish we didn't need it! But I do think it is *an* answer. It's not a good one, and it's not perfect but no other answer is! And as far as things go, for major criminals who have no sense of regret or desire to change and would upon release re-engage in the same activities that placed them in prison in the first place, there is no place for them in our society and they should be removed! And I don't want my taxes to go to keeping these scum alive! I want my money to go to building schools, supplying hospitals, planning affordable housing for low income individuals and families! It's a brilliant episode with fantastic writing and has a lot of great arguments, but unless you have a better solution to the problem don't remove what's there and leave a vacuum!
nYou don't have to pardon someone on death-row, just commute their sentence to life in prison. The death penalty is no solution and it's more expensive to kill someone than to keep them alive due to the appeals process. Even if it was more expensive, it's a bad argument to say we need the death penalty so we can save money. 1 human life is priceless 2. it's not like the money we'd save would go to the things you mentioned. They'd go to war and taxes cuts for corporations. 3. the amount of money saved would be minuscule compared to the amount of money needed to solve those issues. Finally, the death penalty is a final solution in an imperfect justice system. too many people are wrongly convicted in our system and it is known that innocent people have been killed by the state. the death penalty serves no purpose and is wrong.
The more I rewatched The West Wing, the more my sense of Jed Bartlet as a character was as a man initially fundamentally emotionally unprepared for the realities and demands of the Presidency. He wasn't even supposed to really get out of his home state in the race, much less win. He just wanted to keep his party and its likely sure win candidate honest by offering his genuine, alternative further-Left views as a fringe candidate. Then it all takes off and after a terrifying campaign, he's the President. And for all his wit and wisdom and charisma, he's not ready for the reality of that post, the decisions he has to make because of that post. Abby says as much on Election Day, and while her faith that he will be ready is not misplaced, I think it ultimately takes longer than anyone is willing to admit. His dry humor, his back and forth with Mrs. Landingham, his somewhat lovingly demanding style of leadership; these are perhaps both personality traits, but also rehtorical and personality-based methods of defense, of hiding his frustrations and fears of how he meets the demands and responsibilities of the Presidency. This whole episode is a perfect example, where his personal morals as a intense Liberal and Catholic crash full speed against the wall of his responsibility to not abuse Presidential authority by unduly pardoning a man condemned to death. It's not until part way into season 2 (if memory serves) when he abandons the 2 years long strategy of staying in the political center for reelection purposes that he truly seems to feel comfortable as the President, and that comfortability quickly gets dashed by the MS scandal and Mrs. Landingham's death. It's his decision to run for reelection in spite of the intense adversity he'll face from all sides, in embracing his flaws and potential as a leader, that seems to really help convince him that he is fit for the office, that he can be who he is and govern according to himself and his beliefs without being in danger of failing as the highest authority in the country.
In a rare broadcast TV series that had more than any series' fair share of great or near-great episodes, TTSD has got to rank in the Top Ten, maybe the Top Five, and it's one of the few I consider perfect.
What is the lesson here? Was he supposed to commute a prisoner's sentence based on a religious choice? I don't know what is supposed to be so subtly conveyed here.
The whole story and speech was about how people ignore God’s message because he speaks through others at times. Why wouldn’t he have done so here with a servant of the Lord. And would it have changed anything. Jed blamed God for not speaking to him but ignored those who spoke around him, not knowing if perhaps God was also speaking. Whatever your view on the death penalty, Jed did what he believed was wrong for fear of political consequences and not for fear of his faith.
So is it your contention that no Christian or Jew or Muslim could ever run for president? Because for all of these religions, murder or allowing murder is a mortal sin and is in the Ten Commandments. A person should NEVER be allowed to have to break God's laws to hold public office.
Whether one believces in religion or not, this scene provides a valuble lesson in pride. The man in the story was looking all along for a "sign" that God would help him....completely ignoring all the things that were already provided to help him. And Bartlett too was presented with all these options...so the priest was right to ask bascially what exactly are you still looking to God for? He's already given you what you need..
Oh this is such a powerful scene. The president in the Oval asking God to forgive him. Obviously deeply conflicted but praying for a little wisdom and peace just like the rest of us. I imagine that even if you’re not the religious type you can appreciate this
And Jesus said “Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar’s and unto God the things that are God’s.” Man made laws are Caesar’s, as much as we might hate and disagree with them. God’s kingdom is not of this world.
Hey religious people who won’t wear masks or follow guidelines because God will protect you, listen to the messages being sent from God through scientists so you can be safe and keep others safe!
Malden was 88 years old here. His last acting performance on screen. Looked great, and acting was great as always.
He was perfect in this role. In his typical style, he was loving, but firm and exact. Sorkin's choice of Malden as the priest for this particular episode, given its gravity was brilliant.
What an amazingly powerful last acting scene for him😊
@@billboyle5456
I can't believe Mr. Malden was 88 here ... early 70s, maybe, but not late 80s. In many ways, looking back, he reminded me of a maternal Great Aunt whom U met, sadly, the one and only time when she turned 100. I swear, to this day, she acted like a lady in her mid-late 70s, but no more. A sparkling, dry, whit, and clearly had all her marbles. Although I was in my 30s, she made feel like a comparative teenager, such was the vast extent of her memories. Only at 103 did she develop dementia, and passed away at an remarkable 106. If only Mr. Malden lived as long ...
... and this scence was an apt bookend to a remarkable career, using the same Bible he had in 'On The Waterfront' ... the kindly, humble, compassionate priest, but with a rock-like interior that brooked no excuses. Although I'm by no means Catholic, he reminds me not just of Pope Francis, but a Bishop, whom, despite overseeing one of the largest diocese in America, was blunt about what should happen in the horrific part his Church played in the ongoing Child Sexual Abuse scandal. He was utterly scathing, and finished with --- to paraphrase --- "We (the Catholic Church), and especially the dioceses in America, all deserve to be sued for every single cent we have. It is the very _least_ that happen, even though all that money will never, ever, undo the damage done. But having the entire Church sued into literal bankruptcy is the _least_ we deserve ...", which I think went on to say "especially in the light of Christ's own words of Matthew ch18 vv6 ..." ...
My favorite West Wing scene.
Thanks for that info.
The Switch from "Mr. President, not to mention his son..." to "Jed, would you like me to hear your confession" will get me every single time.
that time he wasnt the president, and he wasnt just a priest.
as others have said. the priest didnt stand up when the president was on his feet. And the fact that he addressed the president as just a kid from his parrish. the dynamic seems like for that brief time he was his father in a religious way.
talking to the man, not the office
"Jed, would you like me to hear your confession" - "yes, please". I wish they still made TV like this. Absolute brilliance by both actors.
Very elegant way to let President Bartlett that he is responsible. He is not off the hook - he had a job in the church's eyes, and he failed.
"Bless me father . . .for I have sinned . . . " (that's the most important part)
And in front of the Oval Office desk. The most powerful man in the world brought to his knees to beg for forgiveness.
@Andrew Arbuckle - I'm record for my appreciation of Martin Sheen, and the roles he chose. And, your comment gives me a chance to salute Karl Malden. Une of the great character actors in cinema history.
Two of the best.
"He sent you a priest, a rabbi, and a quaker... NOT to mention his son Jesus Christ. What you want from him?"
I only just noticed that he knew that he'd talked to Joey and that she was a Quaker. How did he know that?
@@kevinedie4119 TWW had some serious continuity lapses, the Priest knowing about the Quaker is one of them, that being said it is a great show.
@@kevinedie4119 Guy had been sitting in a waiting room for a few hours, he would have heard every bit of gossip around.
As brilliant as the President Bartlett character was in TWW, one of the most brilliant aspects of this show is when he is shown to be weak, outsmarted and defeated. Remarkable television.
The idea is that he was human, and this was one of those moments where his humanity came out in force.
It was a moment where his duty towards the office and his humanity were at odds, and he sacrificed a part of his ow humanity...to uphold his oath and duty as president.
It is a nice reminder that even the wisest men make mistakes. Nobody should be held above all others.
It's one of the best parts about Jed Bartlett's character. He isn't perfect, he does mistakes, he says and does things he regrets later. Jed Bartlett might be a fictitious character, an ideal of what the writers want a President to be, but at the end of the day even the best men are still just men.
Was just watching a West Wing roundtable on UA-cam, and Richard Schiff mentioned that he was there when they shot this, and Karl Malden had a small, rather well-worn bible with him to do the scene, he asked Malden where he got the prop and he said it was the same bible he'd used in "On the Waterfront."
Just one of the many reasons I love this show so much.
Wow, that's interesting trivia. "On the Waterfront" is one of my favorite movies of all time. I'm also impressed they got Karl Malden on this TV show.
@@bixfrisbee2623 Great actors are drawn to roles with great writing!
One of the greatest scenes in the history of television.
Karl Malden's last credited acting role.
Can we forget the religious debating for a few minutes and just appreciate the brilliance of this scene.
Nope. That is how religion survives. When we just ignore its illogical practice because x reason.
Religion survives because of community and fear of death. There's nothing you or I can do about it, so we may as well relax and accept those who practice it.
tg72211 Depends on what you exactly mean with accepting them. Sure lets not create discriminating laws or something stupid as that. And what people do in the privacy of their homes do not really effect anyone 9/10 times. But i am sure as hell going to call them out when they try and push non nonsensical ideas based on fairy tales for grown ups.
+tg72211
How do you feel about having half the US school system taken over by right-wing religious bigots? Who deny science and try to rewrite history? Because half the textbooks sold to the public schools are now selected and approved by right-wing Christian groups who have taken over the school boards in key states (like Texas).
It's easy to say "relax and accept," but that must also mean you are okay with the ideas being pushed on school children who are too young and naive to know they're being fed propaganda.
You may not be able to stop religion, but you can do something about religious proselytizers.
No, it doesn't mean that. I didn't say relax and accept fairy tales as textbook substitutes. I said accept the people. They also need to accept us, which means no ten commandments outside the courthouse, and the kids are taught evolution. What I'm talking about is people who can't even watch a TV show, probably the most left-wing show to get a mass following, without whining about how other people think.
Even if you’re not religious, you’ve got to admit that’s a damn good parable.
*'Parables' tend to obfuscate any true answer and in the instance of a drowned man asking 'Why did you let me die?' he should have asked "Why do You allow the suffering and ailments of all that lives on Earth?"*
*"Since I am now dead and cannot reveal anything...TELL ME WHY LIVING CREATURES MUST SUFFER GRIEF AND LOSS AND TORMENT AND THEN DIE AS A 'FINAL REWARD"*
And also ask "why is it a person who lives a good life and helps others but does not believe in you goes to help but a person who led an evil life and harmed others and repents before they die gets into heaven?"
We do, but it's not exactly directed at us, is it.
Because I'm not religious I would never be in the self-limiting position of the man by the river. Religion poisons everything.
"I was just planning to destroy your home with that flood. And for some reason my plans aren't infallible."
No other kind of television has ever been able to flood my eyes more than this series.
@FlintF - And the series gave both tears of sadness, and tears of joy & laughter.
This was one of the most powerful episodes of the series.
man from ohio west wing
One of only 3 people who called him dead in the oval office
Jed
iandhr1 Which episode is it?
Rob Schmidt who else?
A similar quote is spoken by Kahless in TNG "Rightful Heir": "Long ago, a storm was heading toward the city of Quin'lat. The people sought protection within the walls. All except one man who remained outside. I went to him and asked what he was doing. I am not afraid, he said. I will not hide my face behind stone and mortar. I will stand before the wind and make it respect me. I honoured his choice and went inside. The next day, the storm came and the man was killed. The wind does not respect a fool. Do not stand before the wind, Gowron."
I'm going to steal that for the anti-mask people.
@@gspendlove The world of sci-fi gives us so many lessons for situations like this. I've been thinking about the Terminator a great deal since the pandemic hit.
"Listen, and understand. That coronavirus is out there. It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop. Ever. Until you are dead."
@@gspendlove And now after two full years we have indisputable evidence that masks did not work.
@@superslash7254 ....unless you wear one. If people weren't wearing them, it wouldn't be 700,000 dead in this country. It would be more like 5,000,000.
"What was his name?"- Gowron
If this was Karl Malden's farewell performance, it was pretty damn good.
Outstanding if you ask me. In his style, a mix of love with firmness, he made the perfect priest for such an issue.
@@retroguy9494
Absolutely ... in fact, if one bookends this with his performance in 'On The Waterfront' --- which is apposite, as the Bible he produced in this scene, was the exact same one he had in that film --- one could say it was a fitting end to an incredible career, that, imho, perfectly encapsulated whom Mr. Malden was, not just as an actor, but his humanity, and dignity, as well ... a rare moment of casting choice in which, I, personally, literally cannot think of anyone else playing that rôle ...
@@nigelft Yes indeed. I wholeheartedly agree! ✔
First time I saw this I thought "I once heard Ronnie Corbett tell this as a joke". Strange how context can really change the tone of a story
Thats the hallmark of really good stories, one can tell them in many ways
It’s not required to kneel while during confession. It can be something as simple as sitting in the chair next to the priest. Martin Sheen made an actor choice to show Reverence and submission and the plea for forgiveness. Absolute brilliant
While it is not required today to kneel during confession, both Sheen & Jed Bartlett are of an age in which kneeling in a confessional was the norm. So, Sheen kneeling was being true to what would have been Jed Bartlett’s actual experience of growing up in the Roman Catholic church.
@@dorothygale1104 i like that! i guess i just showed my millennial-ness ;) i remember as a kid kneeling in the confessional behind the screen but in my adulthood i've done more of the the sit-down face to face. (i find it more intimate and makes me more remorseful)... now i'm gonna end up going down a rabbit hole about pre-Vatican-II traditions! merry Christmas!
@@robertpadillosandiego2821 Just to be clear, I wasn’t trying to diminish your observation, which I hadn’t thought of before I read your comment. Being of an older vintage, I assumed Bartlett/Sheen knelt for confession because that was what they grew up doing. But kneeling out of reverence and submission and out of the custom they grew up with are not mutually exclusive. Whether kneeling was in the script or an actor’s choice, it was powerful that that act represented both takes.
I'm a lot younger than Sheen and I still kneel while confessing. It is to show God that I humble myself before His presence. I could care less what the modern church allows. I still do it and will do it until age or illness prevents me from doing so. As for face to face, I still prefer the traditional confessional with the screen and sliding door or curtain. The priest only serves as the vessel through which we confess to God. Its based on the power Jesus gave to the apostles. "Whos sins you forgive shall be forgiven. Those you retain shall be retained." The anonymity of the confessional for me helps me to feel closer to God and to confess my sins better and to be more remorseful. Remember, we confess to God, not to the priest as the man.
@@dorothygale1104 I love a UA-cam response where someone is able to respond in a rational and articulate manner to make their point.
Many of you may not know Karl Malden, who is playing the priest. He was one of America's great actors, most nobably in the film "On the Waterfront" with Marlon Brando in 1954. You should see it and recognize that the integrity and respect of this character was from Malden himself, as was evident in many of his films. The depth of both these actors in this scene reflect their souls in their performance here and in their private lives as well. I wish we had more actors that this was true.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Malden
We don't seem to have as many actors of his caliber around these days. Plus movies have changed too
Karl Malden was wonderful in the 1961 movie "Parrish" with Claudette Colbert and Troy Donahue. He played a ruthless tycoon in Connecticut's shade tobacco industry, a character almost impossible to like. Then when Claudette Colbert's refined character accepted his proposal of marriage, you began to see how he was the catalyst for new beginnings in the Connecticut River Valley. "Parrish" was Claudette Colbert's last movie.
His last appearance.
And because of him... I still use American Express Traveler's Cheques and never leave home without them... even though they're not issued anymore!!!
The subtle shifts in tone and body language at the end of this scene were fantastic. From the entire man by the river story to the incredible line "he sent you a priest a rabbi and a quaker...what do you want from him" he's acting as a wise teacher giving an important lesson. The shift to a more angry tone in the delivery of "do you want me to hear your confession" shows that he is a scolding mentor who is upset with his pupil. Specifically showing him pull out the holy symbols of his station as a priest communicates that in the final moments of the scene he was acting as a different person separated from his personal feelings performing his duty. So much can be communicated through so little
At 1:29 Malden responds to the comment by Bartlett with the smallest of facial gesture. So skillful.
Went to catholic school as a child. I remember Sister Kane telling us this exact parable. I understood it as a child then, but 20+ years later.. I understand it as a man. I've lived enough life to know, you are only given so many chances in life to do the right thing and stay on the right path. I write this now, tears in my eyes, knowing how lucky I've been in life. Thank you Sister.
"" you are only given so many chances in life"" --- wow, indeed. Something to always keep in mind
It does not get better than this.
This scene is so powerful... Wish they still made TV like this.
Audrey Tucker Aaron Sorkin does.
+eliptical02 The many who gave up on the Newsroom very quickly would disagree :P
+antourte1 yea i wish that they kept going with the Newsroom, but even that doesn't compare to the West Wing imo
This is one of the very few times Bartlett stands and someone else remains seated, such a powerful scene.
didnt catch that. thank you
Yep, because he seized to be a president meeting with a priest. He was now a simple man professing his sins to Christ. He also can no longer separate himself from the office of president.
Over the history of this television series, there were so many incredible scenes. This was one.
One of the few programs that really made me sit and think about the subjects in each episode. So powerful.
The finest final performance from a GREAT HOLLYWOOD LEGEND, KARL MALDEN! REST IN PEACE!
I don't think we will ever see a television show like this again in our lifetimes such beauty, I fall in love with this show more and more with each viewing
No we won’t, they have all been replaced with The Kartrashians, Love and Hip Hop, and the Fake Housewives!
@@Millie226
... and, unfortunately, we are all the lesser for it ...
But ratings are ratings, and, unfortunately, the days of cerebral television, which really made you stop, and think about the very possibility of decency, civility, and dignity, especially in poltics, has lost out in favour of 'light entertainment', where --- and this is a massive assumption on my part --- what television executives think their audiences want is mindless entertainment to remove themselves often dreary, nine-to-five, working lives which are, quite likely, making people ill, physically, mentally, and psychologically; so no wonder programs that effectively dulls that pain are so popular ...
@nigelft To be honest Always Sunny is a great satire on the current state of affairs. They act like fools but are only slightly exaggerate our narcissism , arrogance, racism, xenophobia, homophobia, etc.
I'm not saying it's West Wing, but it's a lot smarter than people give it credit for. Behind the laughs, it's cutting.
Sidenote: The prayer book that Karl Malden is using in this scene is the same that he used as Father Barry in "On the Waterfront."
Wow, nice catch!
Did not know the priest was played by Karl Malden.
Yes, I referenced that film above. I have admired Malden throughout his career, especially for his role in "On The Waterfront".
@@donalde.kingjr.3545 he is truly underrated
@M.C. Squared - Weirdly, I recognized Karl Malden's voice, but not his face. And, On The Waterfront is 1 of the top 25 movies of all time.
What a powerful powerful moment. No words were spoken about the note. You could tell by his very mood, the music, and the way he acted, what happened, proving one again that Sorkin is one of the greatest TV writers ever. This, along with the Brother's in Arms music at the end of "Two Cathedrals", and the airport scene in "In the Shadow of Two Gunmen" are why I love this show so much.
Two brilliant actors plying their craft is a wonder to behold.
This was the final television appearance by Karl Malden prior to his death in 2009. As always, he gave his best performance as his final exit from show business, just as he gave his best in all of his roles. In this scene, I did not see Martin Sheen and Karl Malden; I truly saw an anguished President Bartlett seeking solace from Father Thomas Cavanaugh. Great performances by both of them. RIP Mr Malden, my favourite actor! Another Hollywood legend is now amongst the stars. You are missed dearly, but you are alive on both the silver screen and the small screen.
To this day I'm not sure which scene from season one was more powerful... this, or the finale. It's that good. Also, the song at the end is "Hashkiveinu" by Max Helfman for anyone that's curious.
Carl Malden at his best, his swan song... What a powerful scene! HE sent you a priest, a rabi and a quaker... What else do you want from HIM??? Powerful stuff indeed
Karl with a K...lol...I believe this was his last appearance as an actor...RIP!!!
Two superb actors in an equally superb scene.
My two favorite things from the scene is the powerful use of the music and after Bartlet gets the note and the priest whose name I can't remember says instead of "Mr.Preisdent" says "Jed" it A small and discreet way to humble the president and show that no man is above God
Agreed completely. "Mr President" is titular - the role.
Mr President doesn't need confession. But Jed Bartlet does. Powerfully done.
The priest is played by the actor, Carl Malden. A terrific actor from years ago. Check him out in the Johnny Piersol story.
RetroGuy76 That's because he wasn't talking to the president of the united states but to one of his parishioners. The presidential office doesn't need absolution but his catholic parishioner did.
A good scene, and good comments too (for a change!) I’d add that Sheen’s change from being Mr President to becoming Jed is subtle and meaningful. Also, the way Father Tom (Carl Maldon) prepares himself to receive Confession reinforces his priestly Office, ready to hear from his humble parishioner Jed. Nicely done.
He knows Jed and Abby before Jed's political career. So he asked if he can call Jed, Jed or Mr. President because of that.
One of my favourite series, episodes, and stories. Wish I had the time to tell that little parable to some religious friends of mine.
This scene and the music building alongside, is timeless.
Karl Malden. One of the most under appreciated actors of the 20th Century.
This episode got me permanently hooked on this show. The dialogue and the brilliance of the casting of Karl Malden made me realize how special this show is
"Bless me father for I have sinned . . . ." probably the most powerful words spoken
Just making me cry because of the sheer brilliance of this scene!
That little bible Mr. Malden takes out and the end is the same one that he used in ON THE WATERFRONT.
Nice touch. And thanks for mentioning his name because now I don't have to look it up.
Karl Malden as the priest. awesome cast selection. So much art to read out of this scene.
One of so, so many brilliantly written and acted scenes in this incredible show. Sorkin at his absolute best. Every time I watch this scene, it hits me hard. What we know to be "right" juxtaposed with what is practically "right" or "one needs to do." Sometimes one has to make decisions that we know, going in, that we'll regret forever. It's, obviously, a more heightened version of what most of us will experience in our lives. But, the premise is familiar to us all.
This scene hits me in two ways: It is another brilliantly written scene by Sorkin and perfectly acted by Sheen and Malden. On a personal front Karl Malden resembles my late Father-in-Law who used to tell stories exactly the same way Karl does here. He would bend over and look you in the eye and use his finger to emphasize certain points. This episode is one of many that always brings tears to my eyes.
One thing that bothered me was Jed saying he wanted to be called "Mr. President" out of respect for the office but he did not return the consideration to the Priest who he should have called "Father" out of the same respect.
Up until the note about the execution came, Bartlet was discussing matters pertaining to his office as President. In that capacity even close friends always call the President by his title -- that's the protocol. But when Malden's character saw that Jed Bartlet the man needed spiritual comfort, he switched to first name.
It was also Jed's way of putting a bit of separation between himself (and personal sense of the guilt) and the decision he was making. When it came to life or death decisions such as this one or military decisions he wanted to think of himself as the President making the decision, not Jed Bartlet.
I understand your replies about the protocol of speaking to the President. My point was that he should have returned the courtesy and referred to the Priest as Father. That is what Catholics do until we are asked by the priest to call him by name.
@@tomsampson8084 I think you make a great point. I’ve always wondered that myself as Jed is always rather formal in the oval, using title and courtesy rather than informality
I'm not a religious man, though I spent my whole academic life in Catholic schools and have studied the Bible cover to cover as a philosophical text. At best, I'm an agnostic. Mostly because of how inadequately adapted we all seem to be to any one faith. But I deeply appreciate this kind of thoughtfulness in any faith. And it's profoundly sad that our current White House occupant, Trump, surely lacks anything close to this kind of depth, gravity, or intelligence. Yep, Jed was a TV president. I know. But we've had leaders in the White House who were leaders who cared, who considered, who wanted to do more than just win adulation from a throng or power from the elites. Obama was a thoughtful man. Clinton, at some level, despite his scheming side. Reagan may have been too, at least in the earlier years. Carter, absolutely. Nixon could have been, if not for his paranoia. Johnson, yes, despite his crassness. Kennedy, at least to some degree, though imperfectly. Eisenhower definitely. Truman too. Both the Roosevelts, Wilson, Lincoln, Jefferson, and Adams. Trump is a stain on history and a big one. But if we survive him, there could be better leaders ahead.
I can only hope and pray.. yes pray.. that there will be enabled to be leaders ahead.. I'll settle for good.. decent.. doesn't have to be remarkable.. just sympathetic.. natural empathy.. true compassion.. ability to admit when they're wrong and ask forgiveness.. to someone.. anyone who matters to them.
Thank you sir. I stand with you and respect you.
Beautifully stated!
At this point that's beginning to feel like a big "if"...
In a forum usually full of toxicity and immaturity, this is one of the best UA-cam comments I've ever read.
Simply one of the best acted scenes in television history. I am not a Catholic, nor am I even Christian, and I BELIEVED these two men on screen. The religious overtones are true to the characters. Toby's Rabbi and the President's Priest brought great wisdom to this debate and yet the decision was right because we live in a democracy. I do not know when the last person who sat in the Oval Office acted like that. My favorite episode of the series.
The last person in the oval office to act like that? Ronald Reagan.
@@retroguy9494 Reagan?
@@Kathdath Yes, REAGAN! As in
'The Gipper.' As in 'the great communicator.' As in the guy who won the second biggest landslide in history in '84. Only Nixon got more votes in '72.
First time I ever saw this I was a southern baptist. Now I'm atheist. I get the same chills now I got then. West Wing was and is riveting television.
Perhaps you should try a different Christian denomination. The southern Baptist church was founded as a way to justify slavery. Now it functions to hate other groups. No wonder you turned atheist.
Another testament to The West Wing’s strength was that Jed Bartlett, while a supremely decent character and leader, was also written as having feet of clay. He had a temper, could be arrogant and, as Toby in particular got on him about, could falter on what he knew was right if it was politically unpopular. A lesser show would have made him super-human, but TWW makes a Jed a more complex and relatable character
Karl Malden ROCKED this episode!
I still remember his endorsement of American Express Traveler's Checks. "What will you do, WHAT WILL YOU DO?"
Malden was a truly great actor-they were lucky to get him for this episode-and-supported by good writing he made the episode great
I've been watching this again because the one we have now is...
I wish we had someone like him in the oval office now.
For those who are still attending churches amid this pandemic; saying "God will protect me, I won't get the virus." pls don't be the man who drowns. God has sent you many warnings & advice. Listen to him.
I keep America in my thoughts, because of who you have in power I am very worried for you. Of all times, this is one where a true leader with compassion and integrity is deeply needed. Stay safe. Love from Italy.
@@lindaliriel the one we have now is better than the covert narcissist who previously held the office.
@@richcook2007 I pity you, you poor delusional creature.
@@richcook2007 This comment hasn't aged so well a week later, has it?
@@mc76 oh I think its aged extremely well.
The best telling of that modern parable I know.
Powerful scene. A strong lesson taught by many pastors of different faiths using a variety of scenarios. The people who refuse to take the vaccine because they don't believe the science and that God will take care of them, missed the point that it WAS God responsible for the science and the vaccine.
@Phelan Not to mention that, to the faithful, god is also responsible for the virus.
As per 2021 usual, there's always the vaxx fundamentalist.
God gave me natural antibodies after having, thanks but I'll pass on the experimental drug.
@Phelan Why? Google natural antibodies one gets after having covid. Much stronger than vaccines that need constant booster shots.
Brilliant reply. So very true.
@@christianwestling2019 Uhuh. God also gave the man by the river natural buoyancy but he still drowned. Why are some people so afraid of the idea that God might want people to innovate with the science of the world he created for us, and use it to help each other?
I love this lesson. People always search for a sign when there is either plenty in plain sight or there are none. It is up to us to make the choice. People argue that God is cruel to deny us good actions. If God bailed us out of everything then we would never understand the consequences and we would never have free will because our path would be chosen for us. We have the choice to commit acts of good or bad regardless of his interference. I love Stargate SG1 because they create a literal approach to enlightenment from Buddhism in the form of ascension. You become pure energy with great power on a galactic scale. Only rule is not to interfere in the lower planes. Perhaps God exists and he does not interfere anymore because he learned his lesson. If we chose to kill every bad guy or reverse every bad moment in history then we would never learn of the consequences of our actions. For those who believe or do not, that is the best way to understand the role of God on the basis that he does exist.
Or perhaps the God concept is so far beyond men that they need, desperately, to reduce it and Him to a guy that makes mistakes, rather than accepting that they weren’t there when He created Leviathan … and that He’s always had the right to judge them. Jed understands.
Quite possibly my favorite scene from the whole series....
What a powerful scene. I’ve never watched The West Wing (before my tv time), but I just might find a platform to watch it
please watch!
Jordan W.H. well I do have more than enough time to do so
It just moved from Netflix to HBOMax where you can stream the whole series.
You absolutely should. It is the best tv show ever.
One of my all time favorite scenes.
Leave the World Behind brought me here, one of the few good things in the movie.
Goosebumps! A president of the United States admitting he’s sinned! This is powerful in many a ways.
You do understand this is fiction, right?
That's okay; we've got a fictional character in the White House right now.
Credit that they showed the sacrament of reconciliation properly.
What are you talking about? The episode ended with Jed just about to confess. They didn't actually show it. Its up to us to believe he confessed to allowing a murder to happen.
@@retroguy9494 They shouldn't have shown it. But the form, the lead in, the way the actor playing the priest used the correct prayers, all done well.
Confession itself I would hope would never actually be shown.
@@BOLANAREDE321 Well, yes, that I agree with. The only issue I have is Jed going down on one knee. When permissible, I always get down on BOTH knees.
@@retroguy9494 I usually sit.
I respect that he told truth to power.
This is the best in writing, showing the eternal conflicts.
I send this to my relatives saying God will protect them from Covid, not masks or vaccines
Beautiful scene that still brings emotions now
Great performance by Karl Malden
when Haskiveinu begins...oh my 😥 and the agony in that simple "yes please" 😔
That was an amazing scene.
It is not indicated that the president has told the priest that he met a Rabbi and a Quaker. The fact the priest knows this gives this scene a supernatural feeling which enhances its power.
They should have just walked into a bar.
There was more to this scene.
Toby was speaking to his Rabbi earlier and he told him about it
Joey Lucas was the Quaker
ROMANG, IIRC, THEY "SHOWEDUP" EARLIER IN THE SHOW-IN ONE CASE TOBY'S RABBI PREACHES A LESSON DIRECTED TO HIM ABOUT CAPITAL PUNISHMENT WHICH HE TELLS BARTLET ABOUT, I FORGET THE GUISE OF THE QUAKER.
I love this show so much
I get the message they're trying to convey, I really do. But the idea that we can live in a world where we can pardon notorious criminals who engage in murder and violence on a professional and organized basis is a form of optimism that I unfortunately can't wrap my head around. I don't believe the execution is the answer, far from it! I wish we didn't need it! But I do think it is *an* answer. It's not a good one, and it's not perfect but no other answer is! And as far as things go, for major criminals who have no sense of regret or desire to change and would upon release re-engage in the same activities that placed them in prison in the first place, there is no place for them in our society and they should be removed! And I don't want my taxes to go to keeping these scum alive! I want my money to go to building schools, supplying hospitals, planning affordable housing for low income individuals and families! It's a brilliant episode with fantastic writing and has a lot of great arguments, but unless you have a better solution to the problem don't remove what's there and leave a vacuum!
nYou don't have to pardon someone on death-row, just commute their sentence to life in prison. The death penalty is no solution and it's more expensive to kill someone than to keep them alive due to the appeals process. Even if it was more expensive, it's a bad argument to say we need the death penalty so we can save money. 1 human life is priceless 2. it's not like the money we'd save would go to the things you mentioned. They'd go to war and taxes cuts for corporations. 3. the amount of money saved would be minuscule compared to the amount of money needed to solve those issues.
Finally, the death penalty is a final solution in an imperfect justice system. too many people are wrongly convicted in our system and it is known that innocent people have been killed by the state. the death penalty serves no purpose and is wrong.
"Vengeance is mine, thus saith the Lord." Well, that didn't limit him to what tool he would use to do it, would he, now?
No matter the tool, He would most DEFINATELY not use one of His children to do it. Thou shalt not kill. Ever hear of it?
Different tv cop who loves you baby
What an amazing show - haven't watched it in decades.... hey moral leadership,.... Whaddya know??
The more I rewatched The West Wing, the more my sense of Jed Bartlet as a character was as a man initially fundamentally emotionally unprepared for the realities and demands of the Presidency. He wasn't even supposed to really get out of his home state in the race, much less win. He just wanted to keep his party and its likely sure win candidate honest by offering his genuine, alternative further-Left views as a fringe candidate.
Then it all takes off and after a terrifying campaign, he's the President. And for all his wit and wisdom and charisma, he's not ready for the reality of that post, the decisions he has to make because of that post. Abby says as much on Election Day, and while her faith that he will be ready is not misplaced, I think it ultimately takes longer than anyone is willing to admit.
His dry humor, his back and forth with Mrs. Landingham, his somewhat lovingly demanding style of leadership; these are perhaps both personality traits, but also rehtorical and personality-based methods of defense, of hiding his frustrations and fears of how he meets the demands and responsibilities of the Presidency.
This whole episode is a perfect example, where his personal morals as a intense Liberal and Catholic crash full speed against the wall of his responsibility to not abuse Presidential authority by unduly pardoning a man condemned to death.
It's not until part way into season 2 (if memory serves) when he abandons the 2 years long strategy of staying in the political center for reelection purposes that he truly seems to feel comfortable as the President, and that comfortability quickly gets dashed by the MS scandal and Mrs. Landingham's death. It's his decision to run for reelection in spite of the intense adversity he'll face from all sides, in embracing his flaws and potential as a leader, that seems to really help convince him that he is fit for the office, that he can be who he is and govern according to himself and his beliefs without being in danger of failing as the highest authority in the country.
Wow! Well said!
Leave the World Behind brought me here
I am also here for this reason
A true testament that Earthly power kneels at the feet of Heavenly power.
Just heavenly power never does something.
We can kneel or we can despise, never comes the heaven down, for good, or demise
In a rare broadcast TV series that had more than any series' fair share of great or near-great episodes, TTSD has got to rank in the Top Ten, maybe the Top Five, and it's one of the few I consider perfect.
This was a beautiful scene
Remember people. Don't wait on a miracle. Be the change you desire now.
One of the best scenes in TV history
*'Religion' and 'Patriotism'...the two greatest refuges for scoundrels and hucksters*
The tiny Bible that Malden uses in this scene was the same Bible he used in On the Waterfront
1:39 One of my favourite West Wing stories.
What is the lesson here? Was he supposed to commute a prisoner's sentence based on a religious choice? I don't know what is supposed to be so subtly conveyed here.
The whole story and speech was about how people ignore God’s message because he speaks through others at times. Why wouldn’t he have done so here with a servant of the Lord. And would it have changed anything. Jed blamed God for not speaking to him but ignored those who spoke around him, not knowing if perhaps God was also speaking.
Whatever your view on the death penalty, Jed did what he believed was wrong for fear of political consequences and not for fear of his faith.
This scene gives me chills.
Nothing fails Like prayer
So powerful
And that man's name...was Matt Foley, Motivational Speaker.
Separation of church and state should mean that a president can’t just say “god says I shouldn’t do this’’
So is it your contention that no Christian or Jew or Muslim could ever run for president? Because for all of these religions, murder or allowing murder is a mortal sin and is in the Ten Commandments. A person should NEVER be allowed to have to break God's laws to hold public office.
Karl Malden. KARL. FUCKING. MALDEN. One of our (IMO) more underappreciated actors.
My favorite part about the scene is that at no point had Bartlett told the priest that he had spoken to a rabbi and a Quaker.
Whether one believces in religion or not, this scene provides a valuble lesson in pride. The man in the story was looking all along for a "sign" that God would help him....completely ignoring all the things that were already provided to help him. And Bartlett too was presented with all these options...so the priest was right to ask bascially what exactly are you still looking to God for? He's already given you what you need..
What. A. Scene.
Hashkiveinu has an incredible impact on this scene
This is the reason religious cults should never be in government.
Religious cults are not in our government.
Moral of the story religion makes ppl stupid. When God has been calling them all the time.
Oh this is such a powerful scene. The president in the Oval asking God to forgive him. Obviously deeply conflicted but praying for a little wisdom and peace just like the rest of us. I imagine that even if you’re not the religious type you can appreciate this
And Jesus said “Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar’s and unto God the things that are God’s.”
Man made laws are Caesar’s, as much as we might hate and disagree with them.
God’s kingdom is not of this world.
tears .........
Hey religious people who won’t wear masks or follow guidelines because God will protect you, listen to the messages being sent from God through scientists so you can be safe and keep others safe!
There are Berniebros who don't wear masks thinking that it's a capitalist plot to make more cash.
@@wanrazul Where?
I think the idea is that God speaks in mysterious ways.
Agreed. And even if he doesn't, we're not "owed" an explanation from him or an intervention anyway.
God mysteriously drowning people, when he's not inflicting horrific diseases on children and besetting mankind with disasters.
Two veterans of the old "Insight" shorts from the 70s and 80s.
Thanks, 🦋
"He sent you a priest..." 2nd only to-
"This guy's walking down the street when he falls in a hole..."