Love the video and the clear instruction 👍 I too have been ‘fiddling’ with indicators and my latest version is similar to yours but is detachable without breaking down the leader ! I make my own dense foam balls in various sizes and then instead of your hook system I use Drennan quick snap swivels between two float stops. You can then take the bung off (leaving the float stops on the leader) and revert to high sticking if needed 👍
For those building this at home, I’ve done this successfully with Drennan float stops in Small and Yokozuma silicon stoppers in Medium. Andy is a genius!
Used your indicator system today on the Taff Andy. It was pretty cold but I caught one 16” Grayling and one 18” plus a bonus brownie. Considering the conditions that was pretty good for me. Got tangled a few times but I think I was trying to cast too far. Eventually got the hang of it before my fingers lost all their feeling. Will definitely try it again….great rig ….thanks again Andy…..keep up the good work!
Wow, this is brilliant, I have been trying to find a more visible/adjustable strike indicator that doesn't kink my line. I must say that what I enjoy most about this vlog is the step by step instruction accompanied with logical reasoning for the process. As always, thanks a bunch Andy!
*I bought these and used them at the river where I get snags often they have done a **enjoyable.fishing** recommend great job of not breaking along with some strong line I purchased as well. They are super durable and easy to use.*
This really is sensational dedication to the craft. You’re doing wonders for changing fly fishing mate, you both are, smart thinking and knocking down the barriers. Keep on keeping on
You can teach and old dog new tricks. I was with Andy last week fishing for grayling on the Dove. I was fortunate to try the new indicators Andy has come up with. They allowed me to fish a couple of pools that we could not wade. I caught fish the system it just works, if your moving from pool to pool is so adjustable. After all this time of year the longer you're out of the water re-rigging the less time you have to connect with fish.
Showing my age here, but I remember going back 25 yrs ago and on holiday in Northern Spain on the rivers of Asturias and I was blown away by the skill of these guys, where traditional fly fishing techniques would usually result in a blank.
Andy, only just managed to get out on the river since traveling restrictions were lifted in Scotland. I tried your indicator set-up and had my PB grayling, didn't have scales but took a rough measure on my net which was 50cm. Cheers.
I’m setting this rig up for a session on the Taff on Saturday…..like you I think I’ve been targeting to wrong water because it’s too deep for the ranch leader. Fingers crossed I actually manage to put the rig together but it looks great. Brilliant idea Andy!
I blanked today Grayling fishing which opens a huge can of worms in my head lol so now looking through your tutorials and your spot on Andy With that indicator it’s a great idea , I used the pimps today there not subtle at all and I was thinking at the time it must be spooking then fish ! Going to give your indicator system a go ! Tight lines
Hi Andy. I did a similar thing with the 2 stoppers but the connection of the indicator I did diffrent. Between the stoppers I put a micro o-ring. And to one of the indicator pads I tyed a Stonfo quick-snap. In that way you can (dis-)connect the indicator when you need to.
I’m a big Stillwater trout fisher who’s wanting to fish for Grayling on the Tweed , I’m a complete beginner in this and I will take your advice sir. Thanks for that.
Yet again another informative video. Keep up the good work. Really like the look of the indicator set up, definitely going to try it. I’ve been trying out some different indicators myself to see which one I get on best with.
Great ideas as always and clearly explained, I will be making some of these indicators up and using them with the clear water fly selection that I bought from you, as our section of river is non-wading. Lovely flies by the way, expertly tied. Cheers, Eliot
three/ four spaced float stops (esp bright colours ) also makes a cracking adjustable french leader indicator . light bulb moment after seeing this cheers Andy :)
Andy I do something like that with the foam indicators I fold it round a cotton bud trim two ends so it's flush then use a cocktail stick just nip a small piece of run the line through the cotton bud then pull the cocktail stick in and out when changing depth it works great mate
Hi Andy. I have done something similar. Except I created my own indicator from plastazote foam and threaded it onto the line using a knitting needle with float stops either side. Could be even lighter since no need for the weight of the hook.
Great idea for an indicator. I’m definitely going to give it a go. One of the beats I fish on the river Nith in Scotland is super snaggy and it’s seldom that you get a full cast without snagging up or stopping. My plan this winter is to get to grips with that style of fishing. Love the videos. Keep up the good work.
Hi Andy, great video and thought provoking. I've used the New Zealand indicator for a while when I'm not euro nymphing and have found that there is a 'sweet spot' where the amount of wool is just the right size to hold the fly in position but it is fiddly to get that balance. I agree that the French nymph isn't great for slower pools as I have had several 2lb+ grayling on slow stretches of the river using a single very small brassie with a fluffy black rabbit head and an indicator. They won't look at the same fly fished in upstream nymph 'classic' style but for some reason are happy to take it without question, even when there is quite a bit of colour in the water! Also used your Baby Pink pattern on the Dove and had great catches with it, thanks and please keep the videos coming!
My order of a box of the clear water flies has arrived. They look really good. I hope to fish one of the Salisbury and District waters next week and test them out.....
Another great and informative video mate 😊 love the idea of using the foam indicators stuck together, really clever!! As usual you explain everything so well, really easy to follow. Great work 😁
Fishing is about what works for you there is no right and wrongs do it your own way as long as your catching fish I myself use the thingymabober works great for me all the best mate tightlines.
i like that indicator you've come up with, personally ive had no issues with the new zealand type indicator system, if you try the larger tubing and put some gink on the wool usually lasts most of the day for me. appreciate the points about the line kink and slipping though!
Nice idea that ! As a course /match angler mostly i agree the guru stops are the best. And along the theme of using non fly gear , i did try the Korum poly ball blobs as an indicator, tiny in comparison to the Airlocks. Tight lines
@@IBandAndyFishing The ones i have held up a couple of nymphs ok but i fish a small stream so maybe not right for your venues, and they are the old originals when Korum started making course products so the new ones may be less buoyant unfortunately. There are some oval shaped ones to, or maybe squeeze on a pinch on indicator? The movability on those blobs is what i liked ( if you can find some that hold up well ).
Hi Andy, I’ve just started using the camou French leaders I find there is a lot of coil memory in them. Do you have any tips for taking the coils out? Great idea on the strike indicators👌
Instead of float stops tie 2 nail knots on either side of the indicator with some old fly line. Works great and you can slide it up and down the full taper of your leader 👍
Hi Steve, I did try this after somebody else suggested it, I found the knots didn't grip anywhere near as well a the float stops and would work loose dying the day. In terms of sliding up the taper of the leader, that's what we're trying to avoid really, you don't want thick line under the indicator as it sinks more slowly and gives less direct contact between indicator and flies 👍
@@IBandAndyFishing I’ve been doing it for years and find that they’re plenty tight for about a 6 months. And I also use the NZ wool indicator tubing to attached the 2 foam pinch on indicators so it will slide. But to each his own!
I have no issues using an indicator Andy, first used them on small still waters to hold up buzzers and bloodworm patterns, think it was an Orvis indicator with a toothpick to hold it in place you just moved the pick and could adjust depth, then used the Loon biostrike putty ok for small stuff but very heavy landing on the water for larger nymphs. Fishing mates in Montana use bobbers when the water is full of snow melt, quite big ones really with a large stonefly pattern with a pink San Juan hanging off it, other Pals in Slovenia swear by thingammy bobbers (small) . My home river the Usk we more tend to use dries as the hatches are decent and there are no Grayling, but i have no qualms about putting an indicator on, no Dry or Die in this house.
It's funny but my experience of the Usk (mostly Brecon and above) is that most suspension nymphing techniques aren't that effective - I don't do well there on the duo rig. Have you found the same?
@@IBandAndyFishing where I am (Abergavenny/Crickhowell) so middle Usk most use dries/spiders for the early season March Browns/Brook Duns etc, I have used the klink and dink but as you say not that effective, although some of our Clubs better anglers do well on the french leader but the majority of my water is slower/deeper and therefore more suited for dries /emergers. When fishing some of our rivers here that do hold Grayling, the Taff, Rhymney, Ebbw etc, then due to the fact there are much shallower and probably more like your Derbyshire streams then indicator and fixed line /Euro styles do come into their own.
Love the indicator system, well thought out Andy! 👏👏 Thanks for sharing. I'm also reassessing my three nymph rig. Based on your dimensions I'm fishing my nymphs to far apart and I'm typically on shallower water than you 🤔 thanks for the heads-up. 👍
Hi Andy, with your indicator method could you use one of those fly connector rings between the two float stops? You could then change the size of the indicater easily without having to strip everything down. Just a thought. Thanks for your informative videos.
The 10ft 4wt you use for summer dry and now winter indicators fishing , would it be suitable for euro nymphing as well? Or is it to heavy to use for all day and maybe not sensitive enough? Would a 10ft 2wt be the best option for all 3 styles if you can only afford one rod ? Thanks
Interesting idea. I was looking at the plastic bobber indicators they use in the 'States recently and wondering whether one of those Drennan inline crystal dibber pole floats in the smallest size (0.2 gm) would work as a more subtle version for indicator nymphing here. Being tapered, rather than round in shape, they should be more sensitive. The line passes through the centre of the float body and you secure them in position on it with small pieces of silicone tubing on the short stem of the float, which makes them easily movable. I'm going to experiment with them this winter. I reckon they'll work.
I also thought about this, I just worry that it might sit a bit too low in the water? Also, maybe using an actual coarse float might be a step too far for me even, I'm an old fuddy duddy! 🙈😂
@@IBandAndyFishing At close/typical nymphing range, it should be visible enough. I sort of get what you mean about a step too far, but there are common items used in both coarse and game angling - line/tippet, hooks, etc. It's the techniques that make the difference. I'd certainly balk at using something like a fixed spool reel (not that it would be much use for fly fishing), but not a float (provided it is not weighted and still has to be cast with a fly rod/line).
New idea for you to try 👍👍Excellent video as usual 👍 I might even try that foam and hook idea . Hard to explain what I do to make indicator wool but it involves a dog brush and some of the wife's wool and soak in nik wax dry brush again 👍. Keeps it up longer and a hell of a lot cheaper than the lion stuff I did like but not enough for you money
Great indicator system, the river I fish for Grayling is very deep and really not wadeable so I might well try this. Have bought a furled leader with high viz tip so will grease it up and try that. Finding it fun experimenting with this stuff. On the subject of course gear- please don’t strike me down- have you ever used split shot on the point? A kind of drop shot rig to get a nymph on the dropper down while avoiding snags? Many thanks
Love the vids mate keep them coming if your ever in Scotland Glasgow hit me up ill take you for some beautiful grayling and trout even pike and carp all on fly all the best fae Scotland tightlines.
There is a gentleman out of Canada named Philip Rawley who uses a similar system for Stillwater lake fishing. Check it out. Don't pay too much attention to the fly fishing snobs great system.
Good idea, I understand why it might not suit the total purist but see no issue using the float stops, just because they were designed for coarse fishing so what? Some fly tackle manufacturer could suddenly start selling them as winter rig adjustors for grayling fishing and suddenly they would be a fly fishing accessory. I will give that idea a go if I find myself on hard to reach deeper water maybe, as I have slipped on an Airloc occasionally in these conditions and snagged the odd fish where the day might otherwise have been blank.
Andy, Have you tried the indicator rig with a quick change snap link so that you could change the size of the indicator without having to break down the rig?
Brilliant vlog Andy, as I can't get to the arranged guide day, I'd like to ask you here.... I have a 10ft 4# and a 9ft 3# rod. Would it best best to use your French leader set up with the 4# rod as it gives 10ft for distance from me minimum and keep the 9ft 3# for the indicator / fly line set up? I thought yes , although the 3# is a little softer so I then thought the FL would suit it but I'm losing distance from body to rod tip. 🤷🏼♂️
Hi Andy, quick question...if you had to fish the suspender rig on a 5 weight 9ft rod instead of a 10ft 4 weight is there any particular adjustment you’d make? Longer leader? Your using 5 weight line already so I guess it’s close enough? Good to talk to you about possible dates yesterday. Cheers john
Hi John, honestly no, not particularly, you'd be fine with the 9' stick. The 10' isn't essential it just has a few advantages. Great to catch up, I just dropped you an email 👍
Hi Andy, This may be a daft question but given that you now have a big bulky indicator on the leader, how do you attach the leader to the main line? Do you tie a big enough loop for the indicator to go through or do you knot it on?
@@IBandAndyFishing Thanks for responding, Andy. Since the original post I've actually made up the indicator and it doesn't need that big a loop. Let's hope the rivers get back to fishable for the start of the trout season.
@14.06 “the nice thing about an indicator system is because the flies are landing free fall you can get away with slightly lighter flies’’ Forgive me if I’m missing something obvious here, but I’d appreciate it if someone could explain this to me.
I recognise that the physics of this are a little flippant! In comparison to a euro style rig which generally straightens itself out and is under pretty much immediate tension, the flies under an indicator tend to be afforded a faster and more tension free fall - things tend not to land as straight and the minimal tension provided by the indicator doesn't inhibit the flies falling in the same way a euro style set up does. You often see the indicator move laterally towards the flies as they come under full tension. Granted, you can tuck a cast or allow for a free-er fall on a euro rig but in my experience I can fish lighter flies under an indicator than I can using a tight line technique. I also think longer drifts under the indicator assist in this 👍
I like fishing indicators and sometimes there is no other effective method. Unfortunately 3 of my 4 local waters have banned them due to abuse. So, to point out the obvious, a large deer-hair fly works fine, even better with some ethafoam in the body, so long as very heavy nymphs aren't used. I quite like to be able to take the indicator-fly off again without retying, so a (very old-fashioned) looped-on short dropper lets you do this. You can use two Uni stopper knots to lock the dropper (or threaded fly) in place of the float stops. Finally, if you want to attach a dropper without cutting your leader, Richard Walker's old Grinner/blood hybrid knot, tied around the standing part, lets you do that and generally won't slide down even when you hook a fish.
I'm new to river fly fishing, and am learning loads from these videos. One question: With 1.5-2 rod lengths of leader, how do you stop everything tangled / snagged in vegetation when casting from the bank?
Hi Andy, just watched your recent update to this for small streams and came back here as i'm trying do something similar with foam indicators but on deeper, stronger water. the Frome is in heavy flood right now.....so, I wondered why you used the length of 6lb 2x...I have just done a couple of test and the float stoppers I have seem to work on rio 4x which is .178mm...seemed like a better transition to 5x below the tippet ring? But I honestly I can't say because I am just copying your system and not put it to work yet...as always any feed back much appreciated, thanks john
That's a great question, thanks for putting it out there! The issue with the diameter of the line on which the float stops sit isn't that about the application of the stops to that piece of line. Its about it moving around during casting and on the strike. I found if the line was too thin and the stops weren't grippy enough they would move around during casting and you'd end up with the indicator in the wrong place. There's a surprising amount of pressure on the float stops during casting and the only fix I found was thicker line (or more float stops)
Creative indicator idea! Do you have any ideas on crankbait for Winter fishing? one guy told me he got nothing as his city in Texas is now 40 degree. he once got 6 basses in Summer just the same spot!
Hi Alex, good question. I tend not to fish the indicator much in the summer for a few reasons. The main one is that in most summer situations the water is clearer and lower than in the winter, which means I don't need the buoyancy of the foam indicator(I'm more likely to fish the duo). Also I'm more likely to spook trout with the indicator in lower clearer water than grayling in the winter. Hope this makes sense!
that Fulling mill indicator is just like some floats you see and would be perfect for showing up on videos. I'm disappointed you didn't have a fly called the Dunkin IB :D Interesting as always and I don't do fly. .. well, not for Trout and grayling anyway :D
Hi IB and Andy, I fish the river Don around Sheffield and wondered have you ever fished there? If you have what would you recommend for catching grayling. The river is so varied as some sections are deep and run quite slow and others run very fast. Loving the videos
Love your vids. Keep them coming I've struggled a fair bit with french leader but watching your vids has made so much sense. One question, when using your indicator rig I'm assuming you want the point fly to be dragging the bottom a little?
Love the radiohead reference btw! A little yes, you don't want it really hammering though or you get too many false indications, hence the need to be able to quickly and accurately adjust the depth 👍
Your a damn fine Grayling fisherman Andy ...I've learnt a lot from your videos... P.s. sure your a damn fine trout fisherman too but concentrating on the grayling video due to time of year😀
Had a few small ones and one ok one here and there , River Teme has produced most for me but it is my nearest grayling river ...most on trotted bait as water been so high , a few on fly when water been low enough , but yes , its been a bit of a washout....
Hi Andy, this was really informative. It's such a learning curve going from dry fly trout fishing to this. I'm only just venturing into grayling for the first time. I caught my first one last week but lost a few of my flies on the bottom. How do you gauge the river depth. I seemed to be in the wrong place all the time. Thanks, Mell.
Better, easier, takes a few seconds and vastly cheaper indicator (40 for a fiver or less) and easily holds 4 mill tungsten bead. 1. Howard Leight Laser Lite polyurethane earplugs (can use different Polyurethane plug makes with different colours). 2. size 6 bait holder hooks. Clip hook end off, push into ear plug with hook eye sticking out a bit. Leave to reshape form and use with Guru stoppers. light as a feather and last for ever! All on eBay. Cheers Andy!
Hi Andy. I'm really enjoying these technique videos you're posting. I've just bought a 10ft #5 brook rod (and line) and was wondering in your opinion whether this set up would be more suited to 3/4 or 5/7 reel? This would primarily be for indicator and dry fly use.
Andy, first if a person wants to fish an indicator, that is their perogative as long as it is not illegal. As fisherfolk we have bigger things to worry about. As far as people claiming to be "Purists go, if you think an indicator gives you an advantage and if you don't use one. You are better than everyone else, then your rod better be the original 1/3 winter harvested Hazelnut, 1/3 summer harvested and seasoned Hazel nut, the top 1/3 either Apple or cherry shoot seasoned. Your line had best be 10' of Horsehair and your leader different weights and colours of horse tail hair. If not then you have an unfair advantage! Do you guys use Hopper Dropper rigs? I haven't finished your video yet, just heading back to bed for a couple of hours. I used to have winter trout grab my strike indicator so I fish a gaudy coloured large dry fly over a nymph. This way you are not using an indicator, you are using a hopper dropper rig that can catch several fish at once on. Your rigs so far, look great! As usual a good job!
More clubs should have the non wading rule to be honest. On the bigger rivers it may not matter too much but I’ve seen salmon and trout being disturbed on the upper Hodder by unnecessary wading.
Andy, I've been involved in educating in one way or another since the early 80s. Your channel is so informative and you are a natural teacher! You explain in a way that means I have questions answered! I started fly fishing around 5 years ago but stopped after 18 months because I had so many questions and no one was willing to give up their secrets! You do! My interest has been rekindled in the last few weeks. Now if I can just find my best and flys.... You give concise, simple, and understandable answers. Well done youth!
Hit the nail on the head Andy,if anyone braves subzero conditions to fish for grayling they deserve every single fish they get no matter what technique they use,I live and die by that.There is too much sniping and snobbery creeping into our sport.
Guys, check out the Euro Nymphing In A Box kit here! --> bit.ly/EuroNymphKit
Love the video and the clear instruction 👍 I too have been ‘fiddling’ with indicators and my latest version is similar to yours but is detachable without breaking down the leader ! I make my own dense foam balls in various sizes and then instead of your hook system I use Drennan quick snap swivels between two float stops. You can then take the bung off (leaving the float stops on the leader) and revert to high sticking if needed 👍
For those building this at home, I’ve done this successfully with Drennan float stops in Small and Yokozuma silicon stoppers in Medium.
Andy is a genius!
Used your indicator system today on the Taff Andy. It was pretty cold but I caught one 16” Grayling and one 18” plus a bonus brownie. Considering the conditions that was pretty good for me. Got tangled a few times but I think I was trying to cast too far. Eventually got the hang of it before my fingers lost all their feeling. Will definitely try it again….great rig ….thanks again Andy…..keep up the good work!
Fantastic news, well done!
Andy's technique is first class, I spent a day on The Wye with him 2 weeks ago and had some great fish.
Great to hear from you Tim, it worked ok for us didn't it?!
Worked a treat Andy
Wow, this is brilliant, I have been trying to find a more visible/adjustable strike indicator that doesn't kink my line.
I must say that what I enjoy most about this vlog is the step by step instruction accompanied with logical reasoning for the process. As always, thanks a bunch Andy!
*I bought these and used them at the river where I get snags often they have done a **enjoyable.fishing** recommend great job of not breaking along with some strong line I purchased as well. They are super durable and easy to use.*
This really is sensational dedication to the craft. You’re doing wonders for changing fly fishing mate, you both are, smart thinking and knocking down the barriers. Keep on keeping on
Well thought out system and as usual explained in a straightforward and understandable way. thanks!
Thanks bud, hope it's of some use!
You can teach and old dog new tricks. I was with Andy last week fishing for grayling on the Dove. I was fortunate to try the new indicators Andy has come up with. They allowed me to fish a couple of pools that we could not wade. I caught fish the system it just works, if your moving from pool to pool is so adjustable. After all this time of year the longer you're out of the water re-rigging the less time you have to connect with fish.
Love the indicator idea Andy, really informative vlog, thanks. Tony
Thanks Tony!
Showing my age here, but I remember going back 25 yrs ago and on holiday in Northern Spain on the rivers of Asturias and I was blown away by the skill of these guys, where traditional fly fishing techniques would usually result in a blank.
Andy, only just managed to get out on the river since traveling restrictions were lifted in Scotland. I tried your indicator set-up and had my PB grayling, didn't have scales but took a rough measure on my net which was 50cm. Cheers.
I’m setting this rig up for a session on the Taff on Saturday…..like you I think I’ve been targeting to wrong water because it’s too deep for the ranch leader. Fingers crossed I actually manage to put the rig together but it looks great. Brilliant idea Andy!
cheers Buddy, how did you get on?
I blanked today Grayling fishing which opens a huge can of worms in my head lol so now looking through your tutorials and your spot on Andy With that indicator it’s a great idea , I used the pimps today there not subtle at all and I was thinking at the time it must be spooking then fish ! Going to give your indicator system a go ! Tight lines
Hi Andy. I did a similar thing with the 2 stoppers but the connection of the indicator I did diffrent. Between the stoppers I put a micro o-ring. And to one of the indicator pads I tyed a Stonfo quick-snap. In that way you can (dis-)connect the indicator when you need to.
I’m a big Stillwater trout fisher who’s wanting to fish for Grayling on the Tweed , I’m a complete beginner in this and I will take your advice sir. Thanks for that.
Thanks for sharing your technique. I will definitely try that. And for the record there is no wrong way when you catch fish. Tight lines mate.
Totally agree bud, thank you!
Yet again another informative video. Keep up the good work. Really like the look of the indicator set up, definitely going to try it. I’ve been trying out some different indicators myself to see which one I get on best with.
Let me know how you get on Andy!
Great ideas as always and clearly explained, I will be making some of these indicators up and using them with the clear water fly selection that I bought from you, as our section of river is non-wading. Lovely flies by the way, expertly tied. Cheers, Eliot
Thanks Eliot! Be sure to let us know how you get on!
three/ four spaced float stops (esp bright colours ) also makes a cracking adjustable french leader indicator . light bulb moment after seeing this cheers Andy :)
That. Is. Genius!
Right. That is a few watches for me to take that in. I'm mostly on the Dever .... one fly. But I'd love to travel when I can
Andy I do something like that with the foam indicators I fold it round a cotton bud trim two ends so it's flush then use a cocktail stick just nip a small piece of run the line through the cotton bud then pull the cocktail stick in and out when changing depth it works great mate
Sounds spot on Russell, good system!
Hi Andy. I have done something similar. Except I created my own indicator from plastazote foam and threaded it onto the line using a knitting needle with float stops either side. Could be even lighter since no need for the weight of the hook.
Great idea for an indicator. I’m definitely going to give it a go. One of the beats I fish on the river Nith in Scotland is super snaggy and it’s seldom that you get a full cast without snagging up or stopping. My plan this winter is to get to grips with that style of fishing. Love the videos. Keep up the good work.
Great video Andy, really appreciate you sharing your experiences with the different options...
Hi Andy, great video and thought provoking. I've used the New Zealand indicator for a while when I'm not euro nymphing and have found that there is a 'sweet spot' where the amount of wool is just the right size to hold the fly in position but it is fiddly to get that balance. I agree that the French nymph isn't great for slower pools as I have had several 2lb+ grayling on slow stretches of the river using a single very small brassie with a fluffy black rabbit head and an indicator. They won't look at the same fly fished in upstream nymph 'classic' style but for some reason are happy to take it without question, even when there is quite a bit of colour in the water! Also used your Baby Pink pattern on the Dove and had great catches with it, thanks and please keep the videos coming!
My order of a box of the clear water flies has arrived. They look really good. I hope to fish one of the Salisbury and District waters next week and test them out.....
Another great and informative video mate 😊 love the idea of using the foam indicators stuck together, really clever!!
As usual you explain everything so well, really easy to follow.
Great work 😁
Thanks bud, it needs to be simple or I wouldn't be able to do it! 🙈😂
Fishing is about what works for you there is no right and wrongs do it your own way as long as your catching fish I myself use the thingymabober works great for me all the best mate tightlines.
i like that indicator you've come up with, personally ive had no issues with the new zealand type indicator system, if you try the larger tubing and put some gink on the wool usually lasts most of the day for me. appreciate the points about the line kink and slipping though!
Nice idea that ! As a course /match angler mostly i agree the guru stops are the best. And along the theme of using non fly gear , i did try the Korum poly ball blobs as an indicator, tiny in comparison to the Airlocks. Tight lines
How did you find the blobs Kenton? I thought they were going to be more buoyant than they were, I gave them a fair go!
@@IBandAndyFishing The ones i have held up a couple of nymphs ok but i fish a small stream so maybe not right for your venues, and they are the old originals when Korum started making course products so the new ones may be less buoyant unfortunately. There are some oval shaped ones to, or maybe squeeze on a pinch on indicator? The movability on those blobs is what i liked ( if you can find some that hold up well ).
Hi Andy, I’ve just started using the camou French leaders I find there is a lot of coil memory in them. Do you have any tips for taking the coils out? Great idea on the strike indicators👌
Instead of float stops tie 2 nail knots on either side of the indicator with some old fly line. Works great and you can slide it up and down the full taper of your leader 👍
Hi Steve, I did try this after somebody else suggested it, I found the knots didn't grip anywhere near as well a the float stops and would work loose dying the day.
In terms of sliding up the taper of the leader, that's what we're trying to avoid really, you don't want thick line under the indicator as it sinks more slowly and gives less direct contact between indicator and flies 👍
@@IBandAndyFishing I’ve been doing it for years and find that they’re plenty tight for about a 6 months. And I also use the NZ wool indicator tubing to attached the 2 foam pinch on indicators so it will slide. But to each his own!
Great video. I always fished the NZ style indicator but this looks a lot more versatile.
I think so personally, maybe try it out one day and let me know how you get on?
I have no issues using an indicator Andy, first used them on small still waters to hold up buzzers and bloodworm patterns, think it was an Orvis indicator with a toothpick to hold it in place you just moved the pick and could adjust depth, then used the Loon biostrike putty ok for small stuff but very heavy landing on the water for larger nymphs. Fishing mates in Montana use bobbers when the water is full of snow melt, quite big ones really with a large stonefly pattern with a pink San Juan hanging off it, other Pals in Slovenia swear by thingammy bobbers (small) . My home river the Usk we more tend to use dries as the hatches are decent and there are no Grayling, but i have no qualms about putting an indicator on, no Dry or Die in this house.
It's funny but my experience of the Usk (mostly Brecon and above) is that most suspension nymphing techniques aren't that effective - I don't do well there on the duo rig. Have you found the same?
@@IBandAndyFishing where I am (Abergavenny/Crickhowell) so middle Usk most use dries/spiders for the early season March Browns/Brook Duns etc, I have used the klink and dink but as you say not that effective, although some of our Clubs better anglers do well on the french leader but the majority of my water is slower/deeper and therefore more suited for dries /emergers. When fishing some of our rivers here that do hold Grayling, the Taff, Rhymney, Ebbw etc, then due to the fact there are much shallower and probably more like your Derbyshire streams then indicator and fixed line /Euro styles do come into their own.
Love you guys. It would be great if you discuss dragging the deck vs drifting lighter nymphs down in the zone dead drift . See you!
Great video as always Andy, very helpful...
Love the indicator system, well thought out Andy! 👏👏 Thanks for sharing.
I'm also reassessing my three nymph rig. Based on your dimensions I'm fishing my nymphs to far apart and I'm typically on shallower water than you 🤔 thanks for the heads-up. 👍
It sounds like you might be as well off only fishing two flies? What's your average depth?
@@IBandAndyFishing Andy our grayling beat is maximum 120cm and more typically 70-100cm. So two nymphs?
That is really informative Andy. Will be trying a few things myself.
Hi Andy, with your indicator method could you use one of those fly connector rings between the two float stops? You could then change the size of the indicater easily without having to strip everything down. Just a thought. Thanks for your informative videos.
Excellent Andy.Thanks for sharing.
The 10ft 4wt you use for summer dry and now winter indicators fishing , would it be suitable for euro nymphing as well? Or is it to heavy to use for all day and maybe not sensitive enough?
Would a 10ft 2wt be the best option for all 3 styles if you can only afford one rod ?
Thanks
Just simple and GREAT!
Thanks buddy!
Hi great vlog I am disabled with cfs so Carnot walk the rivers like I used to any chance you can do a blog on Stillwater buzzer fishing x
Those are some cool indicator options I've never seen before
Interesting idea. I was looking at the plastic bobber indicators they use in the 'States recently and wondering whether one of those Drennan inline crystal dibber pole floats in the smallest size (0.2 gm) would work as a more subtle version for indicator nymphing here. Being tapered, rather than round in shape, they should be more sensitive. The line passes through the centre of the float body and you secure them in position on it with small pieces of silicone tubing on the short stem of the float, which makes them easily movable. I'm going to experiment with them this winter. I reckon they'll work.
I also thought about this, I just worry that it might sit a bit too low in the water? Also, maybe using an actual coarse float might be a step too far for me even, I'm an old fuddy duddy! 🙈😂
@@IBandAndyFishing At close/typical nymphing range, it should be visible enough. I sort of get what you mean about a step too far, but there are common items used in both coarse and game angling - line/tippet, hooks, etc. It's the techniques that make the difference. I'd certainly balk at using something like a fixed spool reel (not that it would be much use for fly fishing), but not a float (provided it is not weighted and still has to be cast with a fly rod/line).
New idea for you to try 👍👍Excellent video as usual 👍 I might even try that foam and hook idea . Hard to explain what I do to make indicator wool but it involves a dog brush and some of the wife's wool and soak in nik wax dry brush again 👍. Keeps it up longer and a hell of a lot cheaper than the lion stuff I did like but not enough for you money
Great video buddy...
Cheers AP!
Interesting set up, I’ll try that when the new flies arrive! The small line stops are like Hens teeth....
I found the same thing, there are a few smaller retailers who have them still I think 👍
@@IBandAndyFishing
Just ordered some from Nottingham’s Match-man Supplies if any one asks.
Great indicator system, the river I fish for Grayling is very deep and really not wadeable so I might well try this. Have bought a furled leader with high viz tip so will grease it up and try that. Finding it fun experimenting with this stuff. On the subject of course gear- please don’t strike me down- have you ever used split shot on the point? A kind of drop shot rig to get a nymph on the dropper down while avoiding snags? Many thanks
Love the vids mate keep them coming if your ever in Scotland Glasgow hit me up ill take you for some beautiful grayling and trout even pike and carp all on fly all the best fae Scotland tightlines.
There is a gentleman out of Canada named Philip Rawley who uses a similar system for Stillwater lake fishing. Check it out. Don't pay too much attention to the fly fishing snobs great system.
Good idea, I understand why it might not suit the total purist but see no issue using the float stops, just because they were designed for coarse fishing so what? Some fly tackle manufacturer could suddenly start selling them as winter rig adjustors for grayling fishing and suddenly they would be a fly fishing accessory. I will give that idea a go if I find myself on hard to reach deeper water maybe, as I have slipped on an Airloc occasionally in these conditions and snagged the odd fish where the day might otherwise have been blank.
Andy, Have you tried the indicator rig with a quick change snap link so that you could change the size of the indicator without having to break down the rig?
Brilliant vlog Andy, as I can't get to the arranged guide day, I'd like to ask you here.... I have a 10ft 4# and a 9ft 3# rod. Would it best best to use your French leader set up with the 4# rod as it gives 10ft for distance from me minimum and keep the 9ft 3# for the indicator / fly line set up? I thought yes , although the 3# is a little softer so I then thought the FL would suit it but I'm losing distance from body to rod tip. 🤷🏼♂️
love it mate great indicator!! cant wait to try it...
Hi Andy, quick question...if you had to fish the suspender rig on a 5 weight 9ft rod instead of a 10ft 4 weight is there any particular adjustment you’d make? Longer leader? Your using 5 weight line already so I guess it’s close enough? Good to talk to you about possible dates yesterday. Cheers john
Hi John, honestly no, not particularly, you'd be fine with the 9' stick. The 10' isn't essential it just has a few advantages. Great to catch up, I just dropped you an email 👍
i would love it if you could fly fish for pike it is so exiting
Hi Andy, This may be a daft question but given that you now have a big bulky indicator on the leader, how do you attach the leader to the main line? Do you tie a big enough loop for the indicator to go through or do you knot it on?
no daft questions here Alistair! I will use either to be honest, though if I was looping it wouldn't be a large loop for the indicator to go through.
@@IBandAndyFishing Thanks for responding, Andy. Since the original post I've actually made up the indicator and it doesn't need that big a loop. Let's hope the rivers get back to fishable for the start of the trout season.
@14.06 “the nice thing about an indicator system is because the flies are landing free fall you can get away with slightly lighter flies’’
Forgive me if I’m missing something obvious here, but I’d appreciate it if someone could explain this to me.
I recognise that the physics of this are a little flippant!
In comparison to a euro style rig which generally straightens itself out and is under pretty much immediate tension, the flies under an indicator tend to be afforded a faster and more tension free fall - things tend not to land as straight and the minimal tension provided by the indicator doesn't inhibit the flies falling in the same way a euro style set up does. You often see the indicator move laterally towards the flies as they come under full tension.
Granted, you can tuck a cast or allow for a free-er fall on a euro rig but in my experience I can fish lighter flies under an indicator than I can using a tight line technique. I also think longer drifts under the indicator assist in this 👍
I like fishing indicators and sometimes there is no other effective method. Unfortunately 3 of my 4 local waters have banned them due to abuse. So, to point out the obvious, a large deer-hair fly works fine, even better with some ethafoam in the body, so long as very heavy nymphs aren't used. I quite like to be able to take the indicator-fly off again without retying, so a (very old-fashioned) looped-on short dropper lets you do this. You can use two Uni stopper knots to lock the dropper (or threaded fly) in place of the float stops. Finally, if you want to attach a dropper without cutting your leader, Richard Walker's old Grinner/blood hybrid knot, tied around the standing part, lets you do that and generally won't slide down even when you hook a fish.
I'm new to river fly fishing, and am learning loads from these videos. One question: With 1.5-2 rod lengths of leader, how do you stop everything tangled / snagged in vegetation when casting from the bank?
Hi Andy, just watched your recent update to this for small streams and came back here as i'm trying do something similar with foam indicators but on deeper, stronger water. the Frome is in heavy flood right now.....so, I wondered why you used the length of 6lb 2x...I have just done a couple of test and the float stoppers I have seem to work on rio 4x which is .178mm...seemed like a better transition to 5x below the tippet ring? But I honestly I can't say because I am just copying your system and not put it to work yet...as always any feed back much appreciated, thanks john
That's a great question, thanks for putting it out there! The issue with the diameter of the line on which the float stops sit isn't that about the application of the stops to that piece of line. Its about it moving around during casting and on the strike. I found if the line was too thin and the stops weren't grippy enough they would move around during casting and you'd end up with the indicator in the wrong place. There's a surprising amount of pressure on the float stops during casting and the only fix I found was thicker line (or more float stops)
@@IBandAndyFishing great info...thanks again and for the quick response
Hi Andy... where can I find the rules of the area on Wye to be able to fish it... and is float fishing allowed in there?
Creative indicator idea! Do you have any ideas on crankbait for Winter fishing? one guy told me he got nothing as his city in Texas is now 40 degree. he once got 6 basses in Summer just the same spot!
Would you fish your indicator rig in the summer for trout? If not, could you explain your reasoning? BTW, thanks for a fabulous idea.
Hi Alex, good question. I tend not to fish the indicator much in the summer for a few reasons. The main one is that in most summer situations the water is clearer and lower than in the winter, which means I don't need the buoyancy of the foam indicator(I'm more likely to fish the duo). Also I'm more likely to spook trout with the indicator in lower clearer water than grayling in the winter. Hope this makes sense!
You convinced me! will try on the weekend ;-)
Let us know how it goes Ralf!
that Fulling mill indicator is just like some floats you see and would be perfect for showing up on videos. I'm disappointed you didn't have a fly called the Dunkin IB :D Interesting as always and I don't do fly. .. well, not for Trout and grayling anyway :D
Hi IB and Andy, I fish the river Don around Sheffield and wondered have you ever fished there? If you have what would you recommend for catching grayling. The river is so varied as some sections are deep and run quite slow and others run very fast. Loving the videos
Tried the links for the Scierra Brook 10' 2# and neither come up with 10"2#. Scierra's web site doesn't show one.
Any thoughts?
Interesting stuff Andy... what would you think of taking a single float stop and sticking the adhesive indicator to it? Just a thought.
The stops I have definitely wouldn't provide enough surface area to stick the foam on to, possibly a pair of larger stops might?
Can you use this suspension rig on a french leader?
Love your vids. Keep them coming I've struggled a fair bit with french leader but watching your vids has made so much sense. One question, when using your indicator rig I'm assuming you want the point fly to be dragging the bottom a little?
Love the radiohead reference btw!
A little yes, you don't want it really hammering though or you get too many false indications, hence the need to be able to quickly and accurately adjust the depth 👍
Andy what size hook is please
Your a damn fine Grayling fisherman Andy ...I've learnt a lot from your videos...
P.s. sure your a damn fine trout fisherman too but concentrating on the grayling video due to time of year😀
really kind Paul, many thanks! A shame it's not been a fine grayling season this winter, eh?!
Had a few small ones and one ok one here and there , River Teme has produced most for me but it is my nearest grayling river ...most on trotted bait as water been so high , a few on fly when water been low enough , but yes , its been a bit of a washout....
Hello andy and IB , Dose your fly box go through a standard size door letter box ,cheers alan.
Alan it's a large letter sized box, so it probably wouldn't go through most letter boxes.
Hi Andy, this was really informative. It's such a learning curve going from dry fly trout fishing to this. I'm only just venturing into grayling for the first time. I caught my first one last week but lost a few of my flies on the bottom. How do you gauge the river depth. I seemed to be in the wrong place all the time. Thanks, Mell.
Better, easier, takes a few seconds and vastly cheaper indicator (40 for a fiver or less) and easily holds 4 mill tungsten bead. 1. Howard Leight Laser Lite polyurethane earplugs (can use different Polyurethane plug makes with different colours). 2. size 6 bait holder hooks. Clip hook end off, push into ear plug with hook eye sticking out a bit. Leave to reshape form and use with Guru stoppers. light as a feather and last for ever! All on eBay. Cheers Andy!
Maybe try a foam ear plug instead of the foam tabs. Would be super buoyant.
Hi Andy. I'm really enjoying these technique videos you're posting. I've just bought a 10ft #5 brook rod (and line) and was wondering in your opinion whether this set up would be more suited to 3/4 or 5/7 reel? This would primarily be for indicator and dry fly use.
andy i have a guestion do you ever catch fish on your bobber or is the barb bury
The barb is buried Calvin, I'm not sure if the foam is very imitative!
The Guru stops worked for you then mate 👍👍👍
I bought eight different brands and hammered them bud, those guru definitely the best of the bunch!
Andy, first if a person wants to fish an indicator, that is their perogative as long as it is not illegal. As fisherfolk we have bigger things to worry about.
As far as people claiming to be "Purists go, if you think an indicator gives you an advantage and if you don't use one. You are better than everyone else, then your rod better be the original 1/3 winter harvested Hazelnut, 1/3 summer harvested and seasoned Hazel nut, the top 1/3 either Apple or cherry shoot seasoned. Your line had best be 10' of Horsehair and your leader different weights and colours of horse tail hair. If not then you have an unfair advantage!
Do you guys use Hopper Dropper rigs? I haven't finished your video yet, just heading back to bed for a couple of hours.
I used to have winter trout grab my strike indicator so I fish a gaudy coloured large dry fly over a nymph. This way you are not using an indicator, you are using a hopper dropper rig that can catch several fish at once on. Your rigs so far, look great! As usual a good job!
Just wish you would talk a bit slower Andy but I will try your system because I have had real issues finding a reliable indicator system this season.
Andy, I think you are personally responsible for a national shortage of Small Guru float stops. Can't find them anywhere! 😂👍
More clubs should have the non wading rule to be honest. On the bigger rivers it may not matter too much but I’ve seen salmon and trout being disturbed on the upper Hodder by unnecessary wading.
Genius!
I've been called many words Mike but never that! 🙈😂
@@IBandAndyFishing lol!!
Andy, I've been involved in educating in one way or another since the early 80s.
Your channel is so informative and you are a natural teacher! You explain in a way that means I have questions answered! I started fly fishing around 5 years ago but stopped after 18 months because I had so many questions and no one was willing to give up their secrets! You do!
My interest has been rekindled in the last few weeks. Now if I can just find my best and flys....
You give concise, simple, and understandable answers.
Well done youth!
I.B. labas!
Hit the nail on the head Andy,if anyone braves subzero conditions to fish for grayling they deserve every single fish they get no matter what technique they use,I live and die by that.There is too much sniping and snobbery creeping into our sport.
I like it, great for where no wading is allowed, purist will be horrified but I go fishing to catch fish
I use Orvis Corqs!!
You need to patent that, Andy. ££££££s
I'll let you sort the paperwork on that one Tim!
Just get a float haha
Crystal wagglers at the ready!
@@IBandAndyFishing one of those tiny crystal dennan pole floats ;)
#dibber
@@IBandAndyFishing dribbler ;)
Sorry about the spelling in that last comment….I haven’t invented a system called a RANCH leader….it’s supposed to be French obs🫣