Відео

I have a video series in the "Home Grid" playlist that goes into setup. This video cover how the Network Database (ndb) works. ua-cam.com/video/BBv-XhNbUe8/v-deo.html And I try to put links to the man pages in the description for other things I may have used in the video. For this one, it was dial which is the plan9 function for making a network connection, and json for parsing json.

I haven't tried that. I still have the old 3B's.

idiot filtered 😎

Just like Unix has the "vi vs emacs", the Plan9 world has "sam vs acme". Maybe you are just a sam person?

@@adventuresin9 Windows required for work. I use a DOSBox-X wrapper around a VBDOS editor app that I wrote by taking the example from vbdos and following it step by step. Mine has color themes though. Downside is I have to use a modern editor like notepad if I want to print or paste the text elsewhere. Oh well, I have my dream editor.

Most of these plugs are welded shut so if the flash was unsuccessful it will be a brick.

The newer ones don't have enough CPU to run a full OS. There are people working on 9P interfaces for microcontrollers. Styx-on-a-brick is one example. A newer one NinePea.

@@adventuresin9 I don't mean run a complete plan9 system. If the linux kernel can be stripped down to run on a similar microcontroller, the 9 kernel probably would only provide a 9p interface. The video about NinePea, was fantastic. I saw it months ago. It was mentioned that someone was trying to get inferno to run on 256KB of ram by keeping read-only data in flash.

Well, I will have a way to control them locally soon, and some tools to scrub them of personal data and keep them from phoning home.

I might put these simple tools up. My main project is to do a filesystem interface, and that will be put up on my github, and I've have a link to it when I get that video finished.

Plan9 and 9Front wont run on systems with no MMU. There was another project call "Inferno" which took the Plan9 ideas and was designed to run on embedded systems. However, development stopped on it mostly, and I do not think they have a risc-v kernel for it. There are other projects to implement simple 9P on MCU, search for "NinePea".

Yes, I know about Inferno, been trying it somewhere in 1999 on PC. Wikipedia says it was last released nine years ago and there's no RISC-V port. Will take a look on NinePea. Thanks. But, how much RAM 9Front needs to run ? I'm working on adding MMU. :)

I have run 9front on systems with 64MB of ram, but without graphics. A frame buffer will need some space if it runs it's own display.

I barely understand the acid debugger, and the documentation is sparse. It is truly a wizards tool. One of things I use it for the most has been spun out into a shell script that comes standard in 9front now. /rc/bin/lstk will look for the last Broken process and print out the stack for it. So when a program straight dies, you can run lstk and quickly get an idea of where exactly it crashed.

Hell, add another 20-30 minutes comparing and contrasting concrete examples of shit you can do with 9Front that you couldn't with Linux. I feel like there was definitely some substance missing from your argument but it sounds like with a little work you can come up with something both intellectually honest and educational for those coming in who use Linux but not 9Front.

I might go back down that direction at some point. But I enjoy building up more than tearing down. While that video did have mostly positive reviews, I don't want the distraction of dealing with flame wars and corrections while I'm already in the middle of putting together 3 other videos that I think are much higher quality and more informative.

I might put it up again, or redo it. But between the holiday distractions, and working on other videos, I don't want to be managing flame war material at the moment.

​@@adventuresin9 'Holy war’ or something?) I understand... and I see that it was uploaded 10 days ago (in the web archive), but it only popped up in my 'related' recently. I had planned to watch it later, but upon checking, I noticed it had been deleted. That caught my attention and led me to your channel. I even got intrigued by the topic of an alternative branch of OS development. Though, I haven’t delved deeply into the subject yet. Honestly... I don’t take such videos too seriously-more like something funny or just fun to explore. But in your case, it’s a bit different because I thought you were a Linux user, and it turns out it’s a completely different OS I’d never even heard of. And the concept got me interested. So, I’ll be looking out if you decide to re-upload. ;)

​@@adventuresin9 I too was looking for that video when the algorithm suggested it. I only knew of Plan9 from an article on The Register by Liam Proven but have found your channel fascinating. I definitely get that in this age you don't want to babysit the comments but if you do it, I can see that Linux would benefit from your knowledge and critique even if they're not ready to hear it.

Just checked out that article you mentioned. A very fair take on Plan9 and 9Front. The bit at the end about running little VM's is one I've heard from other people too. Given how large and complicated modern web browsers are, and that web browsers are now effectively an OS, it would make sense to "port" one over as a thing in a VM.

I'm in the same boat. It's a fun B-film.

@ B film ? You are a generous person. Well, it is the Christmas season.

That's what the name is meant to reference

if you mean wizard as in someone who researches arcane mystical things and applies them to modern problems, then yes

I often wonder what I'm doing myself.

it was a Bell Laps operating system based on unix concepts, Never heard of it until this video.

It was picked as the 9Front mascot before my time, so I don't know why.

I see that's cool, everything all goes back to touhou

The fixes should be in there. I'll pull down the latest updates tomorrow and see if I have a similar issue.

One issue that may come up is that the kernel in 9front doesn't have fpu emulation, and that can cause issues when awk is used. I have a patch on github that can help with that github.com/adventuresin9/mt7688-fpu-patch

I honestly think the web was a mistake. Hyperlinked text is handy, but at what cost?

To go along with the "boomer" aspect, there is a bit of "pulling up the ladder behind you" going on. What started as a light weight and flexible system for experimenting later became an overly complex and aimed and promoting vendor lock-in and forced obsolescence.

@adventuresin9 I'm not even that experienced and I have already discovered why there is an appeal in something like FreeBSD where every "system level" (I know that's a noob term) dependency is lock-stepped from the get-go. Though, I haven't tried a BSD or Plan9 yet. I have realized I should invest some time in learning more about these in case they could promise better dependency management. A lot of Linux fans couldn't even comprehend horrors like a franken-ubuntu (v18 kernel, v20 filesystem, v16 bootloader) , and they would defecate themselves at the thought of their livelihood depending on delivering bugfixes to such an abomination. Linux can be just as wretched as Windows if abused. The reality is there are good and bad systems and you can make an abomination or Elysian field in any platform.

I have heard the people who work on the compilers talk about adding in stuff for using SIMD. I haven't kept up with how much they have added or what the use case may be. The OS itself doesn't really need it, but there are people who work with audio and video stuff that probably use it.

I used Linux on similar systems in the past, and they ran fine. Now, I open a basic text editor, like xed, and it takes 20MB just to start.

I bought a small risc-v board, a "Mango Pi" which is single core and the size of a Raspberry Pi zero. It is on the list of things to port 9Front to, and some work has already been done on compilers and libraries. The risc-v ecosystem is a rapidly evolving space right now, so some Plan 9 developers are taking a wait and see approach, to see what becomes standardized.

Here is a video about some of the progress and troubles so far ua-cam.com/video/EOg6UzSss2A/v-deo.html

not sure if it will fit the theme of this channel though

I first used used Linux back in the late 1990's. The system and the people working on it has changed a lot since then.

@@adventuresin9 I guess this more related to M$ and other mega corps have seat board on Linux foundation, I agree with you Linux still useful for running server, it Desktop use case ruined long time ago.

​@@adventuresin9 I started getting my impression of Linux and FOSS a decade after that. It took some time to realize that there were no longer those people nor those ideas that I read about on old forum threads and watched in "Revolution OS" movie...

​@@مقاطعمترجمة-ش8ثtbf linux was never "great" for desktop in the first place... Nowadays we atleast have some standards and infrastructure to build upon, instead of everyone inventing their own set of wheels, that are perpetually broken by some dude half across the globe from you due to a minor change, granted they are waaaay overengineered in more than one place(like this whole dbus thing, basically most of the freedesktop protocols, wayland, systemd, etc. even though most of them have neat ideas in mind the actual standarts and way of doing things is just beyond awfull), but they are there, they are open and they free. Which is a lot more than i can say about anything that is or was a desktop. I would love a new revitalised modern GNU, i would like the rewamp of the kernel, i would like better init system, i would like the new rewamp of mesa, i would love a better wayland, but alas no one including me thinks that any of this actually worth the time and effort it would take to do. Well more like some brave souls do, but i am certainly not one of them at this moment.

Me too. I am on my first steps on my plan9 voyage .. very interesting. B.t.w. Chat gpt recommend me to take a look at plan9 when i was asking what is the most strange thing to install on an empty machine standing here .

One does not casually look for Plan9. 😂

@fmu7679 I google Hurd, Plan9 and some other topics periodically, just to know what's going on. Also I want to get started, but I'm not sure what should I pick them for