Відео

At the time of me making this video (no more than a week after pre-sales started), they'd sold out of the first two months' production (ie. 40 units)...

Glad you appreciated my video and are enjoying your new version of Nursery Cryme. Just wait til you play side two and get to The Return of the Giant Hogweed! You'll need a BIG tractor to combat them, herbicidal battering just won't cut it! ;-)

@@DaveDenyer Haha! I'll have that image seared into my bonce when I get to it :)

Good question Owen: I honestly can't say for sure having not heard the B77 MKIII, however I would very much doubt it will sound as good as an A80 in good health.

Bruford is the greatest!

Thanks for the feedback.

Thanks Dave, very much appreciated.

Wasn't Brothers in Arms digitally recorded but mixed in analogue, and mastered to both analogue and digital? I'm not too sure that digital mixing had been developed in 1985. I have many MOFI albums ranging from the earliest (which are all analogue, made from the 'Original Master Recording' as the name would suggest, and several of the newer issues. I do think they have a 'house sound' generally the bass is more extended, partly because this was often cut for regular non-audiophile turntable playback. I think one of the most overlooked factors in the digital vs analogue debate is the sound of different D to A (and A to D) convertors. Surely you've heard some that are better than others? And digital filters is another major factor. The fact that these have an effect means without doubt that the D to A conversion, and the A to D conversion processes are not transparent, and therefore there is 'good' and bad' digital. Frankly, if the original recording was done well (as was typical in the 50s and 60s) then I'd rather stick to AAA.

@ I’m not talking about the original release for BIA 1985 but the MO FI reissue that was done digitally. 2015. (which was all digital) As I said the issue with the MJ Mo Fi was an extremely small digital segment often seconds were inserted into the music to account for the tape degradation and there is no way you can hear the difference between the two simply because MO FI has some of the BEST sound engineers in the world. Do you think that SONY would lend their original tapes to a bunch of amateurs they are priceless. These is no such thing as non audiophile turntable playback the record is either 180 gram or it’s not audio phile just means manufactured to the highest audio standard. I have absolutely no clue what “house sound means and it definitely doesn’t apply to Mo Fi recordings finally. The issue with MO FI in terms of transparency had to do with the MARKETING department not acknowledging the insertion of the digital aspects it had nothing to do with the sound engineers trying to produce the best sounding copies of an album which they do.

@@robertbyington7715 I've not heard anything about the Thriller master tape being damaged such that segments have needed digital repair (cut and pasting)... I'd be interested to know where you got this info... Either way, the MOFI / digital 'scandal' broke because they announced they were doing such a massive run of the Thriller One-Step, (if memory is correct wasn't it 30,000?) which as you rightly say, would require playing the original master tape very many times... Regarding Sony lending out the tape to MOFI, this is where I think the DSD issue stems from: Sony, and some other labels, decided against lending MOFI (or indeed most other mastering studios / reissue labels) the original master tapes, and so made MOFI a DSD copy of the master to use instead. Once this became known, further investigation revealed that MOFI had been doing this for several years... Of course the MOFI engineers are trying to make the best version of all their releases, whether they succeed is, of course, subjective... I'm not quite sure what you mean by "there's no such thing as non audiophile turntable playback " etc. I personally don't think the record weight has much to do with anything: that is, in my opinion, marketing... Some 'audiophile labels' now make 200g vinyl records. Are they better than 180g? Are 180g records better than 160g records? I don't necessarily think so. FWIW, I would describe any label that attempts to make high quality reissues that sound better than the original, for example, Mobile Fidelity, as an audiophile label. So, MOFI, Analogue Productions, etc. These are all what I'd call 'audiophile labels'.

@ Of course you have to have the master tape to start with that’s why it says ORIGINAL MASTER tape and even when you make a copy you run the risk of damaging the original; especially when it’s 50 years old. So again Mo Fi admitted to the insertion of very small amounts of digital that’s where people then tried to say they could hear the difference between the two which again was BS. MO FI paid a 25M fine not because the product was inferior but because of a lack of transparency in adverting what the customer bought. Customers were allowed to return the album for refund or keep the album and get a 10% cash rebate. As far as the sound quality being subjective that’s generally true with anything except people have done hundreds and hundreds of album comparisons and MO Fi reissue can be scientifically proven that they are SO much better than the original which they are because of the skill of the engineers and the equipment used as well as the pressing process. These are ALL facts. People who say they are not better one never heard them two there equipment isn’t good enough to pick up the difference or their hearing has degraded. Finally record weight impacts the record in the following way durability how long it will last and stability how flat it is as it plays. These are all established facts there is no opinion you can find the information yourself it’s part of the public record.

@@robertbyington7715 Yes, the MOFI fine was for misleading marketing / labelling of the product. What you're saying here is incorrect though: the issue was not that "MOFI inserted small amounts of digital". It was that entire albums (not only Thriller, but most of MOFI's output for around ten years or so) were cut from digital, not direct from the original master tapes as they once were... Since the lawsuit MOFI specify their sources on their website, for example: the source for Michael Jackson's Thriller is "1/2" / 30 IPS analog master to DSD 256 to analog console to lathe". That is not "small amounts of digital" it is using a digital source (in this case a DSD 256 file), of course that digital source ultimately came from the original master tape. But then ultimately everything does. There are companies out there: Analogue Productions being just one of them, that make a point of producing LPs in the same manner as MOFI used to do: ie. get the original master tape and cut the lacquer from that. There are still some trusted mastering engineers, that still can get hold of original master tapes from the record companies. In fact a friend of mine, Tim de Paravicini, who sadly passed away a few years ago, developed a specifically modified Studer A80 master recorder for MOFI, along with a whole suite of bespoke mastering electronics. Back in those days MOFI used to do it in a similar way that Analogue Productions (and a handful of others) still do. I have may MOFI LPs from this era and would not get rid of them. Finally, a record's weight has nothing to do with its longevity nor how flat it is. In fact I have had a higher incidence of warped discs from the MOFI One-Step series than with any other type of LP, regardless of the LP weight. However, MOFI have very recently moved away from RTI and now have their own pressing plant 'Fidelity Record Pressing'. I have so far only got one LP pressed at FRP and I do have to say, it is perfectly flat. Let's hope this is a sign of what's to come.

Thanks for the feedback Brian.

Thanks for the feedback. I'm with you regarding the production choices made, but also agree, it's a good album, in many ways, great.

Yes, if it has a bar code it is definitely a recent reissue…

@ thanks! You might have already done a video on this I’m not sure but it would be interesting on your thoughts of the abbey road half speed master of seconds out

@@owenlewis666 I haven't listened to any Genesis Abbey Road Half Speed Masters, but from the various AR HS albums I have heard, they are not generally to my taste.

In that case I strongly suspect you'll enjoy the Atlantic 75 Stephen. FWIW, I used to have a US pink label Foxtrot (if I remember correctly). It didn’t sound great...

Glad you enjoyed the video!

In theory it doesn’t, I currently have a DS Audio ION 001 which does this job perfectly.

@ Right. Interesting. I totally believe your review on the UHQR because I have the same experience with the Steely Dan “Aja” UHQR . It’s unfortunate.

That’s about how I feel about it…

I’m starting to think this is the way we should be enjoying these releases…

That’s certainly the cheapest way. Fortunately people did pay the price back in the day, so we can enjoy these fifty year old machines…

I shared your first impressions for sure. But actually, what I think is happening is we’ve got used to the original’s flattening of the dynamic envelope… I can’t now hear the OG as being clearer, just ‘thicker’, so to speak. As I try to point out in the video: if you can’t / don’t want to turn up the volume then I think the OG will be more suitable to your requirements…

Hi, that’s a very good point: the Buddha - Atlantic scenario… I don’t know the answer but worth remembering that the ‘Atlantic master’ won’t be the same as the ‘Trident / Charisma’ master…

My pleasure, thanks for the feedback.

I really do hope you find a good condition pink scroll copy Peter!

My pleasure! Thanks for the feedback.

Glad you enjoyed the review. Thanks for the feedback Robert!

Thanks so much for all this feedback. I know what you mean about Abacab vs W&W. I’d even rather have had &TTW3 or Duke… I’m really not sure about the Lamb. I’m sure I’ll love all the stuff to look at and read, but 1/2 speed Abbey Road…. I just don’t know….

Going to go for the CD version I think. Can’t justify double the price for the vinyl given the AP 75 version is so good.

I wish I had a ‘bought new’ pink scroll. Sadly I was way too young in ‘71. I played some of my earliest records on some very dubious equipment too. If I remember correctly a Fidelity UA4… The best I could afford as a young teen.

I really appreciate that! Thank you Jeff!

That pressing of Selling England is a record club edition, if I recall correctly. It is definitely sought after by Genesis collectors. I know I have it in my Discogs wantlist, haha. I actually have a pink scroll US Foxtrot, but it is apparently a second pressing. I saw a whole deep-dive on it once. By the time it got released in the US, Charisma had switched to the large hatter. Then they briefly reverted in the US only. Unused stock, perhaps. I have also heard theories that it is a counterfeit made after the switch to Atlantic and posing as unsold deleted Buddha stock. That sounds plausible, too.

Thanks for the comments. If I remember correctly I also once had a pink scroll US Foxtrot (non gatefold?). I’d still go for UK originals of Genesis, just as I’d go for US originals of American artists…

@@DaveDenyer That makes no sense to me. So, only Italian pressings for Italian opera and Spanish pressings for Segovia?

@@buppie2000 it's only a trend I've noticed over the decades: to be specific it's not where the artist is from, it's where the recording, but more specifically the mix and mastering is done... Generally, if a recording was made in the UK, for a UK label, the original master will be used to make distribution and production masters and these copies are what is sent out to the various distributors around the world. The overseas distribution company / label may even make additional mastering choices, sometimes adding more reverb, equalisation, etc. It's certainly not a hard and fast rule, but generally I collect (and prefer) UK originals of, for example, Yes and Genesis, the Beatles etc. and US originals of Dylan, Miles Davis etc (although my copy of Ascenseur Pour L'echafaud is of course the French original on Fontana). Of course, as with pretty much anything , there are plenty of exceptions...

@@DaveDenyer Hey, just playing with ya, buddy! I mostly agree. Fun channel. Carry on!

Great question: If I could have only one, it would be my UK original (pink scroll). It took me perhaps thirty years to find.

Totally disagree about the German 1st press , it sounds like a tape copy with the slightly veiled sound that entails compared to a UK 1st press . I was quite disappointed by it actually , considering its reputation amongst some Genesis fans . A UK early pressing is the one to get . Waiting on my Atlantic 75 now .

I've not heard this German pressing. It would be interesting to do so. Thanks for the feedback Manfred.

@@peterlaffey6328 I've not heard it but it would be highly unusual (in my experience) for an overseas release to better the 'home country' release.

I have the German Philips Label. The mix is completely different from any Nursery Cryme I've ever heard. Almost bizarre, but then again, there are spots like where the church organ comes crashing through the mix in Musical Box is fantastic and sublime. I haven't heard the Pink label UK yet, but I want too.

@@maninthemountain I'm intrigued, I definitely need to hear this German release...

Good question. I've not heard the CR Genesis reissues. Thanks for the feedback.

@@preservedmoose these Atlantic 75th 45rpm reissues were all actually mastered and cut by Chris Bellman at Bernie Grundman Mastering for Classic Records back in the early 2000s at the same time as the Classic Records 33rpm. Unused, they were recently acquired by Chad Kassem. The only exceptions are Trick of the Tail (not reissued by Classic) and some damaged sides that had to be replaced (SEBTP?). Chris Bellman was again used to newly master and cut Trick, and to cut replacement sides as necessary. I suspect they sound similar, with the Atlantic 75th having the added benefit that 45rpm can bring, and the quieter vinyl that QRP brings to the table.

@@jeffwhitehead6268 thank you for the detailed explanation. Yeah, I was aware of that and have the Classic 33 and AP 45 of Selling England and The Lamb. I was surprised at the difference, particularly on Selling England but also on the bass on The Lamb. However, from Dave’s comments, I have a feeling that the difference will be more subtle on this one (though I don’t know, of course).

Glad you found the review useful John. Not sure I've ever seen an Aussie Phillips before now... I'll have to have a look. 🙂

Hi Ralph, Thanks for the feedback. I'm glad you enjoyed my review. I'd love to see a really good all-analogue reissue of 'Hissing', but also 'Don Juan's Reckless Daughter', my other favourite Joni LP from that period... I'm not sure I'll even bother with the MOFI...

@@ralphsmart2023 not a 45 but the Speakers Corner release is worth getting - mastered by Kevin Gray, if memory serves.

@@DaveDenyer, Vinyl Me Please reissued “Hissing” in July. 2x45rpm by Ryan Smith from the original tapes. I have not heard it yet, but what I’ve heard others say is great. Ryan Smith has been knocking it out of the park for them lately, and I really hope VMP carry on for a while. There are a couple available on Discogs from the UK for £39-£45.

@@jeffwhitehead6268yes that’s right, it’s almost like an AP release as it’s AAA, cut by Ryan Smith at 45 like many of the AP releases and probably has a tip on jacket. It’s also quite a bit cheaper. I think a lot of VMP stuff flies under the radar for a lot of people. But they have done quite a lot of decent stuff recently and all analog.

Hi Nick, I've got two Nakamichis: a BX100e and a model 600. The BX100 sounds notably better than the 600, being about ten years younger, so significant technical advances had been made even though the BX100 was the bottom of the range. Although because it looks so damned cool I've been toying with the idea of getting the 600 'restomodded'.

@DaveDenyer - 2 Naks eh- very nice Dave. Mine are humble in comparison- Yamaha KX 480 & 580, along with a 70's Pioneer and an early TEAC with the central tape door. Still looks cool though I think the days of picking up good decks in charity shops are long long gone. Thanks as always for the great content. If they release "Avalon" on Blu-ray in Dolby Atmos would you do a comparison with the 2003 SACD?

@@nickbitten9910 I did once have a KX-580 (I think it was that model) which was a really nice deck. Younger / newer again than the BX-100e so in all honesty, probably just as good a deck.

@@DaveDenyer - many thanks Dave.

Glad you enjoyed it, thanks for the feedback Ross.

Hi, yes I certainly will do a review, when my double 'half speed mastered' LP arrives. Whenever that is...

Glad my video prompted you to buy the album Rob. I suspect they’ve been swamped by demand because my 2LP, CDs etc have still not shipped…

Thanks for the feedback Herb. However I’m not so sure about it ‘not bringing any more fans’: I was a fan of their 70s /80s pop stuff but had completely lost interest since then, and my wife was 100% “not a fan”… however we just can’t stop playing it.

I’m not really a metal fan (never have been), but I find this album absolutely compelling. Maybe I’ve finally matured into my ‘metal phase’.

@@DaveDenyer my point is that it is NOT metal, but similar modern metal mixing techniques were inadvertently applied. Current shoe gaze bands are doing the same, so that may have influenced the sound. Anyhow.. Great album.

Glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for the feedback.

Glad you agree, thanks for the feedback.

Glad you found the video useful, thanks for the feedback.

I'm not sure I understand the science of why this should happen... but what you describe does fit exactly with what I hear. The BG cut goes deeper whereas the MS cut goes so far down (could well be around 60Hz) then seems to just get louder, not lower. Same effect I heard that ruins the Sade, and Duran Duran I recently talked about... I'd like to read the science behind what you say here Mark. Very, very interesting, thanks for the feedback.

@@DaveDenyer Well, thanks to you I learned there was a Grundman cut lacquer. It wouldn't have occurred to me to look... but as it turns out there were 5 distinct versions released, which is unusual... 3 Showell half speed masters, all pressed at Pallas, 2 Grundman, one pressed in Mexico and the other Pallas, which is the clear winner on paper at least. I ordered a copy.

Thanks for pointing that out to me. I've now watched the live concert: you are right, it does seem to be the bass guitar is the main source of distortion.

Thanks for the feedback. I'll do a follow up video as soon as my Cure shop order arrives.

Thanks for the feedback Jonathan. I'm still waiting for my order from the Cure store... Follow up video including the 2LP cut, CD, 24/96, Atmos (and cassette) versions to come...

Glad you found the review useful Mark. I hope you enjoy the CD. Cheers!

Thanks for the feedback Sammy.