Trying to FIX : Faulty Apple Keyboard Model A1243 purchased on eBay
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- Опубліковано 16 лют 2020
- Hi, this 'trying to fix' video shows me attempting to fix a faulty Apple keyboard purchased from eBay. The fault is that the majority of the keys are not working,
Remember that this is just for entertainment and I am not an expert in these repairs. The processes in the video may not be the best way, the correct way or the safest way to fix these things.
I do love fault finding and trying to fix broken things so I hope that comes across in this 'Trying to FIX' series.
Many thanks, Vince. - Навчання та стиль
Such a bummer that Apple doesn't make their stuff more repairable. These would be a relatively easy fix if they did. Interesting video
TronicsFix this would mean you would not buy a new one. So no profit for Apple.
The aluminum keyboard I got with my 2010 Mac Pro, quit working this past week actually. That's with 15 years of heavy usage. Apple doesn't have to make their products user repairable because they function well past their warranty date. 15 years use out of any computer peripheral is pretty damn impressive. Ive been through 3 $1000 TVs in the time I started using that keyboard. Ill gladly spend another $150 on an apple keyboard.
@@MrSharesky I went through 3 Apple Keyboards in 2 years. All were replaced under warranty, but would not spend my own money on another one. I'll go elsewhere when this one fails.
@@ftrueck they have a massive sustainability department headed up by former director of the US EPA . Right to Repair is something Apple needs to get their head around. Just getting worse by the day.
This isn't just Apple, I had a Microsoft Natural Keyboard 20 years ago that had the same type of Membrane. This is what cost reduction/cheap manufacturing has done. They've reduced the cost of keyboards to the point where they literally are just pieces of plastic paper with the tiniest metal printed on them. Very easy to break/corrode/damage. None of this stuff is designed to be repairable and it's a real shame that Electronics has gotten to this point. Makes a good argument for buying mechanical keyboards.
This is the most interesting video that I have seen more in recent years !!!
You are really patient !
I have 5 broken imac keyboards (more than 500$)
It's a scandal to make irreparable accessories like this. Imagine the pollution on a global scale.
I knew this was going to be the membrane! It's the same issue in old retro systems too, but the difference in those older systems - you can repair them. Well worth tearing that one down to show us exactly what was wrong with it! Stuff like this puts me off buying Apple!
Great demonstration. I had planned to buy and clean up a used keyboard, but now I'll focus on an inexpensive aftermarket solution...you saved me a lot of time and headache!
I did this myself a week ago, pain staking process each individual key and each individual key bracket etc. When I realised the circuit board was basically laminated with membrane I knew then the damage was irreversible so continued to dig deeper as curiousity got the better of me. Great video, nice to know I'm not the only one 🤣
It’s always fun when you start with something partially working and up with completely dead
its a learning process!! I got some great inside a keyboard knowledge from this Video
😅😅😅😅
I admire the persistence. I watched til the end since I was certain you're going to figure out out and put it back together!
The way these keyboards work is that they have a matrix with a keyswitch at every intersection. The microcontroller sends voltage down a column line, and looks to see if it comes out on any of the row lines. If a key is pressed, then it connects a column to a row. The arrangement of the matrix probably doesn't match up with the actual physical arrangement of the keys completely.
Interesting and informative exploration - thanks. Would not have thought an hour long video on failing to fix a keyboard would be watchable, but your curiosity and enthusiasm drew me in!
Good video Vince. The tracks on the membrane under the keys are very thin and can go bad with age or contamination. Sometimes it's obvious because they go a dark color as you saw. I've repaired older keyboards with broken tracks on the membrane by using a "circuit writer" pen, which is just a conductive ink. First I would take apart the keyboard and wash all the plastic parts and membranes in the bath tub and lay them out to dry on towels. My experience is with older keyboards which are much easier to take apart but these apple keyboards are obviously much more difficult...
I love fixing stuff but you convinced me that as much as I love this keyboard when you have a few keys that start failing after a "beverage" spill it isn't worth it. Cheers!
Very interesting video, I got a bunch of these sitting around with faulty wires / boards, you’ve inspired me to try open a few of them up see if I can swap out the boards and get a few back out into working order. I did try before but I nearly stabbed myself tryna open em up. Such a shame they are glued on so strongly compared to the newer ones.
Hi,
This is by far the best tear down video of this keyboard. I have the same keyboard which stopped working suddenly. I've tried all the tips that are available on forums and UA-cam , nothing seems to help. So I bought a mechanical keyboard which is great but I miss the low profile format of this keyboard.
Anyway thanks for the great video.
And if there's a way to fix it without taking it apart which is irreversible, please make it your next video.
Professional ! Amazing instructions, real time troubleshooting , basically enjoyable to watch ;)
Thank you Vince for your video. I Just repaired mine, by opening it with hot air gun, and a slunger like you. Then, jiggled the junction between layers you mentioned at @49:38 without removing the welded part.... and voilà ! Back to life !
Thank you so much !!!!!
When you introduce contaminations to the deionized water it will start to conduct 😉 but it's still better than tap water,
I think the aluminum is just there to make it feel higher quality than it actually is. Because without it, the keyboard would feel like typing on a Happy Meal toy.
Have the same keyboard, had issues with keys not working (i spilt red bull on it) so put through dish washer (warm wash no soap) and when it was finished i put on radiator for a day and when i tried again it worked fine...
also had one in office that had same issue as yours, only a few keys working, took home and also put through dish washer, same results, working fine now...
Nice video as always Vince. I always get a bit of education and entertainment watching your videos. One thing that I was curious to see was the "spot welds" on the back plate. They kind of looked like solder blobs to me and got me wondering if they could be de-soldered. Might be something to look at when your other two arrive. Although, thinking about it as I type, I'm not sure if the heat would destroy the membrane. :-)
Hi, I have a question 🙋♂️.
I’m currently building a 17 inch mac book pro with the internals of a M1 Mac Mini and I was originally planning on removing/ cutting into the case in order to fit in another high end keyboard however, I’ve also come across the teensy board which would allow me to rewire de signals from the ribbon to usb… unfortunately that all seems too tedious and I’m afraid the keys won’t really match in the end. Since this keyboard is mechanically similar to early mac book pros’ do you reckon the chips on this external keyboard could be used as the encoder for the inbuilt macbook pro keyboard?
Blimey! Last time I saw that many layers, I was peeling an onion! Surely with that many layers they could find some way of waterproofing the keyboard. Unlucky on this one, you were always going to be up against it, still a good informative video, hope you don't face the same problems with the other 2! Keep up the good work Vince!
Waterproof! are you kidding, that doesn’t sell replacement keyboards or am I being clinical
Thanks for the video! My case is a bit odd, because only the number keys stopped working after a casual clean with rubbing alcohol, but the "zero" is working. So 1, 2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9 not working. This way I can't pair the keyboard or enter any passwords which renders my keyboard useless. It's the smaller model with no num pad. Mouse keys is unchecked. I tried everything offered in blogs and discussions, but nothing works. Any ideas?
That's one way of get out of doing the dishes. Watching this is the next best way.
I love watching stuff like this. Great stuff
The fact they can't be repaired is such a pain! I have one that works but it's in rough shape (crushed edges and missing keys) and a broken one in mint condition and I was planning to put the working electronics in the working one. Guess not after seeing this. I'll just swap the missing caps over and leave the crushed aluminium edges as they are.
Amazing patience Vince. I have been the given the same model A1243 keyboard with same problem. Such a nice looking keyboard so thinking I will just leave the board on my desk. Theres an option with the 2 USB ports live so its a bit left field, but use the board as a hub for a USB mouse and keyboard connection to my windows computer.
Ahh, yes. The membrane keypad. Words cannot convey how much I detest them. They are, for the most part, simply unrepairable. If it were just a few bad tracks, they might be repairable with some conductive ink (though I don't know if it would even adhere to that plastic film), but that would depend on how easy it would be to take it apart _and_ put it back together. 9 times out of 10 it's just not feasible. If it's not sandwiched between welded plates it's between glued plastic film, like in microwaves and treadmills. No matter how well sealed they are they always seem to suffer from their tracks rotting away, so even with no moisture ingress I suspect maybe a chemical reaction from the components used in its manufacture.
A few years back I repaired a treadmill's keypad by reverse-engineering it, making a schematic and hardwiring a bunch of momentary pushbuttons. Even then I could not access _all_ of the functions due to the membrane specifying some of the buttons have more than 2 contacts made at the same time.
The membrane keypad won't be going away anytime soon, as they save a ton of space and are simple and cheap to manufacture.
Great video, Vince!
I recently tried to fix Mac pro a2338 keyboard Butter spilled with 99% iso propyl alcohol black substance under two layers appeared after watching your video now I know keyboard must be replaced without wasting time
Very helpful video
Thanks lot
5:48 I'm very disappointed that there is no rubber ducky.
i liked your determination to find the fault apple make it so you cannot repair it great video vince
You can soften and/or remove the adhesive with Naphtha - sold as Zippo Lighter Fluid, Ronsonol Lighter Fluid, or VM&P (varnish makers and paint) grade naphtha (quart size) from a paint store.
Squirt and wipe off. Gloves recommended. Similar but stronger than IPA.
I use it to clean sticky goo and labels off of cardboard boxes, and plastic cartridges.
you should think about a dremel tool, then you can grind away those joints. very useful tool. another comment said you could use conductive paint/marker and the like to restore those connections👍 great vid any how
As usual Vince, a very interesting video.Thank you.
Very interesting Vince, enjoyed that. Glad to see you have a Dyson Hairdryer lol. Bought the other half one for Christmas, near broke the bank lol. Keep up the good work. Mick 👍🍻
Vince you’ve learnt a few things which is worth it
Welds are just solder
Don’t clean using anything but IPA
Heat up before dissembling
I think you’ll have more success with next one
About 20 years ago when I was doing my own DIY car PC/MP3 player I had to use old keyboard (because it has the controller chip) and just find shortcut keys from those keyboard membranes. So example if space was play button on winamp you just had to find which two lines connect when you press space and solder a switch to those lines and you had play button.
Great detailed video Vince, much appreciated!
You saved me a lot of time !
Subscribed right away ! 🙏
When I wash a circuit board with water or alcohol, it has to be quickly dried off and then left for a few days to allow moisture under the chips to evaporate.
@Smattless when soldering I clean with 70% alcohol. It still will linger under IC's, so I leave it for a day or so before powering up. On motors I will use water and compressed air, then run them until warm to dry out.
@Smattless the 70% alcohol is 30% water, and if not fully evaporated will conduct electricity and cause a short.
@Smattless I have 97% for certain things. On some plastic items it will cause a white film.
The number keypad switches between the number input and the function input on those keys. Toggle the NumLock button to switch between the modes. The mode that was being used was function (arrow) keys at the initial test at 3:42
Im glad I found this tutorial.
So this is my issue, yesterday I decided to wipe down my keyboard (the same one in this tutorial). All I did was I used a damp hand towel, and went across the keyboard to remove some smudge and dirt off of the keys.. The keyboard was connected to my mac.
After I noticed that the green led light indicator for the caps lock was not lighting up anymore. So I went online to see what could be the issue (I have El Capitan by the way). So I tried holding down the caps lock key for a second, tapping it 5 times, tapping the alt/option key 5 times, so on and so forth.
Now when I hit the caps lock key it still doesn't light up but now the d key wont work, unless I click on the caps lock again.
but also other keys will not work when the caps lock key is initiated.
Do you have any idea what could be the issue?
I have tried to do a pram reset and nothing. Your help will be very much appreciated.
Thank you
Also if the caps lock is initiated certain keys like the o, or p would actually eject the cd carrier.
You say that it´s well made, I don´t think so.
They made a keyboard that can´t be opened without destroying it and it´s not water proof.
So it means if you have the bad luck to spill some liquid in your keyboard. It´s gone...... it´s just a matter of time....
Yeah, it's well made... To not give Apple any money as it is only fit for the trashcan. LOL! 😜
This is a problem with thin membrane keyboards in general. I killed my Logitech K800 with literally 2 or 3 mL of filtered tap water landing on the arrow keys.
I agree. I have many Thinkpads and all of them still work. I can replace most of the parts, especially the most failure points, battery, keyboard, ssd. Currently use a Lenovo L380 and stuck 32 gigs of ram in it, everything in it is replaceable by the user.
Only idiots buy apple
@mister kluge is your iq higher than 20 ?
Thank you for the video... after seeing the dirts from the keyboard in the water, i decided to lift the faulty keys with my finger and blow them hard with my mouth, and boom it worked like magic. Thank you.
Hi Vince! Have you ever tried conductive ink for trace repairs? It couldn't help in this particular case but could prove useful in some future projects. There's a few pens on the market right now that are quite helpful on trace and pad repairs but you can use conductive paint as well to try it out first.
Great work! And for a rule I tend to stay away from Apple products when repairs are needed.
There's a conductive glue on the market for defroster repair, almost in any car parts shop, it's glue with copper dust.
Hi Vince, I was very interested in this video as I have a broken keyboard of the same type. I'm thinking that it may not be rust from water that you have seen, as the backplate is not made of ferrous metal, It's more likely to be coffee, the weak acids from which would etch the traces over time. All pretty academic as it couldn't be fixed. I do wonder if bathing in IPA may have been a better move, as it is more likely to clean than cause shorts. I may have a go and if successful, will let you know. Keep up the great work!
That keyboard is never going to type again.
A good thing about this keyboard being broken and you experimenting whit it, is that you have a greater chance a getting the other keyboards working when you get them :)
Hey Vince, don't bother with Apple products in the future, they are notorious for making their things hard or impossible to service, and are getting better and better at it
The layout for buttons is like chessboard matrix. For example if you want the fist button on a row A on the first column 1 - you connect A on first connector and 1 on the second and so on. So for standart classic keyboard you should have 104 keys which is (it could be 8x13 which is exately 104 keys) 10x11 matrix (for 110 keys with 6 unused/reserved) e. g. from A-J for rows and 1-11 for columns. If you want 3 button on the 5 row you connect E with 3. On the flex board they can be layed out differently but the mapping will be the same. So you can make somekind of DIY device from leftovers ;) You can even wire your own unique keyboard from buttons or rubber tacktile switches and wires and even put LED backlight on its USB cable on +5V line :D
this video was exactly what I was looking for! Great job! Too bad the keyboard is basically unrepeatable.
Designed in California, clued in China. These are terrible keyboards, I have 3 of them and all the same issues (hower all different keys). There is theory that these keyboards are pressed (to tighten the glue - too tight) at the factory and this maybe already damage a small piece of the horrible fragile membrane or damage it over time by the crazy amount of pressure inside the glued materials. This is not designed for repair, a real shame. You can take out the PCB and mount it under a desk to provide 2 usb ports.
I just got the same model keyboard in junkyard for 2$ it was perfect working but was bent a little
Repaired it now working
Mine also have few keys not working 4 keys from 1 horizontal line, what should i do now? I think i have exact the same problem as you....
I’ve had a few of these from Carboot sale, just bin them if not working. What did Vince pay for it?
Thanks for spotting out the root cause. I have a magic keyboard + a macbook air which few keys do not work. Intended to repair but after watching this I decided not to waste the time!
Like 6 years ago I washed it, keys removed, under tap water. The only thing I damaged was the usb power with a very inconsistent connection. But apart that, it's working fine, for 12 years now. I know it's value, and I salvaged some others all those years, but latter versions are so sensible now, they definitely don't like liquid whatsoever. I can't get over it. I don't have mac anymore, but all my PC has an wired apple alu keyboard.
Brilliant video Vince. 👍
I've just repaired an apple pro keyboard, circa 2001 from a classic mac i have, the keyboard came with the quicksilver models. The story started when i spilt coffee from a flask! on it, it went everywhere. So it needed cleaned anyway, but, boy was it a pain, you can get the main board and the accompanying membrane and metal chassis away from the clear polycab easy, but after taking all the keys off the amount of screws that hold the membrane and chassis together are ridiculous and bloody tiny as well. It took ages to get all the screws out, clean everything then put it all back together, thought i'd done a great job, did it work nope (god dam) then i thought there might be still water in it; i'd not washed the membrane or electrical parts in-case, what happened effected the outcome, just the polycab areas and keys!. needless to say, somehow, water must still have got in somewhere, as it was stone dead. However, a little patients and a day in a very, very! hot conservatory 31 plus degrees and what would you know it works. Just shows what patients gets you. Thanks for an honest and informative video.
Thanks for this. I was heating my keyboard to try to pry it open, and I put this video on at the same time. I realized I could just stop and throw it in the bin Instead of wasting more time dismantling it. No way I could repair this. Also, mine was broken because I got a few droplets of beer on it, because I suddenly had to cough while I had a sip of beer in my mouth. ( looked funny though ). So they are very fragile when it comes to moisture. Mine stopped working over night, I guess because of the corrosion process it had a delay. I will buy a cheap new one or second hand one instead. My mac works with other brands of keyboards, so there is no problems in buying logitech or other cheap stuff.
I enjoyed the video the silver lines that go to the buttons I was told is platinum some keyboards are platinum some are gold
On my USB Apple keyboard I just bought (used) the keys 6 z h n are not working - one whole string. Would I have to open it too? I think that's too much work and b) I can't fix it then either (those metal channels)
Hey Vince! Sweet stuff. I'm having trouble with -oddly- just the shift keys on this board. Swapped the KB to another pc and both Shifts won't work. It has been my main KB for quite a handful of years now and it I haven't poured stuff on top of it ever. I wonder if there's a way around this! Enjoyed your whole video, incredibly tough to get to the membranes! Didn't expect it to be that hard.
Greetings!
Interesting to see how it works.
Very thorough methodology, I commend your approach! Learnt a lot from this video, thanks for the up :-)
So, how did it go? With the rest two boards?
I am an Apple fan, but I do really wish that they made their hardware more repairable. That said, even if it was possible to open one of these easily, they would still almost never get repaired, so I think Apple just decided that they might as well make it sealed. At least the keys and scissor mechanisms are replaceable, which hasn't been the case with the most recent MacBook Pros until the just-released 16" model.
This was an interesting video. I have a couple of these keyboards (and never had any issues with them for what it's worth) but I never knew what they looked like inside.
wonder when people start realizing that apple products are build to a cheap price and sold to a price where only fans can afford to buy em. Apple gives a shit about serviceability.
58:30 - of course it can be made with a circuit board, you could even make it out of Californium, however it's all about the price point. It's expensive to make a thin keyboard with full travel mechanical keys, expensive to make low profile keyboards as well. You can make keyboards very cheaply, but you have to make a few compromises...
props to you for exhibiting how apple products are sold as luxury items but are extremely cheap + non-repairable. a machined aluminum keyboard deck does not make a reliable keyboard.
This video is really helpful. Thank you
This got so much junk out of my keyboard I will wait for it to dry to see if it worked out for me! I'll just get a new one if it doesn't, but this is still worth a try!
you've got more patience than I have!
Loving the videos also would love to see some retro gaming handhelds fix it videos maybe Psps or Gameboys
Very enjoyable forensic deconstruction of an Apple Mac USB external keyboard. I was drawn in becuase I have this exact model USB keyboard and it's shwowing many similar issues. Whereas I was hoping to see a fixed keyboard at the end, it was really quite useful to see all of the problems these can have. The further positive comments down below indicate that your hard work was worth all of the effort.
i'm amazed. i watched the entire video. such a good explanation mate.
Thanks for your wonderful insight, for taking the time and reverse engineer through this keyboard! I just somehow magically ruined my A1234 keyboard. I clean the fat residue off the keys using 94% alcohol every other year or so. Now I did so, and all of a sudden the qwerty row of keys and some others stop working, and some are continually pressed.
Depressed and let down I went to a large electronics store to find out Apple sells their (full alphanumeric) Magic keyboards now only wireless at a staggering €150, compatible ones starting at €90. I can't remember having ever having to pay those kinds of numbers for a keyboard. So I figured my 13 year old keyboard would be as corroded as the one in the video with connections being blocked (although I can't remember having spilled anything in it but some 94% alcohol here and there), but still decided to flip out some keys (the first ones, as those would be blocking the rest of the row). There were a lot of small hairs and dirt trapped there which I tweezed out, and surely enough, my keyboard works again! So thanks again for your video!
The actual keyboard is a matrix with columns and rows. So to simulate a keystroke you'll have to connect one row with one column.
The diode is completely normal. It is reading the resistance through the rest of the circuit. If you was to take the diode off it would read .1883 one way and open the other way. If you test across the empty pads where the diode belongs on the board. You would read 1.3571 both ways.
If conductive inks don't work, you could try using that silver paint that's used to repair car rear windscreens
i have same product only left arrow key is not working i dont want to crack it open i hope i am able to fix it
kudos for persistence. that was really helpful for a guy without tools and on a remote desert island. right now my shift button has fallen into the abyss. but i'm not 'going in', no sir.
Hi. That small laptop you are using to check keyboard at bathroom - what is it? What's the model?
A bit late to the party. It's the GPD Pocket. It has since been replaced by the GPD pocket 3.
I have a Windows 10 10 inch tablet and I use a mini Apple clone keyboard with it. These are very nice looking keyboards and my one has bluetooth built in.
@24:38 I thought that was going to work...
I look at time remaining, and see 30 more minutes.... nope.. saw that coming...LOL
Love your videos man, I am ordering up a soldering station cause I started watching your videos, I love tinkering and taking things apart as well, just to see how it works. Used to do it when I was young, turning 50 and I need a new hobby anyways.
The business trick of Apple is to make their products as complicated as possible, as hard to repair as possible, and then ask morons 4 digit price for the product. And it works wonderfully.
Truth 👍
Great Video, Do you have any suggestions to clean the membrane, I see the water was not working for you. I spilled Tea with sugar init. I think It can be fixed.
Can you wash with rubbing alcohol?
Hey Vince, do ye live in the UK? whats it like there?
@mister kluge oof, I feel bad for the ol uk
Normally it is caused by crap getting under the keys and shorting out the contacts or preventing contacts working properly, this can be fixed by washing the whole thing in a dishwasher. You just have to make sure you dry it out for a few days after before trying out though.
Thanks man. I have been searching for hours how to simply remove the scissor mechanism of the Left Command key so I can swap the right key's cup/spring and found nothing. You show exactly how to do that. I was able to successfully remove the mechanism only to find that the silicone cup/spring that I want to exchange from the right key to the left cannot be removed/replaced without complete disassembly of the frame because it is stuck beneath that plastic membrane. Grrrrr! I hate this keyboard anyway. Time to replace it with a REAL keyboard from a REAL manufacturer.
This is a new level of insanity, very inspirational!
Hey Vince I have a logitech headset that worked great for the longest time, and now the one side doesnt work unless you wiggle the switch. If you want I can ship it to you and you can try and figure it out. I dont think it's just the switch because power remains on. And the other speaker works I also found if i give it a thud on that side it works at a different volume
It's a pc headset wireless. Logitech G933. I dont need it anymore I just went out and bought a new one.
Great video! thanks for making
I would recommend using a shop vac to suck out the water. An to suck out any additional debris. Then use the hair dryer.
It may help to disassemble a simple, conventional, PC keyboard from Logitech, Microsoft, PC manufacturers to understand how they work - eg how the two conductive layers form a circuit at corresponding points at each key that is translated by the board.
Great video, loved the entire testing process!
would you know that the track is complelty contains silver ? i think first step you should do was check the integrated chips then without losing any time checking keyboard tracks...
Had mine for several years, worked fine until I cleaned it the other night, now it works exactly like yours did. What a POS when you can't even clean them without wrecking them! What's a good replacement?
Good work!
When you plug-in the apple keyboard, don't you hear the device (drivers) mounting and dismounting within 2 seconds?
No, that's a windows thing.
Ricky Ostrom yeah
On windows
@@PaulJamesMuldoonGYST it;s a sign of a (low) power issue. Short or overload.
Nice try, well explained and interesting to see...
Vince, before going to destructive methods, you could've used oscilloscope. It wouldn't have changed anything this time, but under normal circumstances, it makes sense to check/measure as much as possible before destroying it for the sake of learning.
Keyboards work by cyclically sending short impulses through a number of lines and reading signals on the other set of lines. Pressing a key shorts some input and output lines and by analysing input and output signals keyboard electronics can say which key was pressed.
You can measure signals on both ribbon cable connectors and see what signals were sent or received. I don't know exactly how this keyboard works but most likely one connector is for input signals and the other one is for readings. In any case, oscilloscope would've shown it.
And shorting the output lines is a bad idea. Because at any given time only one line is active and all others aren't, by shorting them together you are looking for trouble and risking to fry the controller.
if you get something wet you need to let it dry for a few days if you can't get it apart to do it. water don't kill stuff. electric added to wet stuff does.what made you think spot welds? i never seen them ever in electronics. i would have thought they were solder and desolder them.