Rab Neutrino Pro VS Positron Pro | Review
Вставка
- Опубліковано 2 сер 2024
- I'm an adventurer, not a UA-cam reviewer. I've extensively used and tested both the Rab Neutrino Pro and Positron Pro in the UK, Norway, Sweden, Finland and Canada. l compared both jackets so that you can make an informed decision on which one to buy, if any.
RAB didn't even say hello, let alone sponsor me. l'm doing this honest review for those fellow adventurerers who risk their life going out in the wild and need the advice from a fellow adventurer who knows what's at stake.
00:00 - Both Jackets
00:24 - Positron in Norway
00:38 - Neutrino in Scottish National Trail
01:07 - Which One Should You Get?
02:03 - Weight
02:20 - Packability
02:38 - Hoodies are TOO BIG
02:59 - Positron Chest Pocket
03:08 - Do I Recommend the Jackets?
POSITRON PRO in Norway:
- Winter Ski Trip in the Arctic: • Winter Camping & Ski T...
- Winter Camping Dovrefjell Natioanl Park (Norway): • Playlist
- Neutrino Pro in action in Norway:
• Ultralight Arctic Wint...
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INSTAGRAM: / alwaysforwardyt
Camera Gear:
- Nikon z6
- Nikkor z 24mm f1.8 S
- Nikkor 28mm f1.8 G
Excellent review. Very helpful information. My question is what other similar jackets do you recommend? Thank you 🤙🤙
Thank you! I haven't tested other similar jackets myself, but l have some Scandinavian friends who swear for their Norrona and Klattermusen jackets.
When my Positron jacket breaks, I'll look at those brands for a replacement. Hope this helps 😊
Hi, thanks for all the solid info.-Could you tell me if there is a way to fold the hood down on the Positron Pro. I'm using the velcro strap from the neck but not sure if that's correct. Thanks
Hi, yes, the velcro strap is meant to be used for folding the hood. Thanks for the feedback 😊
Very interesting video... thank you from Greece...
Thank you! I'm happy you found it 'interesting,' l hope you enjoyed it, too 😅
@alwaysforward I need a jacket for finnish winters which is almost -25 to -35 which of these two would be better as my needs are normal going out for my uni classes.
Last winter l was twice in Kilpisjärvi. You'll see it at the end of this video: ua-cam.com/video/mahZB0zlO4Q/v-deo.html So I have a good idea of how cold it gets over there.
The Positron Pro will take you down to about -20°C. Below that you'll need a heavy jersey (like those typical Scandinavian ones made of wool that weighs about 1kg) and, of course, your usual layers.
The Positron will be by far more comfortable than a parka jacket, but the latter will offer better protection against cold, wind and snow drift, plus much better durability. I only use the Positron to sit in my tent, meal breaks and sometimes while packing.
If you plan on waking around the city in inclement weather, the parka would be my choice, unless you want the comfort of a puffy jacket and you understand you may have to cut your walk short and get back indoors. Hope this helps! (Sorry for long answer 🙄😅.)
Great video, ive been hoping for somebody, who had a Positron in hand, would post a video. Ive been round quite a few outdoors retailers and no one has seemed to bother having the positron in stock. Nevisport actually have the black one for £200 currently. Seems like a great deal but does it also tell a story about its success, that its actually not been that popular. Either way think im going to pull the trigger
Thank you! The Positron Pro is an overkill for the UK, unless you want to just wear a base layer underneath. l think (again, for the UK) the Neutrino Pro + mid layer + base layer is a better, more functional option. But hey, if you love the Positron Pro and being toasty, why not?
In truly cold countries (Norway, Sweden, etc.), people opt for fully tested Scandinavian brands like Norrona, Klattermussen, Bergans and so on. Those are the brands Scandinavian people know, just like here in the UK we know RAB, Montane and so on. l didn't know those brands so l got the RAB jacket.
l'd say this is the Norrona equivalent to the Positron Pro (link below). See the price difference? www.norrona.com/en-GB/products/trollveggen/trollveggen-down850-jacket-men/?color=5541
l paid £238 in Taunton Leisure back in 2020 (just checked it). For this money (or less, of course), the Positron is a great choice. l must say, the Positron did a fantastic job in Norway but, in time, l'll subsitute it for a jacket from an Scandinavian brand.
Let me know if you have any questions 🤓 l hope this helps! 👌
@@alwaysforwardyt thanks for this great response and better still thanks for bringing the names of these new brands i’d never heard of before, im interested to see what they have. I like being toasty an i feel more comfortable in a big coat and a simpler layer underneath rather than mulitiple layers. Although certain occasions multiple layers suits me
@@xabi1417 My pleasure! Let me introduce you to another couple of Norwegian brands for your base layer: Devold and Aclima. Both are great and do produce in Estonia. Icebreaker produces in China, in case that matters to you. Again, you won't go wrong with the Positron, it truly is an excellent jacket! ATB!
Hi, having a hard time between the Resolute and the Positron. Does the Positron have any interior pockets and are the hand warmer pockets lined at all? Thanks to all.
Hi there, the Positron has 1 interior pocket with room enough to accommodate a passport (or '5 passports,' so to say). The hand warmer pockets are lined only on one side (micro-fleece), on the front side of the pocket. The back side of the pocket (where your palms would rest) is just the material of the jacket itself).
In case it helps, personally l only use the pockets to store my gloves/stuff. If my hands are cold, then l put on the gloves...
Hey, love the detailed comparison, and just got a quick question. Wondering how the neutrino pro stacks up against the TNF summit l3 down hoodie, I know they are vastly different, but just wondering how different are they really? For example in warmth. Main use would be layering under a shell for skiing in really cold temps, thanks! 😊
Thanks! l don't have the TNF Summit L3 so take my reply with a pinch of salt... but as you said, the L3 and the Neutrino are very different jackets (the L3 is 1/3 lighter than the Neutrino). You're basically comparing a 'lightweight' jacket with a 'mild-winter' one. In terms of weight, the L3 weighs almost the same as my Rab Microlight Summit (also in the video 3:33) so it should probably be compared to this one. The Neutrino Pro is significantly warmer than the Mircolight Summit so this should give you an idea of the Neutrino VS L3 in terms of warmth retention.
Considering the main use you're going to give the jacket ("layering under a shell for skiing in really cold temps"), l'd say go for the TNF. The Neutrino needs more space for the goose down to loft (without loft, the down will not trap/retain heat properly) than the L3 because the Neutrino is a much thicker jacket. Wearing a shell on top of it will prevent that from happening. The 'L3' is a much thinner jacket and therefore needs less space for the down to loft (i.e. it should do better under a shell jacket). At the same time, the L3 has less down so all in all, both jackets may retain similar amounts of warmth when worn under a shell jacket (the Neutrino won't loft properly VS the L3 is not as warm by default). Now, the L3 would be the less bulky one and lighter (by around 200g).
Wearing a goose down jacket when skiing is probably not the best idea. You'll very likely overheat with any of the 2 jackets. If you overheat and sweat the down jackets, they will be useless. l'd suggest you get a synthetic 'active mid-layer' instead, like a fleece made with 'alpha' or similar (Arcteryx, Patagonia and many other brands have one). These garmets are designed for active use and they'll do great under a shell. You'll surely be cold as you begin to move, but you'll enjoy your day a lot more once you heat up (and that will happen in about 10-15 minutes).
Both the Neutrino and the L3 would be great to put 'over' your shell jacket once you stop skiing (this is particularly true for the Neutrino as is probably significantly 'warmer' than the L3).
l hope this helps! Good luck with the choice! 😊
@@alwaysforwardyt wow thanks so much for such a detailed response
My pleasure! 😊❄️☃️🏕️
This is a very helpful review. I am doing the three passes trek in nepal in november and Kili in december and i was trying to deicide which to get as i have found them both on sale with only a £10 difference.
Awesome! Happy my review was of help. // Wow! That sounds like an amazing hike. I'm going to check it out! 😻
Can I ask which one did you buy at the end and your impressions? I have to go to upper mustang in November and I need a jacket to wear in the evenings (I won't go above 4000m), and I can't decide which jacket to buy.
Thank you!
@@francescavisentin7455 hi! I ended up buying the positron pro because I wanted to do some 6000m peaks so I felt the neutrino wouldn’t be sufficient.
I love my jacket. I run cold and in this jacket I was always warm, even at almost 6000m. I use it mostly in the evenings around camp at higher altitudes. As the video shows, it doesn’t compress very small so that’s something to keep in mind if you’re backpacking.
IMO it would probably be too warm at 4000m so i would probably save some money and space and opt for the neutrino if I wasn’t going much over 4000m.
@@francescavisentin7455 the mountain equipment light line is also worth looking at.
@@fortheloveofhiking1778 Thank you very much!
Great video! Do you use a shell if it's snowing to protect the down from moisture? If so, any recommendations?
Thank you! No, l don't. Let me give you 2 answers: long and short.
Long story short: Not a good idea in my opinion/experience 🤓😅 Let the Pertex Quantum Pro do its job.
Long story long: First, both RAB jackets deal well with snow fall and, for a certain extent of time, sleet. Second, you're likely to create more moisture when using a shell than when simply letting the snow fall on the jacket, let me tell you why (in case you don't know it):
With a shell jacket over your down one, you'll likely sweat more (or simply produce more transpiration, even if you don't have sweat on your skin). This is because shell jackets (waterproof fabrics) don't breath that well (regardless of marketing claims).
More transpiration will hinder the down feathers performance (i.e. you'll feel colder than you should). Besides, a shell jacket may likely compress the down jacket. Hence, the down feathers may not achieve their optimal 'loft,' therefore not trapping as much heat as they could otherwise.
l hope this helps! ☺
@@alwaysforwardyt super helpful!
If it's well below freezing, snow will won't melt when it hits the surface of a down jacket. It will just slide right off.
Hi, do you have an idea if the RAB Infinity is comparable with one of these jackets? In terms of warmth.
Hi, RAB has a 'product characteristics' table for all its products that may come handy to you. According to RAB, all the 3 jackets insulate the same. Not a very strong selling point for the Positron if you ask me.
Now, if you want to have 'my opinion' this is what l think:
All the 3 jackets have the same quality of down (800FP) but the amount of down varies (from less to more): Neutrino (212g/ 7.5oz, Size M), Infinity (250g / 8.8oz, size M) then Positron (300g/ 10.6oz, Size L). Notice how both Infinity and Neutrino down quantities are for 'size M' whereas the Positron is 'size L' (i.e. it would be less down in 'size M').
My guess is both Infinity and Neutrino may be similar in terms of warmth, Positron Pro being the warmest. Even though the specified down amounts are similar, in my experience Positron is significantly warmer than Neutrino.
Infinity is made of GTX Infinium Windstopper which l like a lot (it's quite breathable compared to usual GTX and great against the wind), whereas Neutrino and Positron are made with Pertex (and Pertex Pro).
My verdict is simple: Since Infinity compares to Neutrino, l'll focus on these two.
- Are you (for whatever reason) going to use the jacket when being exposed to the elements? Then pick the Infinity hands down.
- Are you not going to use the jacket while being exposed to the elements? Then probably the Neutrino is the best choice as it's similarly warm as Infinity yet it weighs +200g less.
Hope this helps 😎
@@alwaysforwardyt Much appreciated your fast and detailed response!!! That helps a lot. 👍🏻
Hi Antonio great video thanks
I'm looking into getting a new jacket to keep me warm. I'm in mobility scooter I can't walk so I don't generate any heat that way. I used to to have a rab valiance jacket but didn't find it that warm. So I've been looking at these jackets and im stuck on which one would best keep me warm. I dont know how much warmer the neutrino is to the rab valiance any help would be appreciated greatly thanks Iain
Hi there,
RAB's website gives 4/5 insulation score to Valiance, 5/5 to Neutrino.
Based on the down quality and quantity (I checked both jackets' specs), Neutrino would be slightly warmer. I'd advise going for the Positron if you want to make sure you'll truly perceive the difference.
A strong suggestion would be to get a thick wool base layer. That could make a very significant difference (regardless of the jacket you wear, of course).
Look at Devold expedition ones, for example: www.devold.com/en-gb/expedition-man-zip-neck/?color=421A I got mine on offer in the UK for £65 (green zip/neck).
A great jacket will do its job best if you also wear a great base/mid-layer 😊
@@alwaysforwardyt thanks for quick reply. Yea I've got a really high quality thermal top and bottoms and good a thick wool jumper and the cold still Penetrates my arthritic bones lol. I think I'll go for the positron and take that risk. Thanks again much appreciated pal
My pleasure! I hope the Positron gives you (if only) a tadd more of warmth and comfort 😊
Thank you for your useful video, I have one question, do you recommend a Neutrino Pro to be a backup jacket for the evenings after hike (so to be used motionless) if the temerature at night falls down to -15?
I need a warm jacket but I cannot understand if the Neutrino is warm enough for this use. Thanks!
RAB jackets aren't the warmest, but they are a good compromise when it comes to warmth/weight/price.
With proper layers and caloric intake at check, the Neutrino will barely get the job done when used around -15°C. Anything colder and you'll be uncomfortable, but doable. Remember you may run warmer/colder than me.
Personally, I'd buy this jacket from Kailas instead (a more serious product than the RAB Neutrino. See Kristin Harila wearing this brand in her incredible climbing record journey). Just keep in mind the Neutrino Women's will have a female shape that will enhance the female figure (truly important when sitting in your tent alone 😅) while the Kailas won't: kailasgear.com/collections/women-down/products/c1-down-jacket-unisex?variant=40590920220866
@@alwaysforwardyt Thank you!
Is the neutrino pro suitable for a holiday to Norway (Tromsø) over the new year? I have a neutrino pro (just arrived) and have a positron pro coming too to try. Both were second hand, but basically new, same price.
Is the Neutrino pro likely to be better for me to wear every day over the Winter after the trip?
If your Tromsø holidays aren't going to be winter camping the way l do, then the Neutrino will do great. If worse comes to worse, you may just need to add an extra layer of insulation (or replace a layer for a thicker/warmer one).
Once back home, assuming home is in the UK, the Neutrino will be the most versatile of the two, as l mention in the video.
Good luck with the choice and enjoy those holidays!
@@alwaysforwardyt I think you're right!
This video is very informative. My kid is going to college in upstate New York (Ithaca) where the winter low temperature is about -10 C. It goes down to -17 C. Plus it is very windy. I'm looking for a jacket that is
1. Good for the -10C + windy weather
2. Packability is not an issue
3. 20 mins walk from Dorm to classroom where the jacket will be mostly used + some winter outdoor activity
4. Should offer mobility
Which of the two would you recommend?
Thank you! 🙏 Jesus, in the 2 years l've been a 'UA-camr' never had l so much responsibility answering a question 🙃 l better get this one right, for the sake of your kid 😟
Now, seriously, if packability and mobility are required, then we rule out a parka jacket. So, from the Neutrino or Positron Pro choice, l'd go for the Positron Pro. In those freezing temps, cooling down is easy; warming up is not. l'd go for the warmer jacket, the Positron Pro. l hope this helps! Regards from London 😊 (l hope l can go back to the US one day, l love it! ♥🇺🇸)
@@alwaysforwardyt Really appreciate your super quick response.
My pleasure! I hope your kid likes the jacket. ATB! 😊
What is your height weight and chest size. I'm trying to decide between the L/M Neutrino being 6ft 170 with 37inch chest.
I'd say M for you almost certain. l can accommodate quite a few layers on my L Neutrino. My measurements are: 5'8'' (178cms), 41'' chest. Hope this helps ;-)
Hey again.. i have a question with the positron. Do the draw cords get in the way of your face? like when the jacket is closed. how covenant are they stowed away?
I was doing some research, i see the Montane Resolute Down Jacket is identical, but the draw cord are outside. i might like that better, better brand and quality of jacket or nah?
Hi. No, they don't. However, if you adjust the hoody (and you will unless you're wearing a helmet) the draw cords get on the way of the zipper. Not a big deal, but annoying.
RAB and Montane are more or less at the same level, IMO. I think it's more about their individual products and personal preference. I believe Montane does much better hoodies than RAB. A climber wearing a helmet probably disagrees...
@@alwaysforwardyt yeah i see they are SO similar. I notice little things, the hood on the back of the montane is a cinch vs velcro. so i kind of like that..and i think i like the pull cords on the outside. the montane seems to have the aquaguard zippers, not that these are designed for we conditions, so??? . Im not sure about the box wall in the hood and arms on the montane, but the RAB does in the hood and arms. RAB seems to have a better selection of gear and a better website lay out for their products. geese, now im thinking about the Montane.. decisions, decisions.....
Either jacket will serve you well. How about this: Since both jackets are probably just as good, you may pick the one you think may resell better if ever you choose to sell it...
@@alwaysforwardytthat's is a good idea but my thinking is going to be based on fit. Quality of how the jacket it made, if Montane is made in the UK that's a plus, i know Rab isnt. I do see Montane products made in the UK, so, if they are both made in an asian country, no biggie. I need tonsee how well the hood functions. I do like the Montane pull cord outside and the pull cord in the back hood. I think its easier to adjust in the cold or rain without opening the jacket.Maybe it won't be an issue with the velcro on the positron. I wanna see how well the hem pull cords stay tight. I had TNF Himalayan Parka like a 2018 version and the hem pull cords came lose when I walked, really disappointed. And massive cold spots on the top elbows. Worse then my TNF L3. So that's another thing I'll be looking at. So far I like the Montane water proof zippers (aquaguard) and the inside lining says Montane all over as a nice detail. I will also be looking at what brand has good choices for Ski Jackets/pants. And also Midlayers and Baselayers for when I ski.
Both companies make nice gloves. Rab seems to make more and probably more of a warmer style glove.
I want a company where what ever I need I can go to them. I like both of these brands. Well respected and clean looking gear. Both haven been in extreme conditions and design for that so we will see. The Montane is shipped and the Rab is coming Tomorrow.
Hi there, thanks for your video comparison. I am female who runs cold. I will be climbing the 5 Volcanoes in Ecuador this July including Chimborazo and I was wondering which jacket to get? I am tempted to go for thr Positron Pro as I would also like a jacket for future expeditions, however, I don't want to be stuck boiling if the jacket is too warm compared to the Neutrino Pro. Your thoughts?
Wow, that sounds like an awesome holiday plan! l'd buy the Positron. You can always do the zipper down if you start overheating but, if you're getting cold and the Neutrino is not enough, you'll be in trouble. My 2 cents 🤓
@@alwaysforwardyt thanks so much for your quick reply. I was thinking of adding a Goretex outer shell for wind and rain and I would have a baselayer as well. Would that be overkill or would you still recommend the Positron over the Neutrino in this case?
@@lynnette6268 I took for granted you'd bring your shell and baselayer. You'll be using that 'actively.' When you rest or get to camp, you'll probably want to put a puffy on and, if you run cold, the Positron will more likely keep you warm. Again, it's a lot easier to get rid of extra heat than to retain it. And then, for future expeditions (as you said) the Positron is the more 'serious' jacket of the two.
@@alwaysforwardyt great thanks again for your input. And out of curiosity are there any other jackets that you might recommend to compare with the Positron Pro?
@@lynnette6268If you want much better quality and attention to details, and a much stronger compromise with 'green production' then look at the Swedish brand Klattermusen. It's a bit more expensive than RAB (here in the US), but the quality can't begin to compare. l switched from a pair of Montane trousers (super terra) to a Klattermusen Gere 2.0 (about $100 pricier) and oh my, what an incredible jump in quality. Can't begin to compare, as l said.
There's also the fact that Scandinavian brands know much better about cold environments. A normal summer in the Norwegian/Swedish Arctic regions is as cold as (if not colder than) your usual UK winter - think about that. Scandinavians know how to stay warm in the coldest environments because that's where they live. Many Europeans don't realize that Tromsø, for example, where l was winter camping last March is in the same latitud as Buffin Island (way up north in Canada)...
Personally, l prefer like pull-overs more than jackets. This would get you covered despite being ligther than the Positron. www.klattermusen.com/en/women/down-jackets/10622u81-liv-2.0-sweater-unisex-burnt-russet/
Just to say, l asked Klattermusen for product support because l love their products but the answer was 'no.' They encourage me to apply next year which, by the way is 'this year' now! Anyway, l hope this helps and happy 2023! 🌞🎉
Hi Great Video! really, since I will have to go to a very cold climate , will go with the Positron Pro. I am a rookie on these kind of products, but could you also tell me which is the model of the light blue sweater you are using, since looks that it can be combined with the jacket as well in terms of getting wam.. Thanks a lot and thanks in advance.
Thank you! 😊 That's the Omm Smock. Here's my review: ua-cam.com/video/W-6hKxCyzj0/v-deo.html
Two other products that you may want to take a look at (highly regarded if you're going to be exposed to the elements):
- Aclima Warmwool Sweater with zip (mid layer with very useful buffy/hoodie incorporated).
- Devold Expedition Merino 235 zip neck (thick base layer).
I hope this helps! 😊
Wow that was fast! thanks so much and will check the products you mentioned! once again you have a great channel. !
@@cristiansierra2556 Thank you! Enjoy your trip! 😊
Hi, its me again! wanted to ask if you could suggest a good pair of winter shoes, focus on avoid slippery ice roads, these since last year I felt quite bad, even though I had a vibram sole. Hope you can help me with this as well. Thanks in advance.
@@cristiansierra2556 Hi there! Probably the shoes you bought are great, it's just that ice is an extremely slippery surface. I also fell last winter quite badly after l took off my skis (20m away from my destination 🙄).
For ice, l'd say your best bet are micro spikes. Get yourself a pair of easy fit, lightweight micro spikes. You keep them in a pouch in your pocket (so that they don't make wholes in your jacket) and put them on and off your shoes/boots as required.
These are the minimum you can buy that will get the job done. Easy/quick on and off, lightweight, cheap. They are more 'city friendly' but they'll do OK in trails: www.blackdiamondequipment.com/en_US/product/blitz-spike-traction-device/
If you are going to walk in the mountains (not in a path), you'll then need a real pair of micro-spikes (or even crampons!). Compared with the above, you'll want them to have spikes on the heel area (that gives the most traction). Notice that the ones above only have spikes on the forefoot (they're minimalistic, all you need for many situations). Good luck with the choice!
I will be travelling to the Himalayas in jan 23. -15c in the day. Which jacket would you suggest in that case ?
Personally, l'd take the Positron jacket as l always prefer to err on the warmer side of things. Besides, you can always do the zip down if you get too warm (l doubt you will anyway). Just remember: if you get cold despite wearing appropriate clothing, simply move around a bit to stimulate blood flow. Have a great time in the Himalayas! l'm envious! 😉😅
@@alwaysforwardyt Many thanks for your prompt reply. appreciate it
My pleasure! Enjoy! ☃️❄️😻
Are both jackets the same length? Is one taller than the other?
l'd say the have the very same cut.
thanks for the video. I decided to go with the Positron Jacket. A bit warmer, better hood I think. how has it held up? any down shifting? where is the jacket made? what does the tag say? thank you
My Positron is doing great in all fronts. I haven't used it at much as the Neutrino, but the latter is also doing very well (just lost a few feathers and got a small hole but overall is fine).
The Positron is made in Indonesia (according to the label, I checked it for you). Hope this helps 😊
@@alwaysforwardyt yes definitely.. figures. I was hoping it was England. Does this have a single or dual pull cord at the bottom? One on each side or just the right side?
The jacket is warm huh? It's replacing my North Face L3 Down jacket. Everyone has TNF now. 😔
if you want an English jacket made in England l think you want to look at PhD jackets.
You can adjust the bottom cord in both sides of the jacket. It works very well.
The TNF L3 Down is a completely different animal, isn't it? I think it weighs about half the Positron... The L3 down jacket has a very good reputation... I think it's a great lightweight jacket.
You can look at Scandinavian brands if you want alternatives to the Positron, brands like Klattermusen or Norrona...
@@alwaysforwardyt i really like the rab gear. people seem to summit Everest with their high end gear. i kind of like that.
The L3 is good. i feel i need a bit more, but not ALOT. I like the dual pull cords on each side like you mentioned, and the velcro cuffs, and the chest pocket. my stretch cuffs are stretched out. and everyone has TNF now. fakes, cheap ones at department stores sell them. now they seem to be just run of the mill products. their summit series are good. does the Positron have an inside pocket?
I think there must be 100 Everest climbers wearing TNF for one wearing RAB (and that's probably RAB sponsoring them for publicity). I understand you may dislike TNF, but let's not forget they became that big in the industry for a reason.
If you need a significant step up from L3 (both in warmth and weight), then the Neutrino could be a better choice. You could also go about with a thicker mid-layer and stick to the L3. It depends on your use case scenario.
Yes, the Positron has a 'wallet friendly' interior pocket, so to call it (a small size interior pocket).
Let me also tell you that RAB didn't even offer to repair (for free) the one hole my Neutrino jacket has (l asked them twice). I've been giving RAB free publicity for years. I'm very disappointed. For my next video I'll put a sticker on the brand's logo 😞
Did you ever try the Mythic Ultra? I just tried it and was a little disappointed in the loft so thinking about the Positron Pro instead.
I never tried it, but based on the specs, the Positron Pro may equally disappoint you.
The Mythic has slightly better quality down (900 VS 800) but less quantity (~50g less compared to Positron size L). Let's call it even there.
The other weight (and warmth!) reduction factor is the 10D outter layer (I think Positron is 20D, like Neutrino Pro). A thicker outter layer will help trapping body heat, so here the Positron has the edge, but just marginally (as both jackets use thin outter layers to keep weight under conttol).
This Christmas l bought the Mountain Hardware Absolute Zero (50% off). That jacket is significantly warmer than any of the RAB ones we mentioned, but it's much heavier and expensive (besides, MH does not specify the quantity of down they use in the jacket. I sent it back 🤓).
If RAB were nicer to me and offered me a bit of product support (after all l advertise their brand everywhere for free, for years now), l would have no problem saying that the Positron is the 'best in class' due to an unbeatable Price/Weight/Warmth ratio. Hope this helps! 👌🏻😎
@@alwaysforwardyt thank you for the detailed reply, Positron will be here in a couple of days so will see, there is also a Polish one Malachowski that has 280g of 850fp so might have a look at that.
@@alwaysforwardyt i just found one called Feathered Friends Rock and Ice Expedition with 542g of 900fp! too warm for me but maybe something for you, warmer than the Rab 8000
l bought their camp boots and l was surprised to see how well designed they are! We'll see how they perform in the real world soon🥶😊Of course, l looked at their jackets and they probably are phenomenal, just too expensive for me. @@RogerByrne
My pleasure! I'd be interesting to know if my 'warmth estimation' between the Mythic Ultra and the Positron was somehow right (no problem if l was wrong). Please, let me know what you find, if you don't mind 😊@@RogerByrne
I'm torn between these two jackets. I need a static layer for winter camping and touring in Quebec, Canada, so the better packability, the better. I was originally considering the Positron, but it might be too bulky for my needs. However, I'm also a little concerned that the lighter Neutrino Pro won't be warm enough should I find myself in inclement weather.
Get the Positron Pro: trust me, it's the better jacket of the two. Down to -15ºC or so (it depends on how cold/warm you run) you can manage with the Neutrino while wearing thick base and mid-layers and a mid-weight jacket (around 500g). The Positron will get you down to -20 or -25ºC. Below that l always need to add a heavy weight layer (a 1kg jersery or similar).
Again, it seems like the Positron should be the betteer choice for your needs. ATB!
@@alwaysforwardyt Thank you for your reply :)
The comparison at 2:25 is very helpful, though I'm wondering if you know how many litres the Positron is when stuffed in the sac?
@@davidn.8976 l don't know the exact values, but l estimate the Neutrino staff sac may be around 4l whereas the Positron may be 5.5l (you can ask Rab for the exact values).
l can also tell you that you can store the Neutrino Pro in a 4.5l dry bag from Sea to Summit (folding the top of the bag 2-3 times) but you can't store the Positron Pro in that very same bag, not even leaving it open (it barely fits in it). Thus, the Positron Pro sac must be minimum 5l, most likely 5.5l. l hope this helps!
Good morning :) I am considering to buy Neutrino Rab or Mountain Equipment Lightline. How Neutrino behave with rain? Not strong one, but short time normal one? Is outer fabric solid? I found their 20D fabric is not strong enough and Lightline is better in terms of it. Like this video:)
Thank you
Hi there 😊 The Neutrino jacket does quite well with intermittent and "short time normal" rain. In the city, you'll be covered; in the outdoors, you'll avoid rain exposure (safety first).
Both my Neutrino and Positron have held very well against punctures and tears, but l take good care of my kit.
Basically, the Mountain Equipment jacket will likely be slightly warmer and certainly more robust (ME 40D VS RAB 20D outter layer) but it's heavier. Hope this helps!
@@alwaysforwardyt Thank you for quick respond and help :) good luck with all new journey
@@jacekkoperkiewicz4223 My pleasure! 😊ATB to you, too!
Hey hey buddy. whats up?? I got the Positron Jacket... Damn, what a real nice jacket, I must say.... Its a tad smaller then my TNF older Himalayan Parka. (which is good) I was going to list what I like, but it is better then TNF L3. The hem cords are strong, velcro cuff are great, length is spot on, and it zip up a bit higher then the L3. Im not 100% sold on the draw cords inside, I can deal with it, but I will see what the Montane is like. It is just about the same. I'm looking for a 1 and done brand. Either Rab or Montane.
I took the L3 and Positron outside, 41 degrees slight wind... I didnt wear a shirt while wearing both jackets, and the Positron is warmer. The Baffel Hood is warmer, the Baffel back and front is like a sleeping bag. The positron zips up higher and the front, almost to my nose and hood adjustments really wrap your head very well. I am very pleased with the jacket. I could deal with the inside cords, ill see what the Montane is like.. MIGHT get a cold spot on the top elbow, but my TNF is the same, i think they are all like that... Ill keep you posted tomorrow.
Awesome, you seem to have positive impressions... we'll see when you put it to the test. I'd say the Positron will have you covered; it truly is an excellent jacket.
I'm really not a fan of the draw cords either, especially not in combination with the massive 'helmet compatible' hoody (those cords got really long after adjusting the hoody), but you can't have it all.
At around £220-240, the Positron is hard to beat.
Just to say, no doubt the Positron is warmer than L3: it also is double its weight, isn't it?
These guys from RAB could've had me happy with so little... I have this bitter taste in my mouth, damn!
@@alwaysforwardyt what happened with the guys from Rab? I had a good chat with a worker. I called on Monday to pay the expedite shipping after placing the order on Saturday. He said he will try to have it shipped out On Monday and was very helpful. I do like how they have a headquarters in Colorado. And they offer a cleaning service. Just kind of cool. The Montane people never responded back to my email. (Oh well)
Yeah the draw cords do get long. I can cinch this jacket up so only my eyes show. The stiff hood brim is really cool. Nicest jacket I think I've tried on. I like the fleece lined pockets too. Reflective logos and letters are cool too...
I like the Rab very detailed website. Little details peak my interest. Montane isn't bad. It is what it is.
I believe a bit less then double the weight but they are both 800 fill but the Rab has more volume of fill. Which is exactly what I was looking for.
I sold my TNF himalayan parka. It was like the Rab expedition 8000 . Kinda too big. Like I mentioned, hem cords sucked Kinda short for an XL and cold spot ontop of the elbow. 😏 o well..
I'll keep u posted tomorrow when the montane comes in. 👍
This jacket is 7
I just would've liked a bit of love after walking and promoting their jackets all over Scotland, England and Scandinavia.
Being such a small UA-cam channel, they would easily have gained me over with just fixing a small hole l got on my Neutrino jacket, but they deemed me and my channel as unimportant. It's one of those cases of lack of strategic thinking when, with very little, you get back 'very much' (so to say), yet you are not willing to put in that very little.
In contrast, Omm, a much smaller brand, once offered me a great discount when l asked them for a bit of help. Small brand, yet big support and vision.
Not that l need sponsorship, luckily l manage well without it, it's more about getting love and recognition.
We'll see how the RAB compares to the Montane. I'm curious. I may have to fly to Colorado (I now live in DC!) and shoot a video review with you 😉😅
@@alwaysforwardyt you are in DC? im in CT. wow, small world..
I understand where you are coming from, its kind of a bummer how that happens. Do they even know you promote for them? have you uploaded videos to their website? The smaller brands will give you a discount, because they are smaller and need their name out there. I have seen it with fishing as well. I follow you tubers promoting fishing things, the HUGH names they are not apart of. Politics i guess... while u are in DC keep out of the swamp, lol..
ill be in touch
Which one is warmer neutrino pro or positron pro
Because there is a difference between fill weight
Neutrino pro 212g
Positron pro 300g
I think positron pro will be warmer
Positron Pro is significantly warmer, but it packs a log bigger than Neutrino Pro (pre-2021 version at least). But watch this section in case it helps: 4:08
Which one woulf be better for temps between 0 to -20, at sometime windxhills can get to -30 and then other weeks 0-+5c. Hood is irrelevant, but are either removable. I really want it for walking my dog on those cold morning
For walking the dog I'd get a cheap (on offer) 3 in 1 parka from COLUMBIA or similar, which l could use all year long (except for summer, of course)and will last for many years. Besides, a parka will have you cover on rainy/snowy days.
You pay more for technical jackets when you need a good or excellent 'warmth to weight ratio,' but long term durability isn't part of the equation.
If you really want to buy one of the two RAB jackets, then pick the Neutrino if your dog gives you a workout when you walk it or the Positron if it's a calm dog that stops to pee in every corner. Basically, the more active your walking the dog is, the less insulation you'll need. ATB!
Hey there hows things? I got the Montane Resolute Jacket....It is a nice jacket. I like both, it might take a few days for me to decide. to start with the montane, I notice the inside and outside pertex is a bit (not as soft) i feel the Rab lofts more. There is no boxwall construction in the arms on the Montane, which is a bummer. The Rab has no box wall construction on the bottom arms, and sides. but the fill on the sides is pretty beefy on the Rab. The hood on the Montane is smaller, so a helmet will be an issue. regular use it is fine. The Rab as a longer wired brim then the Montane. The Montane has a Smaller wired brim. The Rab has nice loft around your face, as you might know. Now for the draw cords.... The Montane rear draw cord, doesnt do anything, im surprised. It doesnt cinch anything. I dont understand, you can pull it all the way tight and it might pull an inch. im very surprised. The Rab velcro is better. Both jackets will pull so you can only see your eyes, and yeah the cords can get in the way, but i dont think it will be an issue. both hem cinch's are strong, but I like how the Rab has their own adjustments with their logo on them vs the generic ones that a lot of company's use. I feel the Rab down might shift, but i dunno. have you noticed? I do feel a cold spot on the Bi cepts on both, but maybe a very very slight more on the Rab. The cuffs on the Montane are smaller, you cant get them over large ski gloves, I tried. Could be good or bad. the elastic is a better on the Montane and the Velcro is a tad more sticky. So, I am not sure. Ill try em out and see what happens. Ill think about it over my vacation to Aruba on thursday. ttyl buddy
Thanks for the 'report' 😉 After all this, you go to Aruba (very hot weather)? l thought you'd go to Alaska, at least, to test the jackets! 😅 Whatever you decide, until you put them to the test a few times, we won't find out if you truly like them. And then there are the things we only notice when we've used a product for longer, but that's another story...
And just to say, l trimmed the original video because people would skip those sections. l had gone through more details initially, but then it seems people are mostly interested in the basics and skip through the details. For example, the fact that the front pocket zipper pull (on the Positron) is too short to grab when wearing 2-3 gloves (which you'll be doing when using the Positron in the conditions it's designed for). l even had b-roll demonstrating it (from inside a snow shelter)... Or the fact that the oversized, helmet compatible hoody may actually be helpful in truly extreme sub-zero temps since it can accommodate a heavy-duty winter hat (like those trapper hats)...
Enjoy those holidays!
@@alwaysforwardyt LOL i know right, you are right so true, but for now it exceeds TNF L3. time will tell... I do like the warm climates, and always vacationed there LOL. I do Ski in vermont but nothing too crazy... Well I can make zipper extensions on the Positron (ill try that later on), not a big problem, but after I sent that message to you, and playing around with the rear pull cord on the hood on the Montane, the cord broke.. Imagine that!!! now i have to wait for montane to get back to me about sending it back. Ugh.... Yes, the hood on the Positron is actually better. in my opinion, and after sleeping on it, the Positron is better for me, its like getting into a sleeping bag. The inside lining is softer, so more loft. The only thing is inside pullcords, but at least they work and didn't break. I even tried both jackets on with a balaclava and tightened the hood, i threw on my ski goggles and the fit on the positron was amazing, the larger wired brim fit so good, and the down around the face so cozy. It sucked on the Montane, the plastic pull cord adjustments where you loosen hood were in the way, and the smaller wired brim was in the way, so it didn't work out.. I also did the same test with the ski goggles on inside the hood. and cinched it down, both where good. Better on the positron. Overall I like the brand so far.... ill keep u posted through out.... have a good thanksgiving, that's when I leave. talk soon buddy!!!
@@miketorre16 OK! Happy thanks giving to you too!
Which did you prefer? Looking to get one soon
@@JordyC1993 definitely keeping the Rab Positron.... the rear pull adjustment in the montane didn't do anything. I pulled all the way and all it did was make the cord longer... eventually, the cord snapped. Sending it back to Montane today
I moved away from Rab down jackets solely for that reason, the hoods are terrible for hikers, they have completely inadequate velcro volume adjusters on the rear, makes for a miserable experience when you're unable to achieve a close fitting hood in cold windy weather. I moved to Montane, they are hood experts in my opinion, some of the best fitting hoods in the business, elasticated volume adjusters at the rear, adjustable wire peaks at the front, hoods that fit like baseball caps, moving with you. I recently bought the Rab Valiance which is the exception, as it does feature an elasticated volume adjuster at the rear and a wired peak to the front to help achieve a great fit. When it comes to mid weight down jackets, the best fitting one I've ever come across is the Montane Black Ice 2, its hood is far better than the hoods of; Rab Neutrino, Rab Electron, Mountain Equipment Lightline, M.E. Vega, and Arc Teryx Thorium, when not wearing a helmet. I would not consider buying a down jacket that doesn't have a rear elasticated draw string volume adjuster, it's far too much of a compromise. If Rab would only add them along with stiffed wire peaks to their jackets, I'm sure their sales would vastly increase, after all, I'm pretty confident that down jacket sales purchased by non climbers far exceeds that of the relatively small climbing community (of which many would demand a fully adjustable hood anyway). When you compare the Rab Microlight Alpine Down Jacket to the Montane Featherlite Down Jacket, the Montane's hood is again, far superior. My friend recently went to purchase a down jacket, he tried on various Rabs and M.E's and ended up walking out of the store because of the ill fitting hoods, ones where your face dissappears when you turn your head... All these brands with poor fitting hoods are missing a trick if you ask me 🤔
Thanks for the comment. Yes, RAB hoodies suck (unless you wear a helmet) and Montane is hands down superior in this aspect. And yes, RAB sales of jackets to non-climbers/non-helmet users must by far exceed sales to climbers/helmet users. l don't have the stats on this, but l doubt we are wrong...
l'd also stay away from RAB jackets because of the badly designed hoodies, they simply get on your way. Problem is l now have a few of them so l have to use them. Maybe one day l get some sponsorship and l can finally get rid of the RAB jackets (l must say, if it wasn't for the hoodies, l'd be happy with them).
@@Globetrotter-1Everyone has their own opinion on this as we all have our own preferences. l have zero problems with you disagreeing with me, but you have to edit out the 'stupid' part of your comment or l'll delete it. Hoodies, big or small, are just hoodies. We may like them more or less, but they aren't 'stupid' just because we like them differently.
I do give you the fact that a larger hoodie will accommodate (obviously) bigger hats. I did experience that in my winter experiences. You have a valid point there.
Some RAB hoods will be better for “hikers” than others. The Infinity jacket has a terrific hood. I have both jackets in this review; I prefer the Positron hood. The Neutrino is an excellent everyday jacket. The adjustability is not fully illustrated in this review.
Most people skipped the 'hood section' the original video had so l trimmed it out. They had enough with me saying "the hood has been fully adjusted" 2:38 and showing the hoods.
I would never buy a pair of trousers 5 sizes bigger than l need even if they were 'highly adjustable.' I'd rather buy my size. Same with the hoods.
But thanks for watching my video among SO many others and leaving your opinion, l really appreciate it and I'm sure it'll help other viewers. ATB! 😊👍🏻
What middle layer product are you wearing?
This one: ua-cam.com/video/W-6hKxCyzj0/v-deo.html I still take it with me in all my hikes. You can see me using it in my recent Canadian Rockies (GDT) videos 😎
@@alwaysforwardyt thank you
Thanks, useful info. I need jacket less for hiking, more to put on after riding up a mountain on clear winter night, and then wanting to spend some time looking at stars/meteor showers in the Welsh Valleys in winter (or just to wear outside pub after a ride), and after years living in London, coming back to the valleys, realise, I don't quite have the cold resilience of locals ;-)
In Norway, people take a flask with hot drinks for the 'looking at the sky' usage or similar (maybe you don't need to buy a jacket after all). Remember that you'd get used to colder temperatures ('adaptation') in a matter of 2 weeks to a month. Give yourself sometime and you may not need a new jacket 😊Otherwise, l'd say the Neutrino Pro would suit your needs best.
(Not long ago l was staring at the Aurora Borealis in Northen Norway. Take a look at the 'community' tab of my channel if you want to see a picture of that night.)
@@alwaysforwardyt Thank you for taking time for such a useful reply! I'd actually researched and ordered a flask that would nicely fit bottle cage on evening I posted comment, as thought that might be partial answer, and remembered hot Ribena at top of mountain can be great. However, when it comes to jacket, I'm still a wuss with the cold around here, at the top of the valley, as it's not my first winter here. Local postman will wear shorts all year around, as do many locals... I'm already close to leg warmers coming out, and already on autumn/winter bib-shorts. Certainly, after dark, it's already close to full winter gear on the bike for me. In London, that wouldn't be until at least December. However, with rain/sleet/snow around here, maybe Valiance is better option, better fitting hood, for after effort warm keeping, and local walks in winter. Need to add some walks to training programme, and layers I was using last Winter just start to take ages to get dressed and undressed between inside and out. But thank you for helpful reply. Really, gave me some extra food for thought! But I have definitely become a wuss when it comes to cold ;-)
@@markmitchenall5948 My pleasure. l'm happy you found my comment useful. In fact, in case it helps, let me give you some food for thought. IMO, the whole concept and purpose of a waterproof/down jacket mostly serves the market and what us the users would like to have. Let me explain:
Basically, goose down and water don't go together, right? Then, why would we want to mix down with sweat/perspiration/humidity? Unless you put on the waterproof jacket (e.g. Valiance) to stay still, motionless, you'll very likely sweat (when walking, for example) more than the jacket can handle.
It's a matter of time (how long your walk is) that you collapse the insulation of the jacket (down) with your own perspiration. It's even worse, down feathers are able to 'store' the humidity day after day until they effectively collapse (this is a common, well known issue when winter camping in sub-zero temps using down sleeping bags). This may happen unless you are able to provide a dry environment after each (humid) use.
l love goose down jackets just like most people do, but they have a very specific use. IMO, they excell at keeping your warmth when motionless or, otherwise, strolling around the city at a slow pace (or one that doesn't make you sweat). Anything involving an active usage (and sweating) and it's time to look for something else.
Finally, if what you meant by 'local walks in winter' is what l meant by 'strolling around the city,' then the Valiance may serve you well (it'll do similar than those 'city parkas' that are so common). As long as you keep a very low activity level or you don't sweat, you should be fine. Hope this helps! Sorry for long answer 😊
@@alwaysforwardyt Thank you... I think we're speaking same language, as local walks in winter will be local simple tracks walked easily on rest days, and main reason for getting is for exactly what you said... for when I'm stopped or doing little exertion...to try and last long enough outside to see a few more meteors this year. Plus, the end of an effort, to keep warm while having an outdoor pint, or, as emergency jacket that'll fit into seatpost bag, so if I have terrible bike mechanical that I have to wait a long time for a pick up, I wont freeze. That kinda thing. You've been very helpful! Thanks!
@@alwaysforwardyt 3-5 degrees C tonight according to bike computer, with 2 merino base layers (one short sleeve, one long), decent winter cycling jacket, OK at 150+bpm, but stopped, needed something WAY warmer to put on outside. I don't drink enough on bike in winter anyway, so one bottle of hydration stuff, one of hot drink going to be a good plan. But thank you for taking the time, as your video was already useful in giving me ideas.
hello!! its Manuel here. is it good the neutrino pro jacket to put a rainproof shell on it? or is it too bulky?
Too bulky for that, even the Neutrino. Also, putting a shell jacket on top of a down one may not yield the best results. The shell may compress the down, and therefore it may prefer it from achieving proper loft. Better using a synthetic one... 😊
oh I see... interesting, I was thinking also about the''electron pro'', that maybe works with the shell on top? but I dont know if its warm enough for what im looking for, which is to be still taking pictures in cold conditions like -7 Celsius. But sometimes im around 0 Celsius, so, it rains. what would you recommend? thanks!!@@alwaysforwardyt
Personally I'd get a parka jacket or a puffy and an umbrella 😅 The parka would give you many pockets for extra batteries, ND filters, cleaning brushes and so on, and full weather protection to operate in almost any circumstances. Besides, a good parka is a 'working horse,' whereas puffy jackets, especially the lightweight ones (e.g. Positron, Neutrino, etc.), are delicate and very easy to puncture.
However, a parka is less comfortable than a puffy jacket. You can't have it all 😅 Hope this helps 😊
thanks for the info :) I haver a more clear idea now of what I need.
saludos!!@@alwaysforwardyt
@manuelgomez9730 ¡De nada! Y si te quedan dudas, no dudes en preguntar 😊
Hey buddy. I ordered the Montane Resolute Jacket today. I'll try both. I get the Positron Thursday and I'll let u know.
The Montane looks pretty sweet. I'll see which one I like.
👍
so how's the Montane Resolute vs. Positron Pro?
@@manxxique it was a no go for the Montane. The rear pull cord on the hood broke while trying the jacket on in the house. It lasted about 10 minutes. I sent the jacket back to montane, the package was delayed in customs for a month, I thought it was lost. HUUGGEEEE hassle now, I’m still having an issue with montane about the jacket and the return. I like the Rab better anyways and they are available here in the USA.
Very nice video and hands on experience with the jackets., the only thing not clear from your video is the construction diference between the 2, almost full baffle construction in the positron vs swen trhu in the Neutrino.
I had the old positron (non pro), the main diference was the non box baffles in the top of the arms.
100% agree with your statments about the hood, hate the velcro ajuster, and my other gripe have to do with sizing, if you want to use any of these jackets as its intended use, aka belay jackets, you need to size up, i sold my positron because of bad size choice.
Then i move to a Montane 850 alpine but never got to use it because i found locally my holy grail, a patagonia grade vii, far superior to both the rab and the montane, but at 2x the price.
Anyway, you cant go wrong with any of them, love the value of both Rab and Montane, very good jackets at a down to earth pricing, just a little nit picking here and there honestly.
Hello, thanks for the detailed comment! In the original video, I mentioned the box construction as well as other differences between the two jackets (also some purchasing suggestions). UA-cam is a 'funny world,' I ended up trimming the video and acommodatind it to what people actually watched (that helps positioning the video).
When l bought the Positron l also got the Montane 850 Alpine. I went for the RAB because l didn't know any better back then. Today, I'd probably have kept the Montane. I 'think' it'd be the warmer of the two. Both jackets present excellent value.
I met the Grade VII while living in Boston back in 2014 (at the Patagonia main store). I instantly fell in love with it (Shame l cannot upload a picture over here!). You have a gemme of a jacket! I'm envious! 🤢😅 ATB!
Do you know the Valiance
Yes, but l haven't tested it. Personally, I have no interest in a waterproof down jacket. The waterproof membrane won't be as breathable. As a result, your own body perspiration may cause the down insulation to collapse (down feathers need to be as dry as possible to tap heat). I hope this helps!
@@alwaysforwardyt how would the Neptune do in minus 20 to minus 25 if your walking ?
I don't know the Neptune model (is that a jacket?). However, what l can say is if you're moving, especially if you're also carrying a good load (~20kg backpack), then you'll mostly need a thick base layer (~300g in weight) and a hardshell. If only walking (no load) then add also a midlayer.
Needless to say, you'll need to also wear a pair (or two) of gloves and hats, then 2-3 pairs of socks. This always varies among people, but you can take my answer as an indication.
Neutrino pro sorry
Neutrino pro for Temps minus 15 to 25 by nite . The very odd day minus 30