A lot of these inverters nowadays have soft start built into them I just test it out my AC unit on my solar 200 amp hour batteries with a 25 amp input coming in from the sun it took my battery is down to 12.4 9hundred watts and was able to stay on. at that point as long as you have 900 watts coming in from the solar should work I would imagine. I'm still testing
Very neat video here what I did pick was having a small inverter type generator can be used to run the AC as long as I install a soft start unit on the AC is that correct? If so that would safe hours on my main generator. I'm going to have a solar system like yours installed. I would like to here what your solar components include.
*I use this solar **Generater.Systems** at work. The building is 80 years old so there’s not a lot of electrical outlets. I use it for lights, fans, charge phones etc. works great !*
Hay I so appreciate your videos! As a 30 year Advanced Auto tech and business owner I am happy to answer any questions that you encounter with a shop or mechanic. As new empty nesters we are back on the RV field and I am a tech but for solar, batteries and such. You have helped me so much in understanding the new tech of the industry. Batteries, solar, inverter and soft start. Keep it up!! Thanks you!!!
Hello, I have 1360 watts of solar, 5 100amp lithium battle born batteries and a 3000 watt pure sine victron inverter. Currently I am running a coleman mach Roof A/C with the easy start I installed. As long as I am in a state that is sunny most of the time I do not have an issue! Thanks for your video! ~ Lisa
@@RVwithTito when will the person give the person who asked questions answer? What type of controller and brand names. I'm trying to figure out how to keep my milk cold without buying ice or standing around making my own ice all day. Able to make enough ice to keep my cooler will last all day and night that my friend gave me. He had gotten as a volunteer for the Red Cross many years ago and he passed it on to me since he didn't need it and I did.
4 x Battle borns and victron 3000 I get about same results with my softstart. When it's around 90 and above I just rely on starting my Honda 2200 to assist in powering my ac. I have 5 x 160 watt on roof but at direct light only get max 500 watts input. Renogy flat panels. Love your flat panel mount idea going to deploy on my panels!
I found the same thing Brian, Not only that but the hotter the ambient temperature the less efficient the solar panel is. Manufacturers rate their products’ susceptibility to temperature in the form of the temperature coefficient, which is expressed as a percentage per degree Celsius. It is standard practice to test solar panels for power output at 25 °C. So, if a panel is rated to have a temperature coefficient of -0.50% per °C, that panel’s output power will decrease by a half of a percent for every degree the temperature rises about 25 °C (77 °F).
You're 100% right solar panels need to sunlight but hate the Heat, that's why you must always over panel in preparation for that. Also keep in mind in the winter time you would generate more power then the rating since the temperature it's lower than 77F. Good for electric heaters instead of burning propane.
1) Your Class C is far better insulated than our Class A! We have to run 2 AC units on a summer day to keep the temperature down to 85 degrees. We’ll run the AC off the generator only. I have 1200W of solar on the roof with a Victorn 150/85 controller. We use a Magnum 2800W inverter. And have 6 Lifeline 6V 220Amp hour AGMs. Next batter switch will be to LiFeSO4. 2) Thanks for your videos. We enjoy your projects and can’t wait to get a house with a work shop to do some work on our 2008 motorhome. Storage and weight limitations prevent me from projects.
I did the same experiment but on a smaller scale , I have a truck camper with 215 watts of solar and a 2000 watt pure sine wave inverter hard wired in the RV through a transfer switch. On a hot sunny day no clouds I set my AC on 75 degrees. I also have 2 group 27 ,new batteries. My camper was already cool as I keep it turned on and plugged into shore power. Unplugged the shore power, turned on inverter and watched the meters amp draw and voltage. The AC cycles off and on all day. While off the solar charged back some loss. While on the AC draws about 700 watts after settling down. I've got the smallest roof AC made I think. I ran the AC pretty much all day to experiment but like you said unless you have a way to recharge the batteries at night its not practical . After depleting the power out of the batteries to 50% late afternoon I shut it down plugged back up and turned the converter on to recharge the batteries over night. You can run a AC on solar just need more solar panels more amp hour of batteries and a more efficient AC. Just a thought.
Consider setting t-stat to 78 instead of 74. Your ac unit will dehumidify your space and use less kwh and still be comfortable. I live in Florida and that's where I set it during the day. I'm a retired PE mech/elect. All the best.
That would be better. At home we usually keep it at 74 which is why I set it there for this test. 78 degF is probably a more reasonable comfortable temp while dry-camping. Thanks for the insight.
Well done Tito, thanks for another well produced and very informative video. We recently upgraded our Battery/Inverter system specifically with boondocking while running everything on our 37' DP much like being plugged in (at least like having 30A plugin) :) In any case out set-up is as follows: (8) Lion Energy 105Ah LifePO4 Batteries configured at 24V (420Ah) (2) Victron 24/3000 Inverter/Chargers 1600W Solar W/ Victron 150/100 MPPT Controller (2) 24-12V/70A Converters (to service 12V systems) (2) 12-24/15A DC-DC Converters (To charge Batteries while traveling) Victron Cerbo GX with GX Display and VRM interface So when we installed this in July we configured the system to power every circuit in our Coach and did this in Split-Phase which allowed us to install a 240V circuit for future use (Dual Zone Mini-Split AC Heatpump). As it is right now we can actually start and run both of our 13.5K rooftop AC units without a soft start, but I did order one to see how it works. When we finalize the installation of the mini-split in the future we'll remove the rooftop units and reconfigure for more solar :) We can actually travel down the road now with one rooftop unit running and still put power back into the batteries as long as we can produce at least 1000W of the 1600W Available. Running just a rooftop unit (with the rest of the coach stuff) while stationary we can run a single unit and only use about 20A tailing off to about 60A total with no solar (@24V) so we have a good 4 hours of AC after the sun goes down while still being able to run the coach overnight. When we get the mini-split installed it will use approx. 50% of the power of the rooftop unit and hopefully we'll be all set, especially when we add some more solar. So it can be done but it's not easy, I only post this to show people that I CAN be done, but to your point in the video a small generator will work just fine for most people if the rooftop units can keep up. Happy travels!!
Thanks for the video, I have the same 600w solar, 4 100 amp hr. batteries, 3000 renogy inverter. I able to run my 15000 Coleman for about 2.5 hrs. When running the AC I'm showing 130 amp draw to the inverter. I thought that was way off, now that I seen the video makes me feel better. I thought something was wrong. I need to add more solar panels. Again thank you for the video
Hey Brian, Great video, and very timely! I appreciate the practical approach to your videos and you taking time to explain the “why”, makes it easy to apply to each individual situation. We have a 50 amp rig with: 975 watts of solar 400 AH Lithium battery bank 3000 watt Inverter 4500 watt inverter\generator The Air Conditioner tied to the battery bank has a soft start as well. Same as yours, it consumes about 100AHs (~1 battery per hour) when running. We are in NE Pennsylvania this week and it has been blistering hot (mid 90’s). It has been a bit of a struggle to keep our rig comfortable during the heat of the day. We are on a 30 amp pedestal, but with a full park (and lots of running ACs) the voltage on the pedestal has been averaging 105V-107V...BEFORE we take any juice. Our EMS shuts power down to the rig at anything under 105V. SO....it has been a balancing act for sure. Through trial and error, I was able to take ~ 7 amps off the pedestal during the highest load time with out tripping my BMS. That allowed my battery bank to last most of the day. I only had to run my generator for ~1.5hrs to get back to 50% charge. The moral of the story.....where there is a will, there is a way.
Great Video! I don't have a set up like yours yet, but my ultimate boondock setup is running my A/C on a 3,000 watt generator, powered by propane, 6 hours a day (3 in the morning, and 3 at night before bed) to keep the camper from getting to hot. Then the solar will help keep the batteries charged and only using low powered fans to circulate the air when the A/C is not running. With good insulation, covered and tinted windows, the A/C isn't working as hard, the draw on the batteries is well below my daily intake from the solar panels, and I am confident that I can will keep the battery level right around 80% during the dark hours.
RV with Tito DIY I’m sorry, my comment was a little confusing. I currently RV part time and mostly on shore power. However, I do boondock on occasion to test what my needs are based on the power I normally use. Next year I plan on RVing full time, Boondocking 5 days a week and on shore power the other two. My above scenario is my “Power Plan” setup once I get everything upgraded the way I want it for full time RVing. Your video helped me answer a bunch of questions that I don’t have the equipment to test for myself now. Thank You!
_I pulled all of my A/C units out and put one 12000 BTU 115v mini-split in my custom-built cargo trailer. I'm so glad I did. Can run it throughout the day on solar with no problems. Plus running a small Arctic king freezer, NewAir ice machine, lights, 55 inch TV, DVD player all at the same time. With a system that has a: Samlex EVO-2224 charger/ inverter ( 4 ) 320 watt solar making 1280 total watts ( 4 ) 370Ah 6v flooded batteries. I've seen it get down to 76%, but the average is 80% on the batteries during the day. At night I would run a generator to keep up the same consumption, but if I don't need the A/C to run, then I don't need to run any generator, the system can handle all my needs throughout the night; until sunlight again. The mini-split runs about 9Amp to 12 Amps when running when it goes into a so-call float. It runs about 3amps to 4 amp to maintain my temperature of 77 inside and a 109 outside. I also like to say: it's so quiet, it's incredible, NO MORE noisy jet engine sounding A/C units ever again! The unit is a Senville mini-split I paid just under $800.00 for everything. I installed it myself, and have never done any A/C work before. Take your time. It's a piece of cake. So, so happy! You can too, if you want peace and quiet, with temperature, controlled home/ RV/ Trailer_
@@Hoffmanpack yes, I was a little nervous though, because I have never done it, then on top of that, I also used an Appion mega flow vacuum rate valve core removal tool with the vac pump that was vacuuming out the lines. Then have to put the core back in the valve body. You don't have to use that tool to do the vacuum. Once it all done then you released the refrigerant into the system.
You're a brave man for even trying it IMHO. You do have a huge van though. I think any system would struggle to run a decent sized AC unit. IMHO get the RV in the shade, put out awnings either side and run a separate 300W solar panel out in the sun and run fans... well that's how we got around it...
@@RVwithTito My wife and I can handle the heat but when it's those few weeks that are unbearable, we have resorted to RV parks and just 'plug in' for a few weeks. At least we can run the AC all day everyday, charge all the batteries, bring on fresh water, dump the old, wash and service the van and just chill during those really humid weeks.
Great video, it helps answer a question that many people have. Clearly you can run A/C off grid from solar - maybe not all day every day, maybe you need more solar panels and/or more batteries and maybe a decent inverter - but it can be done. Of course you could increase the temperature setting on the A/C so it runs a bit less. If the camper was better insulated (maybe double glazing) then the A/C wouldn't have to work as hard. It is good to see what happens with 600W of solar and 400Ah of batteries and 2,000W inverter, that provides a basis for working out what would be needed to run the A/C more often or less often.
Thanks for this info- all good .. Remember that new rv’s with all battery setups r using 12 volt ac units , Also - eliminating the inverter that uses at lot of energy to convert the power. Then also, the vehicles alternator is used a generator , kinda a sledge hammer , the vehicles alternator as an auxiliary power source... Thanks again
One thing to keep in mind is that these AC’s use more power when it’s 85 - 110 + I installed the easy start - great product .My small generator will run when below 85 outside - but not over 85 .Fun video to watch.🥵🔥
Excellent share. I have watched several RV videos where the people are mounting panels all over the roof and building huge systems at a ridiculous cost, so they can try to run their AC. The problem is that they do not replenish or, they cannot do much else electrically if they hope to replenish power. All that said, at what cost? This is where green meets reality. I am all for solar on RVs to power inverters and have power for everything smaller but appliances like microwaves, induction cooktops and ACs generally require more than basic capabilities in the solar system and price negates such a choice realistically. Naturally, some are determined to try it anyway- those with money to waste.
Thanks. Actually small equipment like microwaves, hair dryers and small induction burners are no big deal. We use them all the time. They pull a lot of amps but only for a few minutes without any significant hit to the batteries. Air conditioners are a different story.
Tito, first and foremost I love your videos. you give real info in the form of both data and components. This video, the one regarding running a/c on only your batts, struck me in a different way than probably most people. .. I lived in arizona for ten years so I know HEAT.... my question is about humidity.. when we had MONTHS of 100 plus degrees we switched to swamp cooling or evaporative cooling - remember az is a 'dry heat' lol. we would set the ac for 80 and use the evap until we hit than temp. worked great. not an ice rink but - well - no humidity is really great. my kids would beg for blankets when they got out of t he pool as the evap on their skin would bring goose bumps up really quick. I'm moving from a boat to bus conversion now so I can't do this comparison but hope you will explore it.~~ !!! really great vids. much appreciated.
Some good real world information here. Yes it's possible but there are a ton of variables involved. For 1 the size of your RV and the size of your AC unit along with its efficiency.. The bigger the conditioned space the more power you will need to cool it. So this same setup on let's say a 20ft or smaller RV would require a lot less cooling. Also how well insulated is your RV? Leaky windows? Ect. Most Rv's aren't really designed with peak energy efficiency in mind. Another factor to consider is how much cooling are you looking to achieve? Running the AC all day and night requires a whole lot more power than just running it for a few hours during the hottest part of the day. Great Video and great info. Thanks
I have 570 watts of solar, 2000 watt inverter, soft start installed on the AC, 4 100 amp hour Battle Born batteries. your video kinda encouraged me to try the AC on inverter power...have to talk to Battle Born about warranty effects.
hey Mike , have you tried it ? curious how well that works. I have the same setup but only 1/2 the batteries, Im thinking of doubling our BB from 2 x 100 to 4 x 100, for the rare couple of days that we need to run the air conditioning.
I totally agree ... it is more practical to have a quiet generator , I'm working on a ventilated box to put the propane generator in to make it around 40db
I think this is really awesome for those of you that have this type of setup. Even if you have to run a little generator I think it's amazing. Great video! You have an awesome setup.
Hi Brian. We’re in a Newmar 3609 with two Dometic 15k heat pump AC units. Had Arizona Wind and Sun install a solar system. 1400 watts, 3K Victron inverter, 4 100 amp Battle Born batteries. Currently can run one AC for a few hours without any solar. Not using Soft Start. Have not done a long term test with full solar but plan to. Panels typically pull in 1250-1350w on bright sunny day. Panels art flat mounted on roof. Great video.
Glad to hear a 3K inverter would do the trick. I tried it on my 2K and it overloaded it for sure. Based on my tests you'd probably get about 4 hours running both with no solar. So the more solar the better. Good luck!
Thanks for this interesting video! Roof-top RV air seems the all-time least efficient manner in which to obtain cool air. Therefor I use a split air system that draws just 600 watts. It has inverter circuitry which results in a soft start. I have found that with the 19 amps my solar controller offers mid day (tapering up or down from 3 amps morning and evening) my system can barely keep up SO...I turn the a/c (I run one or the other, not both) on about 1 pm and shut it off about 6 pm. I am adding two additional solar panels which may well turn the tide on this race for available current. I should add that the more windows I install, the less need I have for the a/c due to cross ventilation. I am finding after 30 years living on wheels, every day is still on on-going experiment with air conditioning. NOTE that I am in a converted cargo trailer with R-15 rockwool insulation. This has a huge effect helping me shoot for 74 degrees.
Morning Brian! Great video topic and I have been planning a similar one! We also have 400ah of BB's with a 3000 watt Multiplus and 300 watts of solar. It was interesting to see your A/C draws about 110 amps as my Penguin II 13,500 draws closer to 150 amps. I have a soft start but don't have it installed yet. The A/C does start and run off the inverter and batteries without it, but I'm not sure the strain it is putting on them. I was thinking about running it down till the BMS shuts down to see how that actually works. Your test results came out pretty good I thought and your extra 300 watts of solar, plus the more efficient A/C will no doubt produce a much longer run time than mine. Hope you guys are doing well. Thanks, Aaron
Hey Aaron! Yes we're doing well. Hope you are too back home. I'm wondering if your Penguin will run more efficiently with the soft start. Mine seems to be quieter. You'll probably be able to cool your rig down faster too since it's smaller. Looking forward to your video.
i have a victron setup useing 8 12v 100ah batteries running in a 48v config with a 5kw inverter and about 3kw of solar and i can run my ac system without any issues and still make power during the day. for the 12v appliances in my rv i have a 70amp 48v to 12v converter. my rooftop system is a newer model and draws about 1100w and can cool down the area with no issues.
While you’re kind of rooftop system is not really feasible unless you have a massive solar system with batteries it’s being done every day now with mini splits, yes you would have to change your system out but when you have a system that just draws 400 or 500 Watts And can easily runoff solar and house batteries it may be worth just ditching that junk on the roof but thanks again for this one to explain to people that this is a tricky option.
Great video and explanation. For inspiration you might check out the design of the Volta Pure3 systems that Winnebago is installing in some of the class B RVs (travato 59 G/K *L* for lithium). They use a system with off-the-shelf components comprised of a usable 8700 watt hours of lithium to supply an always 30A/120v invertor. They use minimal solar, but mainly charge with a 48 volt 6000 watt alternator run by the van engine that at 1500rpm will fully recharge the batteries in less than 2 hours, either when driving or using a smart controller that can automatically start the engine and run at 1500 rpm when needed. An expensive $25000 option but very well designed in my opinion for a small RV. I roughly priced out similar diy components at about $15000 for major components with about 700 watts of solar. There are a few videos out of folks doing your same test of the Volta (one in 100+ degrees heat!). I agree a $1000 generator is certainly more affordable, but in some situations generators are forbidden and always noisy and smelly.
I use my 5,000 BTU 455 watt air conditioner every day that I am in my van (Texas panhandle). I installed an Easy Start. I also power a TV and microwave. I only have 3, 100 amp hour Battle Born batteries and a 790 watt Grape Solar system. I have 3 inverters; a 3,000 watt for the microwave and AC, a 1,500 watt for backup, and a 180 watt for the TV.
Excellent video. I have a question I have not found an answer to. How about replacing your A/C's AC motor with a DC motor and bypassing the converter and it's efficiency loss. Since you would want at least 4 batteries (12 volts each), use a 48 volt DC motor to better handle the load.
Could certainly be more efficient if you want to put in the effort. Have you found a DC motor for that, then probably a speed controller...not sure. I know the motor (fan only uses about 12A at 13V).
Our AC draws 500-700watts with the compressor running. We use a 1 farad capacitor on our 12v system for any major drawdowns and it helps. We need a larger solar aray to run it for hours however. Its fine to stop for lunch and use it.
Thanks for the info. Much appreciate the tips, do & don'ts. Sometimes it's difficult to get the most efficient especially when you need the inverter to remain as cool as possible and not overheat.
NICE VIDEO BRIAN ..!!Since i installed the 364 (2yrs) is nice to run the ac 13,500 btu Carrier in my class B + 22ft Holiday Rambler Augusta with The Honda 2000/2200..Never and issue $2 a day that is CHEAP ..!!!Instant Power..! In Florida that test will last about 5 min..! Maybe with a 5000 btu ac unit it will work longer..!! The test that you did is like filling a siwimming pool with a garden hose and in same time you draining the water with a 5 inch pipe..! Ja.ja..!! Unless you have a massive battery bank like 12.or more batteries.? If you downsize to a class b the results will be different ...The best friend of a solar is a Honda generator..!!!
I live off grid and run my AC unit strictly off of solar.. No generator.. I have a window unit with a built in soft start that cost 260 bucks.. It is a 6000btu Danby that I got from Home Depot.. When it starts it draws about 450 watts and then slowly increases until it gets up to about 550 watts.. It is only good for about 200+ sq ft but the fact that it came with a built in soft start with the AC for only 260 is what amazes me.. If a window unit is an option,, this is the way to go..
We have a 40' class A with 2700 watts of solar, and 25kWh of batteries. This completely removes the need for a generator; (We don't have one) It would be difficult to park off-grid in Phoenix in July, but we can exist most anywhere else we want and use air conditioning day and night. If we DO need to visit Phoenix in July, at most a 15 amp extension cord supplies all the extra power we need to sit in 100F+ heat.
Hey Tito, I recently installed the soft start module in a Colemen Mach 8 in my 2020 Eaglecap 1200. I have 500 watts of solar and thus far have tested it to 90 F. The solar easily keeps up with the AC, keeping the temp at 74F on low cool. I wondered about your AC units drawing 100 amps. My single unit, 13,500 bti draws only 12 amps.
Hmmm, coupla thoughts, Brian. You have some deployable solar panels (ground & window awnings), which might create another 15 Amps when added together? Which would cut the draw in half. Also, your solar setup is partially older, and- there are some newer flexible panels with higher output, so- if you 'chose' to upgrade your roof set up, you could easily bump to 800 or 1,000 watts. Many of us have smaller campers with lower draw, more efficient units... I still think that running a small portable generator for an hour or two in the late afternoon, early evening could really make this a viable solution. You've lost 140+ Lbs by removing the the Onan, but, a 2,000w inverter/generator and a touch more solar...hmmmm. just sayin', Tito!
:) Yes I know. I've been contemplating replacing the old Unisolar panels with a few hundred watts more of flex. They've served me so well for the last 8 years and are still going strong especially in low light. I may just mount some new stuff over the top and avoid having to remove the adhesive.
Thanks for the experiment. I was once curious if it was possible. I've a 3000 watt Inverter with 600 amp hrs (6 Battleborn). I've a 2020 Grand Design with 15,000 btu AC's and no soft start. I've a Victron Battery Monitor so I am able to see amps and expected runtime. I turned on 1 AC and can't remember what kind of surge there was but the Battery Monitor said I had about 5 hrs of runtime. I then ended the experiment satisfied that I could run at least one in a pinch. I've 4 190 watt solar panels. At this time I can't justify a Soft Start. Romeo
I'd like to see you install an electric car receiver to fill your batteries from a refill station. Or how to make your RV alternator charge your batteries. Unless your RV already does that . I find both you and Love Your RV very helpful to someone like me with electrical learning challenges
Not here to correct anything you've stated, but to learn & have subscribed! However, somewhere around 8:00 U stated the a/c is drawing more energy, the fact is, it's drawing the same, but the batteries are just being charged at a lesser rate!
My rooftop air conditioner on my truck camper will run continuously while the Sun is out. And the batteries stay at 100%. I also have 600 W like you, but they are wired in series which gives me more amps. I use Renogy everything, including the 3000 W inverter and 2 - 170ah Renogy lithiums
Excellent report. We're getting in the same situation as summer in Europe is getting hoter. I'd like to know more about your aux. generator suppling energie to the AC. Regards
Great video and info as always, thanks! Our current travel trailer doesn’t have an inverter or solar but it’s so poorly insulated that I wouldn’t bother! In this Texas heat the 13.5k AC has to run almost non-stop anyways (at least during the day)! We enjoy it but it’s not an ideal rig for boondocking unless it’s perfect weather!
I have 800Watts solar and LiFePo4 180AH battery, my AC unit is only 8000 BTU but 15 Seer rating. If the sun shines every day I can still run the AC and recharge the battery. Even I would need more solar to keep up with the demands of the AC if I was doing this every day. Thanks for the video.
I have 1400w and 964 amp h of Lithium And it runs my mini split day and night with no problem in 95 + I have only electric appliances electric range hot water heater microwave convection oven TV xbox
@@mobileempire5522 No no not at all. I bought used Tesla batteries out of a 2016 model S I purchased 2 modules they were $950 apiece They weigh 60 pounds apiece So far I'm loving them
Would mounting a panel on a vertical surface possibly be more efficient in the winter months? The flexibile panels could be positioned to look like a window on the sides or even on the rear. Or even be made to cover the over cab window. I just an throwing out silly ideas.
Probably not a good option. You would always have to be parked with that side facing south for winter. It would have to be a temporary setup using flex panels like this ua-cam.com/video/Al8rCydNiLs/v-deo.html.
FYI, the Airxcel (Coleman) Mach 10 NDQ has the same operating specs, noise and amperage draw as the Houghton unit. Same price range also. I have one and it works great and is QUIET.
Thank you for your video. I haven’t bought one yet but I’m looking for diesel pusher about 20 years old or more. What did you buy your product from? Thank you.
if it's just one person or one room, my Vornado 660 is more than adequate for the job, for multiple people, I recommend USB fans everywhere if it's more than 10 degrees of "perceived cooling" you need to achieve, then yeah I guess AC is a must... or very high humidity
Interesting test. Would have been interesting to see it go for 24 hours to see what level the batteries would be at. I would assume the next morning you would get some power back before the AC started again. Would also be interesting to see how it would work overnight in a campground where you have quiet hours and can't run the generator.
Great test Brian. Always wanted to see how that would work. It looks like you would need more panels and/or more batteries which would add considerable expense complexity and weight.. probably best to just run on shore power.. GOOD test though...
Another option came to mind is, instead of converting DC from solar panels to AC to run A/C unit which always some energy lost during that process to the inverter. There is a 12 v A/C system 20,000 BTU rating. It's a roof mount unit, not an undermount by ProAir. Maybe it will help.
Nice videos, very well explained. Thanks! I guess in this case it depends on tje usage of AC. For example if you only ise AC 1-2 hours noon and then again 2 hours on the evening (as the rest of the time one might be outside) then its more than enough. And then having as backup the portable gas generator
Yes. You're right. I'd only use it in a pinch. When we were in Arizona, we were ready to leave once the outside temps reached the upper 80s. Thanks for the comment!
We have 520w Solar, GoPower IC3000 inverter (true 3000W inverter, the Victrons are 3000VA, (Volt/Amps) vs watts, there watt output is 2400w by the math). We have 4 BB Li batteries as well. My system powers the entire trailer, so the converter box acts as a sub panel. We have a heat pump, as a AC unit it will run in the 4 hr range, great for short runs, but have not used it long term. As a heat pump, it will run all night and only draw down 30%. We do have a generator, but have only used it once. The truck DC-DC controller (RedAcrc BCDC1240D) can act like a generator to top off the batteries mainly when driving, also because it is a MPPT controller, it is an input for portable solar panels. The other nice thing about Li batteries over Lead, is you can drain them nearly to 0%, I have my cutoff set to 10% though. I was curious how long theses might last, so thank you for doing this test.
Thanks for sharing your setup. Sounds like it's working. I also use a DC-to-DC from my alternator while driving as needed. When I tested the heat pump mode it drew a little more current than in cooling mode. Good info!
RV with Tito DIY , fortunately the heat pump only runs 10 min at a time to maintain, yes it draws more on heating than cooling when running , just doesn’t run as long😉
Agreed! NOT PRACTICAL! Part of the problem that not many discuss is the extreme heat the inverter generates when running an AC unit (or actually anything drawing 50-100% of the rated wattage). Also, lots of heat gets generated in the batteries when pulling (or charging) large amps from the batteries. Yes, they say lithium batts can be used up to say 130F but they don't say how you are degrading the batts on that sort of temp. I also notice the amps pulled from the AC depends on the outdoor temps and humidity. I have 600 AH LiPo and 960 watts of solar
Thanks for chiming in and sharing your thoughts on this. I agree, that is a concern. We don't typically run into that since we haven't used the A/C in this mode. We typically only use high-draw loads for a few minutes at at time.
Why would you stop the test at 50%? I thought if you have lithium Iron Batteries you supposed to be able to run them down completely (to auto shut off point which is something like 5-10%) with out ANY battery degradation? Maybe I misunderstand something. Thanks for the test. It pretty much answers my question as to weather I could run the ac over night with the gen off.
I got 4000 watts GIANDEL runs Air conditioning from 15 amp plug. 13500 BTU ... Problem is 910 amps /hours T-105 battery banks go down fast at night 2000 watts solar pants will let You run during days...Nights are difficult . Drag your battery below 50 percent . So is expense ..Battery won't last long. If You replace with lithium total cost of that is around 7000 thousands dollars ..No problem then ...
To run an AC on solar can be done, but you should think of it far in advance and not make it an after thought. You should have several factors in mind when building out your system. The hodgepodge approach can cost you more in the long run by trying to make up for it as you go. Always plan it out. Below is just some of what you should keep in mind when building a system for your needs. 1#: What will you power? If you want to run the A.C. off grid, you need to have a minimum of 125 amps DC power of just solar input. That is around (25) 100-watt panels or the equivalent there of. That is roughly an area of glass 8 foot x 17.5 foot. This means the solar setup needs to produce that much power the whole time you run the A.C. Not including when clouds drift by or it's a hazy day and power output dips. Solar is not a constant. If the power is not constant the batteries make up for the dip in power. Solar is rated by a max value. Of course you can mix and match panels to get you to this point but when you go over 1000 watt mark, you should implement some safety factors to reduce the chance of fire and electrocution. Because you are playing with the power a welder make at that point. A short circuit or pad panel can cause a fire real quick. #2: Your inverter efficiency. Most have a loss of 2% - 5% and you avoid maxing out your inverter. You should always have an "overhead" of 15% - 20%. So a 2000 watt inverter is basically maxed out with just the use of the A.C. or a microwave oven by it's self. This means your inverter is putting out around 1400 watt OR 20 amps VAC while it is using 116 Amps VDC. Of course I'm not including the locked rotor amps needed to start any motor. That varies on all motors. #3: Wire size and length to the inverter and solar. Inverter wiring: You always want to keep the run of wire from the batteries to the inverter as short as possible and as large as possible. You want to keep the total run under 10 feet. That INCLUDES both positive AND negative wires. Battery cables should be sized accordingly. Most of the time that means using 4/0 AWG welding cable when you have 3 - 5 LifePo4 batteries. You should have a 400 amp fuse as close to the batteries as possible and a 400 amp continuous rated battery cut off switch after the fuse. Something like the Cole Hersee 75920-05-BX cut off switch. The fuse should always come first. It's your first line of defense during a short. Solar Wiring: The higher the amp draw the larger the wire size must be. The longer the run the larger the wire mus be. On a solar system that uses a string of 15 100 watt panels operating @ 12 VDC you are literally using #6 welding cables at that point. Or you can double up on #10 runs. Both are fine if you do your homework and figure in voltage loss. A 12VDC system is not as efficient as a 24VDC or 48VDC system. The higher the voltage the more efficient the system will run. This moves us into controllers and how they work. #4: The solar controller. By now everyone know that we have 2 types of controllers to pick from. PWM ('Pulse Width Modulation') and MPPT ('Maximum Power Point Tracking'). But what most people do not know is they operate on different voltages. PWM: The PWM controller only takes a couple of volts from a battery to allow the panels to start charging. But they are limited on the max amps they can deliver and system voltages. Some PWM controllers need as little as 1VDC from the batteries. Some as high as 7VDC. This means if you have completely discharged your batteries (you left on a light while away) you won't need to jump the main bank to start up the charging system. You can literally use a 9 volt battery or string together 4 AA batteries depending on the minim voltage needed to get you on the way to recovery. Once they start charging they just run off the sun. The PWM controller only needs a small amount of voltage to get running while most MPPT controllers needs a higher battery voltage to fire up the charge cycle. MPPT: The MPPT controller, while more expensive can provide a higher amount of current / amps from a panel string with one controller, but this is only help full if you have thought through your whole system before hand. If your system is an all 12VDC system from the panels to the controller then you are not using the MPPT controller to it's fullest. MPPT controllers want you to use the highest input voltage you can give them. If a controller is rated for an input of 150VDC then that is what you should try and give it. If you give them the max input they can deliver the max output. Also with an MPPT controller you can use a smaller gauge wire and get longer wire runs on the panel side since voltage drop will be less of a factor. But you always want to keep your voltage drop under 2% no matter if you are using the PWM or MPPT controller. Voltage is the power that pushes the amps through the wire, and everything else. Once on the battery side of the controller a larger wire is needed since you have now reduced the voltage and increased the amperage flow. Amps and resistance cause wires to get hot , not the voltage. This is very important for everyone to under stand because it's the #1 source of fire. The smaller the wire size the less amps it can flow, making higher resistance. The fewer the strands the less electrons it can flow. On my MPPT charger it has a max input voltage of 120VDC but I'm only able to give it 105VDC. This drops me down to around 35 amps of output because of limited space to carry panels. It's all about give and take when it comes to an RV or a horse trailer like I have. Conclusion: When it comes to running an A.C. off of your inverterk, yes it can be done but you must think far ahead if you plan on doing it. If you build your system while thinking about the overheads and limitations you may have then yes you can operate the A.C. no problem. Or any other thing that you may need to run. Just keep in mind I will always talk about the extreme ends of a system. You should always factor the the extreme of a system because you never know what will happen in the real world. It's better to build your system with expansion in mind or over kill on the wiring because it adds in a safety margin. It's always better to be ready and completely understand what you have, and what you can do with it, to get yourself up and running again. Because everyone knows help might be several miles or hours of walking away. In the mean time, 73s Crazy Marty KK6OEF
@@bobsworld2351 For a house and running 24/7 you would need to expand everything. Because after the sun goes down you have no input power. Since it's a house you are trying to run you can run much higher voltages. You might want to look through Will Prowse on his UA-cam channel to get an idea of what you need to know. He does small systems but you can up size once you know what to do. I would guess you can build something like that for around $35K. Give or take 10,000. The battery bank is where the maintenance cost comes in.
I have 4 deep cycle lead acid batteries and 1700 watt Giandel inverter and I'm drawing 45 amps dc and aircon draws max of 3 amps. Drops to about 2.7 amps AC. But I am still in testing range. Also have 700 watt solar with total amps at 20. My pwm charge controllers own put out 11 amps. Can I run solar panels direct to batteries and get a total of 40 amps while running the aircon? Any reply appreciated cheers from Australia 🙂👍
Brian, You should check out Gone Boondocking UA-cam channel. He did a mini split ac install on his class c. He says he can run it 24/7. Would love to know what you think.
I do subscribe to him and have seen the video. I don't think we use our A/C enough to justify it. Good content though...also love the 1 hour shower. I'm working on something like that too.
@@RVwithTito please post your version of the hour shower. We don't boondock often, but I may put one together for those week long on-the-beach boondocking vacations that my daughter loves. I would be interested to see your take on the device.
I followed gone boon dockings install with a Pioneer 9000 BTU unit 22 seer My solar almost keeps up with it running in the summer with 950 W on the roof. When I add my 240 W of ground deploy I'm in the plus
Same easy start, VictronConnect solar, 3000 watt power converter, battery monitoring and three 100ah battle born battery’s. Will run air about 100ah per hour. The generator Honda 2000 runs it as well. I think you run the generator but, if you are away and then the generator quits the battery takes over. With animals this could be a life saver.
We have a heat pump style A/C system in the basement of our motorhome. Which gives me a lot of roof area for solar panels. We installed 2000 watts of solar. This makes it possible to run the system all day long. But I also setup a 6000 BTU window unit for cooling. This allows us to cool on days of limited sun. I have a video about our system on my channel.
Thanks for sharing your setup. I wish I could do that. I checked out your video and left you a comment. I also liked your grid-tie solar. Did you use the same panels on the RV?
Thank you!! Great video! Perfect for giving me a sense of how big a project (cost and effort) I would be considering if I wanted to go this route. The mrs loves her a/c and I love boondocking (and hate the noise of the generator). It would be so freeing to be able to boondock (quietly) and run A/C. But, did not have a good sense of how viable that wish might be or how big of an investment in time and energy I might be taking on to make it a reality.
Thanks Tito, great edit. A few years ago, the idea of running an AC on solar was poo-pooed. Today you are showing its possible and maybe doable in short bursts, but not really ready for 24/7. I'm wondering how much improvement a 12v AC unit would make over a 120v, inverter driven unit. Is there a significant loss going 12v-to-inverter? Also, we operate around 78 degrees on our AC, so I'm wondering what savings you get for 2-4-6-8 degrees warmer.
Nice video very well presented. It IS practical, it's just your current system was not designed with air con in mind. If you follow one rule: You need to run a big load for large parts of the day then you need to up your solar game to have at least as much solar power as the load i.e in your case 2000w of solar. You appear to have plenty of roof space so those 12v stick on panels could be replaced with proper ~300w 24v panels in series and a new charge controller and hey presto, air con all day. This isn't as expensive as you think as the flexible solar panels are hideously overpriced usually so you can actually buy proper big panels for approx the same price. It's an idea, worth a look!!
We have 400 AH lithium battery bank with a Victron 3000W inverter and 900W of solar panels. We also have a "hard" start capacitor $10 that handles the compressor surge on start. We can run all day on this. We have a campervan with all the electrical components in the garage and we keep a small fan running on them as the inverter, charge controller and batteries generate a lot of heat when under a heavy load. We turn the a/c off at night and by the time the van is warming up in the early afternoon (we have 3" of spray foam on walls, ceiling and floor) the batteries are charged.
That's Awesome! Can you share the capacitor specs and online listing info where you found one like that? That would be great. Good job btw on your working build and system👍💪
Interesting. I have wondered about using a “hard start”. Used them on old house AC split system compressors and they worked great. How long have you used a hard start and what amp draw difference did it make?
Tito informative as always; how about the lithium batteries getting charged by the actual coach motor as does the Alta Power System you find in Winnebago 59KL Class B. Yes larger alternator and larger radiator and engine automatically comes on and takes the place of an generator when batteries reach a certain level. The coach motor is quieter than these small generators. I have a new towable being delivered in Jan 2021. I will be using a small 2200 Generator. This model is only 19ft with a slide- out and comes with the Coleman Mach 10 15KBtu and 12V fridge. Living in South Florida and dry camping means A/C 98% of the time. Dry camping here also means neighbors in our state parks that have no electrical or sewer but some have water. And many are slotted as if a normal camp site. Meaning you have neighbors and no generator to run at night due to noise. So I'm thinking going full Lithium, with large inverter and capturing power source to reboot my charge through my tow vehicle "1500 Pickup" One side of this is easy. But getting power from my tow vehicle is the tricky part? Yes this will be pricey...lol I'm looking at 6 lithium's minimum and Hybrid inverter. And heat warmers for batteries since i plan to winter camp in Northern States. I have yet to see anyone do this with a Tow vehicle?
I think this was a great video and it will work if you have enough wattage coming from your solar panel to run your air conditioner and simultaneously add a good little charge to your batteries, you should be able to run your air conditioner from 10 a.m. maybe to 5 pm then the air conditioner has turn off because the sun is getting too low. But if is done right you should be able to end the day with a full battery with enough solar generation on your rooftop and sunlight of course. I'm working on that it as i speak now, my roof regenerate me 1480 w of DC power from my solar panel. So I should have plenty of power run my AC and keep my battery topped off throughout the whole sunlight hours.
I have a class a rv with 960 watts of solar, 600 ah of lithium, and a 3000 watt inverter. I have three rooftop AC units, and all three are needed to cool my 40' MH in really hot weather. I like the plan to start early, when the temp in lower and not wait until the space is already hot to start the cooling attempt. I could run my 10,000 watt generator in a pinch, but I hate the noise it makes, and the fuel it consumes would be unsustainable. One could start with the batteries, and then, when the bat bank reaches a certain draw down point (50% or 40%), have the generator fire up automatically. It also seems that the best solution would to match the solar production to the AC demand as close as is possible. A set of portable panels could be deployed when this is attempted, using the on-board equipment. I think my rig is really too large for this to work though. Better to have a one AC sized rig. Great video. It makes me think about what is possible....many thanks. If the panels are in the sun and the rig is in the shade you would get the best out of both....
Great video! So if you had 4x 300w panels (residential but should fit on an RV) and assuming AC runs 50% of the time, you should be able to make it, right? (esp if cooler in the morning and if you set AC to 77*C)
Hey Brian, good try but not enough storage or manufacture of electricity it seems. What I’m interested in is the newer 12v A/C units. The ones I’ve seen are spendy but more manageable that A/C that designed for 110v.
Perhaps this has already been mentioned, but if you adjust your comfort zone up 5 degrees and get used to it, you can get much more out of the system...
Clarke McGee running warmer temps usually requires lower humidity to be comfortable. Low humidity, often requires tight building construction, and dedicated dehumidification.
Tito, very good video as usual. If anyone is entertaining running a stock RV rooftop AC off of solar they are in for some major investment. A mini-split system is the best option and that still requires a decent amount of solar and batteries.
great video brian and well appreciated . knowing the size of your set up is great -someday i’m probably going to have to do some math on weight and cubic inches needed to size out a coach. cost too of course ( all this is gentle suggestions for more info if y are so inclined😂). your demeanor, humor and information are very high on my i’m impressed list. be well😊
Thanks so much for the feedback Bruce. My setup is kind of in the middle of most boondocking setups out there so I though it might be a good benchmark.
Who spends all day inside their van? I bought the smallest van i could find. When I need air conditioning it's usually for an hour or 2 at most.. at lunch, dinner or when it's too hot or raining. I simply run my very small 2.4L engine in idle with the AC blasting and the cab gets cold in 2 minutes. Everything I need came with the van... It consumes about .3 Gallons ($.70) per hour and I've seen no impact to the van (this is highly debated and debunked myth) but I hope I'm not wrong. Also, I don't drive much so this does not take away miles from my power-train warranty so i will get the full 5 years coverage and if ive not destroyed the van by then then it will last forever :) . Not having to drive back anywhere or pay for hotels or restaurants offers a much greater ROI than whatever damage this is doing and many mechanics including Scotty's Garage say is negligible in modern engines. Anyways.. I'm sure the cost of installing and maintaining a house A/C and power plant is far greater than the repairs I will need make by using the van this way. I'll roll the dice and keep an eye on my engine temp gauge.
Great video. A bit off subject but can you do a video on replacing the air filter for the cab heater and air conditioner. I get mice in there and I want to be able to change it myself. I know I have to remove the battery. I have a Tioga class C. Thank you
I realise that this video is over 2 years old but I will still post my RV setup and running an AC...just in-case it is useful for someone. 2.25Kw of solar, 800AH of lithium batteries, split cycle AC. And the result is....I have the same issue that you found, the solar was going into running the AC thereby putting the battery capacity at a lower percentage the next day, followed by the next until I have to plug into an external power source to fully recharge again. It is a bit more complicated than that though as the solar is putting in 1900+ watts during the peak solar charging of the day with the AC only using 800-900 watts of that and the rest being wasted after the batteries are 100% by 11am - 12 noon, but as it moves into late afternoon (4pm onwards) and the solar charging drops off, that is when the AC is using up the battery capacity. However I do live in a part of Australia that is over 40 degrees Celsius during the day and only reaches a low of 27degrees Celsius at night, (It is now 11pm and the outside temp is 30 degrees Celsius) therefore the AC has to run 24/7 and has no time to shut off...keeping in mind that your test did not take into account other activities that happen in the RV including going in and out of the door during the day which will affect the AC run time vs idle time. My solution - I am upgrading to 1200 AH of lithium batteries so that I can store some more of that wasted potential during the peak of the day, and my calculations show that I should then be able to run an AC 24/7 and use the RV without compromising on other activities that use power.
Didn't know if people were aware of a co called Arctic Breeze they make a 12v ac for big trucks they pull 47 amps at 12 v dc it could be an option for someone who wants to add an ac to what they have, just a thought. Like your channel.
I run a Nomadic Cooling 8750 btu DC powered mini split on my 32’ RV. That unit pulls 48amp from batteries on high. I have 5 240w 46v solar panels and they just keep up with that power draw at peak sun times. So I do need to run a generator at the end of hot days...but not all day! At night it is cooler and the A/C unit draws more like 25Ah and cycles off so my 300 Ah of LiFePO batteries run it all night to keep bedroom cool.
Use a smaller inverter to minimize the idle power draw. Maybe 600W would even work. A lot of people say you can't run an inverter because it's not efficient, but mini-split ACs are almost 2x more efficient than most 12V AC systems. That means even with even if you lose 15% of the power to the inverter, you're still more efficient.
Thanks for your DC-DC converter video. I protect my RV alternator with one now. I’m not a fan of generator noise. The DC-DC converter would be a good supplement to solar while running AC, but idling our big gas coach is still pretty noisy and stinky when stationary. But our car is quiet and uses less fuel. Do you think it’s possible to simply connect jumper cables between my car’s battery and the coach battery and use the coach’s preexisting DC-DC converter to protect the car alternator instead? In this scenario, the inverter pulls from the house batteries which pull from the coach chassis battery which pulls from the car battery which pulls from the car alternator. Might not be particularly efficient but ?
Great Video, thank you! Something to think about while I was watching this, I just want to keep the inside moderately cooled. 74 degrees is pretty cool where we live (AZ). I would guess that if the AC was set at 82 or 84 the batteries would have more chance to recover. I really like the idea of the soft start unit and will consider it for when I finally install my solar system. Right now I am looking at assembling a 400W system (2 x 200W panels), a controller that will accommodate up to 600W of panels, 2 group 27 batteries, and a 2K or 3K inverter. I would like to get input on what I am getting ready to do as well if someone wants to comment.
In order to run your air conditioning off of solar you need solar panels that will produce enough electricity to run a/c and recharge your batteries. Figure that you need probably twice the solar power as the air conditioning draws.
Would be interesting to see what works :) A/C with a BLDC compressor would be more efficient. It could cut about 200 Watts. Heat reflecting coating or film on windows could help. Better isolation, air sealing and HRV could be needed. On the production side, one may need to cover the entire roof with the most efficient panels on the market. Use a higher voltage system. And may even need to make panels tiltable or put a second array on a side of a vehicle.
Thank you for you’re very thought out and informative video… I think I’ve watched just about everyone of them since I started down this RV path… What are your thoughts on replacing your current AC unit with a mini split ? Or just your thoughts on a mini split in general thanks again and looking forward to more videos
Extremely informative & presentation, as always, well thought out. You are such a great instructor. Thank you again Brian. Titofied production! 😇🤩💜
My pleasure! I appreciate that. Hmmmm "a Titofied Production". I like that :)
A lot of these inverters nowadays have soft start built into them I just test it out my AC unit on my solar 200 amp hour batteries with a 25 amp input coming in from the sun it took my battery is down to 12.4 9hundred watts and was able to stay on. at that point as long as you have 900 watts coming in from the solar should work I would imagine. I'm still testing
Very neat video here what I did pick was having a small inverter type generator can be used to run the AC as long as I install a soft start unit on the AC is that correct? If so that would safe hours on my main generator. I'm going to have a solar system like yours installed. I would like to here what your solar components include.
*Works great **Fastly.Cool** compact and Easy to install*
*I use this solar **Generater.Systems** at work. The building is 80 years old so there’s not a lot of electrical outlets. I use it for lights, fans, charge phones etc. works great !*
You'll need a generator or DC-DC charger. It's good to have multiple options since the sun doesn't always shine.
Hay I so appreciate your videos! As a 30 year Advanced Auto tech and business owner I am happy to answer any questions that you encounter with a shop or mechanic. As new empty nesters we are back on the RV field and I am a tech but for solar, batteries and such. You have helped me so much in understanding the new tech of the industry. Batteries, solar, inverter and soft start. Keep it up!! Thanks you!!!
Hello, I have 1360 watts of solar, 5 100amp lithium battle born batteries and a 3000 watt pure sine victron inverter. Currently I am running a coleman mach Roof A/C with the easy start I installed. As long as I am in a state that is sunny most of the time I do not have an issue!
Thanks for your video! ~ Lisa
Very nice! Thanks for sharing your setup.
1350 Watts of solar? No wonder you have no problem running the AC.
What panels are you using and how many?
How do you have 5 batteries? Are you running that with 12v? What sort of charge controller do you have for that?
@@RVwithTito when will the person give the person who asked questions answer? What type of controller and brand names. I'm trying to figure out how to keep my milk cold without buying ice or standing around making my own ice all day. Able to make enough ice to keep my cooler will last all day and night that my friend gave me. He had gotten as a volunteer for the Red Cross many years ago and he passed it on to me since he didn't need it and I did.
4 x Battle borns and victron 3000 I get about same results with my softstart. When it's around 90 and above I just rely on starting my Honda 2200 to assist in powering my ac. I have 5 x 160 watt on roof but at direct light only get max 500 watts input. Renogy flat panels. Love your flat panel mount idea going to deploy on my panels!
Great. Thanks for sharing that. Cheers!
I found the same thing Brian, Not only that but the hotter the ambient temperature the less efficient the solar panel is. Manufacturers rate their products’ susceptibility to temperature in the form of the temperature coefficient, which is expressed as a percentage per degree Celsius. It is standard practice to test solar panels for power output at 25 °C. So, if a panel is rated to have a temperature coefficient of -0.50% per °C, that panel’s output power will decrease by a half of a percent for every degree the temperature rises about 25 °C (77 °F).
You're 100% right solar panels need to sunlight but hate the Heat, that's why you must always over panel in preparation for that.
Also keep in mind in the winter time you would generate more power then the rating since the temperature it's lower than 77F.
Good for electric heaters instead of burning propane.
True. More reason to follow that 77 deg Standard Test Condition temp around :)
1) Your Class C is far better insulated than our Class A! We have to run 2 AC units on a summer day to keep the temperature down to 85 degrees. We’ll run the AC off the generator only. I have 1200W of solar on the roof with a Victorn 150/85 controller. We use a Magnum 2800W inverter. And have 6 Lifeline 6V 220Amp hour AGMs. Next batter switch will be to LiFeSO4.
2) Thanks for your videos. We enjoy your projects and can’t wait to get a house with a work shop to do some work on our 2008 motorhome. Storage and weight limitations prevent me from projects.
I did the same experiment but on a smaller scale , I have a truck camper with 215 watts of solar and a 2000 watt pure sine wave inverter hard wired in the RV through a transfer switch. On a hot sunny day no clouds I set my AC on 75 degrees. I also have 2 group 27 ,new batteries. My camper was already cool as I keep it turned on and plugged into shore power. Unplugged the shore power, turned on inverter and watched the meters amp draw and voltage. The AC cycles off and on all day. While off the solar charged back some loss. While on the AC draws about 700 watts after settling down. I've got the smallest roof AC made I think. I ran the AC pretty much all day to experiment but like you said unless you have a way to recharge the batteries at night its not practical . After depleting the power out of the batteries to 50% late afternoon I shut it down plugged back up and turned the converter on to recharge the batteries over night. You can run a AC on solar just need more solar panels more amp hour of batteries and a more efficient AC. Just a thought.
If you have access to shore power then that'll work I suppose. Still...more solar seems to be the solution.
Consider setting t-stat to 78 instead of 74. Your ac unit will dehumidify your space and use less kwh and still be comfortable. I live in Florida and that's where I set it during the day. I'm a retired PE mech/elect. All the best.
That would be better. At home we usually keep it at 74 which is why I set it there for this test. 78 degF is probably a more reasonable comfortable temp while dry-camping. Thanks for the insight.
Well done Tito, thanks for another well produced and very informative video.
We recently upgraded our Battery/Inverter system specifically with boondocking while running everything on our 37' DP much like being plugged in (at least like having 30A plugin) :)
In any case out set-up is as follows:
(8) Lion Energy 105Ah LifePO4 Batteries configured at 24V (420Ah)
(2) Victron 24/3000 Inverter/Chargers
1600W Solar W/ Victron 150/100 MPPT Controller
(2) 24-12V/70A Converters (to service 12V systems)
(2) 12-24/15A DC-DC Converters (To charge Batteries while traveling)
Victron Cerbo GX with GX Display and VRM interface
So when we installed this in July we configured the system to power every circuit in our Coach and did this in Split-Phase which allowed us to install a 240V circuit for future use (Dual Zone Mini-Split AC Heatpump).
As it is right now we can actually start and run both of our 13.5K rooftop AC units without a soft start, but I did order one to see how it works. When we finalize the installation of the mini-split in the future we'll remove the rooftop units and reconfigure for more solar :)
We can actually travel down the road now with one rooftop unit running and still put power back into the batteries as long as we can produce at least 1000W of the 1600W Available.
Running just a rooftop unit (with the rest of the coach stuff) while stationary we can run a single unit and only use about 20A tailing off to about 60A total with no solar (@24V) so we have a good 4 hours of AC after the sun goes down while still being able to run the coach overnight.
When we get the mini-split installed it will use approx. 50% of the power of the rooftop unit and hopefully we'll be all set, especially when we add some more solar.
So it can be done but it's not easy, I only post this to show people that I CAN be done, but to your point in the video a small generator will work just fine for most people if the rooftop units can keep up.
Happy travels!!
Thanks for the video, I have the same 600w solar, 4 100 amp hr. batteries, 3000 renogy inverter. I able to run my 15000 Coleman for about 2.5 hrs. When running the AC I'm showing 130 amp draw to the inverter. I thought that was way off, now that I seen the video makes me feel better. I thought something was wrong. I need to add more solar panels. Again thank you for the video
Hey Brian,
Great video, and very timely! I appreciate the practical approach to your videos and you taking time to explain the “why”, makes it easy to apply to each individual situation.
We have a 50 amp rig with:
975 watts of solar
400 AH Lithium battery bank
3000 watt Inverter
4500 watt inverter\generator
The Air Conditioner tied to the battery bank has a soft start as well. Same as yours, it consumes about 100AHs (~1 battery per hour) when running.
We are in NE Pennsylvania this week and it has been blistering hot (mid 90’s). It has been a bit of a struggle to keep our rig comfortable during the heat of the day.
We are on a 30 amp pedestal, but with a full park (and lots of running ACs) the voltage on the pedestal has been averaging 105V-107V...BEFORE we take any juice. Our EMS shuts power down to the rig at anything under 105V. SO....it has been a balancing act for sure. Through trial and error, I was able to take ~ 7 amps off the pedestal during the highest load time with out tripping my BMS. That allowed my battery bank to last most of the day. I only had to run my generator for ~1.5hrs to get back to 50% charge.
The moral of the story.....where there is a will, there is a way.
Nice to have options so you can do the balancing thing. I appreciate you sharing your system setup and experiences.
Great Video! I don't have a set up like yours yet, but my ultimate boondock setup is running my A/C on a 3,000 watt generator, powered by propane, 6 hours a day (3 in the morning, and 3 at night before bed) to keep the camper from getting to hot. Then the solar will help keep the batteries charged and only using low powered fans to circulate the air when the A/C is not running. With good insulation, covered and tinted windows, the A/C isn't working as hard, the draw on the batteries is well below my daily intake from the solar panels, and I am confident that I can will keep the battery level right around 80% during the dark hours.
Is this your current setup? Or by ultimate do you mean it's just hypothetical?
RV with Tito DIY I’m sorry, my comment was a little confusing. I currently RV part time and mostly on shore power. However, I do boondock on occasion to test what my needs are based on the power I normally use.
Next year I plan on RVing full time, Boondocking 5 days a week and on shore power the other two.
My above scenario is my “Power Plan” setup once I get everything upgraded the way I want it for full time RVing.
Your video helped me answer a bunch of questions that I don’t have the equipment to test for myself now. Thank You!
@@MrBklein31 Understood. Thanks.
_I pulled all of my A/C units out and put one 12000 BTU 115v mini-split in my custom-built cargo trailer. I'm so glad I did. Can run it throughout the day on solar with no problems. Plus running a small Arctic king freezer, NewAir ice machine, lights, 55 inch TV, DVD player all at the same time. With a system that has a: Samlex EVO-2224 charger/ inverter ( 4 ) 320 watt solar making 1280 total watts ( 4 ) 370Ah 6v flooded batteries. I've seen it get down to 76%, but the average is 80% on the batteries during the day. At night I would run a generator to keep up the same consumption, but if I don't need the A/C to run, then I don't need to run any generator, the system can handle all my needs throughout the night; until sunlight again. The mini-split runs about 9Amp to 12 Amps when running when it goes into a so-call float. It runs about 3amps to 4 amp to maintain my temperature of 77 inside and a 109 outside. I also like to say: it's so quiet, it's incredible, NO MORE noisy jet engine sounding A/C units ever again! The unit is a Senville mini-split I paid just under $800.00 for everything. I installed it myself, and have never done any A/C work before. Take your time. It's a piece of cake. So, so happy! You can too, if you want peace and quiet, with temperature, controlled home/ RV/ Trailer_
That's impressive! Thanks for sharing you're numbers. I've been curious how much current a mini split draws. 👍👍
For those amp draws you must have 48 bolts
Ed Mor no, it’s 24 v not 48 bolts. I built the system, I know!
Your able to vacume to lines yourself?
@@Hoffmanpack yes, I was a little nervous though, because I have never done it, then on top of that, I also used an Appion mega flow vacuum rate valve core removal tool with the vac pump that was vacuuming out the lines. Then have to put the core back in the valve body. You don't have to use that tool to do the vacuum. Once it all done then you released the refrigerant into the system.
You're a brave man for even trying it IMHO. You do have a huge van though. I think any system would struggle to run a decent sized AC unit. IMHO get the RV in the shade, put out awnings either side and run a separate 300W solar panel out in the sun and run fans... well that's how we got around it...
That's pretty much what we do until it gets too hot. Then we're moving on to cooler places.
@@RVwithTito My wife and I can handle the heat but when it's those few weeks that are unbearable, we have resorted to RV parks and just 'plug in' for a few weeks. At least we can run the AC all day everyday, charge all the batteries, bring on fresh water, dump the old, wash and service the van and just chill during those really humid weeks.
Great video, it helps answer a question that many people have. Clearly you can run A/C off grid from solar - maybe not all day every day, maybe you need more solar panels and/or more batteries and maybe a decent inverter - but it can be done. Of course you could increase the temperature setting on the A/C so it runs a bit less. If the camper was better insulated (maybe double glazing) then the A/C wouldn't have to work as hard.
It is good to see what happens with 600W of solar and 400Ah of batteries and 2,000W inverter, that provides a basis for working out what would be needed to run the A/C more often or less often.
Thanks for the feedback Mark. You picked up on my point in making the video which was to see what was possible with a moderate setup as a baseline. 👍
Thanks for this info- all good ..
Remember that new rv’s with all battery setups r using 12 volt ac units ,
Also - eliminating the inverter that uses at lot of energy to convert the power. Then also, the vehicles alternator is used a generator , kinda a sledge hammer , the vehicles alternator as an auxiliary power source...
Thanks again
Thanks for the info. I haven't done much research into 12V A/C units but I will.
One thing to keep in mind is that these AC’s use more power when it’s 85 - 110 +
I installed the easy start - great product .My small generator will run when below 85 outside - but not over 85 .Fun video to watch.🥵🔥
Excellent share. I have watched several RV videos where the people are mounting panels all over the roof and building huge systems at a ridiculous cost, so they can try to run their AC. The problem is that they do not replenish or, they cannot do much else electrically if they hope to replenish power. All that said, at what cost? This is where green meets reality. I am all for solar on RVs to power inverters and have power for everything smaller but appliances like microwaves, induction cooktops and ACs generally require more than basic capabilities in the solar system and price negates such a choice realistically. Naturally, some are determined to try it anyway- those with money to waste.
Thanks. Actually small equipment like microwaves, hair dryers and small induction burners are no big deal. We use them all the time. They pull a lot of amps but only for a few minutes without any significant hit to the batteries. Air conditioners are a different story.
So glad you did this video. I am solar newbie and wondered if this was feasible..
It's definitely feasible but you need a bunch of solar. I've got friends who run 2 A/C units on solar.
Brian, I think in your past life you were a high school science teacher lol. Your videos are always instructive. Thanks for being so thorough - Hal
Thanks Hal. I appreciate that feedback. I believe we can all be teachers and pass on what we learn. In fact I learn the most through teaching. 👍
@@RVwithTito That's been my experience. If you think you know a subject, try teaching it. You'll find you don't know as much as you thought.
Tito, first and foremost I love your videos. you give real info in the form of both data and components. This video, the one regarding running a/c on only your batts, struck me in a different way than probably most people. .. I lived in arizona for ten years so I know HEAT.... my question is about humidity.. when we had MONTHS of 100 plus degrees we switched to swamp cooling or evaporative cooling - remember az is a 'dry heat' lol. we would set the ac for 80 and use the evap until we hit than temp. worked great. not an ice rink but - well - no humidity is really great. my kids would beg for blankets when they got out of t he pool as the evap on their skin would bring goose bumps up really quick. I'm moving from a boat to bus conversion now so I can't do this comparison but hope you will explore it.~~ !!! really great vids. much appreciated.
Some good real world information here. Yes it's possible but there are a ton of variables involved. For 1 the size of your RV and the size of your AC unit along with its efficiency.. The bigger the conditioned space the more power you will need to cool it. So this same setup on let's say a 20ft or smaller RV would require a lot less cooling. Also how well insulated is your RV? Leaky windows? Ect. Most Rv's aren't really designed with peak energy efficiency in mind.
Another factor to consider is how much cooling are you looking to achieve? Running the AC all day and night requires a whole lot more power than just running it for a few hours during the hottest part of the day.
Great Video and great info. Thanks
I have 570 watts of solar, 2000 watt inverter, soft start installed on the AC, 4 100 amp hour Battle Born batteries. your video kinda encouraged me to try the AC on inverter power...have to talk to Battle Born about warranty effects.
hey Mike , have you tried it ? curious how well that works. I have the same setup but only 1/2 the batteries, Im thinking of doubling our BB from 2 x 100 to 4 x 100, for the rare couple of days that we need to run the air conditioning.
Yes. Your setup is very close to mine. You should see similar results.
@@RVwithTito I have not had a chance to try it yet
I totally agree ... it is more practical to have a quiet generator , I'm working on a ventilated box to put the propane generator in to make it around 40db
I think this is really awesome for those of you that have this type of setup. Even if you have to run a little generator I think it's amazing. Great video! You have an awesome setup.
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it. Trying not to overdo the setup, but who knows...maybe a little more solar :)
Hi Brian. We’re in a Newmar 3609 with two Dometic 15k heat pump AC units. Had Arizona Wind and Sun install a solar system. 1400 watts, 3K Victron inverter, 4 100 amp Battle Born batteries. Currently can run one AC for a few hours without any solar. Not using Soft Start. Have not done a long term test with full solar but plan to. Panels typically pull in 1250-1350w on bright sunny day. Panels art flat mounted on roof. Great video.
Glad to hear a 3K inverter would do the trick. I tried it on my 2K and it overloaded it for sure. Based on my tests you'd probably get about 4 hours running both with no solar. So the more solar the better. Good luck!
RV with Tito DIY I think your numbers are spot on! The control panel indicated about 4 hours if we ran it on the solar 👍
Thanks for this interesting video! Roof-top RV air seems the all-time least efficient manner in which to obtain cool air. Therefor I use a split air system that draws just 600 watts. It has inverter circuitry which results in a soft start. I have found that with the 19 amps my solar controller offers mid day (tapering up or down from 3 amps morning and evening) my system can barely keep up SO...I turn the a/c (I run one or the other, not both) on about 1 pm and shut it off about 6 pm. I am adding two additional solar panels which may well turn the tide on this race for available current. I should add that the more windows I install, the less need I have for the a/c due to cross ventilation. I am finding after 30 years living on wheels, every day is still on on-going experiment with air conditioning. NOTE that I am in a converted cargo trailer with R-15 rockwool insulation. This has a huge effect helping me shoot for 74 degrees.
Thanks for sharing your insight. Cheers!
Morning Brian! Great video topic and I have been planning a similar one! We also have 400ah of BB's with a 3000 watt Multiplus and 300 watts of solar. It was interesting to see your A/C draws about 110 amps as my Penguin II 13,500 draws closer to 150 amps.
I have a soft start but don't have it installed yet. The A/C does start and run off the inverter and batteries without it, but I'm not sure the strain it is putting on them. I was thinking about running it down till the BMS shuts down to see how that actually works.
Your test results came out pretty good I thought and your extra 300 watts of solar, plus the more efficient A/C will no doubt produce a much longer run time than mine.
Hope you guys are doing well.
Thanks, Aaron
Hey Aaron! Yes we're doing well. Hope you are too back home. I'm wondering if your Penguin will run more efficiently with the soft start. Mine seems to be quieter. You'll probably be able to cool your rig down faster too since it's smaller. Looking forward to your video.
i have a victron setup useing 8 12v 100ah batteries running in a 48v config with a 5kw inverter and about 3kw of solar and i can run my ac system without any issues and still make power during the day. for the 12v appliances in my rv i have a 70amp 48v to 12v converter. my rooftop system is a newer model and draws about 1100w and can cool down the area with no issues.
While you’re kind of rooftop system is not really feasible unless you have a massive solar system with batteries it’s being done every day now with mini splits, yes you would have to change your system out but when you have a system that just draws 400 or 500 Watts And can easily runoff solar and house batteries it may be worth just ditching that junk on the roof but thanks again for this one to explain to people that this is a tricky option.
Great video and explanation. For inspiration you might check out the design of the Volta Pure3 systems that Winnebago is installing in some of the class B RVs (travato 59 G/K *L* for lithium). They use a system with off-the-shelf components comprised of a usable 8700 watt hours of lithium to supply an always 30A/120v invertor. They use minimal solar, but mainly charge with a 48 volt 6000 watt alternator run by the van engine that at 1500rpm will fully recharge the batteries in less than 2 hours, either when driving or using a smart controller that can automatically start the engine and run at 1500 rpm when needed. An expensive $25000 option but very well designed in my opinion for a small RV. I roughly priced out similar diy components at about $15000 for major components with about 700 watts of solar. There are a few videos out of folks doing your same test of the Volta (one in 100+ degrees heat!). I agree a $1000 generator is certainly more affordable, but in some situations generators are forbidden and always noisy and smelly.
I use my 5,000 BTU 455 watt air conditioner every day that I am in my van (Texas panhandle). I installed an Easy Start. I also power a TV and microwave. I only have 3, 100 amp hour Battle Born batteries and a 790 watt Grape Solar system. I have 3 inverters; a 3,000 watt for the microwave and AC, a 1,500 watt for backup, and a 180 watt for the TV.
That is awesome! Thanks for sharing your system.
Excellent video. I have a question I have not found an answer to. How about replacing your A/C's AC motor with a DC motor and bypassing the converter and it's efficiency loss. Since you would want at least 4 batteries (12 volts each), use a 48 volt DC motor to better handle the load.
Would the DC motor pull less on the start and is it an easy swap?
Could certainly be more efficient if you want to put in the effort. Have you found a DC motor for that, then probably a speed controller...not sure. I know the motor (fan only uses about 12A at 13V).
Our AC draws 500-700watts with the compressor running. We use a 1 farad capacitor on our 12v system for any major drawdowns and it helps. We need a larger solar aray to run it for hours however. Its fine to stop for lunch and use it.
Thanks for the info. Much appreciate the tips, do & don'ts. Sometimes it's difficult to get the most efficient especially when you need the inverter to remain as cool as possible and not overheat.
NICE VIDEO BRIAN ..!!Since i installed the 364 (2yrs) is nice to run the ac 13,500 btu Carrier in my class B + 22ft Holiday Rambler Augusta with The Honda 2000/2200..Never and issue $2 a day that is CHEAP ..!!!Instant Power..! In Florida that test will last about 5 min..! Maybe with a 5000 btu ac unit it will work longer..!! The test that you did is like filling a siwimming pool with a garden hose and in same time you draining the water with a 5 inch pipe..! Ja.ja..!! Unless you have a massive battery bank like 12.or more batteries.? If you downsize to a class b the results will be different ...The best friend of a solar is a Honda generator..!!!
Yes. You're right. If we were to use our A/C more, I'd probably be carrying our portable generator more. Thanks for sharing your setup.
I live off grid and run my AC unit strictly off of solar.. No generator.. I have a window unit with a built in soft start that cost 260 bucks.. It is a 6000btu Danby that I got from Home Depot.. When it starts it draws about 450 watts and then slowly increases until it gets up to about 550 watts.. It is only good for about 200+ sq ft but the fact that it came with a built in soft start with the AC for only 260 is what amazes me.. If a window unit is an option,, this is the way to go..
Sounds like a good solution for a small to medium space. Thanks for the info.
We have a 40' class A with 2700 watts of solar, and 25kWh of batteries. This completely removes the need for a generator; (We don't have one)
It would be difficult to park off-grid in Phoenix in July, but we can exist most anywhere else we want and use air conditioning day and night.
If we DO need to visit Phoenix in July, at most a 15 amp extension cord supplies all the extra power we need to sit in 100F+ heat.
Quite the setup. Thanks!
That is quite a battery set up. my four battle born 100 AH is about 5KWH you have 5 times that wow
Hey Tito, I recently installed the soft start module in a Colemen Mach 8 in my 2020 Eaglecap 1200. I have 500 watts of solar and thus far have tested it to 90 F. The solar easily keeps up with the AC, keeping the temp at 74F on low cool.
I wondered about your AC units drawing 100 amps. My single unit, 13,500 bti draws only 12 amps.
Sounds like you've solved it. My A/C with dual compressors draws between 1300 and 1600 watts.
Hmmm, coupla thoughts, Brian. You have some deployable solar panels (ground & window awnings), which might create another 15 Amps when added together? Which would cut the draw in half. Also, your solar setup is partially older, and- there are some newer flexible panels with higher output, so- if you 'chose' to upgrade your roof set up, you could easily bump to 800 or 1,000 watts. Many of us have smaller campers with lower draw, more efficient units... I still think that running a small portable generator for an hour or two in the late afternoon, early evening could really make this a viable solution. You've lost 140+ Lbs by removing the the Onan, but, a 2,000w inverter/generator and a touch more solar...hmmmm. just sayin', Tito!
:) Yes I know. I've been contemplating replacing the old Unisolar panels with a few hundred watts more of flex. They've served me so well for the last 8 years and are still going strong especially in low light. I may just mount some new stuff over the top and avoid having to remove the adhesive.
Thanks for the experiment. I was once curious if it was possible. I've a 3000 watt Inverter with 600 amp hrs (6 Battleborn). I've a 2020 Grand Design with 15,000 btu AC's and no soft start.
I've a Victron Battery Monitor so I am able to see amps and expected runtime. I turned on 1 AC and can't remember what kind of surge there was but the Battery Monitor said I had about 5 hrs of runtime. I then ended the experiment satisfied that I could run at least one in a pinch. I've 4 190 watt solar panels. At this time I can't justify a Soft Start.
Romeo
Yes. In a pinch for me as well. I have extra solar I can throw at the setup if need be.
I'd like to see you install an electric car receiver to fill your batteries from a refill station. Or how to make your RV alternator charge your batteries. Unless your RV already does that . I find both you and Love Your RV very helpful to someone like me with electrical learning challenges
Here's a video showing how I do the alternator charging ua-cam.com/video/TDxfRXgQT04/v-deo.html.
Not here to correct anything you've stated, but to learn & have subscribed! However, somewhere around 8:00 U stated the a/c is drawing more energy, the fact is, it's drawing the same, but the batteries are just being charged at a lesser rate!
Sorry to be confusing. Drawing more the from batteries is what I meant.
My rooftop air conditioner on my truck camper will run continuously while the Sun is out. And the batteries stay at 100%. I also have 600 W like you, but they are wired in series which gives me more amps. I use Renogy everything, including the 3000 W inverter and 2 - 170ah Renogy lithiums
How much does your A/C draw?
@@RVwithTito
It's an 11,000 btu unit.
Excellent report. We're getting in the same situation as summer in Europe is getting hoter. I'd like to know more about your aux. generator suppling energie to the AC. Regards
I don't use a generator anymore. We do have that small one, but don't typically bring it along because then we'd have to carry fuel.
Great video and info as always, thanks! Our current travel trailer doesn’t have an inverter or solar but it’s so poorly insulated that I wouldn’t bother! In this Texas heat the 13.5k AC has to run almost non-stop anyways (at least during the day)! We enjoy it but it’s not an ideal rig for boondocking unless it’s perfect weather!
I have 800Watts solar and LiFePo4 180AH battery, my AC unit is only 8000 BTU but 15 Seer rating. If the sun shines every day I can still run the AC and recharge the battery. Even I would need more solar to keep up with the demands of the AC if I was doing this every day. Thanks for the video.
You bet. With that solar to battery ratio your LiFePO4 batteries should recharge pretty quickly.
Thanks Brian. Great presentation however I called that one from the start: if you want AC use a generator.
Nailed it 😀
I have 1400w and 964 amp h of Lithium And it runs my mini split day and night with no problem in 95 +
I have only electric appliances electric range hot water heater microwave convection oven TV xbox
@@williambrawner2618
That's like $10,000 in batteries!!!
@@mobileempire5522 No no not at all. I bought used Tesla batteries out of a 2016 model S I purchased 2 modules they were $950 apiece They weigh 60 pounds apiece So far I'm loving them
Would mounting a panel on a vertical surface possibly be more efficient in the winter months? The flexibile panels could be positioned to look like a window on the sides or even on the rear. Or even be made to cover the over cab window. I just an throwing out silly ideas.
Probably not a good option. You would always have to be parked with that side facing south for winter. It would have to be a temporary setup using flex panels like this ua-cam.com/video/Al8rCydNiLs/v-deo.html.
@@RVwithTito Thank You
FYI, the Airxcel (Coleman) Mach 10 NDQ has the same operating specs, noise and amperage draw as the Houghton unit. Same price range also. I have one and it works great and is QUIET.
Good to know. Thanks.
Thank you for your video. I haven’t bought one yet but I’m looking for diesel pusher about 20 years old or more. What did you buy your product from? Thank you.
if it's just one person or one room, my Vornado 660 is more than adequate for the job, for multiple people, I recommend USB fans everywhere
if it's more than 10 degrees of "perceived cooling" you need to achieve, then yeah I guess AC is a must...
or very high humidity
Lots of things would be different if it were just one person :)
Interesting test. Would have been interesting to see it go for 24 hours to see what level the batteries would be at. I would assume the next morning you would get some power back before the AC started again. Would also be interesting to see how it would work overnight in a campground where you have quiet hours and can't run the generator.
Yes. A lot of battery capacity can be recovered the next morning before you need AC
I'm guessing it would fully drain the battery bank, depending on the temps.
I think mini split is the way to go. Highly efficient with built in inverter. A guy here has a mini split running off solar.
Agreed. Based on the comments. Mini split seems to be the best solution if you can find a place to mount it.
Would love to have mini getting closer to plausible!
Great test Brian. Always wanted to see how that would work. It looks like you would need more panels and/or more batteries which would add considerable expense complexity and weight.. probably best to just run on shore power.. GOOD test though...
Yes. Always more, more, more :) We're pretty content with what we've got.
Another option came to mind is, instead of converting DC from solar panels to AC to run A/C unit which always some energy lost during that process to the inverter. There is a 12 v A/C system 20,000 BTU rating. It's a roof mount unit, not an undermount by ProAir. Maybe it will help.
Nice videos, very well explained. Thanks!
I guess in this case it depends on tje usage of AC. For example if you only ise AC 1-2 hours noon and then again 2 hours on the evening (as the rest of the time one might be outside) then its more than enough.
And then having as backup the portable gas generator
Yes. You're right. I'd only use it in a pinch. When we were in Arizona, we were ready to leave once the outside temps reached the upper 80s. Thanks for the comment!
Very good explanation. Thank you so much.
You are welcome!
Nice test sir.
Thanks 👍
We have 520w Solar, GoPower IC3000 inverter (true 3000W inverter, the Victrons are 3000VA, (Volt/Amps) vs watts, there watt output is 2400w by the math). We have 4 BB Li batteries as well. My system powers the entire trailer, so the converter box acts as a sub panel. We have a heat pump, as a AC unit it will run in the 4 hr range, great for short runs, but have not used it long term. As a heat pump, it will run all night and only draw down 30%. We do have a generator, but have only used it once. The truck DC-DC controller (RedAcrc BCDC1240D) can act like a generator to top off the batteries mainly when driving, also because it is a MPPT controller, it is an input for portable solar panels. The other nice thing about Li batteries over Lead, is you can drain them nearly to 0%, I have my cutoff set to 10% though. I was curious how long theses might last, so thank you for doing this test.
Thanks for sharing your setup. Sounds like it's working. I also use a DC-to-DC from my alternator while driving as needed. When I tested the heat pump mode it drew a little more current than in cooling mode. Good info!
RV with Tito DIY , fortunately the heat pump only runs 10 min at a time to maintain, yes it draws more on heating than cooling when running , just doesn’t run as long😉
Agreed! NOT PRACTICAL!
Part of the problem that not many discuss is the extreme heat the inverter generates when running an AC unit (or actually anything drawing 50-100% of the rated wattage). Also, lots of heat gets generated in the batteries when pulling (or charging) large amps from the batteries.
Yes, they say lithium batts can be used up to say 130F but they don't say how you are degrading the batts on that sort of temp.
I also notice the amps pulled from the AC depends on the outdoor temps and humidity.
I have 600 AH LiPo and 960 watts of solar
Thanks for chiming in and sharing your thoughts on this. I agree, that is a concern. We don't typically run into that since we haven't used the A/C in this mode. We typically only use high-draw loads for a few minutes at at time.
Why would you stop the test at 50%? I thought if you have lithium Iron Batteries you supposed to be able to run them down completely (to auto shut off point which is something like 5-10%) with out ANY battery degradation? Maybe I misunderstand something. Thanks for the test. It pretty much answers my question as to weather I could run the ac over night with the gen off.
I got 4000 watts GIANDEL runs Air conditioning from 15 amp plug. 13500 BTU ... Problem is 910 amps /hours T-105 battery banks go down fast at night
2000 watts solar pants will let You run during days...Nights are difficult . Drag your battery below 50 percent . So is expense ..Battery won't last long.
If You replace with lithium total cost of that is around 7000 thousands dollars ..No problem then ...
To run an AC on solar can be done, but you should think of it far in advance and not make it an after thought. You should have several factors in mind when building out your system. The hodgepodge approach can cost you more in the long run by trying to make up for it as you go. Always plan it out. Below is just some of what you should keep in mind when building a system for your needs.
1#: What will you power?
If you want to run the A.C. off grid, you need to have a minimum of 125 amps DC power of just solar input. That is around (25) 100-watt panels or the equivalent there of. That is roughly an area of glass 8 foot x 17.5 foot. This means the solar setup needs to produce that much power the whole time you run the A.C. Not including when clouds drift by or it's a hazy day and power output dips. Solar is not a constant. If the power is not constant the batteries make up for the dip in power. Solar is rated by a max value. Of course you can mix and match panels to get you to this point but when you go over 1000 watt mark, you should implement some safety factors to reduce the chance of fire and electrocution. Because you are playing with the power a welder make at that point. A short circuit or pad panel can cause a fire real quick.
#2: Your inverter efficiency.
Most have a loss of 2% - 5% and you avoid maxing out your inverter. You should always have an "overhead" of 15% - 20%. So a 2000 watt inverter is basically maxed out with just the use of the A.C. or a microwave oven by it's self. This means your inverter is putting out around 1400 watt OR 20 amps VAC while it is using 116 Amps VDC. Of course I'm not including the locked rotor amps needed to start any motor. That varies on all motors.
#3: Wire size and length to the inverter and solar.
Inverter wiring: You always want to keep the run of wire from the batteries to the inverter as short as possible and as large as possible. You want to keep the total run under 10 feet. That INCLUDES both positive AND negative wires. Battery cables should be sized accordingly. Most of the time that means using 4/0 AWG welding cable when you have 3 - 5 LifePo4 batteries. You should have a 400 amp fuse as close to the batteries as possible and a 400 amp continuous rated battery cut off switch after the fuse. Something like the Cole Hersee 75920-05-BX cut off switch. The fuse should always come first. It's your first line of defense during a short.
Solar Wiring:
The higher the amp draw the larger the wire size must be. The longer the run the larger the wire mus be. On a solar system that uses a string of 15 100 watt panels operating @ 12 VDC you are literally using #6 welding cables at that point. Or you can double up on #10 runs. Both are fine if you do your homework and figure in voltage loss. A 12VDC system is not as efficient as a 24VDC or 48VDC system. The higher the voltage the more efficient the system will run. This moves us into controllers and how they work.
#4: The solar controller.
By now everyone know that we have 2 types of controllers to pick from. PWM ('Pulse Width Modulation') and MPPT ('Maximum Power Point Tracking'). But what most people do not know is they operate on different voltages.
PWM:
The PWM controller only takes a couple of volts from a battery to allow the panels to start charging. But they are limited on the max amps they can deliver and system voltages. Some PWM controllers need as little as 1VDC from the batteries. Some as high as 7VDC. This means if you have completely discharged your batteries (you left on a light while away) you won't need to jump the main bank to start up the charging system. You can literally use a 9 volt battery or string together 4 AA batteries depending on the minim voltage needed to get you on the way to recovery. Once they start charging they just run off the sun. The PWM controller only needs a small amount of voltage to get running while most MPPT controllers needs a higher battery voltage to fire up the charge cycle.
MPPT:
The MPPT controller, while more expensive can provide a higher amount of current / amps from a panel string with one controller, but this is only help full if you have thought through your whole system before hand. If your system is an all 12VDC system from the panels to the controller then you are not using the MPPT controller to it's fullest. MPPT controllers want you to use the highest input voltage you can give them. If a controller is rated for an input of 150VDC then that is what you should try and give it. If you give them the max input they can deliver the max output. Also with an MPPT controller you can use a smaller gauge wire and get longer wire runs on the panel side since voltage drop will be less of a factor. But you always want to keep your voltage drop under 2% no matter if you are using the PWM or MPPT controller. Voltage is the power that pushes the amps through the wire, and everything else. Once on the battery side of the controller a larger wire is needed since you have now reduced the voltage and increased the amperage flow. Amps and resistance cause wires to get hot , not the voltage. This is very important for everyone to under stand because it's the #1 source of fire. The smaller the wire size the less amps it can flow, making higher resistance. The fewer the strands the less electrons it can flow. On my MPPT charger it has a max input voltage of 120VDC but I'm only able to give it 105VDC. This drops me down to around 35 amps of output because of limited space to carry panels. It's all about give and take when it comes to an RV or a horse trailer like I have.
Conclusion:
When it comes to running an A.C. off of your inverterk, yes it can be done but you must think far ahead if you plan on doing it. If you build your system while thinking about the overheads and limitations you may have then yes you can operate the A.C. no problem. Or any other thing that you may need to run. Just keep in mind I will always talk about the extreme ends of a system. You should always factor the the extreme of a system because you never know what will happen in the real world. It's better to build your system with expansion in mind or over kill on the wiring because it adds in a safety margin.
It's always better to be ready and completely understand what you have, and what you can do with it, to get yourself up and running again. Because everyone knows help might be several miles or hours of walking away.
In the mean time, 73s
Crazy Marty
KK6OEF
What is the cost of a system like you are talking about? So 2 AC 1/ 15000 and 1 13500 to run 24/7? Thinking about an off grid home in the future?
@@bobsworld2351 For a house and running 24/7 you would need to expand everything. Because after the sun goes down you have no input power. Since it's a house you are trying to run you can run much higher voltages. You might want to look through Will Prowse on his UA-cam channel to get an idea of what you need to know. He does small systems but you can up size once you know what to do. I would guess you can build something like that for around $35K. Give or take 10,000. The battery bank is where the maintenance cost comes in.
I have 4 deep cycle lead acid batteries and 1700 watt Giandel inverter and I'm drawing 45 amps dc and aircon draws max of 3 amps. Drops to about 2.7 amps AC. But I am still in testing range. Also have 700 watt solar with total amps at 20. My pwm charge controllers own put out 11 amps. Can I run solar panels direct to batteries and get a total of 40 amps while running the aircon? Any reply appreciated cheers from Australia 🙂👍
Thank you. I am interested installing a solar panel system but not sure where to begin.
Brian, You should check out Gone Boondocking UA-cam channel. He did a mini split ac install on his class c. He says he can run it 24/7. Would love to know what you think.
I do subscribe to him and have seen the video. I don't think we use our A/C enough to justify it. Good content though...also love the 1 hour shower. I'm working on something like that too.
@@RVwithTito please post your version of the hour shower. We don't boondock often, but I may put one together for those week long on-the-beach boondocking vacations that my daughter loves. I would be interested to see your take on the device.
I followed gone boon dockings install with a Pioneer 9000 BTU unit 22 seer
My solar almost keeps up with it running in the summer with 950 W on the roof. When I add my 240 W of ground deploy I'm in the plus
Ed Mor nice info to have😀
@@lauramathys2131 Oh I certainly will if can get to it. There will certainly be a bit of trial and error first :)
Same easy start, VictronConnect solar, 3000 watt power converter, battery monitoring and three 100ah battle born battery’s. Will run air about 100ah per hour. The generator Honda 2000 runs it as well. I think you run the generator but, if you are away and then the generator quits the battery takes over. With animals this could be a life saver.
Thanks for sharing that. Sounds very similar to what I have.
We have a heat pump style A/C system in the basement of our motorhome. Which gives me a lot of roof area for solar panels. We installed 2000 watts of solar. This makes it possible to run the system all day long. But I also setup a 6000 BTU window unit for cooling. This allows us to cool on days of limited sun. I have a video about our system on my channel.
Thanks for sharing your setup. I wish I could do that. I checked out your video and left you a comment. I also liked your grid-tie solar. Did you use the same panels on the RV?
@@RVwithTito Yes the panels of the grid tie system. Are the same panels as on the motorhome.
Thank you!! Great video! Perfect for giving me a sense of how big a project (cost and effort) I would be considering if I wanted to go this route. The mrs loves her a/c and I love boondocking (and hate the noise of the generator). It would be so freeing to be able to boondock (quietly) and run A/C. But, did not have a good sense of how viable that wish might be or how big of an investment in time and energy I might be taking on to make it a reality.
It's definitely an investment in time and energy to get there. Most of us avoid areas/seasons that require A/C.
Great video production! Really enjoyed the comprehensive dialog and results. S+L
Thanks!
Thanks Tito, great edit. A few years ago, the idea of running an AC on solar was poo-pooed. Today you are showing its possible and maybe doable in short bursts, but not really ready for 24/7. I'm wondering how much improvement a 12v AC unit would make over a 120v, inverter driven unit. Is there a significant loss going 12v-to-inverter? Also, we operate around 78 degrees on our AC, so I'm wondering what savings you get for 2-4-6-8 degrees warmer.
Nice video very well presented. It IS practical, it's just your current system was not designed with air con in mind. If you follow one rule: You need to run a big load for large parts of the day then you need to up your solar game to have at least as much solar power as the load i.e in your case 2000w of solar. You appear to have plenty of roof space so those 12v stick on panels could be replaced with proper ~300w 24v panels in series and a new charge controller and hey presto, air con all day. This isn't as expensive as you think as the flexible solar panels are hideously overpriced usually so you can actually buy proper big panels for approx the same price. It's an idea, worth a look!!
Full hook ups for this old phart. Park, set up, then go exploring.
Ha. When you absolutely need A/C we opt for full hookups too.
We have 400 AH lithium battery bank with a Victron 3000W inverter and 900W of solar panels. We also have a "hard" start capacitor $10 that handles the compressor surge on start. We can run all day on this. We have a campervan with all the electrical components in the garage and we keep a small fan running on them as the inverter, charge controller and batteries generate a lot of heat when under a heavy load. We turn the a/c off at night and by the time the van is warming up in the early afternoon (we have 3" of spray foam on walls, ceiling and floor) the batteries are charged.
That's Awesome! Can you share the capacitor specs and online listing info where you found one like that? That would be great. Good job btw on your working build and system👍💪
Interesting. I have wondered about using a “hard start”. Used them on old house AC split system compressors and they worked great. How long have you used a hard start and what amp draw difference did it make?
Great insulation and smaller space certainly helps. Thanks for sharing your setup!
Tito informative as always; how about the lithium batteries getting charged by the actual coach motor as does the Alta Power System you find in Winnebago 59KL Class B. Yes larger alternator and larger radiator and engine automatically comes on and takes the place of an generator when batteries reach a certain level. The coach motor is quieter than these small generators. I have a new towable being delivered in Jan 2021. I will be using a small 2200 Generator. This model is only 19ft with a slide- out and comes with the Coleman Mach 10 15KBtu and 12V fridge. Living in South Florida and dry camping means A/C 98% of the time. Dry camping here also means neighbors in our state parks that have no electrical or sewer but some have water. And many are slotted as if a normal camp site. Meaning you have neighbors and no generator to run at night due to noise. So I'm thinking going full Lithium, with large inverter and capturing power source to reboot my charge through my tow vehicle "1500 Pickup" One side of this is easy. But getting power from my tow vehicle is the tricky part? Yes this will be pricey...lol I'm looking at 6 lithium's minimum and Hybrid inverter. And heat warmers for batteries since i plan to winter camp in Northern States. I have yet to see anyone do this with a Tow vehicle?
I think this was a great video and it will work if you have enough wattage coming from your solar panel to run your air conditioner and simultaneously add a good little charge to your batteries, you should be able to run your air conditioner from 10 a.m. maybe to 5 pm then the air conditioner has turn off because the sun is getting too low.
But if is done right you should be able to end the day with a full battery with enough solar generation on your rooftop and sunlight of course.
I'm working on that it as i speak now, my roof regenerate me 1480 w of DC power from my solar panel.
So I should have plenty of power run my AC and keep my battery topped off throughout the whole sunlight hours.
Yeah if you had 1500 to 2KW of solar than it should work. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
I have a class a rv with 960 watts of solar, 600 ah of lithium, and a 3000 watt inverter. I have three rooftop AC units, and all three are needed to cool my 40' MH in really hot weather. I like the plan to start early, when the temp in lower and not wait until the space is already hot to start the cooling attempt. I could run my 10,000 watt generator in a pinch, but I hate the noise it makes, and the fuel it consumes would be unsustainable. One could start with the batteries, and then, when the bat bank reaches a certain draw down point (50% or 40%), have the generator fire up automatically. It also seems that the best solution would to match the solar production to the AC demand as close as is possible. A set of portable panels could be deployed when this is attempted, using the on-board equipment. I think my rig is really too large for this to work though. Better to have a one AC sized rig. Great video. It makes me think about what is possible....many thanks. If the panels are in the sun and the rig is in the shade you would get the best out of both....
Great video! So if you had 4x 300w panels (residential but should fit on an RV) and assuming AC runs 50% of the time, you should be able to make it, right? (esp if cooler in the morning and if you set AC to 77*C)
I'd probably need a bit more. Probably 1500 to 2000 watts.
Hey Brian, good try but not enough storage or manufacture of electricity it seems.
What I’m interested in is the newer 12v A/C units. The ones I’ve seen are spendy but more manageable that A/C that designed for 110v.
Need a low surge 5000 btu window unit.Been running mine all summer.
Great. Good to know.
Perhaps this has already been mentioned, but if you adjust your comfort zone up 5 degrees and get used to it, you can get much more out of the system...
Yes. You're right. If it were just me, I'd go even higher :)
Clarke McGee running warmer temps usually requires lower humidity to be comfortable. Low humidity, often requires tight building construction, and dedicated dehumidification.
Tito, very good video as usual. If anyone is entertaining running a stock RV rooftop AC off of solar they are in for some major investment. A mini-split system is the best option and that still requires a decent amount of solar and batteries.
Seems to be the case. Thanks.
Your experiment was great! I truly appreciate the content. 👍👍👍
Glad you enjoyed it!
Excellent, informative video.
Glad you enjoyed it!
great video brian and well appreciated .
knowing the size of your set up is great -someday i’m probably going to have to do some math on weight and cubic inches needed to size out a coach. cost too of course ( all this is gentle suggestions for more info if y are so inclined😂).
your demeanor, humor and information are very high on my i’m impressed list.
be well😊
Thanks so much for the feedback Bruce. My setup is kind of in the middle of most boondocking setups out there so I though it might be a good benchmark.
RV with Tito DIY - yes indeed it certainly was a good episode
thank you
Who spends all day inside their van? I bought the smallest van i could find. When I need air conditioning it's usually for an hour or 2 at most.. at lunch, dinner or when it's too hot or raining. I simply run my very small 2.4L engine in idle with the AC blasting and the cab gets cold in 2 minutes. Everything I need came with the van... It consumes about .3 Gallons ($.70) per hour and I've seen no impact to the van (this is highly debated and debunked myth) but I hope I'm not wrong. Also, I don't drive much so this does not take away miles from my power-train warranty so i will get the full 5 years coverage and if ive not destroyed the van by then then it will last forever :) . Not having to drive back anywhere or pay for hotels or restaurants offers a much greater ROI than whatever damage this is doing and many mechanics including Scotty's Garage say is negligible in modern engines. Anyways.. I'm sure the cost of installing and maintaining a house A/C and power plant is far greater than the repairs I will need make by using the van this way. I'll roll the dice and keep an eye on my engine temp gauge.
Great video. A bit off subject but can you do a video on replacing the air filter for the cab heater and air conditioner. I get mice in there and I want to be able to change it myself. I know I have to remove the battery. I have a Tioga class C. Thank you
I realise that this video is over 2 years old but I will still post my RV setup and running an AC...just in-case it is useful for someone.
2.25Kw of solar, 800AH of lithium batteries, split cycle AC.
And the result is....I have the same issue that you found, the solar was going into running the AC thereby putting the battery capacity at a lower percentage the next day, followed by the next until I have to plug into an external power source to fully recharge again.
It is a bit more complicated than that though as the solar is putting in 1900+ watts during the peak solar charging of the day with the AC only using 800-900 watts of that and the rest being wasted after the batteries are 100% by 11am - 12 noon, but as it moves into late afternoon (4pm onwards) and the solar charging drops off, that is when the AC is using up the battery capacity.
However I do live in a part of Australia that is over 40 degrees Celsius during the day and only reaches a low of 27degrees Celsius at night, (It is now 11pm and the outside temp is 30 degrees Celsius) therefore the AC has to run 24/7 and has no time to shut off...keeping in mind that your test did not take into account other activities that happen in the RV including going in and out of the door during the day which will affect the AC run time vs idle time.
My solution - I am upgrading to 1200 AH of lithium batteries so that I can store some more of that wasted potential during the peak of the day, and my calculations show that I should then be able to run an AC 24/7 and use the RV without compromising on other activities that use power.
Good info. Thanks for sharing!
Tito lives in Canada!
Didn't know if people were aware of a co called Arctic Breeze they make a 12v ac for big trucks they pull 47 amps at 12 v dc it could be an option for someone who wants to add an ac to what they have, just a thought. Like your channel.
I can't find out price or where to buy them. Do you know?
74 degrees! We keep our house at 83 in the summer! Ceiling fans help a lot.
jdonalds2001 I’m guessing you live high altitude, or low humidity location...
@@SuperVstech very low humidity, usually under 10% daytime all summer
Existe algún AA para motorhome que sea inverter? gracias
De nada!
I run a Nomadic Cooling 8750 btu DC powered mini split on my 32’ RV. That unit pulls 48amp from batteries on high. I have 5 240w 46v solar panels and they just keep up with that power draw at peak sun times. So I do need to run a generator at the end of hot days...but not all day! At night it is cooler and the A/C unit draws more like 25Ah and cycles off so my 300 Ah of LiFePO batteries run it all night to keep bedroom cool.
Thanks for sharing your setup. I appreciate it. I didn't realize so many were using a mini split in their RVs. Now I know :)
Use a smaller inverter to minimize the idle power draw. Maybe 600W would even work. A lot of people say you can't run an inverter because it's not efficient, but mini-split ACs are almost 2x more efficient than most 12V AC systems. That means even with even if you lose 15% of the power to the inverter, you're still more efficient.
Thanks for your DC-DC converter video. I protect my RV alternator with one now.
I’m not a fan of generator noise. The DC-DC converter would be a good supplement to solar while running AC, but idling our big gas coach is still pretty noisy and stinky when stationary.
But our car is quiet and uses less fuel.
Do you think it’s possible to simply connect jumper cables between my car’s battery and the coach battery and use the coach’s preexisting DC-DC converter to protect the car alternator instead? In this scenario, the inverter pulls from the house batteries which pull from the coach chassis battery which pulls from the car battery which pulls from the car alternator. Might not be particularly efficient but ?
Great Video, thank you! Something to think about while I was watching this, I just want to keep the inside moderately cooled. 74 degrees is pretty cool where we live (AZ). I would guess that if the AC was set at 82 or 84 the batteries would have more chance to recover. I really like the idea of the soft start unit and will consider it for when I finally install my solar system. Right now I am looking at assembling a 400W system (2 x 200W panels), a controller that will accommodate up to 600W of panels, 2 group 27 batteries, and a 2K or 3K inverter. I would like to get input on what I am getting ready to do as well if someone wants to comment.
In order to run your air conditioning off of solar you need solar panels that will produce enough electricity to run a/c and recharge your batteries.
Figure that you need probably twice the solar power as the air conditioning draws.
Would be interesting to see what works :)
A/C with a BLDC compressor would be more efficient. It could cut about 200 Watts.
Heat reflecting coating or film on windows could help. Better isolation, air sealing and HRV could be needed.
On the production side, one may need to cover the entire roof with the most efficient panels on the market. Use a higher voltage system. And may even need to make panels tiltable or put a second array on a side of a vehicle.
Agreed. 2KW or more probably is what I've seen.
Plus twice the battery's to save the electricity in.
Thank you for you’re very thought out and informative video… I think I’ve watched just about everyone of them since I started down this RV path… What are your thoughts on replacing your current AC unit with a mini split ? Or just your thoughts on a mini split in general thanks again and looking forward to more videos