AZ PCC Championship: 10 Stages of Hotchkiss Universal!
Вставка
- Опубліковано 30 вер 2020
- / forgottenweapons
www.floatplane.com/channel/Fo...
Cool Forgotten Weapons merch! shop.bbtv.com/collections/forg...
Every year, the Rio Salado Sportsman's Club host's the Arizona PCC (Pistol-Caliber Carbine) Championships. I signed up initially planning to use my Calico carbine, but my travel schedule kept me form getting the gun in shape to use in time. Instead, I polled my Patrons to choose a replacement, and they picked the Hotchkiss Universal (it won overwhelmingly over all the more modern alternatives I offered). Note that this match does not allow machine guns, but my Hotchkiss is a semiauto model and thus suitable. Of course, if I was going to shoot a historic French carbine, I would need to pair it with French lizard camo, double-buckle ranger boots, and a kepi.
The match consisted of 10 stages, with round counts of 30-60 rounds each. They were generally split between a lot of close range (7 yards max) paper and steel and a small number of smaller steel targets at 100-200 yards. Unfortunately, the Hotchkiss sights are not adjustable, and mine does not shoot to point of aim. I needed to aim substantially low and left at range, and I would have substantial trouble hitting the long range targets in the match. The gun itself is quite accurate, but the sights made it difficult for me to exploit that mechanical accuracy.
There were 202 competitors in the match, of whom 2 did not shoot all the stages and 7 were disqualified for various reasons. Among the 193 people who completed the match, I placed 191st. Ha! Not quite dead last! In my division (Iron Sight), I was 6th of 7, but the 7th place guy was disqualified.
Next year, I hope to compete again, with an equally interesting historical gun - but one that I can properly zero. Thanks to my Patrons for the support and feedback!
Contact:
Forgotten Weapons
6281 N. Oracle #36270
Tucson, AZ 85740
Ian evaluated various PCCs and then went to the championship with the worst one. Gotta love the guy.
Those patreons are such jerks 🤣
That gun is a pile of junk !!!
@@tafino For the record, I voted for the Hotchkiss. The reason I and others did was that we support Ian so he can educate the public on vintage/unique firearms. Using a firearm within his work scope furthers that goal.
@@bobparson4424 Ian gave his supporters a choice. If he was not willing to use the Hotchkiss, he should not have put it on the list. As is, he did learn more about the gun, which furthers the purpose for which we support him. Anybody can go to store and buy the latest super weapon and try to boost his ego by showing that he is the next Rambo. This is not why his supporters invest their money in his efforts.
@@bobparson4424 how...at short range it seemed fine,i doubt a modern paratrooper would have fired at 500 metres with that gun,but for clearing out an apartment block full of terrorists as the modern day sas do it seems like a good choice
Pistol ammo: *more than a dollar a round*
Ian: "Time for a PCC competition."
Ammo is only that expensive if you waited until 2020 to buy some
Wait until you hear the price of 8mm Lebel.
Those who actually train need to always source more ammo...always. High prices are bad no matter what...what about the kid who just turned 18 and is now a patriot.
Got any 7.65 French long?
IF you can even find it.
I like the commentary during the match. It makes it more interesting to watch when I know more of what's going on, what you're thinking, and explaining what you encounter.
....couldn't agree more! 👍
Ian of the future commenting past Ian's actions and sometimes answering him ! Ianception !
I agree as well! The VO work really helps me to follow along.
Yes this works well and makes it more interesting.
6th @CFABN267
Ian: “My Calico is broken, but I want to shoot in the Arizona PCC State Championship in the worst way possible!”
Pareton Supporters: “Say no more!”
if the calico was working I bet it wouldn't have been as bad tbh
@@robinlaszlo If the calico was working it might have stopped working mid-match. Even worse.
The “chunk” sound of the barrel extending is so cool.
Yeah. It’s such a cool gun with such a cool system, it’s just a shame it’s terrible. :-)
To quote Julio Scoundrel: "It doesn't matter if you win or lose, as long as you look cool doing it.'
a man of stick figure culture, i see
If you look good you feel good.
I actually like the “director’s commentary” in this video 😂. Forgotten Weapons should do more full commentary videos.
I would love to see him, othias and bloke do a commentary on an action movie. They made that footage of ww1 gun manufacturer fun.
I agree
Sinistral Rifleman does commentary over his matches and stages like this as well
Bonne prestation et mention spéciale au cosplay du "légionnaire".
It's always interesting when Ian brings oddballs to actual gun competitions. AR15 and 1911 pros were like at the 1st day "Wtf is this guy doing?" but when he got recognition "Oh hey it's Ian trying out guns"
The real question is how many of those gun racers wanted to shoot Ian's weird stuff after the match.
@@ScottKenny1978 The even better question is how many had the nerve to run them through a stage.
That would test them!
Ian, dressed as Gun-Obi-wan, to the Calico "You were supposed to be the Chosen one! To win the Arizona PCC, not destroy it!"
Obi-gun?
You missed a "Obi-Gun Kenobi" pun :P
Don't you mean "Steyr-Hahn Gunobi"? If you have to pun, punhard
@@Uncommoner Steyr-Hahn Gunobi driving to a match in a Punhard armoured car perhaps?
Ref: "Are you ready?"
Ian: "Je suis prêt"
My french girlfriends' head pops around the corner from the kitchen: "Is he french?"
Ruben1994OL gun jesus stealing girls
Gun Jesus is a cunning linguist.
@@richieb7692 hahaha
No, but his firearms are, and that is all that matters in this world.
@@richieb7692
Oooo, baaad.
You look like someone unlocked you as an alternative skin lol
🤣 foreign legion edition
Hey if I ever make a shooter you best know Ian will be a character
#putIanonRainbow6Siege
@@rodrigogascagomez5190 give him all weird old French guns 😆
@@rodrigogascagomez5190 if he is gonna be on RS6 it's gonna be a sureball that Ian is gonna be on the GIGN team question is what is his role?😂
Can't wait to see Ian rocking the
Zip 22 in the handgun competition.
And completing all stages within 24h.
really liked the "talk over" commentary of each stage !! Like that better than commentary after or before the stage footage
I like post stage/match commentary when it's Ian and others and they compare their experiences.
Id love to have both if possible
@@kevinsullivan3448 they're insightful as they're just out of the oven, so to speak, happening after the event and with fresh feelings about how the different stages went for them. Ideally I'd like them more too...
But the usual shooting going on in the back (unsurprising given the environment they're recording in) is really annoying and in some videos gets to the level of being obnoxious. I'd like that style of commentary but in a more calm environment without so much shooting going on. At least the final conclussions as the commentary between stages obviously has to be done on spot. But the final thoughts they maybe should record after the event in a more collected environment free of so much noise.
But as it is and as they usually do them, I'd rather have this. Isn't as fresh as the immediate commentary after the event, but at least I don't find myself trying hard to understand what they're saying over the ongoing shooting havoc that usually goes on in those videos all the time.
@@ramjb I concur about the background shooting in many of their commentary rolls.
In a perfect world we would get the voice over for each shooting segment for each shooter, then the group discussion at the end. Maybe they could go somewhere a bit more removed from the range, but there might not be anywhere within a few miles of the range to go to.
Love to have seen the look on the competition officials faces when Ian showed up with this gun. wearing his French hat lol.
"Ian, what in the hell is that?"
"Hotchkiss Universal"
"Doesn't it shoot 7.65 Longue?"
"Yes."
"Where in the hell did you find ammo for it?!?"
If the gun community in AZ doesn't know Ian by now, they never will.
@@ScottKenny1978 Some time previously
"Ians coming"
"I wander what monstrosity he will bring with him today"
Went through 500 rounds of ammo in these times? Truly a move only gun jesus himself could pull off.
He turned a box of fifty into a case of 500
He turned water into Winchester white box
Allan Singer this comment deserves more upvotes than I can deliver
Karl was actually wearing Paul Harrell's Coat of Unlimited Ammo and Ian just kept reaching into the pocket off camera and pulling out more boxes.
I think the thing is he didn't buy the ammo during these times. Someone like him would obviously buy them by the 5, 000 when they are cheap.
I love the “technically I’m not wearing a belt” response, it’s the previous step to “I’m not wearing any pants!”.
Ahh! The Weinstein defense!!! 🤔😁
-A perfect opportunity to use the MP5
-PATRON OVERLORDS: Hahahaha....the Hotchkiss. Now go, amuse us!
all those calico torture tests and the damn thing breaks down when you need it hahaha
Sometimes you just have to go for fun! I really enjoyed the color commentary during the stage.
The 'bazooka' /tank prop was way cool!
Kudos to your cameraman; getting good footage safely at a crowded event had to be challenging.
I remember that gun, if you fold it the wrong way it turns into Megatron.
"Shut up Megatron and let me shoot!"
You mean the right way.
@@zemylaYou Decepticon!
Ha! On a side note, what would it take to have Ian do a tabletop review of a gen 1 Megatron toy? It'll make a great April fools day video.
@@TheJohnflyboytay Love it! Maybe he can explain the mechanics of how the scope becomes a canon. That part always confused me it would be nice if he could clear that up.
10:05 It wasn't just you, Ian. I wasn't sure what was going on either. It sounded like he said "time" (probably easier for me to hear than it was for you wearing ear plugs) but there was no beep. Then he started repeating "time, time, time" and I was like where's the beep? They need to address that for next year's shoot. Other than that, this was really fun to watch. 👍
Hotchkiss Universal: " I am your father!"
Keltec Sub2k: " Noooooo!"
When Ian gets his cameo in John Wick 4, JW needs a hotchkiss for ultimate memery
My money says Karl will start putting Irish Stars in 2-gun
Extra misery!
The unfolding was sick to watch!
That "Irish spinner" is basically a double pendulum ... the movement is going to be chaotic (like mathematically unpredictable) in some situations ... really awesome.
Thank you for suffering through this match with the Hotchkiss, I don't think there will ever be a better opportunity to showcase why it was only briefly adopted. A treat to see this historical firearm in use, "warts and all".
Man, imagine if the Calico had worked for this!
They would just ad a cylinder somwere calicos are so darn ugly
he would only need to reload inbetween stages 😆
Yeah, real shame that the Calico didn't want to play. Would have been fun.
I do wonder how Ian would’ve dressed if he was able to use the Calico. 80s action hero?
its unfortunate you couldnt use the Calico with the 100 round drum :(
The voice over was great. Worth the extra time that it took to do it. Fun to watch you having fun !!
Points for style should have been included.
I love the match videos. It’s a better way to show strengths and weaknesses than a flat shooting gallery. I liked the commentary bc it’s insight into what’s going on for a given situation. All the tryhards using optimal gear remind me of playing video games with randoms using only the most overpowered gear. I like seeing someone have fun, not gas pedal sweat high score 24/7. I liked how the stage plan was just flow with it, that highlighted what the Hotchkiss did well.
In case anyone is wondering, the helicopter at 13:20 is a Piasecki HUP Retriever, designated H-25 Army Mule in US Army service. It was adopted in 1949 and used until 1958 by the US Army, though remained in service with the USN until 1964. Besides being operated by the US, it was operated by the Royal Canadian Navy and the French Navy, where it remained in service until 1964 and 1965 respectively.
The helicopter was the result of a competition ordered in 1945, and competed against the Sikorsky XHJS-1, which was a development of the earlier Sikorsky H-5, scaled up to match the design requirements of the competition. The XHJS-1 lost due to being a relatively poor design, decent enough as the H-5 but the problems of the design became apparent when scaled up. It was the first helicopter in US service to use an overlapping tandem rotor arrangement, a design that would prove very stable and reliable for later US helicopter developments, feeding into later designs such as the Piasecki H-21 (H-21 Workhorse, later Shawnee, in US Army service), the Boeing-Vertol CH-46 Sea Knight and Boeing CH-47 Chinook, a very iconic helicopter.
This is the perfect gun for one of the older James Bond movies.
Really like the commentary track, keep doing that!
Thank you Ian and Thank you Pàterons. Very cool choice
That gun unfolds like a transformer in action.
Kel-tec in the corner taking notes.
Reminds me of how some of the Cassette toys worked...
The commentary was actually really helpful and made it much more interesting. I wouldn't mind having it on more of these videos
Bonjour forgotten weapon super chaine ne change pas et ca plaisir de voire un americain autant aimer les armes francaise super video respect a toi!
Hey Ian, these competition videos are some of my favorite videos you do and i appreciate you uploading them and i am looking forward to more. I was curious, what is that ear pro you are wearing? Thank You -Jeremy
@UCLvR-cJpKNcYamOLIItdAyw and with a stolen avatar
Enjoyed this match video. Think the voice-over added to your presentation. Interesting weapon choice. Was there an Elbonian influencer consulted?
I wished he shot it with the Calico. Thing is if the round count is that high he'd have to load full 100 round mags between stages and there was some still unidentified maybe feed-malfunction (?) during the last reliability test.
What an interesting time! I believe the helicopter fuselage is from a Piasecki H-21 Shawnee. Also known as the "Flying Banana".
Regards,
L
Can you do more of this voice over stuff with your match shooting i find it a lot more enjoyable
This is how Sinistral Rifleman does it. I think people are starting to realize that a 15 min video of muffled voices and muzzle blasts gets boring.
Your commentary was really helpful and made the match a lot more interesting to watch!
When you unfold the gun that is the coolest thing I have ever seen
As always, thanks for bringing me the videos I didn't know I needed.
Aww I read that as Hotchkiss cannon. I got really excited to see you run a match with that!
I would love to see the pistol that handles that cartridge xD
This may get buried, but it's worth a shot: Ian, if you get a chance you should try and find a converted Mosin biathlon rifle. They used their own cartridge, which was a 7.62x54mmR but necked down to 6.5mm. The USSR used the converted Mosins along with Vostok brand rifles in biathlon competition in the 1960's and 1970's.
Sounds like maybe it would ballistically be a 6.5*57 ish?
Damn these competitions look so fun. Want to try this one day.
Also I enjoy the commentary. It's nice knowing what you're doing and shooting.
I really like the voiceover and hope it potentially returns in the future. Great vid as always
I love your channel a great deal Ian. I consider myself a gun nut and delve into the history of them but I always learn something watching your Channel. Just wanted to say as a fan who has watched for years you do a great job! Thank you for the years of fantastic content!
Thank you for starting some stages by unfolding it.
Was super fun shooting with you Ian and seeing this very interesting PCC. Thanks for bringing it.
Is bracing the magwell against a wall or something causing malfunctions a problem with all SMGs that have foldable magazine or only on the Hotchkiss Universal?
Never seen it happen with another gun before. I'm not sure exactly what caused it here.
Holding the mag well is ok but never hold the mag eve n. Mp7s jam if the mag gets knocked
Overrotation of the magwell changing feed angle and causing rounds to nosedive into the feedramp?
Not involving a folding magwell, but I've seen something similar with my CMMG 9mm radial-delay PCC using Glock magazines. I would get occasional FTF with two of five magazines, both the same model Glock factory 24-rounders. On the left side of the magazine, there's a tiny bump on the outside of the magazine (not shared by the two different models of my other magazines); I shaved off the little bump on both, and the magazines have since performed perfectly. Not sure what was going on, but it's fine now...
Always taught in British Army never to hold the mag on Stirling SMG but every film I've ever seen with a Stirling( or Sten ) in the actor is always holding the mag!
The voice over was great, I appreciate it
I like the post match commentary.
That was fun as hell. While it may not have been totally competitive (against tricked-out modern rifles shot by elite competition shooters,) it performed admirably. You handled the stages very well for the amount of planning that you put into this. I'd say with an electronic sight you would have been in the middle of the pack.
This was the perfect pcc for this match, there WAS a helicopter, after all... 😅
7:50
Cowabunga it is !
The voiceover is great... Much better than just shooting without it. Keep it up.
It makes me happy to see Ian having fun on a course again. I've seen too many videos where Ian uses a bad gun on a course and has a bad time.
I always appreciate the efforts you put in. Not only in information, but in costume as well. I'm guessing that hat wasn't the coolest (as in cold) choice you could have gone for. 💖💖👏🏼👏🏼
Great practical application, and kudos to Ian for his stamina
Voice over commentary was a great addition to a competition video
Shooting Course w/ Commentary is great great content. Would love to see more of this.
I love the commentary...!! Makes it better... 👍🏼💪🏼💪🏼
The commentary is a very nice touch.
Good job patrons! This is so cool to see oddball stuff like this get put through the paces. However poorly it may go, though I guess that's easy to say from this side of the computer screen!
Commentary during the shooting footage is a lot more interesting than just the shooting footage.
The voice over was a good idea for this match. Well done 👍
Thank you Ian!
Thank you , Ian .
You may have had your reservations, but seriously, it helps to see what arms are like when practically applied. I figured the grip would be more difficult to work with and hadn't thought resting on the barricades would be a problem.
for what its worth i enjoy the commentary
I really like the voiceover commentary !
For the record, I voted against the Hotchkiss.
@Beth Schroeder The H&K. It was the only one with enough votes to stand a chance of dethroning the Hotchkiss.
This channel never fails of entertainment. Great gun sports.
A bad day at the range has got to be better than the best day at work!
One exception, if one has your gig. You are very lucky. I take that back. It's not luck but very hard work on your part and you've earned it.
May your God bless you. John Moses Browning maybe?
That was a really cool match! Nice job
Nice. Like the voice over narration.
Love the bullet holes in the safe area. Cof looked interesting/fun!
Love watching that Hotchkiss unfold. It's just so satisfying.
I like the voice over
the unfolding action looks really cool
0:53 That just might be the coolest thing I have ever seen.
Pretty cool ian that looked super fun
Lets all appreciate how Ian always has the DRIP. My man looking like a snack in those tactical suspenders
@Beth Schroeder keep dreaming, larper
these targets and stages are REALLY awesome!
I enjoyed watching Ian unfold the gun like a butterfly knife.
Ian needs to put the Kel-tec and Hi-Point carbines through the same course. The gun snobs poo-poo these guns, but they are affordable for the peasants and they still go BANG when you pull the trigger. Knowing just how rugged/reliable these "PCCs for the people" really are would be appreciated by many fans.
That chunk of helicopter seems to be a piece of Piasecki HUP Retriever which went out of service in the mid- 60s. That's a pretty rare beast.
Thanks Ian!
Superbe! Fantastic, Ian. Viola. Love the pants.
I need to pay attention to the Patreon more. I won't let them do this to you Ian.
In a way Ian did this to himself by including the Hotchkiss on the list of choices. And it was appropriate that he did include it as using it in the competition further advanced the efforts for which he is given support. He was able to further understand the gun's good and bad features and how the gun stacks up to current technology. Anybody can use the latest technotoy in an attempt to show off. It is badass to try to see how old school really performs without having their ego getting in the way through fear of failure.
Great video! Ian is always outfit authentic. I would probably show up wearing cargo shorts, bouncers, sleeveless tee, pouches hanging off my GI belt and suspenders, and most importantly my PTSD dog and cane of course. Thank you so very much...
May not have won, but golly that was cool! Ian, thank you for entertaining us.
Those orange flasher targets are a really clever design.
I loved everything about this
Right then, next IPSC match, time to show up in semi-period attire, reload only when dry, and use a foreign PCC for the lulz.