Thanks Dave for speaking a rarely talked about truth about people with disabilities & their relationships to the people who support them. I grew too close to a couple of female workers, when they bailed when things got difficult it floored me because I come from a broken family already & suffer from chronic loneliness & isolation from my friends that leads to me to be seeking the godamn support in the first place.
I have a disability myself and a ton of mental health issues and internalized ableism. I quit being a disability support worker because I realized that the disability community is my community and I want genuine relationships with the people, not paid ones. It just didn't feel right being in such a position of power over people I view as peers. I'm so glad I made that decision. I wouldn't be where I am today without the support and companionship of my fellow people. I've found my voice and purpose as a disability self-advocate and an ally to disability workers :)
Smart choice or you can make your organisation where friendship is part of disability process. In Germany it develops love and marriages. I guess western world needs more love not a business transaction.
This is true for any client!! As a health educator, I had to continuously emphasize to patients that I was there to empower and support them. Nothing more, nothing less. Sadly, the clinical team that I worked with thought I shouldn't have reinforced healthy boundaries with clients. Maintain your professional boundaries in healthy ways. Not doing so has thr potential to backfire and cause unnecessary stress.
Well, I found this video because my job makes us watch these. Our lady is like family and will definitely protect her as such. The last person I worked w9th , I told her I couldn't work with her anymore because she was moving. Eveytime I see her, I give her hug and ask how is she doing because she knows I will always care about her but I can't work with her anymore.
I found this video while searching for info on boundaries ‘as i am a client’ ... this is a very good video .... i have a slightly different problem... my support worker is crossing boundaries.. & i am trying to stop them... i dont want their friendship & they are getting upset because my boundaries are there & im trying to keep that distance.. .. i have trouble communicating this & not wanting the human element ruining the functional aspect of their support of me ... its ‘their’ emotions that im trying not to hurt at the same time aiming to be civil & assertive .. its not nice to see a grown adult support worker being upset, moody & passive aggressive when i don’t reciprocate ‘friendships vibes’ ... i have to manoeuvre life in general.. & now im also trying to manoeuvre around my support worker disclosure of her personal life or opinions constantly... i know that i am a calm & gentle understanding soul .. but i didn’t want to partake in this added burden... .. i don’t want that syrup & I’m about to cut contact with this person & i know she isn’t going to take it well .... this is a repeat issue for me & my other support worker is also taking my kindness for friendship at a lesser degree .. i seem to get people telling me all of their personal life problems ... i am not their therapist/councillor 🤦♀️.. but it seems this way
My clients always get in to deeper conversations with me. But I never get into deeper concersations with them. My statement has different meanings but This is the my example of setting the boundaries. My clients are my priority❤️. and tbh, I have beautiful friendships with all of them and I accept it as my clients way of friendship😊
I can relate so well! I have support workers for me being autistic, and also cause I have mobility issues. They are drained af and I understand, the are all reaching burnout, and I become their emotional support, and dare I can't provide it, and I need help, they snap!! I changed so many agencies and this always happens and now I can't change again. I try to be assertive at first meeting to show my boundaries from the 1st meeting, yet this dynamic sneaks in all the time. I am dependent on their help. And they know it. I don't feel save in my own home anymore.
This has always ALWAYS been the culture, but it is not so simple as this!!! We are CAREGIVERS. We are PAID to CARE. Clients aside, we genuinely do care. We love. We spend more time with clients than our own friends and family. These feelings, these relationships, are real for us too. We grieve too. I know I do, even years after I have to leave. I know caregivers who stay BECAUSE the client had no family. Who buy Christmas and birthday presents and throw parties, spend the holidays with them, because no one else would. They become family. I know, how taboo, how "inappropriate!" I firmly believe the culture needs to change. Not to encourage or teach what I describe, but to honor and recognize those feelings, the stark realities of these rules and laws that say NOTHING of the impact and real experiences we've all had. It's so easy to say "paid supports don't get attached." Yes, we do. And I'll never stop. Sometimes, we have to care more than others. Sometimes, we care against the rules. I always say, in these infuriating trainings we all sit through, that I may not be allowed to say, "I love you." But I can say, "I love working with you. I love coming to work and hanging out with you. This job means the world to me." And it does. We do this work because we love it. How can that be wrong.
For strong workers like you with 30 year marriages & healthy happy kids & grandkids & deep, wide, rich support networks who can manage to do so much emotional work overtime because they are very well supported in their own lives, yes they do this & can do this. But for a young, inexperienced, worker who has issues with their small family of origin, who has their own boundary issues, or issues with their own mental health ➡️ which has given them the drive to do this caring work? That’s a disaster. I had an employment support worker who put her clients needs above her own relationship to her family, & talked to them late into the night. She disclosed her mental health conditions to me, probably exacerbated by her terrible boundaries with her clients. She said this to demonstrate how much she “loved” her clients - it just made me uncomfortable. Clients can take and take and take from workers because they have no one else in their lives. & The workers with terrible boundaries are often driven by a “need” to “feel loved” based on their own difficult experiences, which is not their clients’ responsibility. The client is there to get help from their worker, not the other way around. It can be a very fine line.
We should work in a friendly manner and distinguish this from being friends. Our role however should include supporting people to go to the places they will find real friends and assiting people with the skills to establish and maintain those friendships.
It is really difficlut to work with anyone and not develop a relationship. Depending on the individual, it can be very hard or impossible to explain to them that you're a paid staff to be with them. These blurred lines also make it difficult for people to get paid a livable wage because people don't take the field serious enough. They feel that you're getting paid to hang out with your friends.The only way you can make a good living is working overtime. It is very common to see people working 14 hour days 6 days a week.
I would rather friendship over payment what if the support worker is attractive what if that worker becomes attracted to you?. I guess it's all about fate.
I disagree! I have a physical disability and use a communication device, I am very lucky to have a busy life. I have some excellent friends, but for people who have behaviors, nonverbal, or don't get out of the place that they are living the community aides need to be their friend just like someone who is living in a nurseing home the nurses are their friends. I am lucky enough to have many of my former school team members as my friends. When I was still in school, were we friends? No because they were adults and I was a child and teenager then.
It's not a lie...it's policies which are preventing the pissibilitiy if creating continued networks in a safe way for these people. I would live to maintain contact and supports. As support workers we also get cut off! Doesn't seem right
Pardon me I understand what you're saying, but there are instances in which a support worker can also develop a friendship. I'm a guy with CP, so my speech is affected. I've even done things to my own family in order to get care, and because of that, everyone in the community thinks I'm stupid. This video and the other one on UA-cam encourage emotional abuse, but since I recently helped someone close to me get out of a really difficult situation, I don't think I'll be treated that way.
It's generally not support workers then. Where I am we call that Carers as opposed to support workers. SW is that paid hourly role, and really quite different!
This is NOT the way. It makes us feel worthless and only there for their paycheck. Treat us like everybody else. Maybe we will become friends maybe we won't. To disregard that from the start demeans us to an object purely there so they can have a job. 😠
In the module Dave explains that not being friends does not mean you cannot be friendly. As Dave says in the video when you discover that someone is lonely that is where you start i.e. your job is to help forge connections and friendships.
EXACTLY! Just like ANY job sometimes you become friends, sometimes you don't. To rule this out from the beginning just makes us objects without feelings. "Better to have loved and lost than never loved at all". Often in life we develop deep feelings in one way or another KNOWING it's maybe temporary a great example is our pets, we love them and then they die. Doesn't mean we don't even begin that close bond in case they leave! This video and concept is nonsense its all about perspective, choice and control and BOTH/ ALL parties choice regarding the relationship boundaries.
@@maidment1 not so, it's about not lying to clients and not disrespecting their boundaries. Some people don't know how to help someone in a professional way, and instantly become over involved, with no intention of honest, unpaid friendship. As Dave says, when you leave it's devastating to just dump that person because you are not being paid to be there any more. Real people are friendly and remain professional without needing to actually be friends. Friendship may develop over time.
That is not always true and pretty offensive. I am my son's coach. He knows when I am coaching and he knows when I am Mom. I challenge anyone to shadow me on my work days with my son and tell me that they would put in the amount of work I do in order for him to be successful.
@@sharonhobbs4144 There is that ideology, not all people with Disabilities know right from wrong. In my view, people with Disabilities should be treated as equal as any other Human being, People look at people as having a mind of a 5 year old child and they look like aren't normal those type of people can be just mean, when I tell people that I have a Disability they say to me, Sam you don't look like you have a Disability. That part is true, they see on the outside that I don't have a Disability, but it's not on the outside it's on the inside. I have been in that world myself. I've struggled with a lot of things and being in the environment some don't see how smart I can actually be, they say I have a low IQ. But an IQ is just an imperfect tool to measure for Intelligence, it doesn't measure Wisdom. So to answer your question, not all staff see clients as paycheck. But some really do care and they do see them as an equal. But there are some who don't, it just takes the right people to see that. I hope that answers your question.
People are just very angry.... you just showed them a mirror. As a young person in care staff told me they cared and loved me and wanted the best for me.... but they were there for the money. They were there because it made them feel better Bout themselves. Bullshit. And I called them all on their bullshit. They were just trying to have an easy shift.
Thanks Dave for speaking a rarely talked about truth about people with disabilities & their relationships to the people who support them. I grew too close to a couple of female workers, when they bailed when things got difficult it floored me because I come from a broken family already & suffer from chronic loneliness & isolation from my friends that leads to me to be seeking the godamn support in the first place.
I have a disability myself and a ton of mental health issues and internalized ableism. I quit being a disability support worker because I realized that the disability community is my community and I want genuine relationships with the people, not paid ones. It just didn't feel right being in such a position of power over people I view as peers. I'm so glad I made that decision. I wouldn't be where I am today without the support and companionship of my fellow people. I've found my voice and purpose as a disability self-advocate and an ally to disability workers :)
Way to go!! We do need advocacy/self advocacy.
Love this!
It is possible to be both.
Smart choice or you can make your organisation where friendship is part of disability process. In Germany it develops love and marriages. I guess western world needs more love not a business transaction.
I’m Germany support workers fall in love with & marry their clients? That’s quite a few kinds of wrong.
LOVE especially the question at the end
This is true for any client!! As a health educator, I had to continuously emphasize to patients that I was there to empower and support them. Nothing more, nothing less. Sadly, the clinical team that I worked with thought I shouldn't have reinforced healthy boundaries with clients.
Maintain your professional boundaries in healthy ways. Not doing so has thr potential to backfire and cause unnecessary stress.
Powerful words 100%True and to the point.
Well, I found this video because my job makes us watch these. Our lady is like family and will definitely protect her as such. The last person I worked w9th , I told her I couldn't work with her anymore because she was moving. Eveytime I see her, I give her hug and ask how is she doing because she knows I will always care about her but I can't work with her anymore.
I found this video while searching for info on boundaries ‘as i am a client’ ... this is a very good video .... i have a slightly different problem... my support worker is crossing boundaries.. & i am trying to stop them... i dont want their friendship & they are getting upset because my boundaries are there & im trying to keep that distance.. .. i have trouble communicating this & not wanting the human element ruining the functional aspect of their support of me ... its ‘their’ emotions that im trying not to hurt at the same time aiming to be civil & assertive .. its not nice to see a grown adult support worker being upset, moody & passive aggressive when i don’t reciprocate ‘friendships vibes’ ... i have to manoeuvre life in general.. & now im also trying to manoeuvre around my support worker disclosure of her personal life or opinions constantly... i know that i am a calm & gentle understanding soul .. but i didn’t want to partake in this added burden... .. i don’t want that syrup & I’m about to cut contact with this person & i know she isn’t going to take it well .... this is a repeat issue for me & my other support worker is also taking my kindness for friendship at a lesser degree .. i seem to get people telling me all of their personal life problems ... i am not their therapist/councillor 🤦♀️.. but it seems this way
Sorry to hear that. I hope you can find a new person soon.
My clients always get in to deeper conversations with me. But I never get into deeper concersations with them. My statement has different meanings but This is the my example of setting the boundaries. My clients are my priority❤️. and tbh, I have beautiful friendships with all of them and I accept it as my clients way of friendship😊
@@anjalisahni4130 that sounds good 👍 😊
Isn't this video good? I'm going to share with new support workers. We have brilliant long term ones who don't struggle with this but new staff can.
I can relate so well! I have support workers for me being autistic, and also cause I have mobility issues. They are drained af and I understand, the are all reaching burnout, and I become their emotional support, and dare I can't provide it, and I need help, they snap!! I changed so many agencies and this always happens and now I can't change again. I try to be assertive at first meeting to show my boundaries from the 1st meeting, yet this dynamic sneaks in all the time. I am dependent on their help. And they know it. I don't feel save in my own home anymore.
This has always ALWAYS been the culture, but it is not so simple as this!!!
We are CAREGIVERS. We are PAID to CARE. Clients aside, we genuinely do care. We love. We spend more time with clients than our own friends and family. These feelings, these relationships, are real for us too. We grieve too. I know I do, even years after I have to leave.
I know caregivers who stay BECAUSE the client had no family. Who buy Christmas and birthday presents and throw parties, spend the holidays with them, because no one else would. They become family.
I know, how taboo, how "inappropriate!"
I firmly believe the culture needs to change. Not to encourage or teach what I describe, but to honor and recognize those feelings, the stark realities of these rules and laws that say NOTHING of the impact and real experiences we've all had. It's so easy to say "paid supports don't get attached."
Yes, we do. And I'll never stop. Sometimes, we have to care more than others. Sometimes, we care against the rules.
I always say, in these infuriating trainings we all sit through, that I may not be allowed to say, "I love you." But I can say, "I love working with you. I love coming to work and hanging out with you. This job means the world to me."
And it does. We do this work because we love it. How can that be wrong.
For strong workers like you with 30 year marriages & healthy happy kids & grandkids & deep, wide, rich support networks who can manage to do so much emotional work overtime because they are very well supported in their own lives, yes they do this & can do this.
But for a young, inexperienced, worker who has issues with their small family of origin, who has their own boundary issues, or issues with their own mental health ➡️ which has given them the drive to do this caring work?
That’s a disaster.
I had an employment support worker who put her clients needs above her own relationship to her family, & talked to them late into the night.
She disclosed her mental health conditions to me, probably exacerbated by her terrible boundaries with her clients.
She said this to demonstrate how much she “loved” her clients - it just made me uncomfortable.
Clients can take and take and take from workers because they have no one else in their lives.
& The workers with terrible boundaries are often driven by a “need” to “feel loved” based on their own difficult experiences, which is not their clients’ responsibility. The client is there to get help from their worker, not the other way around.
It can be a very fine line.
Such a powerful message
That's where you start . . . truth.
its not just the support workers its the plan managers as well, leave when the going get tough~
Powerful
How Powerful
100% true.
We should work in a friendly manner and distinguish this from being friends. Our role however should include supporting people to go to the places they will find real friends and assiting people with the skills to establish and maintain those friendships.
It is really difficlut to work with anyone and not develop a relationship. Depending on the individual, it can be very hard or impossible to explain to them that you're a paid staff to be with them. These blurred lines also make it difficult for people to get paid a livable wage because people don't take the field serious enough. They feel that you're getting paid to hang out with your friends.The only way you can make a good living is working overtime. It is very common to see people working 14 hour days 6 days a week.
I would rather friendship over payment what if the support worker is attractive what if that worker becomes attracted to you?. I guess it's all about fate.
Wow!
I disagree! I have a physical disability and use a communication device, I am very lucky to have a busy life. I have some excellent friends, but for people who have behaviors, nonverbal, or don't get out of the place that they are living the community aides need to be their friend just like someone who is living in a nurseing home the nurses are their friends. I am lucky enough to have many of my former school team members as my friends. When I was still in school, were we friends? No because they were adults and I was a child and teenager then.
I will stay with my guy his whole life. He is devastated if I take one day off. 😂
It's not a lie...it's policies which are preventing the pissibilitiy if creating continued networks in a safe way for these people. I would live to maintain contact and supports. As support workers we also get cut off! Doesn't seem right
Time to create my own organisation which allows friendships to happen with clients. I'm a lefty vegan hippie I'm all about spreading the love.
Pardon me I understand what you're saying, but there are instances in which a support worker can also develop a friendship. I'm a guy with CP, so my speech is affected. I've even done things to my own family in order to get care, and because of that, everyone in the community thinks I'm stupid. This video and the other one on UA-cam encourage emotional abuse, but since I recently helped someone close to me get out of a really difficult situation, I don't think I'll be treated that way.
What happened if parents get paid to get to take care of their own kids
It's generally not support workers then. Where I am we call that Carers as opposed to support workers. SW is that paid hourly role, and really quite different!
This is NOT the way. It makes us feel worthless and only there for their paycheck. Treat us like everybody else. Maybe we will become friends maybe we won't. To disregard that from the start demeans us to an object purely there so they can have a job. 😠
In the module Dave explains that not being friends does not mean you cannot be friendly. As Dave says in the video when you discover that someone is lonely that is where you start i.e. your job is to help forge connections and friendships.
EXACTLY! Just like ANY job sometimes you become friends, sometimes you don't. To rule this out from the beginning just makes us objects without feelings. "Better to have loved and lost than never loved at all". Often in life we develop deep feelings in one way or another KNOWING it's maybe temporary a great example is our pets, we love them and then they die. Doesn't mean we don't even begin that close bond in case they leave! This video and concept is nonsense its all about perspective, choice and control and BOTH/ ALL parties choice regarding the relationship boundaries.
@@maidment1 not so, it's about not lying to clients and not disrespecting their boundaries.
Some people don't know how to help someone in a professional way, and instantly become over involved, with no intention of honest, unpaid friendship.
As Dave says, when you leave it's devastating to just dump that person because you are not being paid to be there any more.
Real people are friendly and remain professional without needing to actually be friends. Friendship may develop over time.
But your feelings are not our responsibilities. Just keep being friendly, but not payed friends ya know
Exactly that's not fair
Disabled people are like paychecks
That is not always true and pretty offensive. I am my son's coach. He knows when I am coaching and he knows when I am Mom. I challenge anyone to shadow me on my work days with my son and tell me that they would put in the amount of work I do in order for him to be successful.
I'm just sorry that something you see makes you feel that way.
Do you mean that a paycheck is all that some staff see in their clients? That clients aren't seem as equals?
@@sharonhobbs4144 There is that ideology, not all people with Disabilities know right from wrong. In my view, people with Disabilities should be treated as equal as any other Human being, People look at people as having a mind of a 5 year old child and they look like aren't normal those type of people can be just mean, when I tell people that I have a Disability they say to me, Sam you don't look like you have a Disability. That part is true, they see on the outside that I don't have a Disability, but it's not on the outside it's on the inside. I have been in that world myself. I've struggled with a lot of things and being in the environment some don't see how smart I can actually be, they say I have a low IQ. But an IQ is just an imperfect tool to measure for Intelligence, it doesn't measure Wisdom. So to answer your question, not all staff see clients as paycheck. But some really do care and they do see them as an equal. But there are some who don't, it just takes the right people to see that. I hope that answers your question.
People are just very angry.... you just showed them a mirror. As a young person in care staff told me they cared and loved me and wanted the best for me.... but they were there for the money. They were there because it made them feel better Bout themselves. Bullshit. And I called them all on their bullshit. They were just trying to have an easy shift.
Powerful
Thank you!