thanks for watching! have you ever edited an audition tape? should you do it? is it 'dishonest'? let me know what you think of editing an audition tape in the comments below!
What if I just want to edit the lighting and color grading of the tape? My camera just doesn't pick up colors great, so my tapes end up looking gray and muddy.
The short answer is yes, I edit. The long answer is, if I have so many opportunities to submit my best work, why would I choose to submit anything less than my best? To that end, I treat my "audition tape recording phase" as an audition in and of itself - my excerpts have already been completely scoured and performance ready. I've already chosen what room I'm going to use, I've already practiced in that room to know what spot has the best acoustics, I've chosen my reeds, I show up when I'm comfortable, and I record down my excerpt list 3 times, taking as much time as I need. I've also already chosen what setting on my microphone sounds best and what setting on GarageBand sounds best (because "natural" doesn't actually sound representative of my sound in a hall), and that right there is a form of editing. Nobody gets to do all of that on an actual live audition day. My thing is, if I can't get a good take in 3 tries, then whatever excerpt is hanging me up isn't good to go. At that point I'll give myself another week to look back, figure out what went wrong, and iron out the spots that I couldn't nail in the recording, and then do another session the next week. The final tape will be from my last recording session, where I'll just put together the best take of each excerpt in its entirety The process seems to work for me - I've gone from not making it past the tape round to actually getting invitations, so at least something is going right.
I have many thoughts about this topic. I recently recorded an audition video, and I remember feeling frustrated at the fact that it took me two and a half hours to record what will end up being less than six minutes of music. I was physically and mentally spent afterwards, and I was fussy with myself about which takes were the best, every little thing was important and my friend who was hitting play and stop also was very picky. While I feel that editing could improve my videos, I also think that there is no such thing as perfection. The word perfect is thrown around when people discuss how to win an orchestra job, but it doesn’t exist. I have seen professional concertmasters miss an entrance, for example. I like to think that a committee, while looking for a musician who performs at the highest level, is also looking for a musician that is human, and doesn’t perform like a programmed robot. I’d be interested in hearing your thoughts as well. Thank you for this video!
Agreed, I’ve found that replacing the word “perfection” with “consistency” was a much needed paradigm shift in my playing and career. Although, it is a paradox because the standards of the tape round are so high in many situations , that if you do have a missed note, or three out of tune notes in succession, they can cut you for that. However, I’d rather send in a tape with 2 wrong notes and was extremely musical, than a perfect tape that was bland, because in the end, the committee wants to hear music, a good sound, and maturity.
great points! in terms of perfection versus sounding like a robot, there’s a difference between playing something mathematically perfectly and playing something perfectly to your musical vision. can you perfectly craft the rubatos that you intend to play? can you perfectly adjust the tone note to note to follow your intended phrasing? don't let your worry of mathematical perfection and sounding inhuman prevent you from reaching towards musical perfection.
The risk with editing is that you won’t actually sound like you do on the tape on audition day and you’ll get cut. So you cut together 2 different tambourines for that one excerpt, cool. On audition day, are you going to be able to pick up that 2nd tambourine absolutely silently in those bars of rest? They might not KNOW you edited like that, but I’d want to know FOR ME that I can play just as well in a live audition as a recorded one. It’s a pride thing, I’d feel fake turning in something that’s not really me doing my best. That being said, I’ve corrected a note that I missed and added reverb and stuff (it was really bad and obviously edited af) for a summer festival tape once, but they never said I’d get disqualified for editing.🤷🏻♂️
Hey Rob just here for some content suggestions: for the next several videos, could you interview people who didn’t go to those big name school? Would love to hear how they manage to compete with people who graduated from the schools with high reputation and win the job.
good idea! you should check out a blog i did about this exact topic. www.robknopper.com/blog/2017/4/21/can-you-take-an-orchestra-audition-if-youre-too-old-too-busy-or-if-you-didnt-go-to-conservatory
How do you like to determine your dynamic levels when recording audition tapes? As a listener/judge for these do you listen over some computer speakers or something more like nice headphones? Also it would be cool if you gave a video about making your vlog videos and the recording steps and setups you use. Also thanks for providing a place for people to talk about niche topics like this!
for orchestra auditions especially, you should create the tape primarily to be played over a set of speakers because usually the committee is sitting in a room together listening to it. you should also test it coming out of all different types of audio output, which is sort of a mini-version of the concept of mastering. it doesn’t matter where they listen, but that it sounds right. with dynamic levels, you do want to hear the contrast between loud and soft excerpts, but you don't want to make them turn up the volume for something super soft and then get blown out when something loud happens. try to make it sound natural!
On the topic of recording the actual audio and video. You should always try to get a good engineer and play in a space that that you feel comfortable in and they know how to work in and make you sound good. If it's worth it to you to spend tens of thousands dollars to go to music school, it should be a no brainier to spend a hundred to have your best chance at getting live auditions at the schools you want to attend.
You need to define "edit" more closely. I would say that making multiple takes and choosing the best one is what most people do. Is that "editing?" I think that if you try to splice together 2 halves of the same excerpt, maybe at a point there there are a few bars of rests, then what would be actual editing and generally frowned upon. And most people would notice it when listening to a recording.
i spliced together two different takes of one excerpt in my met audition tape, which is what i consider editing. apparently they either didn't notice it, or it was good enough to get through.
thanks for watching! have you ever edited an audition tape? should you do it? is it 'dishonest'?
let me know what you think of editing an audition tape in the comments below!
I auditioned for Interlochen's summer program this year and recorded a scale dozens of times too 💀
What if I just want to edit the lighting and color grading of the tape? My camera just doesn't pick up colors great, so my tapes end up looking gray and muddy.
i would definitely work to make the colors better while still looking natural! you should totally explore that.
The short answer is yes, I edit. The long answer is, if I have so many opportunities to submit my best work, why would I choose to submit anything less than my best? To that end, I treat my "audition tape recording phase" as an audition in and of itself - my excerpts have already been completely scoured and performance ready. I've already chosen what room I'm going to use, I've already practiced in that room to know what spot has the best acoustics, I've chosen my reeds, I show up when I'm comfortable, and I record down my excerpt list 3 times, taking as much time as I need. I've also already chosen what setting on my microphone sounds best and what setting on GarageBand sounds best (because "natural" doesn't actually sound representative of my sound in a hall), and that right there is a form of editing. Nobody gets to do all of that on an actual live audition day. My thing is, if I can't get a good take in 3 tries, then whatever excerpt is hanging me up isn't good to go. At that point I'll give myself another week to look back, figure out what went wrong, and iron out the spots that I couldn't nail in the recording, and then do another session the next week. The final tape will be from my last recording session, where I'll just put together the best take of each excerpt in its entirety The process seems to work for me - I've gone from not making it past the tape round to actually getting invitations, so at least something is going right.
impressive! this is a template that others should follow.
I have many thoughts about this topic. I recently recorded an audition video, and I remember feeling frustrated at the fact that it took me two and a half hours to record what will end up being less than six minutes of music. I was physically and mentally spent afterwards, and I was fussy with myself about which takes were the best, every little thing was important and my friend who was hitting play and stop also was very picky. While I feel that editing could improve my videos, I also think that there is no such thing as perfection. The word perfect is thrown around when people discuss how to win an orchestra job, but it doesn’t exist. I have seen professional concertmasters miss an entrance, for example. I like to think that a committee, while looking for a musician who performs at the highest level, is also looking for a musician that is human, and doesn’t perform like a programmed robot. I’d be interested in hearing your thoughts as well. Thank you for this video!
Agreed, I’ve found that replacing the word “perfection” with “consistency” was a much needed paradigm shift in my playing and career. Although, it is a paradox because the standards of the tape round are so high in many situations , that if you do have a missed note, or three out of tune notes in succession, they can cut you for that. However, I’d rather send in a tape with 2 wrong notes and was extremely musical, than a perfect tape that was bland, because in the end, the committee wants to hear music, a good sound, and maturity.
great points! in terms of perfection versus sounding like a robot, there’s a difference between playing something mathematically perfectly and playing something perfectly to your musical vision. can you perfectly craft the rubatos that you intend to play? can you perfectly adjust the tone note to note to follow your intended phrasing? don't let your worry of mathematical perfection and sounding inhuman prevent you from reaching towards musical perfection.
The risk with editing is that you won’t actually sound like you do on the tape on audition day and you’ll get cut. So you cut together 2 different tambourines for that one excerpt, cool. On audition day, are you going to be able to pick up that 2nd tambourine absolutely silently in those bars of rest? They might not KNOW you edited like that, but I’d want to know FOR ME that I can play just as well in a live audition as a recorded one. It’s a pride thing, I’d feel fake turning in something that’s not really me doing my best. That being said, I’ve corrected a note that I missed and added reverb and stuff (it was really bad and obviously edited af) for a summer festival tape once, but they never said I’d get disqualified for editing.🤷🏻♂️
Hey Rob just here for some content suggestions: for the next several videos, could you interview people who didn’t go to those big name school? Would love to hear how they manage to compete with people who graduated from the schools with high reputation and win the job.
good idea! you should check out a blog i did about this exact topic. www.robknopper.com/blog/2017/4/21/can-you-take-an-orchestra-audition-if-youre-too-old-too-busy-or-if-you-didnt-go-to-conservatory
What are your thoughts on recording multi movement piece movement by movement and putting it together when the audition requirements state no editing?
what are _your_ thoughts?
How do you like to determine your dynamic levels when recording audition tapes? As a listener/judge for these do you listen over some computer speakers or something more like nice headphones? Also it would be cool if you gave a video about making your vlog videos and the recording steps and setups you use. Also thanks for providing a place for people to talk about niche topics like this!
for orchestra auditions especially, you should create the tape primarily to be played over a set of speakers because usually the committee is sitting in a room together listening to it. you should also test it coming out of all different types of audio output, which is sort of a mini-version of the concept of mastering. it doesn’t matter where they listen, but that it sounds right.
with dynamic levels, you do want to hear the contrast between loud and soft excerpts, but you don't want to make them turn up the volume for something super soft and then get blown out when something loud happens. try to make it sound natural!
On the topic of recording the actual audio and video. You should always try to get a good engineer and play in a space that that you feel comfortable in and they know how to work in and make you sound good. If it's worth it to you to spend tens of thousands dollars to go to music school, it should be a no brainier to spend a hundred to have your best chance at getting live auditions at the schools you want to attend.
totally agree!
You need to define "edit" more closely. I would say that making multiple takes and choosing the best one is what most people do. Is that "editing?" I think that if you try to splice together 2 halves of the same excerpt, maybe at a point there there are a few bars of rests, then what would be actual editing and generally frowned upon. And most people would notice it when listening to a recording.
i spliced together two different takes of one excerpt in my met audition tape, which is what i consider editing. apparently they either didn't notice it, or it was good enough to get through.
I was today years old when I realized the sound effect in your videos is the full orchestra hit in the Infernal Dance