Bishop Barron on "Will all be Saved?" w/ Ralph Martin
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- Опубліковано 15 вер 2024
- This clip was taken from a recent livestream with Ralph Martin. Watch the full interview here: • A Church in Crisis w/ ...
In this clip, Ralph talks about why, in his opinion, Bishop Barron sometimes gives the impression that "we're all going to heaven". Hint: it's all stems from Vatican II.
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Apologies for the original thumbnail. My team put that together and as soon as I saw the video live I asked them to change it, which they did immediately.
You're the man, Matt.
Wuduyumean I actually liked the original one better.
God bless you for the fraternal correction of your team. I saw the original thumbnail this morning - not sure how if you took it down 2 days ago (a UA-cam problem?). I seldom leave comments, but I was going to on that one. I was concerned that the reference to BB was unnecessary. It was provocative CLICKBAIT. I am glad that you saw fit to change it. For me, the cheap clickbait left a bad taste in my mouth after listening to the excellent talk with Ralph Martin. Even at 2-1/2 hours it is definitely worth a second listen.
@@JackFalltrades they replaced Bishop Barron with Dr. Ralph Martin in the thumbnail. Personally I thought the original was better from an artistic and UA-cam standpoint, but it's fine.
@@JackFalltrades no just the fact that he was in the thumbnail I think. I don't see the need for the change myself, but it is what it is.
As a gen Z Catholic convert, when Ralph began to talk about the failure of befriending the world, brought upon by Vatican 2 & various social movements, I began to get excited. He mentions bishops now recognizing the failure of this strategy I couldn’t help but shout “yes!” It’s time the Church stands in it’s whole beauty, not withholding any of the glory she brings to Christ!
As a part of gen z, I can confirm, the nice guy role certainly will not work with my generation. The Church should proclaim the gospels, boldly, & unapologetically.
AMEN!
@@778FraxK
And what is the truth? The Church of hundreds of years ago said that nobody but Catholic's will be saved. The Church of Vat II says that it is possible for people to be saved outside the Church. How can both teachings be harmonized with what Scripture says, that is the real question that should be answered?
@@778FraxK
I should have been more clear, I was referring specifically to the Papal Bull of Eugene IV (Council of Florence 1438-1445) when it says;
It firmly believes, professes, and proclaims that those not living within the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics cannot become participants in eternal life, but will depart “into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels” [Matt. 25:41], unless before the end of life the same have been added to the flock; and that the unity of the ecclesiastical body is so strong that only to those remaining in it are the sacraments of the Church of benefit for salvation, and do fastings, almsgiving, and other functions of piety and exercises of Christian service produce eternal reward, and that no one, whatever almsgiving he has practiced, even if he has shed blood for the name of Christ, can be saved, unless he has remained in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church.
I believe that even this seemingly harsh statement must be able to be reconciled with what Vat.II says. Possibly when it speaks of being "added to the flock before the end of life", it may at the very least, leave open the door for God to intervene in some mysterious way unknown to us, into the life of the one outside the Church, to reveal Christ and His Church to them, and allow them to either accept or reject Him at that point, even if it occurs as late as being at the moment of death.
" The Church should proclaim the gospels, boldly, & unapologetically."
The problem with that view is that it can lead catholics to go into simply telling "convert to Catholicism or you will go to hell" and that obviously doesn't bring no one into the faith, that's what Bishop Barron understands that trads don't.
@@elizabethkraszewski6603 I have never said that we shouldn't preach the truths of the faith. What I said, is starting with threats with hell is not how should we do it, if it was, then the Westboro Baptist Church would clearly be the church with most converts. Besides, the goal of being a catholic is not merely avoiding hell but being a saint both on earth as in heaven. A Catholicism fueled only by a fear of hell doesn't produce saints, it produces puritans. We should be catholics out of love of God and neighbor first and mostly and that's what we should always share. In fact, hell is no other thing than the absolute self-exclusion of God's love, as the Catechism says.
Bishop Barron has a wonderful way of relating to people. By listening to him for the past 5 years, I was able to find my way back home to catholicism
Do you think catholicism is true?
@@kevinjunior_kid yes do you
@@parissturt2788 No... Because some of the teachings are against the Bible
@@kevinjunior_kid No book will interpret itself to us. Not even the Bible. Ultimately, it seems, the Bible is subject to your interpretation. I hope you are an infallible interpreter. Thousands of Protestant churches exist because they thought the other Protestants were teaching against the Bible.
@@bradleymosman8325 Alright then.. Who is Jesus Christ according to your faith..
I've listened to both Bishop Barron and Ralph Martin on this topic and I can't see where they differ. They both emphasise exactly the same points. Neither is unclear or divergent in their interpretation. If you're seeing a conflict, it's because you're not hearing either party properly. It's the style that differs between the two men only. The doctrine is clear on this - specifically being a Catholic has the greatest chance of getting you into heaven but we honestly don't know for certain. It isn't as easy as simply believing in God and being a Catholic, you actively have to be genuine in the practice of your faith and faith can be an extreme struggle at the best of time. Had I listened to people like Ralph Martin when I was agnostic I simply would have put him in the 'radical Christian' box and continued to live my life not believing in hell or the devil and not being convinced by the existence of God. I came back to religion because I was convinced that God truly loves me. Some people need the stick to be convinced and will be really won over by Ralph's style of argumentation, others like me need the carrot and are far more convinced by the Bishop Barron type approach. It's why we have a diversity amongst styles of Catholic preaching. The issue I have with Catholics like Matt Fradd (although I watch his content regularly and agree with most of it) is just the underlying need to sew division amongst Catholics. On one hand he criticises Bishop Barron for not calling Ben Shapiro to repent of his sin of adherence to Judaism (which is not a sin per se) and yet he gets defensive when others call him out to do the same to Dave Rubin. It's far more fruitful to focus on the Christian principles that both men already agree to. Ben is an extremely vocal pro-life advocate that we should support and Dave Rubin is a model example of appropriate dialogue between disagreeing parties. Will both go to hell for not being Catholic? We don't know, maybe, but I hope not. Who knows, in time both may become Catholic because of their engagement with Catholics like Bishop Barron.
I agree completely. Really great comment.
I also completely agree. Thanks for your eloquence.
Good comment. We should strive at all times to avoid infighting.
Awesomely said.
Love this comment. I agree with a lot. But just agreeing where we agree and not asking people to repent of non Christian ideals is how we have grown men who claim they feel like women in little girls' changing rooms. How do we ask people to consider their selfishness and sins and still spread God's bigger message of love? Repentance and doctrine is a tough message. The carrot approach is how Jesus got reduced to a happy hippie when He preached often about the reality of hell. I dont have an answer but I agree with you that both Barron and Martin are right and their messages appeal to us at different times on our journey towards heaven.
O My Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of Hell and lead ALL souls to Heaven, especially those who are in most need of Thy mercy.
That is the Fatima prayer that the Mother of God taught the 3 shepherd children: Lucia, Francesco and Jucinta.
She also showed them a vision of HELL where the children saw HUMAN SOULS. The children were frightened nearly to death on seeing it. She also told them that more people go to Hell for sins of the flesh than any other sins and that they should pray and do penance so that others won't go there.
If you say" that's private revelation, we don't have to believe that " , i shall agree with you. However , that prayer comes from private revelation from the same series of apparitions. You can't dismiss one without the other.
So, if you are dismissing that human souls DO GO TO HELL, I suggest that you pray and FAST for those for whom you are hoping they don't go there.
You are both correct , While we pray for God's mercy, we must rember the old version of the Act of Contraction. "Because of the loss of heaven and the pains of Hell, "remember this old quote "the streets of hell are paved with the skulls of Bishops.
@@wg820 Dear People: Listen to Fr. Mark Goring! He's 1000 times better then the Barron
ua-cam.com/video/H8UBT-3USeY/v-deo.html
there is no place as hell, hell fire is a fire that annihilates the wicked then the fire goes out, there is no limbo or purgatroy...and a priest cannot forgive your sins because he has enough of his own
I financially support Word on Fire AND Pints with Aquinas. I have learned so much and been very blessed by BOTH of these apostolates. Also, Bishop Barron was instrumental in bringing me back to my faith.
Like you I send $$ to PWA & WOF and also RM @ Renewal Ministries. Appreciated this talk and the thoughtful differences among all three platforms. I hate to see listeners spin it into division.
Same!
There is no HEll or Limbo or Purgatory...and a priest cannot forgive sins
@@DavidKing-qd3sp Is there Heaven? Can Jesus forgive sins?
@@montyrock4 .............Yes,
I am disappointed at this critic of Bishop Baron. He speaks to young people about the love of God which is greater than any sin and the source of our salvation. Christ came to call sinners to repentance, He condemns the sin and not the sinner. Bishop Baron emphasizes that the church need to build walls and bridges; to protect its values but also reach out to the bring the world. That finger-wagging approach to the gospel will not get this generation out of scientism. Bishop Baron is doing great work and should be encouraged.
O my Jesus, forgive us our sins,
save us from the fires of hell;
lead all souls to heaven especially those who are in most need of
Your mercy.
Amen.
I do love Bishop Robert Barron and he has done so much in my life and I am sure a lot of lives. By the way, today is his Birthday, thank God for him.
I love Bushop Barron too. He managed to explain the presence of Christ in the Holy Spirit especially.
I do watch his videos every Sunday
He’s done a lot for me too. Happy birthday to him. And God bless him. He’s a powerful evangelist. To me it’s not that his opinion is at all that will be saved. Its that the Lord‘s mercy is so infinite and his love for us is so unlimited to assume that you’re damned because you’re not a part of this small club… well
I love Bishop Barron as well but he is soft peddling the Gospel. It doesnt mean he is the AntiChrist,it just means he is wrong.
@@PerfectNormal exactly
Bishop Barron has never maintained that all people will go to Heaven.
He is quoting from the Catholic
Catechism - that we may have hope that all may be saved.
Read St. Paul - letter to the Corinthians about the Excellence of
Love.
Love is patient, Love is kind. Love is not boastful or envious or arrogant or rude. Love does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice in wrongdoing, but rejoices in the truth. It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.” St. Paul, First Letter to the Corinthians Chapter 13 verses 4-7
“ Love...bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. “
Perhaps you also disagree with St. Paul who says love “ hopes all things “.
I am nourished and still I am by Bishop Baron’s talks . Thank you Bishop Baron. 🥰
I love bishop Barron before my returning to the faith of the church I've never heard anyone so well spoken in the matters of catholicism, the life, the meaning, the beauty. Ive watched the growing numbers of controversies on both sides about his approach, but my faith is in Bishop Barron he has called out so many to return to the church, many of this generation, the young that want a deeper embodying of tradition the value true religion holds. God bless him for it, and happy birthday, Amen
for real, he has done SO MUCH, and he has done so with intelligence, passion and love for all those who have fallen away! That's why so many people respond to him.
I suggest your Faith be in JESUS, not a sinner. The question is very simple, is Bishop Baron's statement consistent with what Our Blessed Lord said in the Gospels or not? If it is, KUMBAYA! Otherwise...be careful of the wolves dressed in Shepperd's clothing!!!!
@@archangelliii2536 Dear People: Please listen to Fr. Mark Goring! He IS 1000 times Better then the Barron
The Fatima secret was meant to be revealed in 1960 , it wasn’t, Russia was meant to be consecrated, it wasn’t.
But in 1965 we have Vatican 11 and the new mass, and this was to bring unity with the Protestant faiths, and as the years have past trying to bring unity to all religions, ideologies, democracy, etc etc.
The Fatima secret holds the key to everything that is happening in the catholic and apostolic church today and the future, and the secrets from our blessed mother have been coming and warning mankind since her earliest apparitions.
God bless.
Janitor @ I’m afraid it you’re wrong and just saying it is proves nothing , Even the chief exorcist in Rome father Gabriel Armoth said Russia was never mentioned in any consecration by any pope.
The Consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary by a specific act of a reigning Pope along with all the other Catholic bishops of the world was ordered in a Marian apparition by Our Lady of Fátima in 13 July 1917. Sister Lúcia dos Santos, one of the three visionaries publicly stated that at different times the Virgin Mary had given her a message of promise, that the consecration of Russia (as a country) would usher in a period of world peace.
A religious statue depicting Our Lady of Fatima, with her Immaculate Heart surrounded with thorns, a necklace chain of golden ball (of light) and barefooted as described by Sister Lúcia dos Santos at the Pontevedra and Fátima Marian apparitions.
The Vatican stated that Sister Lúcia declared to them in private correspondence during the 1980s that the consecration offered by Pope John Paul II in Saint Peter's Square on 25 March 1984 had been properly accomplished and was “accepted in Heaven”.
The authenticity of this is vehemently rejected by some traditionalist Catholics, including those at Fatima Centre, namely Father Nicholas Gruner, Christopher Ferrara, the SSPX, among others, who support claims of parallelism to the alleged Marian apparitions of Our Lady of Akita in 1973.
In addition to this Consecration, Pope Pius XII (1942), Pope John Paul II (1984), Pope Benedict XVI (2010) and Pope Francis (2013) have consecrated “the world” to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Pope Pius XII verbally consecrated "the peoples of Russia" in 7 July 1952 via his Papal bull “Sacro Vergente”.
To date, no ceremonial rite of Papal consecration has been specifically addressed to “Russia” per verbatim, nor invoked with the physical presence of the sum total of Catholic bishops present at the Vatican.
God bless 👍🙂
I appreciate the reference Dr Ralph Martin made to the last few sentence of lumen gentium 16. I re-read the section and noticed the beginning of the this sentence: “But often men, deceived by the Evil One...” Deception by the evil one does not happen rarely, or occasionally, but OFTEN. 🤷♂️
How can we have a reasonable hope that all are saved when “often men, deceived by the Evil One.... exchanged the truth of God for a lie”
Thanks for your work Matt. 👍
Hey Ken - thoughtful comment! I would counter with this - does a mother hope that all her children will graduate from public school, even if it seems unlikely that all will?
@@angelicdoctor8016 apples and oranges
@@stevenhotho4094 both involve hope for the unlikely -- apples and apples
How can we have a reasonable hope that all men shall be saved? Because the Bible teaches it. Because the Church for the first 500 years up until Augustine, widely taught this. Because holy saints of God have taught it, men such as St. Gregory of Nyssa and St. Isaac of Syria taught it and have NEVER been declared heretics by any ecumenical council. Because God has defeated death by His death, so that there is no way that death can win and hold even one person. Because God is just and eternal torment would be the most unjust thing that God could do.
@@IrishEddie317 I really don't know what gospels you are reading.
I would also like to point out that sometimes the conversion happens, through the grace of God, and seeing the brokenness around you; being a witness to the evils that walk this earth can create a conversion in someone's heart. This is what happened to me. It was a wake up call to how I lived my life and how I NEEDED to follow my Catholic faith not only for the saving of my soul but because I believed that there is more to life than the emptiness of this world. And this is what lead me back to the truth of the Church.
This is exactly what happened to me. God's grace definitely reached me at my lowest but I ignored it until recently. Finally, seeing how disgusting the world is becoming and being horrified made me realize if we all just do whatever we want and live however we want, the whole thing turns to crap awfully fast. I craved morality and goodness and truth, which of course comes from God and I reverted back to my Catholic faith.
Bishop Barron talks to and challenges those who do not believe. He goes out into the world as a true evangelist should. My experience with Matt Fradd is inviting only like minded people to his show while wagging fingers outwardly to others. I find him helpful to listen to occasionally as I find his guests enlightening but always using at least an ounce of discernment. In addition Bishop Barron has been immensely helpful in explaining the Gospel. It is possible to bring the joy and love of Christ to all without watering down the faith or beating them over the head with it.
Let’s say you’re right about Matt Fradd. How does it follow that he is wrong in critiquing him on this point? Careful not to commit the ad hominem!
Thank you for this. Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who thinks this way. I like them both, but I think Matt's wrong on this point on evangelization
I strongly agree. Bishop Barron has done so much good, and is so intellectually amazing, that it feels deeply wrong and not pragmatic to criticize him at all. Matt Fradd can sometimes be a bit cheeky.
Wonderful reply and I agree completely. Bishop Barron is interested in expanding his church. Unfortunately, there's a lot of elitist snobbery in certain circles. The condescending way that Fradd laughs off the idea that "everyone is going to heaven" is proof of that. As if these two are in on some joke that the rest of us idiots can't comprehend.
Bishop Barron is concerned with appearing "nice" not with conversion. Look no further than the interview that is cited in this clip with Ben Shapiro. Barron makes zero attempt to invite him to the faith and actually implies Ben is just fine the way he is.
Approach this from another angle; Barron believes all are likely saved. If thats the case, why do any hard work reaching out and evangelizing? His own position on this issue robs him and others of the motivation to actually go into the world and convert people.
Finally, you are dead wrong about Matt inviting likeminded people. He has literally hosted over a dozen debates with people who he disagrees with. His last debate was literally a month ago (oct 20). Your either ignorant of his work (which begs the question why claim to know what he does) or a liar.
In contrast, Bishop Barrons hides from debate with Catholics who disagree with him (just see here him dodging Mr. Martin who is a scholar on this exact topic). Can you name one time Bishop Barron didnt hide from Catholics disagreeing with him? When he was on Catholic Answers, he has them screen his calls to avoid anybody who will disagree with him. He is cowardly. In contrast to Matt who actually puts himself out there and has genuine debate with people. Matt's discussion with Tim Gordon, for example, was one of constant debate and disagreement.
Thank you for not misrepresenting Bishop Baron's comments like I've seen Michael Voris and Mother Miriam have. He hasn't said that "everyone will go to Heaven" only that we can hope everyone will accept the grace God gives them, if even only at the moment of their death.
Bishop Barron is awesome and amazing nevertheless. I'm very grateful to him for his sharing of knowledge so generously and lovingly.
Ralph Martin is one of my very favorite Catholic apologist and have been a fan of his for years! I believe Karl Rahner and Hans Urs von Balthasar were responsible for bringing in this church of nice, spirit of the age, theology into the church in the 60's. Unfortunately, Bishop Barron appears to be a huge fan of theirs. I agree with Martin, the 60's theology hurt the church and was happy to hear him say some bishops are finally recognizing it.
Thank you, thank you, thank you! If we love our neighbors we want them with us in eternity. Love them enough to tell them the truth 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
I always enjoy listening to Ralph. God Bless you both. Viva Cristo Rey
I don't want to contribute with any fingerpointing myself, but I'm seeing a lot of that in the comments here. I don't think this is healthy; provided we're charitable, respectful and interested in honest, informed dialogue aiming for the larger purpose that the Church was built for, there is zero problem in voicing theological disagreements with a Bishop, or Cardinal, or even the Pope. The point isn't to knock some people down a peg; it is, ultimately, to lead everyone a bit closer to Heaven.
It seems like we’re only allowed to “disagree” with the church from a right wing stance. What about standing up and demanding more compassion and kindness towards marginalized groups and people who are different from us, more of an emphasis on helping the needy and oppressed in this life? Seems like that always gets written off as a heresy
@@thebacons5943 What about it? That's just the standard Christian ethos - which is not to say that, therefore, prostitution and gender disphoria and a plethora of things promoted and celebrated by groups branded (with more or less reason) as "marginalized" are themselves to be promoted. If you ask _my_ opinion, though, I'd say all this talk of Right and Left is ultimately a pointless secular red herring; Christianity stands on its own feet as a complete cosmovision with inbuilt sociopolitical implications and aspirations - moreso if we recall it is the foundation of our modern Western civilization.
New subscriber! I learned so much from this short clip. Can’t wait to see more videos. Thank you for the content. Praying for renewed faith and conversion of the whole world this Lenten season. I struggle with evangelizing as I don’t want to impose on others but goodness it’s so important.
Well, I did hear the same answer like bishop Barron 's answer on EWTN. Why does this topic continue with him? He did a video responding to Bishop Barron already. When I see video like this, it makes me feel sad. Because we are as catholics, we shouldn't tear others down.
He is giving fraternal correction. Whoever heard what Bish B said didn’t hear truth. Martin is correcting that with footnotes
Because are priests and bishops must speak the truth at all times. And act on the Truth. We can't have unity on falsehoods.
I enjoy and appreciate your shows; I don't always agree with your approach to the faith but those times aren't many! This is one of those times. Bishop Barron has more than proven to be a loyal son of the Church; as a Bishop, he is a successor of the Apostles; neither of you are. In large part, my return to the Church can be credited to first and foremost, God's grace and His choice of Bishop Barron to be a conduit of that grace. I'll stick with Bishop Barron in spite of your reservations.
In this video they completely misrepresented bishop Barron. He said explicit faith and practice of the Christian faith is the normative(privileged) way to heaven and that is the belief of the church. People should mind who they are and how little they know before attacking bishops. This is disrespect of authority and individualism.
@@pk47831 While its unfortunate that Bishop Barron's position was deplorably straw-manned and caricatured, I really doubt that it was intentional considering that they maintained a rather respectful (albeit mildly condescending) tone throughout the video.
@@Wanderer-s2c Explain how it was a strawman? I have read Bishop Barron's own explanation of his belief on his website, and he is not in line with what even VII says let alone, the Fathers, Scripture, the Doctors etc. It isn't disrespectful, or attacking. How is this disrespect of authority? It is libel to say they are disrespecting authority by criticizing a bishop. Bishops can, have, and will be wrong. Just because he is a bishop doesn't make him right.
They're not talking about loyalty, they're talking about theology. And what a mess implementing Vatican II was and still is.
@@pk47831 he said the word privileged and that word has different meanings and can be interpreted in different ways. He needed to mention Jesus, the Gospel and Isaiah 53.
I was born a Catholic and had no clue how I needed to pursue a relationship with God every day by repentance and faith, no clue. Only by joining with holy people and being taught by them am I learning. If I were born as a non believer I know I would have founded some evil cult and the world would have celebrated it because I'd wear flowers in my hair all the time. Thank you Ralph Martin for speaking the full truth.
I think that's a very common story, and mine too. I think post-Vatican II catechesis in the Church has been awful. We grow up knowing nothing about our own faith.
if you had no clue then u failed to listen. You are now being led astray by heretics
@@SoCal9705 thats so truth, they have watered down so much
Right. Many say that those ignorant of the faith are not to blame. True, but those who keep them in ignorance are then to blame. Imagine how many souls have been deprived of the Truth because too many in the church don't want to tell them the hard truths.
I enjoy and respect Bishop Barron but he honestly doesn't challenge me very much. He says a lot but rarely with full clarity and boundaries. I'd much rather hear a teaching in simple language that makes a muddy world more clear. I lean more traditional but I have to say I have yet to be let down by Fr Mike (Schmitz), he is a regular guy, regular language, and yet-he has never, ever missed an opportunity to challenge his viewers/listeners in his teachings. I appreciate that so much!! He played a huge role in bringing me back to the Church and in my husband's conversion from a fully devoted Protestant to an even more fully devoted Catholic (he entered into the Church on Pentecost Sunday).
Welcome home to your husband! That is fantastic news.
Thanks be to God.
Regarding Bishop Barron, it appears to me that he's gotten soft since his appointment as Auxiliary Bishop.😕
I agree with much of what's said here. However, I also think that Bishop Barren had done as much or more than any single priest, Bishop or lay person in bringing people to God and thinking about our faith in a true and mature way. Despite this stance you're taking about here, he has done a startlingly amazing job at evangelization. So... Anyway, he has said some things that seem too wishy washy, but has done so much good for souls and bringing them to God that his fruit is easily seen as good.
that is soooo true.
Maybe he could consider revising the wishy-washy bits. The problem with his statements around Hell is that they can invite a lazy attitude not only towards spreading the gospel but also in committing to it. As Ralph Martin points out, that wishful thinking attitude rather than a careful listening to what Vat II actually said has not served the Church's mission well. Fr Avery Dulles SJ addressed this issue well.
He said multiple times its with Balthasar, that we should hope that hell is empty, which is a totally different thing.
Sorry, but stating that "Jesus is the privileged way" is FAR MORE THAN wishy washy... What good is being an amazing evangelizer when APOSTOLIC TRUTH is not proclaimed at its most basic level??
@@dija5578 Yes, I take your point. Jesus did NOT say "I am the privileged way, the better truth and the best life".
Another thought - "How many people end up in Hell?" is the WRONG QUESTION. It's none of our business: see John 21:21-22.
so impressed with the firm, but gentle handling of this topic and the commitment to speak out the whole truth--even those parts that are less palatable. Kindness matters, but truth is truth.
I used to have a perspective like Bishop Barron. I had read a book by Fr. Neuhaus, "Death on a Friday Afternoon" and it proposed that perhaps Hell is empty. The way he stated it seemed loving and it appealed to me emotionally. Without getting into too much detail, I had a wild religous experience after being away from the church after 12 years. Gosh, like the next day, I was looking for a priest to go to confession and did like 3 confessions over the next month because I kept remembering stuff from the last decade and wanted to be sure I made a good confession.
I have a lot of sympathy for Bishop Barron's views because I used to share them. In hindsight, I see those views weren't merciful. Kudos to Mr. Martin for reaching out to Bishop Barron. It's so easy to believe that being merciful is affirming other people's lives and values. What a wakeup call the last few years have been for a lot of us.
I feel like I could have written a lot of this. I like Bishop Barron but I think an honest and firm approach is needed. Not an apologetic one. The church needs to stop apologizing and start telling people like me (a millennial) the truth. We are SO hungry for the Truth, when the church starts shouting it, that's when we will see massive conversions, IMHO.
@@lahair5751 I know. This generation has been handled with so much political correctness by the world, it's incredibly difficult when we get mixed messaging from the church. There is a great danger in the Church posturing to be politically relevant with younger generations--it leaves a gapping hole for the state to become religiously relevant for the people who are looking for a moral authority and finding none.
Full of love in his speech and delivery. I wholeheartedly respect and agree with Ralph Martin!
I understand the criticism against BB. I think there's another angle though that people aren't talking about, and I can't help but wonder if he's purposefully playing these cards close to the chest.
BB is a doorway to people who would otherwise remain outside the fold. Fire and brimstone isn't a one size fits all evangelical approach. BB is drawing people in with gentleness, non-aggresiveness, God as Good, and True, and Beautiful. He's warming them up, which they so desparately need, and softening the blow. Many people are hypersensitive to Christianity, especially the Church, and so you HAVE to meet them where they're at, even if that means giving them just "the good stuff" so to speak, for now.
People are already in so much pain, the idea of going to hell afterwards just because you're not part of an, at times, historically incredibly corrupt institution that is, by all appearence, at the hands of men who are just as sinful and fallible as anyone else, is incomprehensible. Another way of putting it, BB is casting a wide net; Jesus can sort it out later. Yes, some may never come to fully accept the Church in ALL Her teachings, some may never accept Jesus Christ, but others will, in time.
People are so broken right now, and it's not because they're bad. We're getting our butts kicked by generational sin. So much conflict and war and treason and betrayal and lies. So many broken families. People didn't fight in WWI and WWII and come back without any problems. My grandpa, who was otherwise a good Catholic man, daily mass-goer, was in some ways a horrible father. Way too strict and disciplinarian with my Uncles, all of whom fell away from the faith, while my grandpa was supposed to be this great Catholic? No.
The world is sick, and God knows it. I think that's one of the main reasons the Church appears so soft these days; it is! Yes, it's corrupted, and wicked people are trying to subvert it and take advantage of God's mercy, twisting and perverting it. But people are at a place right now where they need to be able to call out to God in anger and frustration and hurt, to really lean on Him as a father, who is all patient and kind and merciful, and not be rebuked for drowning in the misery of sin, so much of which was passed on to them by others. The culture is ripe for harvesting, and I get the unfortunate suspicion that many otherwise well-meaning "traditional Catholics" are thwarting the movements of the Holy Spirit in the Church, because they see the corruption and are conflating the two. God help us.
This is a really thoughtful analysis of the situation. Even though your comment is so long, I found every line was meaningful. Bishop B is indeed casting a wide net and it's effective. Sometimes, people who have been in the church for a long time and are hyper-aware of all the do's and don'ts can become so afraid of not doing everything "properly" they cease to see how people outside that faith sees the world, and so are ineffective in bringing them in.
Thank you for this response, you have explained perfectly what I wanted to say but was too annoyed to verbalise.
You don’t go looking for the lost sheep with a gun. You have to bring the sheep back to the fold first. Thank you.
This is so beautiful. Thank you and God bless you. 🙏
"Another way of putting it, BB is casting a wide net; Jesus can sort it out later. Yes, some may never come to fully accept the Church in ALL Her teachings, some may never accept Jesus Christ, but others will, in time." These are great and beautiful words!
No offense, but I'm going to give your comment a big "DUH". You are right 1000%. But my real question is: How do you guys not realize this???? Have you spent time outside of the Church at ANY point in your life? I fell away for 14 years. The idea that brimstone would have brought me back? You guys are larping like it's the middle ages. You're up against Nihilism.
Bishop Barron is an immeasurable asset to our faith! I have not seen someone who can explain things as well as he can in my lifetime. The spirit is in him for sure!
Love Ralph. What a great light he has been for us in the Church. Thank you for Ralph, Lord Jesus!
EWTN Bible
Luke 13:23
23 And some one said to him, "Lord, will those who are saved be few?" And he said to them,
24 "Strive to enter by the narrow door; for many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able.
I am looking for the narrow door.
Acts 4:12
There is no name under heaven and earth by which we can be saved, except in the name of Jesus.
Ralph Martin…Thank you so much, for clarifying what Barron said. I saw that interview with Shapiro. It sounded so nice & charitable, but I really felt like something wasn’t quite ‘right’ about what he said. But I couldn’t articulate it. I couldn’t explain why it was ‘wrong’…. So thank you so much. I’m going to share this video with a few people who need to hear it. I think it might help. Will keep you both in my prayers. 🙏🏼✝️
Bishop Barron is the most important, influential, smartest Catholic whom I've experienced that's largely brought me back to the Catholic Faith. He's kept his focus on Jesus and the Faith instead of divisive Catholic culture wars. Grateful for Bishop Barron, the Word on Fire team, and I thank God for them.
Thank you, Ralph Martin, for your commitment and courage to speak with clarity and truthfully.
I love Bishop Barron, he has done so much for the Catholic church, have learnt so much from him. He is the reason why I am so proud to be Catholic. Bishop Barron has clarified more than once on this subject - don’t see why this needs to be brought up and discussed again.
Although Bishop Barron has posted videos reiterating how he follows Balthasar in his understanding of LG 16, he has not responded to very basic questions concerning why we should trust Balthasar when he was influenced by Barth's exclusive attention to God's role in our salvation (the Protestant reformed position) as though we don't need to cooperate with grace (the Catholic position).
Because Bishop Barron needs to recant his position. Otherwise no one should listen to him.
@@johnpglackin345 no John - there will be no recanting, since it's not a teaching of the Church that a particular human soul is currently in hell -- theological speculative debate is permissible in the Catholic Church
@@angelicdoctor8016 I bet you worship the virus this past year and a half.
@@johnpglackin345 let me guess, John - you reject papal teaching on the morality of the vaccines
If we attempt to align ourselves of things of this world, we are doomed to fail.
The modern world needs to embrace the church, not the church needs to embrace the modern world.
I love Bishop Barron and he has been such a big part of my return to the Church. I understood what Bishop Barron mean’t when he said these things. So do many. The people who harp on Bishop Barron ought to listen to everything he actually said.
@PintsWithAquinas - Thank you so much for posting this. I am a Protestant who has been doing some soul searching and investigating into Catholicism. A number of Catholic doctrines have made sense to me. But when I encountered Bishop Barron’s interview with Ben Shapiro, I thought I had finally come to the point where I had to reject the Catholic faith. What Bishop Barron said was, imho, indistinguishable from universalism and a heresy. Christ did not sacrifice himself on a cross to upgrade our salvation tickets from economy plus to first class-the so-called “privileged route” to salvation, in Bishop Barron’s words. I’ve been searching for the last two days to find some response-either Catholic or Protestant-rejecting Bishop Barron’s statements. I’d almost given up until I saw this video, at the top of my recommended algorithm. I cannot express how deeply grateful I am to you for uploading this response, and how relieved I am to know that a cheap view of Christ’s death is not an essential holding of the Catholic faith. My exploration of Catholicism can resume!
I agree with your sentiment, but it is still very much an orthodox view that Christ's death is rather so 'expensive' that His Grace and salvation extends further than just to Christians, yet still limited as outlined by Ralph Martin. But thus their salvation is still not possible without Christ's saving Grace outpoured on the Cross. That said, Universalism is undoubtedly a heresy and in clear contradiction to Scripture, including many direct utterances of Our Saviour. It has clearly not been the experience of the great mystics of the Church, that should never be discounted, nor the Marian messaging of Fatima. God sped you on your journey, brother.
Very very few are saved, but those that are, are through the Catholic Church. I cannot do it without the grace of God and neither can anyone else. There are very very many heresies in the church, you should look up the pure truth which is Catholic Dogma and De fide and Ecumenical Councils(don’t read Vatican 2)
Look into traditional catholicism.
I understand what your guys are saying, and I agree this post Vatican mindset - all can go to heaven after all - is now embedded in the Church. However, I didn't take Bishop Barron's comments as meaning that at all. I believe he was simply exploring the question, "Well, we know that God is abundantly merciful.... How far does that wonderful mercy go? What if, what if God has provided a way for most people to be saved?" I think he knows very clearly that most will not be saved and that hell is very real, but let's push these things a bit further.
You are saying Bishop Barron's strategy "doesn't work anymore", but I don't know a Christian who has helped convert more people to the true Church, and he still does it today... So Idk about this one, I get the point about some comments he has said, but overall I think he's such a great evangelist
Exactly he offers a mystical approach to understanding. He’s not gonna beat you over the head with tired talking points that do come from a place of love but are nonetheless tired. People aren’t looking to be moralized or brow beaten, they want a place of spiritual and intellectual refuge which bishop Barron demonstrates is contained in the Catholic Church. But at the same time bishop Barron understands that truth exist in a hierarchy
If you look at the numbers of practicing Catholics now, the number of baptisms, the number of Catholic weddings, the number of vocations now and compare them to prior to Vatican II, it is blindingly clear the strategy has not worked, just like Dr. Martin said.
@@eamonob84 It is clear that overall whatever the church has done since Vatican 2 has not worked, but Bishop Barron has had success. You cannot deny that. Maybe it's that he understands better what the council actually was asking for and he accomplished it better.
To all in this comment section, what it comes down to is if (and if yes, how much of) there is a distinction between the methods of Vatican II and the methods of Bishop Barron.
I get what you're saying: that since Bishop Barron isn't so clear what he's saying is verging on heresy and other people might fall into a kind of complacency when it comes to evangelization and the saving of souls.
What I notice and have experienced in his ministry though is he is still very faithful to the catholic faith and extremely passionate about evangelizing the culture without compromises (just look at the work he and his team have produced). He's brought so many people to God and the catholic faith in a non-threatening exclusivist finger-pointing way that most catholic evangelists do cause he focuses on how beautiful God is rather than how impossible salvation is. Therefore we focus on God's strength rather than ours. The thing is, I think his goal is to draw people in first so that we can allow grace to work. Once we are open, we become ready to accept the difficult teachings and become willing to start evangelizing ourselves. That's my experience at least, and the many testimonies of people he's reached is witness to that.
That's a very good point, I think it's just disconcerting to practicing Catholics who (should) know it's not that simple for salvation. Focusing on the loving majestic God who loves us as a Father is so important as well.
Thank you for this comment, I was hoping to see an objection to this critic of Bishop Baron. The finger-wagging approach to evangelism will not get young people to see the beauty and love of God which is the reason for our salvation. Christ came to call sinners to repentance and not condemn them.
@@fhdhjydv1547 God will judge based on knowledge too, if they don't know for no fault of their own God will not be unfair.
That's why priests will have a lot more work to do.
Matt why not have Bishop Barron on your show? Maybe Dr. Larry Chapp. Why lean towards folks that lean towards rad trad. I don't mean Ralph, and not other orthodox Catholics with a different perspective? I think you owe Bishop Barron or someone associated with Word on Fire abplace at the table. Let him explain his position. You and Ralph are great, but I think your short changing Bishop Barron. But of course like any media person you will probably only pick guests whose viewpoint you totally agree with. But Bishop Barron would make a great guest and there is much you would agree on and you could let him set the record straight. Anyway wish you and Ralph well.
Rad trad, lol
you seem to be making a lot of assumptions here. bishop barron has one of the biggest platforms of any american catholic. if his position needs clarifying, it's not matt's fault lol
How are you supposed to fight the left wing media if you can't project that on your own congregants in the Church?
To be traditional is to be Catholic. If people don't like that they can go join a Protestant denomination.
@@espi371 Who knows what that means? I don't.
Matt, spot on: “It’s like a 40-year-old man trying to be hip with the teens.” It comes off insecure, pathetic, and creepy. It arouses suspicion in the teens and drives them away. I think they’d be far more impressed with the man if he was firm in his beliefs, unapologetic and unconcerned with their opinion of him. If nothing else, it would set an example to them, maybe even arouse their admiration. “Yo, old Bob’s a badass. That guy spits facts and doesn’t budge on anything.”
That’s the Church I think many of us long for: firm, unapologetic, uncaring of the opinions of the world. What a taunt to the Enemy that would be. One of the best analogies you’ve ever made on your show. Your whole talk with Ralph Martin was excellent. Love Bishop Barron and his work dearly as well: his work helped rescue me from atheism and return to the Catholic Church. You're both great forces of good in the world. God bless you, Dr. Martin, Bishop Barron, and the Holy Church. Christ, have mercy on us!
I like Ralph Martin. He is a soft speaker BUT he is super intelligent and tells it like it is. I would love to see Fr. Isaac Mary Relyea give his input on the Bishop of the Internet.
Praise God,Thank you Ralph Martin ,you are spot on keep saying this we need to hear 👂 this .🙏
I'm a subscriber to Martin, Matt and Barron. I avoid the divisiveness talks that have been so prolific lately. We have one commandment of Jesus, love one another. Bishop Barron projects with much love and hope, Ralph Martin explains it with love. Two purposes two great Catholics. Everyone needs to accept their roll in Gods plan. If I hear divisiveness I hear disunity. Am I wrong for not listening? Am I missing salvation? Perhaps, but so often when I see, "he said, she said" tag lines I see prideful attempt to capture headlines. It is not about our will but Gods. His will... will be done regardless of what any of us believe, to seek is innate. To discover is by grace. To follow is our choice. Agape et Shalom
Bishop Baron is 100% orthodox and HE was pivotal in my return to faith after years away from it. He has reached a huge amount of lasped Catholics and those outside the faith. I didn't agree with this take on him at all and imho he did explain the conditions without going into the detail that someone that did a PhD in that particular area might like him to. It was a general interview to reach a huge audience. If he had answered in great detail it might have been understood as nobody ever gets saved , so he would be damned by another for something else. This is criticism from the prayer on the bench not the one playing the ball with more talent and a bigger strategy.
Not addressing very serious sins that are DESTROYING your country is dereliction of duty. Plus he also ignores that targeted individuals are being remotely tortured. 🤷
Jonathan, I agree with some of what you said because like you I did hear the words of the Holy Spirit speaking through Baron during my reversion. But the biggest issue is his utilization of Von Balthazar’s theology is which is demonic because it goes against the truths spoken by Christ Himself. Further he needs to correct his words to Ben Schapiro when he essentially told him that he didn’t need to convert to Christianity to merit (favorable) eternal life.
I remember when the Ben Schapiro-Bishop Baron video dropped, a couple of my non-practicing Christian friends saw the video and saw this crescendo of beautiful philosophy and metaphysics only to be let down by Baron’s indifference to Christianity when Schapiro asked him if he needed Jesus to merit eternal life. Instead of leading these souls to Him, my friends made the inevitable cosmic shoulder shrug since the pastor they heard from gave them the ultimate message of indifference to His eschatological master plan.
He is not 100 percent Orthodox.
@@johnpglackin345 yes he is
Thanks forgoin a bit deeper on this. I grew up pre Vatican II. The approach of focusing so much on hell left me thinking there was little hope. In a way it opened up my scape goating and blaming others in order to protect my false self from being seen. What you and Bishop Barron are saying is the importance of focusing on Christ who is hope. One of the key breakthroughs for me has been meditating on the Lord's prayer regarding asking God for forgiveness as I forgive those I judged/scapegoat/blame. In my reflections it extends to Christ giving the church the power to forgive sins. In a way it extends the priests role in the sacrament of reconciliation. It is part of our royal priesthood to forgive. Why because forgiveness frees the one forgiving from self protecting compulsive behaviour to recognising and taking responsibility for our sin and opening to hope that God loves us and wants the same for me a sinner hasn't deserved forgiveness. All part of celebrating the mass. This opens the possibility that all can be forgiven yet maintains Christ's own words to the apostles that not all will be saved(it takes away some of the ambiguity for me). It comes down to the core of free will which is yes to Jesus or no to Him. It puts responsibility in my hands to seek Christ by reconciling myself to my encounters with him in the guise of others sharing this planet with me. It re-emphasises Mother Teresa's call to the poor. The Same message St Francis of Assisi, St John of God (thrown into prison starting his vocation to the sick ) and so many more saints. Jesus prayer for unity is entwined with this. Who then as Christians condem others? We cannot but we can warn of the dangers of poor choices. A strong case for responsibility over rights. Sin is missing the target that is Christ Jesus.
I forgot to add the revelation to me is about loving the person not the sin which is not easy.
Matt - agree with Catholic Bard - invite Bishop Barron on your show and have an open, honest dialogue with him instead of constantly saddling up with the Rad Trad echo chamber. Bishop Barron explained this whole issue on his Word on Fire website quite extensively. He is a real light and force in Catholic evangelization without having to do the trick-pony allegiance to anything related to Donald Trump.
What does Trump have to do with any of this? Are you a Christian or a Democrat first?
Bishop Barron's ministry brought me into the church. Admittedly, I roll my eyes when people bring up their concerns about the Bishops remarks on this subject. If I ever met one person who cited Bishop Barron and said "all people go to heaven" I'd agree with Matt. However, I have never ever heard anyone say that. This conversation is old news, and it's just for rage-clicks.
We shouldn't be tearing each other apart like this 😔 (in the comments specifically)
Spot on . Bishop Barron has never said this ....ever
Sad then that we are talking about it if he never said it. Why do we have to attack other Catholics? Division is the devils work.
@Skelley-PriestYou're quite right. But - to quote the old saying - why let the truth get in the way of a good story? I have learnt so much from Bishop Barron's weekly homilies. He has done so much to deepen people's faith. Given the generally poor level of adult catechesis in the church, he is literally a godsend.
Ralph always speaks Fire!!!🔥🔥🔥He is filled with the Holy Spirit! He is also very humble. Thank you Ralph for speaking truth! Never stop proclaiming the Gospel!
i was studying Islam when Jesus spoke to me and told me I was Christian...i was trying to save my marriage to a muslim man...i was away from the Church when i married him..but was a baptised Catholic...i was willing to convert...but i needed to find truth...i did ..he came to me...seek AND YOU WILL FIND,,
Thank the Lord our God for Bishop Barron.
His net worth 1-5 million. Not bad. He’s the Joel osteen of the Catholic Church. His Bible study is a joke.
@@rickdockery9620 bruh, why'd you even go through the trouble of finding someone's net worth? Plus, nothing good is gonna come out of judging someone based on how much they earn.
@@ABB14-11 yes cuz the apostles were after those $$$. Successor lol
@@rickdockery9620 nothing wrong with making money though, maybe he uses it for his ministry? you never know ya' know?
@@rickdockery9620 firstly secular priest don't take a vow of poverty.. Secondly Joel Osteen net worth is oil the 100's of millions .. Talk about blowing things way way out of proportion ... lol
I couldn't agree more with your accession. This cuddling up to the world hasn't worked, isn't worked and will never work. As a lay 45 years old man, I can clearly see it and I find it impossible to believe that our bishops and priests can't.
I'm glad I found this. I love watching Bishop Barons stuff but he got me closing the door to my could be conversion when I heard him say that. But its good to see that not everyone thinks that way in the church.
Hi Rico. I think they have misread Bishop Barron. Have you seen his latest video on the subject, where he makes it very clear that he is exploring the HOPE that all will be saved, as per the Catholic Catechism. He is such a force for truth for the Church whom the Lord has used to touch more people than we can probably imagine. The enemy would do anything to destroy, including using his "friends" and brothers in Christ.
Time and time again Bishop Barron would be unable to square up to Pope Felix III:
"Not to oppose error
is to approve it;
and not to defend truth
is to suppress it,
and indeed to neglect to confound evil men,
when we can do it, is no less a sin than to encourage them"
Thank you, Ralph! This is truly enlightening!
People need to hear the TRUTH even if it hurts! It's supposed to hurt, how else can you heal.
I don't agree with Mr. Martin's take on Vatican II, it seems he's positing that VII represents a hermeneutic of rupture, that is a breaking with tradition, but the vast majority of the pontiffs at the time (both left and right) as well as Benedict XVI and JPII were of the opinion that it in no way breaks with Church tradition but radically affirms it.
No he fully supports Vat II. He's only talking about how it's implemented.
He’s clarifying what Vatican II actually says.
No he isn’t he’s talking about the misconceptions & abuses done “in the spirit of VII”
What I see when a bunch of Catholics trash Vatican II is that they freak out over the apparent lack of belief in the Eucharist in others but fail to see their lack of belief in the legitimacy of Church Authority. 🤷♀️
Why did Vatican II rescind the Oath against Modernism 🤔?
“People make a big leap from possibility, to probability to virtual certainty”
God's mercy and forgiveness are perfect and infinite, but he isn't going to nail your foot to the floor to keep you in his presence.
He technically did that when we were nailed with Him to the Cross😆
“If I ascend to heaven, you are there! If I make my bed in Sheol, you are there!” - Ps. 139:8
His mercy is that no matter what you choose, He’s never gonna let you go, anymore than a loving father would let their child jump off a bridge without, first, doing everything in their power to make sure that never would happen. A human life is far more precious than its will to self-destruct. At the end of the day, if our “no” (which is subjected to change) has the final say over God’s eternal “yes”, then we are more sovereign than God. Unless your beliefs are Calvinistic, and you believe that God wills some to paradise while willing others to damnation, then that would be a different position of faith altogether.
“God does nothing as a judge that he wouldn’t do as a father. And I will accept nothing in the description of God that I would find abhorrent in a man.” - George MacDonald
Thanks for the inspiration, sometimes it's hard to believe that with all the evil people commit in the world especially abortion.
When I disassociated from the Catholic Church at about 18 yrs old (am a Protestant now), my local parish's lack of fidelity to the Gospel was the biggest reason. When reading the Bible started producing doubts about what my church taught me, I had a long conversation with my church's Deacon and he couldn't have made it more clear you don't have to believe the Gospel/in Jesus in order to be saved. It's refreshing to hear Catholics defend the Gospel and not just the rightness of the Catholic Church. To be honest, I doubt I will ever go back to Catholicism, but it would no less be a joy to see Catholic parishes get this right.
I love Jesus, Dr Ralph helped us in Syria
Matt: as far as I'm concerned Bishop Barron is doing more good right now than just about any English speaking Catholic in the world. If anyone thinks he is fluffy in the slightest on the need for repentance and conversion, they haven't watched or read enough of him. He has been attacked from all sides on points like these (and in a particularly malicious way) by the extreme right for his views on the "dare we hope" piece. They are always such misunderstood characterizations of his positions. He has spoken out extensively against these 'critiques', including the ones you discussed with Dr. Martin in this video. His interlocutors just don't seem to want to care about what he has to say in response.
That said in no way am I saying that Bishop Barron is above reproach. But there is a great deal of difference between legitimate criticism and calumny.
And the thumbnail that you used for this video is silly. I get you're trying to be a bit edgy and get views, but come on.
And Dr. Martin is a great guy and I'm usually aligned with most of his thinking. But parts of his recent book, especially his take on Adrienne von Speyr and Hans Urs von Balthasar, is a big head scratcher.
100% agree with you. The claims made in this video and in Dr. Martin's book are seriously questionable. Bishop Barron's position is far more tenable and needs to at least be acknowledged instead of mischaracterized.
yo, I need to know what the original thumbnail was!
Matt, I like your show and I have benefitted greatly from the beautiful truths and insights shared by many of your guests. This clip however is a low blow. Bishop Barron is an orthodox bishop. His teaching is faithful to the teaching of the Magisterium. This is sowing division where none need exist.
"Oh my Jesus, forgive us our sins. Lead all souls to heaven, especially those most in need of your mercy". Of course we pray for the souls of all, even our enemy. But we also know that the road is wide that leads to destruction. And many are going down it.
Bishop Barron has discussed precisely that issue on the Word on Fire Show. Furthermore, he has shown himself very open to dialogue with others on any number of issues, including atheists. It seems to me that if one is not including Bishop Barron in the dialogue, and in this case also Hans Urs von Balthasar, with whom Bp Barron is interacting, on is almost certainly discussing a caricature rather than a real person and their position and in significant danger of the mortal sin of slander to the extent that it is conscious.
Dr. Martin did attempt to interact with Bishop Barron on this point as Dr. Martin stated so plainly in this video and there was some level of unwillingness on Bishop Barron's part to do this. I have interacted with Bishop Barron on this point in the combox of his video with Larry Chapp calling his attention to Dr. Martin's dissertation in response to his suggestion that a Balthasarian reading of LG 16 is the manifest reading. My comments were deleted. It seems that there are limits to Bishop Barron's openness to dialogue. That unwillingness to dialogue with Dr. Martin (who has written a dissertation that engages both Balthasar and Rahner on this point while accounting for both the Tradition and doctrinal development) is extremely strange. Your suggestion that Dr. Martin is offering a caricature of Balthasar reflects that you have not read Dr. Martins dissertation. In light of this, you should be more circumspect about suggesting that he is caricaturing Balthasar's position and slandering either Balthasar or Bishop Barron. Martin is aware of the video you are referring to and has produced a video in response to it on this point. Perhaps you should make sure you are better informed before making the suggestion that caricatures are occurring or accusing people of mortal sin (it is people that fall into mortal sin; not "positions").
exactly
I totally agree with Bishop Barron though. The Blessed Virgin Mary herself sent an angel to teach the three young children in Fatima a prayer she wants added to the end of every decade of Her rosary. It's a prayer of extreme Faith in God's infinite Mercy, Hope, and Love.
The Fatima Prayer/Decade Prayer:
“O my Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of hell,
lead ALL SOULS to Heaven,
especially those most in need of Thy mercy. Amen.”
Some of the early church fathers believed this. Everyone is called into the presence of God. Which is a powerful light. To those in grace the light is beautiful and soothing. To those not in grace that same light is an everlasting torment.
Everlasting? Why? How do you know this? If God maintains them in a state of everlasting torment, then the Cross is a magnificent FAILURE! Jesus came to save THE WORLD, not some "elect of God known only to Him" (i.e., Calvinist hogwash!). If eternal torment is true, then God is going to maintain sin, death, and separation from Him forever, which contradicts the purpose of the Cross. I thought Jesus came to defeat death, the devil, and hell. If eternal torment is true, then guess what - the devil wins.
@@IrishEddie317 is this a denial of hell? Or am I just misreading this.
@@rudymatheson1415 It is absolutely a denial of hell. There is no such place. It comes from paganism, and the vicious and hateful pagan gods and their hate for mankind. That is not our loving Heavenly Father of whom the Bible says wills to save all mankind.
Now don't get me wrong. There is torment after death of the wicked. The Saints of the church taught that the wicked experience God's love as torment. But this torment does not last forever. The purpose of it is to restore the soul through chastisement. God is just and would never do such a thing as eternal torment. That is a pagan idea from darkened minds.
@@IrishEddie317 this is a direct repudiation of the Christian faith and of Catholic dogma.
@@rudymatheson1415 It's not a contradiction to the Christian faith because it was taught for the first 500 years of the Church without anybody declaring it a heresy. It was the Roman Catholic Church that attacked it, and the Church attacked it in order to keep people in line through fear. For me, not being Roman Catholic, I really don't care if it's one of their dogmas. They can say or teach anything they want to, doesn't mean it's the truth. I'll go with the Holy tradition of the Church and the Sacred Scriptures.
I've been examining the roman catholic faith for a while now, and while I still have more to learn, it is becoming apparent that a direct contradiction to Christ now exists in the church.
Christ said "I am THE way, THE truth, and THE life, and no one comes to the father except by me."
Catholics say "christ is one way, but conscience is another"
This is striking, and it is deadly.
If my church history remembers that Orgin, and one of the 13 century saints taught that . I left the church, I was a Southern Baptist for a bunch of years . I was drawn to them because of the doctrine of Once saved always saved. However, upon reflection on it . I could see the danger in that. Especially when there is no one to hold you accountable for your sins. Returned to Holy Mother the Church. I am sorry that I ever left. Let me say though I did learn a lot.
Origen is a condemned heretic
As a former Roman Catholic, now reformed protestant, it has been eye opening to see Catholic doctrine discussed by sincere Catholics on Pints w Aquinas and now this video. The protestant point of view would be that no one will be saved except those that hear the Gospel of Christ, repent from their sins, and put their faith in the saving work of Christ death on the cross. This is based on Romans 10:13 among many other verses. "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved." Romans 10:14-15 goes on to say "How, then can they call on the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? And how can they preach unless they are sent? As it is written, "How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news!" As far as a person who has not heard the gospel but has a desire to please God through the revelation of nature and his own good conscience, I believe the Apostle Paul makes it perfectly clear when he states in Romans 3:10-18. As it is written: "There is no one righteous, not even one: there is no one who understands, no one who seeks God. All have turned away, they have together become worthless: there is no one who does good, not even one. Their throats are open graves; their tongues practice deceit. The poison of vipers is on their lips. Their mouths full of cursing and bitterness." "Their feet are swift to shed blood; ruin and misery mark their ways, and the way of peace they do not know." "There is no fear of God before their eyes."
In Jesus time, the Jews put their traditions ahead of the Law and the Prophets, which were given through divine revelation. Jesus said "you have heard it said, but it is written" to show them God's true will. The Talmud was their extra-biblical text by which they tried to make detailed rules about following the Mosaic law. It led them further from God's will. Many protestants believe Catholics hold their traditions in higher regard than the clear teaching of the Bible. I would not want to follow the practices which Jesus rebuked. I am not trying to insult anybody. I am just sharing my point of view.
The question begs why should I accept your interpretation of the Bible ?
@@jeffreyrodrigoecheverria2613 It is not merely my interpretation. This is a widely held understanding. I understand that the Roman Catholic church also held this doctrine for hundreds of years. In fact, they held a much stricter requirement of being a baptized Roman Catholic.
I am interested in your understanding of Romans 3:10. Some might claim that Paul is addressing only Jews. Romans 3:9 states that both Jews and Gentiles are all under sin. What do you think Paul is saying in Romans chapter 3 and Romans chapter 10?
A small part of me will always believe in universalism, through one man (Adam) all fell, through one man (Christ) all were saved. Also nothing unclean shall enter heaven so purgatory is where most people will be purified
Can't save Lucifer or force salvation on people who have freewill. For not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven. Mt 7:21-23
If that were the only passage in the New Testament I might agree with you.
@@AJMacDonaldJr Even well known verses that are talking about hell (gehenna) are debatable, for example ‘everlasting punishment’ is correctly translated from Greek as eonian (age of) chastisement - which pertains to the view of correction.
Theres also verse like 1 Tim 4:10 which flat out say “we have put our hope in the living God who is the Savior of all people, especially of those who believe”
@@Mickyboi1 The Sheep and the Goats. "And these [goats] shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal" (Matthew 25:31-46).
@@AJMacDonaldJr yeah, people don't realize how long 'everlasting' is!
I really like a lot of what was said here. It has given me a lot to think about.
However, to think that preaching to non-Catholics is as simple as saying 'repent and believe in Jesus, so you can go to heaven' is also 'naive'. If this was the best way to preach than JWs with megahorns at train stations would be raking in the converts everyday.
I believe that it is from depth of understanding of the teachings of Jesus, as well as the joy and peace of the Gospel life, that we can genuinely evangelize others in a way that touches their hearts.
Full marks to Dr Ralph Martin with respect to James 4:4
Thank you for your spiritual depth!
I highly respect Ralph Martin. I grew up Roman Catholic however I've left the church. I am a Christian in Anglican Church.
Wasn’t the Anglican Church started by Henry the VIII because he wanted to get a divorce?
@@bonniethomas2439 yes
Bishop Barron has been extremely careful in his approach specially on doctrines because He does not want to spark debate or polarization in communities. Rather, He wants to inspire self-conscience to seek the Divine will by themself. Remember, it is a free will. It is not FEAR but LOVE. Bishop Barron has done tremendous job!
Hi. Listening to this again with two men I respect highly, Ralph Martin and Matt Fradd, both of whom have impacted my life in different ways for the good. However, I feel that until conversations have been had with Bishop Barron about this topic, I don't think he should be judged and condemned because of one video. It seems that all the incredible work that he has done - engaging with and evangelising the churched and the non-churched alike - is in danger of being eradicated in a cloud of suspicion and innuendo. I think it is particularly unhelpful doing so in a public forum, especially in social media. I commend Bishop Barron on not responding - to my knowledge - to the criticism meted out, some of which has been foul. I think it would serve the Church much better if pundits sought this as an opportunity to bring further healing and unity to the Church and not an opportunity to pick at one dubious talk. Today our gospel reading is Jesus sending out the disciples (the Church) on mission. Maybe we should be concentrating on this and not debating the possible sins of our brothers.
We all have the opportunity to be saved. The CCC explains it very well that we will also be judged by our knowledge for those who have not yet received the word they will be judged by what they are seeking.
What is happening with this channel? The thumbnail is literally putting words into his mouth. I find myself subbing and Unsubbing from this channel on a regular basis as it swings from decent long-form interviews to a large does of hubris every now and then and comes across as a tad arrogant.
I know exactly what you mean. Arrogant is the right word. We all have our weaknesses. Sometimes we can be very prideful Because we feel like we know better than everybody else
I'm on the same boat, I'm gonna have to see in the next 3 uploads if I want to stay subscribed.
Btw, what was the original thumbnail and title?
@@ABB14-11 Yes, me too. I agree.
@@ABB14-11 it was the same words but they had put them on a picture of the. Bishop as a speech bubble coming out of his mouth. Disgraceful behaviour. Thanks for your reply. I felt a bit bad saying it but it’s been happening more and more.
I don't how videos like this one helps to the unity of the Church. I know there are false prophets and probably Bishop Barron has helped more than any other apologist out there, but lay people publically attacking or getting into confrontation with a successor of the apostles doesn't help much the Church.. In the end, Bishops in communion with the Pope have the power of binding and loosing not lay people with Phds like Taylor Marshal and others.
Bishop Barron is excellent and erudite .
I love Ralph's work, but I sincerely think he's off the mark on this issue. I've listened extensively to Bishop Barron on this issue, and he has NOT stated or even implied that all go to heaven. In fact, quite the opposite. As for Bishop Barron's views on Vatican II, he recently published a bound copy of the four conciliar constitutions along with commentary, as well as published a companion book by Father Blake Britton on Vatican II through Word on Fire Ministries. Both give accurate representations of the inspired genius of the council and an informed opinion on what went wrong after the council. In absolutely no way does Bishop Barron support the "paraconciliar" modes of implementation that came in the years following. Any frequent listener knows how much he despises the watered-down Catholicism that prevailed after the council; he mentions it often.
I've also listened to Bishop Barron's interviews with Ben Shapiro (an Orthodox Jew) and with Dave Rubin (an agnostic homosexual man in a same-sex civil marriage with another man). For his first meeting with both men, Bishop Barron's intent was clearly to find common ground, not the obvious differences between them. In keeping with his own oft-cited strategy of letting others be led to Christ through introducing them to the Church's beauty rather than through aggressive proselytizing, Bishop Barron drew in millions of views and left the door open to further discuss the beliefs of the Church with both hosts in the future. Both Shapiro and Rubin were clearly impressed with the non-aggressive approach and indicated they would have the bishop back. As a Catholic evangelist myself, I'd call that a win. The bishop could have bludgeoned them with the Catechism, but instead opted to play the long game and draw them in. Shapiro is a fairly pro-Catholic advocate of the Church in many respects, and Dave Rubin has recently announced that he firmly believes in God now.
I'm surprised that Matt Fradd and Ralph Martin, two highly intelligent and respectable disciples of Christ seem lost on this. There is no dispute here.
I love bishop Barron and owe him a lot in terms of my return to the Catholic Church and to the Truth, but Dr. Martin is right in this one.
I will follow the narrow way that leads to life and not the universalist "everyone will be saved" stuff. If people really think hell will be only populated by demons, think again and study St. Teresa of Avila vision of hell (you will find it interesting to say the least).
Don't @ me i don't have the time and i'm fixed on my beliefs. God Bless.
yup...amen to that.
We don’t need a strategy! We only need to speak the TRUTH, like the Lord did, and let the Holy Spirit do the work (conversions).
Excellent commentary🙏
It’s time for the successors to the Apostles to adopt a tougher line because so so many are living in hell because the one true Church is failing in its duty to preach the full truth devoid of Modernism🙏
With a name and spelling like yours, you must be from Ireland. 🇮🇪 ☘
I'm in the States, but my Mom was born in Co. Clare and she grew up in Co. Kildare.
I was an international Irish dancer, and the surname of one the families who played the accordion at the feiseanna was Early.🙂
It's encouraging to see faithful Catholics in Ireland, because I've heard that church attendance is low.😥
Especially grateful to Ralph Martin for sharing insights regarding this intriguing subject
Thank you for this. I needed to hear this
A true Christian “Universalist” (if said Christian subscribes to that label) believes in the inevitability that all will repent and behold the Living Son of God. So repentance is still absolutely necessary and involved in that position of faith. No one gets away with anything.
Well said. As a universalist I completely agree with this. The wheels of justice move slowly.
The apostle Paul was a universalist. He clearly spoke on the “Restoration of all things” in his writing
Bishop Barron has NEVER maintained that all people will go to Heaven. He has simply reiterated the Catholic Catechism - that we may have the hope that all may be saved.
St.Paul.
Letter to the Corinthians: 13 -7
“ Love...bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.”
Do you also disagree with St. Paul?
Barron “hopes all go to heaven”. But Jesus doesn’t agree. Hell is not empty so how could ANYONE possibly “ dare to hope”? Nonsensical
@@Crusader33ad St. Paul dared to hope.
Pj Smith - would you point out the passage? Never heard that Paul held to the apokatastasis theology. In fact St Paul warns of condemnation in 1 cor 11 for sacreligious communion (that means hell), 95% of our bishops just OK’d it.
I would want everyone to be saved. But as a holy priest once said,” hell is filled with volunteers “.
@@Crusader33ad And this Holy Priest can name some people who are in hell? My guess is no.
That is simply his opinion.
And in what way have our Bishops okayed sacrilegious Communion for 95% of communicants?
Any person going receiving the Eucharist without confessing a Mortal sin is in danger of going to Hell.
But hope never dies. Why would I point out that passage? Because
I think St. Paul’s letter to the Corinthians sums up what love is perfectly. And he says “ Love...hopes all things.”
So I am sticking with him, as he is one of my Patron Saints ( name is Paula )
It is also in the Catholic Catechism.
I find the picture on this site to be unkind - looking to make fun of Bishop Barron. This is not Christ like behaviour. Bishop Barron is not perfect - who among us is? But I have never heard him make fun of a fellow Catholic, or any other person, for that matter.
@@Crusader33ad
St. Paul - 1 Corinthians 13
The Excellence of Love
I remember being so disappointed when Bishop Barron told Ben Shapiro that Christianity was the “preferred way” [to heaven]. I was so shocked. The preferred way !??? He had an opportunity to tell Ben the good news that his messiah is Jesus but instead he gave this long winded explanation that ended with “ it ‘s [christianity] the preferred way” instead of saying “the only way.” Of course we can place hope in God’s mercy towards non-believers but hoping is not the same as affirming that they will go to heaven.
They kept us away from church and the Eucharist long enough that many feel now that church is unnecessary.
Yeah that was a terrible move. Still can't believe that happened.
Despite the supportive comments for Bishop Baron below, I think that the Bishop must know what he is doing, he must know that he avoids saying certain things and probably in order to keep in with the Francis pontificate. He is not stupid. For goodness sake, he is a Bishop, after all. Knowing this, his not telling the whole truth is tantamount to telling a lie and it is very serious indeed, especially for one in his position. It certainly appears that he is putting politics before Church teaching.
Watched and loved the full interview, thank you Matt. Ralph Martin is a very wise theologian and evangelist, very highly regarded, and humble in spirit.
What’s the point of this sanctimonious talk? Bishop Barron is a beautiful and intelligent soul. What he has accomplished in enlightening the masses of all of us sinners is immeasurable to me. So Ralph, you know who’s getting into Heaven ? Lighten up and love.