This is great tutorial! I’m going to still put my prosaic on the break hand side. I’m up at 30 feet at the absolute highest. I would do something like this if I was climbing higher.
Nice looking backup. But safety is all about ever-developing conversation so I just want to throw this: Lets assume you are rappeling down like shown and suddenly the worst case scenario hits. The mechanical device (Safeguard, Grigri etc) experiences a total failure and lets go. We are human beings and this will happen when we least expect it, and our hands will grab where ever there is something to grab on. But you have this Home Depot key carabiner with the line wrapped around your hand. When you start to fall after the failure, your hand will grab the line even tighter and prevents the friction hitch to activate. This causes the unstoppable fall to the ground. What are your thoughts about this, and have you tested who will win during this kind of event, the friction hitch or the mini carabiner and hand of a baffled human?
@@ollivihermaa This is a great question and it’s obviously subjective because there are variables such as reaction time, someone’s weight and experience. In our opinion, in an instance like you’ve given, the rappel device had catastrophic failure meaning it dropped quicker than your cheap (25 to 40 lbs breaking strength) carabiner can apply the force required to move the hitch. One thing I should probably have announced slightly better in the video is that I keep my hitch with a light amount of friction on it so that it stays partially engaged. If the device did fail, the drop would apply more force to the hitch (and faster) than my cheap carabiner could apply. The force required to break the hitch while partially loaded is greater than the tensile strength of the cheap carabiner. Another thing worth mentioning is that when people fall, the initial reaction is subjective. Many often reach inward towards trees or branches rather than just pulling on a small piece of paracord… At least that’s what most guys we spoke to, who have suffered a fall (even a short fall) have reported. Also worth mentioning is pulling the cord in any direction other than straight down, would allow the hitch to grab with a stronger force than the carabiner could handle. We did go through a couple of faux falls to reaffirm that the carabiner would bend or break away when the “shock” load was applied by disengaging the gri gri handle. The biggest idea behind this video is that running the high side hitch and tender allows you to use the device in a hands free manner without fear of the device brake failing, so that guys can safely do things like remove their one stick, platforms or other methods from the tree safely. As with all things, practicing letting go of the carabiner (muscle memory) would also assist in making sure the back up performed its function each time. Thank you for the great talking point and hopefully others take the time to think about worse case scenarios like you have.
There are two important parts to making this work; 1- make sure whatever carabiner, or s biner you use is barely big enough to clip onto the rope. Smaller and tighter is better so that it doesn’t slip off the hitch cord 2- make sure the hitch cord isn’t tight while tending it, if it’s still under load or bound tightly, you’ll be fighting it all the way down. To grab, the cord only needs a partial pull once it’s been set and broke free. Thanks again for watching and if you have any issues feel free to reach out to us. Happy hunting
Hi Zane. We love the super Munter for emergency rappel and that will be on display at our Saddle Flaooza meet up. The negative is if you tie the Munter incorrectly in the dark, that can lead to an accident. Also you can’t ascend on a Munter. A big advantage mechanical belay devices have are that you can connect them on the ground and never come off the device throughout your entire hunt, including your ascent and descent.
@@phaupt123 8mm on a 9 mm rope will work with additional wraps but ideally your hitch cord should be between 60 and 80 percent the size of your rappel rope for a more reliable hold. I would recommend 7mm eye to eye cord and try the schwabisch, distel, or our personal favorite: the Cornell hitch. We sell a 29” eye to eye cord that is 7mm on our website.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
This is great tutorial! I’m going to still put my prosaic on the break hand side. I’m up at 30 feet at the absolute highest. I would do something like this if I was climbing higher.
Awesome Content. Thanks For sharing. have a nice day!❤👍
LOVE IT! Great tip, Robert! I'll be giving this a try. 👍🏼
Wish you guys had a moveable belt on your saddle. That would make it the best saddle on the market
pretty cool idea
Thank you. Give it a try and let us know how it works for you
Nice looking backup. But safety is all about ever-developing conversation so I just want to throw this: Lets assume you are rappeling down like shown and suddenly the worst case scenario hits. The mechanical device (Safeguard, Grigri etc) experiences a total failure and lets go. We are human beings and this will happen when we least expect it, and our hands will grab where ever there is something to grab on. But you have this Home Depot key carabiner with the line wrapped around your hand. When you start to fall after the failure, your hand will grab the line even tighter and prevents the friction hitch to activate. This causes the unstoppable fall to the ground.
What are your thoughts about this, and have you tested who will win during this kind of event, the friction hitch or the mini carabiner and hand of a baffled human?
@@ollivihermaa This is a great question and it’s obviously subjective because there are variables such as reaction time, someone’s weight and experience. In our opinion, in an instance like you’ve given, the rappel device had catastrophic failure meaning it dropped quicker than your cheap (25 to 40 lbs breaking strength) carabiner can apply the force required to move the hitch. One thing I should probably have announced slightly better in the video is that I keep my hitch with a light amount of friction on it so that it stays partially engaged. If the device did fail, the drop would apply more force to the hitch (and faster) than my cheap carabiner could apply. The force required to break the hitch while partially loaded is greater than the tensile strength of the cheap carabiner. Another thing worth mentioning is that when people fall, the initial reaction is subjective. Many often reach inward towards trees or branches rather than just pulling on a small piece of paracord… At least that’s what most guys we spoke to, who have suffered a fall (even a short fall) have reported. Also worth mentioning is pulling the cord in any direction other than straight down, would allow the hitch to grab with a stronger force than the carabiner could handle. We did go through a couple of faux falls to reaffirm that the carabiner would bend or break away when the “shock” load was applied by disengaging the gri gri handle. The biggest idea behind this video is that running the high side hitch and tender allows you to use the device in a hands free manner without fear of the device brake failing, so that guys can safely do things like remove their one stick, platforms or other methods from the tree safely. As with all things, practicing letting go of the carabiner (muscle memory) would also assist in making sure the back up performed its function each time. Thank you for the great talking point and hopefully others take the time to think about worse case scenarios like you have.
Thank you! I’ve been looking for a way to do this.
There are two important parts to making this work;
1- make sure whatever carabiner, or s biner you use is barely big enough to clip onto the rope. Smaller and tighter is better so that it doesn’t slip off the hitch cord
2- make sure the hitch cord isn’t tight while tending it, if it’s still under load or bound tightly, you’ll be fighting it all the way down. To grab, the cord only needs a partial pull once it’s been set and broke free. Thanks again for watching and if you have any issues feel free to reach out to us. Happy hunting
@@WoodHuntingSaddles thank you for the added tips. That makes sense for sure. I already have a small nite ize s-biner.
Why buy a device you don't need and have to back it up? A Munter hitch with the rope and carabiner does the job well.
Hi Zane. We love the super Munter for emergency rappel and that will be on display at our Saddle Flaooza meet up. The negative is if you tie the Munter incorrectly in the dark, that can lead to an accident. Also you can’t ascend on a Munter. A big advantage mechanical belay devices have are that you can connect them on the ground and never come off the device throughout your entire hunt, including your ascent and descent.
Hi thanks for this - I’m using 9mm CE rope for rappel - is a sewn eyed 8mm cord(30ish inches) appropriate for the friction hitch backup here
@@phaupt123 8mm on a 9 mm rope will work with additional wraps but ideally your hitch cord should be between 60 and 80 percent the size of your rappel rope for a more reliable hold. I would recommend 7mm eye to eye cord and try the schwabisch, distel, or our personal favorite: the Cornell hitch. We sell a 29” eye to eye cord that is 7mm on our website.