Arguing with a narcissistic individual is like shoveling in a blizzard. Exhausting and futile. Make the move to Healthy and melt that mess away! Stay Healthy!!
I was told yesterday by my partner you're 100 percent responsible it's all you and don't open your mouth you are a Moron and other nasty words. I can't take it anymore staying with a relative do not want to go back. It's disturbing new start for me I have to do this.👊👊👊😢
Narcissists act like you are an employee. A very unsatisfactory one, at that. They take a tone that is very disapproving, and love to tell you where you are falling short of their expectations. They misread your intentions, or just distort them to make it sound like you are the one to blame for things not working out. If you stay silent, they blame you for not caring. If you try to explain your feelings, they blame you for "attacking" them. If you stick to the observable facts, they say, "That's not what happened." There is no winning in the Narcissist Game of Life. The game is rigged in their favor, and they insure that it will remain so.
I was a Jehovah's Witness for over 50 years. I left the DOOMSDAY CULT about 5 years ago. The leadership are all narcissistic sinister psychopaths who are CULT leaders who destroy families.
@@atomisum6445 Constantly being in the shadow of disapproval is awful. We end up questioning ourselves constantly, questioning our own validity and judgement, and even if we are convinced we are not to blame for their behavior, we still have it under our skin, and find we obsess over recent interactions with them, trying to resolve it. We cannot. They are like poison ivy, and they can steal years from our lives just by being in contact with us. Being able to think of them in their own bubble, in their own space that has nothing to do with you, helps. Like a speedbump you must drive over several times a day to get into your apartment complex, just see it as a necessary fixture that you may not be able to ever get totally rid of. But limit your driving over it, and that will help immensely.
If this happens in a worksituation, you have to stick to the facts + document. Do not bring your feelings into it, nor speak in "I- messages", as those funky consultants would have you believe. The moment you do that, they shift the narrative to: "You are oversensitive/ You are the only one with this problem/ etc." Gone, factual discussions. Only speak to them in neutral, objective tones, eg: "The info was delivered 2 weeks later than planned" "The redo did cost 10 manhours" etc. They will still contest you, but your chances are much better. And, again: Document !
The last big blow up I had with my soon to be ex husband I told him I didn’t respect him, I didn’t trust him and quite frankly I didn’t like him. I told him he wasn’t a good person and that he had a black hole where his heart should be. I told him he had no business getting married and should be alone for the rest of his life. I told him he failed miserably at being a husband and should never be in another relationship.. I told him he never had a relationship with his mom, had a falling out with his dad and ghosted his sister for no reason. He didn’t have a single relationship with any of his family whatsoever. I told him that it wasn’t ME that was the problem.. it was HIM.. you can imagine how much he liked that
6 Arguing Tactics of Narcs: 1. Refusing to take personal responsibility (Denial, Defense) 2. Reverse attention back to you (Blame shifting ARVO) 3. Paint themselves to be the Victim in the situation 4. Whittle away at the Logic in the conversation 5. Constant Interruptions (so you get sidetracked) 6. Pouting: Resentful, Stonewalling, Passive Aggressive reactions Mistakes on your part, in reacting: Respond in kind (=> you step into their game) They try to bait you, to get you to justify yourself (Just state your case once) Just stand your ground, and make your own decisions/ proceed with your own life Minimal relationship with this person
@@SurvivingNarcissism My pleasure* I make the notes for myself, so i can refer back to the content easily later: Very useful to remind myself just before i have to have a difficult conversation with one of these people. Just posted in case others feel the same. Thank you for teaching us to keep our heads & hearts clear in these fuzzy relationships, much appreciated !
This hits the nail on the head. The notes are very helpful. It's all starting to make more sense. My bru's hyper instigation of arguments always seemed to confer equal guilt on both of us so we'd both get beaten, and usually me first because I was older and should know better. It was awful.
After insult after insult, betrayal after betrayal, when you grey rock them, sometimes they will just come out of the blue and show up at your door. Usually when something is paramount in their lives as a loss to them. You should "just let it go" as they are in pain now and have decided YOU need to help them as you are so good and they only one who could. What a compliment. This happens years or months after. It's unnerving to say the least. With mine, as it always was, the performative falsetto voice and pigeon toed stance, to try to make himself sound and look meek was always pathetic, whilst saying "but you made me feel..." When you're over it, you just are. The voice changes, the foot comes back to standard as does the "you're F888cking bItch" when you tell them no, you can't come in.
I come in to listen more often when I need to refuel my knowledge and understanding and gain support from others here that I am not alone. Human interactions with this serious topic is helpful and needed.
Hi pepper. I listen everyday videos in this concept lest I forget snd get in the traps of my narc. Have the blessings of the Lord richly in your life and enjoy away from the manipulation and traps of the enemy
Narcissists do not allow their presumptions of truth to their arguments to be questioned and refuse explanations of criticism because those could lead to their arguments becoming unsubstantiated. Narcissists attempt to utilize any correlation whatsoever to imply a causal relationship.
I work with narcissists they have infinite ways to get me to react I constantly have to be aware of it so I can remember to grey rock. Ignoring it doesn't feel right as I do it, but hours later it does feels like I won. These people are so good at getting reactions it's as if they stay awake at night thinking of ways. Watching your videos helps people see that a reaction is what they want
"These people are so good at getting reactions it's as if they stay awake at night thinking of ways. "🎯 Yeah, aint that the truth... I believe they have some favorite tricks they have already finetuned on rotation, and try these on different occasions. They also pick up stuff by watching others (+ seeing what you are sensitive to). Dont forget some of these creatures have been training & educating themselves on this angle from childhood NB A work narc once told me "sometimes i think about how to get good relations with others while i am jogging" Guess i understood what he ment by that euphemism...
In my family it started generations ago, born of poverty and ignorance. Resulting in helpless babies raised to think abuse is normal. Who as adults see similarly damaged people as normal. A truly horrible situation, with no real winners. It CAN be helped. At 74, after a lifetime of struggle and yes counseling and a huge amount of suffering, I'm now doing better. I expect some of the struggle will be lifelong. But I did not pass it down, refused to pass it along. This is one victory.
@@jeankipper6954 It is indeed a victory to not pass it down, I see it this way too. I think it is also a victory to be able to say : "I'm now doing better". Keep on the good work of taking care of yourself !
@@jeankipper6954:Thanks for sharing. You are one of my heroines! ❤ I have found Dr Carter’s talks beneficial too. I wish I could adopt him! I like I’ve been through one of those car washing machines. (86 y/o, married 60 years to a 2 y/o.) Hang in there Jean, there’s light ahead!
@@jeankipper6954 Same deal here, generations of verbal, emotional, & mind games. I didn't have kids because I didn't want to take a chance of it continuing with me & I didn't want to expose them to a grandmorher that would abuse them in the same way. Yes, I got more crap from her and many other people for being 'selfish' and not 'giving her grandchildren'. I'd love to have had kids but not with the track record in the family.
Arguing with a narcissist is like trying to play chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, the pigeon will just strut around the board sh*tting everywhere and acting like it's won.
I didn’t know it when I was in it for 32 years what it was. But as I have come out of the fog and into healing and wholeness for 2 years…I get it now. Everything you said Dr. C is 💯 what I experienced. Sometimes it still takes my breath away how someone I have never met knows exactly what arguing with my X was like. Thanks for the video.
@@JoyTracie-vm1qs it’s been 30 years here too!! He split our bank account, RATHER, MADE me go do it since it was a joint account. Now he’s hiding assets, but won’t go file. In the meantime, he’s traded my car- insisted I sign the title over. Insists everything we have is HIS. There’s no hope, he’s 70. Of course, once I quit playing the games- he doesn’t LIKE me anymore.
It's been over 4 decades for me. My eyes are wide OPEN and that was a rude awakening! We are still together and probably will be until the end for one of us. The relationship is no better but I AM BETTER and living much happier now. I have a life outside of our sick relationship with healthy people. I refuse to be pulled into 'the mess' any longer!
Arrested development & preadolescence is surprisingly similar in adults who never separated from mother as toddlers but stayed in black/white thinking without a clue that true adulthood means seeing humanity in everyone… it’s like they’re living in a hall of mirrors & you were just the secondary supply mommy mirror who was supposed to validate their delusions
@@MichelleRochnergets worse as they age & I got rid of the over 70 year old by going gray rock then taking control of my life since dead & gone is the virtual equivalent of gone then dead
"Let's talk about how many times you did things wrong!'😭 Meanwhile you're asking about their infidelity and they are talking about the time you burnt dinner. It's pointless to try and have a conversation with these people.
I hear you. I've been through the same thing. My husband actually said to me, "That I was thinking too much ( about the infidelity), and he actually brought God into it and said, "In God's eyes, I did nothing wrong." I was absolutely dumbfounded! 😮😧😳
I wish I could tag my narcissistic sociopathic stalker in this. I tried going no contact 20 years ago and she still won’t go TF away. Funniest thing is, she’s always telling me what a loser I am. If I’m such a loser, why do you keep bothering me?
The narcissist is a walled in person with no exterior door handle. It swings only one way, only enough room to throw bricks at you.... they are evil to the core.....
My mother wouldn't believe anything I told her after I became an adult. Her attitude was 'If it didn't happen to me it couldn't happen to you.' Difference was she lived her whole life in Indiana working one job her entire life; I lived several places, work in different professions, traveled with a race team (she hated that because it made her 'look bad' to her friends), there was no respect atvall.
I literally had to get in my car and get away from the narcissist I'm living with and stay in a hotel (at my expense!) for the night and not only did they not care, but they're furious I stood up for myself! Unbelievable! These people are filth.
I have nothing to say to these people. I will not use my energy on them anymore, their toxic personality has done too much damage for too long. I’m learning to love me more than their toxicity.
Yes. So much yes. I can't agree with you more that to waste your time and life on such toxicity, to grant it space in one's mind, heart, soul is not something that I am willing to do any longer and support those who have come to this same conclusion. 🙂
They are threatened by your independence….boy, learning that really helped my sanity over the years of dealing with the narcs in my life I still have to associate with! When I first started working with my employer some days he would literally debate me over the weather forecast and my interpretation of what I heard or read because he watched The most accurate forecaster on tv..Before I knew about narcissism I used to think, this is so crazy, I can’t even talk to this person about the weather!!!!
Lol, you could have been talking about my partner! Anything is up for grabs with narcs! Winning is everything for them! Losing faithful people doesn't play into it.
Thank you Dr Carter , I follow your advice, I don’t listen to the illogical selfish viewpoints of the two narcissists in my life I listen to you . Nowadays I just keep my contact with them to the minimal and I maintain my civility. And I’m attuned to what to look out for going forward and as they pop up in my experience I make sure that’s a road I don’t go down .
I'm really trying and very tired. While driving last night, I hear on catholic radio two men talking on how we need to know how to talk to our husband's because men don't like being told what to do. The caller, already at a disadvantage, I am thinking must be asking herself why she was ever so compliant ?! 😅 I'm thinking do they think we needed to be told? We just did what needed to be done. When it's flipping and so many women are walking out you might think this might be an error in reasoning? I need to know if this is true. So men, let me know If this is true, and is this not to be noted as a narcissistic behavior. And I can laugh, because I know bossy women. 😂 This is just another fly in my coffee. 😤 I'm trying!
@@Ultramowing They weren't discussing abused men. It was just two men taking calls injecting that men don't like being told what to do and that we need to read up on how to talk to them kind of like a prerequisite. They were talking to women who were older, those whose husbands were semi retired or retired.
Your channel is so very unique. I love the direction you've gone with the specific subject matters of your videos. You have greatly expanded the guidelines of interaction with those we perceive as toxic.
I have lived all of these experiences that he talks about here. It was my husband for many years and I kept thinking that I would eventually get through to him but never, ever could. Then he suddenly turned completely against me and wanted a divorce which is what I wanted to. I ended up losing a lot but my head is still on my shoulders and God has taken care of me. He abandoned me with nothing except all the household furniture. It's a long story. I am just glad to be away from him and not be living these horrible experiences any more. I wish I knew then what I know now and would've gone about things differently. Anyone going through something like this with your mate should quietly look for a way out and then take it. If I had pretended to suck up to him and not openly argue with him, (arguments that I never won anyway and just caused him to go more and more against me) and then I could've gotten him to sign a few things over to me, I could've left with more financial stability. I'm 68 years old and had to go back to full time work. Had a lousy lawyer too. It's a terrible experience. Use your head and get out!
Great ideas except when you're an only child you're stuck with the narrasitic mother. She used all six during the 63 years we both lived; along with great humiliation of me with everyone else, and then she couldn't understand why I only had interaction with her when I absolutly had to. She's been gone 3 years and I'm still trying to get over all the crap. Thank for the help.
You're free now, kudos to you for lasting 63 years! You deserve a knighthood ❤ I lasted 42 years and still live in fear of bumping into her. Least you are no longer looking over your shoulder. Bless your life, good luck x
The narcissist argues while keeping their eye on the prize (you upset,offended,defensive) & the prize is like a bright shiny gumball spiralling down until you react & are in a full blown meltdown.
They have their own personal carnival going on in their head. There are many games they play, and they make you participate whether you want to or not. They corral you, and prevent you from leaving the game, for if you do, you will have accusations thrown at you as you leave. Staying and arguing gets nowhere except maybe a stroke. The only satisfactory result the narcissist will recognize is if you tell them they are RIGHT about absolutely everything, every day, every week, every month for the rest of your life around them.
@@yellowbird5411 So very true. If you are around them, they will try to beat you down, and tame you, into a depersonalised figure of obedience devoid of any personality. Then they will look down upon you, because now you are demonstrating you are "lesser" than them and cant think for yourself. This of course only strengthens their belief they have to be the leader ! The struggle for you to keep your own identity is real, and the emotional stress is causing physical problems in the end. Then they look down on you because you are "physically weak" and a nuisance. They will ignore your needs for rest / revalidation as bothersome + your own fault, due to your own ineptitude for not taking care of yourself properly (... which they prevented & thwarted every step of the way ...). This is something they cannot be accused of: they often take excellent care of themselves, first & foremost. Just leave. As quickly as you can + expect a smearcampaign when you do. Once you get ensnared by a narc, all of your moves have at least some negative consequences for yourself. They make sure of it.
@SamanthaHamlin-Pate-s3f and then they whip out their phone and start recording you when you've finally lost your cool as a result of their narc tactics. Happens in almost every argument my husband and I get into. He interrupts so much and blame shifts constantly. There's only so much I can take. I'm actually staying in a hotel right now as a result. 😞
Watching you always makes me feel so sane, Dr. C! I feel so validated and understood every time I watch a video and you put words to my experience. Bless you, Doc!
Dr. C, have you ever addressed Narcissists and their sexuality? My husband used to make me feel so bad about our sexual relationship. He was never happy about it. He would often ask me out of the blue, “when is our sex life ever going to get better?” He would keep track of how many times we had sex and throw it in my face. He didn’t understand that after grilling me that day, I certainly didn’t feel like being intimate with him. It hurt me so much and made me feel like a failure in the bedroom.
Yep, the nicest, best sex is about connection. For narcs its either a mechanical release/ an achievement/ dominance of another person They forget about the emotional connection. They do not get the body of their partner goes cold if there is no emotional connection You are not a failure, you have a normally wired body that has alarm systems in place to stop unsafe intimacy. Good for you !
They’re autoerotic not straight but often in the closet like my father who cross dressed @ nite but my mother ignored it 🤦♀️ remember they’ve never separated from mother @ age 3 & are stuck in a pre adolescent stage of arrest so expecting adult behavior from them isn’t going to work. You’re not mommy. You’re not a servant. You’re not a sex slave. They come from fear/rage/envy with no higher emotions but just stay transactional... A narcissistic trifecta is sex/cash/show & you’re simply a mirror for them
@@lisar317 I have the same experience. Never good enough. Why didn’t I respond more, you’re just lying there, etc. I started to feel like I had to perform so that he felt like we were making a film 😳. After years of criticism, I’ve cut him off. He complains, but never leaves.
It’s the ultimate mind f$&k (pun intended) to be treated like a punching bag and then be expected to want to have intimate relations with them. My body shut it down even when my mind didn’t know better. Always listen to your body folks.
Why am I talking with my therapist through homicidal thoughts after years of such abuse? Because with every interaction like this she killed me. She killed me as a father to my children, she killed me as a person of human dignity. I cannot recognize myself anymore as the person of hope, goodwill and faith in humanity that I've been before. Because everything about such continuous invalidation and punishment says: "it's better you'd be dead or gone instead if involving yourself in my realm of control". I can truly remember the immature fear and instinctive hate showing up within her whenever I challenged her; then the insidious attempts, ingenuine tactics of trying to put the blame on me for even speaking up, and showing up, having reactions, then pushing me away further and further - "your fault for being here in the first place, guess I'm still too nice for tolerating your presence at all". She wouldn't give a shit about her ex-partner or show fairness and compassion, some with her mother, and the mother of hers too. The husbands had to be lap dogs or be abandoned and it's repeating itself.
Narcissists have the ability to bring forth our most primitive and violent instincts. Please understand that her behavior is all about who she is, not about who you are. You must separate the two, as they will repeatedly try to rope you into believing it is all your fault, and accuse you of intentions, words, thoughts and actions that are not true. We have the impulse to fight off the unfairness and protect ourselves, and that is what they bait their hook with. They taunt and dare you to take the bait. The narcissist must be left in their own existence, responsible for their own actions and words, the same way we are. You are not responsible for anyone but you. How you react can be tailored, with practice. When you cannot escape a relationship such as this because you have children, taking on a flat and unreactive persona will help you immensely as you can stay centered. The efforts to game play are inevitable, but your children will see you as the hero who in spite of the games and the nastiness, stayed calm and loving toward them. If you can find a therapist that does EFT (Emotional Freedom Technique) you can free yourself up from the PTSD she has left you with in a few sessions, and the change is permanent. Save yourself, as there is no saving a narcissist.
After my wife died my mom kicked it up. A few months later my aunt moved from assistant living to a nursing home and we were moving her out of her assisted living apartment my mother wanted to go through her things to 'retrive' some things she gave her. At one point one of the other people there asked if I had lost my wife a couple months ago. I said yes. She then asked what my plans were. My mother answered; "He's going to come live with his mommy!" I had a pair of nine inch shears in my lap and when I looked down I saw them blood covered in a bad labeled 'Prosecustion evidence #1'. There was the worse thought of murder I had.
@@haworthlowell805 Appalling stuff, as if the loss of your wife (!) wasn't enough to go through, you had to realize how your mother never saw you as an adult or separate person, and all she could do in that moment was mocking you. I can relate how indignant und hurtful that must have been and there is no excuse for that. Also, narcissists/abusers outliving the decent and loving people is a travesty in itself. Really sorry to hear that. Make their opinions never matter to you again. Hope you'll have the space the deal with and reflect on your complicated times, and the remembering your marriage is place of solace for you. I personally tend to think of my life in episodes now. Some of them can remind me of who I've been, what I wanted from life, and what matters and what I was supposed to have. (sorry for the mistakes, composing text on youtube is a bit of a pain)
@@cruisemissle87 Oh, she was a treat all my life. When my wife was going through cancer treatment I was cleaning the house, cooking, laundry, plus whatever outside work, my mom's reaction, she called me PW! But then after my wife died mom would call and ask me if I was doing my dishes, keeping my house/clothes clean, everything I was doing while she called me PW but now, because there wasn't a woman around telling me what to do, I was incapible of doing it without a woman telling what to do!
Hi Dr C been watching you for years and you always always hit the nail on the head. My father is a monster. I am 62 now he is 88 I live next door to him and mom She is a casualty in this it's sad because I rarely see her because I ve gone as little contact with him as possible hopefully soon her and I will be alone
I'm so thankful for this channel! I'd been struggling to understand mine and my mums relationship and couldnt put my finger on what was wrong. The last few years ive noticed how she interacts with other people and im positive she is a vulnerable narcissist or has avoidant personality disorder. I thought i was loosing my mind as every visit has this awful tension peppered throughout. if im making sandwiches for everyone else in the house and my mums round, ill offer her one, and she will say "no" but in a way where shes sounds like she does really want it. I used to make her one anyway and she would either get annoyed or would sometimes eat it. So ive started treating her like everyone else..if she says "no", then she means ,"no". Ill ask her twice to make sure, then when everyones eating their sandwich she will somehow become very meek and quiet as if weve left her out. I dont know how she does it shes a professional at making you feel guilty.Dont get me wrong, there are times when we have pleasant conversations about topics but its never very deep. I feel sorry for her as she doesnt get out far (i think theres some agoraphobia there aswell) and has to walk the same streets wherever she goes. Im painting an awful picture here and shes definitely not as hard work as some people have to deal with but im fustrated!! 😂 think this is my longest comment I've ever put on youtube i just needed to vent! ❤
I am always laughing while I watch your videos. So many things you say are SO TRUE, and bring to mind how ridiculous my narc was. Of course, when I was in the middle of one of these manipulative situations, there was nothing to laugh at. I was so trusting of him, and he took full advantage. Being in the middle of the situation brings a kind of blindness at their silliness. Now, I look forward to any interactions because he doesn't phase me anymore. He is still ridiculous and childish, it just doesn't affect me anymore. Thanks, Dr C, for helping me out of the chains and shackles. I'm 3 years free!! And I finally love myself again!!❤❤
Great video, Les - thank you. Sometimes, you really don't know who you're dealing with. . . until you're done dealing with them. And perhaps, nothing changes until I do.
Thank you so much for all the amazing content and great advice! Expecting reciprocal conversations with people who have NPD traits is not worth you breath, time and energy!
Thank you for your video, again, it’s really helping me to keep strong. I’ve been no contact for a few months with my relative but now she’s been in touch, messaging me, wanting to see me, asking how I am and my family. I answered her at first but for the last few messages I’ve read, I’ve not responded. I can’t bear to see her again, to live in constant fear that she’s judging me and finding all manner of faults with me, including ones in her head only. She is very controlling and even messaged me to say if I meet with her for coffee she will stay longer, what she means is she will dominate my Christmas celebrations again. Thank you so much for the videos, I’m not going to see her or respond I’m so much happier and feel safer with no contact.
i recommend regularly reading the descriptions in the list of "Logical Fallacies", wikipedia, it helped me a lot being able to readily recognize and name a "strawman" or a "tuo quoque/what about you?" or a "begging the question" BS argument, and over 40 others, and i can catch myself before i inadvertently use such toxic tactics in a conversation or to delude myself
Yessssss. This was the right time. I was about to get entangled with a female narcissist. First time i ghosted someone and it kinda feels like avoiding death.
So accurate. You described my situation perfectly. I am in No Contact, and he's gone. You need a bottle of liquor when you get done with them, all I can say. The Merry-go-round of Crazy.
Thank you. Your guidance has brought me so much relief. I was/am able to understand the horrible work relationship I had. What’s hard, I endured the abuse for 3 years. Not until the last year did I finally figure out what was going on. But by this time it was too late, she made me the bad guy and I lost my job. She isolated me among other things and the two men (leadership) became her flying monkeys. She convinced them everything was my fault. People in leadership and HR desperately need to be skilled in this behavior. I got zero help. But I stayed true to myself, I refused to be broken.
I keep seeing this 85 year-old man at my local park that will disagree with almost anything I say. I'm trying to avoid him, but it's hard because he goes to the park every day. I mentioned the other day that FEMA sent electric chainsaws to Hurricane Helene victims and said that was weird because there's no electricity in the North Carolina Appalachian Mountains. He disagreed with me by saying they probably don't have gasoline too. It's a lot easier to get gasoline shipped there in trucks than it is to get the power grid up again. He's blind in his left eye and I asked him if that makes it hard for him to walk because of how it hurts his depth perception and balance. I asked him because I recalled a Bible story in 1 Samuel 11:2 where an Ammonite king told an Israeli city they could live if they paid him tribute and he let them blind them in their right eye. I thought maybe there was a difference in how being blind in the right eye would be worse than the left eye when it came to depth perception and balance, but I think it has to do with right handed people being able to use a bow or a sling weapon. His response to me was to say that it did hurt his depth perception and balance a lot. I said to him that makes sense it would hurt those things when he was disagreeing with me about the right eye being worse to lose. I noticed though when I agreed with him that for a moment he stopped to think about how to disagree with me again because I had just said something that agreed with what he said. What I've noticed is that when talking to this guy he doesn't actually care about anything I'm saying because sometimes after a minute he starts looking at his watch. It's like a game to him to disagree with me no matter how stupid he looks. I heard his daughter no longer talks to him from another guy at the park and now I know why.
In my case you were damned if you did and damned if you didn't. You could argue, but the nex had a million ways of twisting everything you said around to make himself the victim and you the villain.
I remember the three words this way Dr. C. A person and I had a difference. She said, lets talk about it in person. When I was headed to see a friend, she blew up in a rage and said, "I don't want to talk." Then she blocked the stairs turned around and raged at me. I turned and went back to my apartment. Im done with her so now I am struggling on how to detach. I was fearful when she raged and I don't ever want to go through that again.
They impose themselves on your work. I had someone who wanted to help me. I said ok and they did, but sort of took over to seem like what they were doing was more efficient and pointed out something I was going to do but wasn’t my priority. The next time, when the person asked me, I said no thanks I’m ok. The person became very upset and I asked the person why they were upset. The reply was because I made them feel regret for the person to even have asked me for the help.
Refusing to take responsibility is usually followed by throwing someone else under the bus. Sadly that includes blaming children or “loved” ones, as long as they come out as victims.
Dr Carter, while I'm listening to you, I keep thinking about a man from church, who is about 81 years of age. My husband , my 17 year old daughter, and myself, attends a church that has about 25 members or less in attendance, on any given Sunday. We joined this church in 2021. Since then, we have been actively involved in all the activities. Once a month we have business meetings. Most of the members are senior citizens. The church looks like a small traditional church in the country, surrounded by a good amount of land. About 3 of the senior citizen men mow the grass, but the garden in front of the church is not maintained well enough, because it requires more manual labor. I suggested in our business meeting that we hire a landscaper to maintain the garden. The church agreed to allow me to find someone for the job. The 81 year old man, wasn't for my idea, and he wanted to be present the day the young landscaper arrived to do the job. After that day, the young landscaper never returned. When I mentioned in the next business meeting, my intention to find out why he didn't return, the 81 year old man, quickly chimed in, that the young landscaper had to probably do catch-up work on his other properties, due to all the rain we had been getting. I did talk to the young guy, but I really felt like he wasn't being transparent with me; he was just playing clueless. My point is, I have no way of proving anything, but I feel very strongly that the 81 year old, sabotaged my efforts. It's so sad, when you go through the proper channels to accomplish something, and someone sabotages your efforts. I just don't know what to think about someone who claims to be a christian, and yet, behaves in such an ungodly manner. What do you think?
Imo, they have near zero empathy or understanding of you as a separate person. I ended up the dysregulated one because the feedback I was getting was so confusing. The constant monitoring of my behaviour, what I say what I do how I think how I feel. Everything is done from their beliefs needs and wants to manipulate in the direction they want things to go. Then when you go against their advise, they withdraw all support and help. The nail in the coffin with my mother was when I andsked her to try and understand my illness and how it affects me so we could interact better and ao interact didn't feel so alone with it , she came straight back with "I don't need to know that". That's been her unspoken attitude my whole life, as I scrambled to get her to see and hear me and love me for who I am and not what she wants me to be. Decades of trying to please this woman who is never pleased anyway.
Dr C, what do you think about the "new" position (so to speak) of dr Peter Salerno on narcissism? A conversation between you two would be very interesting. Actually, I think I have understood dr Salerno main points. However, for me, it's not very clear, for example, the possible behavioral change or any other attitude change for us, victims/survivors... if there are any change to do , in the case he is right and/or in a more correct direction. This question is for everybody in Team Healthy, too
Dr. Les, why is it that 2 siblings from the same parents can be so different? One is highly narcissistic, and the other one is not?? Thank you in advance
Am I the only person to say Hey Bud The Couch Dog!!!! That doggie is so DONE with narcissists. ✔️ My favorite toddler antic is when they get caught RED HANDED in the cookie jar, and they cry, “But everyone else did it!!!” This list is EVERYTHING. Thank You For Your Life Saving Work!!! Thank you, sweet dog.
My husband is 84, typical narcissist who's made my life hell, and I'm 76. I've cut his hair for him most of our married life. I don't want to do it anymore. I've suggested he goes to an hairdresser, but he gets really mad and nasty. I also want him to make an appointment with a podiatrist instead of me looking after his feet. I'm just dreading saying anything to him. Any advice on how to deal with this situation would be appreciated. And yes, I should have left years ago. Missed my best opportunity when I was 35 😢
I was in the same boat. I knew ahead of time he would be angry, so I steeled myself to be calm and direct. Just said "I'm not going to do that anymore. From now on, please have professionals tend to your haircut and pedicures." Of course he was angry and accused me of being unloving. I just mentally shrugged. It's not easy but it's worth it.
@isobelshaw3958 I always wonder if in particular cases like this [ _meaning a very old narcissist who could blame someone for whatever and then start a bad smear campaign_ ] would it be better telling him some lies like, "I have problems with my hands / eyes / back" "the doctor told me to have a rest for my shoulders / arms / hands / back / legs" "Unfortunately, I have serious physical problems doing those movements" . My thought (I mean, choosing lies, not choosing the direct truth) is based on the age factor of the narcissist Plus, the age and the situation of a victim who can't go No Contact. Any thoughts about that solution? Is there anything too wrong with this idea of mine?
@@DawnSelby-k5w Thank you. I have told him. He's remained silent about it, so far. His reaction will come when I've made the appointments. I have to take him as he can't drive.
I refuse to argue with my mother full stop, I've seen how she behaved with my stepdad, I've had constant frustrations with her and yet I was not being difficult with her. I was looking for guidance and caring from her as my mother. All I ever saw was that it was pointless even trying with her, to the point of not wanting to bother with her anymore. It's just sad.
Why are they always at something? Agitated, unsettled, flying around like a chicken who has no head, and mad. Acting like everything is life or death that doesn't even matter. Weirdos. They drive me nuts.
Unfortunately, when you are around them too much and/ or dependent on them for something, it rubs off on you... The endless pressure (life/ death style) for the most stupid, unimportant details. Simple contentment goes out of the window..
I tell my sister that she is talking to me in a condescending manner and is being very disrespectful. Suddenly the topic is about character types and how some folks need respect from people more than others. The topic is not that she was behaving disrespectfully in my eyes. The topic is that I have a problem with gaining respect from people and what I should do to change that. As you said in another video there is just no getting through to a highly narcissistic person (not sure if I should call her a narcissist in the clincal sense but she's certainly on the edge, ugh).
When arguing with someone narcissistic, toxic or even someone who may be somewhat uninformed about what’s acceptable, would asking them: “Can you prove you know what you’re talking about?” be a big mistake? A lot of toxic people have views or ways of doing things that seem completely out of the norm. Sometimes I feel I need proof from different sources and perspectives to accept someone’s opinion or way of doing things is actually okay.
With my narcissistic wife I just don't get her she spends more time my daughter's house who is 40 . She goes down to my daughter's for a weekend a week when I say what about me and my dog answer none . She still does not talk illustrious to she makes arguments about anything
Dr Carter what can you do when you have an entirely different value system from your family? Opposite political, religious views, views on the environment, different values and world views all together and your family can't accept this and gets really angry and personally abusive? How do you handle this?
If you want to keep a relationship with them, you will have to know it will be shallow by necessity. BTW, you're not alone with this problem. It's rampant. Thanks, Snowbear.
What worked for me was to run like a bunny. 1,000 miles and NO responding to them is very effective. Sometimes not easy at all--but FAR easier than dealing with that specious behavior.
@@jeankipper6954 I already live 3000 km away and have not seen my sister in 15 years. She won't see me because I refuse to see her husband because he has been abusive to me. They have refused family therapy.
My Mum does that (4-6) so many Times. I get angry, argumentativ and so on. I don't want that being told ..i don't know what i say. I can't completely cut her off.
This entire topic of narcissistic (selfish) tendency or to the extreme is pointless to analyze. Whomever is speaking will speak same to the one complaining of 'this tendency' (it's a no win situation) The reason it exists one to other and other to the one trying to make aware. The answer: DON'T QUARREL. Romans 12:18 If possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all. When another makes a statement, but does not ASK what do you think? Do not respond. (anything said will be met with OH YEA?) Remain MYSTERY and let them state whatever they wish to vent. Best method of response is "I can certainly sense your (anger, hurt, confusion)." I hope sharing has helped you. (which is the job of those professional counselors, right Dr. Carter?) Trying to discuss problems another 'vents' is a 'damned if do talk and damned if we don't talk' scenario. THE BEST FRIENDSHIPS ... listen and then say, HEY, let's go 'drown the sorrows' in lunch (I'm starved) or let's go to a movie, play, or get some exercise. (best to DO THINGS WITH rather than chat ...and live peacefully) The problem one, will forget the problem when they get their mind off of (whatever). NEVER DISMISS their 'feelings' ... empathize with (I can certainly sense your (anger, frustration, hurt, confusion) or don't worry... you are a good person, you'll work it out.
RELIGION is the 'faith in practice' . . . putting GOD first, in the ORDER OF A GOOD LIFE. Praise to Him for our blessings, Petitions 'as one' for those 'not in understanding of the GO(O)D spirit yet, Thanksgiving for our good health, mind and body and spirit ... so as to serve 'in the world of flesh' in whatever vocational occupation or profession. When HE is remembered by 'sitting one hour' with HIM who lives, moves, and has being in us... HE grows the faith in our soul, by HIS PRESENCE in the soul. Do 'our own thing' and HE diminishes in soul and 'we are left to fend for self' (oooh boy) So many moved from religion in the mid 1960s... which is reason for this topic called narcissistic, to the extreme or degrees aka tendencies of selfISH demeanor. LORD, for the sake of your sorrowful passion...bring enlightenment to the spiritually ignorant. (called 'know nots')
Arguing with a narcissistic individual is like shoveling in a blizzard. Exhausting and futile. Make the move to Healthy and melt that mess away! Stay Healthy!!
We used: “Cleaning the house while the kids are present and/or awake, is like brushing your teeth while eating Oreos.”
I was told yesterday by my partner you're 100 percent responsible it's all you and don't open your mouth you are a Moron and other nasty words. I can't take it anymore staying with a relative do not want to go back. It's disturbing new start for me I have to do this.👊👊👊😢
God bless 🙌 ❤
@@Ratgirl2 I’m so sorry. You really do have to get away. Don’t waste 30 years. They will never change.
@@BaraSchmidt Nicely put 💖
When the Narcissist gets that way.. I found saying this to myself was very helpful.. Tell yourself IT'S NOT MY PROBLEM, IT'S HIS
Narcissists act like you are an employee. A very unsatisfactory one, at that. They take a tone that is very disapproving, and love to tell you where you are falling short of their expectations. They misread your intentions, or just distort them to make it sound like you are the one to blame for things not working out. If you stay silent, they blame you for not caring. If you try to explain your feelings, they blame you for "attacking" them. If you stick to the observable facts, they say, "That's not what happened." There is no winning in the Narcissist Game of Life. The game is rigged in their favor, and they insure that it will remain so.
I was a Jehovah's Witness for over 50 years. I left the DOOMSDAY CULT about 5 years ago. The leadership are all narcissistic sinister psychopaths who are CULT leaders who destroy families.
These comments have a way of explaining how I feel better than I can. It's comforting that I'm not alone but depressing finding some clarity
@@atomisum6445 Constantly being in the shadow of disapproval is awful. We end up questioning ourselves constantly, questioning our own validity and judgement, and even if we are convinced we are not to blame for their behavior, we still have it under our skin, and find we obsess over recent interactions with them, trying to resolve it. We cannot. They are like poison ivy, and they can steal years from our lives just by being in contact with us. Being able to think of them in their own bubble, in their own space that has nothing to do with you, helps. Like a speedbump you must drive over several times a day to get into your apartment complex, just see it as a necessary fixture that you may not be able to ever get totally rid of. But limit your driving over it, and that will help immensely.
gaslighting ramps up and blameshifting. There s no resolve in dealing with a con artist. The more you explain the worse it gets
If this happens in a worksituation, you have to stick to the facts + document. Do not bring your feelings into it, nor speak in "I- messages", as those funky consultants would have you believe. The moment you do that, they shift the narrative to: "You are oversensitive/ You are the only one with this problem/ etc." Gone, factual discussions. Only speak to them in neutral, objective tones, eg: "The info was delivered 2 weeks later than planned" "The redo did cost 10 manhours" etc. They will still contest you, but your chances are much better. And, again: Document !
#4: They try to whittle away at your sense of logic by bringing up a completely different argument (topic).
the Non Sequiturs are flying wildly
Diversion tactics.
They'll revert to a victim of trauma if you are starting to win so your empath side switch up for pitty
@@susanmercurio1060 Yes, because the more intelligent ones begin to suspect that their behavior is not good.
@@mikebott6940 I don't believe that they are either intelligent (at least in emotional intelligence) or that they are capable of introspection.
The last big blow up I had with my soon to be ex husband I told him I didn’t respect him, I didn’t trust him and quite frankly I didn’t like him. I told him he wasn’t a good person and that he had a black hole where his heart should be. I told him he had no business getting married and should be alone for the rest of his life. I told him he failed miserably at being a husband and should never be in another relationship.. I told him he never had a relationship with his mom, had a falling out with his dad and ghosted his sister for no reason. He didn’t have a single relationship with any of his family whatsoever. I told him that it wasn’t ME that was the problem.. it was HIM.. you can imagine how much he liked that
6 Arguing Tactics of Narcs:
1. Refusing to take personal responsibility (Denial, Defense)
2. Reverse attention back to you (Blame shifting ARVO)
3. Paint themselves to be the Victim in the situation
4. Whittle away at the Logic in the conversation
5. Constant Interruptions (so you get sidetracked)
6. Pouting: Resentful, Stonewalling, Passive Aggressive reactions
Mistakes on your part, in reacting:
Respond in kind (=> you step into their game)
They try to bait you, to get you to justify yourself (Just state your case once)
Just stand your ground, and make your own decisions/ proceed with your own life
Minimal relationship with this person
Thanks for the good notes!!
@@SurvivingNarcissism My pleasure* I make the notes for myself, so i can refer back to the content easily later: Very useful to remind myself just before i have to have a difficult conversation with one of these people. Just posted in case others feel the same.
Thank you for teaching us to keep our heads & hearts clear in these fuzzy relationships, much appreciated !
Really wonderful comments and right on!
This hits the nail on the head. The notes are very helpful. It's all starting to make more sense.
My bru's hyper instigation of arguments always seemed to confer equal guilt on both of us so we'd both get beaten, and usually me first because I was older and should know better. It was awful.
After insult after insult, betrayal after betrayal, when you grey rock them, sometimes they will just come out of the blue and show up at your door. Usually when something is paramount in their lives as a loss to them. You should "just let it go" as they are in pain now and have decided YOU need to help them as you are so good and they only one who could. What a compliment. This happens years or months after. It's unnerving to say the least. With mine, as it always was, the performative falsetto voice and pigeon toed stance, to try to make himself sound and look meek was always pathetic, whilst saying "but you made me feel..." When you're over it, you just are. The voice changes, the foot comes back to standard as does the "you're F888cking bItch" when you tell them no, you can't come in.
I come in to listen more often when I need to refuel my knowledge and understanding and gain support from others here that I am not alone. Human interactions with this serious topic is helpful and needed.
Hi pepper. I listen everyday videos in this concept lest I forget snd get in the traps of my narc. Have the blessings of the Lord richly in your life and enjoy away from the manipulation and traps of the enemy
Narcissists do not allow their presumptions of truth to their arguments to be questioned and refuse explanations of criticism because those could lead to their arguments becoming unsubstantiated. Narcissists attempt to utilize any correlation whatsoever to imply a causal relationship.
From the way you are able to so clearly articulate your point, I know that you have a lot of experience with these creatures.
I work with narcissists they have infinite ways to get me to react I constantly have to be aware of it so I can remember to grey rock. Ignoring it doesn't feel right as I do it, but hours later it does feels like I won. These people are so good at getting reactions it's as if they stay awake at night thinking of ways. Watching your videos helps people see that a reaction is what they want
🙏
"These people are so good at getting reactions it's as if they stay awake at night thinking of ways. "🎯 Yeah, aint that the truth... I believe they have some favorite tricks they have already finetuned on rotation, and try these on different occasions. They also pick up stuff by watching others (+ seeing what you are sensitive to). Dont forget some of these creatures have been training & educating themselves on this angle from childhood
NB A work narc once told me "sometimes i think about how to get good relations with others while i am jogging" Guess i understood what he ment by that euphemism...
Facts of life they do not sleep I can't make this up
When you put it that way, it is a wonder that narcissists have anybody in their lives at all.
In my family it started generations ago, born of poverty and ignorance. Resulting in helpless babies raised to think abuse is normal. Who as adults see similarly damaged people as normal. A truly horrible situation, with no real winners.
It CAN be helped. At 74, after a lifetime of struggle and yes counseling and a huge amount of suffering, I'm now doing better. I expect some of the struggle will be lifelong.
But I did not pass it down, refused to pass it along. This is one victory.
@@jeankipper6954 It is indeed a victory to not pass it down, I see it this way too.
I think it is also a victory to be able to say : "I'm now doing better".
Keep on the good work of taking care of yourself !
@@jeankipper6954me ❤️🩹 2 now @ 66 never married or had kids but both my younger sister & I had careers in helping professions instead ♥️
@@jeankipper6954:Thanks for sharing. You are one of my heroines! ❤ I have found Dr Carter’s talks beneficial too. I wish I could adopt him! I like I’ve been through one of those car washing machines. (86 y/o, married 60 years to a 2 y/o.) Hang in there Jean, there’s light ahead!
@@jeankipper6954 Same deal here, generations of verbal, emotional, & mind games. I didn't have kids because I didn't want to take a chance of it continuing with me & I didn't want to expose them to a grandmorher that would abuse them in the same way. Yes, I got more crap from her and many other people for being 'selfish' and not 'giving her grandchildren'. I'd love to have had kids but not with the track record in the family.
Going no contact is SOOOOOO freeing!
Yeeeeeeesss.
I wish I could go no contact but I'm not financially able so I'm just stuck.
@@SurvivingNarcissism I did it a month ago with my father. The letters keep coming.
Arguing with a narcissist is like trying to play chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, the pigeon will just strut around the board sh*tting everywhere and acting like it's won.
Love this analogy!
Oh that's perfect! 😂
🤣🤣🤣
This is the most accurate description of I’ve ever seen!!!
😂😂😂😂
I didn’t know it when I was in it for 32 years what it was. But as I have come out of the fog and into healing and wholeness for 2 years…I get it now. Everything you said Dr. C is 💯 what I experienced. Sometimes it still takes my breath away how someone I have never met knows exactly what arguing with my X was like. Thanks for the video.
@@JoyTracie-vm1qs it’s been 30 years here too!! He split our bank account, RATHER, MADE me go do it since it was a joint account. Now he’s hiding assets, but won’t go file. In the meantime, he’s traded my car- insisted I sign the title over. Insists everything we have is HIS. There’s no hope, he’s 70. Of course, once I quit playing the games- he doesn’t LIKE me anymore.
It's been over 4 decades for me. My eyes are wide OPEN and that was a rude awakening! We are still together and probably will be until the end for one of us. The relationship is no better but I AM BETTER and living much happier now. I have a life outside of our sick relationship with healthy people. I refuse to be pulled into 'the mess' any longer!
@@a.pepper6687 when you think back over the course of relationship, SO much becomes clear.
Arrested development & preadolescence is surprisingly similar in adults who never separated from mother as toddlers but stayed in black/white thinking without a clue that true adulthood means seeing humanity in everyone… it’s like they’re living in a hall of mirrors & you were just the secondary supply mommy mirror who was supposed to validate their delusions
@@MichelleRochnergets worse as they age & I got rid of the over 70 year old by going gray rock then taking control of my life since dead & gone is the virtual equivalent of gone then dead
"Let's talk about how many times you did things wrong!'😭 Meanwhile you're asking about their infidelity and they are talking about the time you burnt dinner. It's pointless to try and have a conversation with these people.
I hear you. I've been through the same thing. My husband actually said to me, "That I was thinking too much ( about the infidelity), and he actually brought God into it and said, "In God's eyes, I did nothing wrong." I was absolutely dumbfounded! 😮😧😳
I wish I could tag my narcissistic sociopathic stalker in this. I tried going no contact 20 years ago and she still won’t go TF away. Funniest thing is, she’s always telling me what a loser I am. If I’m such a loser, why do you keep bothering me?
The narcissist is a walled in person with no exterior door handle. It swings only one way, only enough room to throw bricks at you.... they are evil to the core.....
"LOVE is listening."
cc. ❤
Yes, narcissists are unwilling to challenge their established beliefs and assumptions.
My narc used to challenge everything I used to tell him. He would say "How do you know that?" Drove me crazy!
My mother wouldn't believe anything I told her after I became an adult. Her attitude was 'If it didn't happen to me it couldn't happen to you.' Difference was she lived her whole life in Indiana working one job her entire life; I lived several places, work in different professions, traveled with a race team (she hated that because it made her 'look bad' to her friends), there was no respect atvall.
I literally had to get in my car and get away from the narcissist I'm living with and stay in a hotel (at my expense!) for the night and not only did they not care, but they're furious I stood up for myself!
Unbelievable! These people are filth.
There is no respect and no accountability. These types DO NOT CARE ABOUT PEOPLE.
Facts.
I have nothing to say to these people. I will not use my energy on them anymore, their toxic personality has done too much damage for too long. I’m learning to love me more than their toxicity.
Yes. So much yes. I can't agree with you more that to waste your time and life on such toxicity, to grant it space in one's mind, heart, soul is not something that I am willing to do any longer and support those who have come to this same conclusion. 🙂
Amen to that 🙏 🙏🙏
Insecurities as well as powerlessness are the true feelings that lie in wait inside every narcissist just waiting to cause trouble in any setting
#6 They save up their grievance to fuel their vindictive response far in the future.
The amount of past brought up irrelevant of the current situation is baffling
They are threatened by your independence….boy, learning that really helped my sanity over the years of dealing with the narcs in my life I still have to associate with! When I first started working with my employer some days he would literally debate me over the weather forecast and my interpretation of what I heard or read because he watched The most accurate forecaster on tv..Before I knew about narcissism I used to think, this is so crazy, I can’t even talk to this person about the weather!!!!
Lol, you could have been talking about my partner! Anything is up for grabs with narcs! Winning is everything for them! Losing faithful people doesn't play into it.
Thank you Dr Carter , I follow your advice, I don’t listen to the illogical selfish viewpoints of the two narcissists in my life I listen to you .
Nowadays I just keep my contact with them to the minimal and I maintain my civility.
And I’m attuned to what to look out for going forward and as they pop up in my experience I make sure that’s a road I don’t go down .
Keep leaning forward...I'm pulling for you.
I'm sure I will wished I could have known this a long time ago
🙏💜
Me too!
Me either.
I'm really trying and very tired.
While driving last night, I hear on catholic radio two men talking on how we need to know how to talk to our husband's because men don't like being told what to do.
The caller, already at a disadvantage, I am thinking must be asking herself why she was ever so compliant ?! 😅 I'm thinking do they think we needed to be told? We just did what needed to be done.
When it's flipping and so many women are walking out you might think this might be an error in reasoning?
I need to know if this is true.
So men, let me know If this is true, and
is this not to be noted as a narcissistic behavior.
And I can laugh, because I know bossy women. 😂
This is just another fly in my coffee. 😤
I'm trying!
@@Summer_HarvestI tried to comment with some resources about guys’ thinking, but it got filtered.
@@Ultramowing They weren't discussing abused men. It was just two men taking calls injecting that men don't like being told what to do and that we need to read up on how to talk to them kind of like a prerequisite. They were talking to women who were older, those whose husbands were semi retired or retired.
Your channel is so very unique.
I love the direction you've gone with the specific subject matters of your videos.
You have greatly expanded the guidelines of interaction with those we perceive as toxic.
I have lived all of these experiences that he talks about here. It was my husband for many years and I kept thinking that I would eventually get through to him but never, ever could. Then he suddenly turned completely against me and wanted a divorce which is what I wanted to. I ended up losing a lot but my head is still on my shoulders and God has taken care of me. He abandoned me with nothing except all the household furniture. It's a long story. I am just glad to be away from him and not be living these horrible experiences any more. I wish I knew then what I know now and would've gone about things differently. Anyone going through something like this with your mate should quietly look for a way out and then take it. If I had pretended to suck up to him and not openly argue with him, (arguments that I never won anyway and just caused him to go more and more against me) and then I could've gotten him to sign a few things over to me, I could've left with more financial stability. I'm 68 years old and had to go back to full time work. Had a lousy lawyer too. It's a terrible experience. Use your head and get out!
I feel for you x I'm in pain too
"You know, that's your pitiable life and I'm sorry that you're there." Perfectly said.
Thank you Dr. Carter❤
Great ideas except when you're an only child you're stuck with the narrasitic mother. She used all six during the 63 years we both lived; along with great humiliation of me with everyone else, and then she couldn't understand why I only had interaction with her when I absolutly had to. She's been gone 3 years and I'm still trying to get over all the crap. Thank for the help.
I hear you! 😕
You're free now, kudos to you for lasting 63 years!
You deserve a knighthood ❤
I lasted 42 years and still live in fear of bumping into her.
Least you are no longer looking over your shoulder. Bless your life, good luck x
@@susan-ij5fh Thank you; I'm working on it.
The narcissist argues while keeping their eye on the prize (you upset,offended,defensive) & the prize is like a bright shiny gumball spiralling down until you react & are in a full blown meltdown.
They have their own personal carnival going on in their head. There are many games they play, and they make you participate whether you want to or not. They corral you, and prevent you from leaving the game, for if you do, you will have accusations thrown at you as you leave. Staying and arguing gets nowhere except maybe a stroke. The only satisfactory result the narcissist will recognize is if you tell them they are RIGHT about absolutely everything, every day, every week, every month for the rest of your life around them.
@@yellowbird5411 So very true. If you are around them, they will try to beat you down, and tame you, into a depersonalised figure of obedience devoid of any personality. Then they will look down upon you, because now you are demonstrating you are "lesser" than them and cant think for yourself. This of course only strengthens their belief they have to be the leader ! The struggle for you to keep your own identity is real, and the emotional stress is causing physical problems in the end. Then they look down on you because you are "physically weak" and a nuisance. They will ignore your needs for rest / revalidation as bothersome + your own fault, due to your own ineptitude for not taking care of yourself properly (... which they prevented & thwarted every step of the way ...). This is something they cannot be accused of: they often take excellent care of themselves, first & foremost. Just leave. As quickly as you can + expect a smearcampaign when you do. Once you get ensnared by a narc, all of your moves have at least some negative consequences for yourself. They make sure of it.
I had a colleague who delighted in pushing my buttons. Generally in an impish way but more often not. He fell down his stairs at 42 and died.
@SamanthaHamlin-Pate-s3f and then they whip out their phone and start recording you when you've finally lost your cool as a result of their narc tactics. Happens in almost every argument my husband and I get into. He interrupts so much and blame shifts constantly. There's only so much I can take. I'm actually staying in a hotel right now as a result. 😞
Watching you always makes me feel so sane, Dr. C! I feel so validated and understood every time I watch a video and you put words to my experience. Bless you, Doc!
You are quite welcome!
Dr. C, have you ever addressed Narcissists and their sexuality? My husband used to make me feel so bad about our sexual relationship. He was never happy about it. He would often ask me out of the blue, “when is our sex life ever going to get better?” He would keep track of how many times we had sex and throw it in my face. He didn’t understand that after grilling me that day, I certainly didn’t feel like being intimate with him. It hurt me so much and made me feel like a failure in the bedroom.
Yep, the nicest, best sex is about connection. For narcs its either a mechanical release/ an achievement/ dominance of another person
They forget about the emotional connection. They do not get the body of their partner goes cold if there is no emotional connection
You are not a failure, you have a normally wired body that has alarm systems in place to stop unsafe intimacy. Good for you !
They’re autoerotic not straight but often in the closet like my father who cross dressed @ nite but my mother ignored it 🤦♀️ remember they’ve never separated from mother @ age 3 & are stuck in a pre adolescent stage of arrest so expecting adult behavior from them isn’t going to work. You’re not mommy. You’re not a servant. You’re not a sex slave. They come from fear/rage/envy with no higher emotions but just stay transactional... A narcissistic trifecta is sex/cash/show & you’re simply a mirror for them
@@lisar317 I have the same experience. Never good enough. Why didn’t I respond more, you’re just lying there, etc. I started to feel like I had to perform so that he felt like we were making a film 😳. After years of criticism, I’ve cut him off.
He complains, but never leaves.
It’s the ultimate mind f$&k (pun intended) to be treated like a punching bag and then be expected to want to have intimate relations with them. My body shut it down even when my mind didn’t know better. Always listen to your body folks.
@@caroleminke6116wow! Bingo!
Communication with my narcissistic sibling has vastly improved since I quit speaking to them two years ago.
Why am I talking with my therapist through homicidal thoughts after years of such abuse? Because with every interaction like this she killed me. She killed me as a father to my children, she killed me as a person of human dignity. I cannot recognize myself anymore as the person of hope, goodwill and faith in humanity that I've been before. Because everything about such continuous invalidation and punishment says: "it's better you'd be dead or gone instead if involving yourself in my realm of control". I can truly remember the immature fear and instinctive hate showing up within her whenever I challenged her; then the insidious attempts, ingenuine tactics of trying to put the blame on me for even speaking up, and showing up, having reactions, then pushing me away further and further - "your fault for being here in the first place, guess I'm still too nice for tolerating your presence at all". She wouldn't give a shit about her ex-partner or show fairness and compassion, some with her mother, and the mother of hers too. The husbands had to be lap dogs or be abandoned and it's repeating itself.
Narcissists have the ability to bring forth our most primitive and violent instincts. Please understand that her behavior is all about who she is, not about who you are. You must separate the two, as they will repeatedly try to rope you into believing it is all your fault, and accuse you of intentions, words, thoughts and actions that are not true. We have the impulse to fight off the unfairness and protect ourselves, and that is what they bait their hook with. They taunt and dare you to take the bait. The narcissist must be left in their own existence, responsible for their own actions and words, the same way we are. You are not responsible for anyone but you. How you react can be tailored, with practice. When you cannot escape a relationship such as this because you have children, taking on a flat and unreactive persona will help you immensely as you can stay centered. The efforts to game play are inevitable, but your children will see you as the hero who in spite of the games and the nastiness, stayed calm and loving toward them. If you can find a therapist that does EFT (Emotional Freedom Technique) you can free yourself up from the PTSD she has left you with in a few sessions, and the change is permanent. Save yourself, as there is no saving a narcissist.
After my wife died my mom kicked it up. A few months later my aunt moved from assistant living to a nursing home and we were moving her out of her assisted living apartment my mother wanted to go through her things to 'retrive' some things she gave her. At one point one of the other people there asked if I had lost my wife a couple months ago. I said yes. She then asked what my plans were. My mother answered; "He's going to come live with his mommy!"
I had a pair of nine inch shears in my lap and when I looked down I saw them blood covered in a bad labeled 'Prosecustion evidence #1'.
There was the worse thought of murder I had.
@@haworthlowell805 Appalling stuff, as if the loss of your wife (!) wasn't enough to go through, you had to realize how your mother never saw you as an adult or separate person, and all she could do in that moment was mocking you. I can relate how indignant und hurtful that must have been and there is no excuse for that. Also, narcissists/abusers outliving the decent and loving people is a travesty in itself. Really sorry to hear that. Make their opinions never matter to you again. Hope you'll have the space the deal with and reflect on your complicated times, and the remembering your marriage is place of solace for you. I personally tend to think of my life in episodes now. Some of them can remind me of who I've been, what I wanted from life, and what matters and what I was supposed to have. (sorry for the mistakes, composing text on youtube is a bit of a pain)
@@cruisemissle87 Oh, she was a treat all my life. When my wife was going through cancer treatment I was cleaning the house, cooking, laundry, plus whatever outside work, my mom's reaction, she called me PW! But then after my wife died mom would call and ask me if I was doing my dishes, keeping my house/clothes clean, everything I was doing while she called me PW but now, because there wasn't a woman around telling me what to do, I was incapible of doing it without a woman telling what to do!
@@haworthlowell805 They won't get. It's that simple: they just don't get it, underneath it all.
Hi Dr C been watching you for years and you always always hit the nail on the head. My father is a monster. I am 62 now he is 88 I live next door to him and mom She is a casualty in this it's sad because I rarely see her because I ve gone as little contact with him as possible hopefully soon her and I will be alone
They twist and bend the truth to suit themselves. I prefer Guslighting to gaslighting 😉
Guslighting 😊😅😮😢🎉😂❤ a new word for the Webster Dictionary!!!
@hchayes9431 I can't take the credit, however. It's a term used among Team Healthy 👍
Great Gus, our Doctor rules,
This is so accurate it is scary. 😱
I'm so thankful for this channel! I'd been struggling to understand mine and my mums relationship and couldnt put my finger on what was wrong. The last few years ive noticed how she interacts with other people and im positive she is a vulnerable narcissist or has avoidant personality disorder. I thought i was loosing my mind as every visit has this awful tension peppered throughout. if im making sandwiches for everyone else in the house and my mums round, ill offer her one, and she will say "no" but in a way where shes sounds like she does really want it. I used to make her one anyway and she would either get annoyed or would sometimes eat it. So ive started treating her like everyone else..if she says "no", then she means ,"no". Ill ask her twice to make sure, then when everyones eating their sandwich she will somehow become very meek and quiet as if weve left her out. I dont know how she does it shes a professional at making you feel guilty.Dont get me wrong, there are times when we have pleasant conversations about topics but its never very deep. I feel sorry for her as she doesnt get out far (i think theres some agoraphobia there aswell) and has to walk the same streets wherever she goes. Im painting an awful picture here and shes definitely not as hard work as some people have to deal with but im fustrated!! 😂 think this is my longest comment I've ever put on youtube i just needed to vent! ❤
I am always laughing while I watch your videos. So many things you say are SO TRUE, and bring to mind how ridiculous my narc was. Of course, when I was in the middle of one of these manipulative situations, there was nothing to laugh at. I was so trusting of him, and he took full advantage. Being in the middle of the situation brings a kind of blindness at their silliness. Now, I look forward to any interactions because he doesn't phase me anymore. He is still ridiculous and childish, it just doesn't affect me anymore. Thanks, Dr C, for helping me out of the chains and shackles. I'm 3 years free!! And I finally love myself again!!❤❤
Great video, Les - thank you. Sometimes, you really don't know who you're dealing with. . . until you're done dealing with them. And perhaps, nothing changes until I do.
Thank you so much for all the amazing content and great advice! Expecting reciprocal conversations with people who have NPD traits is not worth you breath, time and energy!
Thank you for your video, again, it’s really helping me to keep strong. I’ve been no contact for a few months with my relative but now she’s been in touch, messaging me, wanting to see me, asking how I am and my family. I answered her at first but for the last few messages I’ve read, I’ve not responded. I can’t bear to see her again, to live in constant fear that she’s judging me and finding all manner of faults with me, including ones in her head only. She is very controlling and even messaged me to say if I meet with her for coffee she will stay longer, what she means is she will dominate my Christmas celebrations again. Thank you so much for the videos, I’m not going to see her or respond I’m so much happier and feel safer with no contact.
Yes Dr Carter I make him miserable you are explaining it to a T. It's a nightmare don't dare give your opinion. 😮
It won’t change honey. Next they will claim YOU, have mental illness. What?
i recommend regularly reading the descriptions in the list of "Logical Fallacies", wikipedia, it helped me a lot being able to readily recognize and name a "strawman" or a "tuo quoque/what about you?" or a "begging the question" BS argument, and over 40 others, and i can catch myself before i inadvertently use such toxic tactics in a conversation or to delude myself
Yessssss. This was the right time. I was about to get entangled with a female narcissist. First time i ghosted someone and it kinda feels like avoiding death.
So accurate. You described my situation perfectly. I am in No Contact, and he's gone. You need a bottle of liquor when you get done with them, all I can say. The Merry-go-round of Crazy.
They do do this! Unfortunately some workplaces are full of these people.
Thank you. Your guidance has brought me so much relief. I was/am able to understand the horrible work relationship I had. What’s hard, I endured the abuse for 3 years. Not until the last year did I finally figure out what was going on. But by this time it was too late, she made me the bad guy and I lost my job. She isolated me among other things and the two men (leadership) became her flying monkeys. She convinced them everything was my fault. People in leadership and HR desperately need to be skilled in this behavior. I got zero help. But I stayed true to myself, I refused to be broken.
Setting the pace and one big ugly mess. Pretty much describes it. 😢
I haven't finished a sentence in over 20 years. Don't even attempt to have an adult conversation with them, it's futile.
I keep seeing this 85 year-old man at my local park that will disagree with almost anything I say. I'm trying to avoid him, but it's hard because he goes to the park every day. I mentioned the other day that FEMA sent electric chainsaws to Hurricane Helene victims and said that was weird because there's no electricity in the North Carolina Appalachian Mountains. He disagreed with me by saying they probably don't have gasoline too. It's a lot easier to get gasoline shipped there in trucks than it is to get the power grid up again.
He's blind in his left eye and I asked him if that makes it hard for him to walk because of how it hurts his depth perception and balance. I asked him because I recalled a Bible story in 1 Samuel 11:2 where an Ammonite king told an Israeli city they could live if they paid him tribute and he let them blind them in their right eye. I thought maybe there was a difference in how being blind in the right eye would be worse than the left eye when it came to depth perception and balance, but I think it has to do with right handed people being able to use a bow or a sling weapon. His response to me was to say that it did hurt his depth perception and balance a lot. I said to him that makes sense it would hurt those things when he was disagreeing with me about the right eye being worse to lose. I noticed though when I agreed with him that for a moment he stopped to think about how to disagree with me again because I had just said something that agreed with what he said.
What I've noticed is that when talking to this guy he doesn't actually care about anything I'm saying because sometimes after a minute he starts looking at his watch. It's like a game to him to disagree with me no matter how stupid he looks. I heard his daughter no longer talks to him from another guy at the park and now I know why.
In my case you were damned if you did and damned if you didn't. You could argue, but the nex had a million ways of twisting everything you said around to make himself the victim and you the villain.
I remember the three words this way Dr. C. A person and I had a difference. She said, lets talk about it in person. When I was headed to see a friend, she blew up in a rage and said, "I don't want to talk." Then she blocked the stairs turned around and raged at me. I turned and went back to my apartment. Im done with her so now I am struggling on how to detach. I was fearful when she raged and I don't ever want to go through that again.
They impose themselves on your work. I had someone who wanted to help me. I said ok and they did, but sort of took over to seem like what they were doing was more efficient and pointed out something I was going to do but wasn’t my priority. The next time, when the person asked me, I said no thanks I’m ok. The person became very upset and I asked the person why they were upset. The reply was because I made them feel regret for the person to even have asked me for the help.
Refusing to take responsibility is usually followed by throwing someone else under the bus. Sadly that includes blaming children or “loved” ones, as long as they come out as victims.
I have rarely liked a video as fast as now. Good summary of the bs I deal with a narc sibling.
Thank you!
Thank you Dr Carter
An excellent video
Very helpful
A lot of great advise
Dr Carter, while I'm listening to you, I keep thinking about a man from church, who is about 81 years of age. My husband , my 17 year old daughter, and myself, attends a church that has about 25 members or less in attendance, on any given Sunday. We joined this church in 2021. Since then, we have been actively involved in all the activities. Once a month we have business meetings. Most of the members are senior citizens. The church looks like a small traditional church in the country, surrounded by a good amount of land. About 3 of the senior citizen men mow the grass, but the garden in front of the church is not maintained well enough, because it requires more manual labor. I suggested in our business meeting that we hire a landscaper to maintain the garden. The church agreed to allow me to find someone for the job. The 81 year old man, wasn't for my idea, and he wanted to be present the day the young landscaper arrived to do the job. After that day, the young landscaper never returned. When I mentioned in the next business meeting, my intention to find out why he didn't return, the 81 year old man, quickly chimed in, that the young landscaper had to probably do catch-up work on his other properties, due to all the rain we had been getting. I did talk to the young guy, but I really felt like he wasn't being transparent with me; he was just playing clueless. My point is, I have no way of proving anything, but I feel very strongly that the 81 year old, sabotaged my efforts. It's so sad, when you go through the proper channels to accomplish something, and someone sabotages your efforts. I just don't know what to think about someone who claims to be a christian, and yet, behaves in such an ungodly manner. What do you think?
Imo, they have near zero empathy or understanding of you as a separate person. I ended up the dysregulated one because the feedback I was getting was so confusing. The constant monitoring of my behaviour, what I say what I do how I think how I feel. Everything is done from their beliefs needs and wants to manipulate in the direction they want things to go. Then when you go against their advise, they withdraw all support and help. The nail in the coffin with my mother was when I andsked her to try and understand my illness and how it affects me so we could interact better and ao interact didn't feel so alone with it , she came straight back with "I don't need to know that". That's been her unspoken attitude my whole life, as I scrambled to get her to see and hear me and love me for who I am and not what she wants me to be. Decades of trying to please this woman who is never pleased anyway.
Im interested to learn if gaslighting is related to early onset dementia
Dr C, what do you think about the "new" position (so to speak) of dr Peter Salerno on narcissism?
A conversation between you two would be very interesting.
Actually, I think I have understood dr Salerno
main points. However, for me, it's not very clear,
for example, the possible behavioral change or
any other attitude change for us, victims/survivors... if there are any change to do , in the case he is right and/or in a more correct direction.
This question is for everybody in Team Healthy, too
There is no cure for NPD. Sadly. But there is free therapy & education at team healthy! Thankfully
My Narc deflects during these times.
Dr. Les, why is it that 2 siblings from the same parents can be so different? One is highly narcissistic, and the other one is not?? Thank you in advance
@feelgoodgenerationx680 probably have different father's like my situation
Am I the only person to say Hey Bud The Couch Dog!!!!
That doggie is so DONE with narcissists. ✔️
My favorite toddler antic is when they get caught RED HANDED in the cookie jar, and they cry,
“But everyone else did it!!!”
This list is EVERYTHING.
Thank You For Your Life Saving Work!!!
Thank you, sweet dog.
Gus is inspirational!
Ohh love the title. Imona Cook my pizza from scratch then enjoy this with dinner. Thank you.
My husband is 84, typical narcissist who's made my life hell, and I'm 76. I've cut his hair for him most of our married life. I don't want to do it anymore. I've suggested he goes to an hairdresser, but he gets really mad and nasty. I also want him to make an appointment with a podiatrist instead of me looking after his feet. I'm just dreading saying anything to him. Any advice on how to deal with this situation would be appreciated. And yes, I should have left years ago. Missed my best opportunity when I was 35 😢
I was in the same boat. I knew ahead of time he would be angry, so I steeled myself to be calm and direct. Just said "I'm not going to do that anymore. From now on, please have professionals tend to your haircut and pedicures." Of course he was angry and accused me of being unloving. I just mentally shrugged. It's not easy but it's worth it.
@isobelshaw3958
I always wonder if
in particular cases like this
[ _meaning a very old narcissist who could blame
someone for whatever and then start a bad smear campaign_ ]
would it be better telling him some lies like,
"I have problems with my hands / eyes / back"
"the doctor told me to have a rest for my shoulders / arms / hands / back / legs"
"Unfortunately, I have serious physical problems doing those movements" .
My thought (I mean, choosing lies, not choosing the direct truth)
is based on the age factor of the narcissist
Plus, the age and the situation of a victim who can't go No Contact.
Any thoughts about that solution?
Is there anything too wrong with this idea of mine?
My wasband tried to have me cut his hair. But he sure didn't like my giggling.
@@DawnSelby-k5w Thank you. I have told him. He's remained silent about it, so far. His reaction will come when I've made the appointments. I have to take him as he can't drive.
I refuse to argue with my mother full stop, I've seen how she behaved with my stepdad, I've had constant frustrations with her and yet I was not being difficult with her. I was looking for guidance and caring from her as my mother. All I ever saw was that it was pointless even trying with her, to the point of not wanting to bother with her anymore. It's just sad.
Gray rock didn't work I was told I'm not going to take this what is wrong with YOU. It's so disturbing.
, I used to have questions, but my community does great questions, great helpful comments
Gray rock keeps us from reacting emotionally. It doesn't change their behavior unfortunately, just our reactions.
@@DawnSelby-k5w
Yes I'm done no more 😏😏
Why are they always at something? Agitated, unsettled, flying around like a chicken who has no head, and mad. Acting like everything is life or death that doesn't even matter. Weirdos. They drive me nuts.
Unfortunately, when you are around them too much and/ or dependent on them for something, it rubs off on you...
The endless pressure (life/ death style) for the most stupid, unimportant details. Simple contentment goes out of the window..
Toddlers
I tell my sister that she is talking to me in a condescending manner and is being very disrespectful. Suddenly the topic is about character types and how some folks need respect from people more than others. The topic is not that she was behaving disrespectfully in my eyes. The topic is that I have a problem with gaining respect from people and what I should do to change that. As you said in another video there is just no getting through to a highly narcissistic person (not sure if I should call her a narcissist in the clincal sense but she's certainly on the edge, ugh).
When arguing with someone narcissistic, toxic or even someone who may be somewhat uninformed about what’s acceptable, would asking them: “Can you prove you know what you’re talking about?” be a big mistake? A lot of toxic people have views or ways of doing things that seem completely out of the norm. Sometimes I feel I need proof from different sources and perspectives to accept someone’s opinion or way of doing things is actually okay.
A slightly milder way of getting to your point would be...help me understand how you learned about this. It would feel less competitive in nature.
With my narcissistic wife I just don't get her she spends more time my daughter's house who is 40 . She goes down to my daughter's for a weekend a week when I say what about me and my dog answer none . She still does not talk illustrious to she makes arguments about anything
She's been doing this for years I have no problem with her going down to my doses when this goes on and on I find it ridiculous
Just LEAVE.
Dziekuje!
Dr Carter what can you do when you have an entirely different value system from your family? Opposite political, religious views, views on the environment, different values and world views all together and your family can't accept this and gets really angry and personally abusive?
How do you handle this?
If you want to keep a relationship with them, you will have to know it will be shallow by necessity. BTW, you're not alone with this problem. It's rampant. Thanks, Snowbear.
@@SurvivingNarcissism Thanks, Dr Carter.
What worked for me was to run like a bunny. 1,000 miles and NO responding to them is very effective. Sometimes not easy at all--but FAR easier than dealing with that specious behavior.
@@jeankipper6954 I already live 3000 km away and have not seen my sister in 15 years. She won't see me because I refuse to see her husband because he has been abusive to me.
They have refused family therapy.
I am at the point where I called the police and found out what my options are..
My Mum does that (4-6) so many Times. I get angry, argumentativ and so on. I don't want that being told ..i don't know what i say. I can't completely cut her off.
1:42 I Knew It ...... Gaslighters!
The narcissist’s weakness is the truth. That’s why they distort and manipulate. Stick to the truth and avoid bringing your feelings into the conflict.
That is soooo true!!!
Thanks!
Thank you!
Dr. C, you have almost a million subscribers! Hug Gus for me! Good to see you both!
Thanks, Joanna. See if you can get 200,000 of your closest friends to join us!!
3:10 It Is Nuts 🐿️
Hi Gus! 😂❤
My dear friend China 😅
Is this psychology or based in psychological findings?
I was in an active practice of psychotherapy for 40 years. Most of my teachings are drawn directly from my observations in the counseling office.
This entire topic of narcissistic (selfish) tendency or to the extreme is pointless to analyze. Whomever is speaking will speak same to the one complaining of 'this tendency' (it's a no win
situation) The reason it exists one to other and other to the one trying to make aware. The answer: DON'T QUARREL. Romans 12:18 If possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all. When another makes a statement, but does not ASK what do you think? Do not respond. (anything said will be met with OH YEA?) Remain MYSTERY and let them state whatever they wish to vent.
Best method of response is "I can certainly sense your (anger, hurt, confusion)." I hope sharing has helped you. (which is the job of those professional counselors, right Dr. Carter?) Trying to
discuss problems another 'vents' is a 'damned if do talk and damned if we don't talk' scenario. THE BEST FRIENDSHIPS ... listen and then say, HEY, let's go 'drown the sorrows' in lunch (I'm starved)
or let's go to a movie, play, or get some exercise. (best to DO THINGS WITH rather than chat ...and live peacefully) The problem one, will forget the problem when they get their mind off of (whatever). NEVER DISMISS their 'feelings' ... empathize with (I can certainly sense your (anger, frustration, hurt, confusion) or don't worry... you are a good person, you'll work it out.
🙏🩵
RELIGION is the 'faith in practice' . . . putting GOD first, in the ORDER OF A GOOD LIFE. Praise to Him for our blessings, Petitions 'as one' for those 'not in understanding of the GO(O)D spirit yet, Thanksgiving for our good health, mind and body and spirit ... so as to serve 'in the world of flesh' in whatever vocational occupation or profession. When HE is remembered by 'sitting one hour'
with HIM who lives, moves, and has being in us... HE grows the faith in our soul, by HIS PRESENCE in the soul. Do 'our own thing' and HE diminishes in soul and 'we are left to fend for self' (oooh boy) So many moved from religion in the mid 1960s... which is reason for this topic called narcissistic, to the extreme or degrees aka tendencies of selfISH demeanor. LORD, for the sake of your sorrowful passion...bring enlightenment to the spiritually ignorant. (called 'know nots')
Your courses are too expensive.