Stop Euro Nymphing and Start Drop Shotting
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- Опубліковано 4 вер 2024
- This system gives you way more control over your drift, depth, drag, and increases your ability to catch more trout while fly fishing. Part 1 and 2 of Dave Rothrock's Drop Shot videos originally posted on the Suffering Outdoors channel. Learn how to use the drop shot system and catch more trout.
Great explanation on how to use a dropper system. Like you, I prefer using unweighted nymphs on this system. Well done Dave, very educational.
I love your channel and videos! Thank you for watching and commenting! Keep up the good work!
Bloody brilliant! All my fly gear is "on loan" with my 30yr old son, who lives 800kms from me and is now used wholly for salt water work. I have given him my 5 and 8 wt gear to use and he has caught several impressive fish in the year or so he has been learning his craft. Your set up is the answer to noodling around rock and reef while fishing the sands, estuaries and bays that dot his home turf, (Port Lincoln and the Eyre Peninsular, South Australia). The terrain often involves fast rips and scour outs that fish lurk in and ambush prey. The permutations of the rig and its application are many and varied and I will be referring him to this production tonight! Also, I now have a solid excuse to go buy another setup or two as mine are just too far away, dum de dum. Great, well explained and demonstrated topic David, you've hooked me good and proper, thankyou.
Thanks for watching, and your thoughts are spot on!
I have been using this method for many years. I is my most effective way to nymph fish for a majority of conditions.
Great tutorial!
Thanks for watching!
When I was a young scout, one of my leaders fished the provo river in utah almost every day. He fished with this method. So this is how I learned how to fly fish. It is effective!
This is the smartest advice on nymphing I think I have ever watched.
Dave is a fabulous guide and teacher. I have had the benefit of his instruction on a few occasions. All advice was spot on. tight lines!
Thanks, Andy!
In many places in Europe this technique is not allowed, that's why Euro nymphing was developed. In some way you can cheat a little bit using a two nymph rig, with a really heavy nymph in the bottom. And, this is also going to be forbiden sooner or later, at least here in Spain. Great to see how you guys fish, hope some day I travel there to enjoy your great waters!
I apparently subscribed to your channel sometime back. Don't know why I haven't been getting recommended your videos more. The information in this video is PRICELESS! You are clearly knowledgeable. I'll have to go back through your catalog and watch your other videos!! Thank you and tight lines! 🎣
Thanks! Let us know if there is a video topic you are interested in and would like to see!
I just started fly fishing this summer and I’ve been finding myself using those smaller midges and attractor nymphs the most. I feel like I just came across a dirty secret 😊 genius!
True story, I took a client out on a private stretch of water with a guide. The guide was helping my client and I kept catching fish. He came over and asked me quietly how I was set up. I showed him my drop shot rig and all he said was “dirty bird…”
@@therantingangler oh yeah I’m definitely in the right place. I love the little story. Cheers!
Most informative! Best instructional I've seen in years and I will adapt this system immediately!! Thank you
Thanks for watching!
Fast tie tool makes this method easy. Thanks for the video
Deadly rig high sticking in tight. I use a high vis butt section for a sighter with a perfection loop to attatch my leader. Also I switched from tags to tippet rings tied inline, much easier in my opinion than tags. Great video sir!
Thanks for watching.
Nice 🎣 video Dave 👍. As some of my fishing buddy's, have a go at me . For carrying a micro spinning reel, for those tricky situations. No back casting room, can't wade out, & no chance to use a pinch cast. I use small split shots, to make it like a dragon weight . You also get called out on , using a ultra light spinning rod with a bubble float. For dry fly fishing.
it depends on the river, I gave it up on the Yakima because of snag ups and re-tying constantlu😮
Excellent description and love how you over analyze every aspect of your system! Thank you for sharing! Sub'd
This is such a pragmatic approach to nymphing, and even if you’ve gone heavily into the Euro Nymphing approach, you can incorporate much of the gear and the thinking in a drop shot system. It’s just so much quicker and easier to add or subtract weight this way. Regarding weight, it appears that you stick with BB shots. Is that correct? Obviously, there are ways to complicate it, but do you really go out with just the BB size shot? I guess a lot of us are wondering if we have to complicate it further or if that is enough to deal with the vast majority of situations you might encounter.
John answering on behalf of Dave, I have a multiple size shot and will start with around half the weight I think I need then add on based upon how quickly I’m getting down and how often I’m ticking bottom. Earlier in the year I’m using a lot of weight like 2 BBs. Later in the year I might be using two size 4s which is equivalent to one BB but having two spread out a little helps with getting my shot snagged.
Indeed a nice technique, I use drop shotting a lot for blackbass or other fishes but in the Pyrénées there is not enough water at all, that's why euro nymphing is a thing, there's no other way to fish truits in 20cm max of water, our rivers are much, much smaller.
I’ll give it a shot for sure!
Really enjoy all of it thanks for sharing
I just don’t understand how the presentation with a dry fly will look like with a leader like that, I guess I’ll have to try😅 🙏
thank you thank you ..... its more practical , , much easier to add or remove weight
Thanks for watching!
Great tip but check local regulations. On sections of The Salmon river here in NY weight below the fly is not permitted
Also in California as well. Damn snaggers use this kind of set up
That's why I mentioned some states have banned this set-up. Thanks for watching.
I was just thinking about the salmon River while watching this. Then, ran across this comment.
Dave , are you still using 5 ft of .016" Stren Clear Blue above your .014 sighter section? Looks like you also did away with 3X in the formula? Good follow up video, thanks for the info.
Very interesting thoughts. I still rather use tungsten bead flies and euro nymping since I have better contact to my flies and it's easy to feel all the takes instantly. Sometimes if I need longer casts I use NZ style rig with normal fly line.
Fly fishermen on the Provo River in Utah have been using this technique for decades. We call it a “bounce rig” because the shot bounces along the bottom letting you know that you are getting your nymphs down in the strike zone. If your line isn’t bouncing then add more shot.
Yeah same concept, curious the proper fly rigging procedure. Tags? Or in line?
@@therantingangler Tags exactly as you described.
The information shared is very valuable thank you. I also saw a magnifying glass in the hat, is it useful, could you share a link if you have one. Use pliers if you bite a bullet. regards
I've only been fly fishing for 3 years. Typically, when I go out, I bring 3 to 4 rods with me, and fish for 8 to 12 hours, and try 3 to 4 different styles of fishing for the duration. I fish a couple times a week usually. What I have found is that drop-shotting, or bounce rigs as they're called around here, are more effective than euro rigs, at least in the hands of a guy with 3 years experience. I have also found that I lose way way more flies with Euro than with drop shotting. I think fly shops actually promote Euro because they make more money on flies, haha.
I like switching back and forth between drop shot rig and tandem euro rigs. I just add a drop shot above the bottom fly using a uni knot. Works great!
Very interesting video with excellent information.
Thanks for watching!
Every technique has its time and place
True. Thanks for watching.
Excellent presentation and explanation.
Glad it was helpful!
Make a video on how you tie in all your stuff would be very helpful thanks for the great inf though
Yup, I'd like that too! Also, I just don't get a blood knot tag. I use a davy knot for speed. The rest of the video is very cool! Thanks.
Interesting …. I usually tie my tags a bit longer but will shorten them now! Thanks
It's called bounce nymphing in Utah and has been used since the 1930's. Strike indicators were added in the early 80's but some prefer sighters. It's the only way I know to slow the flies down and the weights bouncing the bottom animate the nymphs too.
Yep. And I fish it with a sighter or indicator. Conditions dictate. Thanks for watching.
Been tying a texas rig and drop shots on my fly rod since I got it
Thanks for watching.
How about an A-Rig?
@@highthai7 I find my tippet can hinge too much if the weight is up the line any
Oh wow I knew I wasn't the only one tight lining before the pond jumpers arrived ,its how I mostly fish steel head and salmon,wayyy back
Yes, some of us have been doing it for longer than most would have imagined. Thanks for watching!
This systhem will never ever beat french leader nymphing.
Never used that system but I incorporate a long mono leader with the drop shot. You might be surprised at how effective it is if you try it.
@@therantingangler i have been experimenting with different kinds of ESN for about 20 years now. I have fished these systms all over the world and learned from world champions. I fished the world championships in Bosnia Herzegovina in 2015. Almost all contenders fish the same systems. All the winners pretty much do exactly the same. These people have perfected this way of fishing in amazing details. There's now way a system with split shots could even be half as effective. You need direct contact with your fly from all angles. And fish will 100% attack the splitshots. There's so many reasons why french leader style fishing will beat this system any day anywere and any time. Trust me 😎
Correct.Been doing so for years.Tight Lines.BTW tying a second fly in at the bend of the first some six inches away is deadly,no upper dropper to tangle.Non toxic shot of course.
Thanks for watching.
That’s way better than this euro nymphing in my opinion. Cool idea!
Thanks for watching.
What size mono is placed above the sighter?
I wonder how using adjustable tags with a small perfection loop above a triple surgeons know would work?
It'd work, but the sliding loop knot slides too easily in my opinion. I use a unit knot for the sliding tag. It holds much tighter and still slides. The knot is quicker too than a perfection loop too, well, according to my fingers. Haha. Cheers
Thank you for Part 2 of the video. Answered a lot of questions i had in Part 1.
As for “ethical or not ethical” when it comes to ‘is this fly fishing or not?’, i don’t think it’s a matter of ethics. It’s a matter of spirit of fly fishing. Thusly, i don’t think this is technically fly fishing. To me what makes fly fishing differentiated from other forms is the physics of having the FLY LINE act as the weight to propel lure to fish (as opposed to the physics of the weight residing in the split shot, the live bait, or the weighted lure like a crank bait). Since this method (which I LOVE by the way) places the physics of the weight primarily on the split shot at the END of your terminal tackle (as opposed to IN THE LENGTH of the fly line), this violates the spirit of fly fishing. You can argue then that with my definition, nymph fishing with split shot or weighted flies where the physics of delivering lure to fish mouth is NOT in the fly line is ALSO not true fly fishing, then yes, nymph fishing is not really fly fishing. Indeed, i have a VERY narrow-minded and elitist view of fly fishing…i admit that. I believe in dries and emergers, matching the hatch, sight-casting, three-quarter casts upstream, etc. etc. etc., but that’s more a function of what i learned the first 20 years of my fly fishing on (i.e., tailwater, nanoflies in 20-28, size 8 tippets, overlapping hatches, etc.) and less a function of my fishing DNA.
In any case, I will try your method…i can’t believe no one has combined drop-shotting and nymph in before. It’s rather brilliant! Thanks for sharing your decades of expertise. Truly Hall of Fame approach and content!
We appreciate your thoughts and opinions on what is truly fly fishing. I would agree this method takes the art of fly casting out of fly fishing. But we feel using more natural realistic flies without beadheads is a nice trade off. My favorite method to fish is dry fly fishing and we are purists when it comes to that. Under high water flows in early spring, we will use this method to catch fish when they aren’t looking up despite the blurred lines of “true fly fishing”.
At 17 minutes. Could you use tippet rings for a switch out?
I don’t mean at the dropped tags but at the top for those times when you switch to dry droppers.
You can use tippet rings but Dave and I prefer just tying knots and not dealing with the tippet rings.
This is really great. Which # Orvis non toxics are you using please?
Orvis has an option to buy multiple sizes in one pack. I would start with that then the amount or size depends on water speed and depth. It takes a little tinkering to find the right balance each time you go out.
@@therantingangler excellent thank you so much,I'm going to try it tomorrow.
I make my own drop shot weights from W beads. Specially bent wire is inserted through the (slotted) W bead and glued in place. These allow me to on/off or move the weight just like a miniature bass sized drop shot. Great feel of the bottom with W. The other non-toxics are too light in some stretches. No pliers needed. Use the weights you’re no longer incorporating into flies.
Do you use a blood from your 2x mono to your 4x tippet or a tippet ring?
Dave doesn’t use tippet rings so either a blood knot or I use a surgeons knot.
This method is all well and good, however on most rivers in UK your not allowed the use of 'Drop shot'
Are you really able to cast long mono leader? In my experience all you can do is water load and fling it back up. How do you switch to drys without chaning your entire leader?
Dave isn’t using a true mono right now setup. He is using a very long leader he is able to cast more easily that he incorporates sighter so he can switch back and forth. I can cast a mono rig about 15-20 feet max.
Sinking line cast upstream and mended seems to work for me
Thanks for watching. It's all about what works for you.
To metoda znana od zeszłego wieku 😊 jako metoda żyłkowa , zdominowała zawody muchowe w Polsce , bardzo skuteczna jaśli chodzi o łowienie małych rybek co niestety przyczynia się do wyrybienia rzek .Powinna zostać zakazana lub mocno ograniczona
agree 100% with the value of a drop-shot rig. But I disagree that the only way to achieve versatility (nymphing to dries, etc) is to rely on fly line vs an all mono system. If you load you reel with fly line (not Euro line) and then have 20 lb Maxima as a 25-30 foot "leader" you are still plenty versatile to throw dries. If you want to get back to fly line you can do that quickly, too.
Thanks so much for watching and providing a much apperciated comment. After a conversation with a peer I constructed such a "leader" to give it a go and also provide me with first-hand experience. Some would describe me as at least a fair caster and I struggled to present a dry fly to 30' with it. Since this set-up has been promoted to "John and Jane Q. Flyfisher" I took this set-up to a gathering of avid fly fishers with "average" casting skills. To a person none of them could present a dry to a level considered worthy of stream time. Perhaps some day I'll go more in-depth in my findings.
How is that rig to cast?
When nymphing, you are more so lobbing with your casts. If Dave switches to dries with his leader, it casts surprisingly well. I’m able to cast his setup and I’m not the greatest caster.
what happened to just a good ol dry/dropper?
I love a good dry dropper setup and it’s my favorite way to fish! But with high flows early spring, late fall, or winter, it’s not very affective.
You are shotting drop or you are dropping shot? 😊
Basically what you are saying is that folks have been euro nymphing long before they gave it that exotic name, it was just called tight line drop shot nymphing.
Can you show this stuff on a table or something. I can see anything you are talking about
Might have another video in the works for this. Thanks for watchign
Sorry but is this really FLY fishing. Just my own thought. Bass Fishers have been doing this for more than 50 Years, with ultra light spinning gear.
Cry about it. It's still using a fly, spinning gear is better anyways as it is more versatile and I never lose fish on a nice spinning reel with smooth drag. Fly rods are obsolete old tech. Fly rods are only good for people fishing small streams or people on a boat able to get where you'd be unable to cast with a fly rod.
You could say the same about euro nymphing. I don't think it is fly fishing either, but whatever, I'm happy with a fly or spin rod in my hand.
Is it legal to have weight below your flies ? I do not think this set up is legal in California
As far as I know it is not legal in CA
not everybody here lives in California. It is perfectly legal in MANY areas of the world.
@@josephine6602 I never said everyone lives in California I was just trying to spread awareness. Jeez take a pill .
@@gregorymilla9213 nope. think before you post. Your comment was indicative of someone who thinks only of their own small world.
@@josephine6602 just trying to spread awareness and prevent a giant ticket from dfg
👍👏👏
😎🎣
That is illegal in my country, if they catch you pay fine … 😂
Not legal in many places unfortunately.
Why do Americans treat it so seriously?
The only thing that I don't like about fly fishing is fly fishermen.
Moreover: stop using fly rod for drop shotting and use spinning rod. 😆
Thanks for video!
Then we couldn't say we're fly fishing...
If you put weights on your fly line to me its not truly "fly" fishing... great video sir...
We all have opinions and it is important to respect them. Thanks for watching.
Not legal in California.
What? Two hooks? I’m sure you can
@@FEAR_DaCoachYT You can't place weight/split shot below your lowest fly.
@@user-ym6ny7be5m got ya. I never fly fish. I was just thinking two hooks lol
I think this is referring to the DFW regs page 19, "Hook and Weight Restrictions TR 14, CCR 2.10 (b) (4) It is unlawful to use any weight directly attached below a
hook." I was in a fly fishing class discussing Euro Nymphing and the instructors interpretation of the regulation was that using a tag for the hook (versus an inline hook/weight) does not violate this regulation as the weight is not directly attached below the hook. It would be nice to get that directly from a game warden.
Well you can't use split shot in competition and u can just achieve same thing standard euro
One of the big advantages of the drop shot is using larger, more realistic flies. You can get down much faster or as fast as euro nymphing. There is a reason all the competition euro nymphers use very small, stripped down flies. It’s all about getting them to sink faster. You also have way more control over adjustments by adding more shot or taking shot off. Vs. cutting a fly off and adding one with more weight.
American anglers seem to make such a big deal of catching small trout.
When you live1000 miles from the Ocean in some of the most beautiful countryside on Earth its not a bad excuse to get outside and appreciate the beauty of a stream and its ecosystem. You simply can't compare a pretty mountain stream to the desert that is fishing offshore. Mountains are far more interesting.
But I get it. I've used tougher fish for bait for big saltwater fish than any trout that ever swam. If I want a real fight with unlimited tackle then Salt is where its at.
Your bigotry is showing. If you're from the UK ,I can assure you that you will find larger fish on this side of the pond than anywhere in your blessed islands.
Huge brown trout San Juan River
Fly fishing has basically become monoline fishing…the art of swing is dead
Dry fly fishing is alive and well in our area. But swinging wet flies is a lost art for sure.
"Dave Rothrock's Drop Shot" Tell Dave to buy himself a ticket to go in France and see how they're doing it, spoiler alert -> Dave's using the wrong rod and reel setup to take full advantage of this technique.
What should he be using
As an older guy, I have seen many people finding great success on the river/stream using equipment that most would deem “wrong”. A good fisherman, like a good guitar player or craftsman don’t have to depend on equipment to be successful. Besides, the rod and reel on this vid are high quality but really it’s whatever you feel comfortable with that will make for a good time on the water imho
Doesn’t ( pls excuse grammar)
@@Stonefly222 Don't need to be old or young to acquire knowledge and seeking ways of doing things... Now as for the Good or average fisherman, everyone has its own goal and when it comes down to opting for the right technique it's just about being efficient rather than stubborn snobby and absolutely wanting to use a fly rod. I adapt to what the fish want, not to my own preferences.
Actually this concept of using split shot with a larvea or a fly has been around since WW2 in France. What annoys me is when someone from another continent is just claiming the name of something that has been around for over half a century AND doesn't provide an improvement, worse part is that a less effective method is presented as "novelty" with a click bait title.
The copying attitude is in Europe too with stuff coming from the US. {I guess human nature is just full of self-centred individuals}
Makes total sense. Normal euro nymphing is constrained by competition rules which don't apply to the every day fly angler. I really love the idea of not having to tie flies in multiple weights. Just change the splitshot to adapt.