Oh and thanks to burningcherry from my discord for the Thumbnail! Edit: steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3311603479&searchtext= a mod made by OriginalPoster from my discord, who meticulously went through and updated all missions, events, decisions, triggers, etc; and replaced trade power abroad with global trade power. Enjoy!
It is already useful, at least in multiplayer. Say you own only the English Channel, if you get a ton of domestic trade power modifiers you can pull a lot more from Lubeck, Caribbean, Ivory Coast, etc… without owning a single province in those nodes. So as England for example you could focus completely on new world conquest and still snag some of the Spain player’s trade from the Ivory Coast and some of the trade from the owners of the Lubeck node. Not to mention in a dense MP game you won’t control all of the EC anyway thanks to the Netherlands and northern France being included, so it helps with that too.
@@lainling there used to be an exploit where you turn it off and on repeatedly and every time you do that it would queue a different province, click it enough times it would convert the whole node at once
@desran4447 there is nothing in principle making it impossibe, except maybe there is a limit on how many trade nodes that there are, but i dont know if it exists. You can freely define connections between trade nodes via editing the trade nodes text file. Its will just take a lot of work.
@@desran4447 Trade nodes are softcoded so there is nothing stopping you from spending a week or so adding trade nodes connecting them and checking if game crashed yet or you can keep going. Only limiting factor would be ownership of supercomputer capble of running the game afterwards sindce trade is one of main lag generators in eu4.
Wow, that's amazing. I've been trying to do this for a while, but I always had trouble with completely deleting trade nodes as lots of events and mission are linked, and it would end up crashing the game. Great job!
Do light ships protecting trade take massive attrition circumnavigating the globe or do they just all wind up in the actual English Channel area (and take massive attrition if they’re not local to it)?
@@jacob2389, the player still has naval attrition… XD Also I was unaware ai doesn’t have naval attrition… nothing stops Portugal ai from circumnavigating the world as soon as it gets admin tech 5?
@@Mordacitas7 I don't believe the player has attrition during ship missions like protect trade or explore. Additionally, the AI follows certain conditions for AI only to trigger discovery and circumnavigation.
Interesting are 2 Tradenotes, both are endtrade. The first is with all Costal Provinces and its a Tradenote with ships. The second one is with all no-costalprovinces and its just a tradenote with Inlandtrade.
Merchants dictate the maximum number of Tier 3 Centers of Trade so they are just as important as ever since T3 CoTs are waaaaay better when they affect the whole world and not just one small Trade Node that can be monopolised through conquest.
Basically think of trade as water. Collecting trade is scooping water out of the river (netting you ducats) and forwarding trade is letting the river flow downstream (which doesn't net you ducats, but it does increase the trade value by 5%, which might help if you collect downstream). Trade power is how good you are in that node at scooping water out of the river / forwarding the river (this is increased for example via light ships protecting trade). Trade value is how much water is in the river (this is increased for example by building a workshop: production in a province becomes water in that trade node). Also, you automatically collect trade in your home trade node. So at the start it's often best to just collect trade everywhere. But later on it's possible to forward trade from across half the world to your trade node of choice (say English Channel), and make a lot of money because you keep increasing the value by 5% (or even more with good modifiers) every time you forward it. How do you get so many merchants? If you assign overseas provinces to a trade company, that will give you another merchant (if you have the wealth of nations DLC).
Makes me wonder what a dynamic trade node system could look like. Like, each province us part of a region based around whatever nearby province has trade center builsings and developments. Trade capitals have connections between them, and merchants can either be on local distribution, long range connections at a trade capital, or actually travel up and down the network. Honestly seems much more likely to be the sort of addon for Victoria than Europa Universalis, though both eras had pretty distinct international trade situations.
Let's hope for EU5 having that. It kinda looked like it a little bit, and would make sense if larger nations / trade heavy nations could warp the trade landscape around them. Imagine it similar to the bloc mechanic, every main trade node of a country exerts trade pressure on the provinces around it, certain factors weaken it, like distance decreasing that pull and others increasing it, like wealth of a nation, size of their trade navy etc. and the market that has the highest influence on a tile adds that tile to its market and other nations can take those tiles away, either by war, like demanding trade rights, or enforcing naval hegemony in an area, or by diplomacy, like establishing trade posts, embargoing etc. And if your influence is consistently higher than another nations influence for a year that province becomes part of your trade node, the overall weight of a node then also decides if trade goes into your node from somewhere else or if trade is sent away. To stop the blobbing of trade nodes, at certain distances from your main node if you still have the most weight it will create a separate node that is still yours, but not part of the main node that always sends trade downstream to your main node.
Play the MEIOU and Taxes mod. In that mod, trade goods are consumed (i.e. people need salt and food, miitary needs weapons, navies needs ships) and therefore provinces buy goods. In turn, adjacent trade nodes can import / export goods to the adjacent trade nodes under specific circumstances. Having single provinces in trade nodes (like Genoa / Venice has) actually works because those single provinces let you trade in those further-away trade nodes. And if you're the one connecting valuable trade over longer distances, that's quite lucrative. And yes, if you're the first to have a series of colonies towards the east, then your income will suddenly jump by +20 or +40 ducats or so (which is huge in that mod) because you're the one who is importing Asian luxuries to Europe, which your provinces and other European countries are then buying from you. But also for example China will be buying salt from Europe and probably a few other things. It's an amazing mod but also monstrously complex.
Tbh, this could work extremely well if some things were changed. For example, privateering only affects nations with sea tiles where you locate the privateers
Would be an interesting game, although I doubt fair would be a correct word. If anything, significantly less fair as European dense trade center heavy areas will dominate even harder...
The reason the whole world is poorer is because every single trade connection multiplies the value going out by a %, depending on trade steering modifiers. The default is 5%, so even at default, trade going through 20 nodes would be 2.6 times more valuable than it was at the origin
I would like to see a comparison with normal nodes. How much steering etc. increases the money. like summing all the nodes and comparing with the 1 node
@@LemonCake101 uff that makes sense tbh, as I think theoretically every trade note would slowly but infinitely increase their value because of how goods increase value as it travels
I wonder what happens if you pick the option to turn Demak Sunni during the Majapahit disaster. Does it cause random provinces around the world to turn Sunni?
Is that ~75% green portion of the trade power in the pie chart the "native" special game tag? If so, are they receiving (and so wasting) some money or is that trade power ignored?
Do you have to be upstream to get treasure fleets, or is the same node allowed? Do privateers still get like 1 ducat of those? I suspect Arabian Plutocracies may be funny here, if they can get their mercantilism mechanic running.
curious how the ship ai works with this, if you protect trade, do the ships all go protect around the coast of holland or will they stick close to your nation, what would be the rules
Trade being a zero-sum game? Competition over finite resources ensuring everyone is worse off? Is this the textbook example of economic theory before free market capitalism? Because I've definitely read about this before.
Oh and thanks to burningcherry from my discord for the Thumbnail!
Edit: steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3311603479&searchtext= a mod made by OriginalPoster from my discord, who meticulously went through and updated all missions, events, decisions, triggers, etc; and replaced trade power abroad with global trade power. Enjoy!
This could be the first time domestic trade power is a useful modifier
It is already useful, at least in multiplayer. Say you own only the English Channel, if you get a ton of domestic trade power modifiers you can pull a lot more from Lubeck, Caribbean, Ivory Coast, etc… without owning a single province in those nodes. So as England for example you could focus completely on new world conquest and still snag some of the Spain player’s trade from the Ivory Coast and some of the trade from the owners of the Lubeck node. Not to mention in a dense MP game you won’t control all of the EC anyway thanks to the Netherlands and northern France being included, so it helps with that too.
@@nathanbean8763tryhard, all we do is blob
@@vesai1 imagine being immersied. couldnt be me
@@vesai1 Yeah! Imagine caring about ingame stuff?
And in 1445, Portugal circumnavigated the globe by setting their light fleet to protect trade
11:25 ''You can privateer literally the entire world from random native american tribes to random Australian native *american* tribes''
shhh, they are coded as native american so I will call them that
@@LemonCake101 fair
Imagine Convert Religion being used
Exactly!
Seems pretty mediocre since it's still one province at a time, even if you could get the trade power and religious majority
I think it should be the next campaign. To have 50% trade power and make one faith
@@lainling there used to be an exploit where you turn it off and on repeatedly and every time you do that it would queue a different province, click it enough times it would convert the whole node at once
Now lets go for the opposite. Each province is its own tradenode
The game might freeze the second the trade menu is loaded.
Can you even set it up? With no trade connections maybe, but then what is even the point, it will be like removing trade from the game
@desran4447 there is nothing in principle making it impossibe, except maybe there is a limit on how many trade nodes that there are, but i dont know if it exists. You can freely define connections between trade nodes via editing the trade nodes text file.
Its will just take a lot of work.
@@panwp123 Yeah, that is what I am talking about - how long will it take
@@desran4447 Trade nodes are softcoded so there is nothing stopping you from spending a week or so adding trade nodes connecting them and checking if game crashed yet or you can keep going.
Only limiting factor would be ownership of supercomputer capble of running the game afterwards sindce trade is one of main lag generators in eu4.
i didn't expect to see spiffing brit for the thumbnail
Wow, that's amazing. I've been trying to do this for a while, but I always had trouble with completely deleting trade nodes as lots of events and mission are linked, and it would end up crashing the game. Great job!
Thanks, it took a while!
What if there is a freaky node and it does freaky stuff if you interact with it
Do light ships protecting trade take massive attrition circumnavigating the globe or do they just all wind up in the actual English Channel area (and take massive attrition if they’re not local to it)?
Good point, they probably make the migration into there, with some dying on the way...
Did they add attrition back to AI navies?
@BobbiusRossius so I guess the answer to @Mordacitas is no, they don't take massive attrition.
@@jacob2389, the player still has naval attrition… XD
Also I was unaware ai doesn’t have naval attrition… nothing stops Portugal ai from circumnavigating the world as soon as it gets admin tech 5?
@@Mordacitas7 I don't believe the player has attrition during ship missions like protect trade or explore. Additionally, the AI follows certain conditions for AI only to trigger discovery and circumnavigation.
9:10 "This is frankly the perfect game for playmaker" Is he going to take this lying down??? Playmaker response flame war when???
Merchants are super good for hanging around in the court and allowing for lvl 3 centers of trade
Good point actually!
0:36 "New mortal enemy" Tf u do the last guy 😭
Wow lemon cake still at 4 subs and im one of those
Its actually just me, you, three other people and a swarm of bots
i am another one😂
Oh no lemon bought the low quality bots cheap bots no premium bots
Sorry, I'm one of the bots. You got me!
@@LemonCake101 Hello fellow Humans, may we partake in some joint videoludic entertainment?
i got more into eu4 so i actually understand your videos, subbed
Interesting are 2 Tradenotes, both are endtrade.
The first is with all Costal Provinces and its a Tradenote with ships.
The second one is with all no-costalprovinces and its just a tradenote with Inlandtrade.
zoroastrian persia getting more than 50% trade power should be able to convert the whole world through that
Funny that a global trade node makes it harder for global trade to spawn.
Now we need to see the opposite version. What if every area (or maybe even every province) was its own trade node?
just 3 words - Paradox Crash Reporter
Merchants dictate the maximum number of Tier 3 Centers of Trade so they are just as important as ever since T3 CoTs are waaaaay better when they affect the whole world and not just one small Trade Node that can be monopolised through conquest.
That's fair, I kinda forgot about that not going to lie
Does the lack of trade flow make tax meta a better-than-usual alternative?
Strictly speaking yes, but I believe a normal build will still win overall.
1500 hours clocked and I still don’t know how trade works
Basically think of trade as water. Collecting trade is scooping water out of the river (netting you ducats) and forwarding trade is letting the river flow downstream (which doesn't net you ducats, but it does increase the trade value by 5%, which might help if you collect downstream).
Trade power is how good you are in that node at scooping water out of the river / forwarding the river (this is increased for example via light ships protecting trade). Trade value is how much water is in the river (this is increased for example by building a workshop: production in a province becomes water in that trade node).
Also, you automatically collect trade in your home trade node.
So at the start it's often best to just collect trade everywhere. But later on it's possible to forward trade from across half the world to your trade node of choice (say English Channel), and make a lot of money because you keep increasing the value by 5% (or even more with good modifiers) every time you forward it.
How do you get so many merchants? If you assign overseas provinces to a trade company, that will give you another merchant (if you have the wealth of nations DLC).
Makes me wonder what a dynamic trade node system could look like. Like, each province us part of a region based around whatever nearby province has trade center builsings and developments. Trade capitals have connections between them, and merchants can either be on local distribution, long range connections at a trade capital, or actually travel up and down the network.
Honestly seems much more likely to be the sort of addon for Victoria than Europa Universalis, though both eras had pretty distinct international trade situations.
Let's hope for EU5 having that.
It kinda looked like it a little bit, and would make sense if larger nations / trade heavy nations could warp the trade landscape around them.
Imagine it similar to the bloc mechanic, every main trade node of a country exerts trade pressure on the provinces around it, certain factors weaken it, like distance decreasing that pull and others increasing it, like wealth of a nation, size of their trade navy etc. and the market that has the highest influence on a tile adds that tile to its market and other nations can take those tiles away, either by war, like demanding trade rights, or enforcing naval hegemony in an area, or by diplomacy, like establishing trade posts, embargoing etc. And if your influence is consistently higher than another nations influence for a year that province becomes part of your trade node, the overall weight of a node then also decides if trade goes into your node from somewhere else or if trade is sent away.
To stop the blobbing of trade nodes, at certain distances from your main node if you still have the most weight it will create a separate node that is still yours, but not part of the main node that always sends trade downstream to your main node.
Play the MEIOU and Taxes mod. In that mod, trade goods are consumed (i.e. people need salt and food, miitary needs weapons, navies needs ships) and therefore provinces buy goods. In turn, adjacent trade nodes can import / export goods to the adjacent trade nodes under specific circumstances.
Having single provinces in trade nodes (like Genoa / Venice has) actually works because those single provinces let you trade in those further-away trade nodes. And if you're the one connecting valuable trade over longer distances, that's quite lucrative.
And yes, if you're the first to have a series of colonies towards the east, then your income will suddenly jump by +20 or +40 ducats or so (which is huge in that mod) because you're the one who is importing Asian luxuries to Europe, which your provinces and other European countries are then buying from you. But also for example China will be buying salt from Europe and probably a few other things.
It's an amazing mod but also monstrously complex.
so funny video LOL! greetings frum poland.
0:19
me: well seeing this is 19 seconds into a 15 minute video, yes. Yes the game will run
The key question what happens if you properly set up trade companies
Trex is going down
We will win this!
A world where marketplaces are actually useful 😂
I mean I won't go that far...
Wait, they ain't?
Marketplaces aren’t useful?
Tbh, this could work extremely well if some things were changed. For example, privateering only affects nations with sea tiles where you locate the privateers
Would be fun to play a game like this, makes trade a lot more fair.
Would be an interesting game, although I doubt fair would be a correct word. If anything, significantly less fair as European dense trade center heavy areas will dominate even harder...
@@LemonCake101 In our crusade for fairness, the next step would be to remove all centers of trade.
as an england main i dont see what the mod changes
Everyone would love it if Persia completes its missions!
The reason the whole world is poorer is because every single trade connection multiplies the value going out by a %, depending on trade steering modifiers. The default is 5%, so even at default, trade going through 20 nodes would be 2.6 times more valuable than it was at the origin
Oh yeah, of course: I mean literally mention trade steering making everyone poorer a couple times, and do elaborate on that at the end.
9:10 that is hilarious
youtube algorithm brought me here. interesting video. i subbed.
Welcome, and enjoy!
9:04 unless i am completly mistaken doesnt the amount of merchants you have equal the amount of t3 center of trade you can have?
Before watching, expectations, china gets even richer
This one trade node scenario probably should have changed colonisation since AI tends to colonise upstream nodes.
Real GLobal Trade mod
I would like to see a comparison with normal nodes. How much steering etc. increases the money. like summing all the nodes and comparing with the 1 node
Love how Oldenburg has lower trade power than the Siberian opms
Now lets see a timelapse with lemon Cake comlentary plz
Ughhh that English channel joke kinda pissed me off xD
Sorry, I read it out and saw how bad it was, but you know what you can suffer through it too
I wonder what would happen if you made every trade steering line go both ways, so there are no end nodes or starting nodes
Crash :(
@@LemonCake101 uff that makes sense tbh, as I think theoretically every trade note would slowly but infinitely increase their value because of how goods increase value as it travels
I wonder what happens if you pick the option to turn Demak Sunni during the Majapahit disaster. Does it cause random provinces around the world to turn Sunni?
I believe that scales to specific provinces in fairness
Does anyone remember when you could make Propagate Religion stack infinitely
Is that ~75% green portion of the trade power in the pie chart the "native" special game tag? If so, are they receiving (and so wasting) some money or is that trade power ignored?
that is every other nation whose slice was too thin to show
@@LemonCake101 oh that makes much more sense
What if every state/province is it's own trade node?
What if all trade connections are inverted? So End nodes become starting nodes and vice versa
Good stuff
thanks!
Do you have to be upstream to get treasure fleets, or is the same node allowed? Do privateers still get like 1 ducat of those?
I suspect Arabian Plutocracies may be funny here, if they can get their mercantilism mechanic running.
What i want to jknow is where do ships on protect trade go? do they just sail around the entire world?
Happy 16th of August
Thank you, you too?
today's GAIL foundation day ,
now do the opposite: every province a trade node, and yes i can imagine how much work this would be
That would take a while, but could be a meme
curious how the ship ai works with this, if you protect trade, do the ships all go protect around the coast of holland or will they stick close to your nation, what would be the rules
@Lemoncake101 what about a trade node per province or state? 🙃
I did consider that, and then I concided that I would rather not
@@LemonCake101 understandable
200+ hours in EU4 - I still don't get trade
is this mod uploaded anywhere. why didn't you run an ai only game so we could see how it effected things?
no I didn't upload this one
What if there only 2 trade node and no end node ?
crash :(
trade steering feedback loop doesn't sound too good for the game
Game crashes immidietly if there exists a loop in the trade network
How much money does ming make tho?
You should do a vid on random new world, I feel like that thing is ripe for exploits
Fair, although it also just straight up doesn't work a lot of the time.
Can you share the mod? I have always wanted to do this but it is a pain in the ass to do
I didn't make it as a mod, just local file edits
can you please make it a mod for us crazy people to use
how about you just reverse the whole trade flow on the map
Interesting 😂
ai only drew durnil
Do a timelapse
Trade being a zero-sum game? Competition over finite resources ensuring everyone is worse off?
Is this the textbook example of economic theory before free market capitalism? Because I've definitely read about this before.
Sir this is an Eu4 video
I feel like you're making a political statement about globalization
That the entire world... is part of the English Channel?
@@LemonCake101 "every country is worse off because they're competing with everyone else" 🤣
@@LemonCake101 I'm just trying to make a joke. Interesting video. I'd like to see what the world looks like after a few hundred years
@@BorkDoggo oh sorry I got confused, yeah could be interesting
How does Malay fair?
... worse
OUAA fuckin ceke
i need to privateer this
Do timelapse
would
Everyone is poorer . . . Except china
Wierdly.. no China is the first I checked, they are also poorer.
@@LemonCake101 surprising. Their share of global trade looked so chonky is hard to believe
@@Aarlaeoss fair, but they had a significantly better strangle on... well the Chinese trade; 4% of the global amount wasn't great.