Placing the tunnel entrance at an angle (rather than square to the track) might make the track look more like it is going straight on. Loving your videos. :)
I did consider the tunnel portal on an angle but doing so stretches the arch even further, which I didn't want to do without the tunnel arch becoming too flat.
Great video once again Julian and brilliant to see a photo of the arch girder bridge (called Wearmouth Bridge) from my home town of Sunderland in the N E of England with the road bridge behind it
I like how you are adding all these different levels, i think it is the secret of building scenic realism rather than just a flat board, very interesting plans.
Super video Julian. I certainly like the elevation changes that you're making. It makes the layout more realistic. You always seem calm when things don't go to plan. It's the one thing we all have to learn with this hobby of ours. All the best. Kevin
Nice bit of planning. I have a Proxon Rotary tool bought from Mitre 10 in Lower Hutt in the mid 1990's. Still use it today. All your suggestions sound good Julian. Stay safe and happy modelling. Mon
Hi Julian. A very interesting video with lots of things going on. I am pleased to see that despite the problems that you had with the various bits of baseboards, you got there in the end. Looking forward to seeing how your latest project progresses. Kind regards. Mark.
I agree with the last comment about placing the tunnel entrance square to the track and you may also want to consider where the viaduct foundations might conflict with the tracks in the tunnel. Excellent idea, however, and I think the viaduct will fit really well with the scenery.
Great video Julian getting complicated but your strategy to just get on with it works, you just tackle any issues that come a long brilliant. As others have said the different levels will make all the difference to your layout. Keep safe.
Hi enjoyed your video as usual. I personally would like to see the viaduct extended towards you. And the girder bridge the opposite side.l also like the triple porthole at an angle. Looking forward to your next video. Mike Bristol UK
I did consider the tunnel portal on an angle but doing so stretches the arch even further, which I didn't want to do without the tunnel arch becoming too flat.
I must concur Kiwi, with your plan to advance the tunnel entrance. I envisage it forming the forward edge of a rising land form back towards the bridge (definitely go with the truss rather than the arch). At this point we differ, as I see the bridge not extending to the edge of the layout but ending with abutments and the start of a cutting, with rail end not visible around a curve and being lost in grass, shrubs and a young tree or two. Given some liberal weathering and lots of undergrowth, track overgrown etc. the viewer's line of sight will wonder where the old track went? I don't think it will look out of place but rather hint at the history of the back corner and yet still tie it into the current landscape. Love ya work old mate.
I would say that the layout Much Nattering for Great Report, which has a long tunnel, is a layout that might well help you to decide the location of your tunnel.
I think making the viaduct go right to the edge of your baseboard would be best, and having that tunnel entrance our where you've said will work really well. there would easily be a walkers path or country lane running on top of the tunnel and then going under the viaduct too! can't wait to see what you do with it
Nice idea for a walking track across the top of the tunnel and then heading under the viaduct, I'll definitely be including something of this nature to the scene.
Hi Julian, your idea to bring the tunnel entrance forward to hide the curve is spot on. We all tend to show too much track on our layouts, when deceiving people by hiding a large amount of the curve gets rid of a lot of the unrealistic heavy overhang that passenger stock in particular has helps the illusion of the scenery no end. By the way the level changes are superb also breaking up the layout into beleivable cameos. Your videos are a great inspiration to all. Please keep them coming 👍👍👍👍
Great video Julian, core blimey mate you got your work cut out there its gonna look great though. I think the arced girder bridge looks great going by the phot and would make welcome change from a viaduct you said it may look too high, well cant you cut it down and make it a little lower . well what ever you do I am sure it will look great.
Your last video (Part 1 of the inclines) I meant to say almost brought tears to my eyes. The flow of the tracks design in curvature and in height is perfection. Previously, a very long time ago, I’d suggested the disused Great Central viaducts to the south of Nottingham Victoria as a possible inspiration. With your latest concept, however, you’re echoing the very high brick viaduct at Stockport - still in use - and the long gone separate line through Stockport Tiviot Dale which used to run in a tunnel underneath the viaduct. If you check out the Disused Stations web pages for Tiviot Dale you’ll also see an old map showing the engine sheds and sidings at Tiviot Dale which almost ran up against the viaduct at 90 degrees.
@@NorthernJerseyRailroad Yeh. The tool I bought came with different shaped robust cutting attachments (Im guessing most do). These gave me a multitude of ways to safely cut in those awkward places. One of the best tools I have in my extended armoury.
Where there are three tracks, instead of the usual six foot spacing the third track would be further apart with a ten foot spacing to the nearest track. Also applies to any four track sections, so the spaces between tracks would be six, ten and six feet. Keep up the good work, Dave
The track spacing has been determined by two MK1 coaches passing each other on the tightest curved section (3rd radius). It came down to available space and the lower level track, not being able to separate out the third line a bit.
Hi Julian, your plans sound great. I'm impressed with your vision for how you'd like to see layout looking. Not being the slightest bit artistic, I find it hard seeing beyond the boards and track in front of me. Yes, to moving the tunnel portal forward. I think that'll look better. One thing i am interested in is your forthcoming testing of the joint when your incline changes to a decline for the coaling siding. If I heard you correctly, that's a 6 degree (3+3) change in what looks a short distance and under a point. Fingers crossed that works okay for your longest locomotive. Keep up the great work. You're videos are very inspiring. Thank you.
I have an old 8" grinder that I have and I fitted a wood-cutting blade on it and it would probably be more useful for you on this than that jigsaw... because I can vary the depth and also angle the cuts slightly and the blade will take it as long as it's not too sharp of an angle, even a small hand saw/fret saw would be much better than a normal jigsaw..... sometimes I don't get why everyone goes for power tools, what's wrong with a hand saw and chisels etc.. yes it takes time but less sawdust and vibrations to the layout, sometimes it is a compromise.... I think when I am building my new layout I will not glue any of the baseboards down just screw it down, then it can be removed easier if I want/need to make any changes down the track. The only concern I have is with all of the foam insert that you are making to fill the access area..... you will then lose sight of the rear sections of the track that are there now and they might become a nuisance area that things happen and you need to get into because you cannot see what is happening there......
As progress has moved on, you've possibly caught up with the latest video where the rear embankment has now been carved from the foam lift-out. This provides a clearer view of the lower tracks running along the back.
Dear Julian, very interesting progress and video! Love the way you’ve shown how your former work was no longer completely on the ‘hard drive,’ as for the glued parts of the baseboards. I humbly think that’s something we all have to face every now and then. The incline to the loco maintenance facility definitely adds to the overall quality of the scene. Absolutely agree on the extra 14mm for the viaduct. Don’t know yet what kind of stone arch viaduct you’re planning, but would like to suggest a version which is supported by tapered buttresses to further emphasize the height of the viaduct and its former importance. On the Proxxon micro jigsaw; indeed the generic blades that come with the tool can be rather sensitive. Their full range of blades offers more sturdy versions. Although, for similar small and thin saw blades for a generic jigsaw the same applies, those are also rather sensitive. Especially to lateral movement. Of course the access hole and its location adjacent to the necessary cuts you needed to make, required some cuts to be made from a rather awkward position. A position in which lateral movement is almost impossible to avoid. Only the slightest movement out of the saw line direction is a possible ‘hazard’ for these small jigsaw blades. Don’t really see how you could have avoided this otherwise. Nevertheless, I sincerely hope your future endeavors with the Proxxon micro jigsaw will be more successful, without breaking too much blades. Looking forward to seeing your next episode. Cheerio
I've been researching a number of brick viaducts, none of which have tapered pylons. I plan to cover some of the examples I researched in an upcoming video.
From a ‘real-world’ engineering perspective, I definitely prefer that the viaduct will now extend to meet the upcoming valley side (to the left in the video) and the ‘new’ tunnel mouth definitely helps to achieve that. As for the other end, I’d be concerned about such a relatively tall viaduct, just stopping before those three low-level tracks (with your suggested lattice bridge continuing across to the opposite side of the valley). Granted, some viaducts do stop at a river bank (for example), before crossing via some other bridge structure, but for a tall viaduct, that’s a lot of masonry/brickwork just waving about in the breeze. Ideally, it would continue-on and cross those other three lines, but their placement makes placing the necessary support pier(s) almost impossible (without relocating the tracks). Suggestion: have the viaduct stop as intended there, but make the last viaduct archway a ‘blind’ one, to give a suitable mass of masonry as an abutment for the lattice bridge to spring from. Mind you, having that abutment directly over a tunnel (as it would be on your layout) is, as they say, ‘sub-optimal’. As an aside, viaducts are also structurally stronger if constructed on a slight curve, but that would obviously add a level of scratch-building complexity you may wish to avoid.
I have come across examples of taller viaducts which have girder structures in them. I plan to cover some of the examples I researched in an upcoming video.
Hi mate, Shame about that tool, but it looks decent and as I am sure you know, if you can get a more heavy duty blade it will work just fine. In the event, I think the option to cut and replace was a better one anyway so perhaps with hindsight it’s as well that you couldn’t do what you meant to! 😉 I do agree that it will look better with the bridge arrangement you have replanned. I’d even bring the tunnel entrance a bit nearer the camera so to speak so the track has barely started curving. This would allow you to perhaps put a structure or Road on a hill that could either be lifted off with a road across it (since this would indicate the reason or need for a railway being built in the first place) and perhaps have a road bridge parallel to the railway bridge heading over the tracks at the back with another road dropping down at a T-Junction providing road access to the sheds 😎 Just an idea. I guess you might need a retaining wall or two but I think it would really help give credence to the way the bridge skews over and why there was a railway built but perhaps fell away once road transport improved and the costs spiralled 🤔 Have a great weekend mate 🍀👍🍻
Hi Julian, I think the new tunnel mouth position is a good improvement and the different levels will look very dramatic. Not sure why you had to lift the viaduct 40mm. Do you intend to have a backscene? If so it may be best to visualise or offer that up before settling on the landform and viaduct height.
I wanted to achieve a reasonable amount of height for the viaduct, suggesting an imposing structure marching across the landscape. In a way, the viaduct will act as the backscene creating the scenic break. I will have a back scene at the edge of baseboard but I envisage this being reasonably wooded in front.
Instead of having the tunnel further round have you concidered flying buttress being placed around the bend prior to tunnel just a thought. Get vids as usual julian.
That's happened to me a few times. Bought the ideal tool for the job only to revert to my existing tools due to an issue with the new one. I agree with @ianjeffery4773 regarding angleing the tunnel entrance. The updates are looking great Julian, I really should have included more elevation changes in my layout. No matter, layout no 2 is in the planning stages. 😊
I did consider the tunnel portal on an angle but doing so stretches the arch even further, which I didn't want to do without the tunnel arch becoming too flat.
There’s tunnels in Glasgow and beyond that run under huge factory’s like cotton mills , paperwork’s etc and thats what I thot you were doing and I notice you need to ballast the track I use the dry pva myself and all you need to do is wet it with water n ipa 3hrs later its dry n ready to rock pun intended its less messier than the usual method I’ve used it since the 70s in my first foray in my first house lol … your layout is superb mite , 🥸
Placing the tunnel entrance at an angle (rather than square to the track) might make the track look more like it is going straight on. Loving your videos. :)
I did consider the tunnel portal on an angle but doing so stretches the arch even further, which I didn't want to do without the tunnel arch becoming too flat.
I like your revised plan for the viaduct. Cheers Peter.
Julian, I also found that when adding to the layout, it is seldom easy. However, your ideas seem to work well. Thanks for sharing Bruce in Minnesota 😊
It looks great on Station Road. Lots of work to complete this section. Mike HO from Australia.
You make great videos. Hope when I start my layout, That my scenery turns out as great as yours, any planning is as good as yours
Interesting progress on your engine shed area. Look forward to seeing your next update. Thanks for sharing. Roy.
Great video once again Julian and brilliant to see a photo of the arch girder bridge (called Wearmouth Bridge) from my home town of Sunderland in the N E of England with the road bridge behind it
I like how you are adding all these different levels, i think it is the secret of building scenic realism rather than just a flat board, very interesting plans.
I love seeing the progress and redesign ideas, my Layout has been stalled for a while now. Great ideas. thanks for another great video.
Wow looking cool Julian and coming on well. Take care - Kevin
Super video Julian. I certainly like the elevation changes that you're making. It makes the layout more realistic. You always seem calm when things don't go to plan. It's the one thing we all have to learn with this hobby of ours. All the best. Kevin
Nice bit of planning.
I have a Proxon Rotary tool bought from Mitre 10 in Lower Hutt in the mid 1990's. Still use it today.
All your suggestions sound good Julian.
Stay safe and happy modelling.
Mon
Ahh, good old Mitre10, this and Bunnings are my favorite stores after the local model shops🙂
Looks nice Julian, variations in height make for good viewing. Thanks for putting your ideas on here.
Hi Julian. A very interesting video with lots of things going on. I am pleased to see that despite the problems that you had with the various bits of baseboards, you got there in the end. Looking forward to seeing how your latest project progresses. Kind regards. Mark.
I agree with the last comment about placing the tunnel entrance square to the track and you may also want to consider where the viaduct foundations might conflict with the tracks in the tunnel. Excellent idea, however, and I think the viaduct will fit really well with the scenery.
The potential conflict between the tunnel and viaduct foundations was the first thing that came to my mind when Julian explained the vision.
You've no doubt caught up on the latest progress where the viaduct foundations are cut short to not interfere with the mainline tracks🙂
Great video Julian getting complicated but your strategy to just get on with it works, you just tackle any issues that come a long brilliant. As others have said the different levels will make all the difference to your layout. Keep safe.
Hi enjoyed your video as usual. I personally would like to see the viaduct extended towards you. And the girder bridge the opposite side.l also like the triple porthole at an angle.
Looking forward to your next video. Mike Bristol UK
I did consider the tunnel portal on an angle but doing so stretches the arch even further, which I didn't want to do without the tunnel arch becoming too flat.
I must concur Kiwi, with your plan to advance the tunnel entrance. I envisage it forming the forward edge of a rising land form back towards the bridge (definitely go with the truss rather than the arch). At this point we differ, as I see the bridge not extending to the edge of the layout but ending with abutments and the start of a cutting, with rail end not visible around a curve and being lost in grass, shrubs and a young tree or two. Given some liberal weathering and lots of undergrowth, track overgrown etc. the viewer's line of sight will wonder where the old track went? I don't think it will look out of place but rather hint at the history of the back corner and yet still tie it into the current landscape. Love ya work old mate.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to You and Your Family
Proxxon is a relatively good brand over here in Germany. Hopefully getting aftermarket blades will help.
I would say that the layout Much Nattering for Great Report, which has a long tunnel, is a layout that might well help you to decide the location of your tunnel.
I think making the viaduct go right to the edge of your baseboard would be best, and having that tunnel entrance our where you've said will work really well. there would easily be a walkers path or country lane running on top of the tunnel and then going under the viaduct too! can't wait to see what you do with it
Nice idea for a walking track across the top of the tunnel and then heading under the viaduct, I'll definitely be including something of this nature to the scene.
I wondered what a mini jigsaw was in the last video! Now I know!
Give me a shout if I can help with the Lattice girder bridge!
Hi Julian, your idea to bring the tunnel entrance forward to hide the curve is spot on. We all tend to show too much track on our layouts, when deceiving people by hiding a large amount of the curve gets rid of a lot of the unrealistic heavy overhang that passenger stock in particular has helps the illusion of the scenery no end. By the way the level changes are superb also breaking up the layout into beleivable cameos. Your videos are a great inspiration to all. Please keep them coming 👍👍👍👍
Thanks Christopher for your kind words and comments.
Looking good well done
Great video Julian, core blimey mate you got your work cut out there its gonna look great though. I think the arced girder bridge looks great going by the phot and would make welcome change from a viaduct you said it may look too high, well cant you cut it down and make it a little lower . well what ever you do I am sure it will look great.
Your last video (Part 1 of the inclines) I meant to say almost brought tears to my eyes. The flow of the tracks design in curvature and in height is perfection.
Previously, a very long time ago, I’d suggested the disused Great Central viaducts to the south of Nottingham Victoria as a possible inspiration. With your latest concept, however, you’re echoing the very high brick viaduct at Stockport - still in use - and the long gone separate line through Stockport Tiviot Dale which used to run in a tunnel underneath the viaduct. If you check out the Disused Stations web pages for Tiviot Dale you’ll also see an old map showing the engine sheds and sidings at Tiviot Dale which almost ran up against the viaduct at 90 degrees.
Thank you kindly, and also for sharing the useful info, I'll check that out.
Hi Julian. For jobs such as the cutting you've been doing, I find the best tool to use is a multitool. Never had a problem. All the best.
I was looking to see if someone else would recommend a multitool. I agree it would be the best option particularly for cutting in tight areas
@@NorthernJerseyRailroad Yeh. The tool I bought came with different shaped robust cutting attachments (Im guessing most do). These gave me a multitude of ways to safely cut in those awkward places. One of the best tools I have in my extended armoury.
I do have a multi-tool but I find it too aggressive and it vibrates through the entire layout.
Where there are three tracks, instead of the usual six foot spacing the third track would be further apart with a ten foot spacing to the nearest track. Also applies to any four track sections, so the spaces between tracks would be six, ten and six feet. Keep up the good work, Dave
The track spacing has been determined by two MK1 coaches passing each other on the tightest curved section (3rd radius). It came down to available space and the lower level track, not being able to separate out the third line a bit.
👍 Great ideas.
good vid on the channel nice build thanks lee
Hi Julian, your plans sound great. I'm impressed with your vision for how you'd like to see layout looking. Not being the slightest bit artistic, I find it hard seeing beyond the boards and track in front of me. Yes, to moving the tunnel portal forward. I think that'll look better. One thing i am interested in is your forthcoming testing of the joint when your incline changes to a decline for the coaling siding. If I heard you correctly, that's a 6 degree (3+3) change in what looks a short distance and under a point. Fingers crossed that works okay for your longest locomotive. Keep up the great work. You're videos are very inspiring. Thank you.
Is it quite a vertical curve in this area but it seems to be ok. Testing it with long wheelbase of the 9F presented no issues.
I have an old 8" grinder that I have and I fitted a wood-cutting blade on it and it would probably be more useful for you on this than that jigsaw... because I can vary the depth and also angle the cuts slightly and the blade will take it as long as it's not too sharp of an angle, even a small hand saw/fret saw would be much better than a normal jigsaw..... sometimes I don't get why everyone goes for power tools, what's wrong with a hand saw and chisels etc.. yes it takes time but less sawdust and vibrations to the layout, sometimes it is a compromise....
I think when I am building my new layout I will not glue any of the baseboards down just screw it down, then it can be removed easier if I want/need to make any changes down the track.
The only concern I have is with all of the foam insert that you are making to fill the access area..... you will then lose sight of the rear sections of the track that are there now and they might become a nuisance area that things happen and you need to get into because you cannot see what is happening there......
As progress has moved on, you've possibly caught up with the latest video where the rear embankment has now been carved from the foam lift-out. This provides a clearer view of the lower tracks running along the back.
Dear Julian, very interesting progress and video! Love the way you’ve shown how your former work was no longer completely on the ‘hard drive,’ as for the glued parts of the baseboards. I humbly think that’s something we all have to face every now and then. The incline to the loco maintenance facility definitely adds to the overall quality of the scene. Absolutely agree on the extra 14mm for the viaduct. Don’t know yet what kind of stone arch viaduct you’re planning, but would like to suggest a version which is supported by tapered buttresses to further emphasize the height of the viaduct and its former importance.
On the Proxxon micro jigsaw; indeed the generic blades that come with the tool can be rather sensitive. Their full range of blades offers more sturdy versions. Although, for similar small and thin saw blades for a generic jigsaw the same applies, those are also rather sensitive. Especially to lateral movement. Of course the access hole and its location adjacent to the necessary cuts you needed to make, required some cuts to be made from a rather awkward position. A position in which lateral movement is almost impossible to avoid. Only the slightest movement out of the saw line direction is a possible ‘hazard’ for these small jigsaw blades. Don’t really see how you could have avoided this otherwise. Nevertheless, I sincerely hope your future endeavors with the Proxxon micro jigsaw will be more successful, without breaking too much blades. Looking forward to seeing your next episode. Cheerio
I've been researching a number of brick viaducts, none of which have tapered pylons. I plan to cover some of the examples I researched in an upcoming video.
From a ‘real-world’ engineering perspective, I definitely prefer that the viaduct will now extend to meet the upcoming valley side (to the left in the video) and the ‘new’ tunnel mouth definitely helps to achieve that. As for the other end, I’d be concerned about such a relatively tall viaduct, just stopping before those three low-level tracks (with your suggested lattice bridge continuing across to the opposite side of the valley). Granted, some viaducts do stop at a river bank (for example), before crossing via some other bridge structure, but for a tall viaduct, that’s a lot of masonry/brickwork just waving about in the breeze. Ideally, it would continue-on and cross those other three lines, but their placement makes placing the necessary support pier(s) almost impossible (without relocating the tracks). Suggestion: have the viaduct stop as intended there, but make the last viaduct archway a ‘blind’ one, to give a suitable mass of masonry as an abutment for the lattice bridge to spring from. Mind you, having that abutment directly over a tunnel (as it would be on your layout) is, as they say, ‘sub-optimal’. As an aside, viaducts are also structurally stronger if constructed on a slight curve, but that would obviously add a level of scratch-building complexity you may wish to avoid.
I have come across examples of taller viaducts which have girder structures in them. I plan to cover some of the examples I researched in an upcoming video.
Hi mate,
Shame about that tool, but it looks decent and as I am sure you know, if you can get a more heavy duty blade it will work just fine. In the event, I think the option to cut and replace was a better one anyway so perhaps with hindsight it’s as well that you couldn’t do what you meant to! 😉
I do agree that it will look better with the bridge arrangement you have replanned. I’d even bring the tunnel entrance a bit nearer the camera so to speak so the track has barely started curving. This would allow you to perhaps put a structure or Road on a hill that could either be lifted off with a road across it (since this would indicate the reason or need for a railway being built in the first place) and perhaps have a road bridge parallel to the railway bridge heading over the tracks at the back with another road dropping down at a T-Junction providing road access to the sheds 😎
Just an idea. I guess you might need a retaining wall or two but I think it would really help give credence to the way the bridge skews over and why there was a railway built but perhaps fell away once road transport improved and the costs spiralled 🤔
Have a great weekend mate 🍀👍🍻
Hi Julian, I think the new tunnel mouth position is a good improvement and the different levels will look very dramatic. Not sure why you had to lift the viaduct 40mm. Do you intend to have a backscene? If so it may be best to visualise or offer that up before settling on the landform and viaduct height.
I wanted to achieve a reasonable amount of height for the viaduct, suggesting an imposing structure marching across the landscape. In a way, the viaduct will act as the backscene creating the scenic break. I will have a back scene at the edge of baseboard but I envisage this being reasonably wooded in front.
Instead of having the tunnel further round have you concidered flying buttress being placed around the bend prior to tunnel just a thought.
Get vids as usual julian.
That's happened to me a few times. Bought the ideal tool for the job only to revert to my existing tools due to an issue with the new one.
I agree with @ianjeffery4773 regarding angleing the tunnel entrance.
The updates are looking great Julian, I really should have included more elevation changes in my layout.
No matter, layout no 2 is in the planning stages. 😊
I did consider the tunnel portal on an angle but doing so stretches the arch even further, which I didn't want to do without the tunnel arch becoming too flat.
There’s tunnels in Glasgow and beyond that run under huge factory’s like cotton mills , paperwork’s etc and thats what I thot you were doing and I notice you need to ballast the track I use the dry pva myself and all you need to do is wet it with water n ipa 3hrs later its dry n ready to rock pun intended its less messier than the usual method I’ve used it since the 70s in my first foray in my first house lol … your layout is superb mite , 🥸