Hello cody I thought of an idea while watching your video..is there a product like a wind turbine(inside a tube) that can be placed onto a vehicle to generate/charge the electrical system whenever you are driving? If not that maybe a pretty effective supplementary charging device or not haha
Ohms test will not tell you what you need to know to make it easy for you find out what relay controls the spool in and loosely replace it and see if it works ... i would say the motor is good because it spins out all that relay does is change direction VOLTAGE DROP BY "REAL FIX REAL FAST" CHANNEL GIVES A GOOD EXPLANATION
@@mechanicmike2858 it's a 3 lead DC reversing motor(i believe) so there are 2 sets of brushes and windings usually he wants to test the brushes just get a clamp on amp meter on the reverse motor brush positive lead and see if there is any current flow when ingage(no current flow bad brush).. bad windings will either short or trickle current continuously when directly hooked up... a megger is another method to test the windings but most likely it is a brush.
Your winch has 2 sets of brushes. 1 set for "spool out" and another, independent set, for "spool in". This motor works just like an automotive starter except that it works in both directions. The problem is that your "spool in" brushes are wasted. If you're going to replace 2 brushes, just replace all 4 and be done. The brushes are located under the 4 silver Torx head screws on the motor body. The reason you're getting a higher voltage reading on the motor positives in the 2 different directions is because when you spool out, there's no load, so the motor is only pulling enough voltage to work. When you try to spool in, there's currently a LOT of resistance (due to the motor being stuck), so it's pulling the maximum voltage trying to operate. Stop trying to make it work until you replace your brushes or you'll end up burning up your relays because of the repeated usage and high amperage the motor is pulling while trying to work. The reason your spool in brushes are fried is because you're never putting it under load when you spool out, so those brushes will wear MUCH slower than your spool in brushes due to the high amperages passed thru them when working. You MIGHT be able to test it before tearing it apart by lightly tapping on the motor body with a hammer while trying to spool in. Sometimes this can get the brushes to make up contact, but it's not guaranteed. If you get into a situation where you NEED it before you get your replacement brushes, you should be able to swap your spool in brushes with the spool out brushes. This will allow you to use the winch while awaiting parts. You'll just have to free spool it anytime you need to spool out. CAUTION!!! Only use the free spool if there's no load on the winch line (don't free spool if you're winching something up a hill and there is weight on the winch line). Your welcome.
@Harry M there are, indeed, 2 sets of brushes. Brushes are ALWAYS oriented 180 degrees apart (opposite sides of the armature). Look closely at the motor body, there are brush access screws offset by 90 degrees. Also, there are 2 types of motors for these winches, 2 wire and 3 wire. 2 wire winch motors (modern design) swaps + and - on the 2 wires. These will only have 1 set of brushes. This is a 3 wire winch where positive is swapped between 2 sets of brushes based on the direction you want and share a common ground.
You are like the UA-cam dad and Grandpa. I'm happy that you share and pass on this knowledge. You've gotten me back into projects I would have left alone forever. You're a great man and I look forward to seeing more of your craft!
Hi Cody, I just bought myself the exact same winch but in much worse condition, rusted solid. Have had a lot of fun fixing it up and learned a lot. I can't wait to get it running right. Super simple to work on.
don’t forget if using a multi meter with to measure amps to put the meter in series. If in parallel you will blow your meter fuse if lucky if not your meter
That towing story was funny. As soon as you said you had to tie the chain to the bumper, I had a feeling I knew where that story was going to end and I wasn't disappointed, LOL! Looks like you all can laugh at that now which is good, I know I've done my share of young and dumb stuff back in the day...
That is a diamond knot if I remember correctly on that soft shackle. From back when I made a bunch. Those soft shackles are nice but they are susceptible to sharp edges. Today!!! BEST CONTENT EVER!! Seriously! Id have that motor so far apart though if I was there. lol
I must say, your videos the past weeks have really gone up a notch (not that they have been bad before, been watching you for several years). I can't put my finger on what you have changed but i like it =)
One more thing about that soft shackle, and ropes in general - you'd be amazed at the rated capacity of some brand-name ropes out there. Many people are actually switching from steel cable to those ropes in winches.
When I was in my youth and on a wheat harvest, the grain truck sunk down into the sand in the road. The boss comes over with the combine and hooks a chain to the front of the truck. I didn't know combines were powerful enough to pull much, but this International Harvester late 1960s combine could pull. He tightened up the chain and it snapped. The link flew into the truck radiator and barely missed the coolant tube. I got a lesson on the danger of pulling with chains.
Try switching the two wires that connect to the motor. If it spools in but doesn't spool out then it's the relays. If it still doesn't spool in, then something is messed up in the motor. If it works when you switch them around it could be a temporary fix because you can just free spool line out.
Wow... lot of bad info here. There are only one set of brushes in that motor. You change the direction of a DC motor by changing the polarity of the power you send to it. Bad brushes in a motor designed to be bi-directional would cause the motor to be unreliable in both directions. If it only quits in one direction, it's in the control relays. The control relays work in pairs. One pair delivers current in one direction, the other pair delivers current in the opposite direction. The "spool in" pair of relays usually sees more current, because most of your winch work is done by retracting the cable, and that's why the "spool in" failed first. Easy diagnosis? First, I would remove power and verify all the connections are good, no corrosion or burns, fasteners snug, then test again. If it still doesn't work, move on to the next step. Disconnect the battery. Swap the two cables attached to the motor. Connect the battery. Hit spool out... winch should try to spool in. Hit spool in... relays should "thunk", winch should not run. If that's the case, disconnect the battery, put the cables back where they were, and replace the "spool in" pair of relays. I would recommend replacing all 4 so you don't have to get in there again for another 15 years, but running through that quick diagnosis process will verify where the problem lies before you go buy parts.
When you pulled that rope out it brought me back to all those times we had to hook up our Humvees to the Chinook to fly somewhere. Those things are crazy strong.
I just finished restoring the same model winch today. I powdercoated it mat black with a fine texture. Which was convenient because we're in the aluminium powder coating business.
those soft shackles are great! we use them for yacht racing since they are so strong, and when something does break and go flying across the deck, they are less likely to cause significant damage.
Mr Warn lived down street from us, saw us mounting warn wrench stopped to watch installation. We were on our way deer hunting, put our 3 bucks on wench an wench bumper for Mr. Warn. He put our picture in his sales brochure.
Wranglestar, You state that all four relays showed no resistance (we only see the two being tested) but the second of the two did not exhibit the normal characteristic of a reading one would expect to see when closing. These relays or "contactors" close by way of an electromagetic field when energized. It happens very fast and with some force so what you should have seen was the meter go from open to approximately zero ohms without slowly making its way there, compared to what we saw. A lot of current flows through these, more than 200 amps initially, and over time one post of the contact will arc (causing pitting and copper transfer) or "wear' out if you will; which is my guess as to what is wrong. Replace at least the two wind in contactors, better all four and keep the working ones as spares. This is of course based on only what I can see from the video.
Excellent sir! Down in the SE (Florida) I have been using "snatch straps" for years. For towing I am not a huge fan, prefer a tow strap. But for pulling someone out of the muck and mire.. the "snatch" part of the snatch strap really comes in handy. It lets you bounce a vehicle with out the dead stop of a chain. I have been using the same Warn 30k lb strap for 20+ years.
Maybe you got an ultra-rare Brittish made Warn winch? I read a comment down the page claiming 90% of all landrovers sold are still on the road today. The rest made it back home. To be fair, AC Bristol did design a cool car way back in the 60's, just needed Shelby to give it an infusion of good ole American designed 289 and 427ci V-8 hp to become a great car. lol
Old_and_Slow I think the line Land Rover themselves quote is 70% of all land rovers built are still on the road in some form.. meaning a Frankenstein Land Rover lol.
Finally you got a recovery rope. The Evaporust shouldn't eat away at the metal even if you do leave it in there for a while unlike some highly acidic options.
An easy check for motor or brushes and a check of your relays: 1. If there are only two power leads going into the motor then the relays send Pos to one, Neg to the other on extend and the opposite polarities on pull, so 2. use your jumper cables to apply power straight to the motor. If it runs, switch the polarity you apply with the jumper cables and see if it runs. Assuming it runs both directions - and this is my expectation since it runs in one direction ... 3. Relays, when closed, should be a perfect conductor so if you measure the voltage across a relay when it is conducting it should show zero voltage. 4. While activating the pull switch measure the voltage across the two pull relays. If one of them is not zero, that is your bad relay. If it is a three wire system as someone below mentioned, I'm not familiar.
They are configured in a "H" configuration. One of the relays is bad but you can't check the resistance with the motor still connected. Disconnect the motor and recheck the relays. There is one bad one. (low side relay on the "pull in" side)
I’d was about to say the same, for some reason it isn’t grounding the motor properly in that direction. Measure over the two lugs, you’ll see 0 volts when you try to spool in, and 9-12 volts when you spool out. The reason for the voltage drop is because when you pull a high current through a wire, the voltage drops due to the resistance of the wire, the larger the current, the higher the voltage drop. I laughed a little when Cody wondered about that, since he basically explained that earlier in the video. Since the motor isn’t pulling any current, you get the full voltage of the battery at the terminal. Battery voltage also says a bit when you load down the battery, so at the motor terminals 8-12 volts would be what I’d consider reasonable. Also, don’t try to measure the current with that fluke, it can only take 10 amps! :)
If I look at wiring diagrams and to the four relays it seems that the 2 closest wires on the motor switch polarity and the third furthest wire is the ground of the metal body that comes from the car ground and loops through to the relays. So when you test voltage you should test on one of the two wires that are next to each other on the motor. What this means is that for each direction 2 relays should fire. For one direction relay 1 and 3 fire (1 becomes positive (first black wire), 3 becomes negative (second black wire)), for the other direction relay 2 and 4 fire (2 becomes negative (first black wire), 4 becomes positive (second black wire)) (notice how polarity changes?). It could still be that inside the motor something is wrong but I would make sure that both relays fire in each event, or put your multimeter in voltage mode, put him on the 2 black wires that are closest on the motor and see if you get 12 volt and in the other direction -12 (minus 12) volt.
zenddoor just take a volt meter and test at the motor leads. Across both leads. Will be 12v one direction and -12v the other. If so then the motor is the issue. Honestly with a winch that old i would send the motor out for repair and replace all 4 relays. Winch needs to work when needed. An unreliable winch might as well be left at home.
If you want to confirm it's a control issue, switch the leads going to the motor. If it will only spin in and not out now, it's controls that are bad. For a great upgrade get one of the wireless adapter kits from Harbor Freight or Tractor Supply (where I got mine). Makes it so you can run the winch from anywhere. Great when your working with trees. I wired mine parallel to the corded remote so I can use both.
Warn winches are DC series motors. The field winding is in series with the armature winding. There are three terminals plus the ground, on that winch. There are only two brushes. The brushes feed the armature (rotating) winding. One brush is connected to ground ( the case ), the other is connected to the terminal which is situated away from the other two terminals. The brushes ride on the commutator, which passes voltage to the armature. The polarity of the field winding is reversed, to switch direction of rotation. This is done with the four relays (2 for CW, 2 for CCW ). The field (stationary ) winding is connected to the two terminals nearest each other. Google warn winch schematic, for a wiring diagram
The mice (or rats) can reach that peanutbutter from the side of the bucket. You could lower that rotating bar 1 - 1,5 inches to get it beyond their reach so they have to get on that bar.
@@markhowards420 but then that spinning rod would not fit. Of course he could make one himself, just use a piece of alltrhread a some small diameter pvc tube
My dog ate the peanut butter on my trap! My son and I still tow with a chain, I am the tower and he is the towee and we use hand signals to tell each other what is needed!!! LOL I suppose if I had a phone it would be different now! LOL
Those soft shackles dont like dirt and mud so make sure you keep them out of the mud. Glad you picked up what I recommended, much safer and a lot better performance.
Mouse trap: we use a stick across the 5 gallon bucket, with a pop can through the center then put the peanut butter on the top and bottom of the can, I think the mice might not weight enough to spin the metal bar. To test the relay's you need to remove the leads to the motor other wise you are measuring across all the relays My .02 cents
Buying British is not buying a problem is means that you are buying character, a character that some times if created in the 60's-80's means its mainly on strike so spending money will result in the character working again. At least that's my excuse anyway.
I had same issuse , buy all 4 new solenoids and it will work like new. Dont just replace 1 or 2. For reliability replace all 4 you can order it from warn or any 4wheel shop , dont use Amazon solenoids
Cody with the winch pull the end of the winch off with the wires going to it inside it there is a copper winding with some bushes for contact that is the way the voltage is supplied to the motor and I have found that gets dirty or a bad contact so would be worth checking them first I had it in the past took it apart cleaned the contacts up and put a decent amount of contact lubricant on and it worked perfectly afterwards
You were right about the "A" on your multimeter for checking amperage. I recommend checking out a video on using one. They are pretty cool and come in handy when troubleshooting electrical problems.
Make a diving board mouse trap, so when they go out a certain distance the board falls in and the mice drown. My papa had one and it worked like a charm
The glass fuses are the best because you can wrap them with foil and they'll last forever.. or until whatever they're in burns to the ground, whichever comes first.
Great Video . I have to rebuild my Warn xd9000 During the next weeks . I Broke the Motor Support by cutting down a tree With 95 cm at the bottom The winch have to Support the tree Not to Fall in a barn .
Check for a short in the motor, sometimes you can see them, many motors just have some insulation rubbed off and you can respray it with laquer if you see arcing inside on a power test after you open it. Relays seem good though, and quite often it is something minor in the motor, even some rust on the armature can cause goofy issues. Finn Electric in Grays Harbor (google shows him) is an old Swede and expert on auto electric motors, it's all he does, we take all our starters and alternators from shovels, cat's, skidders etc to him no matter where we are working in the state, he is very good at what he does.
The motor is not bad. The two terminals closer to the drum are your field windings, the two towards the outside of the winch are your armature windings. It's what's called a series-wound motor. It's not a permanent magnet motor and uses an electromagnet to create a magnetic field. So for spool in, you're getting voltage to your field but not to your armature. Follow the field wire back into the control box and back out to the motor and see where it stops getting voltage. From what I can see in your video, it looks like a faulty connection.
Try emptying the water, they may not be floating. Or get a laptop with a webcam and a light, put some software on there like sighthound and that will highlight. You can export the clips too. The free version is only lower res but will work for what you need.
Engineering student here. First thing I would check is the brushes of the motor, and for any loose connections. those relays aren't going to be the first thing to go bad.
From my family to yours A very Merry Christmas And a Happy New Year, thank you for the awesome content and looking forward for next years surprises. From Elliot Lake Ontario Canada.
I'm surprised the mouse trap didn't work. I've been trying to catch some mice around here myself and it astonishes me at how little they weigh. If it were me, I'd recommend drilling larger holes in the sides of the bucket where you inserted the ends of the spinning trap and perhaps even apply some sort of lubricant to reduce the friction even further. A small mouse may not weigh enough to cause the trap to spin as it's currently configured. Anyway, good luck to you, Cody.
Those mice can EASILY walk across that roller. Way too much resistance in the bearings. The amount of force your finger is applying is 1000s of times stronger than the amount of force a mouse applies.
"Anything British is gonna give you problems"...... Hmmm.... Well as a Brit I'm wondering what problem I can send your way? :) Unless you mean 1970's British Leyland cars.... Then I totally agree ..... :D
Be very careful with that Bubba Rope. While these ropes are a great addition to a recovery kit, they can be dangerous when used in a snatch recovery. When chains fail, they "fall to the ground". Ropes like the bubba rope are kinetic ropes, like a rubber band. That energy has got to go somewhere if they fail. These ropes are generally used to extract vehicles stuck in mud or snow. You use the kinetic energy of the rope to multiply the towing force of the tow vehicle. I've used these for the last 20+ years and I have seen them fail. More specifically, the attachment points on one of the vehicles tend to fail first. When that happens, whatever D shackle, Tow hook or body part that breaks away from one of the vehicles, becomes a weighted missile attached to the end of a huge "rubber band" which has a massive amount of stored energy. Even if the rope breaks free without a weighted object on the end, it still has a lot of mass and energy. The damage on the receiving end of that energy can be immense. Serious injury or loss of life is a possibility if bystanders don't keep well back. These ropes are great, but please be careful using them! Make absolutely sure it is attached to solid and secure anchor points (not tow ball) and use a weighted recovery blanket half way between the vehicles as you would do with a winch cable. Thank you for sharing the info about the soft shackle. I wasn't aware of those. Gotta put in my order with Santa Claus... :-)
Cody check your brushes. You use spool in infinitely more than spool out and I would bet that your spool in brushes aren’t contacting anymore. Merry Christmas!
Rodenticide under a milk crates works best in our barn. We tried the bucket trick and it worked for a few months. The best method is to use a wire with with an oiled pvc small diameter PVC pipe over it. Try chunky peanut butter maybe.
I once spent a summer doing a rodent field survey, using (amongst other kinds of devices) bucket traps. Quite often, we would find something substantially bigger than a mouse (rats, voles, weasels) in the buckets. And sometimes, the bait would be gone and there'd be nothing there ... which suggested that whatever took the bait (usually peanut butter, yes, rodents love it) was big enough to jump right out of the bucket. Our bait was on the bottom of the bucket, and we covered the top (mostly), since we were live trapping and releasing, and did not want the rodents to die in the hours between when they fell in the bucket and we could get to them. Generally, this was interesting and fun, although the spectre of rodent feces borne disease made it slightly less fun.
Try jumping the motor from a battery using jumper cables (disconnect the leads from the solenoids at the studs on the motor first), if it runs both ways then you know it's a solenoid issue. If not, then you know it's a motor issue. I've had the internal leads (underneath the studs) break off so it'll only run one direction. Those motors are fairly simple so if it does seem like the culprit I'd tear into it and see what you find, sometimes it's easy to fix yourself or you can pass it along to an electric motor rebuilder. If it does seem like a solenoid issue then I have some other suggestions but start with the motor...
@@anthonycook8737 it's a quick test, considering he was careful not to activate the solenoids for too long I think he'd have enough common sense to realize there's a short if the arcing is excessive and not hold the cables on there until his battery explodes...
Jumping 12v straight to the motor leads would also tell you if the Solenoid providing the ground to the motor for the pull in mode was not present. I am guessing the solenoids provide switched 12v and ground to the motor depending on which way you want the motor to run - checking for 12v and ground in each mode of operation would let you know if the motor/brushes truly are bad.
@@MichaelWheelock the relays do nothing with the ground on this type of motor. The ground is constant and shared between the 2 modes/ directions. The relays only serve to apply 12v to either of the 2 sides of the motor in order to spin the motor in the desired direction.
I had similar on my van check under the silver screws on the motor body for the brushes there probably badly worn hope it helps great vids by the way Cody
There are two ways of measuring amperage--1. directly by wiring the meter in the circuit which in this case will be difficult and 2. use a meter that clamps around the wire to show the amperage by inductance. This will be the safest and easiest in this situation. If you do not have a clamp-on meter they are not that expensive and are very useful in a number of situations without having to expose yourself to the current. Try the winch measuring the amperage, the wire or circuit without amperage is open.
Yes the A is amps, seems to be there a short at the winding, could also be the brushes, or the wire some where, the through bolt I have also had trouble with also. Use ohms to check from the non working post to the base of the motor, should be open. Good luck and thank you sir.
Warn winches are my favorite too. I'll own one someday when I can afford one. Been keeping my eye on Craigslist for an old one I can fix up. Till then I'll have to settle with an old 12,000lb Harbor freight winch that just won't die.
Your dog may have eaten the peanut butter. Wow I guessed 10,000 Lbs. That is good! When and if I’m able to get a truck I’ll have to purchase some Bubba ropes
That rope, or dyneema, is very strong! Stronger then steel. But it has one "error", it can't stand sanding....! It will damage the rope so badly that it will brake....very quickly!!!! So be carefull and use it wisely, greetings from Holland( were we invent dyneema....😁😁)
reverseable electrical motors have two basic designs,One type had a foreward set of windings and another set of reverse windings they usually have 3 terminals on the motor. one is ground, a forward, and then a reverse . usually have 2 relays. or just a throw switch. Your 4 relays indicate that the relays reverse the currend in one set of windings. check all the contacts. the meter can show continuity but a bad connection will not pass enough current to operate the motor. You can connect jumper cables to the motor and bypass the relay to check motor operation . When installing new brushes it is best to have the armature turned-trued. A starter repair shop could just do the motor work.
I’ve had to replace a solenoid for the same reason. Disconnect the jumpers and energize the solenoid. Check both sides with continuity tester. Easy Peary. Got my replacement solenoid at carquest auto parts. Napa probably stocks them too. I knew you were in trouble when you started disassembly. I did the same thing.
Put a test light on the other side of the relay that clicks it should light up. If it doesn’t it has bad connection inside check them all that way. You could also jump the terminals to see if it works
1st try to hand turn the drum in the direction that's not working. Sometimes debris will wedge it self in the mechanism preventing the drum from turning one way and allowing it to move the other way. If it moves both ways by hand open the motor and check to see if a wire has come loose from the motor. You might be able to repair the break. The only thing left is to have someone test the coils of the motor for continuity. If there is no continuity, a part of the windings has burned apart and the motor will have to be replaced. Good luck on the repair.
You can also check the relay by jumping across the main wires just like jumping a solenoid on older cars. Use a jumper across the terminals then push button. Or swap switches.
Best option is as suggested, check the brushes, however some winches use a changeover solenoid, that is one with a contact that breaks, as well as one that makes, if the break contact is burnt out it will not make contact when the solenoid is turned off...
I’d flip around the connections on the winch. So that when you push spool out the winch should spool in. This way you’ll know if it’s a switch/relay or if it’s something wrong with the motor.
Make sure you remember Kinetic rope like the bubba rope should be used for quick tugs (I.e pulling someone out ) It should not be used for long dragging use, your old lifting strap (static strap) should be used for that or any time your winching with a strap attached
Take that pipe off the trap and replace with a soft drink bottle empty and drill a small hole in the cap and the bottom. The pipe is probably too heavy for a mouse, the pop bottle will turn more easily. I use it in the shop all the time. Some mice can jump out of short buckets. so I use a tall bucket. I leave the bucket empty.
with the relays the problem you've got is you have contact on which ever is bad if not both it/they will show low resistance but because the plates are either buckled or have pitting from use so they won't allow the adequate amount of current through to power the motor my best guess is to connect the winch to the battery and measure the voltage between the high current poles on the relays a higher voltage equals the worse your relay is basically trying to pull power through your multimeter but it's the safest way of testing them
I have never seen a wench taken apart before! Interesting how it works Mr. Wranglerstar! Your new gadget looks cool because it’s not so heavy even I could pick it up and use it. I am looking forward to seeing you put it to use on pulling something out of the mud/or a ditch! Another You Tube channel uses the mouse trap under his cabin with a high rate of success. The channel is the Boss of the Swamp. I think he has it down pat if you want to check out his channel Cody. FYI
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Don't leave home unprepared. BUBBA ROPE IS AN OUTSTANDING CHRISTMAS GIFT IDEA amzn.to/2EBSqbH
Hello cody I thought of an idea while watching your video..is there a product like a wind turbine(inside a tube) that can be placed onto a vehicle to generate/charge the electrical system whenever you are driving? If not that maybe a pretty effective supplementary charging device or not haha
Ohms test will not tell you what you need to know to make it easy for you find out what relay controls the spool in and loosely replace it and see if it works ... i would say the motor is good because it spins out all that relay does is change direction VOLTAGE DROP BY "REAL FIX REAL FAST" CHANNEL GIVES A GOOD EXPLANATION
@@mechanicmike2858 it's a 3 lead DC reversing motor(i believe) so there are 2 sets of brushes and windings usually he wants to test the brushes just get a clamp on amp meter on the reverse motor brush positive lead and see if there is any current flow when ingage(no current flow bad brush).. bad windings will either short or trickle current continuously when directly hooked up... a megger is another method to test the windings but most likely it is a brush.
What brand are the best leather work gloves or which gloves would you recommend for a carpenter which would you recommend
But rest assured.....this is NOT a paid endorsement.
Your winch has 2 sets of brushes. 1 set for "spool out" and another, independent set, for "spool in". This motor works just like an automotive starter except that it works in both directions. The problem is that your "spool in" brushes are wasted. If you're going to replace 2 brushes, just replace all 4 and be done. The brushes are located under the 4 silver Torx head screws on the motor body. The reason you're getting a higher voltage reading on the motor positives in the 2 different directions is because when you spool out, there's no load, so the motor is only pulling enough voltage to work. When you try to spool in, there's currently a LOT of resistance (due to the motor being stuck), so it's pulling the maximum voltage trying to operate. Stop trying to make it work until you replace your brushes or you'll end up burning up your relays because of the repeated usage and high amperage the motor is pulling while trying to work. The reason your spool in brushes are fried is because you're never putting it under load when you spool out, so those brushes will wear MUCH slower than your spool in brushes due to the high amperages passed thru them when working. You MIGHT be able to test it before tearing it apart by lightly tapping on the motor body with a hammer while trying to spool in. Sometimes this can get the brushes to make up contact, but it's not guaranteed. If you get into a situation where you NEED it before you get your replacement brushes, you should be able to swap your spool in brushes with the spool out brushes. This will allow you to use the winch while awaiting parts. You'll just have to free spool it anytime you need to spool out. CAUTION!!! Only use the free spool if there's no load on the winch line (don't free spool if you're winching something up a hill and there is weight on the winch line). Your welcome.
Winner winner chicken dinner right here
You're welcome ;) couldn't resist...
You don't know what you're talking about.
@Harry M there are, indeed, 2 sets of brushes. Brushes are ALWAYS oriented 180 degrees apart (opposite sides of the armature). Look closely at the motor body, there are brush access screws offset by 90 degrees. Also, there are 2 types of motors for these winches, 2 wire and 3 wire. 2 wire winch motors (modern design) swaps + and - on the 2 wires. These will only have 1 set of brushes. This is a 3 wire winch where positive is swapped between 2 sets of brushes based on the direction you want and share a common ground.
@@BlueCollarBachelor are you saying I don't know what I'm talking about?
You are like the UA-cam dad and Grandpa. I'm happy that you share and pass on this knowledge. You've gotten me back into projects I would have left alone forever. You're a great man and I look forward to seeing more of your craft!
"I'm not really buying stuff, but I made an exception for this because it was cool" 🤣
Which brand of leather work gloves would you recommend or which type of gloves would you recommend for carpentry
@@christopherdobbin7184 I dont think you meant to reply to me
Hi Cody, I just bought myself the exact same winch but in much worse condition, rusted solid. Have had a lot of fun fixing it up and learned a lot. I can't wait to get it running right. Super simple to work on.
I love these type of videos. They show a lot more of what you are capable of and what your life is like!
A is for amps. The A with the squiggly is AC current, and the A with the line and dash is for DC Current
don’t forget if using a multi meter with to measure amps to put the meter in series. If in parallel you will blow your meter fuse if lucky if not your meter
I’m an electrician who loved watching your meter technique, good to see you haven’t mastered every trade yet.
That towing story was funny. As soon as you said you had to tie the chain to the bumper, I had a feeling I knew where that story was going to end and I wasn't disappointed, LOL! Looks like you all can laugh at that now which is good, I know I've done my share of young and dumb stuff back in the day...
did you see that part fly off when you were unreeling the cable on the floor. it looks like a rubber gasket or something 4:44 to 4:49
It was the bushing with the slot in it when he was reassembling the wench.
I'm really happy you took our suggestions. I bought both two years ago and I will never go back to snatch straps and steel shackles.
Need a USPS box to hold your tools 😎👍
Welcome to the world of Dynema brother. That stuff changed recreational recovery about ten years ago. Glad to see you're not using chains anymore. =)
youtube is a great resource to learn how to use tools and equipment.
"Anything British you're going to get problems" - let the flame war begin! Love it!
That is a diamond knot if I remember correctly on that soft shackle. From back when I made a bunch. Those soft shackles are nice but they are susceptible to sharp edges.
Today!!! BEST CONTENT EVER!! Seriously! Id have that motor so far apart though if I was there. lol
Wow, this title really PULLED me in!
check the brushes on the motor
I must say, your videos the past weeks have really gone up a notch (not that they have been bad before, been watching you for several years). I can't put my finger on what you have changed but i like it =)
try crunchy peanut butter next!
Always fun to hang around the shop with you Cody! Hope the winch remedy comes soon!!!
One more thing about that soft shackle, and ropes in general - you'd be amazed at the rated capacity of some brand-name ropes out there. Many people are actually switching from steel cable to those ropes in winches.
When I was in my youth and on a wheat harvest, the grain truck sunk down into the sand in the road. The boss comes over with the combine and hooks a chain to the front of the truck. I didn't know combines were powerful enough to pull much, but this International Harvester late 1960s combine could pull. He tightened up the chain and it snapped. The link flew into the truck radiator and barely missed the coolant tube. I got a lesson on the danger of pulling with chains.
Try switching the two wires that connect to the motor. If it spools in but doesn't spool out then it's the relays. If it still doesn't spool in, then something is messed up in the motor.
If it works when you switch them around it could be a temporary fix because you can just free spool line out.
Wow... lot of bad info here. There are only one set of brushes in that motor. You change the direction of a DC motor by changing the polarity of the power you send to it. Bad brushes in a motor designed to be bi-directional would cause the motor to be unreliable in both directions. If it only quits in one direction, it's in the control relays. The control relays work in pairs. One pair delivers current in one direction, the other pair delivers current in the opposite direction. The "spool in" pair of relays usually sees more current, because most of your winch work is done by retracting the cable, and that's why the "spool in" failed first.
Easy diagnosis? First, I would remove power and verify all the connections are good, no corrosion or burns, fasteners snug, then test again. If it still doesn't work, move on to the next step. Disconnect the battery. Swap the two cables attached to the motor. Connect the battery. Hit spool out... winch should try to spool in. Hit spool in... relays should "thunk", winch should not run. If that's the case, disconnect the battery, put the cables back where they were, and replace the "spool in" pair of relays. I would recommend replacing all 4 so you don't have to get in there again for another 15 years, but running through that quick diagnosis process will verify where the problem lies before you go buy parts.
When you pulled that rope out it brought me back to all those times we had to hook up our Humvees to the Chinook to fly somewhere. Those things are crazy strong.
Wasn’t bad content for me. Long day at work and it’s nice to see that your a human and things don’t always go your way too.
I just finished restoring the same model winch today. I powdercoated it mat black with a fine texture. Which was convenient because we're in the aluminium powder coating business.
those soft shackles are great! we use them for yacht racing since they are so strong, and when something does break and go flying across the deck, they are less likely to cause significant damage.
Mr Warn lived down street from us, saw us mounting warn wrench stopped to watch installation. We were on our way deer hunting, put our 3 bucks on wench an wench bumper for Mr. Warn. He put our picture in his sales brochure.
Wranglestar,
You state that all four relays showed no resistance (we only see the two being tested) but the second of the two did not exhibit the normal characteristic of a reading one would expect to see when closing. These relays or "contactors" close by way of an electromagetic field when energized. It happens very fast and with some force so what you should have seen was the meter go from open to approximately zero ohms without slowly making its way there, compared to what we saw. A lot of current flows through these, more than 200 amps initially, and over time one post of the contact will arc (causing pitting and copper transfer) or "wear' out if you will; which is my guess as to what is wrong. Replace at least the two wind in contactors, better all four and keep the working ones as spares. This is of course based on only what I can see from the video.
Excellent sir! Down in the SE (Florida) I have been using "snatch straps" for years. For towing I am not a huge fan, prefer a tow strap. But for pulling someone out of the muck and mire.. the "snatch" part of the snatch strap really comes in handy. It lets you bounce a vehicle with out the dead stop of a chain. I have been using the same Warn 30k lb strap for 20+ years.
Maybe you got an ultra-rare Brittish made Warn winch? I read a comment down the page claiming 90% of all landrovers sold are still on the road today. The rest made it back home. To be fair, AC Bristol did design a cool car way back in the 60's, just needed Shelby to give it an infusion of good ole American designed 289 and 427ci V-8 hp to become a great car. lol
Old_and_Slow I think the line Land Rover themselves quote is 70% of all land rovers built are still on the road in some form.. meaning a Frankenstein Land Rover lol.
I'm not entirely sure why, but I found this to be a particularly fun and enjoyable video. Thanks for keeping me entertained, yet again.
Finally you got a recovery rope. The Evaporust shouldn't eat away at the metal even if you do leave it in there for a while unlike some highly acidic options.
This is the best type of video. 2 dudes in the shop.
An easy check for motor or brushes and a check of your relays:
1. If there are only two power leads going into the motor then the relays send Pos to one, Neg to the other on extend and the opposite polarities on pull, so
2. use your jumper cables to apply power straight to the motor. If it runs, switch the polarity you apply with the jumper cables and see if it runs.
Assuming it runs both directions - and this is my expectation since it runs in one direction ...
3. Relays, when closed, should be a perfect conductor so if you measure the voltage across a relay when it is conducting it should show zero voltage.
4. While activating the pull switch measure the voltage across the two pull relays. If one of them is not zero, that is your bad relay.
If it is a three wire system as someone below mentioned, I'm not familiar.
They are configured in a "H" configuration. One of the relays is bad but you can't check the resistance with the motor still connected. Disconnect the motor and recheck the relays. There is one bad one. (low side relay on the "pull in" side)
Thank you Jason, I'll try this next,
This is wrong. Check my reply above.
I’d was about to say the same, for some reason it isn’t grounding the motor properly in that direction. Measure over the two lugs, you’ll see 0 volts when you try to spool in, and 9-12 volts when you spool out. The reason for the voltage drop is because when you pull a high current through a wire, the voltage drops due to the resistance of the wire, the larger the current, the higher the voltage drop. I laughed a little when Cody wondered about that, since he basically explained that earlier in the video. Since the motor isn’t pulling any current, you get the full voltage of the battery at the terminal. Battery voltage also says a bit when you load down the battery, so at the motor terminals 8-12 volts would be what I’d consider reasonable. Also, don’t try to measure the current with that fluke, it can only take 10 amps! :)
Love your videos man, you've been my favorite youtuber for a while now.
I think this is one of the best vids on youtube.
If I look at wiring diagrams and to the four relays it seems that the 2 closest wires on the motor switch polarity and the third furthest wire is the ground of the metal body that comes from the car ground and loops through to the relays.
So when you test voltage you should test on one of the two wires that are next to each other on the motor.
What this means is that for each direction 2 relays should fire. For one direction relay 1 and 3 fire (1 becomes positive (first black wire), 3 becomes negative (second black wire)), for the other direction relay 2 and 4 fire (2 becomes negative (first black wire), 4 becomes positive (second black wire)) (notice how polarity changes?).
It could still be that inside the motor something is wrong but I would make sure that both relays fire in each event, or put your multimeter in voltage mode, put him on the 2 black wires that are closest on the motor and see if you get 12 volt and in the other direction -12 (minus 12) volt.
zenddoor just take a volt meter and test at the motor leads. Across both leads. Will be 12v one direction and -12v the other. If so then the motor is the issue. Honestly with a winch that old i would send the motor out for repair and replace all 4 relays. Winch needs to work when needed. An unreliable winch might as well be left at home.
It might have bad brushes.
Good information on the new strap/rope!
I watched every second and now anticipating the next one. Thank you for the videos
Always learning something! Not a waste of a video!
If you want to confirm it's a control issue, switch the leads going to the motor. If it will only spin in and not out now, it's controls that are bad.
For a great upgrade get one of the wireless adapter kits from Harbor Freight or Tractor Supply (where I got mine). Makes it so you can run the winch from anywhere. Great when your working with trees. I wired mine parallel to the corded remote so I can use both.
Warn winches are DC series motors. The field winding is in series with the armature winding. There are three terminals plus the ground, on that winch. There are only two brushes. The brushes feed the armature (rotating) winding. One brush is connected to ground ( the case ), the other is connected to the terminal which is situated away from the other two terminals. The brushes ride on the commutator, which passes voltage to the armature. The polarity of the field winding is reversed, to switch direction of rotation. This is done with the four relays (2 for CW, 2 for CCW ). The field (stationary ) winding is connected to the two terminals nearest each other. Google warn winch schematic, for a wiring diagram
The mice (or rats) can reach that peanutbutter from the side of the bucket. You could lower that rotating bar 1 - 1,5 inches to get it beyond their reach so they have to get on that bar.
Or get a bigger bucket.
@@markhowards420 but then that spinning rod would not fit. Of course he could make one himself, just use a piece of alltrhread a some small diameter pvc tube
My dog ate the peanut butter on my trap! My son and I still tow with a chain, I am the tower and he is the towee and we use hand signals to tell each other what is needed!!! LOL I suppose if I had a phone it would be different now! LOL
Those soft shackles dont like dirt and mud so make sure you keep them out of the mud. Glad you picked up what I recommended, much safer and a lot better performance.
If someone wants to tell a story and starts to chuckle you know its gonna be good.
Mouse trap: we use a stick across the 5 gallon bucket, with a pop can through the center then put the peanut butter on the top and bottom of the can, I think the mice might not weight enough to spin the metal bar. To test the relay's you need to remove the leads to the motor other wise you are measuring across all the relays My .02 cents
Buying British is not buying a problem is means that you are buying character, a character that some times if created in the 60's-80's means its mainly on strike so spending money will result in the character working again. At least that's my excuse anyway.
I had same issuse , buy all 4 new solenoids and it will work like new. Dont just replace 1 or 2. For reliability replace all 4 you can order it from warn or any 4wheel shop , dont use Amazon solenoids
I’m really liking these repair videos. Keep them coming!
Thanks for the explanation of a relay. I like your simple explanations.
Cody with the winch pull the end of the winch off with the wires going to it inside it there is a copper winding with some bushes for contact that is the way the voltage is supplied to the motor and I have found that gets dirty or a bad contact so would be worth checking them first I had it in the past took it apart cleaned the contacts up and put a decent amount of contact lubricant on and it worked perfectly afterwards
You were right about the "A" on your multimeter for checking amperage. I recommend checking out a video on using one. They are pretty cool and come in handy when troubleshooting electrical problems.
Make a diving board mouse trap, so when they go out a certain distance the board falls in and the mice drown. My papa had one and it worked like a charm
The glass fuses are the best because you can wrap them with foil and they'll last forever.. or until whatever they're in burns to the ground, whichever comes first.
Great Video .
I have to rebuild my Warn xd9000 During the next weeks . I Broke the Motor Support by cutting down a tree With 95 cm at the bottom
The winch have to Support the tree Not to Fall in a barn .
Check for a short in the motor, sometimes you can see them, many motors just have some insulation rubbed off and you can respray it with laquer if you see arcing inside on a power test after you open it. Relays seem good though, and quite often it is something minor in the motor, even some rust on the armature can cause goofy issues.
Finn Electric in Grays Harbor (google shows him) is an old Swede and expert on auto electric motors, it's all he does, we take all our starters and alternators from shovels, cat's, skidders etc to him no matter where we are working in the state, he is very good at what he does.
Try switching the leads to the motor to see if the working side of the hand switch will now reverse the motor.
Good idea, should isolate where the problem is.
The motor is not bad. The two terminals closer to the drum are your field windings, the two towards the outside of the winch are your armature windings. It's what's called a series-wound motor. It's not a permanent magnet motor and uses an electromagnet to create a magnetic field. So for spool in, you're getting voltage to your field but not to your armature. Follow the field wire back into the control box and back out to the motor and see where it stops getting voltage. From what I can see in your video, it looks like a faulty connection.
ground the motor use the positive jumper on one terminal at a time if it works find the bad relay,if it don't work have the motor repaired. good luck!
Try emptying the water, they may not be floating. Or get a laptop with a webcam and a light, put some software on there like sighthound and that will highlight. You can export the clips too. The free version is only lower res but will work for what you need.
Another real (and good) video! Thanks for your time.
Engineering student here. First thing I would check is the brushes of the motor, and for any loose connections. those relays aren't going to be the first thing to go bad.
From my family to yours A very Merry Christmas And a Happy New Year, thank you for the awesome content and looking forward for next years surprises.
From Elliot Lake Ontario Canada.
I'm surprised the mouse trap didn't work. I've been trying to catch some mice around here myself and it astonishes me at how little they weigh. If it were me, I'd recommend drilling larger holes in the sides of the bucket where you inserted the ends of the spinning trap and perhaps even apply some sort of lubricant to reduce the friction even further. A small mouse may not weigh enough to cause the trap to spin as it's currently configured.
Anyway, good luck to you, Cody.
Those mice can EASILY walk across that roller. Way too much resistance in the bearings. The amount of force your finger is applying is 1000s of times stronger than the amount of force a mouse applies.
"Anything British is gonna give you problems"...... Hmmm.... Well as a Brit I'm wondering what problem I can send your way? :)
Unless you mean 1970's British Leyland cars.... Then I totally agree ..... :D
It's always the electrical bits manufactured by Lucas that cause problems. They don't call Lucas 'the Prince of Darkness' for nothing! ;-)
definition of a masochist..... a 58-76 British Leyland owner/fixer. I miss it!
Be very careful with that Bubba Rope. While these ropes are a great addition to a recovery kit, they can be dangerous when used in a snatch recovery. When chains fail, they "fall to the ground". Ropes like the bubba rope are kinetic ropes, like a rubber band. That energy has got to go somewhere if they fail. These ropes are generally used to extract vehicles stuck in mud or snow. You use the kinetic energy of the rope to multiply the towing force of the tow vehicle. I've used these for the last 20+ years and I have seen them fail. More specifically, the attachment points on one of the vehicles tend to fail first. When that happens, whatever D shackle, Tow hook or body part that breaks away from one of the vehicles, becomes a weighted missile attached to the end of a huge "rubber band" which has a massive amount of stored energy. Even if the rope breaks free without a weighted object on the end, it still has a lot of mass and energy. The damage on the receiving end of that energy can be immense. Serious injury or loss of life is a possibility if bystanders don't keep well back. These ropes are great, but please be careful using them! Make absolutely sure it is attached to solid and secure anchor points (not tow ball) and use a weighted recovery blanket half way between the vehicles as you would do with a winch cable. Thank you for sharing the info about the soft shackle. I wasn't aware of those. Gotta put in my order with Santa Claus... :-)
Cody check your brushes. You use spool in infinitely more than spool out and I would bet that your spool in brushes aren’t contacting anymore. Merry Christmas!
Rodenticide under a milk crates works best in our barn. We tried the bucket trick and it worked for a few months. The best method is to use a wire with with an oiled pvc small diameter PVC pipe over it. Try chunky peanut butter maybe.
I enjoyed the chain story. Thx
I once spent a summer doing a rodent field survey, using (amongst other kinds of devices) bucket traps. Quite often, we would find something substantially bigger than a mouse (rats, voles, weasels) in the buckets. And sometimes, the bait would be gone and there'd be nothing there ... which suggested that whatever took the bait (usually peanut butter, yes, rodents love it) was big enough to jump right out of the bucket.
Our bait was on the bottom of the bucket, and we covered the top (mostly), since we were live trapping and releasing, and did not want the rodents to die in the hours between when they fell in the bucket and we could get to them. Generally, this was interesting and fun, although the spectre of rodent feces borne disease made it slightly less fun.
Our country needs more masculine men who honor God, their wives, and their community as you show on your channel. I pray for your continued success.
Try jumping the motor from a battery using jumper cables (disconnect the leads from the solenoids at the studs on the motor first), if it runs both ways then you know it's a solenoid issue. If not, then you know it's a motor issue. I've had the internal leads (underneath the studs) break off so it'll only run one direction. Those motors are fairly simple so if it does seem like the culprit I'd tear into it and see what you find, sometimes it's easy to fix yourself or you can pass it along to an electric motor rebuilder.
If it does seem like a solenoid issue then I have some other suggestions but start with the motor...
Bad idea. Could cause a lot of arcing and possibly cause the battery to explode due to high amperage draw.
@@anthonycook8737 it's a quick test, considering he was careful not to activate the solenoids for too long I think he'd have enough common sense to realize there's a short if the arcing is excessive and not hold the cables on there until his battery explodes...
@@keithwalker7151 you should really read my detailed explanation of what's going on above.
Jumping 12v straight to the motor leads would also tell you if the Solenoid providing the ground to the motor for the pull in mode was not present. I am guessing the solenoids provide switched 12v and ground to the motor depending on which way you want the motor to run - checking for 12v and ground in each mode of operation would let you know if the motor/brushes truly are bad.
@@MichaelWheelock the relays do nothing with the ground on this type of motor. The ground is constant and shared between the 2 modes/ directions. The relays only serve to apply 12v to either of the 2 sides of the motor in order to spin the motor in the desired direction.
Love the story times! Keep them coming.
I had similar on my van check under the silver screws on the motor body for the brushes there probably badly worn hope it helps great vids by the way Cody
There are two ways of measuring amperage--1. directly by wiring the meter in the circuit which in this case will be difficult and 2. use a meter that clamps around the wire to show the amperage by inductance. This will be the safest and easiest in this situation. If you do not have a clamp-on meter they are not that expensive and are very useful in a number of situations without having to expose yourself to the current.
Try the winch measuring the amperage, the wire or circuit without amperage is open.
Yes the A is amps, seems to be there a short at the winding, could also be the brushes, or the wire some where, the through bolt I have also had trouble with also. Use ohms to check from the non working post to the base of the motor, should be open. Good luck and thank you sir.
Warn winches are my favorite too. I'll own one someday when I can afford one. Been keeping my eye on Craigslist for an old one I can fix up. Till then I'll have to settle with an old 12,000lb Harbor freight winch that just won't die.
Your dog may have eaten the peanut butter. Wow I guessed 10,000 Lbs. That is good! When and if I’m able to get a truck I’ll have to purchase some Bubba ropes
It looks like his Makita tools survived the FlexVolt campaign ;)
That rope, or dyneema, is very strong! Stronger then steel. But it has one "error", it can't stand sanding....! It will damage the rope so badly that it will brake....very quickly!!!!
So be carefull and use it wisely, greetings from Holland( were we invent dyneema....😁😁)
Check the brushes and hope it’s not the winding
reverseable electrical motors have two basic designs,One type had a foreward set of windings and another set of reverse windings they usually have 3 terminals on the motor. one is ground, a forward, and then a reverse . usually have 2 relays. or just a throw switch. Your 4 relays indicate that the relays reverse the currend in one set of windings. check all the contacts. the meter can show continuity but a bad connection will not pass enough current to operate the motor. You can connect jumper cables to the motor and bypass the relay to check motor operation . When installing new brushes it is best to have the armature turned-trued. A starter repair shop could just do the motor work.
I’ve had to replace a solenoid for the same reason. Disconnect the jumpers and energize the solenoid. Check both sides with continuity tester. Easy Peary. Got my replacement solenoid at carquest auto parts. Napa probably stocks them too.
I knew you were in trouble when you started disassembly. I did the same thing.
Put a test light on the other side of the relay that clicks it should light up. If it doesn’t it has bad connection inside check them all that way. You could also jump the terminals to see if it works
@22:10 "Anything British... is gonna give you problems." XDDD
1st try to hand turn the drum in the direction that's not working. Sometimes debris will wedge it self in the mechanism preventing the drum from turning one way and allowing it to move the other way. If it moves both ways by hand open the motor and check to see if a wire has come loose from the motor. You might be able to repair the break. The only thing left is to have someone test the coils of the motor for continuity. If there is no continuity, a part of the windings has burned apart and the motor will have to be replaced. Good luck on the repair.
You can also check the relay by jumping across the main wires just like jumping a solenoid on older cars. Use a jumper across the terminals then push button. Or swap switches.
Best option is as suggested, check the brushes, however some winches use a changeover solenoid, that is one with a contact that breaks, as well as one that makes, if the break contact is burnt out it will not make contact when the solenoid is turned off...
For your finale, you should have fixed Mrs. W's Christmas lights!! lol Love your videos!
I’d flip around the connections on the winch. So that when you push spool out the winch should spool in. This way you’ll know if it’s a switch/relay or if it’s something wrong with the motor.
Make sure you remember
Kinetic rope like the bubba rope should be used for quick tugs (I.e pulling someone out )
It should not be used for long dragging use, your old lifting strap (static strap) should be used for that or any time your winching with a strap attached
Take that pipe off the trap and replace with a soft drink bottle empty and drill a small hole in the cap and the bottom. The pipe is probably too heavy for a mouse, the pop bottle will turn more easily. I use it in the shop all the time. Some mice can jump out of short buckets. so I use a tall bucket. I leave the bucket empty.
with the relays the problem you've got is you have contact on which ever is bad if not both it/they will show low resistance but because the plates are either buckled or have pitting from use so they won't allow the adequate amount of current through to power the motor
my best guess is to connect the winch to the battery and measure the voltage between the high current poles on the relays a higher voltage equals the worse your relay is basically trying to pull power through your multimeter but it's the safest way of testing them
Never any bad content. Keep up the good work!!
I have never seen a wench taken apart before! Interesting how it works Mr. Wranglerstar! Your new gadget looks cool because it’s not so heavy even I could pick it up and use it. I am looking forward to seeing you put it to use on pulling something out of the mud/or a ditch! Another You Tube channel uses the mouse trap under his cabin with a high rate of success. The channel is the Boss of the Swamp. I think he has it down pat if you want to check out his channel Cody. FYI
Jack the Ripper did a pretty good job at it...