Great interview, Ben and Jaco👏 The insights and points raised were so well thought and it was great for me to get the perspective of a fellow African. As a Nigerian-immigrant currently working and schooling in Canada, I have come to the same conclusion: Social Justice, wokeness and progressivism can ONLY exist in a developed, liberal and first-world nation/region where there are very few existential threats and where the purposeless masses in urban areas have to create some form of ideology to fill the void in their lives. That is why it makes no sense and destroys that society. That is also why rural westerners, and immigrants mostly tend to hate social justice and wokeness more than the native citizens.
@@susanjones7734 it sounds as though this channel & you are grouping any interest in social justice ,&., presumably any political outlook you don't like, along with the extremes of wokeism . That is not remotely good psychology and is an underhand and dangerous political political rhetoric. Although narcissism & trauma, two elements strongly testified to in the ex-president's/now presidential candidate's background & frequent outbursts, it's totally false ,disingenuous & unprofessional to present this as specific to either the right or left (relative terms too often used like curse words in place of proper argument). All sides have suffered exactly this effect which was frequently warned of in 2016 onwards.
Joco just did a major forensic biopsy on the whole body politic of our current moment. One of the best diagnoses of the social and cultural disease plaguing us all. Thank you both!
@@thomassimmons1950 I think/hope you failed to pick up on the sarcasm about this ideologue's mix of abysmally poor psychology and politics . Unprofessional distorted and disgraceful .
My kids are struggling with the real versus the virtual world. So are the students in my school. It's disconcerting. Nothing can remedy it but interfacing in reality versus the internet.
100% I’ve always referred to it as the rich kid syndrome. When your parents are rich (and don’t require you to grow and achieve) your outlook on life reflects that. You believe the rest of the world should treat you like your parents do.
Excellent conversation! I am new to your channel but I am now subscribed. Intelligent, calm dialogue without the drama or overuse of spicy language. Love it!😂
Thanks for having Jaco on. I've been listening to his other interviews online, and I value his insights on very complex psychological and social issues. He's also is a deep thinker, which is appreciated in today's identity driven academic circles.
Regarding the dangers of SA and it's gradual downfall - i am so grateful my father saw the writing on the wall more than 25 years ago, he could tell the direction it would go, even when all his family scoffed and said he was being dramatic. He worked his ass off and eventually had enough money and skills that we could emigrate to a safer country.
Wow. I need more of this guy. There are still great thinkers! So much to be grateful now, even though there’s atrocity’s on the daily. I’ll look for him on Twitter. We’re all grieving and I can feel it here. Thank you.
Here’s a couple more chats from The Radical Center: Primitive Envy and Entitlement Ideologies, with Jaco Van Zyl ua-cam.com/video/AB52yryavo4/v-deo.html Resentment Discourses, Perversion, and Sexual Morality, with Jaco van Zyl ua-cam.com/video/faMkcku5tzI/v-deo.html
God Bless my parents for making me understand nothing is life is free. You work for what you want. I remember being scared as a young person that I might never be able to survive on my own. And I felt that way all through life. It made me work harder when I needed to. Now finally, I am not afraid. And, never, ever do I feel guilt for anything anyone else went through, because it was not my fault. They made their choices and had the same options as me.
Glad it happened to work out for you & does for many. It's a very good lesson but only honest & complete if it includes that this "hard" life means many people will try as much as hard as you to practice that same lesson but it won't work out for them otherwise it doesn't at all reflect real life and the hard life it speaks of wouldn't really be all that hard & your success would say little praiseworthy of you. I'd like to think it SHOULD be praiseworthy although there are certainly plenty of people I've met whose boast/ whinge about all they've done (..& anyone needing a hand being losers who bring it on themselves ) is deluded.
The dilema being oortrayed in this conversation reminds me of the Georgian Vs the Victorian eras. I was raised to scoff at the Victorians for their sense of propriety and moral hubris. But when tou look at Hogarth's cartoons of the squalor, corruption and decadence of the new industrialised societies you begin to appreciate the stiff upper lip, the stoicism and the elevation of heroic acts that the Victorians embraced as a rejection of debauchery. Vixtoria came to throne a decade or two after the loss of the American colonies, an extended war against France, and a futile defeat un the war of 1812. Victorians embraced the moral outrage of Dickens, public sentiment led ro Victirians rejecting slavery and the working people of the Manchester cotton mills campaigning against the unjust treatment of the slaves who grew the cotton they unpacked from bales in their mills. I am hopeful moralising with emory gestures in a pretext to discovering a new integrity a series of new initiatives to effect real change, not merw virtue signalling.
This was an excellent and intriguing interview. Thank you for providing this timely content, on these topics in particular (wokeism, narcissism, the bacchanalian celebration of indecency that now characterizes much of trans-rights activism and "Pride" agendas, the discussion of what compassion is and isn't-- and the humanistic universal take on psychological pathologies or lack of awareness underlying it all). I'm also a psychologist, with similar observations and concerns. I found the talk both validating and enlightening-- one to bookmark and circulate amongst friends and colleagues, particularly those who are yet blindly following the moral virtue signaling of their friends without critically thinking about what is happening. If anyone reading can recommend other content that tackles these issues in a similarly calm, critical, non-partisan, humanistic manner-- which my acquaintances on the far left in particular are prone to instantaneously reject and get emotional and lecturing about, to the point of not being able to even listen-- please comment and let me know!
This guy seems to have spurts of real insight . He is likely a good and decent man . Man do we need more people like him . May God help us all ! Many thanks for your work and in attracting these fine people to let us listen to , Benjamin ...
This interview is fantastic. It makes a very clear case, and I would imagine that it resonates very well with everyone who notices how rapidly all of our cultures are being weakened.
Dr. Marsha Linehan, who researched and developed treatments for borderline personality disorder, described the disorder with this paraphrased analogy: Imagine each person has an emotional skin. Borderline personality disorder is like having 3rd degree burns covering 90% of that skin. Trauma, physical and psychological, is an injury or wound. One who is already covered in unhealed wounds is likely to be quite traumatized by things which may cause mere discomfort to one who is not in such a state. The concerning push to redefine the word "violence" to apply in situations where an individual who is unable to self regulate is retraumatized is very unwise and demonstratably dangerous. But it seems equally unwise to me to then decide to redefine the word "trauma" to apply to wounds that could only be suffered by those who are in a healthy, healed, self-regulated state. What seems to be avoided in both of these changes in definitions is the work it takes to learn to self regulate and the ability--or perhaps patience-- to encourage and guide others to do the same.
Yet again another insightful interview with a thoughtful guest. I agree largely with the assertion that we are experiencing much of this socalled wokeness (which is simply a creation of academic feminism) as a result of prosperity or rather I would better describe as an excess of excesses. I concur with the assessment that the sufficient mother provides the best medium for a child to mature into adulthood. This discussion touched tangentially onto my disagreements with the recent analysis that oral contraception has been bad for western women. This argument reinforces the infantalizing notion that women have no agency and that they were compelled by 'society' to limit their fertility. But in fact, women have always had and used various methods to limit their reproduction. Oral contraception came along at about the same time that industrial output and employment opportunities provided women, initially at least, with a situation in which choosing to not have children during their most fertile phase of life was seen as advantageous. For most of history, a woman's ability to reproduce was her ultimate source of power. Concurrent with this excess output of the late 20th was the precipitous drop in infant mortality. Women today don't expect to give birth to 5 children in the hope that 2 or 3 might reacg adulthood. It follows then that oral contraception was adopted because it was so reliably easy to take that even a woman could depend on using it to limit her fertility and because medical advances made it less necessary for women to have as many children in order to have children.
Such an insightful prognosis of what we are living through in the west. Hating the consequences, while elevating the perversion. For all reading this, do not embody the projected guilt cast by wokeness. Cast it off and out!
Unprofessional, presenting his (right wing ideology) politics as though it were neutral and legitimate psychological analysis. Beyond B.S., not merely misleading but dangerously so.
I am overjoyed to hear this interview! I have been saying for a long time that Critical Social Justice is a two-part personality dynamic. It is the combination of the pathological mother and her narcissistic offspring operating in a somewhat abusive but symbiotic relationship.
This is my family and the Bay Area city that we moved from… On Reddit you see more and more people describing narcissistic neighbors, it’s a growing trend of “disintegration” (good word). We are definitely traumatized.
No Projection is a mechanism in Psych. terms. People who project their own inner goodness onto others, are often unprotected & targeted by perps. So it’s a complex mechanism that’s lifelong, only being ameliorated by lifelong therapy &/or value formation. So no, no one’s immune.
I already included my rambling thoughts for this vid (which was on Spotify) in Jash Dholani vid comments, which is a covert episode that currently only 20 ppl have watched for some reason. Also welcome back Unbannedjamin.
The discussion around the introduction of scarcity in order to manage the human tendency to always crave more is key. Ancient philosophies, both Eastern and Western (for example, Vedanta and Stoicism, respectively), make it very clear that a decent human life is not possible without a large measure of self-restraint. In these (and other) traditions discipline and austerity (i.e., voluntary hardship undertaken by the individual for the purpose of development and refinement of character) are core principles and basic ingredients of a life well lived. Since life is hard, humans tend to seek comfort, and for this reason these principles were never exactly popular or dominant. Yet it seems that despite all our technological advancement, discipline and austerity have gone from well known in the ancient world to almost nonexistent among modern humans. Very few have the ability to tolerate delayed gratification, moreover, many see zero value in doing so. When self-control is a foreign concept we end up with a society of adult children, as we see, and the individual and social consequences are clearly not good.
@@Caitanyadasa108 Your view of scarcity (austerity, self-restraint, survival) is a romantic one. How does it square with your experiences in the wider economy? What do you think of Hume's philosophy?
@@davidsprouse151 IMO self-restraint and austerity are indispensable aspects of a life lived well, moving us away from the base tendencies of animality toward the higher end of what humans can be. I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "How does is square with my experience in the wider economy?" It would affect an economy predicated on continual growth negatively, to be sure, as people would consume far less. Which aspect of Hume's philosophy are you referring to?
@@Caitanyadasa108 The irony is that most people associate romanticism with unbridled passions, but there's its polar opposite as well where radical restraint of those passions is romantic (IMO) Jaco, that's NOT a fetish. I find,maybe I'm averaging here that most folks with your views also have a tendency to apply it at the macro level. Initially, what I meant by my question i.e. wider economy was about your personal experiences. I imagine it makes one a great saver, sometimes it might border on obsessive saving (hoarding of resources, capital etc.) In alot of economic models the micro can't apply at the macro level given certain thresholds of populations. Balance is everything. Narcissism is chronic in western cultures. But what's the cure? Mandating austerity? On a personal level isn't it two different aspects of the brain, certainty and uncertainty? Certainty gives us a hit of dopamine (reward) as our expectations are met; uncertainty triggers the amygdala (part of the limbic system in the brain responsible for survival instincts, among other things). Maybe there was some kind of meta-analysis that Jaco was doing that I missed.
And I followed this up with your Evergreen saga! That was difficult to watch without becoming a bit despondent over the realization of how performative we all can be under the right conditions. *shudder
The kid with the cut finger reminded me of a brilliant teacher my kid had when he first went to school. I noticed that whenever the kids ran to her in alarm to tell her something, she would respond with "uh huh, that's ok" - which would often leave them with this look on their faces like, oh, it is? Ok! And they'd run off. I think kids are constantly trying to suss out what's safe and what's not, and we aren't very good at telling them, "yeah, that's a thing in the world, bodies do that, things like that happen" and not qualifying it as terrible or traumatic or whatever.
Interestingly this teacher was attachment led, but she wasn't permissive. She was clear, she understood the limits of small kids but she had expectations of them and she didn't punish unfairly - IE send them for timeout or whatever. She figured out how to discipline without being punitive or permissive, and essentially pared things back it seemed. She was really astute. Looked like nothing much from the outside but she was very consciously making decisions when responding to them.
I think Jonathan Haidt described the problem more succinctly and - given the data he presented - more realistically in his talk ‘The Three Terrible Ideas Weakening Gen Z’ and other presentations he’s made like ‘The Coddling of the American Mind’.
Some chronic victims have no trauma to blame. Just a victim self image and a cultural hierarchy to climb. I say that because it describes someone I know. Never misses an opportunity to express victimhood
50:00 2 Corinthians 7:10 For the sorrow that is according to the will of God produces a repentance without regret, leading to salvation, but the sorrow of the world produces death
Very much a discussion based upon North American cultural standards. Mexican American here. Totally and completley different from my cultural guidelines and standards.
I do take issue with what Jaco said about venereal disease. I understand his point that we all are responsible for our choices, but the presence of the disease is an injustice as well. Both things can be true. The person in question didn’t deserve that consequence. No one deserves that. Also, you don’t have to be promiscuous or engage in risky behavior to get a venereal disease. You can get it from someone who is. Never blame anyone for their misfortune when you don’t know the whole story. And even if it is their “fault”, they still don’t deserve it.
Right after the 34 minute mark. Adequate appreciation of the other as necessary to your own existence. That's exactly what soulless bureaucracy and atomizing capitalism produce. We don't see the people we rely on, because they're over the horizon. Ergo, we assume they must not be important. We need to rekindle personal, reciprocal, dependency on the individual level up.
I had a horrible thought that huge numbers of men never do get beyond the anger towards mother feeling, otherwise how is it that misogyny is so deep and endless?
Blame their mothers, ultimately. I’ve noticed an epidemic of terrible parenting, but more from mothers than fathers. (I am a mother, fwiw.) Too many mothers these days use their kids as tools for self-expression and a means for gaining clout among their local IRL social groups and on the internet. I think these kids can feel that happening, even if they can’t put it into words. So many of my kid’s peers seem deeply fragile and unstable, and I suspect it’s because they see themselves as mere extensions of their moms, and not fully-fledged people with their own wants and needs. Then, rather than examine that, mom medicates the kids and blames “society,” and outsources that attention-seeking/validation behavior to the entire internet by putting the kid on a tablet and letting them use social media way too early. Imagine growing up that way and *not* being resentful to your mother.
My mother is the most honorable person that I know and she is the first to agree that misogyny is both an inevitable and appropriate reaction to the history of feminism. How did we go from a dignity culture to a victimhood culture? Spoiled and decadent standard of living? Yes. Luxury beliefs largely replacing luxury possessions as signs of social status? Yes. Concentration of wealth and power into the hands of incompetent minds? Yes. And what is the essential distillation of all these things? Spoiled, incompetent, ignorant, out of touch women demanding unearned status for no reason other than that they are women. They kicked in the door with cry-bullying identity based grievance claims and held it open for every other absurd claim to rush in after them. The "liberation" of the incompetent to make group based demands on a share of power and proceed to deconstruct any resistance with an ever-changing post modern hypocrisy where your truth cannot be questioned at the same time that any obstacle to it exists in an absurd void of rational unknowability. The entire structure of wokeness is the spread of the original cancer of bad faith feminism. The decline of the West is the direct result of female ignorance, ingratitude, status seeking, and dishonest opportunism. No "intellectual" youtubers are going to alienate half the world by telling this truth. But nothing could be more historically or sociologically obvious. I am an unapologetic chauvinist and I would do anything to protect my mother. I would respectfully invite you to reconsider your understanding.
The thought is that both maternal and paternal roles are for learning. So often the maternal is equated to a hindrance instead of something useful to learn. Both roles are necessary for proper development.
I ask how this too good mothering is being affected by mothers waiting til later years to have children. I also ask if too good mothering can be applied when so many children grew up in 2nd hand childcare
That point about the internet and the growing issues of adjustnent to it, reminds me of another historically sinilar example. When Gutenberg's printing press was invented, it also ked to maby societal upheavals and drastic changes that took a lot o time to adjust to but human society did. Same with the television. Jaco is right. Human society will eventually cone to a proper atate of adjustment to the Internet
Artificial scarcity is something I practice as a person. Too much sexual experiences? Remove that stimulus from your life for awhile. Too much gaming? Uninstall all of your games for a couple months. Too much sugar? Don't buy that crap. Too much sleep? Put Bright lights on a timer in your room. Its easy, but hard to force yourself.
the part on envy and the mother/mother's milk is a good analysis to apply to porn use - 'I need you but I hate you; regarding the porn provider, usually a woman, then the rage acted out on hating women generally, especially older women telling unpalatable truths about reality.
Benjamin, could you talk to Ernst van Zyl IConscious Caracal) or Rob Duigan (Marobane)? They're South Africans, both very smart and insightful men, and their perspective is important because in 10 years the US will be where South Africa is now.
Fabulous exploration into psych origins of wokeness Gentlemen since we cannot address what we don’t understand. I suggest Stephen Jenkinson, in a 2005 Hollyhock Life utoob video “The Case for Elderhood” deftly proves a certain generation of parents responsible for it.
Wow he is really good at pointing out the distinctions and nuances. What is “smuggled in”. Imo that is the narcissistic mechanism hijacking the real and good stuff…
The freudian melanie klein guilt bs though 😂sorry, no! ”Destroy the breast”. Yeah right 😂. Do your kids ”attack” moms breast 😅? My five did not, definitely. I think they a vere eating and b enjoyed. At every age (it is good to breast feed for as long as you both can and want and feel to do it, and not listen to fear driven nonsens).
Great interview, Ben and Jaco👏 The insights and points raised were so well thought and it was great for me to get the perspective of a fellow African. As a Nigerian-immigrant currently working and schooling in Canada, I have come to the same conclusion: Social Justice, wokeness and progressivism can ONLY exist in a developed, liberal and first-world nation/region where there are very few existential threats and where the purposeless masses in urban areas have to create some form of ideology to fill the void in their lives. That is why it makes no sense and destroys that society. That is also why rural westerners, and immigrants mostly tend to hate social justice and wokeness more than the native citizens.
Exactly, well said.
What have learned exaclty if you havnt taken it on board?
Some of us native citizens do tend to hate the social justice and wokeness nonsense just as much.
@@susanjones7734 it sounds as though this channel & you are grouping any interest in social justice ,&., presumably any political outlook you don't like, along with the extremes of wokeism . That is not remotely good psychology and is an underhand and dangerous political political rhetoric. Although narcissism & trauma, two elements strongly testified to in the ex-president's/now presidential candidate's background & frequent outbursts, it's totally false ,disingenuous & unprofessional to present this as specific to either the right or left (relative terms too often used like curse words in place of proper argument). All sides have suffered exactly this effect which was frequently warned of in 2016 onwards.
Joco just did a major forensic biopsy on the whole body politic of our current moment. One of the best diagnoses of the social and cultural disease plaguing us all.
Thank you both!
Hear hear , Thomas !
Which podcast was it???
@@ceegee287 Woke Narcissism and Complex Trauma with Jaco Zyl.
@@thomassimmons1950 Oh. I thought you meant one of his podcasts on his site. thank you :)
@@thomassimmons1950 I think/hope you failed to pick up on the sarcasm about this ideologue's mix of abysmally poor psychology and politics . Unprofessional distorted and disgraceful .
My kids are struggling with the real versus the virtual world. So are the students in my school. It's disconcerting. Nothing can remedy it but interfacing in reality versus the internet.
The entire society is, in effect, spoiled rotten. No appreciation for how hard it was to get where we are. I think we're doomed by success.
100%
100% I’ve always referred to it as the rich kid syndrome. When your parents are rich (and don’t require you to grow and achieve) your outlook on life reflects that. You believe the rest of the world should treat you like your parents do.
Bingo! Even the people who THINK they're oppressed are just spoiled brats in grown adult bodies.
AMEN
And they have no self worth because you never worked for what you have. So they make up reasons to puff up their egos.
Jaco was EXCELLENT! Wow... he was spot on with everything I heard. Fantastic guest and hope to see him again!
😺 👀 👋
@@SydneyBristow0788 ... 🐈bonKitty, bonKitty *BONK* 🦘🙃😻💜
Fantastic conversation, so insightful. Lots of food for thought. Thank you!
Victim culture (Dignity replacement): Guilt, Shame, Repression, Tolerance = A Potent Cocktail Toxic For Human Flourishing. LOVE IT!
Excellent conversation! I am new to your channel but I am now subscribed. Intelligent, calm dialogue without the drama or overuse of spicy language. Love it!😂
Thank you both for this fascinating calmversation. May Peace and Love find the hearts of all South Africans. 🙏🏾🇺🇸❤️
Its good to have you back on the tube my good sir. Thank you for the convo, and have a wonderful rest of your sunday.
Thanks for having Jaco on. I've been listening to his other interviews online, and I value his insights on very complex psychological and social issues.
He's also is a deep thinker, which is appreciated in today's identity driven academic circles.
Regarding the dangers of SA and it's gradual downfall - i am so grateful my father saw the writing on the wall more than 25 years ago, he could tell the direction it would go, even when all his family scoffed and said he was being dramatic. He worked his ass off and eventually had enough money and skills that we could emigrate to a safer country.
Wow. I need more of this guy. There are still great thinkers! So much to be grateful now, even though there’s atrocity’s on the daily. I’ll look for him on Twitter. We’re all grieving and I can feel it here. Thank you.
Here’s a couple more chats from The Radical Center:
Primitive Envy and Entitlement Ideologies, with Jaco Van Zyl
ua-cam.com/video/AB52yryavo4/v-deo.html
Resentment Discourses, Perversion, and Sexual Morality, with Jaco van Zyl
ua-cam.com/video/faMkcku5tzI/v-deo.html
God Bless my parents for making me understand nothing is life is free. You work for what you want. I remember being scared as a young person that I might never be able to survive on my own. And I felt that way all through life. It made me work harder when I needed to. Now finally, I am not afraid. And, never, ever do I feel guilt for anything anyone else went through, because it was not my fault. They made their choices and had the same options as me.
Glad it happened to work out for you & does for many. It's a very good lesson but only honest & complete if it includes that this "hard" life means many people will try as much as hard as you to practice that same lesson but it won't work out for them otherwise it doesn't at all reflect real life and the hard life it speaks of wouldn't really be all that hard & your success would say little praiseworthy of you. I'd like to think it SHOULD be praiseworthy although there are certainly plenty of people I've met whose boast/ whinge about all they've done (..& anyone needing a hand being losers who bring it on themselves ) is deluded.
Thank God for people like Jaco👍
There is hope for a return to sanity.
The dilema being oortrayed in this conversation reminds me of the Georgian Vs the Victorian eras.
I was raised to scoff at the Victorians for their sense of propriety and moral hubris.
But when tou look at Hogarth's cartoons of the squalor, corruption and decadence of the new industrialised societies you begin to appreciate the stiff upper lip, the stoicism and the elevation of heroic acts that the Victorians embraced as a rejection of debauchery.
Vixtoria came to throne a decade or two after the loss of the American colonies, an extended war against France, and a futile defeat un the war of 1812.
Victorians embraced the moral outrage of Dickens, public sentiment led ro Victirians rejecting slavery and the working people of the Manchester cotton mills campaigning against the unjust treatment of the slaves who grew the cotton they unpacked from bales in their mills.
I am hopeful moralising with emory gestures in a pretext to discovering a new integrity a series of new initiatives to effect real change, not merw virtue signalling.
Thank you both for this conversation. Healthy humans, well-adjusted humans...something we should all be aligned in seeking.
This was an excellent and intriguing interview. Thank you for providing this timely content, on these topics in particular (wokeism, narcissism, the bacchanalian celebration of indecency that now characterizes much of trans-rights activism and "Pride" agendas, the discussion of what compassion is and isn't-- and the humanistic universal take on psychological pathologies or lack of awareness underlying it all). I'm also a psychologist, with similar observations and concerns. I found the talk both validating and enlightening-- one to bookmark and circulate amongst friends and colleagues, particularly those who are yet blindly following the moral virtue signaling of their friends without critically thinking about what is happening. If anyone reading can recommend other content that tackles these issues in a similarly calm, critical, non-partisan, humanistic manner-- which my acquaintances on the far left in particular are prone to instantaneously reject and get emotional and lecturing about, to the point of not being able to even listen-- please comment and let me know!
I’m also horrified at how people in your field are being forced and/or brainwashed into stating or thinking otherwise.
See also “Deprogrammed” by Keri Smith for many topics including very much the psychology of wokeism.
You Must Be Some Kind of Therapist podcast; Gender, A Wider Lens podcast
Maybe non-partisan is a better term to use than bi-partisan.
Dr Gad Saad is good, also the DarkHorse podcast and UnHerd
This guy seems to have spurts of real insight . He is likely a good and decent man . Man do we need more people like him . May God help us all ! Many thanks for your work and in attracting these fine people to let us listen to , Benjamin ...
What a great guest. Thank you for this conversation. Looking forward to another one in the future ;)
So much respect and appreciation for both of you gentlemen. Thank you!
Congratulations on returning to your show!
This interview is fantastic. It makes a very clear case, and I would imagine that it resonates very well with everyone who notices how rapidly all of our cultures are being weakened.
It WAS lovely! Thank you both.
I love the idea of the father leading the child to the internal mother.
Enlightening and uplifting as always. Thank you Benjamin.
😂
The comment immediately after yours:
«This was incredibly bleak!»
You have the most calming voice Benjamin! I love listening to your videos.
User name checks out.
Dr. Marsha Linehan, who researched and developed treatments for borderline personality disorder, described the disorder with this paraphrased analogy: Imagine each person has an emotional skin. Borderline personality disorder is like having 3rd degree burns covering 90% of that skin.
Trauma, physical and psychological, is an injury or wound. One who is already covered in unhealed wounds is likely to be quite traumatized by things which may cause mere discomfort to one who is not in such a state.
The concerning push to redefine the word "violence" to apply in situations where an individual who is unable to self regulate is retraumatized is very unwise and demonstratably dangerous. But it seems equally unwise to me to then decide to redefine the word "trauma" to apply to wounds that could only be suffered by those who are in a healthy, healed, self-regulated state.
What seems to be avoided in both of these changes in definitions is the work it takes to learn to self regulate and the ability--or perhaps patience-- to encourage and guide others to do the same.
Yet again another insightful interview with a thoughtful guest. I agree largely with the assertion that we are experiencing much of this socalled wokeness (which is simply a creation of academic feminism) as a result of prosperity or rather I would better describe as an excess of excesses. I concur with the assessment that the sufficient mother provides the best medium for a child to mature into adulthood. This discussion touched tangentially onto my disagreements with the recent analysis that oral contraception has been bad for western women. This argument reinforces the infantalizing notion that women have no agency and that they were compelled by 'society' to limit their fertility.
But in fact, women have always had and used various methods to limit their reproduction. Oral contraception came along at about the same time that industrial output and employment opportunities provided women, initially at least, with a situation in which choosing to not have children during their most fertile phase of life was seen as advantageous. For most of history, a woman's ability to reproduce was her ultimate source of power. Concurrent with this excess output of the late 20th was the precipitous drop in infant mortality. Women today don't expect to give birth to 5 children in the hope that 2 or 3 might reacg adulthood. It follows then that oral contraception was adopted because it was so reliably easy to take that even a woman could depend on using it to limit her fertility and because medical advances made it less necessary for women to have as many children in order to have children.
Such an insightful prognosis of what we are living through in the west. Hating the consequences, while elevating the perversion.
For all reading this, do not embody the projected guilt cast by wokeness. Cast it off and out!
Yes
Unprofessional, presenting his (right wing ideology) politics as though it were neutral and legitimate psychological analysis. Beyond B.S., not merely misleading but dangerously so.
AWESOME FELLAS. PROUD TO BE SOUTH AFRICAN. mtnz in exile
As an Irishman it's always interesting to hear people's experience/perception of Ireland
Another fantastic calmversation. Thank you Benjamin and Jaco!
Very insightful discussion. Thank you. Great he is here in Ireland with the bees.
I am overjoyed to hear this interview! I have been saying for a long time that Critical Social Justice is a two-part personality dynamic. It is the combination of the pathological mother and her narcissistic offspring operating in a somewhat abusive but symbiotic relationship.
Very interesting thoughful discussion. Good to have your voice back Mr Boyce.
Great conversation. Thanks to both of you. Welcome to Ireland Jaco.
This is my family and the Bay Area city that we moved from…
On Reddit you see more and more people describing narcissistic neighbors, it’s a growing trend of “disintegration” (good word).
We are definitely traumatized.
It’s the generation of the beautiful ones
Rat utopia
Yeah I love Jaco. He’s got the warmest soul!
This was very good and informative. I truly appreciate the discussion and knowledge of your guest and yourself.
Is not projection the most reductive explanation? Narcissism and projection are the primitive dynamic duo. Child mind.
@Robert The encouragement of narcissism. 🙃
No
Projection is a mechanism in Psych. terms.
People who project their own inner goodness onto others, are often unprotected & targeted by perps. So it’s a complex mechanism that’s lifelong, only being ameliorated by lifelong therapy &/or value formation.
So no, no one’s immune.
A guy named Jaco talking about narcissism. ❤
11:00 relevant conversation starts
Another great video Benjamin. Keep up the amazing work. Honestly the only source I trust when it comes to looking at these modern social issues.
I already included my rambling thoughts for this vid (which was on Spotify) in Jash Dholani vid comments, which is a covert episode that currently only 20 ppl have watched for some reason. Also welcome back Unbannedjamin.
What's going on with the "Bannedjamin"?...I missed that story...
@@serpentines6356 He did an episode abt covid vax stuff in Canada, and got banned for a week by the internet overlords.
The discussion around the introduction of scarcity in order to manage the human tendency to always crave more is key. Ancient philosophies, both Eastern and Western (for example, Vedanta and Stoicism, respectively), make it very clear that a decent human life is not possible without a large measure of self-restraint. In these (and other) traditions discipline and austerity (i.e., voluntary hardship undertaken by the individual for the purpose of development and refinement of character) are core principles and basic ingredients of a life well lived. Since life is hard, humans tend to seek comfort, and for this reason these principles were never exactly popular or dominant. Yet it seems that despite all our technological advancement, discipline and austerity have gone from well known in the ancient world to almost nonexistent among modern humans. Very few have the ability to tolerate delayed gratification, moreover, many see zero value in doing so. When self-control is a foreign concept we end up with a society of adult children, as we see, and the individual and social consequences are clearly not good.
What is an adult child? Do you mean adults who act like children?
@@davidsprouse151 Yes, adults who have the emotional maturity and level of self-control of children.
@@Caitanyadasa108 Your view of scarcity (austerity, self-restraint, survival) is a romantic one. How does it square with your experiences in the wider economy? What do you think of Hume's philosophy?
@@davidsprouse151 IMO self-restraint and austerity are indispensable aspects of a life lived well, moving us away from the base tendencies of animality toward the higher end of what humans can be. I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "How does is square with my experience in the wider economy?" It would affect an economy predicated on continual growth negatively, to be sure, as people would consume far less. Which aspect of Hume's philosophy are you referring to?
@@Caitanyadasa108 The irony is that most people associate romanticism with unbridled passions, but there's its polar opposite as well where radical restraint of those passions is romantic (IMO) Jaco, that's NOT a fetish.
I find,maybe I'm averaging here that most folks with your views also have a tendency to apply it at the macro level. Initially, what I meant by my question i.e. wider economy was about your personal experiences. I imagine it makes one a great saver, sometimes it might border on obsessive saving (hoarding of resources, capital etc.) In alot of economic models the micro can't apply at the macro level given certain thresholds of populations.
Balance is everything. Narcissism is chronic in western cultures. But what's the cure? Mandating austerity? On a personal level isn't it two different aspects of the brain, certainty and uncertainty? Certainty gives us a hit of dopamine (reward) as our expectations are met; uncertainty triggers the amygdala (part of the limbic system in the brain responsible for survival instincts, among other things).
Maybe there was some kind of meta-analysis that Jaco was doing that I missed.
Back already!?
I barely had enough time to miss you!
😾
Dam this is what passes for a Saturday night for me. I love it! What an amazing discussion.
And I followed this up with your Evergreen saga! That was difficult to watch without becoming a bit despondent over the realization of how performative we all can be under the right conditions. *shudder
The kid with the cut finger reminded me of a brilliant teacher my kid had when he first went to school. I noticed that whenever the kids ran to her in alarm to tell her something, she would respond with "uh huh, that's ok" - which would often leave them with this look on their faces like, oh, it is? Ok! And they'd run off. I think kids are constantly trying to suss out what's safe and what's not, and we aren't very good at telling them, "yeah, that's a thing in the world, bodies do that, things like that happen" and not qualifying it as terrible or traumatic or whatever.
Interestingly this teacher was attachment led, but she wasn't permissive. She was clear, she understood the limits of small kids but she had expectations of them and she didn't punish unfairly - IE send them for timeout or whatever. She figured out how to discipline without being punitive or permissive, and essentially pared things back it seemed. She was really astute. Looked like nothing much from the outside but she was very consciously making decisions when responding to them.
I think Jonathan Haidt described the problem more succinctly and - given the data he presented - more realistically in his talk ‘The Three Terrible Ideas Weakening Gen Z’ and other presentations he’s made like ‘The Coddling of the American Mind’.
Fantastic interview. Thanks guys!
Some chronic victims have no trauma to blame. Just a victim self image and a cultural hierarchy to climb. I say that because it describes someone I know. Never misses an opportunity to express victimhood
This was superb , thank you both
Great conversation from the hosts of two great channels.
31:40 people who read history can imagine that, and they do rise the flag, but their warnings were casually disregarded.
50:00 2 Corinthians 7:10 For the sorrow that is according to the will of God produces a repentance without regret, leading to salvation, but the sorrow of the world produces death
Thanks for this.
I was thinking about the teachings of Christ that expose the decay of society. For example, I now cringe at the word Pride.
Very much a discussion based upon North American cultural standards. Mexican American here. Totally and completley different from my cultural guidelines and standards.
Fabulous guest!
What a great interview. Fantastic.
I got a strange desire for a glass of milk listening to this episode
Big Dairy strikes again!
I do take issue with what Jaco said about venereal disease. I understand his point that we all are responsible for our choices, but the presence of the disease is an injustice as well. Both things can be true. The person in question didn’t deserve that consequence. No one deserves that. Also, you don’t have to be promiscuous or engage in risky behavior to get a venereal disease. You can get it from someone who is. Never blame anyone for their misfortune when you don’t know the whole story. And even if it is their “fault”, they still don’t deserve it.
Great interview with a very humanizing perspective on our present societal condition.
Totally enjoyed the interview. This gentleman has some really good points about culture... Would love to see him again here. :)
This guy is good! Thank you for this interview. So interesting!
What a great and fascinating interview!
Really enjoying this conversation and especially an alternate perspective on the West.
So great ♥️
Thank you both 🕊
Excellent interview! Always worth listening to Jaco (and Benjamin) 🙂
Right after the 34 minute mark.
Adequate appreciation of the other as necessary to your own existence.
That's exactly what soulless bureaucracy and atomizing capitalism produce. We don't see the people we rely on, because they're over the horizon. Ergo, we assume they must not be important.
We need to rekindle personal, reciprocal, dependency on the individual level up.
He's back
It is amazing to hear your analysis! I have never heard one that is more in accordance with my own, but a bit more differenciated...
Please write a book! ^^
A society has to be quite rich to afford so many spoiled brats, who never work at more than 50% capacity for fear of "stress".
Damn, what an incredible video.
Yaaaay, Benjamin’s back!! 🙂
this is pure excellence.
I had a horrible thought that huge numbers of men never do get beyond the anger towards mother feeling, otherwise how is it that misogyny is so deep and endless?
Blame their mothers, ultimately. I’ve noticed an epidemic of terrible parenting, but more from mothers than fathers. (I am a mother, fwiw.)
Too many mothers these days use their kids as tools for self-expression and a means for gaining clout among their local IRL social groups and on the internet. I think these kids can feel that happening, even if they can’t put it into words. So many of my kid’s peers seem deeply fragile and unstable, and I suspect it’s because they see themselves as mere extensions of their moms, and not fully-fledged people with their own wants and needs. Then, rather than examine that, mom medicates the kids and blames “society,” and outsources that attention-seeking/validation behavior to the entire internet by putting the kid on a tablet and letting them use social media way too early.
Imagine growing up that way and *not* being resentful to your mother.
My mother is the most honorable person that I know and she is the first to agree that misogyny is both an inevitable and appropriate reaction to the history of feminism. How did we go from a dignity culture to a victimhood culture? Spoiled and decadent standard of living? Yes. Luxury beliefs largely replacing luxury possessions as signs of social status? Yes. Concentration of wealth and power into the hands of incompetent minds? Yes. And what is the essential distillation of all these things? Spoiled, incompetent, ignorant, out of touch women demanding unearned status for no reason other than that they are women. They kicked in the door with cry-bullying identity based grievance claims and held it open for every other absurd claim to rush in after them. The "liberation" of the incompetent to make group based demands on a share of power and proceed to deconstruct any resistance with an ever-changing post modern hypocrisy where your truth cannot be questioned at the same time that any obstacle to it exists in an absurd void of rational unknowability. The entire structure of wokeness is the spread of the original cancer of bad faith feminism. The decline of the West is the direct result of female ignorance, ingratitude, status seeking, and dishonest opportunism. No "intellectual" youtubers are going to alienate half the world by telling this truth. But nothing could be more historically or sociologically obvious. I am an unapologetic chauvinist and I would do anything to protect my mother. I would respectfully invite you to reconsider your understanding.
[thinking of 70's TV show theme song] "Welcome back", Mr. Benjamin... you were missed 🐈head bonk x7
If the collectivists are co-mothering then the members never learn to self-mother. i.e. codependent instead of self-reliant.
Interdependence is the natural state of all things, and yet still a self reliant person created a stronger interdependence as well
@@HerWanderlust There's a difference between interdependence and codependence.
they are doubling down. The stumbling block is always the inability to forgive oneself -
Hey it's Jaco, my long time South African fb friend!
I’m only 20 mins in but I think it’s the job of the mother to help the child learn to care for himself.
The thought is that both maternal and paternal roles are for learning. So often the maternal is equated to a hindrance instead of something useful to learn. Both roles are necessary for proper development.
Nearly at 100K subscribers now, grats 🎉
I ask how this too good mothering is being affected by mothers waiting til later years to have children. I also ask if too good mothering can be applied when so many children grew up in 2nd hand childcare
That point about the internet and the growing issues of adjustnent to it, reminds me of another historically sinilar example. When Gutenberg's printing press was invented, it also ked to maby societal upheavals and drastic changes that took a lot o time to adjust to but human society did. Same with the television. Jaco is right. Human society will eventually cone to a proper atate of adjustment to the Internet
10:00 Don't worry, within the next 5 -10 years you'll be hearing plenty of African languages in Ireland
This was a great video..... learned so much.
One of the most insightful calmversations I’ve ever heard.
Yes!!! Jaco is brilliant. Thank you Benjamin!!!
This was very insightful. Thanks!
Welcome to Ireland. If you can manage five years without the weather dragging you down, then you’ll have cracked it!!
Artificial scarcity is something I practice as a person. Too much sexual experiences? Remove that stimulus from your life for awhile. Too much gaming? Uninstall all of your games for a couple months. Too much sugar? Don't buy that crap. Too much sleep? Put Bright lights on a timer in your room. Its easy, but hard to force yourself.
I'd like to get in contact with Jaco, I am also a South African expat living in Ireland
he is on TwiterX
The Problem of Evil - it was one of the exam option questions when I was at college.
the part on envy and the mother/mother's milk is a good analysis to apply to porn use - 'I need you but I hate you; regarding the porn provider, usually a woman, then the rage acted out on hating women generally, especially older women telling unpalatable truths about reality.
WELCOME BACK BENJAMIN
amazing episode .
Benjamin, could you talk to Ernst van Zyl IConscious Caracal) or Rob Duigan (Marobane)? They're South Africans, both very smart and insightful men, and their perspective is important because in 10 years the US will be where South Africa is now.
I spoke with Benjamin in 2021, look for the CRT in SA episode
Fabulous exploration into psych origins of wokeness Gentlemen since we cannot address what we don’t understand. I suggest Stephen Jenkinson, in a 2005 Hollyhock Life utoob video “The Case for Elderhood” deftly proves a certain generation of parents responsible for it.
Wow he is really good at pointing out the distinctions and nuances. What is “smuggled in”. Imo that is the narcissistic mechanism hijacking the real and good stuff…
The freudian melanie klein guilt bs though 😂sorry, no! ”Destroy the breast”. Yeah right 😂. Do your kids ”attack” moms breast 😅? My five did not, definitely. I think they a vere eating and b enjoyed. At every age (it is good to breast feed for as long as you both can and want and feel to do it, and not listen to fear driven nonsens).
❤ your 🧶🐅😺🐾 Intros.
37:28 “Am I too dark?”
LOL. THIS question after he talked about how the baby wanting to bite off the mother’s breast for not feeding them in time.