Audi RS4 Avant vs Vauxhall VXR8 Tourer (Holden HSV Clubsport) - performance estate car showdown
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- Опубліковано 19 вер 2024
- The Audi RS4 Avant and Vauxhall VXR8 Tourer are both V8 high-performance estate cars, but their execution couldn't be more different.
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It's amazing that two £50,000 sporting V8 estate cars can be as different as the Audi RS4 Avant and Vauxhall VXR8 Tourer in character. The RS4 is turbocharged, four-wheel drive with a seven-speed dual clutch gearbox and impeccable fit and finish. The Holden HSV Clubsport-based Vauxhall VXR8 is big-hearted, rear-wheel drive, manual and has a comparatively old-school interior. Steve Sutcliffe drove them both flat-out to see if German precision could overcome the tyre-smoking brawn of the 6.2-litre VXR8.
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3000 pounds cheaper? lol in australia the rs4 is more than double the price of one of these things. You'd have to be on meth not to get the RS4 in Britian but the Clubsport wagon in australia makes a load more sense.
In Aus, the meth users are all driving VXR8's and the meth dealers are using Audi's. That's the difference...
Meth heads are driving broken down old VS/VN commodores not $60,000 HSV's
Andrew Rabbitt this is the best answer ever ever I heard.Buddy you nailed it.Audi is best that's for sure 👌❤😃
To buy any euro car in aus is just plain stupid, cost of parts and repairs are absolutely stupid, its ok if you can afford to turn them in every 3 years but if you buy a car for the long haul Commadore or Falcon any day, parts are cheap, they are easy to work on and you dont need $20,000 worth of special service tools to do anything with them. From a mechanics point of view euro cars are too fragile and expensive to be worth having.
For example audi V8 timing chain kit is somewhere around $3500 in parts alone, timing chain kit for the LS3 around $300 to $500 depending on brand and type.
brought an Audi once never buying euro again! 😅
Also interesting to note the price differences. Here the Audi sells for $190,000AUD RRP, and the HSV R8 Tourer retails for $70,000AUD so that's a $120,000 difference. Hence you see the differences in finish levels and equipment differences. The HSV is a muscle car whereas the Audi is a premium sports model. Not exactly a fair comparison. But no question the R8 is very good considering the on paper shortfalls against the RS4
I love how the Audi's tyres seem very low profile in those corners. Lovely!
Yes I want my tyres to look strained when I go around corners too, maybe come off the tread.
And the comment on ride firmness, he's on a reasonable tracklike surface. City to city in Germany and Australia are two very different sets of roads. Here in NZ you need a really compliant ride when hooning across country, yeah there is body roll and some lurching but at least a pothole won't see you in the trees or worse.
Two things to highlight:
1 - the VXR8 is much bigger and more capacious than the RS4. It's roomier than the RS6 and E63. The latter would have been a fairer comparison.
2 - the VXR8 has 88ft lbs more torque at much lower revs than the Audi.
The Audi may well be more sophisticated and agile and so on, but the Vauxhall is the car I would choose to live with...
Moving aside the sporting characteristics of both cars, the tester did not do some basic comparisons. The Commodore (sorry, VXR8) is a bigger car and, therefore, has greater space in the tail for a family's luggage. The seat room in the Commodore, especially in the rear, is superior as well.
Longevity-wise, the Commodore will last for years. The engineering was developed to cater for not only modern freeways but for the teeth-rattling outback roads as well. I'm not sure the Audi will age as gracefully and I am dubious about the long term longevity of any tubo-charged engine.
The Holden is a well-engineered precise handler. The penultimate in Australian vehicle engineering (sadly Holden will stop making cars next year) it is a comfortable grand tourer. Sadly Vauxhall didn't think to send the non-sporting varieties of the Commodore to the UK. I think most English motorists would have liked to try out the mid-spec Belina model or the high-spec Calais with the 3.6 litre V6. Still a very quick car but with much less thirst than the V8.
I agree. I think that the UK market would love something akin to the Calais or similar that has the 3.6 V6, it would be a true contender for similar size things like Volvo S60s and Opel Insignias. It has larger boot space, so that's always a winner. The only thing I'm disappointed in is the fact that after all this time, only the middle seat folds down and not the whole rear seat. To me that's a fairly large inconvenience.
+15sixmedia They couldn't create a true "boot chute" because it would interfere with the basic structural integrity of the car. The rear panel behind the seat provides the body with lateral support. On our crappy country roads the car would have bent in half if the rear bolster was not there.
I'm not sure what you're referring to with turbo engines since the RS4s V8 is naturally aspirated. And as far as comfort goes, the Audi was developed in Germany, where roads are smooth as silk. Its main territory is derestricted Autobahn sections and some twisty back roads. Catering the australian outback market is not its first priority, its a small fast sporty luxurious wagon for the german family dad that fancies a little speed on his way to work.
tripsadelica, you make excellent points!
Thanks Sionnach. :)
When you review two estates. Please tell us a little about the boot space and rear legroom.
Interesting to note that compared to the 3000Pound difference over in the UK. The RS4 here in Australia will set you back an EXTRA $100k on top of the VXR8 (HSV clubsport)..... When put in to perspective like that, there would be something wrong if the Audi didn't seem more expensive while sitting behind the drivers seat!
This is the VE model of the VXR8. The just launched VF is light years ahead of the VE and will prove to be a much closer match.
Greeting from Canada. I just like the fact that both these cars exist. :-)
its important to take note the importance of room and luggage capacity (otherwise you wouldn't normally considered a wagon). The VXR8 is significantly bigger, 20 cm longer, over 10 cm longer wheelbase, wider and a bigger boot 500+ vs 480
How does that pricing work?!? Here is Aus that HSV (or 'Vauxhall') is only about $70,000, where as the Audi would be around $150,000. That in mind, the Clubsport is a viable option here!
Ridiculous Aussie taxation. Our government has been trying to keep the Aussie car industry alive, which is hard to do with our production costs, so they make stupidly high import taxes to keep the commodore viable.
Michael C That will probably be different in the near future when our car industry sadly ends. That said, there'll still be the 'Australia tax' as on everything where companies gouge us more because we have no choice but to pay, even on software, so shipping and this supposed 'isolation' has nothing to do with it.
Umm how about the fact the Holden is made in your street and the Audi has to be shipped halfway round the world for one.
There is very high taxation on euro cars in Aus. Your normal commodore level merc or bmw in Europe is very expensive in Australia even tho their base models
@@Freshbott2 reading this in 2022 made me sad but you were right
Never understood why they didn't just call it the Commodore in UK, VXR8 is a sht name.
the vxr8 means that you have a Vauxhall racing not sure what the x stands for but the 8 means the engine it has
jprince massey but it’s not a Vauxhall...it’s a rebadged Holden commodore club sport. Therefore it’s a stupid name
:/ its just a fucking name bro
@@Jprincemassey Vauxhall experience racing
Zero Ninety because its not a commodore. Its an Hsv r8
So the Avant costs £5,425 more than the '8 for more luxury & +36 HP… for just over £2k more you can get Monkfish or Walkinshaw to drop in one of their TVS2300-based supercharger kits specifically designed for the LS3 engine.
Instant Avant killer in both acceleration and top speed if unrestricted (Avants 174mph vs 8s est. 200+, it's geared up to 243mph in 6th at redline)
Corners I hear you say? The Avant will probably still be quicker, but it won't look or feel anywhere near as fun ;)
You just got your answer yesterday. VXR8 will return later this year (in saloon guise) with 576bhp LSA 6.2-litre supercharged V8. Costing from GBP57,000.
Yeah thats what they use, my dad works for vauxhall so brings back all their new cars. Great things they are and you can make the biggest burnouts in them!
This man pulls the shit out of the cars.
A maniac.
We call it the HSV or the SS here in Australia. Generally mothers with prams drive them :)
do those milfs slide them around like these boys do too? kudos to the yummy mummies if they do!!
pokiou That's bullshit.
no sense of humor?
+pokiou a lady down the road, who is a mother of 3 has a supercharged one. It really is a family car 😂😂
@@Danyon077 that's her husband's... 😂
The VXR8 sounds amazing.
Price is the issue. In Australia the HSV would be substantially cheaper then the Audi and a lot of the arguments against it in this video would evaporate. Unfortunately by the time the car makes its way to the UK that's not the case anymore. However I have little doubt that far more of the HSV imports will be driving around the UK in ten, twenty or thirty years time (proportionally) then the Audi's. They are easier and cheaper to fix, easier to modify and are going to be more desirable having more character with their old school V8 muscle and rarer numbers.
If you'r a guy that love's old school gear shift, and knows how to enjoy a car, get the VXR!
I'd go for the Vauxhall just because the manual gearbox, it's a shame that almost all car makers are going only for the double clutch automatic, it's faster and more effcient yes, but how hard is to audi to put a six speed manual on their cars.
Only one of the best and most experienced car reviewers ever hes worked for autocar, pistonheads, he does chris harris on cars on the drive channel.
The R8 (the proper name) here is the "VE" version. In 2013 they brought out the "VF" version and that would have made for a better comparison. Don't get me wrong, I love the RS4, but it is four wheel drive and it is a rapier. The "VF" version of the R8 became a lot more sophisticated, but still retained its character, that of a rear-wheel drive muscle car. You can't call anything that the Germans makes that is anywhere similar in character.
Gotta love that numberplate of Holden
The problem I have is that the VRX8 here is really a VE, when in 2013 GMH went over to the new VF - and that is a BIG step-up from the VE. So the VRX8 shown in the video was at the very end of its life - whereas the RS4 is much more current. I have had both the VE and now have the VF, and the latter is far more sophisticated.
+D800Lover I dunno, apart from interior materials VF is the same thing as before. The only difference really is they've gone to electric steering, which when comparing character isn't a good thing.
Commies aren't really meant to be sophisticated, but you get more car per dollar in Australia hands down. But in Europe where the price is so close, it'd be hard not to take the Audi.
+Bannicus Excuse me, have you driven the VE and the VF? I have and there are far more changes than just going over to electric steering. There are significant structural changes made and you can tell. Even aluminium is used in certain places. The VF is so much more planted on the road, feels much tighter and pointier, the electric steering is sharper. Best of all, on longer trips it just seems to drive so effortless, the suspension ride is near perfect. Did I mention the seats? All round, the VF feels like a more expensive car than the VE, you get more for your dollars. This is no mere facelift.
+D800Lover Just got a job. Was thinking about getting a SII VE SV6. But if I save my money for about half a year I can afford a nice 2013 VF SV6 :) And from literally everyone i've heard from (including you) The VF Commodore, its just leaps and bounds ahead of the VE.
Here in NA we had the Vauxhall as a Sedan with the Pontiac Badge. Sick cars
Love the numberplate on the VXR8!
2 great grocery getters, unless you need eggs.
That rs4 is nailed to the pawment
Look at the Torque difference , Audi 317 lb ft compared to Vauxhall 405 lb ft , I know which one I would rather the Vauxhall 405 lb ft
RS4 Avant and Aston Martin DBS is my dream garage. A damn shame we don't get the RS4 Avant in North America.
Well said true to the max. Especially being proud about something that was not even made in Australia and that is new Holden.
I've driven a good range of both and yes the DSG is better for making numbers with but manual taking focus from actual driving? Shifting is, for most car lovers an integral part of "actual driving".
Otherway round in Aus. If you are comparing new cars. The Clubsport is on the $220 fixed servicing. Audi is on free servicing for the first 3 years. But lets say both cars are out of that perk, Audi is $700, going through Holden its $600 for a service. $200 alone for just spark plugs.
Costs are much closer than you think.
It is in Australia, and in other parts of the world, it's a Vauxall or opel
Here in Victoria Australia however the RS4 costs $163,064 drive away (from audis aus website pricing for vic) whereas the HSV costs (not listed on HSVs website but going from Demos on carsales.com with less than 20km on the clock) around 55k. I will add another 10k to that for the sake of the argument as I know they are gonna want to shift stock due to the F series coming in
It’s called a Holden Commodore HSV VE Clubsport Wagon
its a VF mate
Connor Hay oh i see
It's a benefit in specific conditions yes. For general driving it is not a benefit, rather a preference that different people would have.
Had my B8 RS for two months now, and to quote Clarkson ...the Aussie chugger "would have to come with a free moon"...to be better then the Audi. If you can run to 55k+ get one. If you can run to 80k+ get one with all the bells and whistles, it's the best Audi I've ever had; and I've had one or two !
What motor does the zr1 use im pretty sure they both use the ls3, just the zr1 is supercharged. the regular corvette has the ls7 does it not?
Vauxhall UK's reg palte, they put it on everything that goes out to test.
one thing sure I would never choose an opel or Vauxhall over on audio
Omg that shout of the RS4 is just incredible!
Pity about the oversized wheels on the RS4 apart from that a beautiful car
The wheels on the RS4 are probably the nicest looking ones on the market today.
Best review in a long time
Jesus Steve you were manhandling the RS4 like I've never seen! And that's a great test track! It looks good on camera and the bumps and elevation change really highlight how aggressively you are driving those cars. Sideways through those big compressions in the Holden, brilliant.
It seems odd that Autocar would review this VXR8 the same week that the new 585bhp VXR8 GTS is announced
Would have Vxr8 any day
A better comparison i think would be with the rear wheel drive AMG
Question...they limit alot of german cars to 155mph and the vauxhall has the same. If this is because they are worried about various component failure? And if so does that mean the vauxhall components are now on par with the germans? (For this specific car)
Here in Australia the RS4 is handicapped by import duties and taxes (protection) which add about $104,000 (approx £63, 000) to the price, and I'd still buy the RS4 before an R8 any day of the week. The finish in the R8 is low because it doesn't have to compete at home where the playing field is tipped in Holden's favour.
Fact: straight line acceleration is not the only performance aspect of cars. Another fact: almost any "base" car could be tuned with simple bolt-ons to out accelerate special versions of the same car. From BMWs (550i vs M5) to fords (base focus vs focus ST). It doesn't necessarily make a slightly-tuned "base" car more value then special version.
I'd have the vxr8 it's just fun to drive
Steve I have seen you drive in other videos as in this video! I am so impressed with your abilities! Drive like you stole it!!! Great test drive!
The VXR8 is the same as the HSV GTS. It will be > 100k after stamp duty. (search, for instance, "HSV Gen-F GTS full ad" on the carsguide site).
Any comparison on the servicing cost? I know here in oz the servicing cost for the VXR8 is a he'll of a lot cheaper than the Audi
Because he was honest about a Ferrari and they didn't like that, he is right, Harris is one of the best out there. Look up the video he did of the chipped S4 vs the RS4, cool stuff!
Edelbrock do a full blower kit. Send the bracket templates to the engineers, weekend in the garage once they're back. Weapon.
At least you guys have these cars to argue about ! In the states we don't get pooh ! I have to move to Australia to be happy I guess . I would hands down choose the Holden (VXR8) by the way . It just screams drive the dog snot out of me lol .
G S
Wonder if they will release the 430KW VF version over in england
What's up with that no plate? I know it was on a vxr8.
RS4 looks so good. No way i would go for that opel.
It is a Holden.
You do know that Vauxhalls are only sold in the UK?
How is the Commodore wagon (vauxhall) a caddy wagon???
much closer than i thought. thanks for your reply think i'd just get the SS wagon and save some money
What do you think the Cadillac CTS is?
Why Audi decided they aren't bringing the RS4 to the states is beyond me. This thing would teach everyone here how cars should look, feel, and drive.
No, DSG is like two manual boxes. One for odd gears and one for even gears. Each has it's own multi-plate wet clutch, and is actuated by electronic or hydraulic solenoids.
Example, you're flooring it in second. The even gearbox is engaged to the driveline but 3rd is also engaged and speed matched (like shifting a manual without the clutch, if you have one try it. GENTLY) When you hit the paddle 2nd disengages and 3rd is already engaged and ready to go. Like a manual shifted by magic ninjas.
Aussie here and the Audi is so much more desireable that the Holden it's ridiculous.
Here in Oz, your comparing a 50K wagon in the holden vs a 180k Audi.
And you are completely right about the Corvette. In Germany the Corvette is basically in the same market segment as a Porsche 911. Like the 911 is THE german cult sportscar, the Corvette is THE american cult sportscar. But it's a whole lot cheaper. And even with the C6 the Corvette became finally competitive to German sportcars.
I always see this plate on vauxhalls... DE51 RED... why is that!? please someone tell me im going mad.
HSV definitely gets my vote
Dear Steve, thank you so much for delivering nice reviews of great cars continuously.want more:)
Any problems?
the blue one is an aussie holden HSV
The Vauxhall looks like some mid-90s car that's been tuned and styled in somebody's private garage.
you Aussies aren't alone, dude.
Gotta remember in Australia the VXR8 is half the price of the RS4
And almost 1/4 of the price if you just want the standard 6.0L V8.
less than half i think
The RS4 is gorgeous inside and out.
jaguar xfr estate vs the vxr would have been more fair or the chrysler 300c srt8 estate mr sutcliffe can we see these match ups please
Can't watch this because of the advertisement that won't load. Fail!
I'd still take the VXR8
madness vs. perfection - you choose
Both cars are awesome
I'd have the r8 still :-)
Actual local prices in Singapore(without roadtax+insurance) and the RS4 isn't even fully loaded with options.
Yes just looked it up. RS4 is $160,000 and R8 Tourer is $76,000
It's based on a HSV Clubsport R8 wagon, evolution of the VE SS wagon
As far as I know (at least here in Germany) 250 km/h (155 mph ) is a insurance related limit. After which cars count as sports cars and their insurance gets exorbitantly more expensive. Maybe other countries have similar limitations ?
I'd have the HSV because it sounds like it's more fun
I got a 2003 v8 S4 avant love it
you compare Audi against Vauxhall??? :D do you have full clock???
Why isn't this in the US?
I'm not a big fan of Audi, but I like this RS4 very much. I also think it has one of the best value for money of the whole Audi range, especially compared to a standard A1 or A3. The Vauxhall costs the same amount of money just in order to be a direct competitor, there's no other reason. I don't know whether I'd buy the RS4, but sure it's good as it seems. I'd like it more in the saloon version though.
Being a bit of a drifter I'd prefer the rwd and I will take a stick shift over an auto every time.
Can't wait for you's to test the latest F-Gen HSV GTS with a standard 430kw 740N.m supercharged V8.
where are you pulling those figures from..
Well, since manuals are so rare nowadays, they need to be top notch in order to stay around