The Dorsey Yarn Indicator -- Our Best and Most Versatile Indy Choice -- Building it and Fishing It
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- Опубліковано 17 кві 2024
- Materials:
Bonnie Macrame Cord: amzn.to/3xGUfko
Orthodontic Elastics 1/4" Medium: amzn.to/46Ck7tY
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For over a decade, my Troutbitten friends and I have fished a small yarn indicator that weighs nothing, is extremely sensitive, versatile, cheap, doesn't affect the cast, and flat out catches more trout than any other indicator we've ever used. What we call "the Dorsey" is a daily-use tool that is integral to our nymphing system. We mount it on a tight line rig or a traditional leader with fly line. It floats like crazy. It signals takes and information about the drift like no other indy we've ever used, and it's an unstoppable fish catcher.
We all love tight line tactics. But a few thing about the drift change when an indy is attached. If you control the variables, the results are often better than a pure tight line approach.
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Dom - Спорт
I don’t mount the Dorsey to 6X because the extra-thin material grabs the rubber band too much. So when you do slide it, the band gets small cuts from the 6X. The 6X tippet also takes some damage. You CAN mount it to 6X, but you have to baby it. As I mentioned in the video, 5X is the lightest I mount to, and I prefer 4X or 3X. HOWEVER . . . you can still use 6X to your nymphs . . .
The solution is simple. Use two diameters of tippet -- 4X for mounting the Dorsey and 6X for the rest. Here’s a Troutbitten article:
troutbitten.com/2019/11/13/nymphing-a-two-diameter-solution-to-a-one-diameter-problem/
Thank you, I really enjoyed your channel.
@@RobertCotton-zu6hwCheers. Thank you very much
I used the Dorsey for years. I learned it from an older Troutbitten blog post. These days, I often use the NZ indicator system but use bonney craft cord instead of the wool. It's a hybrid of the two systems.
Nice. Glad that works for you. I tried that for a while, but I never like the way the stiffer macrame yarn held in the tube. Seemed that I didn't have much option for more or less yarn. Cheers.
I’ve been using the New Zealand for years but I’m going to build some of these. I really like the roach clip hack for holding the yarn, I’ve been trying to figure out what to use for that. Love the 335 on the wall. That’s what I play the most in our church band. Thanks.
Nice
Great video! Tied a bunch up about a month ago and been using them with great success! I like the idea of using the Rain-x.
Right on.
Good stuff Dom. I still have/use the Dorsey you gave me 4 years ago on a guide trip. Love the split shot idea. JJ
Cheers, John.
Great video, I tied a bunch of these over the winter watching your last vid. This was an amazing follow up to that last one, definitely gonna do the rainx treatment. Headed up to our family camp in western PA first of May and cant wait to give these a try! Thanks so much for all the content you provide I have learned so much from the videos and the podcast. Keep up the great work and I hope to book a trip with you one of these days. Cheeers to tight lines and dry waders!!!!
Dry waders! Cheers.
Absolutely love this vid.
Thanks. That's nice.
great stuff as always
Thank you.
Outstanding as usual, Dom. Wetting the line is what I was missing.
Thanks. You can also put a little paste on the rubber band too. Cheers.
@@Troutbitten Hmm. What kind of paste?
@@billruland1494Payette or Musclin
Good stuff Dom, the Dorsey is a game-changer from my experience (no exaggeration). The original article/video of the Dorsey is actually how I found Troutbitten and I’ve been a Troutbitten addict (seriously) ever since. Can’t thank you and the boys enough for all the articles/podcasts/videos/etc. that you put out there. I’ve learned so much.
I’m in a similar stage of life as Josh, so Troutbitten often is my source of “virtual” fly fishing, and the DIY stuff like this from home is so fun to do prior to getting out there on the water.
Thanks again for sharing all your knowledge. Keep challenging the status quo’s of Fly Fishing brother, I think that’s what I love most about Troutbitten.
Cheers
Very kind. Thanks for your support.
I love the dorsey and have been using it for years. Your split shot hack is amazing and allowed me to get through some light windy days without another change. Anyone else notice how Dom moves his hands like he is doing magic, I mean his tips and tricks are magic, just saying :)
Ha. Good!
He claims it as “style”
Pat Dorsey is a legend! The other benefit of his indicator is it gives a subtle presentation. We've been in "exceptional" drought for over 2 years in the Driftless and that presentation has been key. And, if the fish "hit" that indicator you can have some confidence it's time to put on a dry fly.
For sure
I use the macrame yarn 🧶 on my chubbys hoppers and hivis para posts on drys … works great 👍🏽 good job Dom and Josh great video
Right on.
Great vid, I tried the barrel today as we talked about recently and love how much visibility it added. Might need to try this as well to compare, really intrigued by how it turns upright when tight to the rig below it.
Right on.
Great change up on the format!
Hey now! Thanks. It was fun for us too.
Had some rainx in the garage , and some 2mm bonnie cord for fly tying . tyed red-white tried it with zebra midge. Dorsey indicator worked.
Nice
That roach clip yarn holder was neat. I’m going to have to steal your idea.
I would call this the poor man’s New Zealand hack which awesome if I ever loose my kit
Ha. Good stuff. Cheers.
great info !! THANKS !!
Cheers
Good stuff im waiting to see a video on the swentosky slap from the nymph podcast lol
Ha. Nice.
This should really help my learning curve as I pursue fly tying and fly fishing. Mega Thx !!! As a side note,,, I loved the Steelers glass, seems us Steeler’s fans are consistently “Everywhere”
Hey now!
Great video Dom. Been listening to the early pods and highly suggest them for those who haven’t checked them out.
Cheers
Getting to know Pat over the years and going to his shop weekly has helped my fly fishing tremendously. His yarn indicator is a must from late November to the end of February. Then its
dry fly season here in the Rockies!!
Hey now.
@@Troutbitten Hey now?
@@dankochanek8056 Just a happy expression. Cheers.
I’ve been creating little yarn indicators by folding the yarn and making a little knob with tying thread. Then I thread a new leader tippet through the knob with a sewing needle. A bobber stopper knot goes on either side of the knob to create an easily movable, very delicate indicator that’s not bound to the leader, which creates micro drag. It’s a pretty fiddly set up, but I get a kick out of messing around with this stuff. There’s some videos out there showing the same thing with thingamabobbers, which is where the idea really shines. I’ve always hated the conventional way that thingamabobbers are attached. Dorsey and NZ are much nicer to leaders!!
@@paigeloomis Cool. I like fiddling with things too.
When I build my indicators at the bench, I pretreat them with liquid floatant. I have fished for hours with no trouble keeping it floating. What I need though is something that will work on 6x. I used this last fall on 6x and while it did "work", it wasn't as easy to slid up and down. Here in Missouri, all our creeks are tiny and clear. 6x is a must, and really 7x is better.
Good stuff. I agree, I don't mount this to 6X. That's fine. So I almost always set up my tippet as 4X to 5X. You could go to 6X or whatever is necessary. But make the slidable piece 4X. Here's what I mean, in more detail.
troutbitten.com/2019/11/13/nymphing-a-two-diameter-solution-to-a-one-diameter-problem/
@@Troutbitten Thanks and a great idea. I will play around with this next weekend. I just need to step away from 6x leaders, use 5x and add the 6x onto the leader, then just keep the dorsey on the 5x part. I had not watched the video all the way through before I posted about pretreating at the bench like you showed in the video. I picked up the macrame yarn a year or so ago and amazing how well it works. In fact, here in Missouri, I tie my caddis with a brownish colored macrame combed out for the wing instead of elk hair. I place it on top of a small round bodied piece of foam and the thing floats all day long. I find Macrame comes in so many more colors than EP Fibers and works just as well. Thanks for the follow up and tight lines!
@@MoFlyFlinger Right on. I use the macrame yard for para posts and some wings too.,
Thanks for the tip. Being in CO I should know this but I dont. I may need to try this instead of tight line this weekend.
Put the indy on your tight line, if you don't already. It's a deadly approach.
troutbitten.com/2017/02/14/tight-line-nymphing-with-an-indicator-a-mono-rig-variant/
I've used them the last 3 years or so with a mono rig, and prefer them to bobber-types in all cases except when real distance is necessary because wading closer isn't an option. In Northern California there are more of these situations than in Pennsylvania. I personally don't find using Dorsey indicators with 5x (my go-to) to be a problem, as long as I'm careful when sliding them. If I feel any resistance to the slide, I loosen the loop and inevitably find that twists have formed in it. Such twists form more easily with 5x than with 4x. Rotating the loosened loop and indicator until the twists disappears solves the problem. I also use only 4 turns of the loop through the band, and it works for me. I found that I had to cut it down from 5 loops because the last package of bands I got were not as elastic as the previous package, despite having the same specs. For the first year of using these indicators I did have instances where the tippet got abraded and broke, but a little attention and care took care of that problem, and now it never happens. Can't wait to try the #6 shot idea, fantastic. Thanks.
Good stuff.
Pro Beard Button ->
Hey now!
Josh’s hair looked amazing. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
That's good to hear.
Good stuff! You’ve wrote about this in some of your articles but sometimes it’s kind of relaxing to switch to an indy after tight lining for a long time. Have you tried/seen the new(ish) oros strike indicators? It’s a bobber, but the way it attaches to the leader allows for slide able adjustments like the Dorsey. The Dorsey is my favorite, but when you need a more floatable indy it’s pretty good. I haven’t tried it on anything smaller than 5x, not sure how it would do.
Hi Luke. Good to hear from you. Yes, I've used the Oros. They are about the heaviest indy out there. Anglers don't tend to talk about this, but the WEIGHT of the indicator is a big deal to me. That weight dictates everything about how the indy will cast and perform. I strongly prefer the lightest indy, until I have a reason to choose otherwise. Even when I want a little weight in the indy, I still choose a Thingamabobber instead of AirLocks or Oros, because they don't weigh so much.
Here's an article with a few of those thoughts:
troutbitten.com/2022/11/11/your-indicator-is-too-big-2/
Cheers
Awesome video! I love the rod holder in your 4Runner. Did you make it or purchase it?
Thanks. Here's a video on the Smith Creek Rod Rack.
ua-cam.com/video/CETlTQm0YcM/v-deo.html
In the early 80’s Tim Chavez from Abe’s Fly Shop on the San Juan introduced an indicator like this but far less twists and turns … and no rubber band . 1st polypropylene yarn about 1.5 “ thickness about a pencil with , a slip knot in your leader expose a scant amount past your thumb and forefinger trim add a small amount of floatant and cast away . I have to wonder if Mr Dorsey got the idea from Tim . Anyway Tim’s method is much easier and much faster .
Hi there. I've used the method you're talking about. There are a couple videos out there as well. The BIG thing missing with that system is that it's not slidable. That's a deal breaker for me. As I mentioned in the video and article, perhaps the most important part of an indy, for me, is how easily it slides. I want something that slides easily when I want to reposition, but it won't slide when I don't want it to. With the slip loop method, the only way I got it to slide was by mounting it on thicker material, like 1X. Even then, it wasn't smooth.
Have you experienced the same?
I didn’t get the way you tied the two colors together? I’ll try and figure it out but great video. 👍🏼👍🏼
There's nothing to it, honestly. I just used two different colors and put them side by . . . side? What else is there to show? Use two colors instead of one! Done.
Cheers.
Beard and glasses- looking sharp Dom! When is the next season of the Pod start up again?
Ha. Thanks.. Season Eleven of the podcast began last Sunday, April 14th. Catch up! 😄
I love your stuff! Thanks for the upload. Maybe have Skwala send you a hat though ;).... also, what's an indy?... indicator? Again, thanks for the great content!
Thanks. Yes, indicator.
Dude, you with a beard is a fantastic sight to behold.
HEY NOW
I have used these for years. I now use New Zealand tubes (large size) with poly yarn. I have to use smaller amounts of poly. I keep the tubes on the needle, and have a fly puck with the yarn precuts, the needle and a Velcro stick. I feel it works better than the rubber band on 5x tippet. I really like to keep my indicator on the one size tippet so I can mimic the tight line sink ability of the 5x. I still like and keep rubber bands in the puck as well for larger tippet sizes. I tried to find other tubing but the New Zealand tube in large size has been the best I have found.
Cool
Morning beer is the best. What's your favorite to get the day started.
Ha. Not usually getting the day started with a beer, for me.
From a player’s perspective, Like the guitars, are there more? Would be nice to hear you play sometime.
Yes, there are more. I played gigs full time for 16 years. Don't play much these days, though. Cheers.
Great video Dom! What’s the heaviest tungsten bead you can use without sinking it?
That's completely variable, because remember, you can use more or less yarn. You could float a bowling ball if you like. :-) Honestly, though it doesn't take much yarn to easily float 75 centigrams. Cheers.
What kind of weighted flies can this support? Can it support 2 3.0 tungsten bead nymphs? Just curious what type of flies you have tied on below the yarn? Seems I can just add more yarn but curious on what you recommend or what you can get away with. Thanks and loved the video.
Thanks. Like you said, you can just add more yarn or less. There is no standard size to these indicators. It's another thing that makes it great. Use as much yarn as you need. This is why I didn't talk much about how much weight the yarn supports. Other factors matter too. Are you going tight to the indy? Then without the line on the water, any indicator can hold up a lot more weight. Are you fishing rough water, then you need more buoyancy in any indicator.
So that's my long answer to your question.
Short answer: in the size that I showed, it can support about 75 centigrams. In my box, that's a #12 and a #14 bead head fly with 3.5 and 3 mm beads, or two #1 split shot and a #4 -- give or take.
Give it a try. It's extremely buoyant.
Cheers.
Hi Dom you’re reaching as far as Aus .
Tell me -I have a mono rig with tippet ring attached to the sighter then 5x /6x/7x tippet to point fly . So the Dorsey goes above the tippet ring and adjusts up and down from there .? I.e. always on the leader ?Let me know
PS
My adult son and I love your podcasts
Goodonya buddy
Mike
Hi there. No! Dorsey does not mount above the sighter. It mounts BELOW the sighter on the tippet section.
If you are using really thin tippets for some reason, then do this:
troutbitten.com/2019/11/13/nymphing-a-two-diameter-solution-to-a-one-diameter-problem/
Super ransom question, but where did you get that alligator clip for your yarn? I've been looking for the same thing for my vest, but haven't been able to find anything like it
Google alligator clip. Amazon, eBay, etc., you should find them.
How long you think a trout will hold a fly in their mouth before Realize it’s not food and spit it out ?? You do very good vids , your a good teacher,thanks
Cheers. No time at all. They try to release it as soon as they eat it. That's my opinion.
@@Troutbitten im just about to start fly fishing , I’ve been tying flys all winter and dreaming about each one getting bitten on every pool and run I like to fish , I’ve being trying my nymphs and mosquitoes larvae on the centerpin but no fish on them , I have to finally grab the dumb combo I got from orvis and hit the creeks i love and start hanging fly’s on every tree until I learn how to do a cast . It’s going to be a lot diferent from centerpin cause I only use the big red earth worms and little pieces of skein cured both these baits the trouts love and will hold for up to 3 or 4 seconds before swallowing it 50% of the times I had a couple doing it cause I was distracted , I guess fly fishing will be a lot diferent
@@pedrohenriques2983Have fun out there
I wanna know where you found the Fishpond lumbar pack without the associated belt?
They all come with the belt. But they easily come off, so you can use them with any belt setup! Do it.
Great video....... Gibson man......didnt know you played guitar?? Its never too early to have a beer, LOL
Cheers.
I’m guessing the split shot doesn’t affect the ability to adjust the indicator or weaken the tippet.
Correct. Split shot should never be crimped hard enough to damage the line.
Hello Dom, I have some questions but this is the other hobby you have, I have seen the guitars you use on the wall and you have explained your a musician, what amp do you play though and what type of music you like playing?? thank you
Hi there. I played acoustic and electric guitar, saxophone, harmonica and vocals. Full time gigs for 16 years. Ha. That was too long. Austin now has my last amp, a modded Blues Junior, good for small clubs.
How much weight is too much for this 5 strand Dorsey? 2 x 2.8 flies?
Oh much more than that. It'll hold a 4mm bead and a 3mm at the same time. Lots of buoyancy.
So when I go to adjust it puts the waves in my line
Okay, so I promise that's because you're doing something wrong. It works for thousands of anglers, and it'll work for you. Check out the two articles linked in this video for more details.
My guess: you're probably mounting it on less than 4X or you are attaching it wrong.
If you get things right, it will NOT affect the line. That's why we love it.
Email me if you still have problems.
Cheers.
@@Troutbitten okay most appreciated . Got it on a 9” leader or was , but on the upper part of leader. Tippet ring then tippet. 👍🏻
Best channel on UA-cam! Very helpful video, by the way don't ever shave again! Lol
That might get messy.
About how many grams of weight will that support. Thank you
That's a good question. It definitely depends how much yarn you're using. But with the five strand Dorsey I used in the video I regularly fish 75-90 cg with no problem. I rarely fish heavier than that, but if needed, I would just add more yarn. Easy adjustment. Cheers.
Next time your going to use an indicator other than Dorsey try an Oros, much lighter cast much better.
Oh my, the Oros is definitely not lighter. I don't mean to disagree, but the Oros is factually the heaviest indicator out there. Put it on a gram scale and compare. How could it not weigh a lot more than yarn? What you perceive as "casts much better," is actually the weight of the indy aiding your cast. I mentioned this in the video. I'll use hard indys for that effect, but I strongly prefer the super lightweight of the yarn because you can cast right through it. It weighs less than a dry fly!
Make sense?
Un saludo desde Colombia 🇨🇴 como se llama el material del Hilo ? Muchas gracias 🙏🙏🎣
Any 8/0 or thinner thread will do fine. I use Uni Thread.
Cheers.
Why can't I use these on a 5 weight tippet.
I don’t mount the Dorsey to 6X because the extra-thin material grabs the rubber band too much. So when you do slide it, the band gets small cuts from the 6X. The 6X tippet also takes some damage. You CAN mount it to 6X, but you have to baby it. As I mentioned in the video, 5X is the lightest I mount to, and I prefer 4X or 3X. HOWEVER . . . you can still use 6X to your nymphs . . .
The solution is simple. Use two diameters of tippet -- 4X for mounting the Dorsey and 6X for the rest. Here’s a Troutbitten article:
troutbitten.com/2019/11/13/nymphing-a-two-diameter-solution-to-a-one-diameter-problem/
Do you remember Murph Goes Fishing?
No
I think your first post about the Dorsey used photos from that blog.
I didn't think so, honestly. That first article is here.
troutbitten.com/2017/03/30/dorsey-yarn-indicator-everything-need-know-little/
I thought you had a post from the older version of your site that predates that post. Perhaps I’m mistaken.
I generally pass over your videos because the filler to content ration doesn't fit my attention span, but this was worth it
Cool.
And we don't think of it as filler vs content. Fishing is about the experience of being around the woods and water as much as the tactics. Troutbitten has always aimed to address both sides of what we love, both the beauty and wonder of nature, and the tactics required to catch trout.
Cheers.
Yarn is going to go out of stock after this. Will be some upset macrame-ers for sure
Ha. There ya go.