I also have a theory of pleasure, or rather, the relationship people have with it. A lot of philosophers, like Freud, thought humans were motivated by pleasure, but I think that's wrong. Think about it: imagine a high-teck coffin which you can stand in and gives you perfect happiness and pleasure by messing with the chemicals in your brain, and also keeps you healthy and alive forever, but which you can't leave anymore once you got in. Would you use it? I asked a bunch of people and they all said no. Here you have it! Humans aren't motivated by pleasure. But then what are they motivated by? By thei own will. We choose a bunch of things we want to do, and if we get closer to the goal we feel happy, if we go further from it or stagnate we feel unhappy. People don't choose the happiness coffin because they want to live their lives, keyword WANT. But then what do people want? They want the things that have some sort of positive value to them, the things they think they should want. These things, if we look at some simpler examples, tend to either be "good" things, or beautiful things. I don't think it's wrong to say beautiful things are things that spark desire, and desires are kind of invitations to will specific kinds of things. There are some actions which are not beautiful, but once done give pleasure. This pleasure sparks desires, and those desires lead you to do the thing more. Drugs are an example. These things make people unhappy because humans don't want pleasure.
I tend to think people are driven by Meaning. Like a sense that what they are doing has meaning. Meaning seems to be like a mysterious substance that there's not much I can say about at this point though
@@Ryans_Science That's interesting. One would be tempted to say "The meaning of life is the meaning of life", but that would be kind of an empty statement, wouldn't it?
I was going to say, Nietzsche said will was the greatest driving force, beyond anything else. "One loves ultimately one's desires, not the thing desired." Schizoids are just aware of this.
@@Ryans_Science I think finding the meaning of life, in a descriptive sense, means finding the answer to the question "what do I want to want"? People may answer the question differently. Maybe this is what Nietzsche meant with creating your own values. Personally, I've found that philosophy and learning so far filled my need for meaning perfectly.
The great equalizer is how the human brain can get used to anything. William S Burroughs thought suffering was the norm and pleasure was nothing but relief. This is basically the pleasure principle too. Bertrand Russell made a distinction between "joy" and "pleasure" predicting the world we're in today would be one "a world of pleasure, but not joy." Meaningless distractions in other words.
i think i can see that. that would apply to pleasure as "infinite descent" but maybe not to pleasure as "a way of being invited in". But its kindof hard to start a new discourse on pleasure, and maybe i was not so successful at it, but i tried 🙂
@@Ryans_Science It's good, I think your distinction might even be the same that Bertrand made, he just used different terminology. I see it as the difference between fulfillment (meaning) and hedonism. A "high on life" is like high on "being" itself, without depending on external stimulation per se the way worldly pleasures do.
@@gelidsoul yea. I think i personally was always looking for something off in the horizon until i realized that the riches of Being are everywhere immediately to be found
1:16 nice analogy
thanks.
I also have a theory of pleasure, or rather, the relationship people have with it.
A lot of philosophers, like Freud, thought humans were motivated by pleasure, but I think that's wrong.
Think about it: imagine a high-teck coffin which you can stand in and gives you perfect happiness and pleasure by messing with the chemicals in your brain, and also keeps you healthy and alive forever, but which you can't leave anymore once you got in.
Would you use it?
I asked a bunch of people and they all said no. Here you have it! Humans aren't motivated by pleasure. But then what are they motivated by? By thei own will. We choose a bunch of things we want to do, and if we get closer to the goal we feel happy, if we go further from it or stagnate we feel unhappy.
People don't choose the happiness coffin because they want to live their lives, keyword WANT.
But then what do people want?
They want the things that have some sort of positive value to them, the things they think they should want. These things, if we look at some simpler examples, tend to either be "good" things, or beautiful things. I don't think it's wrong to say beautiful things are things that spark desire, and desires are kind of invitations to will specific kinds of things.
There are some actions which are not beautiful, but once done give pleasure. This pleasure sparks desires, and those desires lead you to do the thing more. Drugs are an example.
These things make people unhappy because humans don't want pleasure.
I tend to think people are driven by Meaning. Like a sense that what they are doing has meaning. Meaning seems to be like a mysterious substance that there's not much I can say about at this point though
@@Ryans_Science That's interesting. One would be tempted to say "The meaning of life is the meaning of life", but that would be kind of an empty statement, wouldn't it?
@@adamsmainchannel3789 or simply "to live is to mean" or "to follow after meaning", idk
I was going to say, Nietzsche said will was the greatest driving force, beyond anything else. "One loves ultimately one's desires, not the thing desired." Schizoids are just aware of this.
@@Ryans_Science I think finding the meaning of life, in a descriptive sense, means finding the answer to the question "what do I want to want"? People may answer the question differently. Maybe this is what Nietzsche meant with creating your own values.
Personally, I've found that philosophy and learning so far filled my need for meaning perfectly.
The great equalizer is how the human brain can get used to anything. William S Burroughs thought suffering was the norm and pleasure was nothing but relief. This is basically the pleasure principle too. Bertrand Russell made a distinction between "joy" and "pleasure" predicting the world we're in today would be one "a world of pleasure, but not joy." Meaningless distractions in other words.
i think i can see that. that would apply to pleasure as "infinite descent" but maybe not to pleasure as "a way of being invited in". But its kindof hard to start a new discourse on pleasure, and maybe i was not so successful at it, but i tried 🙂
@@Ryans_Science It's good, I think your distinction might even be the same that Bertrand made, he just used different terminology. I see it as the difference between fulfillment (meaning) and hedonism. A "high on life" is like high on "being" itself, without depending on external stimulation per se the way worldly pleasures do.
@@gelidsoul yea. I think i personally was always looking for something off in the horizon until i realized that the riches of Being are everywhere immediately to be found
Btw first.