This guy is definitely pulling his weight right now. During the Battle for Oghram, threw him into combat with a Hive Tyrant, Screamer Killer, and Mawloc, expecting him to make a heroic sacrifice while I scored points elsewhere. He then proceeded to kill the Tyrant, nearly kill the Screamer Killer, and took a grand total of two wounds over three rounds of combat. Of note: A Custodes Telemon is basically the Redemptor statline, with a 4+ invuln for ten more points. The ranged weapons might not be quite as good, but having martial katahs on a dreadnought is certainly interesting...
I introduced my friend's redemptor to my Avatar of Khaine. I don't think I need to say much more. Still miss the time tho when my dire avengers could 1 hit this guy in 9th...
@@Meako92 bro I don't want a broken army. That's one of the reasons I chose Aeldari in 9th cos it had around 50% win rate. I'm just reminising about my old favourite unit that is now redundant.
Redemptor's issue is that the macroplasma/onslaught combo is *so much better* than the heavy onslaught and flamer combo, but are stuck at the same price due to free wargear issues in 10e. Would love to see a better reason to take the lighter loadout.
I REALLY want to see Redemptor-pattern upgrade sprues or full kits for Death Company, Furioso, Wulfen, Deathwatch and Grey Knights. They could make some into weapon kits for Ballistus, some for Brutalis. Then they have the chance to add some new datasheets than can work as a rolling balance like a sort of range refresh.
@auspextactics Could you possibly make a video ranking all of the factions' Combat Patrols in the Combat Patrol game mode? I think would be very interested and the game mode has picked up a lot of interest amongst players with a fair few local gaming stores I know hosting Combat Patrol tournaments
I picked up the Dark Angel combat patrol to help turn my space marines from the Leviathan box into a proper army, glad to know this guy was a good addition.
Redemptor's are awesome. I always include at least one in most lists. My only grumble would be that they should have been options on a single unit rather than being multiple types. A lascannon and dreadnought fist for example.
I appreciate the insight on the Redemptor Dread, because I've been thinking of starting my Space Marine army using a Blood Angels and Dark Angels Combat Patrol, so I'll have one anyway so I may as well know how to use it!
I find them to be a great mid board bruiser. Theyll struggle to be the heavy liter in anti tank but they just generally waddle around and put out chunks of damage while being really hard to kill. Vehicle cover and a 2+ save makes them very tough, and every weapom they have loves the rerolls of oath. The plasma is often used to finish off wounded heavy targets or contributing to the oath target damage.
Played my first 10th edition game and I chose the Dark Angels Combat patrol because I love the look of this model. Holy crap this game is awesome and this unit is so much fun to run in a game!
@@I_Am_Alpharius_ Stormraven Gunship can carry any one unit with the dreadnought keyword and just last week these bad boys were given the dreadnought keyword! :D
Invictor tactical war suit is hilerious it better at melee and cheeper than the redemptor and it’s melee variant. Which I find hilarious. It’s basically the same basic arms and legs just the pilot isn’t in bits and pieces .
Waiting for there to be different points for the different options. I've got the Easy to Build one with the Heavy Onslaught, Heavy Flamer, and no rocket pod. It's never going to kill its points with that load out.
Just a bit blocky and ugly compared to contemptors and leviathans. Main issue with the Primaris stuff is how blocky it is on any tanks etc but they all look worse than the older versions. It’s like like living through the dark ages seeing the good things go and their barely functional replacements.
in a news update on games workshop's website it said that the ironclad was gonna be removed for unown reasons. Maybe they are giving it a new model but it's getting removed from the online website for now.
Personally I love the model and what it can do, throw in a Techmarine and it is partytime! However, the pointcost for it right now is pretty steep, going up 20% from 9th.
I think the Icarus missile pod launcher might always be free from now on. There are no alternate build options in the kit to NOT attach the Icarus. The older easy to build Redemptor kit did not have the Icarus included.
Imperium magazine will release their Redemptor here in Germany soon. That will make number 2 and 3 for my collection. Does anybody know if it is the easy to build version or if all weapons are included?
I love my redemptor dread. I got started back into the game around Christmas, and got some fights in 9th in with it with friends. I take it in most games with macro plasma and Gatling cannon. It's never let me down, and goes to most of my games. The only other dread I have is my ballistus, and in 3 games it hasn't removed a single model.
Relentless Assault with Saga of the Warrior Born active on this thing is REALLY good. If you need a long charge to tie up some Neophytes, for example, you don’t have to sacrifice shooting to do it. You can effectively cripple two squads by shooting into one and then tying up the other in close combat if they have pitiful melee
How does the Heavy Flamer perform for this model, I'm making a 1000 pt army and bought one 2nd hand it has the Weapon loadout of: Macro plasma incinerator, Looks like the Icarus rocket pod up top, twin linked storm bolter on the front and the heavy flamer below it's Redemptor fist. As it stands i'm lacking melee close range stuff, and wanted a balanced dreadnought, just wondering if I should fork out a few extra bucks and shed the Heavy Flamer for the Gatling gun below the fist weapon?
I'd be surprised to see a multitude of options in the new kit. I think it could be an assault cannon of some sort and a multi-melta. Grav cannon is a possibility too.
@@RSBurgener the ballistus could use an indirect mortar weapon on its head. similar to the rockers or heavy stubbers the other primaris dreadnoughts get on their heads.
The Redemptor Dread is still awesome. I have two in my Black Templars army and two in Ultramarines. After buying the Agastus box, I started running 1 Brutalis and 1 Redemptor in my BT army, mainly because a melee dread most more thematic for BTs, despite that the Redemptor seemed more effective. The Redemptor’s purpose is to soften up enemy units, especially vehicles and monsters, and be a bullet sponge for enemy ranged units, to minimize casualties to my melee units until they get into charge range. Consequently, my Redemptor rarely survives past Turn 2. I know that if I took 3 Redemptors, I could blast away and have a greater chance of at least one surviving to Turn 3 and beyond, but I don’t want to do that to my friends in casual play.
I tend to rate the ballistus with its 2 lascannons and 2 krak or 2D6 frag alternatable during the game, for only 170 points, up to par for ranged combat, with the aim of objective holding capturing I would opt redemptor, fire support the ballistus.
I think they are very balanced between each other. I usually play more aggressively so I tend to favor, the Redemptor (all-rounder) or the Brutalis for “in your face” close support.
I'm rocking a 1000 pt round Robin with blood angels as my army and I love the Redemptor it's all around good also with the lower the dmg on weapons it helps with devastating wounds because it runs the morals off the dmg of the weapon so thats nice.
How does this compare to the Leviathan Dreadnought? and how would it be best to run a leviathan dread? I have an easy build gatling redemptor and a magnetised leviathan dread?
I think that redemptor should cost 20-40 PTS less that now. And i think about kit with others wepons like lascanons, meltas etc. Because he really can do a lot and can be useful for any marines chapter but wepons options kiling him in my opinion.( ballistus have lascanons and probably have wepon kit in way)
the redemptor is already the best dread. making it 20-40 points cheaper would make taking other dreadnoughts even more pointless. youd have to drop ALL dreadnoughts by 20 points.
Think its overcosted, 225 points is a lot for something that doesn't put out that much damage per turn and will struggle to get into melee. Personally I think the Invictor is the best 'dreadnought' in the SM list, its not as tough as the Redemptor but still gets 12 wounds, has the 8" move and an 8" scout move as well, pumps out a decent amount of shots. Plus its only 160 points, an invictor and 5 incursors or infiltrators is only 250 points compared to 225 of the redemptor, and not only will you get more utility than just the redemptor the two in combo allows the invictor to shoot at anything that shoots at the phobos unit you are supporting so potentially allowing it to shoot more often. The invictor even hits harder in melee, its fist is S14 not 12, so it will more easily wound tanks in melee, like Land Raiders.
+2T, +1 SV and -1 Dmg have a compounding effect and the Invictor turns out to be muuuch squishier in practice. Also there are some armies like Custodes that really, really, really don't like -1 Dmg and it's a very useful piece of tech to have even if the Redemptor dies quicker than you would want to Bright Lances and Fire Prisms
@@alexanderabramov2719 Not denying its not tougher but it's also like 40% more expensive and that is kind of the point, it's still getting wiped off the board in one turn I'd rather risk 160 than 225, when I think the 160 also has potentially more utility and combos, especially for objective taking
The Redemptor is expensive but in my opinion worth the price. Taking multiple Redemptors would give your opponent a tough time. The damage output and the survivability of the Redemptor is enormous especially with Armour of contempt. The invictor is not as though as the Redemptor and its range weapons are not as good. The invictors ability is also quite bad. The invictor is a decent pick but all in all not as good as the Redemptor in my opinion even when considering the lower points cost.
The Leviathan is an excellent alternative. Also Duty Eternal, 3 free Hunter Killers hitting on 2+, an Invuln, great weapon options to kit it out as melee or ranged or both.
Hi...what is your opinion about comparing the redemptor to the balistus from the leviathan box? In terms of shooting, shouldnt the balistus be performing better?
The Ballistus shooting is better against the right targets. Ballistus has reliable damage against vehicles(wounding on 3+ on its Las weaponry), while the Redemptor relies on 5s and 6s(both in number of shots on the Plasma Incinerator and the wound rolls). The Ballistus also has overall better accuracy. It can fairly reliably knock out vehicles on its own. The Redemptor does reasonably well at range and reasonable well in melee. And it is more durable. That is its strengths. So the question is: Do you want to spend 225 points for a generalist or 170 pts for a specialist?
I have owned my venerable dreadnaughts for one year, bought them to go with my Deathwing Terminators. With the majority of my ravenwing legends and and the thread of all of my old greenwing going legends without notice, why should I continue to collect?
It looks like it has a beer gut. I'm not a fan of the overall design, and I can't stand that they have removed a huge chunk of the other dreads just to force people to use this one.
I’m currently building two redemptor dreads and wasn’t sure what weapons to outfit them with. Trying to decide if I want them similarly outfitted or if I want them to have different capabilities.
I would say if the target has OoM on it, you could fish for Devastating Wounds. 12 shots from the Heavy Onslaught and 8 shots from the smaller one. Rerolling hits and rerolling wounds. Great if the target has 4+ or 5+ Inv. Saves. Daemon targets comes to mind. Also, against most fodder units, it is more efficient. The Macro Plasma is bit "swingy" in the number of attacks it gets. Against 2-wound or 3 wound models though, I would say the Macro Plasma is overall the best. And it does not rely on OoM nearly as much for good performance.
I don’t care how good it’s stats are, I still think it’s a goofy ass design that’s both too different and not different enough from the old box dreads.
Don't sleep on the contemptor as a budget option. 55 points less, and whilst it has 1 less point of toughness and 2 less wounds, the 4+ invulnerable save makes up for this where the Redemptor starts suffering when hit with ap-3 or more.
Probably an unpopular take but: I think the redemptor is overrated. In a lot of other factions a unit like the redemptor would be appreciated; the redemptor is basically built entirely to hold the midfield, blast elite infantry and tear apart light vehicles. It’s biggest sell is probably in it’s ability to survive on the mid field. But those roles are extremely over saturated for SM. Tactically and strategically, the redemptor has to compete with terminators, bladeguard, and the Brutalis for holding and flipping the midfield. Offensively the redemptor is competing with (again), terminators, bladeguard, and the brutalis, but also the ballistus, vanguard vets, storm speeders, Devastator centurions, eliminators, eradicators, sternguard, desolators, and most of the motor pool. For holding the centerfield, I’d much rather have terminators to dedicate to it or bladeguard to cheaply hold it, and I’d rather have the brutalis for flipping/pushing the midfield. Damage-wise, there are so many options for highly efficient damage against elite infantry that I just don’t see a reason to take the redemptor. We have infantry that does anti-elite-infantry better. When looking at the marine’s motorpool for 10th, my first objective is getting the tools to deal with enemy armor; the redemptor can’t do this, so it’s selling exclusively on its durability. And as Before, we have better options for brick wall units in the mid board.
As someone who lives in Australia, is £38 a lot of money? I always see UK prices and think “holy shit, that’s cheap” but is it really? Like what’s a litre of milk cost? I need some perspective
These things just feel like they need to be modified to have the coffin-front of the old dreadnoughts. The rest of the model is fine, but the fact that the center looks like a driver's seat and not like the top of a sarcophagus is stupid.
The macro plasma aint all the numbers say it is. In practice youll be lucky to do any signaficant damage to most vehicles and so its relagated to anti-heavy infantry, which is what plasma should be for. The redemptor is your basic boxnaught - gun and fist, though this one is skewed more towards anti infantry. Space marines dont really lack options for anti heavy infantry with hellblasters and various vehicles. The Ballistus is better if you wanted anti tank though as people have mentioned, the Gladiator Lancer is the best for anti tank when it comes to price vs damage output. The lancer does lack versatility admittedly with only really having a pair of storm bolters for other targets
OoM does help it(and every other weapon, really) a lot. However, it really depends on the number of attacks you get on the Macro Plasma to fire(you cant reroll those). If you roll high though(5 or 6, so 6 or 7 attacks) and overcharge against a OoM target, you can probably deal about 12 damage to an enemy vehicle with the Macro Plasma Incinerator and smaller Onslaugh Gatling(devastating Wounds). And you could potentially get more if you also get into melee. The Ballistus will wound easier, but now the damage is random(d6 rolls). On average, and OoM on target, you could do around 16 damage to a vehicle with it. In both cases I am not really accounting for saving throws. As a ranged weapon platform though, yes, the Ballistus will perform overall better against vehicles. It is also less reliant on OoM when doing so(although it does help). I also agree with the Lancer. More efficient anti-vehicle platform, but less versatile.
The redemptor is good, but there's so many other things that can do the same job...In some cases better. Terminators led by a chaplain for example get a 4+ FNP against mortal wounds and a nice +1 to wound in melee. Sternguard led by a librarian is also a proven damage dealer with tons of MWs and a 4+ invuln. to boot...Not to mention the fact that if they kill their target, they can shoot again once per game which can come in clutch when you want to finish off a weakened unit without wasting a squad's worth of firepower. Then you have the deathwatch veterans who are imo the most versatile unit in the whole game right now...Great shooting, great melee (with 4 DW thunder hammers in a 10-man unit), battleline and all that before any character buffs (inquisitors are a neat and thematic option for FNP or extra MW from their psychic attack). Hope they don't get retired due to them being firstborn...
??? Damage characteristics can’t be modified to be less than one, unless an ability specifically states that it makes it become 0. All other things being equal (which is iffy I know) 1 damage weapons are actually more efficient against minus 1 damage abilities.
@@MinePurpose On the same note, high damage attacks(6 and above) barely feels this "-1" as well. It is really only the damage 2 and damage 3 profiles that really feel it(since they rely more on volume of fire).
My experience is he is either a monster or a complete dud. It is very match dependent and/or if your opponent brought real anti tank guns. Brought 2 Redemptors vs Space Wolves who brought 2 lancers. Both dreads died T1. Yes he spiked and my FnP6 did me no favors but with AP4 and D6+3x2 even with -1 they can just die. I have had games vs CSM where my opponent tried killing them with possessed. Obviously did not go well. My issue with them is they are amazing anti elite infantry and good vs normal infantry but are real bad vs anything else. They can't do much outside melee vs T10+ targets and even then their lowered AP and damage means they are a none threat there too. Vs a lancer which is MUCH cheaper they are not worth the points imo. All dreads should be at least 20 points less. I'd even argue 40. Their role as all rounders is fine but they really don't DO their job vs similar options in tanks atm.
I have two of these and they are not as good as in 9th and more expensive. When I play against a redemptor with my other army, 1 or 2 big gun shots destroy it as it has no invuln. Overall, I would be 50% less likely to bring one in 10th as I was in 9th would only include it at 2000pts+, below that it's too expensive.
So i e ran several lists to conpare the Redemptor, Brutalis, and Ballistus. The Redemptor clearly out preforms the others. The Brutalis has been the biggest disappointment. It eaither never gits into combat or it's a bit too efficient. With a 5pts difference i would take the Redemptor every time.
There is zero argument that Repulsors, executioners, and gladiators are superior. the executioner is only 5 more points, hits MUCH harder, and has much more fire powers plus can transport a 5 man with leader squad. Replusors are 195pts, carry 12 guys, and out shoot the redemptor. Lancers are 145pts, reapers and valiants are 155, with the same toughness and wounds statline as the redemptor. Redemptors are too expensive for their statline, with what they can do. I've yet to see one live past a single turn of shooting in 10th. duty eternal is not worth 225pts. Redemptors need serious point drop to make them a decent choice.
The Redemptor is not meant to outshoot any of them. It supports your other elements while being resistant to weapons such as plasma and auto cannon shots(2-3 damage profiles). It can add decent firepower during the shooting phase, and charge in during the melee. If you want a generalist, you go with the Redemptor. If you want a specialist, you pick something else.
Exactly. They hated that people didn't like their dumb cashmaris dread design and are now throwing all their toys out of their pram to make you buy redemptors.
I really do not agree that its worth it's points. The only thing it has going for it is its durability which, looking at your math, its only more durable against things that are already going to struggle to wound vehicles. Being 25 points more than a tyranofex is insulting and 80 more than an armiger is just hysterical. The redemptor is at least 30 points too expensive for what it does.
Dreads are my favorite thing, but there points cost is just too high. A gladiator lancer has more wounds, toughness, movment, and better guns. Its only 145. There are plenty of other options that are better bamg for your buck. Its unfortunate. The redemptor is the best of them all tho.
Small Correction: He can't use the return fire stratagem from Dark Angels sorry, needs a model to be slain to trigger that one!
Thoughts on the Ballistus?
That lore bite about Redemptors killing their pilots will very likely be retconned soon, otherwise how will they have venerable redemptors
Venerable ones have managed to survive for a week and get promoted
Are they making venerable primaris dreads?
Perhaps it's the sarcophagus from a normal dread given an 'upgrade'.
TRUE or they refine the tech. By they I mean Cawl.
QA. You gotta put those bugs on backlog and slowly iron them out. Maybe Cawl will release a software patch to sort that out.
Or maybe that's just a unit they won't make?
This guy is definitely pulling his weight right now. During the Battle for Oghram, threw him into combat with a Hive Tyrant, Screamer Killer, and Mawloc, expecting him to make a heroic sacrifice while I scored points elsewhere. He then proceeded to kill the Tyrant, nearly kill the Screamer Killer, and took a grand total of two wounds over three rounds of combat.
Of note: A Custodes Telemon is basically the Redemptor statline, with a 4+ invuln for ten more points. The ranged weapons might not be quite as good, but having martial katahs on a dreadnought is certainly interesting...
Lmao 4+ invul on a dread.
In my last game one of my redemptors got one shot by a tyranofex in overwatch before it even made it into combat 😢
I introduced my friend's redemptor to my Avatar of Khaine. I don't think I need to say much more. Still miss the time tho when my dire avengers could 1 hit this guy in 9th...
@@knightoftwilight2122 yeh eldar are really struggling at the moment…
@@Meako92 bro I don't want a broken army. That's one of the reasons I chose Aeldari in 9th cos it had around 50% win rate.
I'm just reminising about my old favourite unit that is now redundant.
The one noteworthy advantage that the Heavy Onslaught has is that it lacks Blast, so you can still use against a unit you're in combat with.
I WAS LITERALLY JUST looking for this analysis. 10/10 Auspex. It's why you're the best!
Redemptor's issue is that the macroplasma/onslaught combo is *so much better* than the heavy onslaught and flamer combo, but are stuck at the same price due to free wargear issues in 10e. Would love to see a better reason to take the lighter loadout.
I REALLY want to see Redemptor-pattern upgrade sprues or full kits for Death Company, Furioso, Wulfen, Deathwatch and Grey Knights.
They could make some into weapon kits for Ballistus, some for Brutalis.
Then they have the chance to add some new datasheets than can work as a rolling balance like a sort of range refresh.
Basically free money for GW, give upgrade kits for nearly every chapter/vehicle
Furioso Redemptor is just Brutalis.
Liber daemonica has them
@auspextactics Could you possibly make a video ranking all of the factions' Combat Patrols in the Combat Patrol game mode? I think would be very interested and the game mode has picked up a lot of interest amongst players with a fair few local gaming stores I know hosting Combat Patrol tournaments
I agree, would love to see this
I picked up the Dark Angel combat patrol to help turn my space marines from the Leviathan box into a proper army, glad to know this guy was a good addition.
Redemptor's are awesome. I always include at least one in most lists. My only grumble would be that they should have been options on a single unit rather than being multiple types. A lascannon and dreadnought fist for example.
Ah, the classic. Maybe that could be a kitbash done in the future.
I appreciate the insight on the Redemptor Dread, because I've been thinking of starting my Space Marine army using a Blood Angels and Dark Angels Combat Patrol, so I'll have one anyway so I may as well know how to use it!
I find them to be a great mid board bruiser. Theyll struggle to be the heavy liter in anti tank but they just generally waddle around and put out chunks of damage while being really hard to kill. Vehicle cover and a 2+ save makes them very tough, and every weapom they have loves the rerolls of oath. The plasma is often used to finish off wounded heavy targets or contributing to the oath target damage.
Would love to see your numbers breakdown of the new terminator captain vs the current Gravis Captian
gravis captain + artificer armour wins
Played my first 10th edition game and I chose the Dark Angels Combat patrol because I love the look of this model. Holy crap this game is awesome and this unit is so much fun to run in a game!
Don't forget it can carried in the Stormraven Gunship
Excuse me what in the robo gorillaman my sons must know if this immediately
@@I_Am_Alpharius_ Stormraven Gunship can carry any one unit with the dreadnought keyword and just last week these bad boys were given the dreadnought keyword! :D
Iron Hands will like that haha
Invictor tactical war suit is hilerious it better at melee and cheeper than the redemptor and it’s melee variant. Which I find hilarious. It’s basically the same basic arms and legs just the pilot isn’t in bits and pieces .
Waiting for there to be different points for the different options. I've got the Easy to Build one with the Heavy Onslaught, Heavy Flamer, and no rocket pod. It's never going to kill its points with that load out.
Unlikely. Not how aos ever worked with the same system and the easy build optiond
Time to convert it
Great video analysis on this fearsome unit!!
Considering they are removing the classic ones... It is hard not to be the strongest if you are de-facto the only one left.
The redemptor has been a competitive choice since it’s release…
Brutalis and Ballista Dreadnoughts go with the same design and i think they are neat too
Just a bit blocky and ugly compared to contemptors and leviathans. Main issue with the Primaris stuff is how blocky it is on any tanks etc but they all look worse than the older versions. It’s like like living through the dark ages seeing the good things go and their barely functional replacements.
@@DukeDanseMacambrethat's the theme of humanity in 40k.
@@jellydamgood Where did this new tech come from then?
Although they are very similar, a video talking about the Telemon, or the custodes dreadnought would be very interesting
Do we know if duty eternal negate damage one weps yet? It doesn’t say to a minimum of 1 but not sure if it was a mistake
I would love to see an Iron Clad and venerable dread update. Honestly they should be upgrades and not new models
in a news update on games workshop's website it said that the ironclad was gonna be removed for unown reasons. Maybe they are giving it a new model but it's getting removed from the online website for now.
It really is a great all arounder for your army. It isn't bad into any matchup.
Personally I love the model and what it can do, throw in a Techmarine and it is partytime! However, the pointcost for it right now is pretty steep, going up 20% from 9th.
Especially when compared to a gladiator tank.. my heart says yes but my head say no lol
You are the best I absolutely love your videos keep it up man.
Hope the video of the thousands sons will come soon :D
I think the Icarus missile pod launcher might always be free from now on. There are no alternate build options in the kit to NOT attach the Icarus. The older easy to build Redemptor kit did not have the Icarus included.
Imperium magazine will release their Redemptor here in Germany soon. That will make number 2 and 3 for my collection. Does anybody know if it is the easy to build version or if all weapons are included?
It has both of the big guns: macro plasma and heavy onslaught Gatling cannon
I love my redemptor dread. I got started back into the game around Christmas, and got some fights in 9th in with it with friends.
I take it in most games with macro plasma and Gatling cannon.
It's never let me down, and goes to most of my games.
The only other dread I have is my ballistus, and in 3 games it hasn't removed a single model.
Relentless Assault with Saga of the Warrior Born active on this thing is REALLY good. If you need a long charge to tie up some Neophytes, for example, you don’t have to sacrifice shooting to do it. You can effectively cripple two squads by shooting into one and then tying up the other in close combat if they have pitiful melee
How does the Heavy Flamer perform for this model, I'm making a 1000 pt army and bought one 2nd hand it has the Weapon loadout of: Macro plasma incinerator, Looks like the Icarus rocket pod up top, twin linked storm bolter on the front and the heavy flamer below it's Redemptor fist. As it stands i'm lacking melee close range stuff, and wanted a balanced dreadnought, just wondering if I should fork out a few extra bucks and shed the Heavy Flamer for the Gatling gun below the fist weapon?
Depends, what's your locals look like
No wonder he's the top one when GW deletes classic ones from the game and production
So when the Ballistus Dread gets a multipart kit, what weapon options do you guys think will be made available?
It would be fun if it got something like a big mortar to let it shoot indirect.
I'd be surprised to see a multitude of options in the new kit. I think it could be an assault cannon of some sort and a multi-melta. Grav cannon is a possibility too.
@@RSBurgener the ballistus could use an indirect mortar weapon on its head. similar to the rockers or heavy stubbers the other primaris dreadnoughts get on their heads.
-1 damage does amazing with Black Templars 6+ FNP making it really durable ahain
My BT redemptor gets melted every time i bring him and does next to nothing
The Redemptor Dread is still awesome. I have two in my Black Templars army and two in Ultramarines. After buying the Agastus box, I started running 1 Brutalis and 1 Redemptor in my BT army, mainly because a melee dread most more thematic for BTs, despite that the Redemptor seemed more effective.
The Redemptor’s purpose is to soften up enemy units, especially vehicles and monsters, and be a bullet sponge for enemy ranged units, to minimize casualties to my melee units until they get into charge range. Consequently, my Redemptor rarely survives past Turn 2.
I know that if I took 3 Redemptors, I could blast away and have a greater chance of at least one surviving to Turn 3 and beyond, but I don’t want to do that to my friends in casual play.
Leviathan is still my favorite. I don't care about GW's ban. I'm still running my FW units.
… there’s a plastic Levvy dude. And it has more options. The GW “ban” is just legends rules so as long as it isn’t comp you can use it.
And that’s the problem GW put leviathans in to legends that should of never happened.
These new dreds that GW are pushing don’t do the 30k dreds Justice and they never will.
I tend to rate the ballistus with its 2 lascannons and 2 krak or 2D6 frag alternatable during the game, for only 170 points, up to par for ranged combat, with the aim of objective holding capturing I would opt redemptor, fire support the ballistus.
I think they are very balanced between each other. I usually play more aggressively so I tend to favor, the Redemptor (all-rounder) or the Brutalis for “in your face” close support.
@@cfsm984 The Brutalis is too expensive. There is no reason for it to be 50p more than the Ballistus.
I'm rocking a 1000 pt round Robin with blood angels as my army and I love the Redemptor it's all around good also with the lower the dmg on weapons it helps with devastating wounds because it runs the morals off the dmg of the weapon so thats nice.
How does this compare to the Leviathan Dreadnought? and how would it be best to run a leviathan dread? I have an easy build gatling redemptor and a magnetised leviathan dread?
Leviathan Dread is a cheap anti vehicle loadout essentially. Redemptor is your midrange versatile threat, and Brutalis is you melee Dread.
Thanks,
Comment for the Skull Throne
I think that redemptor should cost 20-40 PTS less that now.
And i think about kit with others wepons like lascanons, meltas etc. Because he really can do a lot and can be useful for any marines chapter but wepons options kiling him in my opinion.( ballistus have lascanons and probably have wepon kit in way)
the redemptor is already the best dread. making it 20-40 points cheaper would make taking other dreadnoughts even more pointless. youd have to drop ALL dreadnoughts by 20 points.
Think its overcosted, 225 points is a lot for something that doesn't put out that much damage per turn and will struggle to get into melee. Personally I think the Invictor is the best 'dreadnought' in the SM list, its not as tough as the Redemptor but still gets 12 wounds, has the 8" move and an 8" scout move as well, pumps out a decent amount of shots. Plus its only 160 points, an invictor and 5 incursors or infiltrators is only 250 points compared to 225 of the redemptor, and not only will you get more utility than just the redemptor the two in combo allows the invictor to shoot at anything that shoots at the phobos unit you are supporting so potentially allowing it to shoot more often. The invictor even hits harder in melee, its fist is S14 not 12, so it will more easily wound tanks in melee, like Land Raiders.
+2T, +1 SV and -1 Dmg have a compounding effect and the Invictor turns out to be muuuch squishier in practice. Also there are some armies like Custodes that really, really, really don't like -1 Dmg and it's a very useful piece of tech to have even if the Redemptor dies quicker than you would want to Bright Lances and Fire Prisms
@@alexanderabramov2719 Not denying its not tougher but it's also like 40% more expensive and that is kind of the point, it's still getting wiped off the board in one turn I'd rather risk 160 than 225, when I think the 160 also has potentially more utility and combos, especially for objective taking
The Redemptor is expensive but in my opinion worth the price. Taking multiple Redemptors would give your opponent a tough time. The damage output and the survivability of the Redemptor is enormous especially with Armour of contempt. The invictor is not as though as the Redemptor and its range weapons are not as good. The invictors ability is also quite bad. The invictor is a decent pick but all in all not as good as the Redemptor in my opinion even when considering the lower points cost.
Tell me you don't actually play the game without telling me you don't actually play the game.
Up to 26 atks per shooting phase for 1 unit and tanky. What's wrong with the dmg?
I'm still using the Leviathan over my Redemptor for the time being.
You run it as an redemptor?
@@JakimAkim no as a leviathan
In competitive?
@@dhobson5439 yes. I've played in two local tournaments since 10th launched and both have allowed legends for now.
Newest dread being the best. What a surprise.
The overcharged plasma gun is kind of OP, despair one face when opponents dreadnought one shotted my carnifex like nothing
That is some seriously hot dice. The plasma doesn't do nearly that much on average.
@@cruelmole on average nahhh, more than 50% I give it a go if you're really unlucky with the rolls
The Leviathan is an excellent alternative. Also Duty Eternal, 3 free Hunter Killers hitting on 2+, an Invuln, great weapon options to kit it out as melee or ranged or both.
Thanks for the video
Just finished building mine today
Good thing ive got one on my shelf half painted
Gw stock room was full of gladiator tanks
Why wouldn’t you be able to fire the fragstorm directly into combat?
Blast weapons cannot be fired into combat
lol didnt we have this same talk last edition? Redemptor holding against the changes
Am I correct in saying that the duty eternal rule means that Damage 1 weapons don’t hurt the Redemptor?
No, damage cannot be reduced to 0
Hi...what is your opinion about comparing the redemptor to the balistus from the leviathan box? In terms of shooting, shouldnt the balistus be performing better?
Lol they had done this in ninth as well. Thr shooting of the Ballistus was worse than the Redemptor.
@@jossypoo lol damn!
The Ballistus shooting is better against the right targets. Ballistus has reliable damage against vehicles(wounding on 3+ on its Las weaponry), while the Redemptor relies on 5s and 6s(both in number of shots on the Plasma Incinerator and the wound rolls). The Ballistus also has overall better accuracy. It can fairly reliably knock out vehicles on its own.
The Redemptor does reasonably well at range and reasonable well in melee. And it is more durable. That is its strengths.
So the question is: Do you want to spend 225 points for a generalist or 170 pts for a specialist?
@@fendelphi thank you for the breakdown =)
I have owned my venerable dreadnaughts for one year, bought them to go with my Deathwing Terminators. With the majority of my ravenwing legends and and the thread of all of my old greenwing going legends without notice, why should I continue to collect?
Imagine the face of a Hellbrute after this
It looks like it has a beer gut. I'm not a fan of the overall design, and I can't stand that they have removed a huge chunk of the other dreads just to force people to use this one.
I think its one of the best models gw make 🤷🏼♂️
It might be the best on paper, but Castraferrum for ever right here. :D
Is the dreadnought topping in the bedroom?
What do you think about the ballistus dreadnought compared to the redemptor?
I’m currently building two redemptor dreads and wasn’t sure what weapons to outfit them with. Trying to decide if I want them similarly outfitted or if I want them to have different capabilities.
Magnetize the main weapon and just swap it out as needed
weird you don't compare it to the ballistus
I am sick to death of fighting these literally every game I've faced marines since their release.
it's pretty overcosted, it's the best dread in that the others are even worse.
all the Primaris Dreadnoughts could be comfortably dropped by 20 points to be competitive.
Does the Gatling Cannon perform better than the Macro Plasma against any set of targets?
I would say if the target has OoM on it, you could fish for Devastating Wounds. 12 shots from the Heavy Onslaught and 8 shots from the smaller one. Rerolling hits and rerolling wounds. Great if the target has 4+ or 5+ Inv. Saves. Daemon targets comes to mind.
Also, against most fodder units, it is more efficient. The Macro Plasma is bit "swingy" in the number of attacks it gets.
Against 2-wound or 3 wound models though, I would say the Macro Plasma is overall the best. And it does not rely on OoM nearly as much for good performance.
Does Duty Eternal mean that it could drop the DMG, potentially, to 0?
I take it you are new to the game. No, you always take a min of 1.
I don’t care how good it’s stats are, I still think it’s a goofy ass design that’s both too different and not different enough from the old box dreads.
Not da choppiest, not da dakkiest but da bes to krump da enemy
Don't sleep on the contemptor as a budget option. 55 points less, and whilst it has 1 less point of toughness and 2 less wounds, the 4+ invulnerable save makes up for this where the Redemptor starts suffering when hit with ap-3 or more.
I've used it, but it's only good for shooting infantry. It doesn't punch up like the redemptor. I like that it stands back up though!
or just take a gladiator lancer instead
These Prices got me laughing, Kids are going to go broke buying models, just buy a printer and save your cash for paint.
not when ghaz is around every time i have had ghaz on the field he has destroyed every dread that he has come across recently in one fight phase.
Probably an unpopular take but: I think the redemptor is overrated. In a lot of other factions a unit like the redemptor would be appreciated; the redemptor is basically built entirely to hold the midfield, blast elite infantry and tear apart light vehicles. It’s biggest sell is probably in it’s ability to survive on the mid field. But those roles are extremely over saturated for SM.
Tactically and strategically, the redemptor has to compete with terminators, bladeguard, and the Brutalis for holding and flipping the midfield. Offensively the redemptor is competing with (again), terminators, bladeguard, and the brutalis, but also the ballistus, vanguard vets, storm speeders, Devastator centurions, eliminators, eradicators, sternguard, desolators, and most of the motor pool.
For holding the centerfield, I’d much rather have terminators to dedicate to it or bladeguard to cheaply hold it, and I’d rather have the brutalis for flipping/pushing the midfield. Damage-wise, there are so many options for highly efficient damage against elite infantry that I just don’t see a reason to take the redemptor. We have infantry that does anti-elite-infantry better.
When looking at the marine’s motorpool for 10th, my first objective is getting the tools to deal with enemy armor; the redemptor can’t do this, so it’s selling exclusively on its durability. And as Before, we have better options for brick wall units in the mid board.
I’m building one of these . . . I don’t game just a collector. 😎
As someone who lives in Australia, is £38 a lot of money? I always see UK prices and think “holy shit, that’s cheap” but is it really? Like what’s a litre of milk cost? I need some perspective
These things just feel like they need to be modified to have the coffin-front of the old dreadnoughts. The rest of the model is fine, but the fact that the center looks like a driver's seat and not like the top of a sarcophagus is stupid.
It's the only dread unfortunately since they yeeted all the other ones to legends.
The macro plasma aint all the numbers say it is. In practice youll be lucky to do any signaficant damage to most vehicles and so its relagated to anti-heavy infantry, which is what plasma should be for. The redemptor is your basic boxnaught - gun and fist, though this one is skewed more towards anti infantry. Space marines dont really lack options for anti heavy infantry with hellblasters and various vehicles. The Ballistus is better if you wanted anti tank though as people have mentioned, the Gladiator Lancer is the best for anti tank when it comes to price vs damage output. The lancer does lack versatility admittedly with only really having a pair of storm bolters for other targets
OoM does help it(and every other weapon, really) a lot. However, it really depends on the number of attacks you get on the Macro Plasma to fire(you cant reroll those).
If you roll high though(5 or 6, so 6 or 7 attacks) and overcharge against a OoM target, you can probably deal about 12 damage to an enemy vehicle with the Macro Plasma Incinerator and smaller Onslaugh Gatling(devastating Wounds). And you could potentially get more if you also get into melee.
The Ballistus will wound easier, but now the damage is random(d6 rolls). On average, and OoM on target, you could do around 16 damage to a vehicle with it.
In both cases I am not really accounting for saving throws.
As a ranged weapon platform though, yes, the Ballistus will perform overall better against vehicles. It is also less reliant on OoM when doing so(although it does help).
I also agree with the Lancer. More efficient anti-vehicle platform, but less versatile.
One thing to keep in mind when comparing the Redemptor to other vehicles like tanks; Dreadnoughts are way cooler than tanks.
Top Dread? Possibly only dread?
It’s hard to name something as a top option because they banned all other options… 😂
You must buy one of these ugly suckers
why do these types of videos always leave out the imperial fist lol
Just as well, I own 2!
*The pregonaught*
Take three against half the armies which have no reliable antitank and watch your enemies tilt
That’s a casual take tbh, they get melted by eldar, tau, nids, other marines, Votann, dark eldar. Really only orks would get tilted lol
The redemptor is good, but there's so many other things that can do the same job...In some cases better. Terminators led by a chaplain for example get a 4+ FNP against mortal wounds and a nice +1 to wound in melee. Sternguard led by a librarian is also a proven damage dealer with tons of MWs and a 4+ invuln. to boot...Not to mention the fact that if they kill their target, they can shoot again once per game which can come in clutch when you want to finish off a weakened unit without wasting a squad's worth of firepower. Then you have the deathwatch veterans who are imo the most versatile unit in the whole game right now...Great shooting, great melee (with 4 DW thunder hammers in a 10-man unit), battleline and all that before any character buffs (inquisitors are a neat and thematic option for FNP or extra MW from their psychic attack). Hope they don't get retired due to them being firstborn...
Comparing apples and oranges here.
Redemptor is about the same points as 5 hellblasters in an impulsor. I kind of think the latter is better.
Except the redemptor doesn't fall over when targeted with the multitude of D2 weapons in the game. No reason you can't field both.
One of my lists fields both lol
Unless we look at legends with the -1 damage, very strong shooting and melee leviathan dreadnought.
??? Damage characteristics can’t be modified to be less than one, unless an ability specifically states that it makes it become 0. All other things being equal (which is iffy I know) 1 damage weapons are actually more efficient against minus 1 damage abilities.
@@MinePurpose On the same note, high damage attacks(6 and above) barely feels this "-1" as well. It is really only the damage 2 and damage 3 profiles that really feel it(since they rely more on volume of fire).
One of the strongest choices more like one of the only choices left 🤣🤣
My experience is he is either a monster or a complete dud.
It is very match dependent and/or if your opponent brought real anti tank guns.
Brought 2 Redemptors vs Space Wolves who brought 2 lancers.
Both dreads died T1. Yes he spiked and my FnP6 did me no favors but with AP4 and D6+3x2 even with -1 they can just die.
I have had games vs CSM where my opponent tried killing them with possessed. Obviously did not go well.
My issue with them is they are amazing anti elite infantry and good vs normal infantry but are real bad vs anything else.
They can't do much outside melee vs T10+ targets and even then their lowered AP and damage means they are a none threat there too.
Vs a lancer which is MUCH cheaper they are not worth the points imo.
All dreads should be at least 20 points less. I'd even argue 40. Their role as all rounders is fine but they really don't DO their job vs similar options in tanks atm.
lancer just op.
I think 220 pts is overcosted.
I have two of these and they are not as good as in 9th and more expensive.
When I play against a redemptor with my other army, 1 or 2 big gun shots destroy it as it has no invuln.
Overall, I would be 50% less likely to bring one in 10th as I was in 9th would only include it at 2000pts+, below that it's too expensive.
So i e ran several lists to conpare the Redemptor, Brutalis, and Ballistus. The Redemptor clearly out preforms the others. The Brutalis has been the biggest disappointment. It eaither never gits into combat or it's a bit too efficient. With a 5pts difference i would take the Redemptor every time.
There is zero argument that Repulsors, executioners, and gladiators are superior. the executioner is only 5 more points, hits MUCH harder, and has much more fire powers plus can transport a 5 man with leader squad. Replusors are 195pts, carry 12 guys, and out shoot the redemptor. Lancers are 145pts, reapers and valiants are 155, with the same toughness and wounds statline as the redemptor. Redemptors are too expensive for their statline, with what they can do. I've yet to see one live past a single turn of shooting in 10th. duty eternal is not worth 225pts. Redemptors need serious point drop to make them a decent choice.
The Redemptor is not meant to outshoot any of them. It supports your other elements while being resistant to weapons such as plasma and auto cannon shots(2-3 damage profiles). It can add decent firepower during the shooting phase, and charge in during the melee.
If you want a generalist, you go with the Redemptor. If you want a specialist, you pick something else.
Best cause they removed the rest...
Exactly. They hated that people didn't like their dumb cashmaris dread design and are now throwing all their toys out of their pram to make you buy redemptors.
I really do not agree that its worth it's points. The only thing it has going for it is its durability which, looking at your math, its only more durable against things that are already going to struggle to wound vehicles. Being 25 points more than a tyranofex is insulting and 80 more than an armiger is just hysterical. The redemptor is at least 30 points too expensive for what it does.
Since they're now phasing out old dreads, they should just downgrade Redemptor and other primarse variants to the same as old dreads.
Fastest commenter in the west.
Dammit
Hes the only cus there is no others
TBH think the Leviathan is better.
👍👍👍❤❤❤
Dreads are my favorite thing, but there points cost is just too high. A gladiator lancer has more wounds, toughness, movment, and better guns. Its only 145. There are plenty of other options that are better bamg for your buck. Its unfortunate.
The redemptor is the best of them all tho.