Ayane | Wasted Plotential
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- Опубліковано 6 бер 2020
- Can Team Ninja screw up a retelling as badly as NRS does? Let's find out.
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I thought that Ryu became the Batman in the DoA franchise. Always showing up for other character's plotline where he's not needed and usually playing a significant part or remind the audience about him being the best fighter/strategist of all the heroes. I despise it where one popular character then supersedes the rest of the cast and becomes a self fulfilling prophecy because the writers built the audience around that popular character.
He's definitely more a quan chi. Even the bats doesn't come into say, Wonder Woman's shit or Metropolis and stick his nose in for the most part. He's usually doing his scene stealing bit while in Justice League but even then he doesn't just jump into other people's limelight blatantly, mostly because its not physically possible for him to do so.
Ninja Goku Batman
the entire doa6 is wasted potential.
Devin Person Well, it is just the Misadventures of Honoka and Marie Rose.
Amen
Bloomie Plays honestly
The story and gameplay is so trash it literally pisses me off
It literally sucks
Team Ninja can't seem to do anything right ever since Itagaki left
They did make Nioh though.
@@harlannguyen4048 Nioh has absolutely nothing to do with DOA though.
@@Metal92990 The topic is about Team Ninja as a whole, not just DOA.
@@Metal92990 there is a possibility that nioh takes place way before ninja gaiden and doa
@@Metal92990 Well for people like me who are way too much into Nioh, it's kind of a factor, I've taken more and more of an interest into Team Ninja's work and uh.... can't say I find DOA appealing seeing how a character like Ayane "evolved".
I'd rather stick to something like Guilty Gear in comparison, at least as far as fighting games goes.
Ayane has much more depth compared to many characters. being seen as a cursed child due to backwards village ideology, lacking parental care, having to kill off her only parent figure and work her way to earning respect as a leader of the clan. I think people forget her age a little too much in the middle of these events. I think there are many emotions explaining why she is so head strong and on guard and her vulnerability is only shown when she tried to kill herself, i think there could have been better opportunities for showing a softer side though. Her character could have been explored and respected much more. It’s sad that was watered down in doa6 and was made into a bullshit sassy tsundere when the game became a loli circus. RIP Ayane
Oh boy... DOA's story has taken the utter piss in general since Dimensions. Sure I'd like to think the whole situation with the Mugen Tenshin clan has always been rather ridiculous since the first game but ever since Itagaki left it's got no where near the same level of emotional investment. Guess character development and motivation... or just meaningful plot in general can go be on the backburner as long as pretty girls and expensive fan-service is the top priority all the time in such a series.
Emphasis on expensive.
Team Ninja don't care about anybody but Honkers-chan (Dead or Alive's Lars Alexandersson), Nico (the moeblob replacement for Lisa) and the Not-Loli AKA the otaku bait moneymakers. Sad to see after being into DOA since the second game, but it's the truth. Like, sure, DOA has always been fueled by fanservice, but pre-Dimensions entries at least attempted to have a plot.
Ayane was always an interesting character. She had the potential for lots of nuances give her status in the Mugen Tenshin as an unloved bastard child and her conflicted feelings towards her half-siblings.
Honoka was nothing more than a plot device for a guy that no one cared and was killed in 5 minutes, so i wouldn't say that they care about her either lol, and even if they care, it means nothing since they can't think of nothing to do with their characters outside of fanservice
But I like Lars and is fighting style😢
@@vilao9230 Its funny how they keep doing this shit with deceased villians. Virgil banging some chick in Fortuna to have Nero, Wesker having what's his name in RE6 and so on. I mean, I know some of the most unlikely people can get laid and reproduce (just go in your local wal mart) but knowing these characters and their personalities its just so unlikely and out of left field. Also we are supposed to accept that Wesker being infected with a highly virulent contamination didn't affect the women he banged and their son in an adverse fashion. Instead, it gives them special abilities and shit? Despite seeing countless other people infect themselves and becoming monstrosities?
@@Ergeniz Timeline wise, I believe Wesker probably had a kid sometime before the Spencer mansion incident which would make Jake's powers and virus immunity kind of a plot hole? Hard to picture Wesker as a guy that would ever settle down or just have a one night stand where he can knock someone up
Has to be before the Spencer mansion incident otherwise Jake's age and the timeline of RE6 don't add up.
Edit: Just checked the RE Wiki. Jake's date of birth is listed as 1992. The Spencer Mansion incident happened in the summer of 1998, so I don't get how Jake even has powers or "special DNA"
@@Ergeniz Wesker didn't get infected until after he allowed himself to be killed by the Tyrant in RE1. This happened 6 years after Jake was born
Ayane is still my favourite character in DOA but yeah its ridiculous how she's essentially been nerfed in the story ever since Dimensions. Yeah I know Dimensions is now canon but as far as I'm personally concerned the original plots from the original games are still the canon events. As big a fan of Ryu Hayabusa that I am, he doesn't need to be the deus ex machina of the series!
That's the thing about rival characters. A lot of the time they end up getting left in the dust.
At least in DOA: Dimensions Ryu Hayabusa wasn't portrayed as a *"Jobber"* like in DOA 5 & 6
@@joseurbina3835 DOA isn't Ryu's story.
@@cui8789 Don't get me wrong I love Ryu Hayabusa as Ninja Gaiden is one of my favourite franchises, same goes for DOA. Like you said, it isn't Ryu's story. Its ultimately the story of Kasumi, Ayane, Hayate, Helena, Tina and all of the other characters. Alot of rival characters do get left behind and often don't get much extra attention once their arc is done which is a shame.
Hayabusa is the Batman of DOA! I love the guy, but this is too much!
Wow, Ayane went from having an actual character arc to yeah let's degrade her character to the point of putting Ryu on a high mountain a lot, have other characters save her a lot and finally make her go through anime bullshit. It really is sad since hearing what happened in DOA3 sounds really great, but then Dimensions through 6 onwards, Ayane got worse with the exceptions of her being cool with Kasumi. Good job with the video man!
Well, technically Ayane's only been saved once, but you're right about her spiraling sownhill due to Team Ninja trying to do DOA without Itagaki.
@MrDarkSol I absolutely love that people on here care about the story and not the fan service.
@@quickclipsart1028 if you get in the right parts of the community. Yeah. Then theres the subreddits, worst mistake i made.
Ayane is definitely among my favorite female characters in fighting games, and in my opinion is the best one in DOA, and this video does a good job of talking about some of the motivations that drew me to her, as well as address some of the major criticisms I've had with the character in the more recent entries in the series. Specifically DOA 6, which in my opinion is currently the worst DOA story wise by far, and doesn't do the character justice at all.
Dimensions was just bleh. I also kinda feel like Ayane was meant to be an antagonist throughout the series, and not jsut a rival, but her popularity made the writers turn her more sympathetic in DOA3, although I could just be talking out of my ass on that one. Still she was my second favorite in DOA2/3, but he rest of the games she just kinda, didn't seem to have much of a reason to be in the games, other than the rival aspect.
Also, I would love it if Ryu just kept to a more mentor/side character role in DOA. The games are not about him, and it definitely cheapens the story having him there during all the major conflicts. Like I love Ryu, but he already has stories about him.
Ayane was always an anti-hero to me. Not an altruistic protagonist but not on the bad side, just has flaws that made her more likable to me.
Everything post Itagaki was ''wasted potential''
I honestly thought you were going to compare Ryu to Batman but Quan Chi does work better.
I think making Sonia and Irene the same person was done to better integrate the DOA and NG stories and also cut down on the number of women Ryu could be potentially shipped with since he already has Rachel, Momiji and Kasumi.
Ayane has basically been hit with "Knuckles the Echidna" syndrome in that she starts out as a tough rival but over time gets nerfed. But whereas this happened to Knuckles due to Sonic getting newer rivals it just seems like the writers ignoring much of Ayane's competence.
Looking forward to your video on Irene/Sonia if you make one. Rachel and Genshin from NG I think could also use one too.
I actually think it would have been better if they kept the original canon and had Ryu married to Irene from the beginning so as to kill any potential shipping.
The point of games with sex appeal like this is to have pervs doing imagine spots with the women anyways. So it would be prudent to avoid shipping as many of the girls as much as possible. This is why you don't see any of the Tekken women hooking up with anyone for the most part, and if they do they get axed (Jun, Christie).
Irene will always be Ryu's love for me. Since the 80s baby~!
At least Knuckles has seen some sort of renaissance as of last year. Sonic movie 2 is probably the best portrayal of the character in over a decade.
Best girl under used.
For real...Ayane is my favorite character and they butchered her
@Ayane you are weak
I'd love to see some Tekken characters covered on this series that would be amazing
Well, when it comes to Tekken, almost every character has a wasted plotential. So yeah.
5 is still the pinnacle of the series for me don't get me wrong I enjoyed 6 it just lacked a certain...magic that 5 had I don't know how to explain it 7 however was just disappointing live service trash I've never been more let down by a game than I was with Tekken 7 it was a heart breaker
Was just looking at the 407 DLC worth 2k Dollar that _"game"_ gathered after only one year...
Jesus...
@DIXIE CLEMETS What's funny is DOA was already one of the games that did that. DOA for PSX built on the arcade and saturn versions with remixed tracks, more stages and more costumes. DOA3 had a promotional disc that had some neat interviews and added additional costumes. DOA2U added a ton of costumes and some DOA3 characters.
We are now being charged for this and then some and then some more for shit we already used to get as part of the package. Fuck.
Oh! I swore it was it Wasted POtential not PLOTential, plotential is better anyway. Glad to see you talk about this series
I could've sworn the same exact thing so just know you're not alone
DOA went from a good fighting game series to just "Look at the boobs bounce."
DOA 6 story as a whole is a wasted plotential lol, but Marie, Honoka, Ayane and Raidou were the biggest offenders(how about a vid about it?)
@Joechef2001 Picon lol, tied with Jump Force
@@vilao9230 Marie, Honoka and Nico are not even characters at all; they are blatant service packs to the pedo tastes of Japan and the basement dwellers in the US. Which would be more acceptable if they were at least fucking honest about it. No, no, they tell us, they are actually 18 and legal. Totally not pedo bait they say. Lies. We all know it.
@@Ergeniz tbh honest you could say the same to every other female character in DOA(minus the pedo part lel) and the males don't even have that. idk if it's because I'm pissed with TN and KT, but the more I played DOA, the less I liked the characters. Now I think that DOA has the weakest roster of the FGC, the worst ones being Nyotengu and Diego (they're easily the laziest DOA characters). Leifang, Kokoro and Hitomi are runner ups. The first is annoying as hell, the second is boring and super ditzy to the point that isn't even funny(and with a long running melodrama), the third is just Bland at any way possible.
Raidou was brought back to enhance Honoka’s storyline. That was his entire purpose.
@@bradleyh4534 aaand didn't made any difference, there's still many things that we don't know about her lel
Can we except to see Honoka on this series at some point? What a waste she turned out to be. I already wasn't expecting that much and it STILL turned out worse than anticipated.
I would mention Marie too but I don't even know if she had potential in the first place because I still know nothing about who she is.
Ayane was better in the original run. Team Ninja is turning Ryu into a Gary Stu and it’s dumb.
PS: Ayane is best DOA girl, coming from a big Christie fan
I'd take it that Kasumi's next then, right? Team Ninja missed a lot of opportunities with her too.
She was fine until they retconned her in dimensions. DOA 6 put salt on the wound. He pretty much touched on it here but I wouldn't mind a video if he does.
Huh... this whole time I didn’t realize Ninja Gaiden and DOA is apart of the same universe.
FINALLY! I had issues with how they handled ayane as a character! They really squandered her character!
Holy shit, this series has been called 'Wasted PLOTential' the whole time. Just had Mandela effect moment when I heard him say it.
It's pretty clear the newer DoA games don't really care about insignificant stuff like story or characters they only care about how many DLC and micro transactions they can stuff into one game and also toning the sexiness way down which was like their one saving grace up until now.
It's weird. The sexiness has been toned down and the questionably aged characters have been aged up... But also, DOAX3 is the most fanservicey of all the spin-offs, and nearly every new character that's been introduced recently is just anime fetish pandering with no real plot relevance.
@@cherrycordiaI Like you said it's a spin-off. The Xtrem series is supposed to be just dump fun and over the top fan service. On the other hand DoA 6 literally put black underlays on everything that could be considered remotely sexy and don't get me even started at how they completely ruined skins like demon Rachel!
@@nikolasfaraday9934 Its like on one hand bringing back older costume sets is like appealing to fans and on the other putting black underlays is pandering to E-Sports. From what I understand DOA already has a pretty strong tournament scene, just not in the same level as EVO and to be honest I don't think Koei Tecmo should aim for that, be happy with what there is. DOA6 was really hampered by alot of decisions and there's only so much they can really do now. Hopefully if we see another game it'll be a fresh start and without any notion of pandering to bigger E-Sports scenes like EVO, who clearly don't have any interest in DOA anyways.
@@GinraiPrime666 KT really needs to listen to the community and bring back the stuff that made DoA great, like the story and the sexiness. If they keep chasing that fictional e-sport crowd, or try to please twitter outrage mods or worst of all continue with that horrendous monetization scheme any new DoA game is doomed to fail.
@@cherrycordiaI It really says a lot that Maire, Honoka and Nico are the most popular among Japanese players. What is it with the Japanese and these overly neotenous women? They are underage women no matter what the fucking bios say and everyone knows it.
People keep defending this shit, saying they are not pedos and don't like super young girls but we all have eyes and we know that is a lie.
i always liked ayane but it wasnt until she was comforted by her mother did i really fall in love with her. At the end of the day i think ayane fans just really want her and kasumi to be a real family because lets face it thats all ayane really wants.
She canonically can't beat a Jackie Chan knock-off? She defeated Obaba.
As well as 3 prototypes of GODS simultaneously on the Black Narwhal in NG3RE, but in DOA, Team Ninja nerfed her terribly.
Yeah, she beat the revived final boss of NGDS at age 15. This is a year later and she's somehow weaker.
I agree on the fact hayabusa is everywhere in DOAD. His intrusion against Raidou and Genra was too much 😒
I also never liked how ayane and hayate fight their enemy always together. I mean, i get they are both Mugen tenshin elite ninjas, but that devalues them as fighters, having to rely on each other to beat a strong enemy, while Kasumi and Ryu can do it just fine 😒
Yeah, i noticed those many slaps in DOAD 😂
DOA6 made Ayane really look like an idiot 😒
They made Christie competent for once, at the expense of Ayane falling into an evident trap 😒
And i hate how they removed Raidou immediatly, instead of having him come back in the future. Not to mention Ayane and Honoka's relationship being unexplored 😒
About Itagaki's vision of DOA5, he said something like: The Mugen Tenshin village gets attacked by DOATEC, apparently following an order from Miyako.
Kasumi finds an injured Ayane an she swears she'll kill Miyako. Or something like that
And kasumi and ayane would be working together to fend off DOATEC from the village! And there was some more but I'll link it when I find it!
Kasumi USED to be able to do it just fine until dimensions and later games retconned that.
So now in DOA1 she didn't actually beat Raidou herself, it was secretly Ryu there as well. Its as if Ryu is like, "Well there won't be any new Ninja Gaiden games in the near future so I'll just take control of DOA now".
@@Ergeniz ikr 😒
I mean, at least in DOA1 he just throws a kunai, instead of being directly involved in the fight, like with Genra 😒
However, Kasumi still has her final showdown against the last Alpha clone in DOA5. That's something 👍
Unlike Ayane and Hayate who had, again, to fight together 😒
As much as i love Ayane,i think its mostly because of her design and her fighting style. Her story is very mismanaged and really poorly executed in alot of ways
Ain't that the truth.
I wouldn't have an issue with Hayabusa being everywhere if they made it seem like the four ninjas being good friends rather than him just being their sage. Hayabusa slapping Kasumi, berating Hayate, and hardly acknowledging Ayane just made him really unlikeable for me in Dimensions. Especially since he seems so much nicer to outsiders in NG3.
Lol and she still has the better character development.
So Ayane used to be an interesting character with a good arc. but the developpers had no idea about what to do with her, so they gradually turned into a fucking immature tsundere.
yes
Dont forget, Ayane went to Fatal Frame V.
Ayane will kill Kasumi in DOA2 if you meet the right conditions
Indeed.
Isn't it when you do Ayane's spin attack move? Kicking her away really far to k.o Kasumi?
I forgot-
@@PinkCheshire001 General distance in the lower part of the arena.
@@The4thSnake oh yeah! I never really noticed it :o i would just do the move then it'd happen
Pfft...Some sister...
(Before you say anything, yes, I am aware of her upbringing that would cause her to behave like that, but I still hate siblings killing each other, for personal reasons.)
Ninja XJ9 getting the Sindel treatment, I see.
You should do a video on Havik and Hotaru. We never got to see their rivalry, which is a real shame. The Chaos and Order realms on the whole have been underutilized.
I get the feeling that were only created to make the world you explored in Deception larger. They had no the real long term plans for either of them.
@@almightycinder that honestly sounds sad.
Ayane is what I look for a girl from Japan. Honestly, I don't expect her to be a ninja but I like a girl with fire!
who says this lmao
the people who think the series took a nosedive into waste has never heard of MK11 aftermath
I don't think it's actually commonly known that Genra was brainwashed.
We're getting all kinds of "they were evil all along" amid some of these retellings
Ayane was my favourite but I dropped the series after 3, tried 4 later which was bad, and then never returned because I have no interest in DLCoA5 and 6. Best will always be DoA Hardcore to me.
Well damn I love DOA but I never even noticed how irrelevant they made Ayane to be. I just thought that they were just retelling the whole story how it was always meant to be I never realize that things have changed. And I never even noticed that they made Ryu into Batman basically just interjecting and stealing the spotlight from other important characters 🤦🏾♂️
Itagaki is an easy guy to make fun of... but damn this really shows how better he is than what people give him credit for.
Problem is that cannonically she was broken AF the only ninja on mugen tenshin who actually has contributed in saving the world from demon kings, crazy cults, etc etc.
My headcannon Is that itagaki's versión of her Is what has been happening until DOA 5 where... Yeah, she's cocky, but i like that cockiness i take It as something she got from her father...
And the fact that now, even if she's a ninja, she has been falling in love with the modern era Style... (When she's not seen, or when she's not in ninja buisness, she's buying cute clothes, going to Spa's, and she even got a pretty cute smartphone, probably not even Hayate knows her hobbies)
I also love the fact that she's disrespectful with everyone EXCEPT Ryu and Hayate the only two people in the world she seems to respect, and the only two people she thinks are worth risking her life/dying for.
She has had more costumes than Kasumi, more swimsuits, and her hobby is beauty treatment, I always felt she was very more modern and fashionable so it is a cute and good idea.
Dead or Alive seriously needs another reboot or maybe a beat'em up that recaps DOA1-6 but only through Ayane's perspective, maybe even how she tries to watch over Honoka, and have an actual writer on board than the some of the staff who making skimpy DLC costumes.
This is sadly true. I returned DOA6 (even after getting it for $15) it was a shit game! I sold Doa 4 for I don't even how little. The original game deveolper knew what to do with his characters. He made them respectable. Now i ashamed to even look at this game series because of how far downhill it keeps going.
It's sad what they did with the story. Ayane befriended Honoka and Marie because this three are the most popular Doa characters in Japan. Hell, Ayane even has chances to be playable in Smash Bros Ultimate. Since she is a playable character in Fatal Frame 5 and Ninja Gaiden's series.
Strangely enough (and I don't know how), Ayane is a DLC playable character in Senran Kagura: Estival Versus.
Thanks for showing some love to DOA
I've always seen DOAD as a one giant recon meant to reintroduce and clear/clean up things that may not have been explained. Some of it I appreciated but The post Itagaki Team Ninja is really trying to Keep the Classic DOA story while trying to tell their own.
Wait until they make Ryu Hayabusa the mastermind behind Ayane and kasumi's rivalry.
Actually the weirdest thing is Ryu is essentially a GUEST character coming from another series (yes the games share ties closely with each other like Street Fighter and Final Fight but here it is way more over the top).
You're taking let's say LINK in Soul Calibur 2 and having him be the incredible hero that sorts out everything in that series!
All I can say DOA Dimensions NEVER happened even if you tell me it's canon IT'S NOT!
She's still my favorite DOA character, damn Tecmo and Team Ninja had a hard on for Hayate/Ein and Ryu Hayabusa on those days. They down played her and still repeat the same stuff in the older games instead of moving forward. Also irony she's the female character that had the most crossover in other games because she's Team Ninja's waifu as I heard before in an interview in DOA1 where they made her as a playable character.
Too bad Tomonobu Itagaki is not with the series anymore, but instead it's being handled with no heart or respect, it's like they don't know what hell to do with it anymore.
Jose Urbina i lost interest after 3/4. 2 and 3 will forever be my favourites. Series is ruined, made now for pervs and incels. This series along with soul blade and soul cal 1 got me into the fgc. Its so frustrating that they dont even try or push toward evo or anything outside of nonsey costumes 🤦🏾♂️
@@CrowBag At this point, it'll probably fade away like Virtua Fighter, even though I don't play DOA but I respect it just like every Fighting Games out there.
@@joseurbina3835 As a game in terms of mechanics, the games are still as good as ever. They've just lost their direction in terms of story and not really knowing where to go it seems. With Nioh it seems like they've gotten an idea and possibly what we might see later on with Ninja Gaiden, DOA needs some revitalization in terms of its story and ultimately where it should go. Flesh out the characters we have before adding more to the fray would be a start.
Reminder that Tecmo says they will never release a game on PC again if mods happen. Probably because it goes against their dlc costumes
@@dc7981 Mods have already happened. You know people will go for nudes. I know people will go for nudes. Tecmo knows people will go for nudes. We all know. There's no way anyone could NOT know.
Thanks for this video mr Snake 🐍 can’t wait for the next one ❤️
DOA6 is in itself is Wasted Potential.
Probably an unpopular opinion at this point, but DOA's never really had all that good of plotlines. It was best when not taken seriously, and Ayane symbolizes my problem with Itagaki's attempts at making cliches seem like it's all of a sudden groundbreaking.
I have to admit I always wondered how DOA went from a rather simple revenge story to labs that clone people. Doesn't really sound like a cohesive narrative
@Naquin Green The only thing I can say about Street Fighter is that atleast they stuck to their timeline by making sure that SFIV and SFV take place before SF3...But also sort of fucked up Alpha 3's storyline by making Nash's Alpha 2 ending canon which makes Guile's formerly canon Alpha 3 route non canon [which is a bummer considering up until that needless retcon that Ryu, Cammy and Guile were considered the main characters of Alpha 3 with Ryu's story happening first, Cammy's happening second then Guile's happening last]
Bruh, Tekken is arguably as bad as Mortal Kombat in terms of story. You have
-Heihachi constantly being retconned and rewritten as Harada tries to make him a sympathetic character which falls flat because he tried to murder his own son twice, shot Jin Kazama in the end, condemned his own father to death, and had numerous crimes to his name. I have heard the argument that Heihachi is a anti hero and that he is not supposed to be good nor evil...The problem with this is that while Heihachi considers his actions to be the right thing, from a objective point of view his actions are rather sinister. Even in Tekken 3 when he achieved world peace that didn't prevent him from trying to take Ogre's power for himself in a opportunistic power grab. Tekken 7 tries to write him as some extremist who kills Devils, but that would only be true if he tried to kill Kazuya after he survived being thrown off a cliff; He wouldn't have adopted another son to motivate Kazuya. You see Heihachi always wanted a strong son who he could manipulate to further his own agenda. However he underestimated Kazuya and only decided to kill him when he proved too strong for him to control. He does something similar in using Jin as his puppet when he uses him as bait to lure out ogre in Tekken 3, however he also underestimated how strong Jin's conviction and desire for revenge was.
-Kazumi Mishima herself as a retcon to serve as yet another retcon to Kazuya's backstory and somehow motivate kid Kazuya to try to motivate him in enacting revenge against his father making him less of a unfortunate victim of Heihachi's cruel parenting. Besides, his Tekken 5 story shows his grandfather Jinpachi was the only one who was nice to him to the point that Heihachi felt he was being too soft on Kazuya. Kazuya even shows that he isn't a totally heartless killer by backing out of the tournament before he could face Jinpachi showing he still has some compassion for his grandfather. Kazumi's plan also makes no sense because if she wanted to kill Heihachi she could have NOT had a kid with him....but Kazumi herself is a underutilized character so she receives less screentime in comparison to a No Name Narrator who adds to the story and who's voice acting is atrocious.
-Tekken 4-7 takes place in the span of a single year and thus has inconsistencies in the character bios. For example, Lili is stated as Asuka's rival "for years" even though they first met in Tekken 5. Wtf? Heihachi's t6 bio says that by the time he woke up, the tournament was already over...Yet Raven's T6 bio confirms his story mode encounter with Heihachi did happen. Lars says that Heihachi wanted to test to see if he had the Devil Gene in T7 but in T6 Heihachi had no fricking clue who Lars was. They don't even pay attention to their own character stories.
-Don't get me started on the character assassination of Jin Kazama in Tekken 6. He had been consistently written as different from the Mishima's and being above the hatred and pointless family feud of the Mishima clan and being the one "Good" Mishima blood relative, yet Tekken 6 takes a massive dump on this and turns him into Kazuya 2.0 in a lazy rehash of Tekken 2's plot complete with Jin wearing a similar suit that Kazuya wore in Tekken 2. Its hard to view Jin as a "good guy" anymore when he is a war criminal who started a world war and ended up with the deaths of millions on his hands, but it's somehow okay because he is sorry and wants to defeat Kazuya? WTF is even the point of his canon Tekken 4 ending where he is about to kill Heihachi but sees a apparition of his mother Jun at the last minute, lets Heihachi go and then flies off. At one point, Jin was considered the main character of the Tekken series and despite being a important character, he is comatose in Tekken 7.
- Not to mention that they clearly have no clue what to do with the characters for the most part. Tekken 7's story mode is okay if you are fans of the Mishimas, but if you don't give a shit about the same fucking Mishima feud story that has been around for the entire series, then you're pretty much shit out of luck. If you like King, Paul, Marduk, Eddy Gordo, Miguel....Then you're given a rather lackluster character stories with no effort put into them.
Only Soulcalibur, DOA, and arguably Street Fighter have more consistent storylines than Mortal Kombat. Tekken is almost as bad as Mortal Kombat in terms of retcons, plot holes and contradictions
@Naquin Green I do agree that a Soul Calibur 6 type reboot could work, as it could especially reestablish some characters like Paul Phoenix who was originally Kazuya's rival as he was the only character to fight him to a tie. He always sought a rematch against Kazuya but never got it. He is also the only character in Tekken to have a consistent winning record against the Mishimas as canon wise, Paul has defeated Heihachi and Jin in the third tournament before defeating Ogre. Nowadays, he is just a comic relief pathetic joke character and its easy to forget that Paul used to be Kazuya's rival who was the main character before Jin was born.
@Naquin Green Tekken 1-4 for the most part had characters have mostly serious endings that were canon and usually had a vague presentation that made them interesting. Even the characters in Tekken who were deemed side characters had reasonable story arcs and conclusions even before the time skip from Tekken 2 to 3
Marshall Law in T1 fights to a draw against Wang Jinrei who was looking for someone to stop Heihachi's corruption. Even though he lost, Law still gets his happy ending after Yoshimitsu defeats a corrupt sumo in Ganryu and takes his money giving it to the Law family since Yoshimitsu is at heart a Robin Hood type character. In T2, his dojo students are assaulted and brutally injured by Baek who had either been motivated by jealousy or was blackmailed by Kazuya into doing the dirty deeds. Canon wise, Law beat the shit out of Baek and was close to killing him but learned to forgive him.
Michelle Chang's story arc for the first two Tekken games revolved around her pendant. Kunimitsu tries to steal it from her in T1 but Michelle beats her. In T2, her mother is abducted by Kazuya because Kazuya thinks her pendant has a secret, so she beats the shit out of Ganryu who knows where her mother is given that he is working for Kazuya [and it was implied Ganryu had abducted her]. In her ending after rescuing her mother, Michelle decides to throw her pendant into the lake since it caused her so much trouble.
Yoshimitsu's T2 story has him deal with two problems. He has a new prosthetic arm thanks to Dr Bosconovitch, but he had been captured by the Mishima Zaibatsu; At the same time he also has to duel with Kunimitsu who has been wanting to slay her former master so she can steal his sword. In his T2 ending, he is successful in rescuing Dr Bosconovitch. Its also implied that Yoshimitsu killed his former pupil given that Kunimitsu hasn't appeared in a canon Tekken game since Tekken 2.
Tekken 3 showed that Anna Williams may have had a sibling rivalry with Nina but that she still cared about her sister enough to be in cryosleep with her for 15 or so years and that when she woke up, she was distressed to see that Nina didn't even remember her so she wanted to help her. Her T3 ending shows this ending badly when Nina slaps her which atleast makes Anna satisfied that she remembers her.
Also Tekken 4...while I hated the attempt to make Devil less of a supernatural entity and more sciencey with the Devil Gene....It atleast had a rather serious and gritty story with mostly serious endings and almost no joke endings to speak of. Pauls ending for one was decent despite being non canon, Bryan left some intrigue since his T4 story basically left him with only 2 months left to live and him being desperate to prove something despite being on deaths door. You had Nina Williams about to assassinate a target only to find out the target is her biological son so she shoots at his attackers so he can escape [which is undermined by T7 where Nina doesn't seem to give a shit about her own son Steve]. Who Steve's father is left a mystery.
Compare and contrast to Tekken 5 in which a majority of characters endings are not only joke endings, but have no possibility of being canon whereas in Tekken 2 and 3 even if a character didn't win the tournament, there was a good chance their ending was canon since it require them to win the tournament. Not only do we have dumb stuff like Jin exactly falling face first into Asuka's boobs, Lee humiliating Heihachi by having him dress in a speedo, but also Bryan and Yoshimitsu's endings where they kill each other and Law's admittedly hilarious ending with Paul in T5 which started the unfunny trend of Law being constantly broke and unable to pay his son Forrest Law's medical bills.
I love Ryu but he would never treat his fellow comrades like that. He has a heart, y'know? Something Team Ninja doesn't have
I would love a Ninja Gaiden 4 with more focus on Ayane and Kasumi. It’s been way too long since NG3:RE
I might prefer it a spin off game with just them, with Ryu, Hayate, or something as a bonus character. Keep Ninja Gaiden 4 Ryu but have them be unlockable bonus characters. That would be cool. I have read recently they are going to do another one.
ThatOneDudeWhoIsn'tInTheSameRoomAsYou Thier Costumes in Nioh 2 would be awesome! With the new Charakter creator you could build the whole DOA cast and Ryu‘s signature move was already in Nioh 1 :D I really hope they make another Gaiden after that
@@MrSexy-hn9oz I'm betting the mod community will have that done quick after release. I could also see that being dlc.
ThatOneDudeWhoIsn'tInTheSameRoomAsYou mods save everything and make it 10.000 times better. (That’s why I got 1000h in Garry’s mod)
Would be cool instead of them being background characters in Ninja Gaiden.
DOAD Ayane gave me such Sakura from Naruto vibes . Like she used to be such a badass 😭
I'm not familiar with dead or alive the third one was the first one I remember having for a brief period of time.
And I remember playing her in story mode her the ending really got to me it was sad and very well done I love the music and her story.
She had to beat her father but that wasn't the father the she knew her father was corrupted and brainwash and he became an evil puppet.
She had to kill him out of love to free him because he was just an empty shell basically a Slave.
You can see the tears coming down Her knowing that her father is destroyed tears running down her face.
Then the music picks up love it.
When Itagaki-san left it was the end of this series for me, the story just went down hill. Ayane losing to Nico in Doa6 was nonsense. Irene Lew was described as brave and gutsy under her rebooted alias Sonia, Its unfortunate she isnt playable.
While I liked Dimensions being a compilation of all the previous games at the time, they did my favourite character dirty and I can't abide that. Great work, mate.
The game series was just that wasted potential.
Yeah I still remembered her ending very well in DOA3.
It's one of my Favorites that I still remember since I first saw it in 2004.
And now........
Yeah I always felt something was off in Dimensions. But then 5 gave her a catchphrase Traitor. And 6.......
Got damn it.
As if the game didn't already have enough problems.
You'll probably disagree with me on this one 4th snake but.
Compared to this, I prefer Tekken7 Story. ESPECIALLY THE ENDING! That still gets me HYPE.
I think it doesn't go too far to say that we can all agree that the teen Ninja up today just doesn't know what to do with DOA, Ninja Gaiden or their characters
DoA Dimensions does NOT exist for me. DoA actually had a semi-interesting story that I was following, and it ruined it. Will always love my favorite purple-haired spinning ninja.
The only people who didn’t mess up the remake were soulcalibur, tekken did pretty well too ig
i love it when u talk about doa
Playing Dead o Alive Dimension : YES TOEI TECH WE GET IT, RYU HAYABUSA EXIST IN THE SAME WORLD AS DEAD OR ALIVE, YOU DON'T HAVE To SHOVE IT DOWN OUR THROATS
I've been waiting for this one
I echo your sentiment about DOA dimensions. It fucked up a ton of plot points that had actually been quite fine. DOA actually had a solid story up until this point. Whoever headed the storyboard on dimensions was pretty insistent on shilling hayate and hayabusha; remember Hayate had been overshadowed by his sisters canonically. Raidou had kicked his ass, only to have Kasumi avenge him. In the second game, Ryu beat tengu and Ayane beat Genra. As of dimensions, it turns out Kasumi actually had to be helped by Ryu so she can't do shit on her own. Genra is retconned to be an asshole and it turns out that Hayate was as strong as Ryu all along despite his feats not being consistent with that. Then we get into the absurd time frame these games take place in, which is like in the scope of a YEAR. Its just a shit show.
As usual I agree with your rewrite of Ayane but even with the original canon her purple hair always bothered me. Yes I know, 'animu style'. However, I think a better way would have been to make her hair color dyed. She could have originally been brunette like the rest of her siblings, but due to being ostracized she began to change her hair color as an method by which to assert her agency and own her ostracizing from the rest of the village. It would be completely in character as well since she's a bit of a fashionista, probably second to the likes of Tina or Helena.
Keeping Hayate a bit of a jobber also had potential of its own. He could have undergone growth as a character due to his realization his sisters and Hayabusha outstripped him. After regaining his memories following his Ein persona his subsequent appearances could explore that and becoming stronger. Perhaps focusing on his resentment at despite being the popular pretty boy that makes not only Hitomi but his sisters wet, he would angst about whether he is fit to lead and not simply there due to Nepotism (which, well he is). Instead he's just a static asshat of a character that doesn't appear to give much a shit about Kasumi at all, despite her going out on a limb for him. Speaking of which, what is it with the incest shit? Fatal Frame did it as well. Is that a trope Tecmo has accepted now?
So many wasted potentials here. Lei Fang and Hitomi are just horny for Jann Lee and Hayate, Zack is a complete joke, etc. Zack could be a total subversion instead of the 'clowish black guy' archetype. Actually he sort of was in the first game, when Jann Lee considered him a rival. He could be the 'obfuscating stupidity' type where he merely ACTS silly to throw people off and get them to let their guards down. However, in reality he is a hard trained street fighter and martial artist. Still ultimately good natured and money/fame hungry but dangerously cunning and more competent than people give him credit for. Now his zaniness has been shilled to Chris Tucker levels and even the stoic ninjas can't stand being in the same room as him.
I think Ayane's hair IS supposed to be dyed because her eyebrows are a similar copper colour to Kasumi's hair.
Remember when Zack swooped in to save Helena in DOA4 and earned a spot as one of her primary allies?
@@The4thSnake I initially thought that as well but it would seem unlikely as ayane's hair is the same color even in the DOA2U opening scene as a child. Additionally the two are in the water and the hair is not affected. Finally, remember she is poverty ridden at that point. Changing her hair color would be the least of her priorities.
Yes, I know Zack got a smidge of respect with helena but it was a step forward and three steps back. He's still a total jobber and a complete joke. Only helena tolerates him, Jann Lee has long since dropped him as a rival and threat, everyone else doesn't even want to be on the same helicopter as him because he's too fucking annoying. He loses to Mila, who imo he has no business losing to considering his experience and Tina regularly makes him her whipping boy.
yeah. i gotta' agree. like the big build up of the 'reveal' that honoka is ayane's sister is lackluster at best, and knowing the raido just takes what he wants i'm not sure why ayane had such a breakdown to whine about it cuz she's related to this ditzy loser. (yes, i called honoka a ditzy loser) even though i only hopped onto doa through doa five i do agree the story mode in 6 was not handled very well and wish it had been done better.
I never thought of dimensions as canon tbh
Dead or alive hasn't been the same since Itagaki left. 💔
Wasted potential indeed, and they really need to turn away from the incest.
I must not have been paying attention, because I haven't seen any incest!
Let's just say post 3 and dimensions: Ayane's relationship with Hayate gets weirder subtext
@@T4751001 oh! I need to rewatch the story!
this was just as enlightening as confusing, but great video.
I haven't played the Dead Or Alive games between DOA3 & D0A5 because I never got an XBOX 360.
I forgot that Irine made an appearance in the 3D Ninja Gaiden 2.
I thought it more like they were making Hayabusa into a Goku
Damn this has to be one of the most underrated characters ever
Her arc from DOA2 to DOA3 was so DRASTIC Almost like a "subvert audience expectations" decision..
Ayane was introduced as a typical "DOA Babe" and "Killer Kunochi" in DOA2 but then in DOA3, you have to realize that she is such a deep and human like character with fears and remorse, damn i was blown away back then!
DOA3 was really the GREATEST DOA of all time, not only cause of Ayane but the fighting engine in generell! One can only imagine how Ayanes story would have went on under different circumstances.. Thank you so much for this video, have a good day sir!
This series continues past Mortal Kombat! Epic.
I like Ayane as a character
It's also kinda crazy because as a Ninja Gaiden fan shes always shown as dutiful and stoic, yet here shes impulsive and a bit of a loose cannon
Ayane...I don't like talking about her. She is not my least favorite character in DOA, but she's close. Sibling rivalries are usually a huge hit or miss for me. Something like Undertaker and Kane are epic stories despite it just being just wrestling stories. Ragna and Jin however kept on getting me off of Blazblue due to how cringe Jin is.
Although I didn't think of it at the time, 4thSnake reminded me how cringe the Sub-Zero brothers were. I feel Akame and Kurome is the only one I feel would be in between the middle. I hate the fact that those two who loved each other would wish death on each other, but at the same time, the anime showed their final showdown in the most tasteful and tragically beautiful way possible. Which I commend. Even if they mean to kill each other, they still love each other.
I guess I expect something like that for Ayane. Showing she does regret being a bitch to Kasumi despite Kasumi did nothing to her directly. She has reasons to be angry, but I just felt like they could have done better to do that. Even in Dead or Alive 2 made Ayane being a bitch to Helena for no good reason.
Don't get me wrong, her story in Dead or Alive 3 was beautifully done, and DO4 could have made Ayane a better character as a result. I felt DOA5 was the story that would make me think I will never like Ayane. They are more interested in Ayane's troupe than her character.
People say Kasumi and Ayane made up in DOA5, but I just didn't felt anything from that. I know fighting games back then couldn't bring a very complex scenes without making things dull. But DOA5's story is basically a full length movie. They could make Ayane rethink her decisions, and if you must kill the poor Clone Kasumi (I'm thinking about naming her Closumi.) have Ayane feel horrible about it. Have her do poorly after the deed, have her depression be the cause of her having Hayate captured, and she would do worse as a result. Then when the real Kasumi show up, this would be the moment Ayane be in shock, awe, and actually show happiness to see her elder sister alive.
I know a lot of people are used to Ayane being a know it all bitch, but I am just not a fan. This moment should change Ayane. I mean if even Netherrealm studios changed Scorpion to be more than just a fat headed ninja who cares only for revenge, why can't they make Ayane actually grow the fuck up, and actually make it believable?
Sorry if I sounded harsh, but that's how I really feel about this.
You missed the Williams Sisters of Tekken. Tbh their sibling rivalry is actually funny. They have layers under to it and their rivalry wasn't as serious early on. Anna clearly just wanted the recognition of Nina and to troll her did everything to be on the enemy side of Nina. Although they care about each other and even help each other.. So their story might be a little better handled
@@gerison320 I remember Anna trying to help Nina in 3 and 5 but when has Nina ever helped Anna?
@@gerison320 I completely forgot about those two. They really didn't matter to me. (Although I did thought of an interesting plot for them in my Tekken fanfic.)
@@DynomiteX246 Tekken 7 has Anna attempting to marry a mob boss and Nina killing him in an assassination. Hence their different default costumes in T7. Not sure if the hit by Nina was a simple job, trying to spite her sister or both. Its worth noting Anna has a special intro line against Nina but the latter does not, hinting it may have been a 'It was just Tuesday for me' sort of deal.
DOA 6 is a mistake
Yes. Yes it is.
@Naquin Green I couldn't agree with you more. Shimbori and Hayashi destroyed DOA and NG with their take of the story and the story writing was, in every sense of the word, shit.
A 4thsnake video? Aww you do care
This franchise has no heart anymore, they just keep dropping games as long someone keeps buying them, if it stops being profitable they will just bury it.
I don't know a single thing about Dead or Alive, I just like playing Ayane in Ninja Gaiden 3 RE
DOA story is so deep... 🥴
Your videos are brilliant... have you considered one of these for Force unleashed?
I could probably come up with something for TFU2.
@@The4thSnake I'd be down for that. Incidentally: Get a job writing for everyone. They need you.
I never played dimensions. I had no idea this retcon exists.
I'm gonna go back to acting like it didn't happen
9:41 Did DoA just fucking reference an 2018 meme?
Doa is like all the worst parts of anime.
Could you possibly do the same for Helena Douglas of the same series too?
I'll just leave my work-in-progress here.
docs.google.com/document/d/1Ln6tSrvRDIeEsOq704tWAIpt0atCe3Eq-Y6QiaNiIlo/edit?usp=drivesdk
I decided to start working on this simply because Dimensions' storytelling was such a goddamn dumpster fire as well as my first introduction to the DoA storyline.
Also, feedback is welcomed.
I didnt know they fucked up this series. I played up to 3.
Ayane isn't really wasted potential.
Phase 4, on the other hand…
Ninja Gaiden is better than Dead or alive
I just pretend Dimensions never happened. I never even played it and had no idea that Doa 1-4 was supposedly retcpnned.
I think that Hayate's potential was wasted even worse and never got spotlight I wish he had more characterization after doa 2
What's even worse is that he couldn't take his revenge from raidou alone in doa 6
!!AYANE!!!
YEAH!