The question of how Oryx’s body ended up on Titan is explained in the lore for the Royal Chase scout rifle from Season of the Hunt. It says that Oryx’s body was being monitored until Titan disappeared and created a gravitational anomaly, pulling Oryx in.
@@ringomandingo1015 Huh, you’d think more players would’ve noticed that piece of lore with how often Royal Chase drops from vendors randomly, and in Trials of the Nine.
I think Chalco's reaction to Fenchurch asking if they were the first to visit Oryx's body is because she had already told them they were the only extant team, meaning he showed signs of memory loss, evidence of the effects they were told to look out for.
I honestly think Chalco’s the one who’s compromised… She has been reacting strange throughout the whole armor lore pages since they descended into the deep. She only seemed normal when giving out the talismans. Fenchurch had a talisman, Lisben too, it was never said that Chalco had one though !
@@_elitenightmare4794 I feel like the other two would notice if she didn't have one but since theres no indication in either directions we really don't know.
@@_elitenightmare4794 I personally dont think anyone is compromised, i do genuinely see it as a potential intentional misdirection to make ppl start having suspicions for it to go nowhere with those character. And it’s just there to hint at something in the future instead
"NEV-000" could be "Neptune Entity Veil". I feel like its definitely referring to the Veil given the linking thread of mental influence and memories. Plus the Veil being unnervingly biological
@@squadass99 I think you're half-right. New logs about the Veil indicate a strange influence on the mind. Veil is going to have something to do with the mind.
@@ChaosTheory0 It absolutely does have something to do with the mind, it's exciting to start seeing all the pieces come together about the veil. almost tempting to look through the datamines for answers but i'm remaining strong to see it paly out in game.
Oryx's return is certainly inevitable. Savathûn predicted he would come back, and while we may have stopped the Lucent Brood from bringing him back, it's still possible. Until we destroy his remains totally, we will risk his return. Also, it sounds like Chalco may be compromised.
considering we've beat him, and more powerful beings than him, i think we'd be just fine beatnig oryx again. at this point he's not the biggest and baddest threat we've killed
@@ready1player31 We may have killed him but he still caused immense damages and traumas. Also, an Oryx with the Light would probably be at a whole other level of power than what we fought until then.
Its worth noting that Savathun didn't predict he would come back, it was part of 2 truths 2 lies. The options were as follows: 1) Mercury, Io, Titan were owned by Savathun 2) The Witness returned Mars to your solar system 3) The Power to move worlds with soon be yours 4) The Taken King will rise again We know 2 is true, and 3 could be referring to the planets encounter (though its hard to tell how much raid mechanics play into this). I also think its important to recognize that Savathun did not say Oryx, she said the Taken King, which could even imply a successor to Oryx rather then himself.
I've seen it mentioned a few times and I really like the idea of oryx "the navigator" being how we enter the traveler. I think that'd be an awesome tie in to his name.
Honestly having Savathun and Oryx as Lucent Hive Lightbearers/Guardians could be very interesting. It may be that in order to defeat the Witness and Xivu Arath, Savathun and Oryx may need to be resurrected. Theres a trope called the "Godzilla Threshold", which in short is the narrative convention where things are so bad, desperate, or otherwise unwinnable that measures unthinkable must be taken. It would also be interesting to see the Hive Gods speak to each other in-game. EDIT: It may be possible that a resurrected Oryx, the Navigator, may be our key into the Traveller. A being touched by the light and darkness and possessing similar properties to the Veil may be what we need to pass through the portal created by the Witness.
I agree. In addition, to my knowledge Oryx is the ONLY entity to have actually spoken face to face with the Witness, outside of the disciples. That in and of itself could be valuable information.
I just had the craziest idea on how Cayde is back in the Final Shape. Nightmares are a product of darkness and Ikora is unlikely to study how to wield darkness based powers herself being the Warlock Vanguard. But Ikora's specific Nightmare is Cayde and Nezerac's conciousness/Power became concentrated near the Veil; Likely due to Osiris being there. What if Ikora goes to Neomuna to visit Osiris and inspect the Veil herself. Only when she gets too close to the Veil Nightmare Cayde appears from her shadow making the Light/Dark Connection and transporting them both to the other side of the portal. Which in turn, much like weapon crafting, makes the Nightmare of Cayde into a physical copy of Ikora's memory of Cayde. Ikora is very perceptive and knew Cayde very well, even the parts of himself he would hide from most others. She would know him almost as well as he knew himself. The Dark makes the form and memory while the Light makes the physical body from the form for the memories to inhabit. Even recreating The Ace of Spades, a gun closely associated with Cayde's former life's Son. Now my only question; Is the Light cracked Ace of Spades the latest Sentient Weapon containing the actual Ace? That would be pretty messed up and dark, so perhaps it contains Cayde instead and would be a Darkness made duplicate of the original but blessed and imbued with Caydes Light (As in his entire life as a Guardian). Sort of a cross between the Travellers chosen and the Wormlauncher...
@@soulsurvivor8293 I’m not sure about this theory, Ikora seemed to talk to Cayde like he was the actual CAYDE-6, because she said “You’ve missed a lot”. Meaning she is referring to the actual cayde missing what has happened after his death. Plus, if Cayde became a memory like shape after Ikora being transported, he would look like the Memories of Uldren or Ghaul at the end of Season of the Haunted, and not like a with pure light imbued Guardian. So I doubt this theory.
You explained the "Godzilla Threshold" and my mind jumped to Dame Judi Dench in the second Riddick film (technically the first film that carries the name "Riddick" on the box) saying "In normal times, evil would be fought by good. But in times like these, well... it should be fought by another kind of evil." Attached a video with the voice line I'm talking about ua-cam.com/video/rrtpOVTX5NA/v-deo.html
I just love how you can tell nuances in Hidden code. TKO-300 is Taken King Oryx, but the 300 was probably chosen because thanks to the World Grave we found back in D1 (which was effectively a super dense Hive library of knowledge), the Vanguard and by extension the Hidden knew about not just Oryx, but also his siblings and the powers/domains of all 3. It's my guess that the 0's are placeholders and the 3 represents how many beings there are in that category. The position of the 3 seems to indicate the order in which we've encountered these beings (i.e. TKO-300 being Oryx Taken King first of 3 Hive God-siblings, WQS-030 is Witch Queen Savathun second of 3 Hive God-siblings and WGX-003 is War God Xivu third of 3 Hive God-siblings), which would be a huge coincidence if these codes were created by the Hidden back when we were still fighting Crota. Of course from an IRL perspective, it makes sense because the codes do appear to be in order of encounter. Being able to dissect these codes and figure them out so totally is something I love. I'm gonna need to dive into Hidden lore and identifier codes properly.
From a lore standpoint, they were probably labeled like that to indicate the age. Aurash was the Oldest and Xi Ro was the youngest putting Sathona in the middle
Calling it now: I think Oryx will be turned into some means to get through the gate on the Traveler. The Navigator will rise and show us the path. The Veil needed to be linked via a source of Light to open the portal - Oryx is giving out "veil like" energy, so we use him as a medium to establish a second link to pass through safely. Or perhaps it's worse than that... Perhaps the only way to get through the gate, is to be Taken there... and Sloane has shown us that yes, Guardians can be Taken. We are in so much trouble.
THAT'S WHY ONLY IKORA IS IN THE TRAILER, it is a secret operation of the hidden, so it makes a LOT of sense of why zavala and other guardians aren't there.
You might be onto something, Sloane had said that when she got infected by the taken to have access to their intel, the light from her ghost and herself was TEMPORARILY holding the infection off. However, we as a guardian do not only have light inside of us, as Stasis for example is a product of our Guardian’s Darkness and our Ghosts Light. And Strand being visible to us is for the exact same reason. Due to this Darkness inside us, we might be prone to being taken, but can resist it’s dominating influence, thus giving us the power to enter the traveler. Ikora’s rage, sadness, and despair over Cayde might be her version of the Darkness inside her being able to fend off the Taken, and wherever she is in that teaser, might’ve cured the Taken infection, as Cayde is shown CLEARLY with PURE LIGHT in his eyes, body and Ace of Spades. Ikora may not have been able to indulge in such Light due to the taken infection and darkness also acting as a buffer.
Maybe the creature in Titans depths is a distraction and Oryx is actually the enemy of the Witness on Titan, as upon his return he becomes Lucent and helps to fight the Witness with Savathun, using the Taken against the Witness on some way.
This is frankly terrifying, and I understand how scared Ikora is. Oryx was one of the worst things to happen to the Last City after the shitshow that Crota caused on Luna. Worse, Oryx seemed unstoppable because he had access to a whole ARMY of potential recruits. Plenty of Cabal, Fallen, and even Vex to corrupt and make into his personal soldiers. His legacy still haunts us through his sisters. And now we're faced with the possibility that he just very well come back. I'm not sure which scares me more, than he might resurrect or that he'll come back as a LUCENT HIVE. He was scary all by himself. I think I speak for everyone that NOBODY wants to deal with him when he has the Light.
@@lukethepotatoking keep in mind, when resurrected with the light you lose your memories. Even savathun forgot her plans before we helped her remember
Is it possible that touch of malice is keeping the body alive somehow? I'm just taking the concept that Oryx had about the gun granting him immortaily more litteral.
We (The Guardian) and Oryx share an interesting dynamic together every since that fateful meeting, its amazing how our Legend began with Oryx and it was where his legendary invincibility came to an end. Crota put us on the map, but defeating Oryx is where we truly became legends. Fates forever intertwined, Us and only Us should have been able to Mantle his throne and powers.
@@ZLunare ppl during d1 didn't know shit. Ever review talking about the end boss fight simply went "you shoot this black thing and that's the" story " guys destiny sucks and they didn't deliver on any story"
I mean the reason why sevu arath is so mad at us is because we didn’t follow the sword logic and take oryx’s place after beating him, I think it’s found in the dungeon dialogue itself, so we kinda have to
The fact that Oryx's body is 100% not dead, and still retaining information, is terrifying. Arguably the strongest enemy we've faced, is now a ticking time bomb just waiting to come back. If anyone besides the original fireteam and the Hidden find this out, it's going to be chaos for everybody.
@@memecrider3585 Oryx killed a worm God, as far as scaling goes we know Rhulk was capable of the same. At the end of the day, they both died to us. So they are realistically even lol
Quite the way to show how strong our guardian is, including the two we brought with us. We went down into the Deep in a dangerous enough place where one fireteam of hidden was already killed/compromised, and not only survived, but also fought an army of Lucent hive including two high-powered enemy commanders (aka bosses) while resisting whatever memetic effects present in the area.
I'm interested in the fact that the hidden now has Savathun and Oryx. One raid on that compound or raids can be a disaster for humanity. And with Xivu visiting the body of her brother, and potentially somehow knowing or learning that her sister is also held by the same guardians to me makes a recipe for a rather big ticking time bomb.
It's very unlikely they would store Oryx's remains anywhere near Savathûn's. They will probably move it to a hidden site elsewhere in Sol. As stated, they will use robot frames and other (probably remote controlled) mechanical means to handle the corpse. Given it's Calcification of memory fragments, its not safe to move or be near it at all. Especially if said individual knows where they are moving the remains is in close proximity, it could easily leave a Calcified fragment of the location. From whats said, they appear to be well aware of the dangers. They seem to have appropriate measures to mitigate, if not eliminate, the threats associated to the remains. The very nature of Oryx's power and remains is a far different prospect to the Lucent Savathûn. How they "Imprison" evil Risen, Warlords, Dregen, Guardians or even the Lucent Savathûn is specific to light bearers. So it's not likely they will employ similar means, let alone place his remains in the same location as the Light bearers. It simply just wouldn't make sense to do so.
It seems like the effects of the area around Oryx's corpse is the opposite effect of how light bearers are risen by the light. Instead of being a resurrected powerful body with no memories, it's resurrected powerful memories without the body (I understand that the dead body is growing but that's all it's doing)
While Oryx’s body growing and still having lingering darkness energies around it is very ominous, I think the fact that the lore specifically drew attention to Oryx’s worm being missing from his corpse is extremely concerning. If his body grew… then would his worm too? Considering we know that Hive worms are sentient creatures that know all that their hosts do, and can already grow to massive size and become more powerful, if that worm is still alive it could be a massive threat to humanity.
They cannot survive on their own - even the Worm Gods depend on the tribute system. Oryx's Worm would need to either find a new host, or it was preserved in some sort of special container (like Parasite GL). But I agree that it could pose a huge problem for us in the future...
@@grzegorzflorek5623 Even if it is dead, Savathun’s worm shows that hive worms can be revived even if separated from their host, at least until given a new host like with Parasite as you mentioned. In that case then, maybe it’s less a question of where is the worm, and more “who has it?” Which is even more ominous to consider.
Here’s a thought i’ve got on all this. We know from the Books of Sorrow that Oryx killed Savathun and Xivu for their power then was able to revive them by remembering what they represented and acting in that accordance. This is conformed by Xivu’s memories in the dungeon. Oryx is interesting however because there are two pretty distinct sides to his character. You have Oryx, The Taken King. Then you have Auryx, The Navigator. I wonder if there is potential for him to be revived back into either one of these two sides of himself. I wonder if he were to come back as Auryx, not Oryx, if maybe he wouldn’t be the same light hating king we killed. Maybe then Auryx could be an ally to navigate us in our war against the Witness. What makes this idea interesting to me is that Auryx would have to be revived by someone who knew him as The Navigator, which would have to be Savathun or Xivu. While Xivu would probably rather have Oryx, The Taken King back, her memories imply that she remembers him more as their Navigator then The Taken King. She could potentially bring him back unintentionally in a form that could be beneficial to us. This would be all the better if we end up aligning with Savathun down the road since we are learning about all she did to protect the Veil and Traveler. Also sorry for posting a novel in here, but thanks for coming to my TED Talk.
This is also interesting because WE have Oryx's soul, in the Touch of Malice, also, the new dungeon exotic is literally The Navigator, and is a darkness energy type. I'd be interested to see how us having his soul plays out in the future.
The theory pans out. When reborn in light, you forget all that you were and become all that you will be. The only reason Savathun remembered her past is because her past self created avenues through which she could remember all that she had forgotten. Oryx doesn't have that. Atleast not for that purpose. He would be revived with no recollection of who he was or why he was. He would simply be a manifestation of the core tenants that made him who he was. Whether that made him an ally though is impossible to say
Could be interesting, especially given that Auryx tried to make peace with the Ammonites in the Hive's earliest days. And his worm is gone, meaning it won't be able to force him to follow the sword logic if he should be resurrected. All the same, it's a massive gamble to be taking with one of the most powerful beings (if not the most powerful) we've ever faced.
I don’t know why I hadn’t notice this until now but, for anyone who played through elden ring, it feels like we’ve got a LOT of similarities between oryx’s situation and Godwyn’s. The way you talk about the egregore sprouting from oryx’s remains makes me think of Godwyn’s deathroot and simmumah reminds me of fia in their goals and use of champions as a proxy. Just kind of a fun parallel.
It's a bit of an "out there" theory, but NEV-000 could refer to Neville, Fenchurch's ghost. If Oryx's corpse is similar to a ghost, well, that's a whole different can of hive worms
@@jonathandavis7048True, but what makes Fenchurch's Ghost worthy of being singled out like this? Neville would need to have a unique quality to be singled out like this. If it was simply that Oryx's remains had similar qualities to Ghosts more broadly then it makes no sense to single Neville out like this over just saying "Ghosts". If he is in fact singling out Neville, then it's more likely that Neville has become infected by the remains. Either directly or through his connection to Fenchurch. Which brings up the question of what particular race of human id Chalco? Fenchurch is an Awoken while Lisbon is an Exo. Is Chalco a Human, Exo or an Awoken? Chalco being an Exo may explain a particular resistance to the remains corrupting effect. While Chalco being a Human would indicate that the Awoken have a higher vulnerability to it. If Chalco is also Awoken, then it may indicate the specific interaction of Fenchurch touching the egragore coral may have led to the infection of Neville. None the less, it's far more likely that the NEV tag is Neptune Entity/Entry: Veil - (number).
Furthermore, if anyone's Ghost is going to be uniquely similar to Oryx's remains; It would be Drifters. It practically cannibalised other ghosts and merged with parts of those dark beasts Drifter encountered. His Ghost hasn't been anything close to "Normal" ever since then.
@@soulsurvivor8293 Chalco can't be an Exo, or there would be a number following her name. I'm not sure if it's ever specified in lore whether she's human or Awoken. I'm inclined to the former for a few reasons, most notably that her name, Chalco Yong, seems more linguistically similar to other human names than to Awoken names. But that's entirely unsubstantiated conjecture on my part.
I wonder if oryx, savathun and xivu are going to be the ones to end the witness.... Imagine the final shape, the witness is totally destroying us, it feels like all hope is gone then the 3 hive gods turn up and sacrifice themselves but also killing the witness but before the 3 disappear they get to look at themselves one last time as the sisters they were Just my wishful thinking
More likely that Savathun tricks Xivu into sacrificing herself while Oryx wants to take over for the Witness, so they've all got different motivations for taking out the Witness.
Sort of like how Darkseid was massacring everyone in Justice League Dark: Apokolips War, and so the heroes had to resort to freeing Trigon to stall/distract Darkseid, and then had to cast the two gods into a pocket dimension to save their own universe. Guardians getting their enemy to help them fight an even greater enemy/threat.
I think maybe humans are the final shape, fighting against the Winnower's, Witness' and the Hives ideology of sword logic (ending in finding the 'final shape') all while unintentionally being the best example of that sword logic as we've defeated everything thats come up.
@@jonrutherford2966The Vex kinda have everyone beat realistically, they literally wrote themselves into existence not using any paracausal forces. So no matter what they will always exist in some form or another at some time or another. Even pasacausal forces haven't been able to alter that fact, it seems doubtful that even the Witness's plans can change that. Mind you, also consider the similarities between the Witness and the Vex. It's quite plausible that the Witness is their collective conciousness and they are It's physical body/s. Each separated from one another but both seem to be a seperate collective of entities unto themselves. The Witness even assisted them and seems to be able to co-ordinate/controll the Sol Divisive somewhat directly through the variation of darkness inhabited Vex minds. I say the Witness seems to have no physical presence as it was entirely unaffected by the Travellers Light/life beam and never seems to physically interact with anything. Appearing in shattered glass projections and within peoples minds, remotely controlling or speaking through things like the Calcified Worm Familiar and our Ghost. Sending Disciples and minions to do anything that requires physical interaction rather than doing it themselves. They can only seem to interact with the physical universe by use of their powers, but not by touching anything with their actual visually seen bodily form. Where as the Vex exclusively use physically tangible means to interact with ecmverything. They have a seemingly perfect understanding of the physical universe and how to apply that knowledge to even time travel and generate the insane power requirements to achieve similar levels of power to what throw round with easy. They have technologies well beyond that of any othher species. Transmats that have longer distances & even through time itself, robotics & cybernetic interfaces beyond compression, layering their simulated realities anywhere & anywhen in the phsyical universe to overwrite reality itself and even creating work abounds for various causal paradoxes. All without paracausal power. The one thing they don't have and simply cannot comprehend. They needed to write in a contingency for the infinete recursive attempt's to rationalise paracausal powers and dedicate an entire Vex Mind and Sect to just stripping Saint-14 of his light, which took an eternity of Saint fighting them to achieve. Even then, that method of stripping away the light would only work on Saint-14, not other paracausal entities. Most of the Data on how the Vex Mind achieved this died with it, even the Data they managed to retain is now useless as us literally breaking time and arriving to save Saint introduced an uncomprehendable & Insurmountable quantiy of new paracausal variables. Honestly, I think the Vex Conclave simply gave up trying to understand paracausal forces after that, they likely still measure & record instances of it. That data likely the only data they allow the Sol Divisive access too. While they shun and actively avoid the Sol Divisive, the Conclave would just let the Sol Divisive deal with trying to comprehend paracausality out of convenience and as a means of bargaining should the Divisives analysis yield results. Which would also free the Conclaves Minds and Sects up for other tasks and such. Quite possibly using the time to build up a massive force and collection of simulations to launch simultaneous offensives across all of time and space. Calculating and coordinating a single full spectrum offensive that is fully integrated cohesively without paradoxes would likely take up most of their processing and resources. Attempting to hack into and use the Cloudarks processing would undoubtedly speed up the proces. Meanwhile the Sol Divisive would likely want to use to understand paracausality and have a deeper connection to their deity the Witness. Sorry for the excessive ramble...
I would love if Oryx did actually return. He’s still my favorite big bad we’ve faced. King’s Fall is still my favorite raid of all time. Oryx returning would be scary stuff. Think of the cutscenes with him and Xivu Arath alone after we were given the Ghosts Dungeon lore. Yes please. Oryx and Xivu v Guardians and Savathun when she inevitably returns? Sign me up.
What about the fact that the armor sets are all called "... of the Taken King", but they all look like the Lucent Hive. Wouldnt this indicate that this is what Oryx looks like after being resurrected?
I like this, or looking at it from the other side, what if they are ‘… of the taken king’ because WE (the guardian) have them now and somehow have taken the place as new king?
@@themanwithamission Xivu expresses great distress and disappointment that we didn’t assume the mantle of Taken King. we hear her say it in the dungeon via calcified fragment.
I have always stood by that I think there is a third "angle" to the grand cosmic struggle that Destiny constitutes. Everything in Destiny is set up in threes. Three classes, three energy types, three types of humanity, the three Hive Gods, etc. If so, there needs to be a third angle to the cosmic struggle between Light and Dark. Personally, I have always imagined that to be the title of the game, "Destiny", of which our Guardian is effectively the angle of, which combines both Light and Dark into a new kind of synthesis. A third logic, to round out the Bomb Logic of the Light and the Sword Logic of the Darkness. Let us call this the "Gun Logic", because it's about going forward (Aim down the sights and fire, as a philosophical concept). If Oryx returns, I suspect it will be through a combination of the Light and the Dark, pushing him into a realm as a kind of counterpart to our Guardian. A trajectory, which is only appropriate for the Navigator of the Hive. Especially if there are plans for a post "Light and Dark" saga Destiny, there's just too much lore invested into the Taken King (Oryx), the Witch Queen (Savathun), and whatever title is appropriate for Xivu Arath for them not to bring it forward into the next story. Even if they don't do it before the end of the Light and Dark saga, this is way too much of a Chekhov's gun at this point not to.
This plus the fact that with how little characterization Oryx received (outside of the books of sorrow) theres a lot of potential in the idea of him grappling with everything thats happened and his faith being a lie, as well as figuring out what the Hive are supposed to do without the Sword Logic ruling over them
Isn't xivu the god of war? I do agree, there is just soooo much lore into them, when say compared to the cabal, which is a whole faction, yet this is 3 member of a faction. I like the idea of there being a 3rd, which is us! Now we are comfortably welding darkness and light, we might well be that person already.
In the old World of Darkness table top rpg setting, there's three cosmological "entities" that make up reality, the wyld, the weaver and the wyrm. The wild is unrestrained creative chaos, it creates instinctively but without plan. The weaver is order, it neither creates nor destroys, but preserves the things the wyld makes. The Wyrm is entropy, it unmakes the things the Weaver has solidified when their time is due and then the cycle of creation, preservation and destruction begins again. (Except in the creation myth of the setting the Weaver gets annoyed about the Wyrm destroying all her cool stuff and wraps it in her webs, driving it mad and changing it from normal entropy in to mad Corruption, thus making it a source of evil etc etc etc) Applying this concept to Destiny, the Traveller is the Wyld, and the Witness represents the corrupted Wyrm, a force of omnicidal destruction. So Where's the equivalent force of the Weaver? It doesn't match 100% of course because they're different settings, but i thought the comparison was interesting
@@SymbioteMullet The Witness is the Wyrm and the Weaver. It wants to irredicate everything, but wants to control, how creation and destruction works. No chaotic life, just existing and destruction. A more simple and controllable state for the universe.
common misconception but "bomb logic" isn't a thing, or at least is not a light-oriented concept to counter the sword logic. the sword logic isn't even something the witness prescribes to, it's a warping of the witness's ideals by the hive. bomb logic was a concept that was thought up by mara as a means to beat the cold ruthlessness of the sword logic, but it's not like "the traveler has bomb logic and the witness has sword logic" or something.
So, If I am right, all one would need to revive Oryx is to find a portion of his mind that is still intact. For instance, could his essence be extracted from the touch of malice and poured back into his body? Or could even Quira play some role as she did simulate a version of Oryx and perhaps that digital mind could be used as a substitute? Also funnily enough all that remains of Quira is her head that I guess would have been stored in the same fashion as Savathun and now Orxy.
quria is dead, the only part of oryx contained in the touch of malice is his heart. i'll repeat it as much as it needs repeating, the touch of malice isn't a way to revive oryx, the "i will live on through you" stuff is just a passing of the torch of his ideology. to craft the touch of malice required to learn his history and mantle his ideals to forge all the pieces of it.
I feel like Oryx is still in there… in one of Xivu Arath’s words in the calcified fragments, she wonders if there is anything left of him in there. I started thinking about this, and I noticed something. When we are in the final fight, we use deepsight to find which part to go to and kill the heretic… when he dies we see Oryx’s symbol… perhaps he tried to help us? Sure he hates us for killing his favorite son but one thing he hates more is necromancy (I mean he cast out his other son and wiped his memory from everything but a statue). Just a thought…
That is really interesting. Maybe that’s why the ritual wasn’t working while they were down there. Oryx doesn’t want to come back. He may not be alive, but his body is his thought and his thought is that he should be dead
in which lore book does he mention his other son? This makes sense to me as Oryx is a sword logic fanatic and would deem himself unworthy of seeing the final shape
In terms of the residual neural activity, remember that when we first encountered egregore on the Glykon, and then later on the Leviathan, we were told that there was still brain activity in the deceased that it had started infesting. It kind of reminds me to when Eramis was frozen in Stasis as punishment by the Witness; she was still able to remember and absorb information (albeit mostly visions from the Witness), so it's possible that Oryx's death and egregore infection might also be part of the Witness' means of controlling and punishing them after their defeat.
Just realized this reminds me of that old Doctor Who episode. The 10th found "the devil" at a bottom of a pit around a black whole. Or at least it's body. It's mind was able to move around.
You know how we have the crown of sorrow, recovered by Savathun posing as Osiris and taken to the last city against the advice of Caityl. What if we bring back the remains of Oryx and put them in the same location as the crown. Perhaps these dark objects piling up in the same place could resurrect oryx
I feel like the next time we hear anything about this outside of a lore tab will be post-Final Shape. Having both the bodies of Savathun and Oryx in our possession feel like Bungie is setting up dominos for the story they wish to tell during or after the Final Shape. I'm very excited to see where this goes
Something to kind of point out since people don't seem to be catching this detail: They've been calling Oryx's place in the dungeon a burial site and not a crash site. And with the knowledge that Xivu has been there several times and has elected to not move the body, I think that means we've been mistaken for a long time on something: Oryx didn't crash on Titan. I believe Xivu Arath took his body and buried it there. They don't have a homeworld to take it to and since Titan was at least within the solar system they decided there after taking several of the planets away
Someone else posted that there's a Scout Rifle called Royal Chase with a lore entry explaining that Oryx's body was being monitored but had not actually entered Saturn's upper atmosphere yet when the Witness took the planets and moons, and the gravitational pull associated with taking something of that size pulled Oryx's corpse to Titan. I cannot verify this information right now because I'm writing this at 5am in the morning for me and I'm more exhausted than a wheel right now (cause they're always "tire'd" hahaha I'll see myself out)
How would we even destroy Oryx’s body? If it survived entry into Titan’s atmosphere and 7 years at the bottom of a freezing ocean, I can’t think of anything short of orbital bombardment that would make a dent, a capability we don’t really have anymore after Rasputin’s death.
In the lore tab of the helmet, Chalco stops talking when they hear the voice and see the face of Lisbon-3. We later see that the fireteam exploring the corpse is Lisbon-13. Do we suspect that was a typo, or was Chalco hallucinating a previous version of Lisbon, hence the squaring of their shoulders and ignoring the question?
Lisbon 13, only survivor of the Kentarch 3 fireteam. ( garden of salvation/ black garden ) Always loved that lore. Interesting to see he's back and now working with the hidden.
I know this would never happen but I feel like D2 should have a season of the Hidden, in this season we’d play as the hidden and play out these crazy hidden missions. Like, Imagine seeing a cut scene where the Marco shoots the Gouging Light sparrow to prevent the tendrils from spreading.
At least we know that the Witness is against resurrection because of darkness logic. It knew all along Oryx was there when Titan was taken and moreso with Xivu's visits. Knowing they won't bring him back as long as their faith in the darkness holds as it is, is somewhat reassuring.
Theory: we need all the help we can to defeat the witness hence the new alliance with cabal and fallen, we know that savathun helped the traveler and wasn’t as evil as we thought. The hidden now have oryx and savathuns bodies what if we let the ghost revive savathun and use her to persuade xivu and oryx that it’s there best interest to help the guardians and defeat the witness once and for all
@@mp6732 they should’ve destroyed both Savathuns and oryx’s bodies but ikora wants to keep them for some reason and I think the twist will be savathun will come back but will be on our side and it’ll be a Ciatil and calus situation all over again
All the hive have natural forces evolution when there main body or avatar dies outside of thron world they gain immunity to whatever killed them b4 oryx has a advanced version of this I mean he is the hive god of death also he died bc he wanted to but his body was to powerful to die even at like 10 percent power full power oryx is insane while his sisters where in black holes for millions n millions of years he was fighting n growing stronger thats how he got so much bigger then them
I think dreaming city curse savathun started wasnt to feed her worm but to feed oryxs worm to keep him alive on lifesupport since she was going to get rid of her worm to join the light anyway... just food for thought
Why do i find it strangely wholesome that xivu mourns at oryx’s grave, i thought they had no emotion and were just worriers but ig the hive gods actually, if even just a little, care about each other
This gives me the impression that between the implications of TKO-300 being-at a technical level-still active and a fireteam prior to Chalco's having been compromised in some way (coupled with the mention of the Crown of Sorrows), the armor we receive from the dungeon may well belong to a mindspun fireteam of Guardians, each being influenced by the will of Oryx. To what ends? Who knows.
You know, this is something I've always wondered but was so niche that it's never warranted being brought up before. What if someone's mind is destroyed, but their body is still alive? Could a Ghost "resurrect" them, even if they aren't... biologically dead, but brain dead? Especially now that we know Darkness is tied to consciousness, the question is much less clear, but it does make me wonder how a Guardian's continuity of memories and consciousness works even with normal rezzing. Also, a really fun tangent, is what's happened to Oryx really that far off from what the Final Shape would be like? The entire universe being perfected (aka incapable of change, because any deviation would necessarily be less perfect than that end state) wouldn't leave a lot of room for cognition or awareness, both for a lack of stimuli to be recieved because it's all self-similar and nothing to be aware of it, because theres no distinction between the "winner" and reality at that point. Is the Witness's goal really just a universal... statue? Perfect and eternal, and as dead as something can be?
@Symbiote Mullet the thing is, technically Stasis crystals do display a sort of "quantum computation" despite their stillness, which could be comparable to cognition. But honestly, I don't know what would be worse, being totally dead with absolutely nothing happening ever again, or being aware and driven insane by being locked into "perfection" for an eternity with no hope of change, or death. Suddenly the Light allowing for a little chaos and failure, and death, doesn't exactly sound like a great argument for why we or anyone should side with the Witness...
Yes, a ghost can resurrect a braindead body, that’s how we, guardians are resurrected! Because the light only manifests itself in the physical world, resurrected guardians don’t remember their past life due to darkness not being tied into their resurrection. That’s why Crow didn’t remember anything until he came in contact with the Crown of Sorrow and the Nightmares of Uldren. If a ghost were to bring Oryx back now however, he would remember everything due to the Taken and Darkness energy still resonating in his body, thus keeping his consciousness within that energy, and outing it as calcified memory fragments. The fact that Oryx can still pick up information, seems to me like he’s in more of a coma than actually dead. And the Taken and Darkness energy inside him is keeping his body AND MIND preserved.
Also, the current theory on the Witness’ intentions of the “Final Shape” is that the Witness is trying to lay contact between the Darkness’ Mental existence and the Light’s physical manifestations, thus explaining the link, using the veil because it is both Light and Dark, this also explains how the veil is organic, it uses light manifestations to create its fungus like form, and the darkness is used to store the Neomuni’s minds, connecting these with the cloudark, the veil is the perfect example of light and dark manifesting its own reality. The Witness’ “Final Shape”, is to reshape reality to it’s own will, his own world according to his mind, using the Traveler’s Light to bring that mental reality into the physical world. Like how the Veil connected to the CloudArk to form the digital world, partially formed by the Neomuni’s own will in their mind, connecting to the Veil’s Darkness, and the Veil’s physical shape of a fungus like shape being created from the light.
@_EliteNightmare crow got his memory back from making contact with Savathûn in season of the Lost, and her presumably using Deepsight on him. His contact with the crown of sorrow wasn't until 6 months later.
What would have happened if the ritual was a success? I mean yeah Oryx would come back, but without his memories. He’s a guardian now. So if we just kill the ritual conductors how would Oryx react to all of this? No one is there to get him back on track of what he’s supposed to do and the only thing in front of him are guardians who know he lost his memories. Best case scenario is we convince him we’re the good guys, but I’m sure it’s not as easy as I’m saying.
He would get his memories back eventually all hive pantheons including xivu and savathuns hive respect oryx of extreme high regard n it makes sense I mean he is their god so they would take him in and give them his memories back then he would be a problem
Last year in Season of the Risen, we came to know that Savathûn used psychic projections to control her Lucent Hive. It is very much possible that had her Hive resurrected Oryx, she would've projected herself into his mind as well to do her bidding. Echtar, who is shown in the dungeon, is Oryx's Sword from the TTK dlc, and he is alive and has the title as something of Savathûn, despite Savathûn being technically dead. So it can be concluded that she still holds a grip over the Lucent Hive mentally despite her body being dead and under hold.
@@SymbioteMullet We actually already have a sword named logic sorta There is a ornament for the Lament called "The Logic" I 100% want a Oryx sword that looks like the strand sword from this season
Imagine from Oryx's perspective that he wakes up years after getting dunked on by the Light just to see his kin getting dunked on by guardians using Darkness. Then someone comes along, drops a dead worm into his lap and says "By the way, your life is a lie. The worm told me so", then leaves.
I love that during the Two Lies, Two Truths missions, we assumed that "the Taken King will rise again" was just a meta comment on them bringing King's Fall into D2. but now we realize she was cluing us in on her plans. In Season of the Risen and the old Savathun's Song strike, Savathun was experimenting on guardians, stealing their light. I wonder if the wizard and ghost combo in the boss encounter of GoTD is the final result of those experimentations, and if so- what is missing? Was it only our intervention that prevented his resurrection in the Light? If so, and these hive were under the orders of Savathun and Immaru, who want to protect the Traveler....I feel like it's more likely that Oryx is brought back as an ally. He has been proven wrong in the Sword Logic when we beat him but didn't take up his mantle, and would be resurrected with no memory of his previous status of the Taken King. Wild lore implications here. Bravo, Bungie.
RANDOM THOUGHT AT START OF VIDEO. it doesn't make sense for the hive to want to resurrect Oryx for hive reason, sword logic etc, but they are. Is this because its simply their last hope? They have no alternative, they don't want their race to die out as much as they respect their 'religion' so they try to bring him back. By that logic, this means the witness must bring the end also for the Hive, i.e everyone is going to die unless EVERYONE stops the witness. Could down the road, Oryx, The Taken King, be an ally of sorts?
Remember, the Hive have already given themselves a loophole in the Logic to excuse the attempt. Effectively, "If it is heresy it will fail, if it works it can't be heresy" or something close to that. Basically if they try and nothing happens, they didn't actually do anything heretical because the Logic holds strong, and if they succed then the Logic is less restrictive than they thought and they've changed it, meaning what they just did can't be heretical
You're forgetting that there are two completely separate factions of Hive at this point, the OG and the Lucent Hive/Savathun's Brood. One has had millions of years of indoctrination to reject ressurection, necromancy, etc etc, and the other basically worship the Traveler and Savathun specifically at this point, who always questioned the Sword Logic, specifically recruited Nokris to learn necromancy, and is herself ressurected in the Light. Don't get me wrong, it's very much an open question whether Oryx will stick with his principles and will basically commit "unaliving" if he is revived because he's the one that championed the idea that necromancy and ressurection was heresy, or if exposure to the forgetting that the Light provides will let him at least explore the possibility he was wrong and stick around. Also, yes, the Witness is out to kill everyone and everything in the universe, and we need more allies (or enemies of the Witness at least) than not at this point. Anyone who still can't see that as the Witness's objective, I've personally got a bridge to sell them.
Well the Lucent Hive don't really follow the sword logic as strictly as "normal" hive, not to mention Hive Necromancy is blasphemous to the sword logic completely.
In a world where immortality and being revived are major parts of the gameplay? I’m sure quite a few, except here it actually makes sense as we know hive gods can be brought back
They’ve been hinting at oryx’s return since shadowkeep if not earlier , it isn’t like it’s out of nowhere. I honestly had a feeling he wasn’t dead when we killed him in TTK bc he’s the only hive god we’ve beaten that didn’t disintegrate lmao
The possibility of the taken king returning, no less as lucent hive, is so terrifying that I myself, when entering that arena for the first time could think of nothing but. "Oh dear traveller, NO, this cannot be happening!" I love this dungeon.
Most troubling part is what Xivu Arath will do now. She visited his body over and over, and now the Hidden have stolen the corpse and squirreled it away somewhere. She will not be pleased to realize it is missing to say the least, and angering the God of War is not normally a good move.
I just want to note that I do play destiny every once and awhile and dearly love the game but what I've always been here for is the story this is my audio book I don't even play the destiny pve I just keep up with the story I do find it fascinating and amazing that a I can love a games story and 80% the story I quite literally play destiny every few months and watch these lore video's daily I love destiny and byf's videos keep it up!
Theres also a chance Xivu claimed it given her frequent visits, or it simply died and faded away given the dissolution of Oryx's tithing servants and the time passed since Oryx's death.
Mara’s motivations have always been uncertain but I find it hard to believe she’s interested in taking up the mantle of monarch of the taken in oryx’s place. The taken are something tied solely to the darkness ie the witness and Mara hasn’t shown any interest in playing to the witness’s favor. Hive magic, the ability to take or any other power that puts her in service of the witness goes against her only 100% confirmed interest, that being her own and that of the awoken people. Not saying she has no use for it but following in oryx’s footsteps doesn’t seem like her style.
@@dumbsterdives I doubt it, Xivu expressed great disappointment that WE didn’t assume the mantle of Taken King, according to the sword logic, only we, the beings who slew Oryx, could assume his mantle. Until we are slain of course.
Oryx’s purpose was the learn… he is the only one to have communed with the Deep… and information about the Deep is what we need. Risk doesn’t matter if we can’t stop the Witness. Whatever it takes.
Wouldn't it be cool if there was some sort of interaction with touch of malice if you use it during the dungeon? Maybe an extra calcified fragment with a voice line from oryx?
I'm guessing they discover a link between The Veil and consciousness, memories, and The Veil is just close enough to have an effect. The link between matter and consciousness, mind and body connection, like a soul to vessel, can be used to resurrect. And we'll find a way to use it, bring back Cayde, and slowly learn from him as he remembers what happened to his consciousness dying as an Exo, since Clarity (darkness) was used to pretty much connect minds to Exo frames without them breaking down and going crazy.
I think part of the issue with destroying Oryx's remains is that if it is a bomb, then we don't know what would set the bomb off. What's more, we can't be certain if the Lucent Hive in the dungeon were the first to try tampering with the body in some way. If Xivu Arath was able to find it then you can bet that Savathun definitely found it, and Savathun is not above pulling tricks like this even if it is her brother. And if the place is full of Egregore coral, then maybe even The Witness did something.
NEV - 000 could the Veil but I think it could also be code for something of Nezarec's. Given Nezarec's ability to produce hallucinations and nightmares from just parts of his corpse even when he is dead, leads me to believe it might be something related to him. Especially given Chalco's briefing in the beginning, I think the argument for Nezarec is strong.
I can’t think of a full acronym for NEV but my knee jerk is nezerac- maybe Nezerac Evil Villian. There’s bits and pieces of Nezzy all over the place and he told us after the raid that while his body may be destroyed his mind will linger. His lingering mind is a whole new kind of terrifying now that there’s a body without a mind to pair with a mind without a body. I would assume there are strong similarities between corpses of formerly powerful darkness beings that we can use to learn more about their weaknesses. The more we understand about them the closer we come to understanding the witness. I thought you covered Oryx gaining power from exploration back in D1. I’ve been under the impression that we’ve been bringing him back to life step by step thanks to toting around touch of malice.
I keep thinking back to one of Savathun's two truths two lies, about how the Taken King would rise again. This is particularly worrying, given everything that's been going on
Personally, with the fact that The Darkness is liked to the mind and Oryx had so much influence over it; I would wager that the energy that resides within Oryx is just continuing what it did when he was alive. Oryx was all about his gains, his influence, and spreading that influence. Oryx's body continuing to grow, continuing to spread calcified fragments, and continue to grow in influence with these egregore coral is more of the energies continuing to follow the will of Oryx from when he was still alive due to his extreme control over it. Where his sisters have had to go about their influence in their unique ways, he simply just dominated it. If Darkness truly did follow the will of such a being while he was alive; who is to say it doesn't still respect that command well into death.
Could it be possible the NEV stands for New Egregore Variant? As in all the new coral growths we’ve been harvesting that Chalco would’ve also very recently and relevantly performed an analysis on? That might also explain where Oryx’s consciousness has gone while his body is still alive on a cellular level. And that would also have some SERIOUS story implications for where this season is going with Sloane and why the “taken radio” gets stronger whenever she uses the processed egregore, instead of just her connection to Ahsa. Maybe we’ve been feeding her taken bits straight from the king himself?
I've been saying to my friends and anyone who would listen saying oryx isn't dead and that he would land on saturn or one of its moons this dungeon made me so hype and that it proved mr right I'm so happy rn
The way they're describing it is the artifact found in the crucible map (audio hallucinations, visual hallucinations) but I honestly don't remember if the hidden ever investigated the artifact there
I wonder if Xivu would be able to bring Oryx back in the same way that Oryx brought her and Savathun back. My idea would be when Xivu learns the truth of the lies of the worm familiar that this discovery might bring Oryx back since he was the navigator of not just the stars but of information and discovery too.
Once upon a time I watched a video of explaining what happens when someone is taken (sorry for not siting it but this was years ago. Maybe byf maybe evade maybe someone else) and spoke about how the new powers an enemy gains after being taken is a reflection of a weakness they had prior (vandel snipers gain a shield so they can’t be sniped. Thrall dash around so they are harder to hit as melee combatants etc). So what if oryx’s body still being alive IS his new ability. Think about it, can we say for sure his abilities he had during the raid weren’t his abilities already as the taken king. Remember he did “take” himself after the campaign but before the raid. My logic is this, he desired to be synonymous with death itself and more than likely wished to become the final shape itself. As the taken king, pseudo king of the hive as a whole he didn’t have any real weakness except death itself which can only be permanent inside his throne world. His throne world which he turned “inside out” and combined into his dreadnaught. So at the point of him taking himself, his only weakness was death itself and which was very possible both because he was just beaten by us and was inside his ship/world. So as a new “power” gifted as a taken enemy was that his body shall never die. Mind, soul gone but the body remains. Still growing. Also his soul lives on in the touch of malice soooo, idk. He May have more than one way to come back
I had no idea that the final boss arena was literally oryx's grave. It was pointed out to me and I was absolutely blown away by seeing oryx. God, this dungeon is quite literally Bungie's Magnum Opus, they did so well with GOTD. Bravo Bungie... Bravo.
You know this whole thing with oryx's body not being dead but his consciousness not being there reminds a lot of Godwyn the Golden from elden ring and how he could not die a true death , so hes body kept growing and branching into the world making a new form of life ( those who live in death) . Pretty interesting parallels ngl
The very fact the body isn't dead gives me major anxiety where ever it's contained they better really really contain it well that's like keter/ applyon level in S.C.P terms
Regarding the Egregore coral growth and spores, you're overlooking the fact that Titan's ocean is FULL of life. We are absolutely surrounded by undersea life during the seasonal activities and the dungeon. When that stuff dies, the organic material drifts down to the abyssal zone like snow as it falls apart along the way. The flooring of the methane sea is likely several meters thick with a slurry of dead tissues and debris, which would be prime food for Egregore.
Oryx's body growing even after his mind is seemingly absent reminds me of Godwyn the Golden from Elden Ring. His Mind was killed, yet his body remained, which kept growing and became a massive grotesque creature that spawns the death root. I don't know if they took inspiration from Elden Ring, but maybe the Deathroot is comparable to the Egregore. I definitely think Egregore has a massive role to play in the future story of Destiny, whatever it may be.
This basically confirms when Saloane speaks after using the agregore that she's tuned into the witness's memories and that Ahsa is filtering it out since it's growing not just from dead matter, but dead matter imbued on a cellular level with taken energy
NEV-000 sounds like it could be the Veil. Considering what we know about it. As for Oxry, store the body on the farthest place we can travel to, examine the body, keep some samples, and destory it.
Oryx being my favorite destiny character (No offense to Zavala and Cayde lovers), I am SO happy he has imminent relevancy, man... I love everything about him and the expansion he was introduced from. Also a nice touch that when it becomes evident we're getting an Oryx spotlight out of this, Byf uses Taken King ost Man... I don't think I'll ever not tolerate Byf's channel, this is prime, primer than Prime saying prime in Transformers Prime.
![[FREE] tyler the creator type beat | "django"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/X-lpwRtpj9U/mqdefault.jpg)
The question of how Oryx’s body ended up on Titan is explained in the lore for the Royal Chase scout rifle from Season of the Hunt. It says that Oryx’s body was being monitored until Titan disappeared and created a gravitational anomaly, pulling Oryx in.
Commenting just so this post gets higher so more people see this
The "monster" in question in that lore tab might've just been the Pyramid, but it's worth keeping in mind regardless.
Holy frick, it’s true. One piece of lore is suspending the disbelief for all of the dungeon lmao
This...exactly. Thank you.
@@ringomandingo1015 Huh, you’d think more players would’ve noticed that piece of lore with how often Royal Chase drops from vendors randomly, and in Trials of the Nine.
I think Chalco's reaction to Fenchurch asking if they were the first to visit Oryx's body is because she had already told them they were the only extant team, meaning he showed signs of memory loss, evidence of the effects they were told to look out for.
I honestly think Chalco’s the one who’s compromised… She has been reacting strange throughout the whole armor lore pages since they descended into the deep. She only seemed normal when giving out the talismans. Fenchurch had a talisman, Lisben too, it was never said that Chalco had one though !
@@_elitenightmare4794 I feel like the other two would notice if she didn't have one but since theres no indication in either directions we really don't know.
Grimmer still: maybe she had to order the execution of the previous team, since they lost their minds after the last mission?
@@_elitenightmare4794 I personally dont think anyone is compromised, i do genuinely see it as a potential intentional misdirection to make ppl start having suspicions for it to go nowhere with those character. And it’s just there to hint at something in the future instead
@_elitenightmare4794 the lore tab says, "He clips the talisman onto his jacket as the rest of his fireteam has." I feel that means all 3 have one.
destiny is at its best when it feels like a sci-fi eldritch horror story
The word ‘eldritch’ gets flung about too much lol
@@plebiusjonbson823 "weird, sinister, or ghostly"
That's basically what the Hive are
@@Brother_O4TS that is not what it means
@@plebiusjonbson823it‘s literally the definition
@@plebiusjonbson823 Yeah, that's exactly what it means kid
"NEV-000" could be "Neptune Entity Veil". I feel like its definitely referring to the Veil given the linking thread of mental influence and memories. Plus the Veil being unnervingly biological
So the connection could be made that the veil is part of a dead creature that's storing memories of some kind, i wonder if this is where it's leading.
@@squadass99 I think you're half-right. New logs about the Veil indicate a strange influence on the mind. Veil is going to have something to do with the mind.
@@ChaosTheory0 It absolutely does have something to do with the mind, it's exciting to start seeing all the pieces come together about the veil. almost tempting to look through the datamines for answers but i'm remaining strong to see it paly out in game.
Could also be Nezarec idk
@@ali18y84 What would the E and V stand for?
Oryx's return is certainly inevitable. Savathûn predicted he would come back, and while we may have stopped the Lucent Brood from bringing him back, it's still possible. Until we destroy his remains totally, we will risk his return.
Also, it sounds like Chalco may be compromised.
considering we've beat him, and more powerful beings than him, i think we'd be just fine beatnig oryx again. at this point he's not the biggest and baddest threat we've killed
@@ready1player31 He was still one of the biggest threats we ever faced.
@@ready1player31 We may have killed him but he still caused immense damages and traumas. Also, an Oryx with the Light would probably be at a whole other level of power than what we fought until then.
Its worth noting that Savathun didn't predict he would come back, it was part of 2 truths 2 lies.
The options were as follows:
1) Mercury, Io, Titan were owned by Savathun
2) The Witness returned Mars to your solar system
3) The Power to move worlds with soon be yours
4) The Taken King will rise again
We know 2 is true, and 3 could be referring to the planets encounter (though its hard to tell how much raid mechanics play into this). I also think its important to recognize that Savathun did not say Oryx, she said the Taken King, which could even imply a successor to Oryx rather then himself.
@@alderstifen7738didn’t savathun bring back mars not the witness
I've seen it mentioned a few times and I really like the idea of oryx "the navigator" being how we enter the traveler. I think that'd be an awesome tie in to his name.
Oryx is also called "the King of Shapes", and could show up either during or after the Final Shape.
You have to get the dungeon exotic to play the next dlc.
Honestly having Savathun and Oryx as Lucent Hive Lightbearers/Guardians could be very interesting. It may be that in order to defeat the Witness and Xivu Arath, Savathun and Oryx may need to be resurrected. Theres a trope called the "Godzilla Threshold", which in short is the narrative convention where things are so bad, desperate, or otherwise unwinnable that measures unthinkable must be taken.
It would also be interesting to see the Hive Gods speak to each other in-game.
EDIT: It may be possible that a resurrected Oryx, the Navigator, may be our key into the Traveller. A being touched by the light and darkness and possessing similar properties to the Veil may be what we need to pass through the portal created by the Witness.
I agree. In addition, to my knowledge Oryx is the ONLY entity to have actually spoken face to face with the Witness, outside of the disciples. That in and of itself could be valuable information.
I just had the craziest idea on how Cayde is back in the Final Shape.
Nightmares are a product of darkness and Ikora is unlikely to study how to wield darkness based powers herself being the Warlock Vanguard.
But Ikora's specific Nightmare is Cayde and Nezerac's conciousness/Power became concentrated near the Veil; Likely due to Osiris being there.
What if Ikora goes to Neomuna to visit Osiris and inspect the Veil herself. Only when she gets too close to the Veil Nightmare Cayde appears from her shadow making the Light/Dark Connection and transporting them both to the other side of the portal.
Which in turn, much like weapon crafting, makes the Nightmare of Cayde into a physical copy of Ikora's memory of Cayde.
Ikora is very perceptive and knew Cayde very well, even the parts of himself he would hide from most others. She would know him almost as well as he knew himself.
The Dark makes the form and memory while the Light makes the physical body from the form for the memories to inhabit. Even recreating The Ace of Spades, a gun closely associated with Cayde's former life's Son.
Now my only question; Is the Light cracked Ace of Spades the latest Sentient Weapon containing the actual Ace?
That would be pretty messed up and dark, so perhaps it contains Cayde instead and would be a Darkness made duplicate of the original but blessed and imbued with Caydes Light (As in his entire life as a Guardian).
Sort of a cross between the Travellers chosen and the Wormlauncher...
@@soulsurvivor8293 I’m not sure about this theory, Ikora seemed to talk to Cayde like he was the actual CAYDE-6, because she said “You’ve missed a lot”. Meaning she is referring to the actual cayde missing what has happened after his death. Plus, if Cayde became a memory like shape after Ikora being transported, he would look like the Memories of Uldren or Ghaul at the end of Season of the Haunted, and not like a with pure light imbued Guardian. So I doubt this theory.
@@soulsurvivor8293 Leaks already confirmed it’s our dead Cayde-6 in a valley of time inside the traveler where all space and time collapses on itself
You explained the "Godzilla Threshold" and my mind jumped to Dame Judi Dench in the second Riddick film (technically the first film that carries the name "Riddick" on the box) saying "In normal times, evil would be fought by good. But in times like these, well... it should be fought by another kind of evil."
Attached a video with the voice line I'm talking about
ua-cam.com/video/rrtpOVTX5NA/v-deo.html
I just love how you can tell nuances in Hidden code. TKO-300 is Taken King Oryx, but the 300 was probably chosen because thanks to the World Grave we found back in D1 (which was effectively a super dense Hive library of knowledge), the Vanguard and by extension the Hidden knew about not just Oryx, but also his siblings and the powers/domains of all 3. It's my guess that the 0's are placeholders and the 3 represents how many beings there are in that category. The position of the 3 seems to indicate the order in which we've encountered these beings (i.e. TKO-300 being Oryx Taken King first of 3 Hive God-siblings, WQS-030 is Witch Queen Savathun second of 3 Hive God-siblings and WGX-003 is War God Xivu third of 3 Hive God-siblings), which would be a huge coincidence if these codes were created by the Hidden back when we were still fighting Crota. Of course from an IRL perspective, it makes sense because the codes do appear to be in order of encounter.
Being able to dissect these codes and figure them out so totally is something I love. I'm gonna need to dive into Hidden lore and identifier codes properly.
go check out ikoras shredded hidden reports from witch queen collectors edition, people have compiled the notes, they're pretty cool
From a lore standpoint, they were probably labeled like that to indicate the age. Aurash was the Oldest and Xi Ro was the youngest putting Sathona in the middle
Calling it now:
I think Oryx will be turned into some means to get through the gate on the Traveler.
The Navigator will rise and show us the path.
The Veil needed to be linked via a source of Light to open the portal - Oryx is giving out "veil like" energy, so we use him as a medium to establish a second link to pass through safely.
Or perhaps it's worse than that...
Perhaps the only way to get through the gate, is to be Taken there...
and Sloane has shown us that yes, Guardians can be Taken.
We are in so much trouble.
I like this.
THAT'S WHY ONLY IKORA IS IN THE TRAILER, it is a secret operation of the hidden, so it makes a LOT of sense of why zavala and other guardians aren't there.
You might be onto something, Sloane had said that when she got infected by the taken to have access to their intel, the light from her ghost and herself was TEMPORARILY holding the infection off. However, we as a guardian do not only have light inside of us, as Stasis for example is a product of our Guardian’s Darkness and our Ghosts Light. And Strand being visible to us is for the exact same reason. Due to this Darkness inside us, we might be prone to being taken, but can resist it’s dominating influence, thus giving us the power to enter the traveler. Ikora’s rage, sadness, and despair over Cayde might be her version of the Darkness inside her being able to fend off the Taken, and wherever she is in that teaser, might’ve cured the Taken infection, as Cayde is shown CLEARLY with PURE LIGHT in his eyes, body and Ace of Spades. Ikora may not have been able to indulge in such Light due to the taken infection and darkness also acting as a buffer.
@@_elitenightmare4794 which subsequently leads to us learning to use these “taken” powers as our final subclass. Shit writes itself
Maybe the creature in Titans depths is a distraction and Oryx is actually the enemy of the Witness on Titan, as upon his return he becomes Lucent and helps to fight the Witness with Savathun, using the Taken against the Witness on some way.
This is frankly terrifying, and I understand how scared Ikora is. Oryx was one of the worst things to happen to the Last City after the shitshow that Crota caused on Luna. Worse, Oryx seemed unstoppable because he had access to a whole ARMY of potential recruits. Plenty of Cabal, Fallen, and even Vex to corrupt and make into his personal soldiers. His legacy still haunts us through his sisters.
And now we're faced with the possibility that he just very well come back. I'm not sure which scares me more, than he might resurrect or that he'll come back as a LUCENT HIVE. He was scary all by himself. I think I speak for everyone that NOBODY wants to deal with him when he has the Light.
Oryx would probably hate his ressurection due to his MASSIVE distain for the light
@@lukethepotatoking keep in mind, when resurrected with the light you lose your memories. Even savathun forgot her plans before we helped her remember
@@Stereo-hb2lobut remember she did plan that happing to her
Having oryx pull a crow while guided by savathun would be a good set of lore if they don't fumble it
Is it possible that touch of malice is keeping the body alive somehow? I'm just taking the concept that Oryx had about the gun granting him immortaily more litteral.
We (The Guardian) and Oryx share an interesting dynamic together every since that fateful meeting, its amazing how our Legend began with Oryx and it was where his legendary invincibility came to an end. Crota put us on the map, but defeating Oryx is where we truly became legends. Fates forever intertwined, Us and only Us should have been able to
Mantle his throne and powers.
Maybe in The Final Shape we will finally ascend his throne, and that will be our way to enter the portal!😮
I'm sorry our legend began with Oryx? Not taking out the black heart in the black garden?
@@ZLunareI got the sense that no one but a few exceptions knew it was us who destroyed the black heart
@@ZLunare ppl during d1 didn't know shit. Ever review talking about the end boss fight simply went
"you shoot this black thing and that's the" story " guys destiny sucks and they didn't deliver on any story"
I mean the reason why sevu arath is so mad at us is because we didn’t follow the sword logic and take oryx’s place after beating him, I think it’s found in the dungeon dialogue itself, so we kinda have to
Even after every villain weve had in destiny, i still feel that oryx was the best! He had the most presence and portrayed the darkness the most.
The fact that Oryx's body is 100% not dead, and still retaining information, is terrifying. Arguably the strongest enemy we've faced, is now a ticking time bomb just waiting to come back. If anyone besides the original fireteam and the Hidden find this out, it's going to be chaos for everybody.
Strongest enemy? Nah Rhulk Stomps him easily
@@memecrider3585 Really wouldn't say easily bro
@@memecrider3585 Rhulk has, arguably, more direct access to a wider variety of Dark powers, but Oryx has demonstrably greater feats, of the two.
@@memecrider3585 Oryx killed a worm God, as far as scaling goes we know Rhulk was capable of the same. At the end of the day, they both died to us. So they are realistically even lol
@@ImQuantumby that logic calus robot is oryx level, rhulk dunks on oryx
Quite the way to show how strong our guardian is, including the two we brought with us.
We went down into the Deep in a dangerous enough place where one fireteam of hidden was already killed/compromised, and not only survived, but also fought an army of Lucent hive including two high-powered enemy commanders (aka bosses) while resisting whatever memetic effects present in the area.
And the fact that our sole motivation its the chance of getting a new gun its amazing
@@davidrodriguez9081 and a title :p
@@davidrodriguez9081I can’t wait for the day our enemies realize that our main purpose is just to get cool stuff. Nothing more, nothing less.
I'm interested in the fact that the hidden now has Savathun and Oryx. One raid on that compound or raids can be a disaster for humanity. And with Xivu visiting the body of her brother, and potentially somehow knowing or learning that her sister is also held by the same guardians to me makes a recipe for a rather big ticking time bomb.
It's very unlikely they would store Oryx's remains anywhere near Savathûn's. They will probably move it to a hidden site elsewhere in Sol.
As stated, they will use robot frames and other (probably remote controlled) mechanical means to handle the corpse.
Given it's Calcification of memory fragments, its not safe to move or be near it at all. Especially if said individual knows where they are moving the remains is in close proximity, it could easily leave a Calcified fragment of the location.
From whats said, they appear to be well aware of the dangers. They seem to have appropriate measures to mitigate, if not eliminate, the threats associated to the remains.
The very nature of Oryx's power and remains is a far different prospect to the Lucent Savathûn.
How they "Imprison" evil Risen, Warlords, Dregen, Guardians or even the Lucent Savathûn is specific to light bearers.
So it's not likely they will employ similar means, let alone place his remains in the same location as the Light bearers.
It simply just wouldn't make sense to do so.
I would be so happy if oryx came back, and don’t care if he is dark or light, I WANT HIM BACK
Preach. I have been saying he will be back for years.
@@bigmol1633 same bro that toland line from patrols on the moon had me calling this shit for awhile
Glad I'm not the only one who misses Daddy Oryx
Dude i just saw you in the comments of the faze video from a little bit ago haha
@@BDubMakes I just want him that bad
It seems like the effects of the area around Oryx's corpse is the opposite effect of how light bearers are risen by the light. Instead of being a resurrected powerful body with no memories, it's resurrected powerful memories without the body (I understand that the dead body is growing but that's all it's doing)
While Oryx’s body growing and still having lingering darkness energies around it is very ominous, I think the fact that the lore specifically drew attention to Oryx’s worm being missing from his corpse is extremely concerning. If his body grew… then would his worm too? Considering we know that Hive worms are sentient creatures that know all that their hosts do, and can already grow to massive size and become more powerful, if that worm is still alive it could be a massive threat to humanity.
They cannot survive on their own - even the Worm Gods depend on the tribute system. Oryx's Worm would need to either find a new host, or it was preserved in some sort of special container (like Parasite GL). But I agree that it could pose a huge problem for us in the future...
What if Ahsa is lying and she is the worm? She could have been using Sloane's fight on the Hive/Taken to feed
@@grzegorzflorek5623 Even if it is dead, Savathun’s worm shows that hive worms can be revived even if separated from their host, at least until given a new host like with Parasite as you mentioned. In that case then, maybe it’s less a question of where is the worm, and more “who has it?” Which is even more ominous to consider.
@@halberd-3291 AYOOOOOO THAT GIANT WORM SWIMMING IN TITAN WAAAY LONG AGO
@@grzegorzflorek5623what if it crawl out and just started killing for itself.
Here’s a thought i’ve got on all this. We know from the Books of Sorrow that Oryx killed Savathun and Xivu for their power then was able to revive them by remembering what they represented and acting in that accordance. This is conformed by Xivu’s memories in the dungeon. Oryx is interesting however because there are two pretty distinct sides to his character. You have Oryx, The Taken King. Then you have Auryx, The Navigator. I wonder if there is potential for him to be revived back into either one of these two sides of himself. I wonder if he were to come back as Auryx, not Oryx, if maybe he wouldn’t be the same light hating king we killed. Maybe then Auryx could be an ally to navigate us in our war against the Witness. What makes this idea interesting to me is that Auryx would have to be revived by someone who knew him as The Navigator, which would have to be Savathun or Xivu. While Xivu would probably rather have Oryx, The Taken King back, her memories imply that she remembers him more as their Navigator then The Taken King. She could potentially bring him back unintentionally in a form that could be beneficial to us. This would be all the better if we end up aligning with Savathun down the road since we are learning about all she did to protect the Veil and Traveler.
Also sorry for posting a novel in here, but thanks for coming to my TED Talk.
I like this theory a lot. It could be possible through multiple means
This is also interesting because WE have Oryx's soul, in the Touch of Malice, also, the new dungeon exotic is literally The Navigator, and is a darkness energy type. I'd be interested to see how us having his soul plays out in the future.
The theory pans out. When reborn in light, you forget all that you were and become all that you will be. The only reason Savathun remembered her past is because her past self created avenues through which she could remember all that she had forgotten. Oryx doesn't have that. Atleast not for that purpose. He would be revived with no recollection of who he was or why he was. He would simply be a manifestation of the core tenants that made him who he was. Whether that made him an ally though is impossible to say
Could be interesting, especially given that Auryx tried to make peace with the Ammonites in the Hive's earliest days. And his worm is gone, meaning it won't be able to force him to follow the sword logic if he should be resurrected. All the same, it's a massive gamble to be taking with one of the most powerful beings (if not the most powerful) we've ever faced.
I don’t know why I hadn’t notice this until now but, for anyone who played through elden ring, it feels like we’ve got a LOT of similarities between oryx’s situation and Godwyn’s. The way you talk about the egregore sprouting from oryx’s remains makes me think of Godwyn’s deathroot and simmumah reminds me of fia in their goals and use of champions as a proxy. Just kind of a fun parallel.
“Did you die?”
“Sadly yes, but I lived.”
You already used this one in the final shape reveal trailer.
@@Banana-Boi it’s a quote you absolute pebble.
@@hellaboveme500 So? Doesn't mean it can't be repetitive. He's the D2 meme guy he can come up with something new.
@@hellaboveme500this in no way should be an insult but just had me in stitches. Totally nicking this 😂😂😂😂
@@Banana-Boi ever seen Ice Age: Dawn of the Dinosaurs?
It's a bit of an "out there" theory, but NEV-000 could refer to Neville, Fenchurch's ghost. If Oryx's corpse is similar to a ghost, well, that's a whole different can of hive worms
That’s not bad, fits right into the FEN, CHA, ERI theme with the fireteam
@@jonathandavis7048True, but what makes Fenchurch's Ghost worthy of being singled out like this?
Neville would need to have a unique quality to be singled out like this.
If it was simply that Oryx's remains had similar qualities to Ghosts more broadly then it makes no sense to single Neville out like this over just saying "Ghosts".
If he is in fact singling out Neville, then it's more likely that Neville has become infected by the remains. Either directly or through his connection to Fenchurch.
Which brings up the question of what particular race of human id Chalco?
Fenchurch is an Awoken while Lisbon is an Exo. Is Chalco a Human, Exo or an Awoken?
Chalco being an Exo may explain a particular resistance to the remains corrupting effect.
While Chalco being a Human would indicate that the Awoken have a higher vulnerability to it.
If Chalco is also Awoken, then it may indicate the specific interaction of Fenchurch touching the egragore coral may have led to the infection of Neville.
None the less, it's far more likely that the NEV tag is Neptune Entity/Entry: Veil - (number).
Furthermore, if anyone's Ghost is going to be uniquely similar to Oryx's remains; It would be Drifters.
It practically cannibalised other ghosts and merged with parts of those dark beasts Drifter encountered. His Ghost hasn't been anything close to "Normal" ever since then.
@@soulsurvivor8293 Chalco can't be an Exo, or there would be a number following her name. I'm not sure if it's ever specified in lore whether she's human or Awoken. I'm inclined to the former for a few reasons, most notably that her name, Chalco Yong, seems more linguistically similar to other human names than to Awoken names. But that's entirely unsubstantiated conjecture on my part.
I wonder if oryx, savathun and xivu are going to be the ones to end the witness.... Imagine the final shape, the witness is totally destroying us, it feels like all hope is gone then the 3 hive gods turn up and sacrifice themselves but also killing the witness but before the 3 disappear they get to look at themselves one last time as the sisters they were
Just my wishful thinking
More likely that Savathun tricks Xivu into sacrificing herself while Oryx wants to take over for the Witness, so they've all got different motivations for taking out the Witness.
@@mrsocko316 yeah that works too, I was just saying how id want it to end lol
Sort of like how Darkseid was massacring everyone in Justice League Dark: Apokolips War, and so the heroes had to resort to freeing Trigon to stall/distract Darkseid, and then had to cast the two gods into a pocket dimension to save their own universe.
Guardians getting their enemy to help them fight an even greater enemy/threat.
I think maybe humans are the final shape, fighting against the Winnower's, Witness' and the Hives ideology of sword logic (ending in finding the 'final shape') all while unintentionally being the best example of that sword logic as we've defeated everything thats come up.
@@jonrutherford2966The Vex kinda have everyone beat realistically, they literally wrote themselves into existence not using any paracausal forces.
So no matter what they will always exist in some form or another at some time or another.
Even pasacausal forces haven't been able to alter that fact, it seems doubtful that even the Witness's plans can change that.
Mind you, also consider the similarities between the Witness and the Vex. It's quite plausible that the Witness is their collective conciousness and they are It's physical body/s.
Each separated from one another but both seem to be a seperate collective of entities unto themselves.
The Witness even assisted them and seems to be able to co-ordinate/controll the Sol Divisive somewhat directly through the variation of darkness inhabited Vex minds.
I say the Witness seems to have no physical presence as it was entirely unaffected by the Travellers Light/life beam and never seems to physically interact with anything.
Appearing in shattered glass projections and within peoples minds, remotely controlling or speaking through things like the Calcified Worm Familiar and our Ghost.
Sending Disciples and minions to do anything that requires physical interaction rather than doing it themselves.
They can only seem to interact with the physical universe by use of their powers, but not by touching anything with their actual visually seen bodily form.
Where as the Vex exclusively use physically tangible means to interact with ecmverything. They have a seemingly perfect understanding of the physical universe and how to apply that knowledge to even time travel and generate the insane power requirements to achieve similar levels of power to what throw round with easy.
They have technologies well beyond that of any othher species. Transmats that have longer distances & even through time itself, robotics & cybernetic interfaces beyond compression, layering their simulated realities anywhere & anywhen in the phsyical universe to overwrite reality itself and even creating work abounds for various causal paradoxes.
All without paracausal power. The one thing they don't have and simply cannot comprehend.
They needed to write in a contingency for the infinete recursive attempt's to rationalise paracausal powers and dedicate an entire Vex Mind and Sect to just stripping Saint-14 of his light, which took an eternity of Saint fighting them to achieve.
Even then, that method of stripping away the light would only work on Saint-14, not other paracausal entities.
Most of the Data on how the Vex Mind achieved this died with it, even the Data they managed to retain is now useless as us literally breaking time and arriving to save Saint introduced an uncomprehendable & Insurmountable quantiy of new paracausal variables.
Honestly, I think the Vex Conclave simply gave up trying to understand paracausal forces after that, they likely still measure & record instances of it.
That data likely the only data they allow the Sol Divisive access too. While they shun and actively avoid the Sol Divisive, the Conclave would just let the Sol Divisive deal with trying to comprehend paracausality out of convenience and as a means of bargaining should the Divisives analysis yield results.
Which would also free the Conclaves Minds and Sects up for other tasks and such.
Quite possibly using the time to build up a massive force and collection of simulations to launch simultaneous offensives across all of time and space.
Calculating and coordinating a single full spectrum offensive that is fully integrated cohesively without paradoxes would likely take up most of their processing and resources.
Attempting to hack into and use the Cloudarks processing would undoubtedly speed up the proces.
Meanwhile the Sol Divisive would likely want to use to understand paracausality and have a deeper connection to their deity the Witness.
Sorry for the excessive ramble...
I would love if Oryx did actually return. He’s still my favorite big bad we’ve faced. King’s Fall is still my favorite raid of all time. Oryx returning would be scary stuff. Think of the cutscenes with him and Xivu Arath alone after we were given the Ghosts Dungeon lore. Yes please. Oryx and Xivu v Guardians and Savathun when she inevitably returns? Sign me up.
I love the fact that the Eliksni actually made them a submarine.
What about the fact that the armor sets are all called "... of the Taken King", but they all look like the Lucent Hive. Wouldnt this indicate that this is what Oryx looks like after being resurrected?
I like this, or looking at it from the other side, what if they are ‘… of the taken king’ because WE (the guardian) have them now and somehow have taken the place as new king?
@@themanwithamission Xivu expresses great distress and disappointment that we didn’t assume the mantle of Taken King. we hear her say it in the dungeon via calcified fragment.
I have always stood by that I think there is a third "angle" to the grand cosmic struggle that Destiny constitutes. Everything in Destiny is set up in threes. Three classes, three energy types, three types of humanity, the three Hive Gods, etc. If so, there needs to be a third angle to the cosmic struggle between Light and Dark. Personally, I have always imagined that to be the title of the game, "Destiny", of which our Guardian is effectively the angle of, which combines both Light and Dark into a new kind of synthesis. A third logic, to round out the Bomb Logic of the Light and the Sword Logic of the Darkness. Let us call this the "Gun Logic", because it's about going forward (Aim down the sights and fire, as a philosophical concept).
If Oryx returns, I suspect it will be through a combination of the Light and the Dark, pushing him into a realm as a kind of counterpart to our Guardian. A trajectory, which is only appropriate for the Navigator of the Hive. Especially if there are plans for a post "Light and Dark" saga Destiny, there's just too much lore invested into the Taken King (Oryx), the Witch Queen (Savathun), and whatever title is appropriate for Xivu Arath for them not to bring it forward into the next story. Even if they don't do it before the end of the Light and Dark saga, this is way too much of a Chekhov's gun at this point not to.
This plus the fact that with how little characterization Oryx received (outside of the books of sorrow) theres a lot of potential in the idea of him grappling with everything thats happened and his faith being a lie, as well as figuring out what the Hive are supposed to do without the Sword Logic ruling over them
Isn't xivu the god of war? I do agree, there is just soooo much lore into them, when say compared to the cabal, which is a whole faction, yet this is 3 member of a faction. I like the idea of there being a 3rd, which is us! Now we are comfortably welding darkness and light, we might well be that person already.
In the old World of Darkness table top rpg setting, there's three cosmological "entities" that make up reality, the wyld, the weaver and the wyrm.
The wild is unrestrained creative chaos, it creates instinctively but without plan.
The weaver is order, it neither creates nor destroys, but preserves the things the wyld makes.
The Wyrm is entropy, it unmakes the things the Weaver has solidified when their time is due and then the cycle of creation, preservation and destruction begins again.
(Except in the creation myth of the setting the Weaver gets annoyed about the Wyrm destroying all her cool stuff and wraps it in her webs, driving it mad and changing it from normal entropy in to mad Corruption, thus making it a source of evil etc etc etc)
Applying this concept to Destiny, the Traveller is the Wyld, and the Witness represents the corrupted Wyrm, a force of omnicidal destruction. So Where's the equivalent force of the Weaver?
It doesn't match 100% of course because they're different settings, but i thought the comparison was interesting
@@SymbioteMullet The Witness is the Wyrm and the Weaver. It wants to irredicate everything, but wants to control, how creation and destruction works. No chaotic life, just existing and destruction. A more simple and controllable state for the universe.
common misconception but "bomb logic" isn't a thing, or at least is not a light-oriented concept to counter the sword logic. the sword logic isn't even something the witness prescribes to, it's a warping of the witness's ideals by the hive. bomb logic was a concept that was thought up by mara as a means to beat the cold ruthlessness of the sword logic, but it's not like "the traveler has bomb logic and the witness has sword logic" or something.
So, If I am right, all one would need to revive Oryx is to find a portion of his mind that is still intact. For instance, could his essence be extracted from the touch of malice and poured back into his body? Or could even Quira play some role as she did simulate a version of Oryx and perhaps that digital mind could be used as a substitute?
Also funnily enough all that remains of Quira is her head that I guess would have been stored in the same fashion as Savathun and now Orxy.
Didn't we kill quoria? Season of the splicer.
@@AnonymousTakenGhost we did but the head didnt explode like a normal hydra
quria is dead, the only part of oryx contained in the touch of malice is his heart. i'll repeat it as much as it needs repeating, the touch of malice isn't a way to revive oryx, the "i will live on through you" stuff is just a passing of the torch of his ideology. to craft the touch of malice required to learn his history and mantle his ideals to forge all the pieces of it.
I feel like Oryx is still in there… in one of Xivu Arath’s words in the calcified fragments, she wonders if there is anything left of him in there.
I started thinking about this, and I noticed something. When we are in the final fight, we use deepsight to find which part to go to and kill the heretic… when he dies we see Oryx’s symbol… perhaps he tried to help us? Sure he hates us for killing his favorite son but one thing he hates more is necromancy (I mean he cast out his other son and wiped his memory from everything but a statue). Just a thought…
That is really interesting. Maybe that’s why the ritual wasn’t working while they were down there. Oryx doesn’t want to come back. He may not be alive, but his body is his thought and his thought is that he should be dead
in which lore book does he mention his other son? This makes sense to me as Oryx is a sword logic fanatic and would deem himself unworthy of seeing the final shape
In terms of the residual neural activity, remember that when we first encountered egregore on the Glykon, and then later on the Leviathan, we were told that there was still brain activity in the deceased that it had started infesting. It kind of reminds me to when Eramis was frozen in Stasis as punishment by the Witness; she was still able to remember and absorb information (albeit mostly visions from the Witness), so it's possible that Oryx's death and egregore infection might also be part of the Witness' means of controlling and punishing them after their defeat.
*Looks at my Touch of Malice* "But we already knew that.....👀"
I love that your channel features so much kitbashing and customizing figures, you have quickly become on of my favorite channels
Just realized this reminds me of that old Doctor Who episode. The 10th found "the devil" at a bottom of a pit around a black whole. Or at least it's body. It's mind was able to move around.
Interestingly enough the warlock bonds description is "If I fail, let me be wormfood" which is the last line in the book of sorrows titled "Wormfood"
You know how we have the crown of sorrow, recovered by Savathun posing as Osiris and taken to the last city against the advice of Caityl. What if we bring back the remains of Oryx and put them in the same location as the crown. Perhaps these dark objects piling up in the same place could resurrect oryx
Waaaait. I have a worse idea.
We have the Parasite.
Put Savathûn's Worm in Oryx's body...
@@SymbioteMullet That is just the definition of asking for a disaster…
I feel like the next time we hear anything about this outside of a lore tab will be post-Final Shape. Having both the bodies of Savathun and Oryx in our possession feel like Bungie is setting up dominos for the story they wish to tell during or after the Final Shape. I'm very excited to see where this goes
Enjoy spending more and more money!
Something to kind of point out since people don't seem to be catching this detail:
They've been calling Oryx's place in the dungeon a burial site and not a crash site. And with the knowledge that Xivu has been there several times and has elected to not move the body, I think that means we've been mistaken for a long time on something: Oryx didn't crash on Titan. I believe Xivu Arath took his body and buried it there. They don't have a homeworld to take it to and since Titan was at least within the solar system they decided there after taking several of the planets away
Someone else posted that there's a Scout Rifle called Royal Chase with a lore entry explaining that Oryx's body was being monitored but had not actually entered Saturn's upper atmosphere yet when the Witness took the planets and moons, and the gravitational pull associated with taking something of that size pulled Oryx's corpse to Titan.
I cannot verify this information right now because I'm writing this at 5am in the morning for me and I'm more exhausted than a wheel right now (cause they're always "tire'd" hahaha I'll see myself out)
Damn it... It only just hit me.
Gandalf the Grey/White is the "Servent of the Sacred Fire. Wielder of the Flame of Anor"
Oryx could literally ascend past witness tier if he got his memories plus light power
How would we even destroy Oryx’s body? If it survived entry into Titan’s atmosphere and 7 years at the bottom of a freezing ocean, I can’t think of anything short of orbital bombardment that would make a dent, a capability we don’t really have anymore after Rasputin’s death.
Which would summon Xivu meaning check mate anyway
Throw it into the sun
@@tank_dempsey Or Drifter’s frying pan. I hear he’s always wanted to cook a Hive god.
If we can destroy it it’s gotta be away to 101% destroy no sliver remain just incase that sliver can be used to revive oryx.
In the lore tab of the helmet, Chalco stops talking when they hear the voice and see the face of Lisbon-3. We later see that the fireteam exploring the corpse is Lisbon-13. Do we suspect that was a typo, or was Chalco hallucinating a previous version of Lisbon, hence the squaring of their shoulders and ignoring the question?
I also saw that and was very confused
Lisbon 13, only survivor of the Kentarch 3 fireteam. ( garden of salvation/ black garden ) Always loved that lore. Interesting to see he's back and now working with the hidden.
I know this would never happen but I feel like D2 should have a season of the Hidden, in this season we’d play as the hidden and play out these crazy hidden missions. Like, Imagine seeing a cut scene where the Marco shoots the Gouging Light sparrow to prevent the tendrils from spreading.
At least we know that the Witness is against resurrection because of darkness logic. It knew all along Oryx was there when Titan was taken and moreso with Xivu's visits. Knowing they won't bring him back as long as their faith in the darkness holds as it is, is somewhat reassuring.
Theory: we need all the help we can to defeat the witness hence the new alliance with cabal and fallen, we know that savathun helped the traveler and wasn’t as evil as we thought. The hidden now have oryx and savathuns bodies what if we let the ghost revive savathun and use her to persuade xivu and oryx that it’s there best interest to help the guardians and defeat the witness once and for all
Nah. Xivu considers Savathun a traitor, which she is, and won't listen to her.
As for Oryx idk. But I would've destroyed Oryx's body
@@mp6732 xivu follows whatever oryx says as seen in the calcified fragments. If oryx helps the traveller, xivu will too.
@@mp6732 they should’ve destroyed both Savathuns and oryx’s bodies but ikora wants to keep them for some reason and I think the twist will be savathun will come back but will be on our side and it’ll be a Ciatil and calus situation all over again
I love listening to your voice. Its helping me get through my hospital visit. I hope to listen more.
Touch of Malice could be the reason he still grows. Perhaps it could be the means for the Taken King's grand return...
I love the idea of one of the greatest threats to humanity returning just because we wouldn’t part with our cool gun
All the hive have natural forces evolution when there main body or avatar dies outside of thron world they gain immunity to whatever killed them b4 oryx has a advanced version of this I mean he is the hive god of death also he died bc he wanted to but his body was to powerful to die even at like 10 percent power full power oryx is insane while his sisters where in black holes for millions n millions of years he was fighting n growing stronger thats how he got so much bigger then them
I think dreaming city curse savathun started wasnt to feed her worm but to feed oryxs worm to keep him alive on lifesupport since she was going to get rid of her worm to join the light anyway... just food for thought
No one:
Not a single soul in the universe:
Not even dust:
Oryx: i'll fuckin do it again
Why do i find it strangely wholesome that xivu mourns at oryx’s grave, i thought they had no emotion and were just worriers but ig the hive gods actually, if even just a little, care about each other
HOW MANY TIMES WE'RE GUNNA TEACH YOU A LESSON OLD MAN!!??!?
Oryx: I love the young guardians
DID HE SAY FENCHURCH EVERIS?
“I never know where my uncle finds these things”
Yep he's a known member of the hidden
"I thought you were dead..."
"Brother, I have always hated you..."
This gives me the impression that between the implications of TKO-300 being-at a technical level-still active and a fireteam prior to Chalco's having been compromised in some way (coupled with the mention of the Crown of Sorrows), the armor we receive from the dungeon may well belong to a mindspun fireteam of Guardians, each being influenced by the will of Oryx. To what ends? Who knows.
You know, this is something I've always wondered but was so niche that it's never warranted being brought up before.
What if someone's mind is destroyed, but their body is still alive? Could a Ghost "resurrect" them, even if they aren't... biologically dead, but brain dead? Especially now that we know Darkness is tied to consciousness, the question is much less clear, but it does make me wonder how a Guardian's continuity of memories and consciousness works even with normal rezzing.
Also, a really fun tangent, is what's happened to Oryx really that far off from what the Final Shape would be like? The entire universe being perfected (aka incapable of change, because any deviation would necessarily be less perfect than that end state) wouldn't leave a lot of room for cognition or awareness, both for a lack of stimuli to be recieved because it's all self-similar and nothing to be aware of it, because theres no distinction between the "winner" and reality at that point.
Is the Witness's goal really just a universal... statue? Perfect and eternal, and as dead as something can be?
The Witness gifted us Stasis, the power to make things unchanging.
I think you may be on the money.
@Symbiote Mullet the thing is, technically Stasis crystals do display a sort of "quantum computation" despite their stillness, which could be comparable to cognition. But honestly, I don't know what would be worse, being totally dead with absolutely nothing happening ever again, or being aware and driven insane by being locked into "perfection" for an eternity with no hope of change, or death.
Suddenly the Light allowing for a little chaos and failure, and death, doesn't exactly sound like a great argument for why we or anyone should side with the Witness...
Yes, a ghost can resurrect a braindead body, that’s how we, guardians are resurrected! Because the light only manifests itself in the physical world, resurrected guardians don’t remember their past life due to darkness not being tied into their resurrection. That’s why Crow didn’t remember anything until he came in contact with the Crown of Sorrow and the Nightmares of Uldren. If a ghost were to bring Oryx back now however, he would remember everything due to the Taken and Darkness energy still resonating in his body, thus keeping his consciousness within that energy, and outing it as calcified memory fragments. The fact that Oryx can still pick up information, seems to me like he’s in more of a coma than actually dead. And the Taken and Darkness energy inside him is keeping his body AND MIND preserved.
Also, the current theory on the Witness’ intentions of the “Final Shape” is that the Witness is trying to lay contact between the Darkness’ Mental existence and the Light’s physical manifestations, thus explaining the link, using the veil because it is both Light and Dark, this also explains how the veil is organic, it uses light manifestations to create its fungus like form, and the darkness is used to store the Neomuni’s minds, connecting these with the cloudark, the veil is the perfect example of light and dark manifesting its own reality. The Witness’ “Final Shape”, is to reshape reality to it’s own will, his own world according to his mind, using the Traveler’s Light to bring that mental reality into the physical world. Like how the Veil connected to the CloudArk to form the digital world, partially formed by the Neomuni’s own will in their mind, connecting to the Veil’s Darkness, and the Veil’s physical shape of a fungus like shape being created from the light.
@_EliteNightmare crow got his memory back from making contact with Savathûn in season of the Lost, and her presumably using Deepsight on him. His contact with the crown of sorrow wasn't until 6 months later.
What would have happened if the ritual was a success? I mean yeah Oryx would come back, but without his memories. He’s a guardian now. So if we just kill the ritual conductors how would Oryx react to all of this? No one is there to get him back on track of what he’s supposed to do and the only thing in front of him are guardians who know he lost his memories. Best case scenario is we convince him we’re the good guys, but I’m sure it’s not as easy as I’m saying.
He would get his memories back eventually all hive pantheons including xivu and savathuns hive respect oryx of extreme high regard n it makes sense I mean he is their god so they would take him in and give them his memories back then he would be a problem
Last year in Season of the Risen, we came to know that Savathûn used psychic projections to control her Lucent Hive. It is very much possible that had her Hive resurrected Oryx, she would've projected herself into his mind as well to do her bidding. Echtar, who is shown in the dungeon, is Oryx's Sword from the TTK dlc, and he is alive and has the title as something of Savathûn, despite Savathûn being technically dead. So it can be concluded that she still holds a grip over the Lucent Hive mentally despite her body being dead and under hold.
The idea of a SCP type of organization in the destiny universe is a really cool concept I've never thought about.
Could this mean a new sword made out of Oryx for Guardians to craft?
That sword could only be called "Logic"
@@SymbioteMullet We actually already have a sword named logic
sorta There is a ornament for the Lament called "The Logic" I 100% want a Oryx sword that looks like the strand sword from this season
That helm of the taken king read felt like an SCP reading. I involuntarily had to say “You do not recognize the bodies in the water.”
Imagine from Oryx's perspective that he wakes up years after getting dunked on by the Light just to see his kin getting dunked on by guardians using Darkness. Then someone comes along, drops a dead worm into his lap and says "By the way, your life is a lie. The worm told me so", then leaves.
I love that during the Two Lies, Two Truths missions, we assumed that "the Taken King will rise again" was just a meta comment on them bringing King's Fall into D2. but now we realize she was cluing us in on her plans. In Season of the Risen and the old Savathun's Song strike, Savathun was experimenting on guardians, stealing their light. I wonder if the wizard and ghost combo in the boss encounter of GoTD is the final result of those experimentations, and if so- what is missing? Was it only our intervention that prevented his resurrection in the Light? If so, and these hive were under the orders of Savathun and Immaru, who want to protect the Traveler....I feel like it's more likely that Oryx is brought back as an ally. He has been proven wrong in the Sword Logic when we beat him but didn't take up his mantle, and would be resurrected with no memory of his previous status of the Taken King.
Wild lore implications here. Bravo, Bungie.
RANDOM THOUGHT AT START OF VIDEO. it doesn't make sense for the hive to want to resurrect Oryx for hive reason, sword logic etc, but they are. Is this because its simply their last hope? They have no alternative, they don't want their race to die out as much as they respect their 'religion' so they try to bring him back. By that logic, this means the witness must bring the end also for the Hive, i.e everyone is going to die unless EVERYONE stops the witness. Could down the road, Oryx, The Taken King, be an ally of sorts?
Remember, the Hive have already given themselves a loophole in the Logic to excuse the attempt. Effectively, "If it is heresy it will fail, if it works it can't be heresy" or something close to that. Basically if they try and nothing happens, they didn't actually do anything heretical because the Logic holds strong, and if they succed then the Logic is less restrictive than they thought and they've changed it, meaning what they just did can't be heretical
You're forgetting that there are two completely separate factions of Hive at this point, the OG and the Lucent Hive/Savathun's Brood. One has had millions of years of indoctrination to reject ressurection, necromancy, etc etc, and the other basically worship the Traveler and Savathun specifically at this point, who always questioned the Sword Logic, specifically recruited Nokris to learn necromancy, and is herself ressurected in the Light.
Don't get me wrong, it's very much an open question whether Oryx will stick with his principles and will basically commit "unaliving" if he is revived because he's the one that championed the idea that necromancy and ressurection was heresy, or if exposure to the forgetting that the Light provides will let him at least explore the possibility he was wrong and stick around.
Also, yes, the Witness is out to kill everyone and everything in the universe, and we need more allies (or enemies of the Witness at least) than not at this point. Anyone who still can't see that as the Witness's objective, I've personally got a bridge to sell them.
Well the Lucent Hive don't really follow the sword logic as strictly as "normal" hive, not to mention Hive Necromancy is blasphemous to the sword logic completely.
@@MelancholicBodhisattva ty for lengthy response, only been following the lore for a month or so! Very interesting.
@matthew knowles welcome to the asylum then! Going down the rabbit holes are fun, but don't forget to touch some grass every once in a while
Oh and fyi, if oryx gets rezzed, and he remembers, he would be beyond pissed. Him coming back goes against everything he believed in and fought for.
10 bucks drifter owes oryx money
Or the other way around. With ol' Drifter there really is no way of knowing for certain.
It's probably Neomuna Veil 000. But could be Nezarec Vessel 000. NEV-000
Bro how many characters are they gonna pull a palpatine on?
In a world where immortality and being revived are major parts of the gameplay? I’m sure quite a few, except here it actually makes sense as we know hive gods can be brought back
It's science fiction...no one ever really dies.
Tbf they have been hinting at oryx coming back aince the start of d2 if you looked hard enough
They’ve been hinting at oryx’s return since shadowkeep if not earlier , it isn’t like it’s out of nowhere. I honestly had a feeling he wasn’t dead when we killed him in TTK bc he’s the only hive god we’ve beaten that didn’t disintegrate lmao
Just Taniks, Oryx, and Kelgorath owned by guardians.
The possibility of the taken king returning, no less as lucent hive, is so terrifying that I myself, when entering that arena for the first time could think of nothing but. "Oh dear traveller, NO, this cannot be happening!"
I love this dungeon.
Yeah he’s literally just Godwyn the golden post death
Most troubling part is what Xivu Arath will do now. She visited his body over and over, and now the Hidden have stolen the corpse and squirreled it away somewhere. She will not be pleased to realize it is missing to say the least, and angering the God of War is not normally a good move.
Oh god oh fuck
I just want to note that I do play destiny every once and awhile and dearly love the game but what I've always been here for is the story this is my audio book I don't even play the destiny pve I just keep up with the story I do find it fascinating and amazing that a I can love a games story and 80% the story I quite literally play destiny every few months and watch these lore video's daily I love destiny and byf's videos keep it up!
What if Mara Sov took Oryx's worm? She already claimed some substance from Oryx's Throne World. Could she be the next Taken "King"?
Theres also a chance Xivu claimed it given her frequent visits, or it simply died and faded away given the dissolution of Oryx's tithing servants and the time passed since Oryx's death.
Mara’s motivations have always been uncertain but I find it hard to believe she’s interested in taking up the mantle of monarch of the taken in oryx’s place. The taken are something tied solely to the darkness ie the witness and Mara hasn’t shown any interest in playing to the witness’s favor. Hive magic, the ability to take or any other power that puts her in service of the witness goes against her only 100% confirmed interest, that being her own and that of the awoken people. Not saying she has no use for it but following in oryx’s footsteps doesn’t seem like her style.
@@dumbsterdives I doubt it, Xivu expressed great disappointment that WE didn’t assume the mantle of Taken King, according to the sword logic, only we, the beings who slew Oryx, could assume his mantle. Until we are slain of course.
Oryx’s purpose was the learn… he is the only one to have communed with the Deep… and information about the Deep is what we need. Risk doesn’t matter if we can’t stop the Witness. Whatever it takes.
This is exiting I hated the fact that the ominous hive gods are now soft and pathetic
Wouldn't it be cool if there was some sort of interaction with touch of malice if you use it during the dungeon? Maybe an extra calcified fragment with a voice line from oryx?
I brought it along on my first run hoping for this
I'm guessing they discover a link between The Veil and consciousness, memories, and The Veil is just close enough to have an effect. The link between matter and consciousness, mind and body connection, like a soul to vessel, can be used to resurrect. And we'll find a way to use it, bring back Cayde, and slowly learn from him as he remembers what happened to his consciousness dying as an Exo, since Clarity (darkness) was used to pretty much connect minds to Exo frames without them breaking down and going crazy.
I think part of the issue with destroying Oryx's remains is that if it is a bomb, then we don't know what would set the bomb off. What's more, we can't be certain if the Lucent Hive in the dungeon were the first to try tampering with the body in some way. If Xivu Arath was able to find it then you can bet that Savathun definitely found it, and Savathun is not above pulling tricks like this even if it is her brother. And if the place is full of Egregore coral, then maybe even The Witness did something.
NEV - 000 could the Veil but I think it could also be code for something of Nezarec's. Given Nezarec's ability to produce hallucinations and nightmares from just parts of his corpse even when he is dead, leads me to believe it might be something related to him. Especially given Chalco's briefing in the beginning, I think the argument for Nezarec is strong.
I can’t think of a full acronym for NEV but my knee jerk is nezerac- maybe Nezerac Evil Villian. There’s bits and pieces of Nezzy all over the place and he told us after the raid that while his body may be destroyed his mind will linger. His lingering mind is a whole new kind of terrifying now that there’s a body without a mind to pair with a mind without a body. I would assume there are strong similarities between corpses of formerly powerful darkness beings that we can use to learn more about their weaknesses. The more we understand about them the closer we come to understanding the witness.
I thought you covered Oryx gaining power from exploration back in D1. I’ve been under the impression that we’ve been bringing him back to life step by step thanks to toting around touch of malice.
I keep thinking back to one of Savathun's two truths two lies, about how the Taken King would rise again. This is particularly worrying, given everything that's been going on
Helm of the Taken Kings Lore Tab reads like an SCP article, holy shivers.
Personally, with the fact that The Darkness is liked to the mind and Oryx had so much influence over it; I would wager that the energy that resides within Oryx is just continuing what it did when he was alive. Oryx was all about his gains, his influence, and spreading that influence. Oryx's body continuing to grow, continuing to spread calcified fragments, and continue to grow in influence with these egregore coral is more of the energies continuing to follow the will of Oryx from when he was still alive due to his extreme control over it. Where his sisters have had to go about their influence in their unique ways, he simply just dominated it. If Darkness truly did follow the will of such a being while he was alive; who is to say it doesn't still respect that command well into death.
Could it be possible the NEV stands for New Egregore Variant? As in all the new coral growths we’ve been harvesting that Chalco would’ve also very recently and relevantly performed an analysis on? That might also explain where Oryx’s consciousness has gone while his body is still alive on a cellular level. And that would also have some SERIOUS story implications for where this season is going with Sloane and why the “taken radio” gets stronger whenever she uses the processed egregore, instead of just her connection to Ahsa. Maybe we’ve been feeding her taken bits straight from the king himself?
This is good stuff!
I've been saying to my friends and anyone who would listen saying oryx isn't dead and that he would land on saturn or one of its moons this dungeon made me so hype and that it proved mr right I'm so happy rn
The way they're describing it is the artifact found in the crucible map (audio hallucinations, visual hallucinations) but I honestly don't remember if the hidden ever investigated the artifact there
I wonder if Xivu would be able to bring Oryx back in the same way that Oryx brought her and Savathun back. My idea would be when Xivu learns the truth of the lies of the worm familiar that this discovery might bring Oryx back since he was the navigator of not just the stars but of information and discovery too.
So we have been tasked with taking the ring of power to mount doom
12:29 The Thrall in the background just needed an excuse to get out of there 😂
Once upon a time I watched a video of explaining what happens when someone is taken (sorry for not siting it but this was years ago. Maybe byf maybe evade maybe someone else) and spoke about how the new powers an enemy gains after being taken is a reflection of a weakness they had prior (vandel snipers gain a shield so they can’t be sniped. Thrall dash around so they are harder to hit as melee combatants etc). So what if oryx’s body still being alive IS his new ability. Think about it, can we say for sure his abilities he had during the raid weren’t his abilities already as the taken king. Remember he did “take” himself after the campaign but before the raid.
My logic is this, he desired to be synonymous with death itself and more than likely wished to become the final shape itself. As the taken king, pseudo king of the hive as a whole he didn’t have any real weakness except death itself which can only be permanent inside his throne world. His throne world which he turned “inside out” and combined into his dreadnaught. So at the point of him taking himself, his only weakness was death itself and which was very possible both because he was just beaten by us and was inside his ship/world. So as a new “power” gifted as a taken enemy was that his body shall never die. Mind, soul gone but the body remains. Still growing.
Also his soul lives on in the touch of malice soooo, idk. He May have more than one way to come back
I wonder if someone has brought the touch of malice to see what would happened.
I had no idea that the final boss arena was literally oryx's grave. It was pointed out to me and I was absolutely blown away by seeing oryx. God, this dungeon is quite literally Bungie's Magnum Opus, they did so well with GOTD. Bravo Bungie... Bravo.
You know this whole thing with oryx's body not being dead but his consciousness not being there reminds a lot of Godwyn the Golden from elden ring and how he could not die a true death , so hes body kept growing and branching into the world making a new form of life ( those who live in death) . Pretty interesting parallels ngl
The very fact the body isn't dead gives me major anxiety where ever it's contained they better really really contain it well that's like keter/ applyon level in S.C.P terms
@@johngancarcik5682 what's keter buddy ?
@@yagamilight775 bad it can't easily be contained and needs constant surveillance with special requirements needed
nev could rever to nezerac, blank blank but its hard to tell maybe nezeracs, expired, vessel
Regarding the Egregore coral growth and spores, you're overlooking the fact that Titan's ocean is FULL of life. We are absolutely surrounded by undersea life during the seasonal activities and the dungeon. When that stuff dies, the organic material drifts down to the abyssal zone like snow as it falls apart along the way. The flooring of the methane sea is likely several meters thick with a slurry of dead tissues and debris, which would be prime food for Egregore.
WGX being Xivu makes much more sense than my first thought: Worm God Xol
Oryx's body growing even after his mind is seemingly absent reminds me of Godwyn the Golden from Elden Ring. His Mind was killed, yet his body remained, which kept growing and became a massive grotesque creature that spawns the death root. I don't know if they took inspiration from Elden Ring, but maybe the Deathroot is comparable to the Egregore. I definitely think Egregore has a massive role to play in the future story of Destiny, whatever it may be.
This basically confirms when Saloane speaks after using the agregore that she's tuned into the witness's memories and that Ahsa is filtering it out since it's growing not just from dead matter, but dead matter imbued on a cellular level with taken energy
In my mind I see byf as a guardian sitting around a fire with new lights telling them these story’s and things going on
NEV-000 sounds like it could be the Veil. Considering what we know about it. As for Oxry, store the body on the farthest place we can travel to, examine the body, keep some samples, and destory it.
Oryx being my favorite destiny character (No offense to Zavala and Cayde lovers), I am SO happy he has imminent relevancy, man... I love everything about him and the expansion he was introduced from.
Also a nice touch that when it becomes evident we're getting an Oryx spotlight out of this, Byf uses Taken King ost
Man... I don't think I'll ever not tolerate Byf's channel, this is prime, primer than Prime saying prime in Transformers Prime.