Honestly I think 90 euro is very fair. I was figuring you would say double that! Considering the work you put into bringing this to market that is more than fair!
@@der8auer-en A clean looking box looks better than edgy alien designs. Just keep doing your stuff, as it looks great even for poor people like me who couldn't ever buy it but at last can watch it.
No chance I'll be buying a 285K and delidding it, but 90 euro for a small volume production run heater product seems pretty good value to me (given the amount of engineering required to design and implement it).
Unless you're doing direct die I don't know why you would do it, replacing the TIM with conductonaut is a bad idea because conductonaut dries out in a year or so, turning into dry black flakes.
@celeriumlerium8266 conductonaut I haven't heard of gallium drying out like that unless it's formed a metal oxide by reacting to copper or eaten away at aluminum? My 4790K de-lidded with conductonaut on the die has been fine for 5 years
@@kekoraaaa He has a video on it, "I missed the obvious problem with my Threadripper". It converts into gallium oxide quickly due to unknown conditions. I put conductonaut on my 7700k and had the same problem, between die and IHS (no aluminium) it turned into a dry black "dust" after about 1 and a half years.
I recently delidded my 7700k with the Die Mate 2 and I was similarly shocked when I saw the temps. Stock with an NH-D15 it was around 65-70c during a run of R23, but afterwards it topped out at like 50-55c. Absolutely crazy. Thank you for developing such great tools for the community =)
Mom: Son what are you doing with the Air Fryer? Son: I'm delidding a 285k, what does it look like? Mom: okay honey, just make sure to clean it out after you use it. 🤣🤣🤣
I can feel that. When I was 17 years old and did Dry Ice OC at home I had to dry my mainboard afterwards. I put it in the oven at 80°C. My mom was like "what the hell are you doing here"
Because this is a new channel he made exclusively for English viewers. His original channel where he used to mix German and English content, has double the sub count.
this channel is new, roman used to upload a english version and then a german version to a channel, but decided to split the content and now has this channel and the original one
It would be great if you could get Intel to disclose the temperature at which the die can deteriorate or get damaged. This is crucial information considering people using other methods might just cross the threshold and damage or degrade the processor.
Silicium is a strong material. The die itself will stay intact way before some of the tin balls on the PCB and the pads under the ceramic caps start to melt and make the chip unusable. Preheating plates for tin soldering can go above 250°C and a reflow process or a hot air station can peak at more than 350 so there is some comfortable margins with this indium solder with such a low fusion point under 200. Since those YTers started delidding soldered CPUs, I've always wonder why they didn't use such inexpensive tools.
I would be more worried about the SMD components on the CPU pcb board. If their solder melts, some may fall off, especially if there is violent shaking, like the one when you break the regular glue. Inert die should withstand solder melting temperatures used during manufacture.
Diffusion does exponentially increase with temperature, but it's such a short time that it would still be meaningless. Also, the CPU has to be soldered at the factory (with much higher temperatures), so I guess it's fine to heat it up to sub-200 degrees temperatures (while CPU is off ofc).
You could analyze the die's convexity (with the water block mounted) with a high-powered CT Scan, but that would kill the CPU at that ridiculous level of radiation. You really are brilliant, Roman, and you deserve more subscriptions.
everything is much simpler, you can make a strip of plasticine around the chip, after pressing on the plasticine there will be an imprint. After that, all that remains is to measure the height of the plasticine around the perimeter of the chip. If the chip bends, then the plasticine in the center will be equal in height to the plasticine in the corners
It's always so interesting to hear about how this works and what people are doing with extreme stuff like this. It's super scary, but I love watching you all do it! lol
I not only have no plan to upgrade to the Arrow Lake CPUs, but wouldn't take the chance to de-lid one if I did. Still watched the whole video. Great work Roman 👍
This was an incredibly entertaining and informative video. Insane decrees in temps there. Hopefully this will be their format for the coming years of this platform and we see some huge gains.
Thank you der8auer for your consistent time and effort into making these products. Your level of transparency and honestly are unparallelled and you're one of my favourite PC UA-camrs to watch!
So much respect for you to go through all the effort that you do. You personally test and tweak the settings of the CPU in order to test and verify everything to the best of your capabilities. On top of that, you go out of your way to separately sell the products in order to not force anyone into purchasing something that they may not want or need. You genuienly want the best product and best user experience for the buyer and it is conveyed to the audience so big props man! ❤️💯🔥👍
Looking at the bear die I kinda chuckled at Intel’s comment from a few years ago: “we don’t sell glued CPUs”. Looks like someone finally learned how to glued CPUs and sell them🤣
Quite amusing seeing the evolution of your delid tools. I've still got my delrin plastic one for the ivy bridge era chips. Things were a bit more simple back then lol
I mean Caseking could sell pre-delidded CPU's but I guess it's not worth the RMA hassle. Normal users don't delid so you can pretty much be sure the delidded CPU's will be hammered with OC.
Probably too much risk. Selling proven delidders is much saver than providing a delidding service where besides killing the CPU during the delidding process there also have risks associated with a CPU which is not well protected and (partially) fool-proved with an IHS. Things like transport accidents, user error during installation and warranties (most countries including Germany have warranties by law that cannot be signed away) can become an financial burden for a company
I would have to give 2 years warranty according to German law if I offer a delidded CPU for sale. And there is no way I would do that with a product that I have no control over
You always find a way to delid any CPU even if the manufacturer has warned you. Greatness...Next on der8auer: deliding the roof of my house to improve cooling and overclocking my heating/cooling system 😆
9:52 you can still see the IHS right? I would loosen the bolts, apply a suction cup to the IHS and lift it simultaniously. That way its a single-step process. Can maybe even create some vacuum seal in another way, like having the top of the IHS delidder have a rubber seal, with a nipple on top, and than just attach one of those handbilges to create a vacuum seal to lift it together with the delidder top. EDIT: ah its already finalized, nevermind :)
So much work for this platform. Too bad the CPUs probably arent worth the trouble. But all of this will likely be useful in the future, too, so at least the knowledge will be helpful. I'm waiting to see how deliddable the 9800X3D will be. Would love to run it direct die. :)
@@jankees4037 a better CPU to water delta means I can run hotter water in my loop, increasing thermal efficiency on the radiator for less fan speed (noise). That's what delidding does.
A friend and I used an oven in the chemistry lab to ease delidding of his 7950x3d. We got the CPU to 100°C (we were afraid of going any higher) and then popped it into the Delid Die Mate. It seemed to work well, but without a comparison CPU, we could not actually determine whether it made any difference.
use floss to cut glue, then position the cpu upside down between two cans, apply heat from underneath with hair dryer until IHS falls off... simple and 100% safe AM5 delid
Their transport would be a mess. If products that are designed to take a beating sometimes already come damaged, imagine the courier yeeting a CPU without heatshield
Too much risk for the reputation. Idiots end up buying it, crack the die, try to RMA under false pretense, manufacturer has to prove it wasn't DOA with a hairline fracture. All of that just to satisfy probably 10-50k people worldwide. You'd have people crying about 'why isn't my i3 released as bare-die and only the top of the line chip gets it' or complaining that 'I'm paying more for a binned CPU with NO metal? This doesn't make sense'
make it a Der8auer special edition that comes with a water cooling kit. pack it with IHS but unsoldered straight from intel or amd. limited series of course depending on water blocks available at the moment.
Why not design it so from the start you put cpu upside down? Then you would just cut open a witness window on the side to able to see if IHS has moved or not. Avoiding the heating of the IHS the second time and spilling the indium on the PCB from the first heating. Originally in factory when they put IHS and substrate together the IHS is facing down for that reason. Also scraping off the indium leftovers on tile design - could this part be as dangerous as delidding itself? Maybe it's safer to scrape diagonally to avoid catching the wedge between the tile's border?
It's tricky because the heater obviously has to be thermally bridged to the IHS, so the heater would have to be able to hold onto the IHS stronger than the force pulling the IHS off the CPU. Probably simpler and easier just to do it this way, if it doesn't cause any issues for the CPU to get this hot.
I love this mentality of "here's how everything works, here's even the hidden menu-you can do whatever you want with it, even kill your CPU, but at least you have full control over it." Not to mention the build quality and design… These guys are truly on a whole different level, way, way above.
guess you're a big StarGate movie fan .... your constellation marking tablet tattoos is a great giveaway ... excellent video thank you for all the knowledge your share... cheers 😎
Do you think it would be possible to cut fins directly into the ihs instead of delidding? Maybe we can finally make use of that thick heatspreader on AM5. Oh also will the indium solder stick to the surface mount components? I would rather not have to clean up tiny tiny solder bridges haha
Роман, крышку лучше сдвигать не вдоль кристалла, а поперёк, как в скальпаторе для 1700 2:27. Для этого предварительно отпаять два мешающих резистора 3:30, а после снятия крышки вернуть их на место.
I did something similar with the 12900K. Ran Prime95 for 30 minutes. Pulled the CPU and delid. Took one push to come part. The problem for Arrow Lake is the SMDs clearance of course. Still doable at home.
90 euro is a fair price if upcoming next gen cpu delidders could fit in that same heater case aswell, it could be one time buy, or atleast for multiple upcoming gens. Very nice job! keep it up.
I reckon this is perfect for boutique system builders rather than individual PC builder-owners. What amazing improvement the delidding makes. I wonder how much R&D Intel spend on the heat spreader & alternatives to it, given how much extra it costs their customers on cooling to get their CPUs below that thermal max.
it is a lot of fun for someone with extreme overclocking needs, and i hope you sell a-lot of kits as a previous buyer of your delidders, but i have to be honest and say that a max ~5 or 6% in best case gain in multicore for all the expense and work/risk should carefully be considered by everyone
DaaaD a blokes selling his Pc for $500 Yeah ok son but does it come with a delided cpu No its old Tell him his dreaming OK dad DAAAAD yes son i dug a hole Mum yes dad The lads an idea's man :)
I don't know if you had this kind of comment before, but from where I am, someone will buy your product and then go online and offer delidding service for $15. I don't know how you can make money from this, but you are a super enthusiast, bro. I used one of those services in the past, but since I moved to AMD (AM4) , I never felt the need to delid my CPU.
The heater controller could have a progress bar, ETA and a piezo for acoustic indicator that its ready - like start clicking near target and beeping on target
Very cute and you must be living your dream being able to combine a fun Hobby with work 😇👍love it as it reminds me of times gone by. I was wondering why you did not design it with a hinge so it only would need two screws to close and secure the two parts together? If the the 285 were not so expensive even I would consider delidding one and get all you nice tools you all designed and made. Who knows if / when Intel comes out with the next version of CPU with same LGA 1851 footprint and prices that may come down. it's looking in a crystal ball. I enjoyed this video, two thumbs up.
15:30 This is getting super fancy! If that's the route you're taking, Roman, why not create a gearbox to turn one screw in a single direction and make the delidder move back and forth when it reaches a stopper on each direction (similar to a differential in a car)? This way, you can keep the screwdriver in place all the time, turning it in only one direction while you watch the delidder and its gears do all the work.
Are we machining the gears? Also.. do we have the Swiss dwarves on staff to assemble the tiny gears, as they do for the watches? Also.. could we compromise on a custom Allen wrench that allows a full rotation based on the height of the heater so you don't have to do that thing, that I was seeing in the video, that we've all been through with an Allen wrench lol.
couldn't you just use high temp tape/glue to glue the heater to the IHS? instead heating the entire tool? You already have hole in the middle of the IHS slider. Also with this setup you could integrate the temp probe into the heater.
Careful with chip height measurements, differences in thickness in mutli-die chips is a classic issue. Direct die cooling might be a very bad idea, especially with classic thermal paste which are relatively low thermal conductivity. The extra "distace" from the cooling interface (of whichever kind) can be an issue much sooner than you might think. Try to get temperatures of all the dies to make sure they also get adequate cooling. Maybe they did the finish very well tho, looking forward to that follow up video! Especially at the edge interfaces of the dies
Curious if the heating element can be placed onto the IHS itself so when you move the delidder to break the glue, take the PCB with the CPU and drop the IHS that quick. There would also be less heat getting to the PCB and related parts. Might need a different way of tightening the delidder to make this process a single-shot but is worth thinking about.
I’d love to discuss simplified fatigue simulation and calculations with you. Should be able to estimate hypothetical fatigue for nominal materials and simplified or “equivalent” material models that approximate composites (like chiplets or pcbs)
You should sell a new block for a water cooler that solves the height issue with the surrounding components. Like the Arctic LF3. You can unscrew the copper contact plate. Could be replaced with a specially machined version that is just right for direct contact. Sell it with a contact frame that perfectly fits it. Could also shape the actual heater block part to fit the Intel cpu.
Intel/AMD should just sell an ‘Enthusiast LM Chip’ that’s got a pre Non-installed IHS (no glue, no STIM on die), a LM tube/kit, and markings on the die for exactly where to keep the IHS when installing… Fairly foolproof…
Pretty cool, I certainly have no plans on deliding, but interesting to watch none the less. I'll be more interested to see where the Ultra 200s CPU's sit performance wise once Intel, Windows, and motherboard AIB's can offer some updates and fixes to optimize it. For those of us who need to build a whole new system, like me upgrading from a laptop back to a desktop system, no point in rushing. I could get a CPU and Motherboard but I'd still be lacking a GPU until the new ones release early next year.. This whole new release cycle is a bit of a pain lol. In all honesty I think I would've preferred CPU's and GPU's to all just be announced/launched at CES. Give them time to prepare OS optimizations, BIOS, microcode, drivers, ect.. AMDs and Intels launch so far has been a mess due to a lack of optimization, everything was put out a bit premature. Get tired of hardware developers, game developers, and even car manufacturers treating the end buying customer as the final quality control check.. I just want to buy a finished product, not some unfinished lab sample..😅
i just got a Alphacool Eiszeit 2000 chiller to play around with and going to be using that on the 5090 when that comes now that i have seen this Direct Die Cooler i think im going to be needing This :D aswell
Seems like for most retail samples we see being tweaked, you can put the ring up to 4.4/4.5, the P-cores to 5.6 all-core, and the E-cores to 4.8, slap the fastest G2 RAM with 10ns first word latency or less in there, and get another 5% performance out of it stably, as compared to stock with the baffling RAM kits the early reviewers used, without much voltage change.
With everything going on at EK…don’t know if they will be around, at least in their current configuration for very long. I believe caution in anything involving EK would be smart. 😮
Roman, you are a treasure to the community, just want you to know we appreciate you dude.
Honestly I think 90 euro is very fair. I was figuring you would say double that! Considering the work you put into bringing this to market that is more than fair!
I was quite surprised as well!
I don't think that price includes the actual delider part though just the heater, but either way it's really cool!
Yes I agree.
I agree for a low volume item with all that R&D the price is a lot lower than I was expecting.
@@martinrwolfeI had pretty much assumed it'd be more expensive than the CPU.
Designer: How should it look like?
Der8auer: A box.
xD I made it myself. I can make functional stuff but not good looking haha
I respect it
As Dan Gelbart says: If it is functional, it is beautiful.
@@der8auer-enI find beauty in functionally designed products.
@@der8auer-en A clean looking box looks better than edgy alien designs. Just keep doing your stuff, as it looks great even for poor people like me who couldn't ever buy it but at last can watch it.
Thank you for showing how much work goes into it and the development process
No chance I'll be buying a 285K and delidding it, but 90 euro for a small volume production run heater product seems pretty good value to me (given the amount of engineering required to design and implement it).
It’s worth it. I’d pay $200 for one
Not me. I'd get an air fryer and test how accurate it is with my fluke temperature meter.
Unless you're doing direct die I don't know why you would do it, replacing the TIM with conductonaut is a bad idea because conductonaut dries out in a year or so, turning into dry black flakes.
@celeriumlerium8266 conductonaut I haven't heard of gallium drying out like that unless it's formed a metal oxide by reacting to copper or eaten away at aluminum? My 4790K de-lidded with conductonaut on the die has been fine for 5 years
@@kekoraaaa He has a video on it, "I missed the obvious problem with my Threadripper". It converts into gallium oxide quickly due to unknown conditions. I put conductonaut on my 7700k and had the same problem, between die and IHS (no aluminium) it turned into a dry black "dust" after about 1 and a half years.
Fantastic Roman. Really good that you share your work with us. Thanks.
I'm thinking de-lidding stresses the Foveros interconnections on the tiles.
Great content. When do you ever see a manufacturer explaining there products so well and even showing revisions and the differences
The guy who made the CHRONOS high speed camera used by some yt channels have done the same on his UA-cam channel
I recently delidded my 7700k with the Die Mate 2 and I was similarly shocked when I saw the temps. Stock with an NH-D15 it was around 65-70c during a run of R23, but afterwards it topped out at like 50-55c. Absolutely crazy. Thank you for developing such great tools for the community =)
Mom: Son what are you doing with the Air Fryer?
Son: I'm delidding a 285k, what does it look like?
Mom: okay honey, just make sure to clean it out after you use it.
🤣🤣🤣
I can feel that. When I was 17 years old and did Dry Ice OC at home I had to dry my mainboard afterwards. I put it in the oven at 80°C. My mom was like "what the hell are you doing here"
@@der8auer-enit seems you were doomed from the start to become an engineer 😂
Wouldn't it work faster in the microwave?
@@briankleinschmidt3664 too much metal.. you'll get fireworks.. 🤣
@@robertdelange2071 or you can get the new styropyro microwave and use the plasma :)
i don't understand why this channel doesn't have more subscribers. Every video is interesting.
Not enough hair
Because this is a new channel he made exclusively for English viewers. His original channel where he used to mix German and English content, has double the sub count.
this channel is new, roman used to upload a english version and then a german version to a channel, but decided to split the content and now has this channel and the original one
The answer is obvious : nobody needs this!
Also it's a very technical channel dedicated to a small niche market of the computer community.
It would be great if you could get Intel to disclose the temperature at which the die can deteriorate or get damaged. This is crucial information considering people using other methods might just cross the threshold and damage or degrade the processor.
Silicium is a strong material. The die itself will stay intact way before some of the tin balls on the PCB and the pads under the ceramic caps start to melt and make the chip unusable.
Preheating plates for tin soldering can go above 250°C and a reflow process or a hot air station can peak at more than 350 so there is some comfortable margins with this indium solder with such a low fusion point under 200. Since those YTers started delidding soldered CPUs, I've always wonder why they didn't use such inexpensive tools.
I would be more worried about the SMD components on the CPU pcb board. If their solder melts, some may fall off, especially if there is violent shaking, like the one when you break the regular glue.
Inert die should withstand solder melting temperatures used during manufacture.
Diffusion does exponentially increase with temperature, but it's such a short time that it would still be meaningless. Also, the CPU has to be soldered at the factory (with much higher temperatures), so I guess it's fine to heat it up to sub-200 degrees temperatures (while CPU is off ofc).
Aren't Intel cpu's degraded out of the box?
@christopherjames9843 very funny. Hahaha...
Excellent video mate and incredible work! It's so cool seeing all the behind the scenes effort that goes into making these tools
amazing solution, might become new standard for delidding.
Beautiful job Roman!👍 World of the custom PC DIY modding wouldn’t be what it is without Thermal Grizzly!💪🤘Thank u for your contribution!🫡😎
You could analyze the die's convexity (with the water block mounted) with a high-powered CT Scan, but that would kill the CPU at that ridiculous level of radiation.
You really are brilliant, Roman, and you deserve more subscriptions.
Whats about the mechanical sample he mentioned?
Feels like that would cost a fortune but would be cool to see
It definitely would be costly. Linus has one of those CT scanners, maybe a collab is in order?
everything is much simpler, you can make a strip of plasticine around the chip, after pressing on the plasticine there will be an imprint. After that, all that remains is to measure the height of the plasticine around the perimeter of the chip. If the chip bends, then the plasticine in the center will be equal in height to the plasticine in the corners
A CPU doesn’t ‘arrive’ until Roman de-lids it.
we de-lid as Romans.
This engineering you've taken the time to share is impressive.
we need cats 8auer.. get it together
Good job Roman! Love your work! Literally cant wait to get my hands on the new delidder.
Figuratively can't wait to get my hands on one, personally.
good job Roman, very proud of you and the team
Love your work Roman 😁 I think I speak for all of us, we appreciate all that you do for the enthusiast's community.
It's always so interesting to hear about how this works and what people are doing with extreme stuff like this. It's super scary, but I love watching you all do it! lol
Oh man, I remember you from xtremesystems forum so long ago. Great channel. 🏆
I really enjoyed this short review of the whole process of delidding the new chip and designing the delidder. :)
I not only have no plan to upgrade to the Arrow Lake CPUs, but wouldn't take the chance to de-lid one if I did.
Still watched the whole video.
Great work Roman 👍
What was the Hello Kitty canister for? lol
Great video btw, every der8auer part is always insanely high quality, keeps impressing me.
This was an incredibly entertaining and informative video. Insane decrees in temps there. Hopefully this will be their format for the coming years of this platform and we see some huge gains.
Really interesting upload, Roman. I really enjoyed it and there’s a ton of helpful information here. Well done on the next gen delidding tool.
Thank you der8auer for your consistent time and effort into making these products. Your level of transparency and honestly are unparallelled and you're one of my favourite PC UA-camrs to watch!
So much respect for you to go through all the effort that you do. You personally test and tweak the settings of the CPU in order to test and verify everything to the best of your capabilities. On top of that, you go out of your way to separately sell the products in order to not force anyone into purchasing something that they may not want or need. You genuienly want the best product and best user experience for the buyer and it is conveyed to the audience so big props man! ❤️💯🔥👍
Looking at the bear die I kinda chuckled at Intel’s comment from a few years ago: “we don’t sell glued CPUs”. Looks like someone finally learned how to glued CPUs and sell them🤣
Howdy,where be the felines? 😁
Not inside the IHS...
@@IIARROWSI hope not...
Yes where are Der8auer CEO Sheik and CTO Makita?
Delidding cat is necessary for success.
Please compare the vout of the delidded to the non delidded.
Quite amusing seeing the evolution of your delid tools. I've still got my delrin plastic one for the ivy bridge era chips. Things were a bit more simple back then lol
Got an idea : why don't you offer delidding service directly, or even resell delidded chips ? It's becoming so complex and risky...
I mean Caseking could sell pre-delidded CPU's but I guess it's not worth the RMA hassle. Normal users don't delid so you can pretty much be sure the delidded CPU's will be hammered with OC.
"for aale my de-lidded Core Ultra, never over-clocked, one careful owner..."
Probably too much risk. Selling proven delidders is much saver than providing a delidding service where besides killing the CPU during the delidding process there also have risks associated with a CPU which is not well protected and (partially) fool-proved with an IHS. Things like transport accidents, user error during installation and warranties (most countries including Germany have warranties by law that cannot be signed away) can become an financial burden for a company
I would have to give 2 years warranty according to German law if I offer a delidded CPU for sale. And there is no way I would do that with a product that I have no control over
@@der8auer-en do it outside of Germany where EU laws don't apply. like Norway. ^^
The glue (or whatever it is) around the silicon got burned quite a bit and for a second I thought it was dead. Glad that this worked.
Fantastic work! I'm really impressed by your end product.
You always find a way to delid any CPU even if the manufacturer has warned you. Greatness...Next on der8auer: deliding the roof of my house to improve cooling and overclocking my heating/cooling system 😆
Love the cooler setup! Awesome video, very impressive temps!
I enjoyed this. Great work on that heater.
Insanely good temperatures, for such a powerful processor, and at 5700mhz there is almost no change in temperature, very good video bravo.
Ty sir for taking the time out of your schedule to make this full tutorial ❤❤
Glad to see Asus HQ hooked u up with a 50th anniversary Hello Kitty Thermos for your OC'n needs!
9:52 you can still see the IHS right? I would loosen the bolts, apply a suction cup to the IHS and lift it simultaniously. That way its a single-step process.
Can maybe even create some vacuum seal in another way, like having the top of the IHS delidder have a rubber seal, with a nipple on top, and than just attach one of those handbilges to create a vacuum seal to lift it together with the delidder top.
EDIT: ah its already finalized, nevermind :)
So much work for this platform. Too bad the CPUs probably arent worth the trouble.
But all of this will likely be useful in the future, too, so at least the knowledge will be helpful.
I'm waiting to see how deliddable the 9800X3D will be. Would love to run it direct die. :)
Absolute no need to delid a 9800X3D, it won't reach high temps anyway.
@@jankees4037 a better CPU to water delta means I can run hotter water in my loop, increasing thermal efficiency on the radiator for less fan speed (noise).
That's what delidding does.
Thank you for the work and insight on this
it is also stated as 5.7 gigahertz boost in the specifications, so they didn’t lie
the 3D printed case for the heater controller is absolutely fine!
A friend and I used an oven in the chemistry lab to ease delidding of his 7950x3d. We got the CPU to 100°C (we were afraid of going any higher) and then popped it into the Delid Die Mate. It seemed to work well, but without a comparison CPU, we could not actually determine whether it made any difference.
use floss to cut glue, then position the cpu upside down between two cans, apply heat from underneath with hair dryer until IHS falls off... simple and 100% safe AM5 delid
Der8auer delidding cat shirts when?
interesting idea :D
Schroedinger's de-lid tool
I'm not in the deliding scene, but watching this video is very very pleasing. A contact frame for me is suffice.
Man that was quick...
If CPU manufacturers sell naked CPUs as an option, then this whole "circus" wouldn't be needed.
Thank you for your service anyway Roman.
Their transport would be a mess. If products that are designed to take a beating sometimes already come damaged, imagine the courier yeeting a CPU without heatshield
They should, however Roman’s TG deliding tools would be out of business. Still both AMD and Intel should opt for naked CPUs besides classic IHS ones👍
Too much risk for the reputation. Idiots end up buying it, crack the die, try to RMA under false pretense, manufacturer has to prove it wasn't DOA with a hairline fracture.
All of that just to satisfy probably 10-50k people worldwide.
You'd have people crying about 'why isn't my i3 released as bare-die and only the top of the line chip gets it' or complaining that 'I'm paying more for a binned CPU with NO metal? This doesn't make sense'
@@bazooka712CPUs come inside a nice plastic blister that does NOT allow you to bend pins (AM4 models), so that shouldn’t be an issue
make it a Der8auer special edition that comes with a water cooling kit. pack it with IHS but unsoldered straight from intel or amd. limited series of course depending on water blocks available at the moment.
Scores and temps look good! CB23 score is pretty much same as my 9950X delid and using one of your new WBs
Epic work & video! Well Done, Roman!
Damn they killed the ring clocks :D
Why not design it so from the start you put cpu upside down? Then you would just cut open a witness window on the side to able to see if IHS has moved or not. Avoiding the heating of the IHS the second time and spilling the indium on the PCB from the first heating. Originally in factory when they put IHS and substrate together the IHS is facing down for that reason.
Also scraping off the indium leftovers on tile design - could this part be as dangerous as delidding itself? Maybe it's safer to scrape diagonally to avoid catching the wedge between the tile's border?
It's tricky because the heater obviously has to be thermally bridged to the IHS, so the heater would have to be able to hold onto the IHS stronger than the force pulling the IHS off the CPU. Probably simpler and easier just to do it this way, if it doesn't cause any issues for the CPU to get this hot.
I love this mentality of "here's how everything works, here's even the hidden menu-you can do whatever you want with it, even kill your CPU, but at least you have full control over it." Not to mention the build quality and design… These guys are truly on a whole different level, way, way above.
guess you're a big StarGate movie fan .... your constellation marking tablet tattoos is a great giveaway ... excellent video thank you for all the knowledge your share... cheers 😎
I delidded my 13900k, 3d printed spacers and it's incredible
Do you think it would be possible to cut fins directly into the ihs instead of delidding? Maybe we can finally make use of that thick heatspreader on AM5.
Oh also will the indium solder stick to the surface mount components? I would rather not have to clean up tiny tiny solder bridges haha
Rowan is a beast, nicely done has always.
Роман, крышку лучше сдвигать не вдоль кристалла, а поперёк, как в скальпаторе для 1700 2:27. Для этого предварительно отпаять два мешающих резистора 3:30, а после снятия крышки вернуть их на место.
I did something similar with the 12900K. Ran Prime95 for 30 minutes. Pulled the CPU and delid. Took one push to come part. The problem for Arrow Lake is the SMDs clearance of course. Still doable at home.
90 euro is a fair price if upcoming next gen cpu delidders could fit in that same heater case aswell, it could be one time buy, or atleast for multiple upcoming gens. Very nice job! keep it up.
Hard work and good video but i'm not going to do it with €500+ CPU anyway.
Thanks for providing all this data for me.
seem to be a must-do for 285k deliding but this heating tool might be really helpful for universal deliding works
I reckon this is perfect for boutique system builders rather than individual PC builder-owners. What amazing improvement the delidding makes. I wonder how much R&D Intel spend on the heat spreader & alternatives to it, given how much extra it costs their customers on cooling to get their CPUs below that thermal max.
it is a lot of fun for someone with extreme overclocking needs, and i hope you sell a-lot of kits as a previous buyer of your delidders, but i have to be honest and say that a max ~5 or 6% in best case gain in multicore for all the expense and work/risk should carefully be considered by everyone
outstanding work. Thank you
14:00 That’s a beautiful transparent print! I get nowhere close to that clear with PETG on my Bambu. Even at extremely slow print speeds. 🤔
Your a mad lad to do all this.
Genius tools for the enthusiast,great video.
def need to make my friend deluded my 4770k with YOUR delidder!
TBF this CPU is way more easier to work with (no solder, a lot of clearance) so you probably don't need any special tool.
i wish we cud delid our brains at times sheez when your looking all day at new pc parts then forget where that great price was always tomorrow
DaaaD a blokes selling his Pc for $500 Yeah ok son but does it come with a delided cpu No its old Tell him his dreaming OK dad
DAAAAD yes son i dug a hole Mum yes dad The lads an idea's man :)
Fully unlocked is the only way to go!
the cpu block with hybrid fins is insane
I don't know if you had this kind of comment before, but from where I am, someone will buy your product and then go online and offer delidding service for $15. I don't know how you can make money from this, but you are a super enthusiast, bro. I used one of those services in the past, but since I moved to AMD (AM4) , I never felt the need to delid my CPU.
The heater controller could have a progress bar, ETA and a piezo for acoustic indicator that its ready - like start clicking near target and beeping on target
you guys make some nice products considering the cardboard worktops and the jank everywhere 😅
Really apprecate the info... would really like to see you incorporate more hello kitty stuff lol
Very cute and you must be living your dream being able to combine a fun Hobby with work 😇👍love it as it reminds me of times gone by. I was wondering why you did not design it with a hinge so it only would need two screws to close and secure the two parts together? If the the 285 were not so expensive even I would consider delidding one and get all you nice tools you all designed and made. Who knows if / when Intel comes out with the next version of CPU with same LGA 1851 footprint and prices that may come down. it's looking in a crystal ball. I enjoyed this video, two thumbs up.
15:30 This is getting super fancy! If that's the route you're taking, Roman, why not create a gearbox to turn one screw in a single direction and make the delidder move back and forth when it reaches a stopper on each direction (similar to a differential in a car)? This way, you can keep the screwdriver in place all the time, turning it in only one direction while you watch the delidder and its gears do all the work.
Are we machining the gears? Also.. do we have the Swiss dwarves on staff to assemble the tiny gears, as they do for the watches? Also.. could we compromise on a custom Allen wrench that allows a full rotation based on the height of the heater so you don't have to do that thing, that I was seeing in the video, that we've all been through with an Allen wrench lol.
couldn't you just use high temp tape/glue to glue the heater to the IHS? instead heating the entire tool? You already have hole in the middle of the IHS slider. Also with this setup you could integrate the temp probe into the heater.
18:10
AIO from ASUS
*Has corsair written all over it
He meant equipment from Asus inventory, I think.
Careful with chip height measurements, differences in thickness in mutli-die chips is a classic issue. Direct die cooling might be a very bad idea, especially with classic thermal paste which are relatively low thermal conductivity. The extra "distace" from the cooling interface (of whichever kind) can be an issue much sooner than you might think. Try to get temperatures of all the dies to make sure they also get adequate cooling. Maybe they did the finish very well tho, looking forward to that follow up video! Especially at the edge interfaces of the dies
Curious if the heating element can be placed onto the IHS itself so when you move the delidder to break the glue, take the PCB with the CPU and drop the IHS that quick. There would also be less heat getting to the PCB and related parts. Might need a different way of tightening the delidder to make this process a single-shot but is worth thinking about.
big like for melting mate :D great video, thank you!
I’d love to discuss simplified fatigue simulation and calculations with you. Should be able to estimate hypothetical fatigue for nominal materials and simplified or “equivalent” material models that approximate composites (like chiplets or pcbs)
Well, hope their performance improves to make this worthwhile for you.
Delid is insane here, oh my
You should sell a new block for a water cooler that solves the height issue with the surrounding components.
Like the Arctic LF3. You can unscrew the copper contact plate. Could be replaced with a specially machined version that is just right for direct contact.
Sell it with a contact frame that perfectly fits it.
Could also shape the actual heater block part to fit the Intel cpu.
Intel/AMD should just sell an ‘Enthusiast LM Chip’ that’s got a pre Non-installed IHS (no glue, no STIM on die), a LM tube/kit, and markings on the die for exactly where to keep the IHS when installing…
Fairly foolproof…
Pretty cool, I certainly have no plans on deliding, but interesting to watch none the less. I'll be more interested to see where the Ultra 200s CPU's sit performance wise once Intel, Windows, and motherboard AIB's can offer some updates and fixes to optimize it.
For those of us who need to build a whole new system, like me upgrading from a laptop back to a desktop system, no point in rushing. I could get a CPU and Motherboard but I'd still be lacking a GPU until the new ones release early next year..
This whole new release cycle is a bit of a pain lol. In all honesty I think I would've preferred CPU's and GPU's to all just be announced/launched at CES. Give them time to prepare OS optimizations, BIOS, microcode, drivers, ect.. AMDs and Intels launch so far has been a mess due to a lack of optimization, everything was put out a bit premature.
Get tired of hardware developers, game developers, and even car manufacturers treating the end buying customer as the final quality control check.. I just want to buy a finished product, not some unfinished lab sample..😅
i just got a Alphacool Eiszeit 2000 chiller to play around with and going to be using that on the 5090 when that comes now that i have seen this Direct Die Cooler i think im going to be needing This :D aswell
Melting mate! That's great!!
Seems like for most retail samples we see being tweaked, you can put the ring up to 4.4/4.5, the P-cores to 5.6 all-core, and the E-cores to 4.8, slap the fastest G2 RAM with 10ns first word latency or less in there, and get another 5% performance out of it stably, as compared to stock with the baffling RAM kits the early reviewers used, without much voltage change.
finally intel is underdog, in 1y they will start selling cpus that fit 3 generations of mobos
Then it's time for AMD's villain arc 😈
Golden informations about Arrow Lake! Thanks for video!
Do you think EK Direct Die AIO would works what if i delid Arrow Lake cpu?
With everything going on at EK…don’t know if they will be around, at least in their current configuration for very long. I believe caution in anything involving EK would be smart. 😮
They should really start offering the CPUs lidless that would be interesting. Include the IHS separate or something in case you want to add it later.