1960s Judo VS Modern Judo
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- Опубліковано 13 жов 2024
- This video discusses the Judo from the era of the 1960s, comparing it now.
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1961 rules:
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#Judo #ModernJudo #Randori #NoguchiSenryuken #BJJ #Sambo #Wrestling #GrandPrix #GrandSlam #Olympics #OlympicGames #MMA #UFC #Grappling #柔道 #講道館 #公益財団法人講道館 #嘉納治五郎 #高專柔道 #三角固 #бөх #講道館柔道 #Kodokan #KodokanJudo #柔術 #禁止技 #投の形
Chadi is the ultimate judo historian on UA-cam there is no one to compare
Thank you 🙇🏻♂️
Totally agree chadi is a Legend and should write a book I'd pay for it
@@prasantadebnath1827 me 3
@@moonsdonut5188 me 4
In English.
I just watched this episode, very nice. I remember my old Korean Yudo/Judo instructors trained and fought the old way. All serious, sometimes brutal techniques/submissions. Kicking, punching, throwing and strangles, neck cranks. Great for self defense, probably not so much with todays competitions.
Chadi check out the book 'The fighting spirit of Japan'. It's written by an Englishman E J Harrison who travelled to Japan at the turn of the last century. He studied judo met Dr Kano and several top Judo and Jujitsu masters. Very interesting read and an insight into the early days of judo.
It’s on my list
😘 Thank you - will read it 😊
Old school was much more fun and combat effective they should bring it back👍
🙏🏻
💯 % I started Jujitsu / Judo in the mid 80's. The Judo program had more emphasis on the self defense applications accompaning sport techniques. Thanks Chadi! 🙏💮
Isao Okano was tied for lightest All Japan champion along with being an Olympic gold medalist. Brazilian Jiujitsu guys also owe him a lot for his newaza.
Those were the days I fought in. I had a flashback watching this video when I saw my old friend Anton Geesink. Ever try to throw an oak tree? That's how I remember randori against Geesink. Another great video, Chadi. I don't comment on all but I watch most of them when notified by the bell. On behalf of Judoka all over the world thank you for the enormous amount of research you put into making the greatest set of martial arts educational videos on UA-cam.
Thank you so much
Perhaps you can answer this question Donald. Why do you suppose tall players like Gessink, choose the double armpit grip instead of what I was taught in modern judo, high collar and sleeve or some variation with the high collar pulling the head down of uke?
@@Chadi you ever heard of the trainer by the name of John Haas? If so is he any good as far as training for martial arts and stuff like that?
The grip fighting of the modern era definitely has to be better than the original grip fighting. But the overall fighting and "self-defense" skills seem to have downgraded a lot.
What is the solution to this? How would you change the skill of the judokas of the modern era?
@@danqfrank44 Oh! Good that you asked as i have always been helping my fellow Judoka find the old ways. This will probably be long, if you want me to be resume everything, just tell me. For now i will only out a few things
First things first:
Judo MUST be practiced along with striking (this includes weapons), or at the very least *against* striking, similar to what Aikido schools do, but against actual striking lol.
Why? Because in a self defense scenario, your opponent is likely to strike (and grapple) rather than only grapple. And knowing how to use their attacks to load your throws is a must have ability!
In fact, the old throw demos were mostly in the context of when someone attacked you with striking. If you have merver really gotten a really clean/demo like throw while in randori, that's because your opponent is actively grappling you and they aren't putting to much force into one direction, but in a scenario with striking, things will be really different, that's why you will see many Judoka getting super clean throws in the streets.
And the Aikido training way that i mentioned earlier is also necessary, if you see the old Japanese Jujutsu and Judo demos, you'll see how the ukes will run at the tori just before getting thrown. That can be interpreted in many ways, may it be someone that is actually running at you (which is unlikely but could happen) to strike you, someone that is pushing with everything they have, or someone that is overcomitting to one attack. So this way of training is actually awesome.
These things alone will improve modern Judo a lot but there are a few more.
Now let's get into the things that modern Judoka should do if they really want to be as good as the old masters:
1-Practice the stuff that is not legal in tournaments. This does not only include techniques like the Double and Single leg takedowns, but also many grips that are ilegal, defensive positions that are prohibited, joint locks that are not permitted, including standing joint locks which are very important.
2-Learn the proper no gi translations. The gi is usually good for practicing throws woth your partners without hurting them a lot (no gi wrist controls and some other grips will bruise them or at least hurt them a little after training) but that does not mean that you should always train in gi as your opponents will probably not be wearing a gi. That's why you gotta learn how to translate your gi grips to no gi ones. Like translating a high collar grip to a Whizzer over hook for an Uchi Mata! You should also practice many no gi chokes.
3-You should also learn the proper unbalancing techniques for no gi, which is really different to the gi Kuzushi. So you should definitely learn it.
I will leave it at that, but know that there are some other things that the Judoka of the past that we do not do anymore, like using techniques that aren't even currently present in Kodokan Judo. Like the ones used in Aikido. Those used to be widely practiced by Judoka. They were part of Japanese jujutsu so it's only natural that they were also practiced by Judoka at some point, and those techniques sure are good for self defense for many reasons but i will leave this here.
That high collar grip ~ wizzer to uchi Mata messed my mind all the way up. Does the kodokan teach this type of judo or is this something to be found elsewhere?
@@jestfullgremblim8002 the reason I ask this is because I seriously desire not only to see Japan but to get my black belt from the kodokan (as a matter of authentication mostly plus the level of competition there is crazy). Is this find there or are they mostly Olympic point style judo like America? I am a grappler at heart so learning joint locks is crucial. But also since there is a rule set (that is not always fair, especially for defensive players) I wonder how this will translate into the mat in a tournament
I know that was all over the place but I got super excited when you posted that. But yeah, I will have to find out or find tournaments where this type of judo is appreciated. I can comprehend the strikes, but the kazushi sounds like wrestling with the no gi.
I think weight classes and altering scoring to accommodate the politics of international sports during the cold war era were detrimental to Judo Tachiwasa skills and techniques. The old style they didn't play with grips because Judo was still considered a combat sport and everything was being done as if your life depended on it. At least in Japan it was considered disrespectful to spend to much time fighting for grips (From what I was told when I was there in the 80's.) because you were supposed to be trying to end the fight by superior throwing technique. And if you didn't score Ippon you were supposed to follow up with Newasa.
Because they were not allowed to kick or punch the strategy was to grab and throw. They were still training that way in Northern Japan in the early 80's. And all the local tournaments had no weight classes. They would break us up into 4 man teams and add up all the points at the end to see which team won.
The Olympics were very political in the 60's, 70's and 80's and there was a lot of politically motivated scoring. Plus there were a lot of countries that didn't have the Japanese Bushido/Honor Culture in their Judo. And they would look through the rule book to see how they could get an advantage by pushing the limits of rules.
When they take the realistic combativeness out of a Martial Sport, they turn it into a game of bending the rules until some referee has the courage to call someone out. If they're a world class contender, this caused the entire world rules to be changed because some people think winning is winning no matter how. Techniques get less and less technically skilled with each generation that follows as the rules become more and more restrictive.
I haven't followed much of international Judo for the last 20 years. So I don't really know what tournament rules they've changed for whatever reasons. But I do know there were a lot of people pushing the rules and doing crappy techniques because all you had to do is get a Yuko or Koka and then stall back in the 80's.
Thanks for the great video. Lots of great comments too!!!
I like the type of judo you described. I would like to find this judo in Japan, do you know what's it can be found?
Nice content Chadi! I like the difficult to get a clear ippon without rolling over.
Thank you 🙇🏻♂️
I trained with all types of weights in judo, back in Venezuela, and it's a great way to understand the Taoist concepts behind the name of the martial art in itself. I see there is no metaphysical lessons infused in the teachings of the art: lack of consistent meditation, endurance training, etc. Anything regarding the epistemics Mater Kano followed when training jujutsu, which at that time was already degenerated.
I also believe that if the open category was brought back that within the open weight format leg grabs(without shooting) should be allowed in order to level the playing field in my opinion
I love Judo so much
There are a few good judo channels, but this channel along with Shintaros are awesome!
Love the historic content
Have any of you guys ever read the Pyjama game by Mark Law?
It's a fun read that touches into the history of Judo
That uchi Mata sukashi was beautiful.
I started in 67. Quit competing when koka came about, to me it got sloppy. A throw had to be very, very good for ippon, ( at least in Texasamong our judges and referees, )and I liked that.
Great to see the old open weight guys
And regarding what you say about heavy weights, that's what I was told and that's what I saw growing up in the scene, maybe that's why Venezuelans and Cubas were, are so prised in the region regarding martial arts of this type.
Have you done a video about Freestyle Judo? If not, I'd like to hear your opinion. I like that they have a no-gi category.
I started in gi/no-gi grappling, and moved to judo. BJJ weakness was the reliance on guard, if you cannot take someone down. That did not seem good to me, altough I could do a lot with rubber guard. After training judo, I gainer much more agressivness from the top, always looking for a way to take someone down and stay on top, while still not being afraid to be at the bottom.
Now judo could be so much more than what it is today. Leg take downs have been removed and that kills pratical part of the art - I dont want to grapple for collar with someone who is bigger than me, I want to grab his leg and sweep him down. Further, judo does either stand-up randori or newaza. In 5 years of training, I have only once had a sparring where we start from the top and continue in newaza. That is unfortunate as that is reality. I would say that the ultimate goal should be to be able to take someone down and then to get choke hold or high precentage joint lock. Kimura for example. And always, from the top.
You could now add trad japanese ji jitsu to your repertoire. Sending someone to the ground using throws , locks, strikes, understanding how locks and throws can disable or even kill... Very useful additional perspective 👍
We teach the old school judo, most local schools don't, and the local scene right now is so injured due to covid. Its not easy being a judoka in the 21st century
What’s the name of your school?
I think that anyone who doesn't score a true ippon (including a true wazari-awaseti ippon) is a loser. So if no one scores, both parties lose. Then they can remove all the rules against stalling, including defensive grips. Excessive bent over posture however should result in shido, because it would result in knees to the face.
Also, any sacrifice technique, including ryo-hiza seoi-otoshi, should not be able to score an more than a wazari, and also results in a shido, making it a true sacrifice. Then all rules against false attacks can be removed. Also making it possible to score wazari-awaseti ippon and be disqualified simultaneously, effectively allowing kamikaze attacks.
Basically, judo rules should cause people to grapple as they ought to if they were in a real fight, but without having to have a real fight, whilst maintaining safety so people don't have to get brain damage, lose their eyes, or get stabbed/shot etc.
Hi Chadi, can you do a video on Darcelito from France? I love his footwork
In judo, you aren't flipped or flip your opponent!! You are thrown or you throw your opponent
I love this channel
Do shime is the 1st tech 2 go 4 whn attacker was n the closed guard n jujitsu self defense training.... i quit using it when training after i damaged a rib on a training partner.... he had trouble breathing for couple weeks after
I hope to see Ono Shohei advance in the All Japan in the next few years. He needs to develop other ashiwaza for the larger opponents as they all know his uchimata and osotogari, but he clearly has the skill to topple giants.
He mentioned it was his last
@@Chadi that is too bad. I watched the 2022 documentary subtitled but don't speak Japanese, so I'm sure a lot of nuance is lost.
@chadi. Was open hand slapping, such as the slap in Sumo, ever been legal in Judo?
Strikes were always forbidden in judo
60s judo is way more effective as a martial art and self defense system than today's olympic watered down Judo.
@Chadi are there if point tournaments with open categories? I will look this up as well. I feel this is the best tournament to win as opposed to weight categories.
Tjhs particular video must be showing the moment Dutch-champion Anton Geesink threw his opponent thus ending the Japanese monopoly in Judo.
Yes open weight should be back here are some of my suggestions 1) bring back leg grabs i like your idea Chadi of the single leg grab as well 2 ) eliminate the pin as a victory I mean if judo really wants to differentiate from wrestling there's no better way 3) have a ne waza clock of sorts so instead of having pins as a win make them do ne waza once they hit the ground they have idk 90 seconds or 2 mins to fight for a submission then the ref cab stand them back up . 4 ) I would bring back the yuko . But again biggest thing eliminate osaikomi as a victory it just doesn't make sense martially . Pinning is a control
check point to get to a finish not a finish in itself just my opinion 🤷
Judo is wrestling tho, just in a jacket.
@@InvisibleHotdog well it involves wrestling but its not wrestling in the sport sense actual/original Judo involves striking weapons defense etc but the subject here is referring to the sport aspect . I get what you mean though. The point i was making is just that the IJF said the Olympic committee IOC whatever said years ago "judo looks too much like wrestling we are going to get rid of it as an Olympic sport if u don't make it different " so that is the bs reason they used to to eliminate leg grabs . All I'm saying is the original point of the sport of wrestling is to pin your opponent to win so if they really wanted to differentiate from the sport of wrestling eliminate the pin as a victory and focus more on ne waza submissions as a way to win. I mean even if they changed the point system & just made the osaikomi pin a form of points that could lead to a win would be better than what is done now .
Banning leg attacks was the worst thing Judo has ever done however manipulating the match with penalties is nearly as bad. The rules on a step out are hilarious, you can get a penalty for stepping out or being pushed out so it's always arguable! Judo has gone down the Rat Hole of rule manipulation.
Any step out should be ruled a penalty, this will cause athletes to push against each other at the edge of the mat and produce large exciting action just like Freestyle and Greco Roman wrestling!
the elite of any ear would fit into any era. However, when people talk about “this guy s that guy”, i personally believe modern athletes will win because the training is smarter now. We know more about strength and conditioning as well as recovery.
What was the technique Leon Edwards used to take Usman down ?
It's called a left round house kick to the right temporal cranium kick
Ko soto gari
We should meassure ippon by the depth of the crater the throw left behind. 1 cm would be an ippon, half a centimeter would be a wazari 😂
judo of the past was more deadly for street self defense, growing up in detroit during the 70s guys would come back from the militarycame back to teach. they really focused on bome breaking locks, judo chops to the throat and groin, eye gouging, ear ripping, you just dont see the deadly stuff taught anymore
i agree. iam in a old school judo class. the teacher teached us leglocks last week and leg grab. i think about to take also karate class. but what is better? 2 times karate and 2 times judo or 4 times judo per week?
@@Supermomo2007 if you really want to learn to fight I'd go with a reputable Hapkido schooll but that's just me, jujitsu is all the rage now but do you really want to be rolling on the ground in a street fight
@@1Blkkato hapkido has bad quality control
@@Supermomo2007 ok well it sounds like you have your mind already set good luck on whatever you choose
@@1Blkkato thanks, good luck to you ,too.
The objective in a 1960s Judo contest was to win by a decisive ippon! The great champions of today do this as well. No one should enter into a match with a less objective. Judo was changed to provide more action,to be more spectator and television friendly. The viewers want action. Today's Judo provides this, often with the outcomes not being decisive. In my opinion.
Today’s shido system is good to prevent stalling
@@Chadi Yes, We had penalties back then too, but it was for major offences. There was less emphasis on Kinsa, but sometimes Kinsa decided the outcome. The referees kept track of this, but not on a scoreboard. It was best to win by ippon using tachi waza. Newaza happened, usually after a throw.
Tachi waza was the preferred way of winning a match. There was less Ne waza, as Tachi waza was preferred. It's a matter of style. Overall Newaza is better developed now.
mass and weight, I think and believed, is critical in Judo. you may be a superb technician but do not have mass and weight you might loss against one who have mass and weight who can can play merely good Judo.
Woooo!!! Ric Flair styling and profiling bring back thee old school!
🙇🏻♂️
IJF IS DESTROYING JUDOOOOO
I feel like judoka are better at breaking defenses than jujitsu guys of average levels but they are very bad at avoiding stalling because they don't need to they just wait to the ref to stand them up if they don't want scrambles
what song is this?
retrieve it all. don't diminish Judo!
Do they still learn resesitation tech n judo like n self defense jujitsu???
HIROMI TOMITA JUDO. You Tube.
evolution? or degeneration