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I think helen's quote around 6:10 'the more clever you are the easier it is to fool yourself' should be - 'the more clever you are the more justifications / reasons you CAN construct to believe something that is false' the other thing that I would say, is that it is feminist ideology that enables this movement. the fact that it is delusional men (generally AGP as I see it) pushing into women's spaces is not really the point. if it wasn't for the rampant feminists ideology that has taken hold throughout the western world, these men would be where they used to be - at home jerking off in women's underwear !
Why don't you be respectful and talk to Blair rather then calling her names. Does anyone understand what she went through?? Pls be respectful. You can't debunk something if your not brave enough to speak and talk to the person.
@JackxJewell hi jack, I'm transgender. Helen's framing it as if we are the sexual perverts is really the opposite of my experience. I like men but they are the ones on dating sites that are gross with their desires to send inappropriate photos and dirty talk. Most of the transwomen I know have similar experiences
when a trans person says they are "living as a woman" what they mean is they put on women's clothes. In what other way do they live as a woman. They don't have to worry about periods, they don't have to worry about their breasts changing size from week to week, they don't have to manage contraception to avoid getting pregnant, they don't have to deal with any of the day to day realities of a woman's life. I am not a dress. woman is not a costume you can put on for fun.
Well, things get even more complicated when someone who does not even make any effort (an does not have the intention) to 'pass' tries to convince you that they are a woman or a man.
@@remeiagullessimo1586 and they've been showing up as women for like 3 weeks and start throwing names like "period haver" and "pregnant person". You for real? You say you want to be a woman and you use dehumanizing language and dehumanizing rhetoric every time you open your mouth? It's like coming into a temple and rearranging the furniture. YES a temple, Not a house, a temple, because it's something that has existed for thousands of years and is also deeply culturally significant to a community
@@stephenpowstinger733 age, hormones, stress, bra use, weight gain, water retention pregnancy. Things you wouldnt understand what feels like from the outside
Yeah, I have noticed this lately. I think she must have reached her maximum BS level. While most of us do not interact with trans activists on a daily basis she has seen and heard it all.
She said it but she didn’t shout it. The thing is, how are people forgetting what a woman is? Or confused about it? Birth control and abortion have disconnected us from reality.
and your point is that its a further penalization that cis women have, that trans women don't have. but both experience sexual crime for the same reasons usually for the same expression.
Trans men, without surgery, can still experience assault that leads to pregnancy. Trans women have far higher rates of violent crime against them than women. If your point is that it is worse for women than it is for trans women, in general, that is not accurate.
I saw Helen speak in Dublin at the let women speak rally and afterwards bought and read her book. Her ability to disesect simplify a complex subject and fact check the misinformation that is being spread is incredible. Keep up the good work Helen you are an inspiration ❤ 🇮🇪
@@surlypiratewench1969 i cant stand Trump, Kamala, the Clintons, Labour, Tories and Reform and i LOVE Helen Joyce ! Bet you are a government bootlicker though !
The autogynophilia also shows up in sexual sadist rapists and killers! I see loathing of women as part of their innate personality. I don't want them accepted in public or in private female spaces.
@@michelledavis2604 So to elaborate further. Gender ideology is the set of ideas that teaches people, children included, that sex can be changed (which it can't) but simultaneously also teaches that what defines who's a man or a woman isn't the sex at all, but instead this pseudoscientific concept of "gender identity." Furthermore, it teaches that sex isn't a binary, one or the other, but instead exists a spectrum, based on very stereotypical things like interests and traits. No wonder children have become more dysphoric over the course of time, they are taught to not trust their eyes and instincts anymore, and to question themselves in even the most basic of ways. "Oh, shit, I'm a boy but sometimes I like to play with dolls... maybe I'm a girl..."
@JD-xd4sy Gender identity is innervated by a neurological structure called the Bed Nucleus Stria Terminalis. This is part of the limbic system ie the thalamus, hyper thalamus, amygdala and hippocampus, which control function such as emotions, behaviour, motivation and memory.
I thought I was once someone for trans rights but it was when I had no idea what that actually meant. I assumed these men knew they were men and were simply suffering from something that only surgery could alleviate. I now know there's a lot more to it now. I was naive and biased. I'm so pleased more and more are waking up to this dangerous ideology.
As Rowling says, trans rights are human rights, doesn't make them women or give them right to their spaces, they've spent their lifetimes in 🚹 & should continue to do so in a skirt.
you not alone i myself was sucked into the lies of this movement . I originally thought it was just allowing people no matter their gender to dress how they want without being dragged into stereotypes . Boy was I wrong instead I discovered a new modern day fascist regime trying brainwash and traumatize the next generation of children
1:04:50 "Passability" ended up being a cruel joke on me. Former "FtM", here, and reaching this milestone did not make me happy inside because there was always more. I had become a lifelong project. There was always another surgery to be had, regardless of how much I had already achieved. Frankly, I question any trans-identified person who can say with all honesty that disembodying themselves (yes, this is what it is) has given them inner peace. The cruel joke on me is that instead of being a "man trapped in a woman's body" (the lie), I am now a woman "trapped" in a male-appearing body. Fortunately, for me, I am older and care a lot less than I did as a young woman how I look; I'm just happy to get a second chance at life, now.
@@j.j.l.I'm glad you found your way back to yourself. I've come to believe living inauthentically is like a slow poison to the soul. The lie that is told by the TRAs is that your desired sex is the "real" you, trapped in a shell that doesn't reflect it. The truth is we are our bodies and inflicting wounds on it (which is what SRS is,) is an assault on ourselves. I wish you all the best and I concur, I too care less about how I look as I get older. It's actually very freeing. I hope I get to hear or read your story one day. I can't pretend to truly understand what motivates ppl to transition, but I'd like to.
this is the point that Germaine Greer was making: it doesn't matter how many body parts you cut off, your basic biology cannot be denied. I hope you find peace in your life. A man who cuts off his penis remains a man and a woman who cuts off her breast remains a woman. There is no surgery that can change that basic fact.
Helen Joyce nailed it with her comment about fear. Females live with fear; it is not only literally in our dna but also built into our lives socially through being passed down through the generations from mother to daughter since time immemorial. And yes, I know men experience fear too, but female fear is at a cellular level.
100% I remember having to talk to my daughters about different things throughout the years. As their ages and bodies changed so did the level of warning conversations on how to protect themselves and not be in certain situations etc. Men and boys don't need those warning conversations as they are the perpetrators.
Aspects of Helen’s directness reminded me of Germaine Greer. We should have listened to her on this issue and maybe we wouldn’t be where we are now. I remember reading her warnings several years ago and feeling that her views were extreme and that she was predicting a future that would never happen. How wrong I was. I’m so glad we now have Helen and others speaking out for women.
It never occurred to me that Germaine Greer was wrong on this subject. I read The Female Eunach in the early 1980s. It was the first book that articulated how I felt about being a woman, so I followed her career with great interest. Of course she was right about this - she knew it was an attack on women and said so. She was Cancelled as a result and that right there should have alerted everyone to the threat of this cult. And it is a cult, and it will be exposed at some point, but we're not quite there yet. Two men boxing women at the Olympics and winning Gold made people sit up and Tickle v Giggle in Australia is making the threat very clear to everyyone.
I read an article she wrote in the 90s about meeting a ‘trans woman’, and I couldn’t believe how right she was all those years ago. She called out the fetishism and misogyny behind it straight away, and she was ignored
I have know a few trans women and have lived in Oxford street Sydney. I have NEVER seen a trans woman that I didn’t know was a man. There is so much involved to being a woman, women can ALWAYS tell.
Yassss I used to live on Bourke St many years ago and spent three nights a week in Stonewall etc and the Transwomen I knew would NEVER want to sit in a women's changing room and watch them get undressed or demand that people pretend that they are more women than 100% women. I actually am starting to think that these crazy one's are predatory AGP men who force themselves into women and girls safe spaces and are crapping in the pool to ruin it for everyone? I've known Trans people for over thirty years now and they ALL like Buck Angel and Rose Of Dawn speak the truth/reality like Marcus 'The Offensive Tranny'.
How did you know they were a man? What tests did you conduct? How do you know there weren't people you took as female who were assigned male at birth? How could you know?
@BobHutton you kust be a man to even question this. There's a plethora of hints from hand size and the way one places their feet when they stand to the width of their shoulders, lack of indent in their waist and length of septum. Moreover, it's how they ACT. Men act VERY differently than women in not only body language but they are generally just more gruff, cruel, haughty, interruptive, combative, and lacking in consideration. They also don't KNOW crap women do about our biology and that comes out in conversation when they try to pretend to be us.
@@BobHutton easy. Big hands. Big feet. Adam's apple. Large head and brow ridge. Large wrists. Broad shoulders. Narrow hips. Ridiculous falsetto. And the way they think and act.
I think he has self-brainwashed to the point where he considers his perspective self-evidently correct. Like those guys who are convinced they are good guys and attractive and can only conclude that women who won't sleep with them are bitches.
When Veronica Ivy proclaimed he was a biological female on The Daily Show it was so disheartening to watch Trevor Noah not push back at all just to avoid any controversy. It was obvious Noah didn’t believe a word that they were saying, but just played it safe. Just disappointing.
He's a trans ally. But more the kind who doesn't want to admit the right is, well... right about this. He knows the left has lost it and there's no way he can make sense of the trans madness so he'd rather be silent about it. PS I've always voted left and I feel politically orphan right now
He didnt want to be cancelled by his own side and felt he had couch even the tiny bits of pushback as 'some might say'. I lost a lot of respect for him.
His Netflix comedy special criticizes women who want only women in women’s public bathrooms, then a few minutes later talks about how different women are in their bathroom habits compared to men. He knows why it’s important. He just doesn’t care.
He’s a coward, but he doesn’t want to lose his job and be a social castaway. Anyone who doesn’t speak up is a coward, but he’s also playing it safe, which I can - to a very, very limited degree - understand. After all, he has nothing to lose by playing it safe in the moment; he’s a man. Should that same trans individual demand he be allowed to share a locker room and shower with Noah’s daughter, or mother, and demand they also be comfortable with it, lest they be Nazis, well…lol
@@surlypiratewench1969 I think all of us are guilty of that. I'm just grateful I was born too soon to be affected by this cult, as this effeminate gay man would have been sliced and diced into a Frankenfemale.
I absolutely adore Helen Joyce! She makes me a braver human being!❤ "Linguistic Fuckery" & "Toss Pottery" are being added to my vocabulary immediately!😊 Great interview Jack!!!❤
If you are worried about using sex-based pronouns for trans-identifying people, see if you can worry about insulting women even more. Tell the trans-identifying person, "Out of respect for women, I use sex-based pronouns. I don't feel entitled to give away the words women need to describe their reality."
@@user-ep3ih4dy1xthats not respectful but normal for a man not to enter women’s XX spaces. He will never be a real woman. I have no problem if he wants to dress up as a woman.
Philosophy Tube has a huge ego, he only wants to hear from those fawning over him. He runs his own Reddit and heavily moderates any slight criticism of his acting. He lives an act everyday, it's all theatrics to masquerade his fetish. And like Contrapoints and all the other copy and paste autogynephile s video essayists, theatrics over coherent arguments, they never actually answer the question they pose.
Any answer that is displeasing, even if it is just a reality of situation they got themselves into, by their own choice, is categorized as offensive and there for ha te speech. It is like saying to a religious zealot that their god is not real. Same thing.
I have been calling out Ollie Thorne for about a year. He has dupers delight and is highly narcissistic. I watched an interview with Ash Sarkar and he was so mysogynistic right in her face and she was just lapping it up. I realised there was a real problem there. Aside his agp, I think he realises that this could be a real grift for him breaking into the acting industry....and it worked. He strikes me as the type of man who would have a tight coercive control on any poor woman involved seriously with him
Yes sometimes it feels as if they use the womanhood as a way to victimize themselfes. I am a woman myself and it feels annoying. They really don't get what they are talking about xD. I wish I could show them what its like to be real female. I would let them fought against men, let them walk outside in the dark with the strength that real woman have, getting into labor, bleeding each month with pains and not the mention the negative effects of the hormones which I think they will notice if they go on hormones. It can make you depressed. Constantly knowing men will be better in sports anyway. As a woman sometimes you just feel so low about yourself and these specific trans people make that feeling even worse for us.
I think the difference between Bowie and Prince is while they might have worn women's clothing it probably wasn't because it was WOMEN'S clothing but had an aesthetic. Like if you wanted to be a goth type in the 80s/early 90s you probably had ruffles or some shit on your shirt. You liked the ruffles regardless if it was sold in the men's or women's section, but you could probably only find it in the women's section if you're looking for your romantic vampire look. The AGPs want to buy the button down in the women's section because it' sin the women's section, not because it's a buttondown of a certain style. If a plain white t shirt is sold in the men's section, they'll still buy the women's section plain white t. It's not about what it looks like, it's about the label. At some point Bowie and Prince could afford bespoke clothing. So that was style of clothing, not women's clothing.
Totally disagree on the “preferred pronouns”. The people who refused to use preferred pronouns are the ones who peaked me. Those that chose to use them because they were being “kind” kept me from recognizing the pernicious nature of trans ideology for far too long. I think preferred pronouns and incredibly dangerous and have brought women’s rights to the perilous position in which it is.
That’s where I took a slight turn from the left I have lovely trans friends just living their lives but it was my “nonbinary friends “ that pushed me away for telling me I’m a transphobe when I came out publicly and said why I no longer support children medically transitioning
It’s the opposite for me. People who use preferred pronouns are what peaked me. I thought people who didn’t were just bigoted and dismissed them entirely. But this just goes to show why it’s important to have people like Jack AND Helen. They’re reaching different demographics with their different rhetoric. The Jacks reached me, the Helens reached you.
23:51 A judge in Australia has just ruled that a person CAN change sex, and that it’s discriminatory to say that trans women can’t go into female-only spaces. So, it sounds like Australia is screwed as far as safety and fairness for women is concerned …
Yes he's a VERY dangerous man. I used to be in a few women's Meet Up groups but they have disbanded due to predatory men encroaching and now this dangerous 'judge' has made it legal for men to abuse women and it's illegal for women to stand up for themselves now. He clearly wants ALL women and girls to sit at home and be bored! We now just have to use different avenue's like the pre-internet days to join women/girl only groups where we can speak about women ONLY issues without predators abusing us. Much like freedom fighters in N@z1 Germany/Communist countries.
If you can change sex it means a man can impregnate himself during a transformation with his own semen into the emerging vagina as a transformer. Lifestyle change, yes, but if ONE person can change sex it means self-produced pregnancy is possible 😂😂😂😂
I used to kinda like Philosphy Tube, until I realised how truly delusional they have grown in their little internet echo chamber, especially post transition. The last straw was one of their videos about a year ago, where they unironically keep talking about historical opression suffered by "us women" at the hands of the patriarchy. I mean, come on, how dare you! They lived most of their life as a white, straight cis-gendered male in the UK, what opression??? What shared experience? They lived and identified as a woman for literally less then 3 years. And ived as a white cis straight man for almost 30. In the same bit they larp as some downthrodden working class from a third world country, meanwhile they are extremely privileged and well off. Upper middle class at least. Not to mention they were educated in elite private schools and attended an elite university at St. Andrews. You know, the one where Prince William and Catherine, the future King and Queen of UK, went. It became so off-putting and nauseating to watch all the enlightened virtue signaling with all that tone deafness!
Jack is a good podcast host...... gave Helen plenty of space, stepped back when Helen came in with extra thoughts.... I enjoyed this, very interesting. Hope they do a repeat!
even if you accidentally drank the oat milk and thought it was cow's milk for some reason it wouldn't actually become cow's milk just a convincing imitation. This is a good analogy for it. They always claim to want to break down binaries I don't know what is so frightening in saying someone like Blaire has a very different experience from both the typical male and typical female in our society.
Blaire actually made a video where she used the men's restroom and filmed the results. TRA's claim that they would be in danger if they had to use the men's room, but Blaire was not unsafe during the experiment. The men who found her in there were actually concerned for preserving her safety, not making her unsafe. It's a tricky thing when they pass like this. I supposed single occupancy or a small 3rd bathroom would solve this.
Trans surgery helps save people's lives and they live happier lives for it. How is it like lobotomy? Or you mean that in the future there will be less crude ways to help trans people transition?
@@jujubesificationIt doesn’t help most people. The suicide rate goes up after the surgery. I hate to make the comparison but it’s like using cocaine. Most people wreck their lives once they start using coke. However there are a tiny margin of people who can and do use cocaine casually and they’re okay.
@bryanhawkins9418 that's simply the opposite of reality. Suicide rates go way down. And let's not forget why trans people do commit suicide. Such as lack of acceptance and exclusion and dehumanization. Which is what people like Helen give a scientific aura to.
That literally destroyed part of the brain making it unusable. Same thing as SRS allowing me to have sexual relations and relationships with heterosexual men ? Make it make sense, the only aspect at all the same is doctors did the jumbling of the brains with metal stick because it became a popular thing as way to resolve issues and were wrong which is only true for those people not gate kept properly for surgery. All the other surgeries are very far from trans exclusive and actually the alternative surgical techniques for penile inversion were developed for inter-sex , females where the vaginal canal did not develop properly vut everything else was there
Except that gender used to mean your sex specific personality. Like back in the 90s we had tomboys and girly girls, meanwhile the male varient was just boys and gays respectively. It was imperfect, which is why I feel that updating the Meyer's-Briggs personality chart to include sex personality stereotypes could give meaning to individuals that struggle. Most trans+ first start out because they don't fit in or feel like the others, due to superficial interests. But if we have a gender chart that gives a boy and girl variant for the same personality collection, that could help them realize that their exisitence is still valid (or whatever buzzword) as a biological boy/ girl. Edit: I should have worded it as repurpose the Meyer's-Briggs chart.
@@Undomaranel We’re all just individuals. No variant or labels necessary. I think that’s the gift in all of this. “We’re all unique….just like everyone else.” That’s a t-shirt lol
@@11Garrett11 I agree. However there are some people of mental deficiency/ social deficiency that can only accept things through stereotypes. The grandma at church that shames boys for keeping manicured nails, the father ashamed his daughter is a grease monkey, the child confused why they like boy things when they ate a girl. Having general subsets available is beneficial to those rigid mental types, because they can look at the chart and see that an authority recognizes that you can be a biological boy and not like sports. I am not talking about the healthy people who understand things. I am talking about people who follow horoscopes, who rely on fitting in, who lack the confidence and intelligence and maturity to separate personality from performance.
I would put Helen Joyce up against any trans activist in a debate and I would bet on Helen to win. She's thought about this deeply and logically and she's not saying anything that she hasn't already thought about what the arguments against her position might be. She has an answer in the chamber. I think that's why they don't want to debate her.
Nah. Helen started by defining male vs female as the production of gametes. This excludes prepubescent, post menopause, infertile, castration, hysterectomy... Let alone the various reasons for being "intersex". Gender is way more complicated than what were taught at school.
On the other hand, I think he does belive his own bullshit. Because philosopher isn't the only title he claims which he does appallingly he is a terrible actor, and couldn't sell that anywhere near as convincingly as he did, if he didn't belive it. Sucks to suck, tubey.
I think he studied a masters, although I’m not 100% sure. But anyway, the fact that someone studied certain things doesn’t guarantee they understood the things they studied, and doesn’t stop them using motivated reasoning etc.
I used to use preferred pronouns years ago when talking about the more moderate and 'passing' trans identified individuals, but even then, I felt the cognitive dissonance. The article 'Pronouns are Rohypnol' by Barra Kerr really articulated the discomfort I felt, and I won't do it anymore.
I know a woman who’s husband abused her for 30 years . They had 2 daughters. She caught him wearing her clothes eventually . She got away from him. He now lives as a “ woman” & ignores his grown daughters. He destroyed her life & now she’s an elderly woman who spent the best years of her life being beaten & coerced by this vile person.
The vast majority of men who abuse their spouse and/or kids happen to be cisgender and straight, because cisgendwr straight men are the most common kind, and abusiveness doesn't discriminate.
Look up Clive Bundy/Claire Fox. In England - Systematically sexually abused, raped and took photos of one of his daughters. He was eventually caught due to photos of his daughter he was sharing with others, leaking. His daughter then told the police everything he did. His sentence was weak, it was shortened due to "good behaviour". While in prison he claimed he was trans, became "Claire Fox" and was released even earlier because our prisons are over flowing and having another person they need to segregate for showers, food, toilet, etc puts extra strain on them.
I had a work colleague who wore women's clothes in private sometimes. His wife left him and their daughter. He brought up his daughter well & they're close & she's well adjusted. He is a good man, gentle, kind & nice to work with. I don't think a desire to dress up in women's clothes automatically means someone is an abuser or bad person
Just because a man wears a dress doesn’t mean it’s sexual. It’s just fashion of Bowie, Cobain etc. I’ve known men who wear skirts and it means nothing but comfort they are not trans or anything close. But pretending to BE a woman or sexualising women’s clothing is something else.
Agree. Personally I don't care how a man chooses to dress, even if in some cases their motivations are "sexual" it's none of my business, what's important is that these men don't enter women's protected spaces and above all that they stop calling themselves "women" and stop forcing their mental delusion on everyone else to recognize them as "women" because they are NOT.
Exactly. It was nothing unusual for bands in the 1990s because androgyny was a popular 'look'. Cobain, Grohl and Novoselic all did it, but people only remember Kurt in Courtney Love's dress. Same with Bowie when many others in the 60s/70s did it. Young people gender-bending isn't new, and it doesn't make any of them trans.
When they say "performing the function/role of a woman in society" or something similar ask them to define what that is without sounding like the Taliban and watch them squirm
And that if you define gender as a performance, people around you can judge your performance. 'Your performance of womanhood was subpar, therefore you are a man.'
yea but "flat earth" lore goes hard fr. look it up cause its insane what they came up with. its really cool from a fantasy perspective, but most certainly makes 0 sense with modern science lmao.
I'm a big fan of both Helen Joyce and Blaire White so even though I'm only half an hour into this I already think it's one of the most interesting podcasts Helen's done. You're the first person to discuss figures like Blaire with her so it's interesting to hear her thoughts. You appear to be genuinely challenging her and making her articulate her thoughts more. Fantastic job so far 😁
Blaire has always said she was a pretty boy and softer voiced. Also talks about the feminisation surgical except SRS, and for good reasons. Does not like the AGP, incel types etc who actually do harm the lovely transwomen like Blaire and Alexis Blake. Neither of them deny their male biology. Great respect for all three of them. And yes...adult human female...by birth.
@@jenniferplatts174Still going into women's spaces with a full functioning p*nis and lying to society by getting facial surgery and taking estrogen to appear female.
Already I feel like I need to say how important this interview is. You really were able to dig deep here and pick Helen's brain, and I appreciate that so much. I'm barely halfway through and I've already had a lot to think about and reconsider. This is such a good interview, Jack. I appreciate your perspectives as well, so much. Brilliant job.
I think our (western) society is very mentally unwell at the moment. And I’m not saying cause there are trans people or gay people or more acceptance for them. I’m saying cause a lot of people have adopted an ideology that doesn’t help anyone but makes them feel good in the moment. The gender ideology movement is the ultimate I’m a good person movement cause I care more about this person’s mental state than what actually is. And I think on both sides the topic of transition and gender dysphoria isn’t being talked about honestly and instead purely on the social level. And this trend towards affirming people’s feelings constantly isn’t just with the trans stuff, but also mental health in general and political biases. And I wonder if the reason part of our society has turned this way has anything to do with the prevalence of being online and interacting with strangers constantly as well as absorbing so much information constantly. And I think the idea of treating everything in a subjective way is also a product of it. Cause if there are no objective truths and morality is relative, why not then? Is the logical conclusion for someone who has adopted such a subjective ideology. People think they are freeing themselves on “man-made oppression” when really they’ve just completely have become untethered to reality’s objective constructs. In a way, it’s a very narcissistic and nihilistic approach to life. And is most clearly a crisis of purpose.
I have a real struggle with non binary and pronouns. Because my native language is gender bound. There is six forms of one pronoun. All nouns have gender and their gender dictate the rest of the grammar. Now imagine when theres more people using different pronouns, do you know how mentally exhausting it is? And when you make mistake because language is already reflexive, they break down because of it and make a drama? And this is what fills the life and work-life instead of living and working. Even calling them just name wont sort it for me. Their neo pronouns Stardust still has a gender in my language. Talking to someone in plural way with plural verbs is a mindf*ck literally (forgive me the curse word).
I thought listening to this would help me drift off to sleep; one o’clock in the morning and I was riveted. When Helen Joyce is involved, I should know better .
@surlypiratewench1969 colluding in the delusion that trans-identifying men are actually women, is a risk to women's safety. Women need to be allowed to call out men in dresses, because they may not be safe.
“You can't really argue with people whose whole position is a denial of reality” - that was precisely what I was thinking when I was listening to Abigail Thorn.
55:03 David Bowie was a creative artist who experimented with sexuality, culture, and dress. He never tried to be a woman. He had gay experiences and claimed to be gay at one point but almost all of his partners were women. He accepted transsexuals but was never one himself. He was for experimentation and freedom, and would be disgusted with the stifling trans ideology of today.
It is not about passability or wearing what they want. Its about insisting that the rest of us, women in particular, have to accommodate them to the point of allowing them into womens spaces ; lockerrooms, women’s shelters, women prisons ,sports etc. So , - women who are victims of grape and assault by men have to accept men, who say they are woman, in those spaces. - 12 year old girls have to undress and change in the presence of fully intact males because they claim to be women. - In sports, look at the olympics, women have to compete against men who claim to be women. - Lesbian women have to allow men in their dating apps, and getting harassed if they don’t want sex with a transwoman. You can even loose your job if you fail to use the desired pronouns Etc etc. In short , they infringe on other peoples rights .Thats why there is less and less acceptance for these people.
It goes far beyond “ wearing what a man wants “ and pretending that it is , doesn’t help acceptance , on the contrary.Did you even listen to the podcast?
I dont think anyone is saying NOT to allow men to be affeminate, this is NOT that. Expecting everyone to take part or accept another person's fantasy is a step too far.
The fact that people lose their jobs, get abused, and cencored tells you everything It's not normal We have accepted trans ppl for years, this is a whole idiology with intentions on affecting little kids That's when your intuition kicks in and you know it's wrong, but youre unable to feel that when you are out of balance Blairs not affecting anyone else
The pronoun fad is in fact imposed speech to be complied with in the absence of the trans activist, who demands other people refer to the transsexual/transvestite in the absence of that transitioner. How manipulative.
17:30 this is crazy that someone is happy to be catcalled 😭 i experienced immense syress when i came to US for three months to NYC and started experiencing catcalls daily multiple times, even wearing baggy shorts, loose tshirt and cap...i surely got some back in my country but i can count them like under 20, and there i once got catcalled three time walking one block. This is smth very sick that has been normalized
I honestly like Blair, I think he's overall a good person (despite obviously not agreeing with him on ALL topics). But I mostly see him as a kind of "cautionary tale"- Blair admirably doesn't have a "victim mentality", but I do still see him as a victim (though not without a share of responsibility) of the harms of trans ideology, EVEN IN the "transexual", as opposed to "transgender", variant of the ideology. Blair admits he grew up in a very homophobic family, in a homophobic rural area. And basically admits this was the main reason for his "transition"; That he'd internalized all this negative stuff about gayness. But saw """being a woman""" as a pathway to still being able to be with men. He also admits that, as an adult, he's wanted to have biological kids, to the extent that he stopped HRT for, I think it was over a year. But the damage was already done; He couldn't produce viable sperm. I just see him as a likeable, funny, charming but also kinda tragic gay man, who has done incredible, totally needless harm to his own body, because of the homophobia that I suspect drives a HUGE percentage of "transitions". I just can't believe that rejecting something as basic as your own biology, can EVER be good for your mental health. Of course, the person themself will SAY it totally helps their mental health. The same way that anorexic wll SAY that allowing them to not eat, is "helping" them. Or that a heroin addict will swear you saved their life, by giving them their fix... ... but ultimately,. these are just ALL variants of self-harm...
Absolutely. I have a lot of respect for Blaire - an intelligent and empathetic person who has long taken flak from his "community" for standing up against the mutilation of children etc. But a non-manly or not-good-enough man is not a woman, nor vice versa. Ultimately how much can we trust the narrative of anyone who is living with what is at heart a severe mental illness (I think Blaire has described it as such too but apologies if he hasn't, I mean no offence or judgment on anyone who has any mental instability). Seemingly none of the trans commentators can truly separate their own personal delusions/experiences from any discussion on these issues. It is, understandably, just a huge blind spot for them no matter how rational they may seem otherwise.
@@RuthIreland-qk4cp Blaire has indeed described it as a mental illness or "condition" for which the treatment was transitioning. I would also recommend another trans UA-camr, Alexis Blake. She's a very down-to-earth trans woman who has been very open about her condition from a medical and mental health perspective and what a serious deal it is to transition. She's called out Dylan Mulvaney for being offensive to women and not realizing that she too is a guest in the space of womanhood.
@@Avarcirith thanks, interesting I will check Alexis out. As a middle-aged woman of the boring original flavour, I rarely have points of agreement with transwomen - who I just consider men whatever their reasons for "transitioning". However, I like to try to understand their points of view as human beings with a very unusual life experience. Getting to a place where we can all have an honest conversation (and disagree sometimes without it causing the end of civilization!) is so important.
@Helen Joyce, please file a criminal complaint against India for cyber bullying, hate crimes etc for takking about your looks and saying you look like a man. Give India a taste of their own medicine. Use the law against them.
Whilst I like Blaire White, Blaire does not fully pass, I used to think so myself but then saw a non-filtered video of Blaire outside somewhere talking to people and saw Blaire in a different light so to speak, better than most but I would suspect 90% of woman would clock Blaire immediately. I saw an interesting interview of a CIA person who specialised in covert make up, masks etc, where the operatives life depended on this persons work, who said woman can pass as men fairly easily but men can rarely pass as a woman, most woman know this already.
it seems an obvious point when Helen says it, but it is absolutely true--that this repeated 'affirmation' is driving the bus. It's cruel and the agenda behind it is anything BUT kind and inclusive.
I do really appreciate how she acknowledged the broad range of reasons men & women tend to transition & that this frequently differs, as well. That’s a good insight that doesn’t seem to be talked about much.
Im a trans woman who learned that i had to use the ladies room very early on. Being nearly passable i noticed how out of place I was in the men's room and got comments that i was in the wrong place. I now socialize, interact and behave entirely as a woman with close female friends. Mentally, i was saved from depression, sadness and no hope for the future the moment i transitioned. I am happy, go lucky, emotional, i cry, i laugh, i feel free, im feminine, i care for my friends, im optimistic and finally enjoying life for the first time, ever.
Did you coming out destroy your family? Did you care? Is your happiness more important than anyone's else's? Are you arrogant about your pronouns and scream at anyone who makes mistakes? Do you know that you will always be biologically male no matter how much you change?
I find Blaire White to be a serious breath of fresh air bc of the honesty and humor in every post, but sometimes I can so clearly see the gay guy shining through in spite of all the artifice. These are the strangest of times.
trans men and trans women are always going to have their female and male brains, way of thinking, and mannerisms regardless of what they do to change themselves. thats just an inherit characteristic thats ingrained in them. doesnt make them any less of what they are trying to be perceived as on the outside. i feel people care too much about "what is a woman", "what is a man". just let people be people and do what they want if it doesnt affect you or anyone else.
Blaire may be in the public eye, but she's very proactive in protecting children. To me her voice and contribution are incredibly important amongst today's folly.
Agreed. Until I found out he supports Trump. Which means voting for a wannabe dictator and someone who won't stop any laws from taking women's reproductive rights. Blaire is a hypocrite if he says he cares about women's rights but votes for Trump...
Frankly, Blair is a hypocrite. He claims he’s gender critical but still violates women’s boundaries by using our spaces. I don’t believe a word that comes out of his mouth. He thinks that men shouldn’t be allowed to use female only spaces as long as they still look like men. Once they “do the work” (ie, transition by going on estrogen, getting fake boobs and plastic surgery) then they should be given the exact same sex based rights as women. The only reason Blair believes that is because he’s just another misogynistic male and no amount estrogen or “HRT will change that.
@@Jezzebel1313 I don't really agree when they state that because she looks the way she looks, she's necessarily selling a lifestyle, especially to young, pliable minds. Yes, we do want what we see sometimes, but her content does stand for something too and disabuses people who might feel that way of the notion. Same with Buck Angel. NOthing but respect in that regard.
Stupendous insights from Helen Joyce. This quote HAS to be the basis for another Joyce book, on the human condition: “I see a lot of it as railing against the human condition. It’s very sad. And I think every parent knows this, and probably you remember it from your own childhood as well. You know that bit where you realize you ‘re going to die.you know that first day, it’s usually that you realize your parents are going to die first, and it’s an awful thought that they are going to die, and then you think that one day I am going to die, and you can see that a lot of human activity is trying to distract yourself from that fact.”
Marcus Dibs needs to feature in so many more compilations, podcasts and interviews like this. I'd love to have seen Helen's take on Marcus. This is my first time seeing your channel and I really enjoyed this format, hearing from a new (to me) thinker writer and speaker. And then there's Helen of course, whom I always want to hear from. She's fierce, truly.
I thought this was a really compelling discussion, and I really enjoyed it. The bottom line is no man can feel like a woman because no man knows what a woman feels like. And when they say they’re living as a woman, what they mean is their dressing as a woman and invading women spaces but they’re not living as a woman because no man could ever live as a woman it’s not possible. I think that society has gone so far in the wrong direction that bringing it back is going to be nearly impossible. The sad fact is that this movement is targeting children. 90% of the children who are identifying as trans right now or actually going to change their minds when they’re grown because it’s a social contagion. I am a woman, a real woman, a biological woman, and I couldn’t tell you what it feels like to be a woman because there is no universal feeling that is womanhood. Every woman feels different. We all feel differently about different things and have different emotions. There is no universal feeling where we can pinpoint it and say this is a woman. So for a man to say he can feel like a woman is not only presumptuous and arrogant but it’s bull. The only critique I have about this discussion as I wish that she had let him talk more because I found his point of view really interesting. And she did 80% of the talking which is pretty typical of women. The other reality that needs to be acknowledged as that women at this point are just dried out of sympathy and compassion for men trying to cosplay as women. It’s become such an invasion, and so invasive of women’s privacy, women’s rights, women’s feelings, and it’s just gotten to the point where women just don’t care anymore how people feel they’re like you’re a man get out of my bathroom. That should be Understandable to most people. At this point women have been so put down and so insulted by this whole movement not to mention, ignored that we just don’t care about feelings anymore. We just want our spaces in our rights back. And anyone who says that women’s rights have not been taken away by this movement is delusional or stupid.
Thank you - haha I'm sure some feminists would argue men usually do all the talking 😂. Appreciate you were interested in my POV. Usually with interviewing my guests, people like to hear them speak more. I'm a bit talker too so have to keep that in mind.
@@JackxJewell I thought your points were valuable and very interesting, I wish you had gotten to finish a few of those thoughts and elaborate a bit more!
I clocked abigail thorne in game of thrones as a man immediately. I didn't even know who they were, but I could tell they were a man as soon as the character appeared as a female character.
Yes! I did the same and then thought to myself "Could they really not find a female actor to play this role?" Apparently not, apparently a man plays being a woman better than all the talented female actors out there. Sexism in the 21st century. 🤷♀️
Blaire freely admits all of that, doesn't have any problems with it. Blaire went to counselling and concluded that, had they not been SA'd as a child, they would likely have grown up to simply be gay. Blaire also doesn't use the women's bathroom.
Blaire does use the women's bathroom. She once on air tried to use a men's room and was immediately thrown out. She says you should do whatever causes the least disturbance.
@@lmp23612 That’s the whole point of these extreme surgeries, isn’t it? To lie to the world and force others to go along with your fiction. Kicking a man out of a female-only bathroom or changing room is immoral if he’s cosmetically altered his body to look like a woman. Never mind how the women in there might feel if they knew a man were disguised amongst them. Never mind religious women who can’t expose their hair in front of men and how their beliefs are being violated without their knowledge. The women and their consent don’t matter. Only the men’s feelings.
Yes Blaire does. And encourages other men like himself to do the same. Blair says that only extremists would want women's spaces to be for real women only.
@@noodleperson17 Buck Angel doesn't demand to be called a man yet passes as a man and is not predatory. He also really cares about kids and speaks the truth to protect kids against the Trans Cult.
I admire Helen but I don't agree with her about sexual orientation being something that leads you to a relationship. Many heterosexual or homosexual people have zero interest in a relationship they just want to have sex. And this kind of sex is not much different than masturbation too, because their partner is an object to them during that action. So the only difference is they're using a person instead of porn to get aroused and satisfied. But that doesnt change they still have a sexual orientation.
@@KatMoore-ih6mw In this specific context Helen was talking about something more than sex, of course I know sexual relationship is a kind of relationship.
Great conversation! Thank you for being logical, truthful and reasonable in your criticisms without stooping to being mean and hateful towards the people you criticize.
1:05:10 It doesn’t matter if someone passes, they still can be really neurotic about it. One of the most “passable” trans identified males I know is also one of the absolutely most neurotic about their looks and super upset all the time about “not passing” etc … always looking for the next procedure
The way I see it looking like something on the outside doesn't make it true. Someone might look like a woman, but what makes them a woman is their biology, chromosomes etc which can't be changed. Its the same as age. People can have plastic surgery and wear makeup to make themselves appear younger, but on the inside they're still aging. If you're 70 but have had surgery to make yourself look 30 - you're still 70! There's currently no technology that can actually reverse your aging and make your body young again. Plastic surgery might make you look younger and feel better but it wont change your age. Same for sex/gender. You can have all the hormones and plastic surgery you want to create an illusion on the outside, it doesnt actually change your biological sex. There needs to be some sort of law that says people can't change their biological sex and whatever you self identify as is not legally recognised. This would help stop men from being allowed in womens prisons, sport etc. What someone does to their own body or how they dress is their business and they can identify as whatever gender they want - but there is still their legal sex that they're born as which cannot change.
What a great video. So thoughtful and insightful. Two articulate people putting forward common sense opinions about a difficult subject. I learnt a lot and I feel somewhat vindicated for many of my own beliefs.
Man, I'm a straight man from Poland, but I've graduated with honors in cultural studies, so I'm spiritually gay, and I have to say, your channel is stellar. You're so articulate and entertaining (sometimes even informative!) that I'm just shocked that you have "only" 7k subscribers. At least "only" in relation to the quality. Wish you all the best and I hope to see Helen on here again soon. One of my favorite interviews with her for sure.
To all PC men who think transwomen are women enough for interviews and panels, stop and ask yourself a simple question. Do I even need to spell it out?
As a lesbian, I was not suffering from body dysphoria (thankfully) however like any teenage girl, I didn't like the changes occurring in puberty and the only time I thought about being a guy had to do with being accepted by my gf's parents. It always had to do with making my life easier for being in a couple that is females only.
Regarding paraphilia and orientation, paraphilia comes with obsession, compulsion and often exhibition. So consider your orientation, you do not feel you MUST get a job which gives you access to who you want to sleep with, you don't consider attacking the object on your orientation because you can't have it and you don't consider breaking laws.
I don't think so - just think of how some men attack women and do all sort of things to get what they want. Also if you saw what many gay men get up to in pursuit of their sexuality... I think the obsessive nature of the paraphilia may be to do with them not being able to act on it morally.
Orientation is based on the sexes and the very reason it exists in the first place is because of sexual reproduction, therefore the attraction to a sex comes in naturally without influences from the outside. Paraphilias/Fetishes/Kinks on the other hand have no such deep root in evolutionary biology and are heavily influenced by the outside, they can be gained and even unlearned and often times did not exist in the past, other cultures or in the animal kingdom at all. They're also objectifying and people with paraphilia never act on honest interest in a person but regard them rather as a tool for gratification.
I am a passing trans woman and use the women’s restroom if I have to. I prefer the privacy and safety of neutral restrooms myself. I don’t use the men’s restroom because it defeats the purpose of transitioning in the first place which is to be treated and seen as a woman. For me if I were to ever be confronted in a woman’s restroom and accused of being trans I would politely leave and cause as little of a scene as possible. I would be embarrassed enough to just be found out, because I kinda also think being trans is not really a good thing. It’s something I am cursed with tbh. I just try to get through my difficult life with as little friction as possible tbh.
@@JackxJewellyeah is not been easy. I transitioned in my teens over 15 years ago and before that I was antisocial and kept to myself for years. Gender identity issues were absolutely the cause of my behaviors. Transition was absolutely the correct choice for me. My parents were very anti-trans and they asked why I couldn’t just be gay. And this was back in 2006-2007, so no one really knew what being trans was. I had to explain that I’m not interested in sex at all so I’m not gay or straight or auto. But after about 8 years being authentic to myself and changing from a depressed antisocial boy to a bubbly, happy, outgoing, and incredibly social “woman”, they changed their opinions on transition. They think, “yes it’s extreme and not right for everyone, but it was absolutely the correct choice for their child.” If people don’t consider me a woman after knowing that’s fine, I can’t argue that based on how they wanna define it. But I’m happier and just a better human this way. Idk how to explain it to people who see it black and white. I wish i wasn’t like this and don’t have to take tons of medication and undergo surgery to have my body feel comfortable. If I coulda been happy as I man I woulda stayed that way, I tried my whole life… i really did. I looked at men and couldn’t find a single one who I wanted to be, there wasn’t one example of a blueprint I could follow. But I looked at women and I saw examples of who I wanted to be everywhere. I worked extremely hard and have for the most part achieved those goals of being who I wanted to be. The only things missing are the essential functions of being a woman that I can never achieve. And that’s ok because that’s just the hand I was dealt. I feel similarly to how I would imagine a woman who can’t have her own kids feels. It sucks but I can’t let that define me and I have other valuable things I can contribute to the world. Regardless I know exactly what I am people can define it how they like and call me a man but I have never really lived as a man and when I was a little boy I never talked to people so my only social experiences have been under the illusion I was born a woman. I only know how to be a woman socially because those are the only experiences I have ever had socially. My entire adult life of over 15 years has been under the illusion I was born female to everyone around me. I have an entire life, an image, friends, a career. I don’t understand why people feel they have a right to destroy my happiness. Sure my happiness is based on essentially fooling everyone around me. But it’s no different than hiding the worst and most embarrassing things in your life. I understand that I’m probably stronger than most women but I’m no threat. I’m just a castrated male bodied person who wants to live life under the illusion I was born female. I’m not competing in sports, if someone ever felt uncomfortable by my presence in a women’s space I would leave without conflict. I’m not hurting anyone if I can help it.
@@residentdoom1This is exactly how I feel being born the wrong race. Intense distress at my skin color are my earliest memories of myself, always desired to change race, and only identified with people of my desired race.
@@raina4732 Those are not comparable because be a race has a genetic heritage, sex and gender don’t. For example being black in the US has history and regional culture attached to it and that lineage is important. And being a particular gender/sex is completely social outside reproduction. The two are hardly comparable. Our culture is clearly gendered and our brains are hardwired to tell the difference between sexes. Our brains are hardwired to tell genetic differences apart only enough to make sure you are not related. Try again.
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I think helen's quote around 6:10 'the more clever you are the easier it is to fool yourself'
should be -
'the more clever you are the more justifications / reasons you CAN construct to believe something that is false'
the other thing that I would say, is that it is feminist ideology that enables this movement. the fact that it is delusional men (generally AGP as I see it) pushing into women's spaces is not really the point. if it wasn't for the rampant feminists ideology that has taken hold throughout the western world, these men would be where they used to be - at home jerking off in women's underwear !
Why don't you be respectful and talk to Blair rather then calling her names. Does anyone understand what she went through?? Pls be respectful.
You can't debunk something if your not brave enough to speak and talk to the person.
@@Sherlock245 I didn’t call her names? I like her a lot
@JackxJewell hi jack, I'm transgender. Helen's framing it as if we are the sexual perverts is really the opposite of my experience. I like men but they are the ones on dating sites that are gross with their desires to send inappropriate photos and dirty talk. Most of the transwomen I know have similar experiences
@@JackxJewell Honey trust and believe you do not want me to comment on you. When do you live-stream?
when a trans person says they are "living as a woman" what they mean is they put on women's clothes. In what other way do they live as a woman. They don't have to worry about periods, they don't have to worry about their breasts changing size from week to week, they don't have to manage contraception to avoid getting pregnant, they don't have to deal with any of the day to day realities of a woman's life.
I am not a dress. woman is not a costume you can put on for fun.
They change size? I know. It has something to do with periods.
Well, things get even more complicated when someone who does not even make any effort (an does not have the intention) to 'pass' tries to convince you that they are a woman or a man.
@@remeiagullessimo1586 and they've been showing up as women for like 3 weeks and start throwing names like "period haver" and "pregnant person". You for real? You say you want to be a woman and you use dehumanizing language and dehumanizing rhetoric every time you open your mouth? It's like coming into a temple and rearranging the furniture. YES a temple, Not a house, a temple, because it's something that has existed for thousands of years and is also deeply culturally significant to a community
@@stephenpowstinger733 age, hormones, stress, bra use, weight gain, water retention pregnancy. Things you wouldnt understand what feels like from the outside
@@amandarios448 Exactly. We live our bodies from inside!
I love how no-filter Helen has gone. Eloquent as ever but now with a little extra spice 🌶️
Yeah, I have noticed this lately. I think she must have reached her maximum BS level. While most of us do not interact with trans activists on a daily basis she has seen and heard it all.
A bit more spunk perhaps?
Can you ask Helen what she and Sex Matters want? When can they end their noble campaign to cut this crap? What will success look like?
@@noodleperson17 When these cretins are in the asylum where they belong 😂
@buntyclara it's pretty obvious that success would mean men stop entering any woman's space ever again, regardless of their identity.
I’m a Helen fan girl too lol. She has the rarity on hitting the sweet spot between intellectualism and ‘real talk’ on her observations.
I love her, too. I could listen to her all day!
Yes! You are spot on with your summary about Helen 👌
Yessss! That's exactly it
No, she’s just confirming your bias
@@CV_411 Her ability to dissect the nonsense and misinformation spread is very impressive, and she is slowly been proven right!
One aspect that Helen omitted is that women face a threat that trans women don't... Sexual violence leading to pregnancy
She said it but she didn’t shout it. The thing is, how are people forgetting what a woman is? Or confused about it? Birth control and abortion have disconnected us from reality.
A lot of sexual violence though...
and your point is that its a further penalization that cis women have, that trans women don't have. but both experience sexual crime for the same reasons usually for the same expression.
Trans men, without surgery, can still experience assault that leads to pregnancy. Trans women have far higher rates of violent crime against them than women. If your point is that it is worse for women than it is for trans women, in general, that is not accurate.
@@freyajonsdottir2620 There is no such thing as a ‘cis’ woman. We are not a subcategory of our own sex class, thank you.
I saw Helen speak in Dublin at the let women speak rally and afterwards bought and read her book. Her ability to disesect simplify a complex subject and fact check the misinformation that is being spread is incredible. Keep up the good work Helen you are an inspiration ❤ 🇮🇪
@@Lemonbonbonare you Serious? Wtf?
I’d bet you’re a Trump supporter
@@surlypiratewench1969 i cant stand Trump, Kamala, the Clintons, Labour, Tories and Reform and i LOVE Helen Joyce !
Bet you are a government bootlicker though !
So pleased to have learned of her!
The autogynophilia also shows up in sexual sadist rapists and killers! I see loathing of women as part of their innate personality. I don't want them accepted in public or in private female spaces.
YES, Helen is spot on: people have only grown MORE dysphoric the further this ideology has progressed, not less.
Don't worry, once the enrichers are in the majority they'll put an end to it.
Which ideology?
@@michelledavis2604 Gender ideology
@@michelledavis2604 So to elaborate further. Gender ideology is the set of ideas that teaches people, children included, that sex can be changed (which it can't) but simultaneously also teaches that what defines who's a man or a woman isn't the sex at all, but instead this pseudoscientific concept of "gender identity."
Furthermore, it teaches that sex isn't a binary, one or the other, but instead exists a spectrum, based on very stereotypical things like interests and traits.
No wonder children have become more dysphoric over the course of time, they are taught to not trust their eyes and instincts anymore, and to question themselves in even the most basic of ways.
"Oh, shit, I'm a boy but sometimes I like to play with dolls... maybe I'm a girl..."
@JD-xd4sy Gender identity is innervated by a neurological structure called the Bed Nucleus Stria Terminalis. This is part of the limbic system ie the thalamus, hyper thalamus, amygdala and hippocampus, which control function such as emotions, behaviour, motivation and memory.
I thought I was once someone for trans rights but it was when I had no idea what that actually meant. I assumed these men knew they were men and were simply suffering from something that only surgery could alleviate. I now know there's a lot more to it now. I was naive and biased. I'm so pleased more and more are waking up to this dangerous ideology.
Me too!!!!
As Rowling says, trans rights are human rights, doesn't make them women or give them right to their spaces, they've spent their lifetimes in 🚹 & should continue to do so in a skirt.
you not alone i myself was sucked into the lies of this movement . I originally thought it was just allowing people no matter their gender to dress how they want without being dragged into stereotypes . Boy was I wrong instead I discovered a new modern day fascist regime trying brainwash and traumatize the next generation of children
1:04:50 "Passability" ended up being a cruel joke on me. Former "FtM", here, and reaching this milestone did not make me happy inside because there was always more. I had become a lifelong project. There was always another surgery to be had, regardless of how much I had already achieved. Frankly, I question any trans-identified person who can say with all honesty that disembodying themselves (yes, this is what it is) has given them inner peace. The cruel joke on me is that instead of being a "man trapped in a woman's body" (the lie), I am now a woman "trapped" in a male-appearing body. Fortunately, for me, I am older and care a lot less than I did as a young woman how I look; I'm just happy to get a second chance at life, now.
Would you ever consider telling your story openly on a podcast? It sounds fascinating
@@barekicks I will be soon. Also writing my memoir.🙂
@@j.j.l.I'm glad you found your way back to yourself. I've come to believe living inauthentically is like a slow poison to the soul. The lie that is told by the TRAs is that your desired sex is the "real" you, trapped in a shell that doesn't reflect it. The truth is we are our bodies and inflicting wounds on it (which is what SRS is,) is an assault on ourselves.
I wish you all the best and I concur, I too care less about how I look as I get older. It's actually very freeing.
I hope I get to hear or read your story one day. I can't pretend to truly understand what motivates ppl to transition, but I'd like to.
this is the point that Germaine Greer was making: it doesn't matter how many body parts you cut off, your basic biology cannot be denied. I hope you find peace in your life. A man who cuts off his penis remains a man and a woman who cuts off her breast remains a woman. There is no surgery that can change that basic fact.
A shame you didn't get the psychological support you needed before they operated on you.
Helen Joyce is brilliant and brings much needed common sense.
Confirmation bias🙄
Helen Joyce nailed it with her comment about fear. Females live with fear; it is not only literally in our dna but also built into our lives socially through being passed down through the generations from mother to daughter since time immemorial. And yes, I know men experience fear too, but female fear is at a cellular level.
terfisaslur, much RTA is not just misogynist but life-threateningly violent as well.
I would call it a fear but an innate genetic survival antenna that we use to scan our environment because we are genetically weaker.
RTA? @@unowen-nh9ov
100% I remember having to talk to my daughters about different things throughout the years. As their ages and bodies changed so did the level of warning conversations on how to protect themselves and not be in certain situations etc. Men and boys don't need those warning conversations as they are the perpetrators.
😊
Aspects of Helen’s directness reminded me of Germaine Greer. We should have listened to her on this issue and maybe we wouldn’t be where we are now. I remember reading her warnings several years ago and feeling that her views were extreme and that she was predicting a future that would never happen. How wrong I was. I’m so glad we now have Helen and others speaking out for women.
It never occurred to me that Germaine Greer was wrong on this subject. I read The Female Eunach in the early 1980s. It was the first book that articulated how I felt about being a woman, so I followed her career with great interest. Of course she was right about this - she knew it was an attack on women and said so. She was Cancelled as a result and that right there should have alerted everyone to the threat of this cult. And it is a cult, and it will be exposed at some point, but we're not quite there yet. Two men boxing women at the Olympics and winning Gold made people sit up and Tickle v Giggle in Australia is making the threat very clear to everyyone.
Yes and Germaine got flack and misunderstanding.....ahead of what was to come. Men in their 40s deciding their marriages weren't enough.....prescient!
I read an article she wrote in the 90s about meeting a ‘trans woman’, and I couldn’t believe how right she was all those years ago. She called out the fetishism and misogyny behind it straight away, and she was ignored
I have know a few trans women and have lived in Oxford street Sydney. I have NEVER seen a trans woman that I didn’t know was a man. There is so much involved to being a woman, women can ALWAYS tell.
Yassss I used to live on Bourke St many years ago and spent three nights a week in Stonewall etc and the Transwomen I knew would NEVER want to sit in a women's changing room and watch them get undressed or demand that people pretend that they are more women than 100% women. I actually am starting to think that these crazy one's are predatory AGP men who force themselves into women and girls safe spaces and are crapping in the pool to ruin it for everyone? I've known Trans people for over thirty years now and they ALL like Buck Angel and Rose Of Dawn speak the truth/reality like Marcus 'The Offensive Tranny'.
How did you know they were a man? What tests did you conduct? How do you know there weren't people you took as female who were assigned male at birth? How could you know?
@BobHutton you kust be a man to even question this. There's a plethora of hints from hand size and the way one places their feet when they stand to the width of their shoulders, lack of indent in their waist and length of septum. Moreover, it's how they ACT. Men act VERY differently than women in not only body language but they are generally just more gruff, cruel, haughty, interruptive, combative, and lacking in consideration. They also don't KNOW crap women do about our biology and that comes out in conversation when they try to pretend to be us.
@@michelledavis2604 ok Mike.
@@BobHutton easy. Big hands. Big feet. Adam's apple. Large head and brow ridge. Large wrists. Broad shoulders. Narrow hips. Ridiculous falsetto.
And the way they think and act.
It is ironic that Abigail bemoans the difficulty of changing someone's mind who "just won't listen to the truth or facts". Is Abigail projecting?
I think he has self-brainwashed to the point where he considers his perspective self-evidently correct. Like those guys who are convinced they are good guys and attractive and can only conclude that women who won't sleep with them are bitches.
90% of what "trans" activists and "allies" accuse others of is pure projection.
Exactly what i was thinking. Talking about denying biological reality... what??
Yep
Haha. my immediate thought!
When Veronica Ivy proclaimed he was a biological female on The Daily Show it was so disheartening to watch Trevor Noah not push back at all just to avoid any controversy. It was obvious Noah didn’t believe a word that they were saying, but just played it safe. Just disappointing.
He's a trans ally. But more the kind who doesn't want to admit the right is, well... right about this. He knows the left has lost it and there's no way he can make sense of the trans madness so he'd rather be silent about it.
PS I've always voted left and I feel politically orphan right now
He didnt want to be cancelled by his own side and felt he had couch even the tiny bits of pushback as 'some might say'. I lost a lot of respect for him.
Yes, I also felt disappointed in Trevor. He's usually an ally of women.
His Netflix comedy special criticizes women who want only women in women’s public bathrooms, then a few minutes later talks about how different women are in their bathroom habits compared to men. He knows why it’s important. He just doesn’t care.
He’s a coward, but he doesn’t want to lose his job and be a social castaway. Anyone who doesn’t speak up is a coward, but he’s also playing it safe, which I can - to a very, very limited degree - understand. After all, he has nothing to lose by playing it safe in the moment; he’s a man. Should that same trans individual demand he be allowed to share a locker room and shower with Noah’s daughter, or mother, and demand they also be comfortable with it, lest they be Nazis, well…lol
Helen is my favourite person on this subject. She's the GOAT on the subject in my opinion.
Confirmation bias
@@surlypiratewench1969 I think all of us are guilty of that. I'm just grateful I was born too soon to be affected by this cult, as this effeminate gay man would have been sliced and diced into a Frankenfemale.
I agree!! I love listening to her interviews. Always something new
Pretty sure ALL women need to be speaking out on this, it's not a Hall of Famer situation.
@@unowen-nh9ov That's a given. It's intelligent, unflappable experts like Helen that give ALL women the confidence to speak out.
I absolutely adore Helen Joyce! She makes me a braver human being!❤ "Linguistic Fuckery" & "Toss Pottery" are being added to my vocabulary immediately!😊 Great interview Jack!!!❤
Toss pottery is an old expression... glad she's reviving it 😂
@@Jonnie-Falafel define please?
@@livingfortheplot a tosspot is a fool. Or a drunk.
@@BackUp-nx2de Ah! lol Thank you! “Toss Pot” and “linguistic fuckery” idk why those descriptions make me so happy. 😂
@@livingfortheplot A Tosspot is also a wang ker... Haha.
Helen is a legend! Always enjoy listening to her views.
Confirmation bias. Just admit what you are ffs🙄
@@surlypiratewench1969 Helen is a legend! Always enjoy listening to her views.
@richalderson6069 she just confirms bigotry. Guess we know where you stand🙄 why can’t you just leave them alone? Scared?
@richalderson6069 🙄
@@surlypiratewench1969 okay Randy, bore off.
I love you Helen Joyce ❤ what a WOMAN
Do you have one Honey?
If you are worried about using sex-based pronouns for trans-identifying people, see if you can worry about insulting women even more. Tell the trans-identifying person, "Out of respect for women, I use sex-based pronouns. I don't feel entitled to give away the words women need to describe their reality."
Wow - that’s powerful - love it and will use it!! ❤😊
13:20 As far as I’m aware, Blair is respectful of female only spaces and would never undress in front of women and children in a public place
I just ignore them. They get nothing from me. They love it when you refuse.
Excellent point. Also protected in law (Forstater case and others) although that is under siege from the extremists.
@@user-ep3ih4dy1xthats not respectful but normal for a man not to enter women’s XX spaces. He will never be a real woman. I have no problem if he wants to dress up as a woman.
She is just the most sensible real woman. Kind, articulate, factual and intelligent.
And sweary, which somehow makes me like her even more
Factual?🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
More like confirmation bias🙄
@@threewisewomentheatreco3460 Her book is amazing. If you haven read it yet I would recommend 👌
So nice to watch two people talk, discuss, agree, disagree and just be normal.
Feeding a delusion is not kind
Then stop being deluded.
And 'Be Kind' has been highjacked.
@@annagreig7977 which delusion?
@@michelledavis2604that they are the opposite sex
@@chrispinsprinkler2747 so much ignorance sbout gender identity.
Philosophy Tube has a huge ego, he only wants to hear from those fawning over him. He runs his own Reddit and heavily moderates any slight criticism of his acting.
He lives an act everyday, it's all theatrics to masquerade his fetish. And like Contrapoints and all the other copy and paste autogynephile s video essayists, theatrics over coherent arguments, they never actually answer the question they pose.
Any answer that is displeasing, even if it is just a reality of situation they got themselves into, by their own choice, is categorized as offensive and there for ha te speech.
It is like saying to a religious zealot that their god is not real.
Same thing.
@@arachnabell Correct.
I have been calling out Ollie Thorne for about a year. He has dupers delight and is highly narcissistic. I watched an interview with Ash Sarkar and he was so mysogynistic right in her face and she was just lapping it up. I realised there was a real problem there. Aside his agp, I think he realises that this could be a real grift for him breaking into the acting industry....and it worked. He strikes me as the type of man who would have a tight coercive control on any poor woman involved seriously with him
But they both are very good at what they do.
Yes sometimes it feels as if they use the womanhood as a way to victimize themselfes. I am a woman myself and it feels annoying. They really don't get what they are talking about xD. I wish I could show them what its like to be real female. I would let them fought against men, let them walk outside in the dark with the strength that real woman have, getting into labor, bleeding each month with pains and not the mention the negative effects of the hormones which I think they will notice if they go on hormones. It can make you depressed. Constantly knowing men will be better in sports anyway. As a woman sometimes you just feel so low about yourself and these specific trans people make that feeling even worse for us.
With public fetishes its very rude to impose it on other people in the public without their consent. And rude is putting it mildly.
Kink is about consent. And none of us consent
They're called Predators....
I think the difference between Bowie and Prince is while they might have worn women's clothing it probably wasn't because it was WOMEN'S clothing but had an aesthetic. Like if you wanted to be a goth type in the 80s/early 90s you probably had ruffles or some shit on your shirt. You liked the ruffles regardless if it was sold in the men's or women's section, but you could probably only find it in the women's section if you're looking for your romantic vampire look. The AGPs want to buy the button down in the women's section because it' sin the women's section, not because it's a buttondown of a certain style. If a plain white t shirt is sold in the men's section, they'll still buy the women's section plain white t. It's not about what it looks like, it's about the label. At some point Bowie and Prince could afford bespoke clothing. So that was style of clothing, not women's clothing.
“Linguistic queer theory fuckery”
Helen I love you ❤
Also "bolloxing around it..." You must have her back on Jack to enlighten us further in these linguistic fundamentals.
I'm always greatful for other gay men critizising this TRA madness. And also such a grest guest! I subscribed!
Thank you x
Gay man deeply critical of gender woo here too. I believe there are more of us than we think
Gay men marginalizing anyone is preposterous. Go do some research about Gay Culture in the 80’s.
@@surlypiratewench1969 marginalizing... classic example of disingenuous rhetoric. Next you gonna talk about giving for respect to maps
@@surlypiratewench1969 what RIGHTs do Trans ppl NOT HAVE in 2024 ?
Helen is a treasure. Thank you.
Totally disagree on the “preferred pronouns”. The people who refused to use preferred pronouns are the ones who peaked me. Those that chose to use them because they were being “kind” kept me from recognizing the pernicious nature of trans ideology for far too long. I think preferred pronouns and incredibly dangerous and have brought women’s rights to the perilous position in which it is.
That’s where I took a slight turn from the left I have lovely trans friends just living their lives but it was my “nonbinary friends “ that pushed me away for telling me I’m a transphobe when I came out publicly and said why I no longer support children medically transitioning
A tip of the hat to those who Peaked you. Great job Terfs! TM-
@@anonymousa-uy1hk it took me a couple of years to realise the harm in using preferred pronouns. Biological facts only for me from now on.
I'm on this same train now!
It’s the opposite for me. People who use preferred pronouns are what peaked me. I thought people who didn’t were just bigoted and dismissed them entirely.
But this just goes to show why it’s important to have people like Jack AND Helen. They’re reaching different demographics with their different rhetoric. The Jacks reached me, the Helens reached you.
23:51 A judge in Australia has just ruled that a person CAN change sex, and that it’s discriminatory to say that trans women can’t go into female-only spaces. So, it sounds like Australia is screwed as far as safety and fairness for women is concerned …
Yes he's a VERY dangerous man. I used to be in a few women's Meet Up groups but they have disbanded due to predatory men encroaching and now this dangerous 'judge' has made it legal for men to abuse women and it's illegal for women to stand up for themselves now. He clearly wants ALL women and girls to sit at home and be bored! We now just have to use different avenue's like the pre-internet days to join women/girl only groups where we can speak about women ONLY issues without predators abusing us. Much like freedom fighters in N@z1 Germany/Communist countries.
If you can change sex it means a man can impregnate himself during a transformation with his own semen into the emerging vagina as a transformer. Lifestyle change, yes, but if ONE person can change sex it means self-produced pregnancy is possible 😂😂😂😂
Oh just sit down🙄
@@surlypiratewench1969 nope.
It’s not over yet . There is an appeal pending. 😊
I used to kinda like Philosphy Tube, until I realised how truly delusional they have grown in their little internet echo chamber, especially post transition. The last straw was one of their videos about a year ago, where they unironically keep talking about historical opression suffered by "us women" at the hands of the patriarchy.
I mean, come on, how dare you! They lived most of their life as a white, straight cis-gendered male in the UK, what opression??? What shared experience? They lived and identified as a woman for literally less then 3 years. And ived as a white cis straight man for almost 30.
In the same bit they larp as some downthrodden working class from a third world country, meanwhile they are extremely privileged and well off.
Upper middle class at least. Not to mention they were educated in elite private schools and attended an elite university at St. Andrews. You know, the one where Prince William and Catherine, the future King and Queen of UK, went.
It became so off-putting and nauseating to watch all the enlightened virtue signaling with all that tone deafness!
It's interesting how many 🍎 🍇 🍐 🍓 become feminists, and SJW's about things they don't know.
Please don’t use the word ‘cis’, you’re just validating trans ideology. There are only men and women. We are not sub-categories of our own sex-class.
Exactly what I was about to say
This was fabulous. Helen, you are a true hero. Thank you both.💗
Jack is a good podcast host...... gave Helen plenty of space, stepped back when Helen came in with extra thoughts.... I enjoyed this, very interesting. Hope they do a repeat!
‘Living as milk’ - exactly that! Always a joy to listen to Helen talking. 😂
"transplaining" is a new one on me =P
even if you accidentally drank the oat milk and thought it was cow's milk for some reason it wouldn't actually become cow's milk just a convincing imitation. This is a good analogy for it. They always claim to want to break down binaries I don't know what is so frightening in saying someone like Blaire has a very different experience from both the typical male and typical female in our society.
Prof Joyce! Thank you! Your book is fantastic. You have given me the language and courage to fight back.
Blaire actually made a video where she used the men's restroom and filmed the results. TRA's claim that they would be in danger if they had to use the men's room, but Blaire was not unsafe during the experiment. The men who found her in there were actually concerned for preserving her safety, not making her unsafe.
It's a tricky thing when they pass like this. I supposed single occupancy or a small 3rd bathroom would solve this.
Banning extreme body modification surgeries and medically-unnecessary hormone prescriptions would also solve this
Use disabled toilet. Problem solved
one day people will look back at trans surgery like we now look back at lobotomy
Trans surgery helps save people's lives and they live happier lives for it. How is it like lobotomy?
Or you mean that in the future there will be less crude ways to help trans people transition?
@@jujubesificationIt doesn’t help most people. The suicide rate goes up after the surgery.
I hate to make the comparison but it’s like using cocaine.
Most people wreck their lives once they start using coke. However there are a tiny margin of people who can and do use cocaine casually and they’re okay.
@bryanhawkins9418 that's simply the opposite of reality. Suicide rates go way down.
And let's not forget why trans people do commit suicide. Such as lack of acceptance and exclusion and dehumanization. Which is what people like Helen give a scientific aura to.
Sculpting the flesh in the image of the opposite sex is not a transition. It's destroying what little good there remained.@@jujubesification
That literally destroyed part of the brain making it unusable. Same thing as SRS allowing me to have sexual relations and relationships with heterosexual men ?
Make it make sense, the only aspect at all the same is doctors did the jumbling of the brains with metal stick because it became a popular thing as way to resolve issues and were wrong which is only true for those people not gate kept properly for surgery. All the other surgeries are very far from trans exclusive and actually the alternative surgical techniques for penile inversion were developed for inter-sex , females where the vaginal canal did not develop properly vut everything else was there
“There are 2 sexes, zero genders & infinite personalities. That covers everyone.” ~ Billboard Chris
Except that gender used to mean your sex specific personality. Like back in the 90s we had tomboys and girly girls, meanwhile the male varient was just boys and gays respectively. It was imperfect, which is why I feel that updating the Meyer's-Briggs personality chart to include sex personality stereotypes could give meaning to individuals that struggle. Most trans+ first start out because they don't fit in or feel like the others, due to superficial interests. But if we have a gender chart that gives a boy and girl variant for the same personality collection, that could help them realize that their exisitence is still valid (or whatever buzzword) as a biological boy/ girl.
Edit: I should have worded it as repurpose the Meyer's-Briggs chart.
@@Undomaranel Meyers-Briggs was debunked years ago, catch up.
@@MGrayl-ib5fo Yes, it was. Do you deny though that the same people who struggle fitting into social boxes wouldn't benefit from the same structure?
@@Undomaranel We’re all just individuals. No variant or labels necessary. I think that’s the gift in all of this. “We’re all unique….just like everyone else.” That’s a t-shirt lol
@@11Garrett11 I agree. However there are some people of mental deficiency/ social deficiency that can only accept things through stereotypes. The grandma at church that shames boys for keeping manicured nails, the father ashamed his daughter is a grease monkey, the child confused why they like boy things when they ate a girl. Having general subsets available is beneficial to those rigid mental types, because they can look at the chart and see that an authority recognizes that you can be a biological boy and not like sports.
I am not talking about the healthy people who understand things. I am talking about people who follow horoscopes, who rely on fitting in, who lack the confidence and intelligence and maturity to separate personality from performance.
I would put Helen Joyce up against any trans activist in a debate and I would bet on Helen to win. She's thought about this deeply and logically and she's not saying anything that she hasn't already thought about what the arguments against her position might be. She has an answer in the chamber. I think that's why they don't want to debate her.
It’s exactly why they won’t debate her.
I’d love the opportunity.
@@surlypiratewench1969 Do it.
@@madelinecox4101 he only wants the opportunity so he can try to physically intimidate her lol
Nah. Helen started by defining male vs female as the production of gametes. This excludes prepubescent, post menopause, infertile, castration, hysterectomy...
Let alone the various reasons for being "intersex".
Gender is way more complicated than what were taught at school.
Helen Joyce is one of the greatest minds of our time! 💫
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Thorne is not a philosopher. He took one course.
On the other hand, I think he does belive his own bullshit.
Because philosopher isn't the only title he claims which he does appallingly he is a terrible actor, and couldn't sell that anywhere near as convincingly as he did, if he didn't belive it.
Sucks to suck, tubey.
I think he studied a masters, although I’m not 100% sure. But anyway, the fact that someone studied certain things doesn’t guarantee they understood the things they studied, and doesn’t stop them using motivated reasoning etc.
hes has been debunked and exposed by actual philosophy professors..
@@LisaBrown-m9u on some aspects of his videos only.
@@nickthepostpunk5766 yeah on his videos what else would we have to debunk ???
I used to use preferred pronouns years ago when talking about the more moderate and 'passing' trans identified individuals, but even then, I felt the cognitive dissonance. The article 'Pronouns are Rohypnol' by Barra Kerr really articulated the discomfort I felt, and I won't do it anymore.
I cannot bring myself to call Blaire a he. My brain does not compute. Maybe if you see them naked.
Cruelty is the point, isn’t it?
@@surlypiratewench1969if you mean permitting penis-havers into vagina-only spaces, then yes, cruelty is clearly the point.
I know a woman who’s husband abused her for 30 years . They had 2 daughters. She caught him wearing her clothes eventually . She got away from him. He now lives as a “ woman” & ignores his grown daughters.
He destroyed her life & now she’s an elderly woman who spent the best years of her life being beaten & coerced by this vile person.
She left him when he was wearing women’s clothing but not for the thirty years he was beating her?? That’s so f’ing tragic. 🤯
The vast majority of men who abuse their spouse and/or kids happen to be cisgender and straight, because cisgendwr straight men are the most common kind, and abusiveness doesn't discriminate.
@@nadiaoak5123 Perhaps it was a "last straw" thing. Or a "turning point" thing in how she viewed her situation.
Look up Clive Bundy/Claire Fox. In England - Systematically sexually abused, raped and took photos of one of his daughters. He was eventually caught due to photos of his daughter he was sharing with others, leaking. His daughter then told the police everything he did.
His sentence was weak, it was shortened due to "good behaviour".
While in prison he claimed he was trans, became "Claire Fox" and was released even earlier because our prisons are over flowing and having another person they need to segregate for showers, food, toilet, etc puts extra strain on them.
I had a work colleague who wore women's clothes in private sometimes. His wife left him and their daughter. He brought up his daughter well & they're close & she's well adjusted. He is a good man, gentle, kind & nice to work with. I don't think a desire to dress up in women's clothes automatically means someone is an abuser or bad person
Just because a man wears a dress doesn’t mean it’s sexual. It’s just fashion of Bowie, Cobain etc. I’ve known men who wear skirts and it means nothing but comfort they are not trans or anything close. But pretending to BE a woman or sexualising women’s clothing is something else.
lol yup
Agree. Personally I don't care how a man chooses to dress, even if in some cases their motivations are "sexual" it's none of my business, what's important is that these men don't enter women's protected spaces and above all that they stop calling themselves "women" and stop forcing their mental delusion on everyone else to recognize them as "women" because they are NOT.
Exactly. It was nothing unusual for bands in the 1990s because androgyny was a popular 'look'. Cobain, Grohl and Novoselic all did it, but people only remember Kurt in Courtney Love's dress. Same with Bowie when many others in the 60s/70s did it. Young people gender-bending isn't new, and it doesn't make any of them trans.
I agree!💜
Pretending to BE a woman and demanding everyone go along ... don't expect everyone to go along, no one has to participate in your charade.
When they say "performing the function/role of a woman in society" or something similar ask them to define what that is without sounding like the Taliban and watch them squirm
And that if you define gender as a performance, people around you can judge your performance.
'Your performance of womanhood was subpar, therefore you are a man.'
It’s always just regressive, conservative (in the bad sense of the word), and sexist stereotypes.
"Transplaining" ... lol, that was good.
If a flat earther tried to get me to ‘look at the facts’ I would happily deny them.
yea but "flat earth" lore goes hard fr. look it up cause its insane what they came up with. its really cool from a fantasy perspective, but most certainly makes 0 sense with modern science lmao.
I'm a big fan of both Helen Joyce and Blaire White so even though I'm only half an hour into this I already think it's one of the most interesting podcasts Helen's done. You're the first person to discuss figures like Blaire with her so it's interesting to hear her thoughts. You appear to be genuinely challenging her and making her articulate her thoughts more. Fantastic job so far 😁
Thank you! I'm glad it worked out
@@JackxJewell I love your work mate. Keep doing what you do! 🙌
Blaire has always said she was a pretty boy and softer voiced. Also talks about the feminisation surgical except SRS, and for good reasons. Does not like the AGP, incel types etc who actually do harm the lovely transwomen like Blaire and Alexis Blake. Neither of them deny their male biology. Great respect for all three of them. And yes...adult human female...by birth.
@@jenniferplatts174Still going into women's spaces with a full functioning p*nis and lying to society by getting facial surgery and taking estrogen to appear female.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Already I feel like I need to say how important this interview is. You really were able to dig deep here and pick Helen's brain, and I appreciate that so much. I'm barely halfway through and I've already had a lot to think about and reconsider. This is such a good interview, Jack. I appreciate your perspectives as well, so much. Brilliant job.
Thank you! So kind 💜
You're so welcome! 💗
Helen Joyce is just amazing so cogent ,articulate and sincere
This was great! I have seen a lot of Helen Joyce interviews and this one felt really fresh thanks to your approach Jack. Well done!
I really enjoyed the set up of responding to statements made by TRAs. They won’t debate, so it’s an excellent way of answering all their points
Helen is always a level-headed, clear, brilliant speaker and intellectual. ❤
45:21 For those men, I think it’s a ‘power’ thing rather than a purely sexual attraction thing.
oh, you know that is a large part of the equation, especially for AGP's---
I think our (western) society is very mentally unwell at the moment. And I’m not saying cause there are trans people or gay people or more acceptance for them. I’m saying cause a lot of people have adopted an ideology that doesn’t help anyone but makes them feel good in the moment. The gender ideology movement is the ultimate I’m a good person movement cause I care more about this person’s mental state than what actually is. And I think on both sides the topic of transition and gender dysphoria isn’t being talked about honestly and instead purely on the social level. And this trend towards affirming people’s feelings constantly isn’t just with the trans stuff, but also mental health in general and political biases. And I wonder if the reason part of our society has turned this way has anything to do with the prevalence of being online and interacting with strangers constantly as well as absorbing so much information constantly. And I think the idea of treating everything in a subjective way is also a product of it. Cause if there are no objective truths and morality is relative, why not then? Is the logical conclusion for someone who has adopted such a subjective ideology. People think they are freeing themselves on “man-made oppression” when really they’ve just completely have become untethered to reality’s objective constructs. In a way, it’s a very narcissistic and nihilistic approach to life. And is most clearly a crisis of purpose.
I have a real struggle with non binary and pronouns. Because my native language is gender bound. There is six forms of one pronoun. All nouns have gender and their gender dictate the rest of the grammar.
Now imagine when theres more people using different pronouns, do you know how mentally exhausting it is? And when you make mistake because language is already reflexive, they break down because of it and make a drama? And this is what fills the life and work-life instead of living and working. Even calling them just name wont sort it for me. Their neo pronouns Stardust still has a gender in my language. Talking to someone in plural way with plural verbs is a mindf*ck literally (forgive me the curse word).
NB isn't even trans!
@@RKingisit’s complete nonsense. Totally illogical.
@@slacktoryrecords4193 Especially since most are dyadic!
I don’t even think about it totally ignore that. Will NEVER ask someone their pronouns. That box is totally ignored.
I thought listening to this would help me drift off to sleep; one o’clock in the morning and I was riveted. When Helen Joyce is involved, I should know better .
Enabling people in delusion is not empathy.
Spare me your diagnosis 🙄
And it's not safe either. Women have the right to recognise men for their own safety and dignity
@@dshe8637 what? Please explain that word salad
@surlypiratewench1969 colluding in the delusion that trans-identifying men are actually women, is a risk to women's safety.
Women need to be allowed to call out men in dresses, because they may not be safe.
@surlypiratewench1969 unfortunately UA-cam isn't letting me use simple terms
“You can't really argue with people whose whole position is a denial of reality” - that was precisely what I was thinking when I was listening to Abigail Thorn.
55:03 David Bowie was a creative artist who experimented with sexuality, culture, and dress. He never tried to be a woman. He had gay experiences and claimed to be gay at one point but almost all of his partners were women. He accepted transsexuals but was never one himself. He was for experimentation and freedom, and would be disgusted with the stifling trans ideology of today.
I am for normalising affeminate men whether gay, straight or bi. Let a man wear whatever he wants regardless of his orientation.
Yes! I truly thought we were almost there by the mid 2000s…
It is not about passability or wearing what they want. Its about insisting that the rest of us, women in particular, have to accommodate them to the point of allowing them into womens spaces ; lockerrooms, women’s shelters, women prisons ,sports etc.
So , - women who are victims of grape and assault by men have to accept men, who say they are woman, in those spaces.
- 12 year old girls have to undress and change in the presence of fully intact males because they claim to be women.
- In sports, look at the olympics, women have to compete against men who claim to be women.
- Lesbian women have to allow men in their dating apps, and getting harassed if they don’t want sex with a transwoman.
You can even loose your job if you fail to use the desired pronouns Etc etc.
In short , they infringe on other peoples rights .Thats why there is less and less acceptance for these people.
It goes far beyond “ wearing what a man wants “ and pretending that it is , doesn’t help acceptance , on the contrary.Did you even listen to the podcast?
@@w.sommen5209 do you understand what you are trying to say yourself?
I dont think anyone is saying NOT to allow men to be affeminate, this is NOT that. Expecting everyone to take part or accept another person's fantasy is a step too far.
I love this woman! She's a champion for women's rights
Bullshit
The fact that people lose their jobs, get abused, and cencored tells you everything It's not normal We have accepted trans ppl for years, this is a whole idiology with intentions on affecting little kids That's when your intuition kicks in and you know it's wrong, but youre unable to feel that when you are out of balance Blairs not affecting anyone else
Your ignorance is absolutely gobsmacking. Please stay away from children
The pronoun fad is in fact imposed speech to be complied with in the absence of the trans activist, who demands other people refer to the transsexual/transvestite in the absence of that transitioner. How manipulative.
Please leave us transexual out of this. We are completely different group of people altogether
@@staceypark7408 I am happy to be enlightened. How is transsexual different from transgender?
17:30 this is crazy that someone is happy to be catcalled 😭 i experienced immense syress when i came to US for three months to NYC and started experiencing catcalls daily multiple times, even wearing baggy shorts, loose tshirt and cap...i surely got some back in my country but i can count them like under 20, and there i once got catcalled three time walking one block.
This is smth very sick that has been normalized
Anyone who WANTS to be catcalled is unwell. Their pleasure is just duper's delight at having successfully tricked the catcaller.
I honestly like Blair, I think he's overall a good person (despite obviously not agreeing with him on ALL topics). But I mostly see him as a kind of "cautionary tale"- Blair admirably doesn't have a "victim mentality", but I do still see him as a victim (though not without a share of responsibility) of the harms of trans ideology, EVEN IN the "transexual", as opposed to "transgender", variant of the ideology.
Blair admits he grew up in a very homophobic family, in a homophobic rural area. And basically admits this was the main reason for his "transition"; That he'd internalized all this negative stuff about gayness. But saw """being a woman""" as a pathway to still being able to be with men.
He also admits that, as an adult, he's wanted to have biological kids, to the extent that he stopped HRT for, I think it was over a year. But the damage was already done; He couldn't produce viable sperm.
I just see him as a likeable, funny, charming but also kinda tragic gay man, who has done incredible, totally needless harm to his own body, because of the homophobia that I suspect drives a HUGE percentage of "transitions".
I just can't believe that rejecting something as basic as your own biology, can EVER be good for your mental health.
Of course, the person themself will SAY it totally helps their mental health. The same way that anorexic wll SAY that allowing them to not eat, is "helping" them. Or that a heroin addict will swear you saved their life, by giving them their fix...
... but ultimately,. these are just ALL variants of self-harm...
Absolutely. I have a lot of respect for Blaire - an intelligent and empathetic person who has long taken flak from his "community" for standing up against the mutilation of children etc. But a non-manly or not-good-enough man is not a woman, nor vice versa. Ultimately how much can we trust the narrative of anyone who is living with what is at heart a severe mental illness (I think Blaire has described it as such too but apologies if he hasn't, I mean no offence or judgment on anyone who has any mental instability). Seemingly none of the trans commentators can truly separate their own personal delusions/experiences from any discussion on these issues. It is, understandably, just a huge blind spot for them no matter how rational they may seem otherwise.
@@RuthIreland-qk4cp Blair seems to speak the truth and is on the side of reality. I personally consider this to be an important and positive feature.
@@RuthIreland-qk4cp Blaire has indeed described it as a mental illness or "condition" for which the treatment was transitioning. I would also recommend another trans UA-camr, Alexis Blake. She's a very down-to-earth trans woman who has been very open about her condition from a medical and mental health perspective and what a serious deal it is to transition. She's called out Dylan Mulvaney for being offensive to women and not realizing that she too is a guest in the space of womanhood.
@@Avarcirith thanks, interesting I will check Alexis out. As a middle-aged woman of the boring original flavour, I rarely have points of agreement with transwomen - who I just consider men whatever their reasons for "transitioning". However, I like to try to understand their points of view as human beings with a very unusual life experience. Getting to a place where we can all have an honest conversation (and disagree sometimes without it causing the end of civilization!) is so important.
@@rvastrik Oh definitely. And I also think Blaire has been extremely brave talking about some very personal stuff, with humour and discretion.
Helen Joyce is a most frank, intelligent and engaging guest on this topic. Very much enjoyed your exchanges.
@Helen Joyce, please file a criminal complaint against India for cyber bullying, hate crimes etc for takking about your looks and saying you look like a man. Give India a taste of their own medicine. Use the law against them.
Whilst I like Blaire White, Blaire does not fully pass, I used to think so myself but then saw a non-filtered video of Blaire outside somewhere talking to people and saw Blaire in a different light so to speak, better than most but I would suspect 90% of woman would clock Blaire immediately.
I saw an interesting interview of a CIA person who specialised in covert make up, masks etc, where the operatives life depended on this persons work, who said woman can pass as men fairly easily but men can rarely pass as a woman, most woman know this already.
it seems an obvious point when Helen says it, but it is absolutely true--that this repeated 'affirmation' is driving the bus. It's cruel and the agenda behind it is anything BUT kind and inclusive.
I do really appreciate how she acknowledged the broad range of reasons men & women tend to transition & that this frequently differs, as well. That’s a good insight that doesn’t seem to be talked about much.
Im a trans woman who learned that i had to use the ladies room very early on. Being nearly passable i noticed how out of place I was in the men's room and got comments that i was in the wrong place. I now socialize, interact and behave entirely as a woman with close female friends. Mentally, i was saved from depression, sadness and no hope for the future the moment i transitioned. I am happy, go lucky, emotional, i cry, i laugh, i feel free, im feminine, i care for my friends, im optimistic and finally enjoying life for the first time, ever.
Did you coming out destroy your family? Did you care? Is your happiness more important than anyone's else's? Are you arrogant about your pronouns and scream at anyone who makes mistakes? Do you know that you will always be biologically male no matter how much you change?
I find Blaire White to be a serious breath of fresh air bc of the honesty and humor in every post, but sometimes I can so clearly see the gay guy shining through in spite of all the artifice. These are the strangest of times.
Totally agree. He reads as a gay guy to me, which is what he is. And it’s totally fine. But he doesn’t read as any type of woman.
trans men and trans women are always going to have their female and male brains, way of thinking, and mannerisms regardless of what they do to change themselves. thats just an inherit characteristic thats ingrained in them. doesnt make them any less of what they are trying to be perceived as on the outside. i feel people care too much about "what is a woman", "what is a man". just let people be people and do what they want if it doesnt affect you or anyone else.
Irish woman here and was absolutely appalled by the government trying to take away the word woman. Not on my watch.
What a great interview!
Blaire may be in the public eye, but she's very proactive in protecting children.
To me her voice and contribution are incredibly important amongst today's folly.
Agreed. Until I found out he supports Trump. Which means voting for a wannabe dictator and someone who won't stop any laws from taking women's reproductive rights.
Blaire is a hypocrite if he says he cares about women's rights but votes for Trump...
Frankly, Blair is a hypocrite. He claims he’s gender critical but still violates women’s boundaries by using our spaces. I don’t believe a word that comes out of his mouth. He thinks that men shouldn’t be allowed to use female only spaces as long as they still look like men. Once they “do the work” (ie, transition by going on estrogen, getting fake boobs and plastic surgery) then they should be given the exact same sex based rights as women. The only reason Blair believes that is because he’s just another misogynistic male and no amount estrogen or “HRT will change that.
Agree. I don't like everything she believe in or fight for, but i can respect her and love her fight against abusers.
@@Jezzebel1313 I don't really agree when they state that because she looks the way she looks, she's necessarily selling a lifestyle, especially to young, pliable minds.
Yes, we do want what we see sometimes, but her content does stand for something too and disabuses people who might feel that way of the notion.
Same with Buck Angel. NOthing but respect in that regard.
HE. HIM. He may be a good person, but language is important.
Stupendous insights from Helen Joyce. This quote HAS to be the basis for another Joyce book, on the human condition: “I see a lot of it as railing against the human condition. It’s very sad. And I think every parent knows this, and probably you remember it from your own childhood as well. You know that bit where you realize you ‘re going to die.you know that first day, it’s usually that you realize your parents are going to die first, and it’s an awful thought that they are going to die, and then you think that one day I am going to die, and you can see that a lot of human activity is trying to distract yourself from that fact.”
Shame on you for subjecting this poor woman to watching PhilosophyTube
Helen is drop dead gorgeous
Takes all sorts
Marcus Dibs needs to feature in so many more compilations, podcasts and interviews like this. I'd love to have seen Helen's take on Marcus. This is my first time seeing your channel and I really enjoyed this format, hearing from a new (to me) thinker writer and speaker. And then there's Helen of course, whom I always want to hear from. She's fierce, truly.
I thought this was a really compelling discussion, and I really enjoyed it. The bottom line is no man can feel like a woman because no man knows what a woman feels like. And when they say they’re living as a woman, what they mean is their dressing as a woman and invading women spaces but they’re not living as a woman because no man could ever live as a woman it’s not possible. I think that society has gone so far in the wrong direction that bringing it back is going to be nearly impossible. The sad fact is that this movement is targeting children. 90% of the children who are identifying as trans right now or actually going to change their minds when they’re grown because it’s a social contagion. I am a woman, a real woman, a biological woman, and I couldn’t tell you what it feels like to be a woman because there is no universal feeling that is womanhood. Every woman feels different. We all feel differently about different things and have different emotions. There is no universal feeling where we can pinpoint it and say this is a woman. So for a man to say he can feel like a woman is not only presumptuous and arrogant but it’s bull. The only critique I have about this discussion as I wish that she had let him talk more because I found his point of view really interesting. And she did 80% of the talking which is pretty typical of women. The other reality that needs to be acknowledged as that women at this point are just dried out of sympathy and compassion for men trying to cosplay as women. It’s become such an invasion, and so invasive of women’s privacy, women’s rights, women’s feelings, and it’s just gotten to the point where women just don’t care anymore how people feel they’re like you’re a man get out of my bathroom. That should be Understandable to most people. At this point women have been so put down and so insulted by this whole movement not to mention, ignored that we just don’t care about feelings anymore. We just want our spaces in our rights back. And anyone who says that women’s rights have not been taken away by this movement is delusional or stupid.
Thank you - haha I'm sure some feminists would argue men usually do all the talking 😂. Appreciate you were interested in my POV. Usually with interviewing my guests, people like to hear them speak more. I'm a bit talker too so have to keep that in mind.
@@JackxJewell I thought your points were valuable and very interesting, I wish you had gotten to finish a few of those thoughts and elaborate a bit more!
I clocked abigail thorne in game of thrones as a man immediately. I didn't even know who they were, but I could tell they were a man as soon as the character appeared as a female character.
Yes! I did the same and then thought to myself "Could they really not find a female actor to play this role?" Apparently not, apparently a man plays being a woman better than all the talented female actors out there. Sexism in the 21st century. 🤷♀️
Me too. A man playing a strong powerful woman. How Ironic 🙄
Blaire freely admits all of that, doesn't have any problems with it. Blaire went to counselling and concluded that, had they not been SA'd as a child, they would likely have grown up to simply be gay. Blaire also doesn't use the women's bathroom.
Blaire does use the women's bathroom. She once on air tried to use a men's room and was immediately thrown out. She says you should do whatever causes the least disturbance.
@@lmp23612 That’s the whole point of these extreme surgeries, isn’t it? To lie to the world and force others to go along with your fiction. Kicking a man out of a female-only bathroom or changing room is immoral if he’s cosmetically altered his body to look like a woman.
Never mind how the women in there might feel if they knew a man were disguised amongst them. Never mind religious women who can’t expose their hair in front of men and how their beliefs are being violated without their knowledge. The women and their consent don’t matter. Only the men’s feelings.
Yes Blaire does. And encourages other men like himself to do the same.
Blair says that only extremists would want women's spaces to be for real women only.
@@tinahochstetler2189Blair is a grifter, he has no integrity
I've heard him say that he gets a kick out of using women's bathrooms.
I am a fan of individuals like Blaire White and Buck Angel but imo transitioning is the ultimate form of self hatred...
So how can you be afan? What’s so great about them?
Blaire White uses women's bathrooms. He hates women just as much as the rest of them.
@@noodleperson17 Buck Angel doesn't demand to be called a man yet passes as a man and is not predatory. He also really cares about kids and speaks the truth to protect kids against the Trans Cult.
The degree of how ‘passing’ you are in the trans world is like height snobbery at a dwarf convention.
Hahaha loving this visual
I admire Helen but I don't agree with her about sexual orientation being something that leads you to a relationship. Many heterosexual or homosexual people have zero interest in a relationship they just want to have sex. And this kind of sex is not much different than masturbation too, because their partner is an object to them during that action. So the only difference is they're using a person instead of porn to get aroused and satisfied.
But that doesnt change they still have a sexual orientation.
Sexual... get this, relationship....
@@KatMoore-ih6mw In this specific context Helen was talking about something more than sex, of course I know sexual relationship is a kind of relationship.
Great conversation! Thank you for being logical, truthful and reasonable in your criticisms without stooping to being mean and hateful towards the people you criticize.
1:05:10 It doesn’t matter if someone passes, they still can be really neurotic about it. One of the most “passable” trans identified males I know is also one of the absolutely most neurotic about their looks and super upset all the time about “not passing” etc … always looking for the next procedure
When a transperson passes away, forensic science can easily determine their sexfr their bones, genes and chemistry of all sorts.
The way I see it looking like something on the outside doesn't make it true. Someone might look like a woman, but what makes them a woman is their biology, chromosomes etc which can't be changed. Its the same as age. People can have plastic surgery and wear makeup to make themselves appear younger, but on the inside they're still aging. If you're 70 but have had surgery to make yourself look 30 - you're still 70! There's currently no technology that can actually reverse your aging and make your body young again. Plastic surgery might make you look younger and feel better but it wont change your age. Same for sex/gender. You can have all the hormones and plastic surgery you want to create an illusion on the outside, it doesnt actually change your biological sex. There needs to be some sort of law that says people can't change their biological sex and whatever you self identify as is not legally recognised. This would help stop men from being allowed in womens prisons, sport etc. What someone does to their own body or how they dress is their business and they can identify as whatever gender they want - but there is still their legal sex that they're born as which cannot change.
What a great video. So thoughtful and insightful. Two articulate people putting forward common sense opinions about a difficult subject. I learnt a lot and I feel somewhat vindicated for many of my own beliefs.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Helen is wonderful
She’s the ultimate woman. Classy, clever, and FOR WOMEN.
Man, I'm a straight man from Poland, but I've graduated with honors in cultural studies, so I'm spiritually gay, and I have to say, your channel is stellar. You're so articulate and entertaining (sometimes even informative!) that I'm just shocked that you have "only" 7k subscribers. At least "only" in relation to the quality. Wish you all the best and I hope to see Helen on here again soon. One of my favorite interviews with her for sure.
To all PC men who think transwomen are women enough for interviews and panels, stop and ask yourself a simple question. Do I even need to spell it out?
Helen is a totally wonderful brave human being.
As a lesbian, I was not suffering from body dysphoria (thankfully) however like any teenage girl, I didn't like the changes occurring in puberty and the only time I thought about being a guy had to do with being accepted by my gf's parents. It always had to do with making my life easier for being in a couple that is females only.
Regarding paraphilia and orientation, paraphilia comes with obsession, compulsion and often exhibition. So consider your orientation, you do not feel you MUST get a job which gives you access to who you want to sleep with, you don't consider attacking the object on your orientation because you can't have it and you don't consider breaking laws.
I don't think so - just think of how some men attack women and do all sort of things to get what they want.
Also if you saw what many gay men get up to in pursuit of their sexuality... I think the obsessive nature of the paraphilia may be to do with them not being able to act on it morally.
Orientation is based on the sexes and the very reason it exists in the first place is because of sexual reproduction, therefore the attraction to a sex comes in naturally without influences from the outside. Paraphilias/Fetishes/Kinks on the other hand have no such deep root in evolutionary biology and are heavily influenced by the outside, they can be gained and even unlearned and often times did not exist in the past, other cultures or in the animal kingdom at all.
They're also objectifying and people with paraphilia never act on honest interest in a person but regard them rather as a tool for gratification.
I am a passing trans woman and use the women’s restroom if I have to. I prefer the privacy and safety of neutral restrooms myself. I don’t use the men’s restroom because it defeats the purpose of transitioning in the first place which is to be treated and seen as a woman. For me if I were to ever be confronted in a woman’s restroom and accused of being trans I would politely leave and cause as little of a scene as possible. I would be embarrassed enough to just be found out, because I kinda also think being trans is not really a good thing. It’s something I am cursed with tbh. I just try to get through my difficult life with as little friction as possible tbh.
Sounds tough, thanks for sharing
@@JackxJewellyeah is not been easy. I transitioned in my teens over 15 years ago and before that I was antisocial and kept to myself for years. Gender identity issues were absolutely the cause of my behaviors. Transition was absolutely the correct choice for me. My parents were very anti-trans and they asked why I couldn’t just be gay. And this was back in 2006-2007, so no one really knew what being trans was. I had to explain that I’m not interested in sex at all so I’m not gay or straight or auto. But after about 8 years being authentic to myself and changing from a depressed antisocial boy to a bubbly, happy, outgoing, and incredibly social “woman”, they changed their opinions on transition. They think, “yes it’s extreme and not right for everyone, but it was absolutely the correct choice for their child.” If people don’t consider me a woman after knowing that’s fine, I can’t argue that based on how they wanna define it. But I’m happier and just a better human this way. Idk how to explain it to people who see it black and white. I wish i wasn’t like this and don’t have to take tons of medication and undergo surgery to have my body feel comfortable. If I coulda been happy as I man I woulda stayed that way, I tried my whole life… i really did. I looked at men and couldn’t find a single one who I wanted to be, there wasn’t one example of a blueprint I could follow. But I looked at women and I saw examples of who I wanted to be everywhere. I worked extremely hard and have for the most part achieved those goals of being who I wanted to be. The only things missing are the essential functions of being a woman that I can never achieve. And that’s ok because that’s just the hand I was dealt. I feel similarly to how I would imagine a woman who can’t have her own kids feels. It sucks but I can’t let that define me and I have other valuable things I can contribute to the world. Regardless I know exactly what I am people can define it how they like and call me a man but I have never really lived as a man and when I was a little boy I never talked to people so my only social experiences have been under the illusion I was born a woman. I only know how to be a woman socially because those are the only experiences I have ever had socially. My entire adult life of over 15 years has been under the illusion I was born female to everyone around me. I have an entire life, an image, friends, a career. I don’t understand why people feel they have a right to destroy my happiness. Sure my happiness is based on essentially fooling everyone around me. But it’s no different than hiding the worst and most embarrassing things in your life. I understand that I’m probably stronger than most women but I’m no threat. I’m just a castrated male bodied person who wants to live life under the illusion I was born female. I’m not competing in sports, if someone ever felt uncomfortable by my presence in a women’s space I would leave without conflict. I’m not hurting anyone if I can help it.
@@residentdoom1This is exactly how I feel being born the wrong race. Intense distress at my skin color are my earliest memories of myself, always desired to change race, and only identified with people of my desired race.
@@raina4732 Those are not comparable because be a race has a genetic heritage, sex and gender don’t. For example being black in the US has history and regional culture attached to it and that lineage is important. And being a particular gender/sex is completely social outside reproduction. The two are hardly comparable. Our culture is clearly gendered and our brains are hardwired to tell the difference between sexes. Our brains are hardwired to tell genetic differences apart only enough to make sure you are not related. Try again.
Helen should be made a Dame.
Love her explanations. So clear.