6v6 allows for tanks to SPECIALIZE in their specific task. Roadhog is supposed to be annoying to go up against, he's a bruiser. The problem is the 5v5 format demands he be a front liner, something he was NEVER supposed to be good at, and the only way to achieve that is to make him nearly unkillable.
Completely agree. Doesn't even just hurt tank design and gameplay either, characters like ana and zen had to get unfun changes to force this dog shit format. Every hanzo and junkrat main crying in a corner. 5v5 is just so bad its slowly ruining every role
Not to mention the sheer toxicity bred by the pressure on that one guy playing tank. Lose a couple of team fights in a row? "tank diff gg". Cocky tank not getting hard focused by supports? "supp diff gg". With 2 tanks the roles were more even, and a good off-tank (anyone remember when that was what Zarya and Hog were?) could do a lot to keep a frontline tank alive. 2-2-2 was peak Overwatch. I just miss Rein/Zar on kings row. And Kings Row night mode.
If 6v6 came back I'd actually play the game again. As an off-tank it felt great to work together with my main tank to deal with threats, knowing that I didn't have to deal with them alone. If queue times are really the issue then they should make the tank role more attractive to play.
Ikr maybe if there was a wider selection of fun tanks then the queue times wouldn’t be so long. Damage has a wide selection, give tank the same treatment. Genuinely don’t get how they couldn’t realise this smh
Queue times are a problem for non-tank players because now there's twice as much demand for tank players but not twice as many players queued for tank... The issue is that TANK role is unrewarding to play without the offtank synergy - If they did bring 6v6 back with a dedicated "offtank" role separate from the "Tank" role, I think it would open the opportunity for DPS-Doomfist and Mei to shift into that dedicated category to bring defensive utility which differentiates them from the "get kills" DPS category. It'd be almost a *third* DPS slot, but with less offensive burst damage and more cc/disruption capability... Mei has been straddling the DPS/Tank line for a while and Doomfist/Ball have been in a weird balance spot for Blizzard anyways...
When will you people realize that you are an extreme minority. Most people did not queue tank and most of the ones that did selfishly played Hog or Ball and didnt work with their other tank.
@@ChristopherSmith-Art Because that's copium. Tank is the least popular role by far in EVERY single game that exists with the trinty role system. They could have 100 tanks and itll still be the least popular role.
6v6 is the only way to balance the game for tanks. I strongly believe as long as there is only one tank it's a near impossible job for the dev team to balance it.
@@Greaseman762 6v6 was great, my only problem with it was double shield meta (or triple shield if you had brig too) the only solution to this was to have tanks and offtanks categories separated and in offtanks having tanks without shield and only allowing 1 main and 1 off tank per team otherwise we're back at it shooting shields but that creates problems of its own...
@garryarganis5801 to fix that shield problem, why don't they just nerf the shields like they do with tanks hp in game modes that have multiple tanks like open queue. Then it less and not as annoying as it was in OW 1
Lets see,if they add 6v6 there going to have to rework every single hero yet again,so yeah im pretty surr they did yhink about it yet they chose not to.
ive said it many times and ill keep saying it. you need two people to take hits. 1 that can be the main focus and a second one that be flexible. like the old rein, zarya combo rein as the main focus and the main damage sponge and zarya as somebody that be flexible and if rein takes to much damage zarya can take over also i used to only flex que cause every role felt like you don't have to be at 100% performance so you I would definitely play more
@@bellingtonedi agree. We are the only game that has 1 tank lol look at games like league and smite they have a tank who peels and a semi tank in the solo lane who can take hits and sustain while doing a decent amount of damage themselves like hog
I hope they will try it and actually balance it, 6v6 is genuienly so much better than 5v5 but in OW1s last years it just got neglected to hard, which caused 2x Shield and CC to get out of hand. But with the new Balance team, who lowered CC with the Hero reworks for Sombra, Mei, Brig and Doom and with Orisa reworked 2x Shield isnt a problem. 6v6 also lowers Counterswaps, removes the Solo Tank pressure and you have more freedom to pick Heroes + there is no 800HP Raid Boss Roadhog running around tanking the impact of a NUKE I genuienly want to play and enjoy OW again which i havent been able to do since OW2, if they bring back 6v6 i can finally love this game again and play 6-Stacks and Tank Duos with my friends. Man i really hope they will try it.
Looking forward to two beefy tanks that do more consistent and less risky damage than DPS, and no cc to slow them down. Supports will get annoyed being flattened again, tank will eventually get boring because that's inherent to the role across games, and they'll still be unhappy, and DPS will get mad because they aren't as effective and have long queue times.
Apart from double shield and the overabundance of cc, I think the last patch of overwatch 1 was generally one of the better patches. Yea there was still bullshit, but a lot of heros felt viable and mostly fair.
@@yukioacumora4430 might feel that way, but it was a stale meta. You either get a stale meta which people will call boring, or you keep changing. But, that's good for balance, you just can't add new heroes. And there was also garbage, people just prefer old garbage from when they were happy. Like Zarya, Winston, Doomfist combo was super unfun with no real counter play. But some version of double shield will always exist tbf. But as a Sombra and support player, not looking forward to being ineffective in most situations. But I'm more worried that if 6v6 is a better direction for the game, how bad of a precedent it will set in respect to "listening to fans"
@@MasterMemo you clearly did not play ow1. tanks did barely any dmg at all *exception roadhog*. these days i see nearly every single tank in this game out dpsing the dps. like these days dps players may aswell be doing nothing cause goddamn theyre getting out damaged by the tanks. also what do you mean no cc to slow them down? cassidy's grenade literally is a slow stops them from crouching aswell. supports are already getting flattened as it is now because a single tank cant be in the front line and back line at the same time. unlike back in the old day where you could have 1 tank in the front and 1 in the back. im sorry but i think youre just talking out of your ass at this rate.
One of the biggest differences about ow2 and ow1 was that ow1 felt that your strategy and decision making mattered. ow2 feels like a random mess where people go on separate directions, reading the game is difficult and every match just feels the same no matter which hero I pick.
@@psxhumwow if only they removed pretty much all cc, actually balanced the game more than once every few years to not have double shield dominate for over a year, and we got updates every month to not let power creep like brig dictate the game just as they did with mauga, crazy ik is almost as if ow1 was even cared fored and not forgotten for months at the time, even mauga back in December was solved so much quicker than brig back in ow1
@@danielalvarez1230 "they removed all cc" ? and they just added flash bang back, give Orisa a javelin stun, give back Brig Ult stun, give Sambra skillset to strip tanks to useless, make Rein Ult stun harder and wider, making mauga the best tank in one season, the worst tank in next season, then the 2nd best tank in next season. If you like to waste money to a game to treat players like this, then go for it. Any those monthly updates are joked re-colored skins. while the match making is awful.
@psxhum what they were saying is they should remove all cc not they did. Their entire post was basically saying the team should have actually balanced the game instead of taking the easy way out by changing the format and then saying "we will fix the problems" before promptly not doing any real fixing and letting the game get worse. Double shield was Overwatch's purgatory, and 5v5 is it's hell.
@@Omegasutoraiki As the video creator already said, no one can balance a casual game, this will result in ruin the fun part of the game. OW1 trying to be an e-sport top-down balanced game and it failed hard. We are sitting in 11th Season in OW2, and it is quite clear to me the develop team has neither skill nor budget to balance it. All they put in the post was "We saw the data shows...", Laughable, do they ever play their own game? They should really stop putting hands on "balance XYZ", fix the core, fix the match making, stop re-introduce 6v6, leave it there.
@@psxhumilliterate mf where did I say ALL CC I said most of the cc learn to read plus flash bang is not hard cc anymore you can still use abilities it doesn’t lock you out from using cds
6v6 would not make me play more ow, it would make me play more tank. its funny cuz I used to be a rein main with 400hrs in ow1 now I don't even touch tank at all, just play dps and supp
Flats got me to main rein in the good ol days but i've put the tank role down and watching flats do the same just makes me sure that tank is worse in 5v5
OW2 was obviously only implemented to add monetization into the game. If they make the BP's good (they are AWFUL imo) and drop the prices of skins to 5$ regular, 7$ epic, 10$ legendary....I'd be game for that.
its insane that it took them from 2017 (initial start of ow2) to 2024 (nearly 2025) to realize that ow1 was a great game that was only lacking content. And their solution was to completely change the game and up the skins. LOL
and also meta goat was very is to banlance, but they chose to abandon the game for years to """"work"""" (big word since they removed more they've added content) on OW2....
@@zhongliimpact6220 I mean even then imo ow1 peaked in 2019. Obviously the launch and game of the year was huge early on but the game was kinda meh then.
actually if u think about it if they made ow free to play since 2016-2018 yea ow could've blew up again in 2019 and so on with 6v6, lootboxes, free skins, events, and even pve lore missions from archives if it were ftp back then yea many would play it and they would have more time to work on pve or whatever expansion or animated short they can ever make but what we got now yea its devastating coz it was lazy management but also actually a joke
As someone pointed out: Que times are also down because there is no reward for playing the game anymore. For a minimum stuff you have to pay 10 dollar every 9 week and even those rewards dry up by week 4 or 5. Way more people would play if there would be a reason to with EARNABLE rewards, not just BUYABLE skins.
Begging and praying it’s not them basically saying “yeah we hear you but we don’t wanna do it”. I’d rather them at least experiment with a 6v6 QP hacked mode like they’ve done before. Glad they’re finally addressing it after 2 years
At the very least if they say they are sticking to 5v5. I know the direction of the game isn’t for me and I can let it go. I’ll at least have closure to OW.
Is there any other game where we are more than 10 seasons into its content, and there is still a fundamental flaw in how a core role is designed? 11 Seasons, and the Tank role is still a mystery to the devs.
The fundamental flaw was reducing team comp to 5v5 in a game that was built from the ground up to work with 6v6. If they designed Overwatch 2 as a true sequel, starting from scratch, it could have potentially worked but they basically tried to shove a battery engine into a 1970's muscle car.
Those are basically a dead industry practice, they won't go back to that because bp's are simply more biased in blizzards favor monetarily...and they do like money!
@@robikkupegasus7039 and also ow will get banned in some countries since lootboxes are believed to be EVIL and Gambling for children i aint against lootboxes but i can't whine about it coz it aint coming back but 6v6 yea keep on whining its coming back hopefully if not then fck it
Honestly they need to rebrand Overwatch. 2 is heavily tainted and doesn’t have a good look with the general gaming audience. Ppl outside the ow sphere clown this game
No matter what they do this decision is gonna piss a lot of ppl off. 6v6 needs to come back and if it doesn’t and they finally confirm it won’t we’re gonna lose a chunk of the playerbase.
I just don't see that happening and not completely breaking the game at this point with all the balance changes and reworks that Blizzard has been doing for the last 2+ years in an attempt to make 5v5 work. Blizzard shit the bed so hard they need a change out the mattress, not just the sheets.
@@charlestonjew75877HSKW is already showing us what it could be and it’s far from game breaking. It’s much better than the live game and I’m even starting to see more content creators hopping in those 6v6 pugs more frequently. Harbleu looked like he was having a blast 1st time and I haven’t seen that in a while.
I still don't understand why they dont just make 6v6 an optional, not arcade beta, like the role pick at startup. You pick either 6v6 or 5v5 and they have an obvious answer to what's fun after a couple of months. Litterally a percentage preferential score. It would end the debate once and for all
because they'd need to have 2 very different balancing. Tanks are strong (but miserable at the same time) because it's just 1 tank versus the whole team focusing them. With 2 tanks they d need to balance not just tanks, but supports too, since with only 1 tank per team, supps have to be able to take care of themself without the help of the second tank
@@zhongliimpact6220 it's Activision Blizzard we're talking about. They have the resources. This isn't some indie company (although the balance team operates like one)
@@SimpCity2000 But they suck at using these ressources. They have abandonned OW1 for 4 years to make OW2 and looks how it looks. It's just the same game with even less content than before
People have to stop using tank queue times as an excuse. 1# No one wanted to play orisa/sigma/symmetra double or triple shield meta. 2# No ban list. (like we asked but Jeff said no) 3# Balance team was horrible because they swore to make changes every month (even today). 4# The game wasn't free to play. 5# They left a skeleton team behind while they were working on a sequel that is worse than the original.
The reason why double shield was a problem, was because of the amount of sustain they had. Brig and Bap furthered this sustain and nothing died as a result of this.
Yes. Double Shield wasn't good because of the shield, it is because the characters with shields ALSO HAVE sustain abilities. Sigma Grasp, Orisa Fortify. And obviously the support AOE healing and broken abilites. Brig Ispire, Whipshot and Shield Bash + Bap shift and immortality. You didn't used Rein and Orisa double shield before Sigma release (minus Bastion bunker/pirate ship). And you never used Rein and Sigma because it isn't viable. Rein never had synergy with these annoying and boring characters. And with the current tank roster, Ram can not be used in double shield as we knew it, because he lacks the sustain (block leaves Ram vulnerable). If Sigma never got released so strong, we really wouldn't be in 5v5.
@@MRPOPMUSIC2014because you weren’t at high rank where people actually played the game correctly lmao. Whenever someone says this they out themselves to being in the metal ranks.
It was brig and bap. Try running double shield with Lucio and mercy and see how well it turned out. Orisa DOESN’T have a shield anymore and she is still problematic. So it wasn’t the shields. People just don’t get this.
- The problem wasn't queue times (that was the symptom), the problem was enjoyability of the tanks role. - Double shield made the games unfun. Make tanks fun by removing cheesy abilities (instead of avoiding balance for 3 years) and there is definitely a world where 2 tanks can exist.
They fixed double shield already. Why do people talk like Orisa can still drop a shield? Its like people hallucinate a world where the worst parts of OW1 were anywhere near as bad as OW2. I don't think many of these players crying double shield ever even experienced double shield, they are just crying, scared of change. We tried 5v5. Its terible.
@@SimpCity2000orisas sheild was never never the problem. It was fortify meaning she’s worse now. Now she has fortify, javalin spin that neutralizes all projectiles and the her ult has its own fortify.
Devs: 'I know we have been quiet for a while, but a priority for us going forward is to communicate more with the community more frequently... ' Community: 'cool, there gonna keep us in the loop now. That's all we've been asking for!...' Devs go silent for another 3 to 4 months... Wash, rinse, repeat....
If 6v6 were to come back, I'd feel a lot more comfortable playing tank again. Being a solo tank is way too much pressure for me personally and just ruins the fun.
Queue shouldn't be an issue anymore, they removed the barrier of entry and made ow f2p that in itself will boost the amount of tank players. They have to do something tho bc more and more ppl are quitting the role bc it's not fun being hard focused the whole match. If we keep losing tanks then queues are gonna be longer anyway.
@UncleJemima Not saying it was, just feels that the 5v5 stuff seems like it's been harder to balance around. Also, some of the ow1 characters just feel different in the ow2 climate
Being a Rien player is sad. You got the cool changes from the mirrorwatch and community crafted events that make the hero super fun to play and then when the time comes to actualy buff the hero all blizard can say is MORE SHIELD like what the actual fuck
I think the point on double shield cant stick when its only 1 shield taking the fire. The problem with double shield was the ability to cycle shields to stop damage forever. Having a shield with a lot of health but that needs a recharge is not the same.
6 v 6 now would be better than OW1 because counter picking made people learn all the tanks meaning tank combos and synergies will be easier to come by since everyone can swap around and match.
One of the main reasons I prefer 6v6 is because I'll have friends get on who wanna group up together, but there's always someone left out because of the 5v5 switch
Its a very straightforward fix really, will take some tuning work but tanks would essentially just need to be split in half, main and off tanks and one each can be selected per team. Thats all they would need to do to avoid double barrier. I'm not sure why this is so difficult for them to understand if they are giving in to 6v6
Tanks don't feel tanky because they're asked to do too many things. I played some Winston today on Esperanca, contesting high ground, peel for my support, contest cart and confirm elim on low HP target, go back to contest high ground, using my brain you know. Fast forward five minutes, my DPS is still 1-6. I can't do all of that plus be the only one preparing for D. Va bomb or death blossom. I refuse to carry players who don't even notice the Genji shooting them in the face, or if they do notice, they kill me with deflect. That's why they need to punish players for leaving quick play. In stead of match maker taking an extra thirty seconds to find a more fun balanced team. They've moved so far away from fundamentals, they reward four stacks who can't leave spawn flaming the random with the only elims. Mauga is prime example of how they want EVERYONE to play the game. Whereas before, in the game I bought, I could play who ever I want on my favorite map. Now I get the same trash map three consecutive matches and if I wanna play ball it doesn't matter because this is already a predetermined loss.
They've had 11 seasons an multiple interviews to "jump in" on the 6v6 debate, an what did they do? They've told people to not bring it up. His post is just another "break glass in case of financial emergency" moment. I don't, and will never again, trust Blizzard. Should have learned my lesson during wow.
tank is the least played bc they’re in such a bad spot. if there was an off tank then maybe more people would go back to playing tank bc it’s more enjoyable instead of instantly getting shredded
Either they try it, or I keep the game uninstalled. Their balancing seems very disappointing in the next patch. Support focused fire is the main tank problem.
Splitting up the role will just make the queue time issue worse which led to 5v5 to begin with. Double shield was a balance issue brought about because of too much sustain. Couldn't dive that because of bap/brig, mainly so you had to brute force it. Same reason Mauga/Orisa metas are lame. They have insane sustain abilities off cooldown and you just have to try and brute force it
Not the answer. The most iconic double shield comp was Orisa Sigma. Orisa was a main tank and sigma was an offtank; splitting the roles has no effect on this. I guess in OW2 they have just removed Orisa’s shield so this solution is outdated anyways. It was the high sustain AOE healing backlines and immortalities that made the Orisa + Sigma pair so powerful in the first place.
@@Decibel00288 dont think so. The reason they went 5v5 is that they had to have an excuse to "make" (rebrand) OW2 and their new monetary System. Its all about the money always has and always will be
Orisa doesnt have a Shield anymore and Ram/Sig dont have enough Shield uptime to be annoying with it And if 2x Shield somehow becomes a meta, they could add a passive (oh boy another one) that lowers your teams Shields when theres 2 Shield tanks in the team. Something like that, but theres lots of stuff that can be tried.
The difference between a great rein shield and double shield from OW1 is that Rein is an ethical pick (to use Flats’ term). Everyone loves rein, and everyone hated orisa/sigma. Just like everyone dislikes playing against hog when he’s good.
Supports and Tanks being tied to each other is something I agree with. However, that's not a new issue. With the way Healing/Sustain works in Overwatch, this was always the case. A Rein with a decent healer was always an absolute monster. A Rein left out to dry, on the other hand, could get chipped down to nothing fairly quickly. As I've said many times before, healing is the source of all the game's issues. Can't make Tanks too tanky because they become unkillable with healing. Can't make Tanks too fragile else they evaporate without healing.
So he's still telling they would still prefer to change everything in the game, even modify every hero's passives etc than admit they fucked the game up with 5v5? Nothing new, then.
I like your point at around 11:00 about readability. I think a good solution for widow would make her more readable It feels horrible to instantly die to a sneaky widow off way deep, but I feel like if you gave her perhaps a laser designator that not only shows who she's looking at, and potentially trying to take a pick on but also communicates perhaps charge (I.e: it flashes while she's charging her shot) But it also adds a fear factor that can be used to influence the enemy's positioning If you have a bright laser looking around for a clean shot it tells you find cover and stay out of the way if you can This can cause enemy positioning to react to her presence, which might be very fun and I think falls in line with the fantasy of widow, a deadly sniper who you need to watch out for It gives her a sense of presence on the battlefield, but also predictability that makes her feel more fair but that's my 2 cents let me know how you feel about the suggestion
Don't waste your time people, this is a massive clickbate. Aaron just said they will share their idea about 6v6 and we already know what it is (it's not coming back). Stylosa earned a unfollow becouse of this.
Why would queue times still be a problem? We even had long queue times in the 5v5 beta of the game, and they somehow fixed the matchmaking queue times.
i would definitely play a helluva lot more tank again, the reason queue times for tank are as low as they are now is because no one enjoys tank rn, that's the whole reason we want 6v6 back, we want tank to be fun again and not a charity role
It’s finally being discussed!!! If Aaron says the game will definitely NEVER return to 6v6, as in they won’t even entertain the idea of it in a Classic Mode or Quick Play Hacked mode, I will stay casual or, eventually, will move on. Tank synergy in OW1 felt amazing, I have missed it so much. I’ve missed streamers like Emongg and Flats playing together, too. 6v6 made Widow and Hog easier to deal with. I played a game the other day on Support where my tank repeatedly got pulled into the well on Ilios by the enemy Rein. I played Ana but no matter how many times I slept him or naded him my tank couldn’t deal with him. Hog would vape and hook my tank off the point. You know what would counter that? Two tanks. Hog never felt this bad to play against in OW1. I remember strategies we used in OW1 against oppressive Widow/Hanzo/Mercy trios and it involved two tanks. Dive feels so bad in OW2. I now only play OW2 when there is a new Battle Pass, and even then it’s like once a week, or less! I used to play OW1 almost every night! If there are more players now, and more heroes, I wonder if tank would be so hard to fill. It is a lot less pressure to not screw up when you have another tank with you. If they put premium currency in as an incentive (25 coins for queuing tank!) I would, no joke, grind the game on tank. There is no incentive to play now because if you sneeze you could get blamed for losing the match. The supports used to get blamed in OW1 but it’s definitely the tanks now. As a support, I hate babysitting our tank. As a tank, though, I hate when my support is dpsing when I’m gettig charged by a Mauga with a Mercy boost. Feels bad. My biggest complaint is how I wasn’t given an option to switch to 5v5. They took OW1 offline so I just had to adapt. I have hated 5v5 since Day 1 of OW2.
im ngl but i genuinely think that role lock queue is what was the start to the end of fun in the game like its no wonder why queue times got bad. back when there was no role queue searching for a game was so quick. as the other person in the reply here said i hope they implement that system that the creator arcade mode instead. would make queue times faster AND would make sure the games roles are balanced.
@@DarkKeybladeMaster23this right here, role lock made it so queue times would spike, we didn’t need role queue the sole reason it exist was due to the devs not wanting to nerf brig as much as they should’ve. Goats was actually fun to play it was something different from the 5/6dps and sometimes 1supp we saw a meta were tanks were important, the thing that made it awful was the lack of updates blizzard gave to the game rendering the gameplay repetitive and boring.
@DarkKeybladeMaster23 don't you remember open queue? Yeah, queues were short, but every single game was 5 dps inta locks that won't swap. tanks didn't exist, and the only time you saw a support was when you were forced to play support.
@@Mr-atom55 did you not see what I said? The creator mode makes it so there is no role queue but it greys out that role when the required number is there. But honestly I loved the chaos of og queueing. Was much more fun and I say that as an ow 1 tank main.
One thing about the tank player base, I played a lot of tank in OW1 it was my second most played role . In OW2 the role deals so fucking bad I would not touch that role with a ten foot pole. It’s just not fun currently. And yes my role of off tank was repeated but I also enjoyed main tank. I would play winton and rein and I would win but not any more.
I feel like if the 6v6 format returns, they should make a system where one player picks a shield tank which makes the other tank player automatically pick a non shield tank.
OR get rid of sig grasp, and nuke aoe healing and immortality abilities lmao. All the issues with 6 v 6 come from balance and design issues not the format, they could’ve balanced double shield out of the game in like 1 month lmao
@@IsThatKris comparing Dva to Sig is downright fucking retarded, and so is the idea of limiting comps to one shield when double shield wouldn’t even be viable for the reasons I mentioned. If you think sig should have a sustain ability on top of a shield and a brawl ability you don’t understand the game lmao.
Double Shield only worked with orisa Sig, Orisa doesn't have shield anymore. Ram's shield is temporary, stationary and occasional so that wouldn't be a problem. However, they would have to nerf AOE healing because that would be OP in 6v6. Aside from the fact that the AOE healing/sustain was insane in late OW1, the initial tank problem with double shield was that both Orisa and Sigma had a self-sustain ability, poke damage, a range CC ability...and a shield. My point is, creating a system to prevent from playing both of them in the same team would not have changed the fact that *both of these heroes were fundamentally flawed in the 6v6 environment* . At least one of them should have been reworked, multiple solutions were possible like focusing on the frontline aspect of Sigma to make him more like a main tank, or focusing on the Grasp mechanic to make him more like an off-tank. They did none of that and gaslit themselves into thinking that the problem was 6v6. It was not.
I really do hope they experiment with 6v6, many people seem to forget that 6v6 has plenty of its own issues. It is not the smoking gun solution some people advocating (not all but some) think it is. It will be fun to have tank synergy again, but im not looking forward to the inevitable double barrier. Then again barriers are paper thin, so maybe we need two for it to make a difference.
Would 6v6 make me play more ? No. Wanna know what would ? - Clan System - Map Editor - Pre-Game Lobby to view everyones rank and most played heroes etc - Map Voting - Better Ping/Communication system - Clan System - More Customization like an OG Cod Emblem Editor - Hero Ban/Protection Voting - Clan System - More PERMANENT Competetive modes like 3v3, 6v6, low gravity, prop hunt, no limits, mystery heroes ... basically an Arcade Competetive playlist - More better ingame Events that add more than 6 challenges and a new game mode - Clan System - Support a Creator - Better progression system that gives you more than a name card and a whacky title (like lvl 50 soldier for "vigilante" ?? wohooo yea cool) - better actual items in the battle pass instead of name cards, souveniers and all the other filler crap and of course a good old Clan System where I can work on my Clan rating/rank/level by playing with friends and invite other people into my clan that I think are cool where we all get a Clan Reward at the end of every season plus the top 10 clans get invited into some tournament or whatever
Wtf, of course 6v6 would make tank players play more. Just because that may not be the case for YOU doesn't mean it's universal. Your points are interesting and I'd like to see them in the game, but they don't invalidate the fact that 6v6 would undeniably make the tank role more appealing, more fair and more fun to play.
yeah. Doing a mistake as a dps / support is fine, because your buddy can replace/help you. Doing a mistake as a tank is just an instant loose... It's so damn stupid I can't believe they went with this idea of 5v5 and kept it until now....
I think SVB had a good idea of keeping the format 5v5 but moving back to open q and limiting it to no more than 2 in any given roll. I would love to try it in a qp hacked.
I believe Blizzard should introduce distinct roles for Main Tank and Off Tank, assigning specific tanks to each. For instance, place Junker Queen, Roadhog, Zarya, and Mauga in the Off Tank role, while Reinhardt, D.Va, and Sigma go into the Main Tank role, ensuring only one shield-bearing tank can be picked at a time. Even if Sigma is considered an Off Tank, just reduce his shield capabilities. It's not a complicated solution, Blizzard. The roles would then be Main Tank, Off Tank, DPS, and Support.
I get what you're going for, but tank players would lose the ability to choose whatever tank they want to play, resulting in heavily increased queue times
I think the worry about the off/main tank increasing queue times is a bit over blown. I wish I had the analytics but there is a big mix of ppl playing various tanks. If anything the double tank return will increase the queue time in general for everyone else, at first, as the pool of tanks will decrease. Which would settle down eventually as players move to playing tank so they can play more often increasing the tank pool. Happened in OW1 when no one was playing supports. Will they be bad tanks? Yes, until they play enough to get better.
OW went free to play and came to steam to boost player numbers to help with queue times, and despite all that we're already about as bad of a spot as we were during the end of OW1. If we were to increase the number of tanks needed in game, we would need to make the role fun to play. And splitting it in two definitely wouldn't help with that, nor would make queues shorter
Also Tanks was the least played because their were fewer heroes. Fewer heroes means less possibiliy for you to find a hero you like gameplay and design wise in that role versus a role with double the amount of heroes.
A 1-1-2-2 set up would solve every problem. Either 1 shield tank, 1 non-shield tank, 2 DPS, 2 support, or the same but instead, 1 anchor tank, and 1 flank/dive tank.
one interesting thing to note on the 6v6 tweet: he mentioned that they are considering actually making a dev video on the 6v6 topic. They are not gonna make a video to announce 6v6 is not comming. they usually make these videos if something interesting is getting announced. i hope they just gonna make a (for now) permanent arcade mode that gets improved over time and if community interest persists over a few months we may see them go further with that.
I think 6v6 at this point was so important to the gameplay that the queue times won’t matter as much because match quality will be so much higher. (Pretty sure queue times were the only reason not to)
I’ve been hearing people talk about splitting the tank role into two roles, main and off tank. And doing so will make the queue times even more horrible, what I think they can do is make it so the two tanks queue for the tank role like normal, get into a game to select their character, if one of them chooses a main tank, every other main tanks becomes unavailable for the other player, and they would have to pick an off tank, maybe that rule can be applied to competitive and not for quick play since you could have less restriction on what character you want to play. And team 4 can further balance the game like this. Not a perfect idea but yeah
I think the worry about the off/main tank increasing queue times is a bit over blown. I wish I had the analytics but there is a big mix of ppl playing various tanks. If anything the double tank return will increase the queue time in general for everyone else, at first, as the pool of tanks will decrease. Which would settle down eventually as players move to playing tank so they can play more often increasing the tank pool. Happened in OW1 when no one was playing supports. Will they be bad tanks? Yes, until they play enough to get better.
I've been a huge proponent of moving back to 6v6 and also putting doom back to dps, but the issue I have now is that I just simply don't trust them to do anything correctly. If they implement 6v6 as they stand as a studio right now it will fail. They have to adjust their culture in how they see heroes, what is actually fair in a game with 30+ heroes, and where the focus for balance sits amongst the population of the game. I don't have it in me to believe in them.
In regards to 6v6, I sure hope people don't think it simply means adding an extra tank. 5v5 heroes are not well-attuned for a 6v6 format. Some take it at face-value, and it isn't necessarily wrong for people to think that. 6v6 isn't an automatic fix, it's a call to change the format. So, I could care less if they remove or add a hero slot, I just want it to change. I want to have fun. Custom games can only entertain for so long.
I think the queue time gains from cutting a tank have been lost from the number of people that refuse to play tank now. In a F2P game, DPS queues are back up to 6 minutes for Silver-Bronze SR (haven't played enough after reset to climb). I tried flex queue, after not playing for a year, and got tank 100% of the time. I refused to go back to QP after that - only play the creator patch if I play at all.
I want 6 vs 6 and ever since I thought that 5 vs 5 would emphasize a huge impact on the tank role, eventually make a good tank vs tank a huge difference on matches, and make it easier to play tank boring and I wasn't wrong
The thing about "there's not enough tank players" is that it works like a Laffer curve (that curve that shows that there's a point where tax rates are so high that revenue falls because people start refusing to pay them). If you make tank more rewarding to play as, there will be more tank players.
100% sure the next dev blog is just gonna say "oh sorry we dont have the man power to explore alternative routes and cant explore 6v6" might be true as blizzard has down sized twice.
OW1: was created by genius people who made a masterpiece OW2: was reskinned OW1 by completely different people that thought they knew better than the original creators and they clearly didn't 0% humility 100% ego Admit your mistake, put 6v6 back and let's go back in the proper direction
6v6 allows for tanks to SPECIALIZE in their specific task. Roadhog is supposed to be annoying to go up against, he's a bruiser. The problem is the 5v5 format demands he be a front liner, something he was NEVER supposed to be good at, and the only way to achieve that is to make him nearly unkillable.
Completely agree. Doesn't even just hurt tank design and gameplay either, characters like ana and zen had to get unfun changes to force this dog shit format. Every hanzo and junkrat main crying in a corner. 5v5 is just so bad its slowly ruining every role
Not to mention the sheer toxicity bred by the pressure on that one guy playing tank. Lose a couple of team fights in a row? "tank diff gg". Cocky tank not getting hard focused by supports? "supp diff gg". With 2 tanks the roles were more even, and a good off-tank (anyone remember when that was what Zarya and Hog were?) could do a lot to keep a frontline tank alive.
2-2-2 was peak Overwatch.
I just miss Rein/Zar on kings row. And Kings Row night mode.
If 6v6 came back I'd actually play the game again. As an off-tank it felt great to work together with my main tank to deal with threats, knowing that I didn't have to deal with them alone. If queue times are really the issue then they should make the tank role more attractive to play.
Ikr maybe if there was a wider selection of fun tanks then the queue times wouldn’t be so long. Damage has a wide selection, give tank the same treatment. Genuinely don’t get how they couldn’t realise this smh
Queue times are a problem for non-tank players because now there's twice as much demand for tank players but not twice as many players queued for tank...
The issue is that TANK role is unrewarding to play without the offtank synergy - If they did bring 6v6 back with a dedicated "offtank" role separate from the "Tank" role, I think it would open the opportunity for DPS-Doomfist and Mei to shift into that dedicated category to bring defensive utility which differentiates them from the "get kills" DPS category. It'd be almost a *third* DPS slot, but with less offensive burst damage and more cc/disruption capability... Mei has been straddling the DPS/Tank line for a while and Doomfist/Ball have been in a weird balance spot for Blizzard anyways...
When will you people realize that you are an extreme minority. Most people did not queue tank and most of the ones that did selfishly played Hog or Ball and didnt work with their other tank.
@@ChristopherSmith-Art Because that's copium. Tank is the least popular role by far in EVERY single game that exists with the trinty role system. They could have 100 tanks and itll still be the least popular role.
@@SirenRyan wrong
ah the classic Sty clickbait
Yeah but don’t forget it’s immoral to take the bag
Earned my unsubscribe lol. 6v6 is the new Bloodborne remake. Steer clear of anyone baiting you with bullshit.
@@jonc3519 It's UA-cam, there's gonna be clickbait bro...
I sort of expect it with OverWatch but the helldivers too stuff is making me seriously consider unsubscribing
Absolute click bait!!!
Overwatch 3: Overwatch 1
Lol
The Blizzard way, it's their only way.
Overwatch: Classic
Add a few currencies to completely obfuscate what you can buy with what.
🤣
6v6 is the only way to balance the game for tanks. I strongly believe as long as there is only one tank it's a near impossible job for the dev team to balance it.
weird how no one has ever thought of that solution before, huh?
Almost like it never needed to be changed at all
@@Greaseman762 6v6 was great, my only problem with it was double shield meta (or triple shield if you had brig too) the only solution to this was to have tanks and offtanks categories separated and in offtanks having tanks without shield and only allowing 1 main and 1 off tank per team otherwise we're back at it shooting shields but that creates problems of its own...
I mean if it does we have to deal with Reinhardt and Sigma.
@garryarganis5801 to fix that shield problem, why don't they just nerf the shields like they do with tanks hp in game modes that have multiple tanks like open queue. Then it less and not as annoying as it was in OW 1
Lets see,if they add 6v6 there going to have to rework every single hero yet again,so yeah im pretty surr they did yhink about it yet they chose not to.
I want 6v6 back.
It felt more like a team game and not a bully the tank simulator
Literally
ive said it many times and ill keep saying it. you need two people to take hits. 1 that can be the main focus and a second one that be flexible. like the old rein, zarya combo rein as the main focus and the main damage sponge and zarya as somebody that be flexible and if rein takes to much damage zarya can take over
also i used to only flex que cause every role felt like you don't have to be at 100% performance so you I would definitely play more
@@bellingtoned dps are the flexibility..
@@bellingtonedi agree. We are the only game that has 1 tank lol look at games like league and smite they have a tank who peels and a semi tank in the solo lane who can take hits and sustain while doing a decent amount of damage themselves like hog
If I can play 6v6 I wouldn't mind going tank cause at least you wouldn't be going protecting ur team alone
I hope they will try it and actually balance it, 6v6 is genuienly so much better than 5v5 but in OW1s last years it just got neglected to hard, which caused 2x Shield and CC to get out of hand.
But with the new Balance team, who lowered CC with the Hero reworks for Sombra, Mei, Brig and Doom and with Orisa reworked 2x Shield isnt a problem.
6v6 also lowers Counterswaps, removes the Solo Tank pressure and you have more freedom to pick Heroes + there is no 800HP Raid Boss Roadhog running around tanking the impact of a NUKE
I genuienly want to play and enjoy OW again which i havent been able to do since OW2, if they bring back 6v6 i can finally love this game again and play 6-Stacks and Tank Duos with my friends.
Man i really hope they will try it.
Looking forward to two beefy tanks that do more consistent and less risky damage than DPS, and no cc to slow them down. Supports will get annoyed being flattened again, tank will eventually get boring because that's inherent to the role across games, and they'll still be unhappy, and DPS will get mad because they aren't as effective and have long queue times.
Apart from double shield and the overabundance of cc, I think the last patch of overwatch 1 was generally one of the better patches. Yea there was still bullshit, but a lot of heros felt viable and mostly fair.
@@yukioacumora4430 might feel that way, but it was a stale meta. You either get a stale meta which people will call boring, or you keep changing. But, that's good for balance, you just can't add new heroes.
And there was also garbage, people just prefer old garbage from when they were happy. Like Zarya, Winston, Doomfist combo was super unfun with no real counter play.
But some version of double shield will always exist tbf. But as a Sombra and support player, not looking forward to being ineffective in most situations.
But I'm more worried that if 6v6 is a better direction for the game, how bad of a precedent it will set in respect to "listening to fans"
@@MasterMemo In Overwatch 1 the tanks had less damage and could die more easily since they had simpler kits than now.
@@MasterMemo you clearly did not play ow1. tanks did barely any dmg at all *exception roadhog*. these days i see nearly every single tank in this game out dpsing the dps. like these days dps players may aswell be doing nothing cause goddamn theyre getting out damaged by the tanks. also what do you mean no cc to slow them down? cassidy's grenade literally is a slow stops them from crouching aswell. supports are already getting flattened as it is now because a single tank cant be in the front line and back line at the same time. unlike back in the old day where you could have 1 tank in the front and 1 in the back. im sorry but i think youre just talking out of your ass at this rate.
One of the biggest differences about ow2 and ow1 was that ow1 felt that your strategy and decision making mattered. ow2 feels like a random mess where people go on separate directions, reading the game is difficult and every match just feels the same no matter which hero I pick.
@@psxhumwow if only they removed pretty much all cc, actually balanced the game more than once every few years to not have double shield dominate for over a year, and we got updates every month to not let power creep like brig dictate the game just as they did with mauga, crazy ik is almost as if ow1 was even cared fored and not forgotten for months at the time, even mauga back in December was solved so much quicker than brig back in ow1
@@danielalvarez1230 "they removed all cc" ? and they just added flash bang back, give Orisa a javelin stun, give back Brig Ult stun, give Sambra skillset to strip tanks to useless, make Rein Ult stun harder and wider, making mauga the best tank in one season, the worst tank in next season, then the 2nd best tank in next season. If you like to waste money to a game to treat players like this, then go for it. Any those monthly updates are joked re-colored skins. while the match making is awful.
@psxhum what they were saying is they should remove all cc not they did.
Their entire post was basically saying the team should have actually balanced the game instead of taking the easy way out by changing the format and then saying "we will fix the problems" before promptly not doing any real fixing and letting the game get worse.
Double shield was Overwatch's purgatory, and 5v5 is it's hell.
@@Omegasutoraiki As the video creator already said, no one can balance a casual game, this will result in ruin the fun part of the game. OW1 trying to be an e-sport top-down balanced game and it failed hard. We are sitting in 11th Season in OW2, and it is quite clear to me the develop team has neither skill nor budget to balance it. All they put in the post was "We saw the data shows...", Laughable, do they ever play their own game? They should really stop putting hands on "balance XYZ", fix the core, fix the match making, stop re-introduce 6v6, leave it there.
@@psxhumilliterate mf where did I say ALL CC I said most of the cc learn to read plus flash bang is not hard cc anymore you can still use abilities it doesn’t lock you out from using cds
6v6 would not make me play more ow, it would make me play more tank. its funny cuz I used to be a rein main with 400hrs in ow1 now I don't even touch tank at all, just play dps and supp
me too, i had 300 on dva in ow 1 but now i only play dps because my main role got removed from the game
Same, I used to do a fair bit of tank, but it’s so miserable in OW2 I had to stop for my mental health.
Used to play tank in my old comp playgroup, haven’t played much tank in ow2 since release (minus doom whos just fun)
Flats got me to main rein in the good ol days but i've put the tank role down and watching flats do the same just makes me sure that tank is worse in 5v5
Literally same, I used to play Rein and Dva back on ow1 but since ow2 i have no interest even touching the tank role again.
OW2 was obviously only implemented to add monetization into the game. If they make the BP's good (they are AWFUL imo) and drop the prices of skins to 5$ regular, 7$ epic, 10$ legendary....I'd be game for that.
Dude. 6v6 coming back would be INSANE for OW, ngl.
I'd come back
its insane that it took them from 2017 (initial start of ow2) to 2024 (nearly 2025) to realize that ow1 was a great game that was only lacking content. And their solution was to completely change the game and up the skins. LOL
they probs knew it was good, just needed a reason to call it OW2 so they could monetize a "f2p model"
and also meta goat was very is to banlance, but they chose to abandon the game for years to """"work"""" (big word since they removed more they've added content) on OW2....
@@gammaxten A prime example of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" then.
@@zhongliimpact6220 I mean even then imo ow1 peaked in 2019. Obviously the launch and game of the year was huge early on but the game was kinda meh then.
actually if u think about it if they made ow free to play since 2016-2018 yea ow could've blew up again in 2019 and so on with 6v6, lootboxes, free skins, events, and even pve lore missions from archives if it were ftp back then yea many would play it and they would have more time to work on pve or whatever expansion or animated short they can ever make
but what we got now yea its devastating coz it was lazy management but also actually a joke
As someone pointed out: Que times are also down because there is no reward for playing the game anymore. For a minimum stuff you have to pay 10 dollar every 9 week and even those rewards dry up by week 4 or 5. Way more people would play if there would be a reason to with EARNABLE rewards, not just BUYABLE skins.
Right. I remember farming lootboxes all the time and also griding levels for more lootboxes
now everything is behind a paywall
Begging and praying it’s not them basically saying “yeah we hear you but we don’t wanna do it”. I’d rather them at least experiment with a 6v6 QP hacked mode like they’ve done before. Glad they’re finally addressing it after 2 years
The best way to see the feedback.
I thought we would have seen exactly that* by now. Maybe the next one. Lol
We had years of experimenting and it was complete shit.
At the very least if they say they are sticking to 5v5. I know the direction of the game isn’t for me and I can let it go. I’ll at least have closure to OW.
Genuinely believe that it's going to be a blog post explaining the reasons why they won't return to 6v6.
I could not hope more that I am wrong
Is there any other game where we are more than 10 seasons into its content, and there is still a fundamental flaw in how a core role is designed? 11 Seasons, and the Tank role is still a mystery to the devs.
The fundamental flaw was reducing team comp to 5v5 in a game that was built from the ground up to work with 6v6. If they designed Overwatch 2 as a true sequel, starting from scratch, it could have potentially worked but they basically tried to shove a battery engine into a 1970's muscle car.
Knew this day would come. Overwatch 1 has officially returned and thus Overwatch 2 is no more. Now bring back loot boxes.
Those are basically a dead industry practice, they won't go back to that because bp's are simply more biased in blizzards favor monetarily...and they do like money!
@@robikkupegasus7039 and also ow will get banned in some countries since lootboxes are believed to be EVIL and Gambling for children
i aint against lootboxes but i can't whine about it coz it aint coming back but 6v6 yea keep on whining its coming back hopefully if not then fck it
if they put 6v6 back into Overwatch, they might as well take the "2" off the end as well lol
Honestly they need to rebrand Overwatch. 2 is heavily tainted and doesn’t have a good look with the general gaming audience. Ppl outside the ow sphere clown this game
That should have happened when they canceled pve. Without that we just have OW1.2. A diminished version of the original.
overwatch 2 minus 0.5
Pve felt more like a reason for the 2 than 5v5, which they cancelled.
I’m beyond fine with that. OW2 was a failure
I am an OW2 only player. I have deleted the game and will only return when 6v6 does
No matter what they do this decision is gonna piss a lot of ppl off. 6v6 needs to come back and if it doesn’t and they finally confirm it won’t we’re gonna lose a chunk of the playerbase.
I just don't see that happening and not completely breaking the game at this point with all the balance changes and reworks that Blizzard has been doing for the last 2+ years in an attempt to make 5v5 work.
Blizzard shit the bed so hard they need a change out the mattress, not just the sheets.
@@charlestonjew75877HSKW is already showing us what it could be and it’s far from game breaking. It’s much better than the live game and I’m even starting to see more content creators hopping in those 6v6 pugs more frequently. Harbleu looked like he was having a blast 1st time and I haven’t seen that in a while.
I fell out of love with Overwatch 2 a long time ago, Overwatch 1 6v6 was so good :(
Tanks where unkillable and dps where useless
@@french_toast223if you were bad
@@tonypena5324Tell us you were bronze without telling us you were bronze.
6v6 was completely shit
@@Catbeans996v6 had its problems , no doubt . However 5v5 heavily relies on the 1 tank . If you have a bad tank your screwed
I still don't understand why they dont just make 6v6 an optional, not arcade beta, like the role pick at startup. You pick either 6v6 or 5v5 and they have an obvious answer to what's fun after a couple of months. Litterally a percentage preferential score. It would end the debate once and for all
because they'd need to have 2 very different balancing. Tanks are strong (but miserable at the same time) because it's just 1 tank versus the whole team focusing them.
With 2 tanks they d need to balance not just tanks, but supports too, since with only 1 tank per team, supps have to be able to take care of themself without the help of the second tank
@@zhongliimpact6220 Very true, still doable
@@zhongliimpact6220 it's Activision Blizzard we're talking about. They have the resources. This isn't some indie company (although the balance team operates like one)
@@SimpCity2000 But they suck at using these ressources. They have abandonned OW1 for 4 years to make OW2 and looks how it looks. It's just the same game with even less content than before
People have to stop using tank queue times as an excuse.
1# No one wanted to play orisa/sigma/symmetra double or triple shield meta.
2# No ban list. (like we asked but Jeff said no)
3# Balance team was horrible because they swore to make changes every month (even today).
4# The game wasn't free to play.
5# They left a skeleton team behind while they were working on a sequel that is worse than the original.
The reason why double shield was a problem, was because of the amount of sustain they had. Brig and Bap furthered this sustain and nothing died as a result of this.
Yes. Double Shield wasn't good because of the shield, it is because the characters with shields ALSO HAVE sustain abilities. Sigma Grasp, Orisa Fortify. And obviously the support AOE healing and broken abilites. Brig Ispire, Whipshot and Shield Bash + Bap shift and immortality. You didn't used Rein and Orisa double shield before Sigma release (minus Bastion bunker/pirate ship). And you never used Rein and Sigma because it isn't viable. Rein never had synergy with these annoying and boring characters. And with the current tank roster, Ram can not be used in double shield as we knew it, because he lacks the sustain (block leaves Ram vulnerable). If Sigma never got released so strong, we really wouldn't be in 5v5.
Skill issues because why is it me and my friends never had issues with double shields or goats??
@@MRPOPMUSIC2014because you weren’t at high rank where people actually played the game correctly lmao. Whenever someone says this they out themselves to being in the metal ranks.
It was brig and bap. Try running double shield with Lucio and mercy and see how well it turned out.
Orisa DOESN’T have a shield anymore and she is still problematic. So it wasn’t the shields. People just don’t get this.
@@MRPOPMUSIC2014 Samito and Spilo have said this as well.
After almost a year of stop playing, if they really bring back 6v6, I 'm going back.
Same here 5v5 made me quit lmao I have no interest in playing
6v6 was garbage
@@Catbeans99said by every low iq
@@Catbeans99 You're literally the only one in these comments saying this. You don't speak for the majority of players.
@@sumisu_senpai_6280 Cool. Add 6v6 and watch all you dipshits still cry.
If we basically get a “hey guys sorry but we can’t do 6v6” it would at least be nice to know why
Yeah same, if they just straight up said yes or no to 6v6, at least I know to leave for good or not
Thanks Aaron! Have fun with your garbage game I'll be playing Marvel Rivals spending time and money there.
- The problem wasn't queue times (that was the symptom), the problem was enjoyability of the tanks role.
- Double shield made the games unfun. Make tanks fun by removing cheesy abilities (instead of avoiding balance for 3 years) and there is definitely a world where 2 tanks can exist.
They fixed double shield already. Why do people talk like Orisa can still drop a shield? Its like people hallucinate a world where the worst parts of OW1 were anywhere near as bad as OW2. I don't think many of these players crying double shield ever even experienced double shield, they are just crying, scared of change.
We tried 5v5. Its terible.
@@SimpCity2000orisas sheild was never never the problem. It was fortify meaning she’s worse now. Now she has fortify, javalin spin that neutralizes all projectiles and the her ult has its own fortify.
Devs: 'I know we have been quiet for a while, but a priority for us going forward is to communicate more with the community more frequently... '
Community: 'cool, there gonna keep us in the loop now. That's all we've been asking for!...'
Devs go silent for another 3 to 4 months...
Wash, rinse, repeat....
If 6v6 were to come back, I'd feel a lot more comfortable playing tank again. Being a solo tank is way too much pressure for me personally and just ruins the fun.
Queue shouldn't be an issue anymore, they removed the barrier of entry and made ow f2p that in itself will boost the amount of tank players. They have to do something tho bc more and more ppl are quitting the role bc it's not fun being hard focused the whole match. If we keep losing tanks then queues are gonna be longer anyway.
I would start playing overwatch again if they adjust the tanks and went back 6v6
I will play overwatch for 12 hour straight if they add 6v6 back
5v5 has been an utter failure
Yeah, ever since 5v5 the balance has been all over the place
6v6 balance was not better. them's some rose tinted glasses
@UncleJemima Not saying it was, just feels that the 5v5 stuff seems like it's been harder to balance around. Also, some of the ow1 characters just feel different in the ow2 climate
Source? Game already in season 11 and the pro competitive scene was normal as ow1, cope harder.
The pro scene doesn't exist! Lol
Being a Rien player is sad.
You got the cool changes from the mirrorwatch and community crafted events that make the hero super fun to play and then when the time comes to actualy buff the hero all blizard can say is MORE SHIELD like what the actual fuck
The only reason Reaper has that win rate is because there are in total 20 reaper mains and all of them are decent at the character.
I think the point on double shield cant stick when its only 1 shield taking the fire. The problem with double shield was the ability to cycle shields to stop damage forever. Having a shield with a lot of health but that needs a recharge is not the same.
6 v 6 now would be better than OW1 because counter picking made people learn all the tanks meaning tank combos and synergies will be easier to come by since everyone can swap around and match.
This is a solid af point
So many tank characters that were never ment 2 solo tank like :Winston,ball,zarya,doom, that’s why those characters are almost never played
If 6vs6 comes back I will have way more fun, also I will play tank again. So yeah I want it back
One of the main reasons I prefer 6v6 is because I'll have friends get on who wanna group up together, but there's always someone left out because of the 5v5 switch
Its a very straightforward fix really, will take some tuning work but tanks would essentially just need to be split in half, main and off tanks and one each can be selected per team. Thats all they would need to do to avoid double barrier. I'm not sure why this is so difficult for them to understand if they are giving in to 6v6
If a solo tank feels tanky and does the dmg it does then it aint a tank, its a field boss
Tanks don't feel tanky because they're asked to do too many things. I played some Winston today on Esperanca, contesting high ground, peel for my support, contest cart and confirm elim on low HP target, go back to contest high ground, using my brain you know. Fast forward five minutes, my DPS is still 1-6. I can't do all of that plus be the only one preparing for D. Va bomb or death blossom. I refuse to carry players who don't even notice the Genji shooting them in the face, or if they do notice, they kill me with deflect. That's why they need to punish players for leaving quick play. In stead of match maker taking an extra thirty seconds to find a more fun balanced team. They've moved so far away from fundamentals, they reward four stacks who can't leave spawn flaming the random with the only elims. Mauga is prime example of how they want EVERYONE to play the game. Whereas before, in the game I bought, I could play who ever I want on my favorite map. Now I get the same trash map three consecutive matches and if I wanna play ball it doesn't matter because this is already a predetermined loss.
They've had 11 seasons an multiple interviews to "jump in" on the 6v6 debate, an what did they do? They've told people to not bring it up. His post is just another "break glass in case of financial emergency" moment. I don't, and will never again, trust Blizzard. Should have learned my lesson during wow.
You are paying attention my friend
tank is the least played bc they’re in such a bad spot. if there was an off tank then maybe more people would go back to playing tank bc it’s more enjoyable instead of instantly getting shredded
Either they try it, or I keep the game uninstalled. Their balancing seems very disappointing in the next patch. Support focused fire is the main tank problem.
If you are scaared about double shield just introduce main and offtank roles...
Splitting up the role will just make the queue time issue worse which led to 5v5 to begin with. Double shield was a balance issue brought about because of too much sustain. Couldn't dive that because of bap/brig, mainly so you had to brute force it. Same reason Mauga/Orisa metas are lame. They have insane sustain abilities off cooldown and you just have to try and brute force it
Not the answer. The most iconic double shield comp was Orisa Sigma. Orisa was a main tank and sigma was an offtank; splitting the roles has no effect on this. I guess in OW2 they have just removed Orisa’s shield so this solution is outdated anyways. It was the high sustain AOE healing backlines and immortalities that made the Orisa + Sigma pair so powerful in the first place.
@@Decibel00288 dont think so. The reason they went 5v5 is that they had to have an excuse to "make" (rebrand) OW2 and their new monetary System. Its all about the money always has and always will be
I find it crazy how people still argue that double shield is an issue with 6v6 when orisa literally doesn’t have a shield anymore
Orisa doesnt have a Shield anymore and Ram/Sig dont have enough Shield uptime to be annoying with it
And if 2x Shield somehow becomes a meta, they could add a passive (oh boy another one) that lowers your teams Shields when theres 2 Shield tanks in the team.
Something like that, but theres lots of stuff that can be tried.
Working with a second tank felt really fun and tactical in 6v6, combining different tank abilities and ults. 5v5 is "better tank wins", it feels.
The difference between a great rein shield and double shield from OW1 is that Rein is an ethical pick (to use Flats’ term). Everyone loves rein, and everyone hated orisa/sigma. Just like everyone dislikes playing against hog when he’s good.
Supports and Tanks being tied to each other is something I agree with. However, that's not a new issue. With the way Healing/Sustain works in Overwatch, this was always the case. A Rein with a decent healer was always an absolute monster. A Rein left out to dry, on the other hand, could get chipped down to nothing fairly quickly. As I've said many times before, healing is the source of all the game's issues. Can't make Tanks too tanky because they become unkillable with healing. Can't make Tanks too fragile else they evaporate without healing.
So he's still telling they would still prefer to change everything in the game, even modify every hero's passives etc than admit they fucked the game up with 5v5? Nothing new, then.
I like your point at around 11:00 about readability.
I think a good solution for widow would make her more readable
It feels horrible to instantly die to a sneaky widow off way deep, but I feel like if you gave her perhaps a laser designator that not only shows who she's looking at, and potentially trying to take a pick on
but also communicates perhaps charge (I.e: it flashes while she's charging her shot)
But it also adds a fear factor that can be used to influence the enemy's positioning
If you have a bright laser looking around for a clean shot it tells you find cover and stay out of the way if you can
This can cause enemy positioning to react to her presence, which might be very fun and I think falls in line with the fantasy of widow, a deadly sniper who you need to watch out for
It gives her a sense of presence on the battlefield, but also predictability that makes her feel more fair
but that's my 2 cents let me know how you feel about the suggestion
Don't waste your time people, this is a massive clickbate. Aaron just said they will share their idea about 6v6 and we already know what it is (it's not coming back). Stylosa earned a unfollow becouse of this.
Hes not saying its happening lol
@@gamerbeast3616 the clickbate titel hints towards it. I haven't watched the video. Becouse of the clickbate.
Why would queue times still be a problem? We even had long queue times in the 5v5 beta of the game, and they somehow fixed the matchmaking queue times.
i would definitely play a helluva lot more tank again, the reason queue times for tank are as low as they are now is because no one enjoys tank rn, that's the whole reason we want 6v6 back, we want tank to be fun again and not a charity role
It’s finally being discussed!!! If Aaron says the game will definitely NEVER return to 6v6, as in they won’t even entertain the idea of it in a Classic Mode or Quick Play Hacked mode, I will stay casual or, eventually, will move on. Tank synergy in OW1 felt amazing, I have missed it so much. I’ve missed streamers like Emongg and Flats playing together, too. 6v6 made Widow and Hog easier to deal with. I played a game the other day on Support where my tank repeatedly got pulled into the well on Ilios by the enemy Rein. I played Ana but no matter how many times I slept him or naded him my tank couldn’t deal with him. Hog would vape and hook my tank off the point. You know what would counter that? Two tanks. Hog never felt this bad to play against in OW1. I remember strategies we used in OW1 against oppressive Widow/Hanzo/Mercy trios and it involved two tanks. Dive feels so bad in OW2.
I now only play OW2 when there is a new Battle Pass, and even then it’s like once a week, or less! I used to play OW1 almost every night!
If there are more players now, and more heroes, I wonder if tank would be so hard to fill. It is a lot less pressure to not screw up when you have another tank with you. If they put premium currency in as an incentive (25 coins for queuing tank!) I would, no joke, grind the game on tank. There is no incentive to play now because if you sneeze you could get blamed for losing the match. The supports used to get blamed in OW1 but it’s definitely the tanks now. As a support, I hate babysitting our tank. As a tank, though, I hate when my support is dpsing when I’m gettig charged by a Mauga with a Mercy boost. Feels bad.
My biggest complaint is how I wasn’t given an option to switch to 5v5. They took OW1 offline so I just had to adapt. I have hated 5v5 since Day 1 of OW2.
If they brought back 6v6 as an arcade mode, I hope it has 2/2/2 role lock
the creator arcade mode has an open queue role lock, 1/2/2. hopefully they implement that
im ngl but i genuinely think that role lock queue is what was the start to the end of fun in the game like its no wonder why queue times got bad. back when there was no role queue searching for a game was so quick. as the other person in the reply here said i hope they implement that system that the creator arcade mode instead. would make queue times faster AND would make sure the games roles are balanced.
@@DarkKeybladeMaster23this right here, role lock made it so queue times would spike, we didn’t need role queue the sole reason it exist was due to the devs not wanting to nerf brig as much as they should’ve. Goats was actually fun to play it was something different from the 5/6dps and sometimes 1supp we saw a meta were tanks were important, the thing that made it awful was the lack of updates blizzard gave to the game rendering the gameplay repetitive and boring.
@DarkKeybladeMaster23 don't you remember open queue? Yeah, queues were short, but every single game was 5 dps inta locks that won't swap. tanks didn't exist, and the only time you saw a support was when you were forced to play support.
@@Mr-atom55 did you not see what I said? The creator mode makes it so there is no role queue but it greys out that role when the required number is there. But honestly I loved the chaos of og queueing. Was much more fun and I say that as an ow 1 tank main.
Would the q times still be bad for 6v6 even with the supposedly bigger player base from being f2p?
I still miss 6v6 when i play tank. I don't miss 6v6 when i play dps or supp 😅
Same, I hate blowing up in overwatch 2
We gonna have 6v6 with 3 dps instead of 2 so we can have more spam coming down at us tank mains😂
My only concern is if this is actually true, I hope double Shield doesn’t become a thing like in the days of overwatch one. It was a pain in the arse.
Simply ban some tank combo's and where golden.@@Junkrat-2020
Let's instead do 7v7
One tank, 3dps, 3supports
One thing about the tank player base, I played a lot of tank in OW1 it was my second most played role . In OW2 the role deals so fucking bad I would not touch that role with a ten foot pole. It’s just not fun currently. And yes my role of off tank was repeated but I also enjoyed main tank. I would play winton and rein and I would win but not any more.
"You were so preoccupied with whether you could, that you didn't stop to think if you should..."
We most definitely should. 6v6 is objectively the better format.
Season 10: Venture Forth
Season 11: Ultrawatch
Season 12: Overwatch 1
I feel like if the 6v6 format returns, they should make a system where one player picks a shield tank which makes the other tank player automatically pick a non shield tank.
OR get rid of sig grasp, and nuke aoe healing and immortality abilities lmao. All the issues with 6 v 6 come from balance and design issues not the format, they could’ve balanced double shield out of the game in like 1 month lmao
@@-.Outlaw.-no. If The 2 life, pure armor, projectile deleter can keep their matrix, Sig can keep his. I think 1 shield is a good idea
@@IsThatKris comparing Dva to Sig is downright fucking retarded, and so is the idea of limiting comps to one shield when double shield wouldn’t even be viable for the reasons I mentioned. If you think sig should have a sustain ability on top of a shield and a brawl ability you don’t understand the game lmao.
Double Shield only worked with orisa Sig, Orisa doesn't have shield anymore. Ram's shield is temporary, stationary and occasional so that wouldn't be a problem. However, they would have to nerf AOE healing because that would be OP in 6v6.
Aside from the fact that the AOE healing/sustain was insane in late OW1, the initial tank problem with double shield was that both Orisa and Sigma had a self-sustain ability, poke damage, a range CC ability...and a shield. My point is, creating a system to prevent from playing both of them in the same team would not have changed the fact that *both of these heroes were fundamentally flawed in the 6v6 environment* .
At least one of them should have been reworked, multiple solutions were possible like focusing on the frontline aspect of Sigma to make him more like a main tank, or focusing on the Grasp mechanic to make him more like an off-tank. They did none of that and gaslit themselves into thinking that the problem was 6v6. It was not.
I get wanting 6v6 back but having a main tank and off tank role would not work
I really do hope they experiment with 6v6, many people seem to forget that 6v6 has plenty of its own issues. It is not the smoking gun solution some people advocating (not all but some) think it is. It will be fun to have tank synergy again, but im not looking forward to the inevitable double barrier. Then again barriers are paper thin, so maybe we need two for it to make a difference.
Would 6v6 make me play more ? No. Wanna know what would ?
- Clan System
- Map Editor
- Pre-Game Lobby to view everyones rank and most played heroes etc
- Map Voting
- Better Ping/Communication system
- Clan System
- More Customization like an OG Cod Emblem Editor
- Hero Ban/Protection Voting
- Clan System
- More PERMANENT Competetive modes like 3v3, 6v6, low gravity, prop hunt, no limits, mystery heroes ... basically an Arcade Competetive playlist
- More better ingame Events that add more than 6 challenges and a new game mode
- Clan System
- Support a Creator
- Better progression system that gives you more than a name card and a whacky title (like lvl 50 soldier for "vigilante" ?? wohooo yea cool)
- better actual items in the battle pass instead of name cards, souveniers and all the other filler crap
and of course a good old Clan System where I can work on my Clan rating/rank/level by playing with friends and invite other people into my clan that I think are cool where we all get a Clan Reward at the end of every season plus the top 10 clans get invited into some tournament or whatever
Lol
Wtf, of course 6v6 would make tank players play more. Just because that may not be the case for YOU doesn't mean it's universal. Your points are interesting and I'd like to see them in the game, but they don't invalidate the fact that 6v6 would undeniably make the tank role more appealing, more fair and more fun to play.
Heck, if I'm being honest then I'd rather have a group/clan system that's across all atvi blizz games...
But that's unlikely 😅
@@DeadlyAlpha ok that would be sick af tho
fuck no to all of this especially the clan bs
I think taking the stress off being the only tank would entice some people to play it more as well
yeah. Doing a mistake as a dps / support is fine, because your buddy can replace/help you. Doing a mistake as a tank is just an instant loose... It's so damn stupid I can't believe they went with this idea of 5v5 and kept it until now....
I really enjoyed 5v5 when it first dropped. At this point id love 6v6 beat. BUT let us have both
Unfortunately I think if they have both it'll be too hard for the devs to balance both, so I think its a situation where its one or the other.
@@Painintake The balance over the years has been all over the place anyway, fuck it lol
Nah, 5v5 is a hot garbage and will be gone for good
Rein was never an issue when everyone was complaining about double shield it was always sigma Orisa no one was complaining about rein shield
I don’t usually get mad at clickbait.
But this one is actually infuriating.
You should have at least some degree of shame.
The thumbnail alone is enough for me to unsub ngl, and I don't even play OW anymore
I think SVB had a good idea of keeping the format 5v5 but moving back to open q and limiting it to no more than 2 in any given roll. I would love to try it in a qp hacked.
I believe Blizzard should introduce distinct roles for Main Tank and Off Tank, assigning specific tanks to each. For instance, place Junker Queen, Roadhog, Zarya, and Mauga in the Off Tank role, while Reinhardt, D.Va, and Sigma go into the Main Tank role, ensuring only one shield-bearing tank can be picked at a time. Even if Sigma is considered an Off Tank, just reduce his shield capabilities. It's not a complicated solution, Blizzard. The roles would then be Main Tank, Off Tank, DPS, and Support.
I get what you're going for, but tank players would lose the ability to choose whatever tank they want to play, resulting in heavily increased queue times
@JustZectro life isn't always fair. Better to try something then nothing at all
@@GavinDaven Im just saying that they switched to 5v5 to lower queue times. This route you're taking would HEAVILY increase queue times
I think the worry about the off/main tank increasing queue times is a bit over blown. I wish I had the analytics but there is a big mix of ppl playing various tanks. If anything the double tank return will increase the queue time in general for everyone else, at first, as the pool of tanks will decrease. Which would settle down eventually as players move to playing tank so they can play more often increasing the tank pool. Happened in OW1 when no one was playing supports. Will they be bad tanks? Yes, until they play enough to get better.
OW went free to play and came to steam to boost player numbers to help with queue times, and despite all that we're already about as bad of a spot as we were during the end of OW1.
If we were to increase the number of tanks needed in game, we would need to make the role fun to play. And splitting it in two definitely wouldn't help with that, nor would make queues shorter
Just bring back 6v6 as its own mode, so people who don’t like it aren’t forced to play it. For ranked play, it can just be another separate category.
I wish Blizzard would give me my money back
Also Tanks was the least played because their were fewer heroes. Fewer heroes means less possibiliy for you to find a hero you like gameplay and design wise in that role versus a role with double the amount of heroes.
A 1-1-2-2 set up would solve every problem.
Either 1 shield tank, 1 non-shield tank, 2 DPS, 2 support, or the same but instead, 1 anchor tank, and 1 flank/dive tank.
Queue times for main tank would be wicked
I was a former 5v5 accepter, but now im convinced that 6v6 is better in every way. I really do hope they start experimenting with it.
I’m kinda amazed the games still going.
100%. They destroyed the IP before OW2 even released.
I used to be roadhog off tank and now it's over, it's only counterwatch
Pls let it be true
Looking back at ow1 I’m wondering why they removed 6vs6 to begin with. Something’s that weren’t broken didn’t need to be changed.
Pleaseeee 6v6 pleaseeeee
one interesting thing to note on the 6v6 tweet: he mentioned that they are considering actually making a dev video on the 6v6 topic. They are not gonna make a video to announce 6v6 is not comming. they usually make these videos if something interesting is getting announced. i hope they just gonna make a (for now) permanent arcade mode that gets improved over time and if community interest persists over a few months we may see them go further with that.
People still play OW?
Yeah, like u lol
Do people really still post this ‘people still play’ comment?
about 200k+ concurrent on all platforms combined
@@celticsgirlI think I a lot of ppl watch this dudes vids and haven’t played OW for years, like me. Could be wrong though
Bro
I think 6v6 at this point was so important to the gameplay that the queue times won’t matter as much because match quality will be so much higher. (Pretty sure queue times were the only reason not to)
Double the Hp, half the Damage
I’ve been hearing people talk about splitting the tank role into two roles, main and off tank. And doing so will make the queue times even more horrible, what I think they can do is make it so the two tanks queue for the tank role like normal, get into a game to select their character, if one of them chooses a main tank, every other main tanks becomes unavailable for the other player, and they would have to pick an off tank, maybe that rule can be applied to competitive and not for quick play since you could have less restriction on what character you want to play. And team 4 can further balance the game like this. Not a perfect idea but yeah
I think the worry about the off/main tank increasing queue times is a bit over blown. I wish I had the analytics but there is a big mix of ppl playing various tanks. If anything the double tank return will increase the queue time in general for everyone else, at first, as the pool of tanks will decrease. Which would settle down eventually as players move to playing tank so they can play more often increasing the tank pool. Happened in OW1 when no one was playing supports. Will they be bad tanks? Yes, until they play enough to get better.
4 roles Main Tank, Off Tank, DPS, Support
Nice! Longer queue times for everyone
@@MasterMemo cry
I've been a huge proponent of moving back to 6v6 and also putting doom back to dps, but the issue I have now is that I just simply don't trust them to do anything correctly. If they implement 6v6 as they stand as a studio right now it will fail. They have to adjust their culture in how they see heroes, what is actually fair in a game with 30+ heroes, and where the focus for balance sits amongst the population of the game. I don't have it in me to believe in them.
Hear me out. Next season. 2 tanks 2 supports 1 dps. let chaos reign and every match take 65min
YES YES YES YES
Bastion or throwing
In regards to 6v6, I sure hope people don't think it simply means adding an extra tank. 5v5 heroes are not well-attuned for a 6v6 format. Some take it at face-value, and it isn't necessarily wrong for people to think that. 6v6 isn't an automatic fix, it's a call to change the format. So, I could care less if they remove or add a hero slot, I just want it to change. I want to have fun. Custom games can only entertain for so long.
This game is such a joke...
I think the queue time gains from cutting a tank have been lost from the number of people that refuse to play tank now. In a F2P game, DPS queues are back up to 6 minutes for Silver-Bronze SR (haven't played enough after reset to climb). I tried flex queue, after not playing for a year, and got tank 100% of the time. I refused to go back to QP after that - only play the creator patch if I play at all.
The whole reason I stopped playing the game was because playing tank was absolutely insufferable. If they ever bring back 6v6, I will be there day 1.
I want 6 vs 6 and ever since I thought that 5 vs 5 would emphasize a huge impact on the tank role, eventually make a good tank vs tank a huge difference on matches, and make it easier to play tank boring and I wasn't wrong
The thing about "there's not enough tank players" is that it works like a Laffer curve (that curve that shows that there's a point where tax rates are so high that revenue falls because people start refusing to pay them).
If you make tank more rewarding to play as, there will be more tank players.
Not only 6v6 is better but you have more tank interactions like Zarya and Mauga
100% sure the next dev blog is just gonna say "oh sorry we dont have the man power to explore alternative routes and cant explore 6v6" might be true as blizzard has down sized twice.
OW1: was created by genius people who made a masterpiece
OW2: was reskinned OW1 by completely different people that thought they knew better than the original creators and they clearly didn't
0% humility
100% ego
Admit your mistake, put 6v6 back and let's go back in the proper direction
Just put 6v6 as a option on QP so they can get the feedback they need either quick play of arcade
Lol, ok. Them talking about it doesn't mean any action will be taken. It could just mean they are acknowledging player complaints.