I have always heard what is recommended here in North America is the "Finish Line Krytech Wax Lube" (needs to be Krytech and not dry/wet variants) mean for bike/motorcycle chains. Shake it up really well, lightly saturate the foam in the bottom of a pellet tin, put in a small handful of pellets, swirl the tin around for 15-60 seconds to ensure an even coating, then remove them and set them aside to dry. For most consistent results set them all up to stand on the skirts for drying.
I like yourself was interested in this theory and I came up with extremely similar results. I could not tell the difference. I tried two separate times and to me I think I was better off spending that time making sure my rifle was dialed in and just practicing. I had more noticeable results buy sorting pellets then by lubing them.
I find it more useful to carefully examine pellets under a magnifying glass during the long winter evenings and carefully weigh them with a precision scale and then group them into different tins. Only with JSB pellets.
I drape a soft cloth or soft cotton tee shirt that is saturated in silicon super lube over a plastic bowl, not soaked but barely damp at the most, poor the pellets on and roll them around like a trampoline, the rag need little oil since it's never dries. the cloth is fine stich so it can just be shaken off for heavy debris. It really helps keep thing clean and get any of the flakes out of the tin and applies an even amount since you aren't trying to apply it individually. This is something I always do. Pellets these days are coming cleaner, but slugs seem to always have a lot of stuff you want to separate.
Interesting. I have tested the lubed vs unlubed pellets, and I used Krown rust protection (I didn't had anything else at the time). What I have found is I saw improvements in grouping on every single pellet brand I used. The next thing I found was that I had a slight increase in the speed of any pellets. I have tested that with an FWB P70 16j rifle on 25 meters indoor range. The next thing that I tested was PTFE dry grease. I haven't counted for tighter groups, my main goal was to test for better efficiency, and I had that. I shot several years with pellets lubed with PTFE, and the only thing i didn't like about that grease was that when it rains, it loses its properties, which can be quite unfortunate if competitions happen on a rainy day. Now I use Napier pellet lube because it's not influenced by the water so much.
Thanks Buddy 👍 Also my conclusion; not worth the trouble with washing, drying, lubing. By the way,... i shoot less than one centimeter groups with my S410 on 30 yards and JSB 8.33gr. I'm sure your comp.EV2 woll do way better with other pellets or there is something wrong with it. Honestly and no b.s, even my HW springers do better groups if i work hard. Cheers!
Did try lubing once, it was because the make of pellets had swarf in the tin, so required cleaning. Now I use JSB almost exclusively I don't find them dirty at all so they don't require any treatment. Your friends in the target world are like passionate competitors everywhere looking for that extra edge.
nice presentation as always. Lubing is in my eyes a sensitive topic. on pellets I do not lube because I don't see any benefit on any of my airguns. on Slugs I see it different. Here I want to possibly prevent leading up the barrel to loose the lead equilibrium. For my M3 22 Slugs I use Guntec and it works. Don't need to clean it up often. For the Panthera it's a different story. Here I use a mixture of Beeswax Engine oil and HBN.Worked fine since 400 Slugs. Cleaning is easier and leading lower.
Very interesting video. I've always inspected my pellets and end by rolling them over a sheet of glass to verify that they are not deformed. As far as lube goes, after cleaning the empty tin, I give it a short blast of silicon spay and then return the pellets. I've been doing this for over 50 years, and I can honestly say that I don't notice any significant improvement. It's more of a psychological ritual. Back in the 60s when I started shooting, the airgunner with a simple break barrel wasn't confronted with a bewildering array of pellets and usually bought a couple of tins of what was available at the local shops. Today I can still hold a 15mm group at 25m shooting a HW97 and a Diana Mod.26 made in 1976, what more could an old man (74) ask for?
Very interesting video. I do LV, HV and unlimited benchrest. I don't wash pellets, but my results on target are best when I heavily lube JSBs for my .22 Daystate (Lothar Walther), lightly lube JSBs for my .22 FX and zero lube my H&Ns for my .177 FX
As ever brilliant assessment, keep up the good work. Incidentally would you do a comparison of accuracy over 40 meters between the bark ghost’s short barrel and the longer barrel with same power settings in same gun. Thanks, Phil.
Sorry Phillip, sold the Ghost about 2 months ago, got tired of waiting for a slug barrel and needed funds for next years World Hunter Filed Champs in Sardinia...
Ah not to worry was just curious, my ghost plus is seriously accurate running JTS 18 grn at 920 ft/sec. Wondered how much better the longer barrel would make it. The most accurate gun I ever had was a Theoben Rapid 12 long barrel running at 32 ft/lb with 16 grn pellets, close to pellet on pellet at 50 M. Keep up the good work, yours is the best airgun post on YT.
@rapalaron6348 I disagree. H&N pellets are harder than say JSB pellets. The none lead pellets are even harder. And yes over years and thousands of pellets it does ware on your barrel, mate !
@@lewis1141951 Hi! Non lead pellets like alloy and mixed metals suck anyway. I own a 30+ year old Anschutz .22lr rimfire that has shot thousands and thousands of rounds and is as accurate as day one, but yes, there are also quality and bad quality barrels if coarse. The micro thin lead film you get in the barrel will lube it. The old Belgium hand made FN browning shotguns are even lead polished on the inside of the barrel against corrosion and wear...,that's why you don't shoot steel shots with them. My FWB300S has shot ten thousands of pellets, two times i had to replaced the seals and springs and i still nail a fly on 25 meters with the same barrel. You can't wear out a quality airgun barrel with light weight and low speed pellets that's not even getting hot and no gunpowder to corrode it. Airgun barrels can be destroyed by wrong use of steel cleaning rods and those darts they shot with in the early days. Please don't believe all the airgun "expert" b.s told here on YT. Even on the airgun channel i heard so much crap because those "experts" just repeating what other "experts" told before. They are like parrots....One was once telling that the HW 77/97 has an anti bear trap mechanism and all are telling that those rifles has an anti bear trap mechanism. They are sometimes not even know what they are talking about... Cheers.
As far as I know most if not all pellets come with a lube/coating to prevent oxidation. Also since I go through 20,000+ a year for my work, there is no way I'm cleaning and lubing.
I've shot even pellets with light deformed skirts that i picked apart, but the air pressure will expend the soft lead skirt to a tight fit in the barrel anyway. No difference in accuracy. It's worse with damaged heads.
I didn't find that lubing increased accuracy (nor hurt it) but in shooting high powered airgun .25 slugs at 950 FPS there is a buildup of fouling that does start degrading accuracy and lubing reduces that considerably and extends cleaning intervals with pellets, I never had to clean often, but with slugs I do. But I quit washing with soap and water and instead use an evaporative solvent (3 parts) and synthetic two cycle oil (1 part or 25%) to wash then drain on a screen (and capture the fluid for next time) and let dry. I'm doing this in batches of a 1000 and it leaves a slight , barely perceptible film on the surface. Just enough that handling 100 slugs will leave a very light oily film on your fingertips. So I'm washing any swarf off and preventing corrosion while reducing fowling, a win in my book. Note that I found silicone spray is a TERRIBLE lubricant and isn't as slick as you'd think so speed usually drops a bit using it AND it builds up on the surface of the bore and is very hard to completely clean off. Thats what you picked to test but it's not a good choice.
The whole idea is to see if lubing makes them better, a good batch will not need lube because they are already great. The batch I shot with is actually a competition batch, not my no 1 batch, that i will only shoot competitions with. lol.
There is no point in lubing 4.5 mm pellets BECAUSE pellets have very small part of their surface come in conduct with the barrel rifling (head and skirt edges only). For pellets it is more important both head and skirt to fit tight (in that order of importance), not to have deformities on the skirt and not to have factory grease on it (e g. h&n). I do size wash and re lube for the prevention of oxidation cheap chineese pellets (snowpeak) because it worths the trouble (1/3 of purchasing cost with 80% performance compare to JSBs after treatment but only for my .22s. For my power guns (huben &LCS) I cast 38 gr slugs (5.56 & 5.58) and lubing is esential since it makes a significant difference in out of barrel speed (slugs I trapped were untouchable hot)... Also in my Brocock and Cometa guns with 5.52 slugs lubing it's the only way to fit them in... I use Teflon oil with the same technique you described. Never use lube on springers (HW77, HW35, LGV) and sporting guns (Steyr LP10)
Tried that , came to the same conclusion , the only thing I do is weigh the little buggers, my hft air arms loves QYS 4.49 streamlines , but QYS are so consistent out of every 100 pellets I weigh I toss two , best advice just give them a quick visual inspection, , save the wrong ones and shoot the ? Then your understand where I’m coming from ❤
I do have to say, the only thing I do is weighing my pellets. Great video.
I have always heard what is recommended here in North America is the "Finish Line Krytech Wax Lube" (needs to be Krytech and not dry/wet variants) mean for bike/motorcycle chains. Shake it up really well, lightly saturate the foam in the bottom of a pellet tin, put in a small handful of pellets, swirl the tin around for 15-60 seconds to ensure an even coating, then remove them and set them aside to dry. For most consistent results set them all up to stand on the skirts for drying.
I like yourself was interested in this theory and I came up with extremely similar results. I could not tell the difference. I tried two separate times and to me I think I was better off spending that time making sure my rifle was dialed in and just practicing.
I had more noticeable results buy sorting pellets then by lubing them.
Great feedback, my conlcuion as well. That constant search for better everything instead of practice...
I build a calibration tool for the Pellets in 4,5 , i never expected such an improvment of accuracy
Please share...
excellent video thank you very much👍
I find it more useful to carefully examine pellets under a magnifying glass during the long winter evenings and carefully weigh them with a precision scale and then group them into different tins. Only with JSB pellets.
I drape a soft cloth or soft cotton tee shirt that is saturated in silicon super lube over a plastic bowl, not soaked but barely damp at the most, poor the pellets on and roll them around like a trampoline, the rag need little oil since it's never dries. the cloth is fine stich so it can just be shaken off for heavy debris. It really helps keep thing clean and get any of the flakes out of the tin and applies an even amount since you aren't trying to apply it individually. This is something I always do. Pellets these days are coming cleaner, but slugs seem to always have a lot of stuff you want to separate.
Interesting.
I have tested the lubed vs unlubed pellets, and I used Krown rust protection (I didn't had anything else at the time). What I have found is I saw improvements in grouping on every single pellet brand I used. The next thing I found was that I had a slight increase in the speed of any pellets. I have tested that with an FWB P70 16j rifle on 25 meters indoor range.
The next thing that I tested was PTFE dry grease. I haven't counted for tighter groups, my main goal was to test for better efficiency, and I had that. I shot several years with pellets lubed with PTFE, and the only thing i didn't like about that grease was that when it rains, it loses its properties, which can be quite unfortunate if competitions happen on a rainy day.
Now I use Napier pellet lube because it's not influenced by the water so much.
I am too lazy to lube my pellets anyway
Thanks Buddy 👍 Also my conclusion; not worth the trouble with washing, drying, lubing. By the way,... i shoot less than one centimeter groups with my S410 on 30 yards and JSB 8.33gr. I'm sure your comp.EV2 woll do way better with other pellets or there is something wrong with it. Honestly and no b.s, even my HW springers do better groups if i work hard. Cheers!
Interesant
Did try lubing once, it was because the make of pellets had swarf in the tin, so required cleaning. Now I use JSB almost exclusively I don't find them dirty at all so they don't require any treatment. Your friends in the target world are like passionate competitors everywhere looking for that extra edge.
nice presentation as always. Lubing is in my eyes a sensitive topic. on pellets I do not lube because I don't see any benefit on any of my airguns. on Slugs I see it different. Here I want to possibly prevent leading up the barrel to loose the lead equilibrium. For my M3 22 Slugs I use Guntec and it works. Don't need to clean it up often. For the Panthera it's a different story. Here I use a mixture of Beeswax Engine oil and HBN.Worked fine since 400 Slugs. Cleaning is easier and leading lower.
Interesting combo...
Very interesting video.
I've always inspected my pellets and end by rolling them over a sheet of glass to verify that they are not deformed.
As far as lube goes, after cleaning the empty tin, I give it a short blast of silicon spay and then return the pellets. I've been doing this for over 50 years, and I can honestly say that I don't notice any significant improvement. It's more of a psychological ritual.
Back in the 60s when I started shooting, the airgunner with a simple break barrel wasn't confronted with a bewildering array of pellets and usually bought a couple of tins of what was available at the local shops. Today I can still hold a 15mm group at 25m shooting a HW97 and a Diana Mod.26 made in 1976, what more could an old man (74) ask for?
Fascinating!
Very interesting video. I do LV, HV and unlimited benchrest. I don't wash pellets, but my results on target are best when I heavily lube JSBs for my .22 Daystate (Lothar Walther), lightly lube JSBs for my .22 FX and zero lube my H&Ns for my .177 FX
As ever brilliant assessment, keep up the good work. Incidentally would you do a comparison of accuracy over 40 meters between the bark ghost’s short barrel and the longer barrel with same power settings in same gun. Thanks, Phil.
Sorry Phillip, sold the Ghost about 2 months ago, got tired of waiting for a slug barrel and needed funds for next years World Hunter Filed Champs in Sardinia...
THE best air gun channel on UA-cam. Always a pleasure to watch from uk.
Ah not to worry was just curious, my ghost plus is seriously accurate running JTS 18 grn at 920 ft/sec. Wondered how much better the longer barrel would make it. The most accurate gun I ever had was a Theoben Rapid 12 long barrel running at 32 ft/lb with 16 grn pellets, close to pellet on pellet at 50 M. Keep up the good work, yours is the best airgun post on YT.
my guns with cz barrels dont like lube but brocock sniper xr with the lothar walther barrel does like lube same with others xr guns down at the range
Excelente vídeo. Gracias
I lube my pellets but not to improve accuracy or speed but to cut down on the wear and tear on the barrel.
Lead pellets won't wear and tear a quality air rifle barrel mate.
@rapalaron6348 I disagree. H&N pellets are harder than say JSB pellets. The none lead pellets are even harder.
And yes over years and thousands of pellets it does ware on your barrel, mate !
@@lewis1141951 Hi! Non lead pellets like alloy and mixed metals suck anyway. I own a 30+ year old Anschutz .22lr rimfire that has shot thousands and thousands of rounds and is as accurate as day one, but yes, there are also quality and bad quality barrels if coarse. The micro thin lead film you get in the barrel will lube it. The old Belgium hand made FN browning shotguns are even lead polished on the inside of the barrel against corrosion and wear...,that's why you don't shoot steel shots with them. My FWB300S has shot ten thousands of pellets, two times i had to replaced the seals and springs and i still nail a fly on 25 meters with the same barrel. You can't wear out a quality airgun barrel with light weight and low speed pellets that's not even getting hot and no gunpowder to corrode it. Airgun barrels can be destroyed by wrong use of steel cleaning rods and those darts they shot with in the early days. Please don't believe all the airgun "expert" b.s told here on YT. Even on the airgun channel i heard so much crap because those "experts" just repeating what other "experts" told before. They are like parrots....One was once telling that the HW 77/97 has an anti bear trap mechanism and all are telling that those rifles has an anti bear trap mechanism. They are sometimes not even know what they are talking about... Cheers.
@rapalaron6348 I think that same statement may apply to you also !
@@lewis1141951 Knowledge and experience mate. Over 40 years.
As far as I know most if not all pellets come with a lube/coating to prevent oxidation. Also since I go through 20,000+ a year for my work, there is no way I'm cleaning and lubing.
That is why you need to wash them and dry them before lubing... i also shoot too much to be bothered by this.
Compelling results. Is there any value to simply washing pellets?
Napier good for slugs?
Know difference but apparently the barrel does not cleaning so much as it stops to much lead build up
I never lubed my pellets, only proper sorting for accuracy.
I've shot even pellets with light deformed skirts that i picked apart, but the air pressure will expend the soft lead skirt to a tight fit in the barrel anyway. No difference in accuracy. It's worse with damaged heads.
I didn't find that lubing increased accuracy (nor hurt it) but in shooting high powered airgun .25 slugs at 950 FPS there is a buildup of fouling that does start degrading accuracy and lubing reduces that considerably and extends cleaning intervals with pellets, I never had to clean often, but with slugs I do.
But I quit washing with soap and water and instead use an evaporative solvent (3 parts) and synthetic two cycle oil (1 part or 25%) to wash then drain on a screen (and capture the fluid for next time) and let dry. I'm doing this in batches of a 1000 and it leaves a slight , barely perceptible film on the surface. Just enough that handling 100 slugs will leave a very light oily film on your fingertips. So I'm washing any swarf off and preventing corrosion while reducing fowling, a win in my book.
Note that I found silicone spray is a TERRIBLE lubricant and isn't as slick as you'd think so speed usually drops a bit using it AND it builds up on the surface of the bore and is very hard to completely clean off. Thats what you picked to test but it's not a good choice.
Awesome feedback, sindere thanks. Will have to try this one day.
Only reason to lube them is for dieseling but, it burn out the piston.
What about putting lube on a o.k. grouping pellet to see if Lube will make the group better?
The whole idea is to see if lubing makes them better, a good batch will not need lube because they are already great. The batch I shot with is actually a competition batch, not my no 1 batch, that i will only shoot competitions with. lol.
Please do the same test for slugs in 216,217,218, 219 on the same barrel
Please consider my request.
I don't have all those sizes... will try and do what I have.
@AimSmall
ua-cam.com/video/oV1zljxj8-Q/v-deo.htmlm19s
There is no point in lubing 4.5 mm pellets BECAUSE pellets have very small part of their surface come in conduct with the barrel rifling (head and skirt edges only). For pellets it is more important both head and skirt to fit tight (in that order of importance), not to have deformities on the skirt and not to have factory grease on it (e g. h&n). I do size wash and re lube for the prevention of oxidation cheap chineese pellets (snowpeak) because it worths the trouble (1/3 of purchasing cost with 80% performance compare to JSBs after treatment but only for my .22s. For my power guns (huben &LCS) I cast 38 gr slugs (5.56 & 5.58) and lubing is esential since it makes a significant difference in out of barrel speed (slugs I trapped were untouchable hot)... Also in my Brocock and Cometa guns with 5.52 slugs lubing it's the only way to fit them in... I use Teflon oil with the same technique you described. Never use lube on springers (HW77, HW35, LGV) and sporting guns (Steyr LP10)
maybe it help lubing for precissiom long distance shooting with powerfull airguns. for normal people I dont think it makes any difference
We're the pellets sized and then shot?
Nope, the averages were supposed to sort that out.
Tried that , came to the same conclusion , the only thing I do is weigh the little buggers, my hft air arms loves QYS 4.49 streamlines , but QYS are so consistent out of every 100 pellets I weigh I toss two , best advice just give them a quick visual inspection, , save the wrong ones and shoot the ? Then your understand where I’m coming from ❤