GAIN STAGING: How to Set Proper Levels ITB, Tracking, Master Fader Headroom Easiest Way
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- Опубліковано 9 гру 2014
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A simple video on how to set up a "safe" gain stage in your mix and
why that is important.
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Still relevant and concise years later.
Totally. This is one of the first ones I ever watched and now here I am again!
This is quickly becoming my favourite recording channel. My mixes sound cleaner after going through and adjusting the gain on each track. Thanks!
I've seen lots of tutorial video's on gain staging on youtube, this is by far the best one, explained clearly and simply without being too complicated, another great video from mixbus
Great tutorial. The biggest thing I've been learning lately are basic fundamentals. I can't believe how long I've been pushing my levels too hard and making more work for myself just like you said. Can't wait to put this particular technique to use.
Thanks, David! Your channel is by far one of the BEST and most INFORMATIVE audio engineering channels on here. This was super helpful. Thank you!!
🙏
So happy to find your channel, with so generous step by step explanation. Thanks a lot !👍👍👍👍👍
I recently subscribed because your channel is such a treasure trove of great insight.
I have been a live front-mixer for many years, and I like to think I was pretty good at it (bands paid good money for pretty large gigs anyway, and some direct-from-desk recordings even ended up being mastered for release).
Studio work is quite something else though, and I have so much to learn there... It's really a lot more work as it seems to be all about the sum of well-considered details (the sort of thing you don't have much time for in live situations).
Anyway, thanks for the great content you're putting out there.
I needed this tutorial thanks David
Thank you so mutch for this tutorial! This was trouble me for a long time now and the discussions on the internet was confusing me!
This is a very important video for me personally. Thank you for sharing your expertise.
Nice and thorough thank you for clearly explaining this. It was easy to listen to you because of that. Thanks again!
Man, you are magician. Best lesson ever! Thanks a lot! Cheers from Brazil
thank you very much for the trim improved my mixes
Dave, your helping me a lot. Thank you 😊
David is just A BEAST!!!!!!!!! Don't know why I'm only seing this!!!!!!
Thank you bro. This worked a charm!
Super helpful and informative. Best wishes from Florida.💯🔥
Great lesson!!!🙏🙏🙏
Thanks very much for your tutorial. I am wondering if it would be fine as well to lower gain on group tracks and leave individual track with higher volume.
cool, simple but very important tip. thanks a lot
great tip. THANK YOU
Very informative and helpful tutorial many thanks
Awesome video, thank you
This is the 3rd video I've watched, I really like them.
In your 'stop the hi pass madness' video, you gave a great demonstration on phase shifting and recommended EQ at the bus (instead of individual tracks) for multi-miked tracks. The SSL plugin seems a little hi-powered for just lowering the track level; is there another reason you choose it instead of the Trim plugin? Do you utilize any other of the SSL plugin functions on the individual tracks?
One small thing I will add about what you say at 3:10 regarding running your signal hot. This is totally true if you’re going directly into your AD converter. If you are running through an analog preamp before your AD, there is a trick you can do to get additional saturation from your preamps while still saving as much headroom on your AD converter as you want. Basically you need to put a *passive* attenuator between your preamp and the interface. An example of this would be to put a LittleLabs Redcloud in between your pres and adc. Run the pre’s as hot as you’d like, but reel them in before they hit your converters. Works great to add saturation if you have a good set of preamps. That is all. Great video btw!
great tip. thank you.
Excellent information. Often over looked.
David love your analysis,so simple but right on
great video best so far
This is very important to me I have always made this mistake of not taking proper look into my gain staging making me struggling alot in mixing.thanks so much mixbus tv ♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️
I use reference C-weighted pink noise just to start the mix levels before adding any effects or adding gain to each track these days. Seems to work though to a certain extent.
Great advice. I had to learn this the hard way.
Hopefully, I am accomplishing the same thing by selecting the hot wave events on the playing field and pulling the gain down there. There's a gain control built into each clip, at least in Studio One there is. I don't know about other DAWs.
@@mixbustv Thank you. You are a great explainer. :-)
Great vid thanks brother
Great Video! Wait, couldn't you also adjust your clip gain?
very helpful thank you
Thanks for the video! Very simple and helpful. Now that I know this, if I have done a mix (incorrectly) of my own stuff using the faders, if I now go in and insert plug ins to lower the gain the way you describe, am I going to have to redo my whole mix and adjust all the plug in settings? Obviously compression will have to be adjusted, but are there any exceptions, like maybe EQ, where the input signal doesn't really change what the plug in is doing? Also is there an easier way to do this, for example like a pre bus, or a VCA group, where just one fader or plug in is used? Seems like that should be standard on all DAWs... thanks again
Is this what the 'gain' plugin in Logic is meant to be used for? I use it to make my 2-bus mono for checking phase issues. I use the Sonimus Satson channel on all my channel strips for the gain staging and for gluing the mix together. Thanks for the great videos!
Brilliant!
ChannelStrip plus Insert before Post (in Pre fader) a little cut or larger it depends will improve any audio track a lot. It’s cool to do, use it in the DAW and seeing the Master finally going below 0 and even to -6dB to -8dB!
verry easy thx bro !!!
Nice and simple, thank you. In Cubase the strip allows me to do this without a plugin.
How? I have Cubase 9 Pro. Can you do a YT tutorial on it?
This will save you a lot of time! It will make you realize big sound is... a little goes a long way...
So helpful
Thank you 🙏
simple but very effective
Hello David sir, Excellent videos and best mixing tutorials. I have learned a lot from ur lessons honestly.
I need an advice from you for my following query.
I am sending all my rhythm kit to rhythm bus where I am using SSL G BUS COMPRESSOR. Again i am routing compressed rhythm bus opt to final master mix bus where I am using ML4000 MULTI BAND DYNAMICS. How far it is fair enough to process twice only Rhythm section. What are all d cautions one must look out and plz advice in this situation.
Thanks.
Is this technique as effective or necessary while making beats? Should the new tracks i create be trimmed first also?
is this a good idea to use trim plugins if you have gain pots in your daw?
I am learning a lot from you sir!! Thank you so much!!! I have one question.. would it make a difference i just put one trim plug in on the master bus instead of puting single trim plug ins for every track?
MixbusTV
How about putting a limiter plugin on the master channel? Would it works?
Is this good idea in order to get enough headroom?
10:30 YES!!! THIS!!
great video! wondering why i see so many people importing their tracks into new project files - how come you just didnt keep the audio tracks in the project they were recorded in?
Awsome..merci.
Thanks you brother
Even though I completely agree with don't overthink it. Usually I bring down the individual levels of each track. I like this approach to do it with a plug in!
@@mixbustv What's the difference between using the SSL/Sonalksis plugin and just turning down the fader for each track?
Outstanding. This helped a lot. Makes gain staging a lot easier in Cubase 9.5. Andeven with the default settings, the SSL sound could be heard a bit. Great all in one solution I already bought a while back but not thought of using like this, so mega thanks.
Just related , is it advisable to use a utility plugin on my master to bring the peaks up to -6 before I get mastering?
That's why I like Reason. All that is included on the mixer. No need to add a channel strip 😎
funny how avid is now 32 bit floating point ...steinberg been 32 bit float from conception!! lol
PT is always "just a bit" behind ;).
Thanks for responding to my comment on your other video. Would you create a rough mix thru the gain staging or should you not worry about balance during gain staging?
I do create the rough mix with/while doing gain staging yes.
Thanks for your prompt and fast reply. I request you to do video on Mc DSP ML4000.
I did not find even in their own website. I wd b very happy if u do the proper tutorial on it. Thnx.
You can also lower the gain of wav files from the gain control from the lower left corner of the file on the waveform view and save your cpu usage
About the fader plugin, does the Ableton's stock gain utility tool does the same thing?
do i use waves mono or stereo ssl e channel to gainstage ? i most work with electronic and loops that always are to loud for the most and in stereo so i convert to mono on them like the kick..i use mixcraft 9 for the moment and it dont have mixbuss as in pro tools for say i can not make output tracks and route and so and so on.. submixes yes.. but is mixbuss same as masdterbuss.. ?
great video! But I'm really confused between setting levels to get headroom on the master bus, and off-setting that with trying to hit the sweet spot for insert plugins at 0dbVU. I've callibrated my DAW meter to sit at 0dbVU with -18dBFS (seemingly recommended calibration) and to show the VU and peak levels. On the snare, I'm having to add gain to get it to hit 0dbVU for the sweet spot for insert plugins. But with that added gain, the peak level is clipping on the master...although the VU level is around 0db on the master. So, I'm clipping already! But if I lower the trim on the snare its nowhere near 0dBVU which is recommended for the insert plugins. Perhaps I'm just misunderstanding something but if I gain stage for 0dbVU on individual tracks I have clipping on peak levels. Am I doing something wrong?
What's the difference from lowering the levels in mixer and putting a gain plug in and lowering it in channel strip? I usually highlight all mixer channels and lower uniform.
thanks!
Thanks!!!!!
Great tutorial. I've been gain staging in pro tools by setting the clip gain volume -10db on each tracks individual wav. Is what your doing with the SSL E Channel getting the same result as what I'm doing with the clip gain? Is there different artifacts effecting each sound involved with the 2 different processes? Is it hurting anything quality/sonic wise by gain staging with the clip gain? Do you keep the analog setting on for all tracks so you're getting the SSL Analog Sound across the board? Thanks for sharing this crucial information that isn't talked about much in depth.
Yes. This is exactly my concern. Most plugins tend to change the tone of the sound even without any parameters turned on which slightly goes against the purpose of gain staging.
@@ashwin230492 That's why I gain stage with Clip Gain or a trim plugin...it doesn't change the character of the original sounds. =)
One thing that I never understood about gain staging is what level of db's should I aim for post processing of the audio? If I'm trimming all of my channels down to 10 db should i aim for 6 db or even higher post processing? Or should I keep it closer to 10 and let the mastering bring my mix back to a higher volume?
Can you balance volume of the whole mix first with only the gain staging proces? Afthe that u can fine tune with fader?
So you gain staging your buses aswell with the amount of dB of gain reduction right?
well done
quick question how would i go about mixing a 2 track session? Because sometimes the beats my clients get are really loud as if mastered already, do i just lower it or mix my vocal into the beat?
do you bounce the mix after gainstageing or do you mix direkt after
How do you get your tone booster plug ins to work with pro tools. I didn't see any AAX format, only vst and AU.
This video is excellent and I've see this before in Recording Revolution. I use sonakais (spl?) trimmer for just about everything. However, I have a question about using this plugin. In the video you just adjust the level...am I supposed to set it to "pre" or not? I thought (maybe incorrectly) that one wants to set the minus levels to pre to acomplish this gain staging to create more headroom. Am I incorrect?
Thanks. And thanks for writing back on previous posted questions too. Peace!
Marty
In the lower left of the sonakais underneath the meter next to the fader is a setting that says "pre" I thought I was supposed to click that for prefader. Sorry I can't use the snippet to show you but if you look you will see it. Is it necessary to click or not?
in logic i use the very simple gain utility plugin to gain stage my tracks. uses very little cpu power. also lower virtual synth levels before they hit the mixr
What a great tutorial! I really liked it and i will def do that in my tracks but I have one little question
Is there a difference between adjusting the input signal from the SSL's input level and just dragging down the volume fader?
I got really frustrated in that part so I hope you can reply as fast as possible
As always keep up the good work! Thanks in advance
+MixbusTV How about if I use a limiter (invisible limiter/fabfilter L) and modify the "OUT" parameter to -10/-18 Db. Is that the exact same thing as adjusting the SSL'S input level?
Alright! Thanks
+MixbusTV Jesus Christ. Every f****ng plugin has a gain nob or level control of some sort. Just reduce the damn level with the first insert in the chain. A whole channel strip just to change the gain, that's just ridicules
@@Leo_Berger Watch the video full before commenting mate
quick question what if the beat was all ready mastered and u wanna put vocals on it do you trim the instrumental, or the master bus? please and thank you
I do my gain stage either directly on the faders or on the audio track itself.... is any wrong doing in it? (Depending the case I also use this method of putting a utility tool like a trim as an insert)
Question I’ve never seen master fader sent to a mixbus why is that and where would you add your plugins on mixbus or master fader and why please explain thank you
Can I use Waves NLS fader for this purpose?
Is there a sonic difference if I just batch process normalization an entire selection of clips to equal -10db individually which Is where I have my yellow high break point set on my meters vs adjusting the input stage of the ssl plug?
Yes I know it creates and individual file and takes up space or I could overwrite and that's obviously undoable.
Reason I'm asking is for example the vtm manual says to get the most out of the tape emulation, 0dbfs equals 0dbvu.
Once I analyzed my tracks i would normalize to -.5dbfs or 94.4% normalization. I think sound on sound or tape op had a article about how normalizing can degrade a file if you do 100% normalization so to avoid that, to normalize no more than -.5db.
Then I'd batch process everything through the vtm, then batch process everything to normalize the tracks to equal -10dbfs for the session.
Thoughts?
Very Very good info my man- thanks a bunch- but what I would like to see is a tutorial on gain staging all the way from say the sound card through the DAW- to the monitors (I'm using powered monitors with vol control)--Let me know if you already have one or going to make one-- Thanks in advance
yeah thats what I thought thanks.But what I was referring to is, all the volume knobs like the one on your sound card, the one on Command 8 (Pro-Tools controller) and finally the monitors--how should they be set?...10 o clock, 12 o clock or all the way up
How about the following process? When composing/ starting mixing gain staging against pink noise peaking at -6 dB ie gain staging each individual track so it can be just about heard through. According to my understanding that creates a pretty well balanced starting point with ample headroom. From there adding compression by roughly -2 dB on each track another -2dB on each group bus or -4 dB per track if there is no group bus and finally another -2 dB (-4 dB or so at hardest genres) at the Master and naturally gain compensating for the used compression so it bring the tracks to the desired peak level (again roughly against pink noise) per track and further when played together at the master . Finally from there fine tuning with fader automation for final mix to be bounced into a master which gets the final mastering treatment (eq, saturtion & typically another -2 dB compression if still desired).
GREAT!
GREAT, Just leave good headroom. Drop back each track a bit. Got it.
Great Video ! Great Channel! Great explained!
now I understand. Only one thing I´m confused over and that´s LUFS.
I know that -18 dB is the same as 0 VU, are -23 LUFS also the same? , just Another scale?
OK now I understand, thank you very much !
Hi David, great vid as always man!
I am in working situation with my own packed song (60-70 tracks) and I didn't do gain staging beforehand. I am near to finish the mix (balances done, fight for every Db, every peak manually editing, lots of plugins inserted already etc). And I did all that without knowledge and with -10Db on MASTER fader. What would you advise to do now? Am I assuming correctly that if I put now on every track simple -10Db Trim / Volume plugin and then hear again my mix with reshaping decisions on how things sound I would be ok? I did quite a lot decisions already on peaks edits, eq, compression etc :( Or will I have to start from the beginning again with every decision made on EQ, compression, saturations, peaks removal etc etc
Thanks so much David! Yes it definitely helped. I was clipping on the master like 4-6 Db, but I have been solving individual peaks after master rendering (EQ or velocities or peaks splits etc) over and over again hitting highest peak each time and now I am on -2, -3 Db on master without clipping - also to prepare crest factor and get louder mix for master (hope this is also good way to do it without losing too much dynamics). But I AM in fact on limiter with some individual tracks before they are going to other buses (because after all processing they were slightly clipping max to +1Db). I will have to do something to them to resign from limiting on this early track stage. Maybe KClip them just slightly to lower output without losing balance (cause other tracks are set already with decisions and sit in the mix)? Anyway.. Thanks to this video and earlier ones also now I know how to save my time and nerves later just by putting volume reduction as you said like -10Db each track when unity gain. Thanks! :)
Hi David, i reviseted this video and i want to ask you something, if you want to simulate the analog workflow and push the ssl to the yellows for the harmonic effect, shouldnt been last on your fx chain? and lowering the output o f the plugin to compensate does affect the harmonic distortion or just trims it? speaking always for the waves e channel plugin. thanks in advance
thank you for your reply d., to expand my question if i may...lets say that all our tracks post fx chains are hitting about -18db and we are happy with mix with faders at unity or below, any aditional fx on the master buss (eq,compression) should be first gain staged? and what is a healthy level before aplying limiting assuming we have achieved a good crest factor? i am new to this fun as you realize, thanks again
hi, great vid (I'm new to recording on a PC, usually i do stand alone DAW's)..... just wondering if you turn the volume down 15 to 18 db, will it effect the actual sound quality.... like cutting some of the frequencies because its too soft? if not at 15 to 18db, when does this happen? i dont want to lose any of the dynamics. ..... thanks again
+MixbusTV thanks for the reply, great help. i run my guitar through my Boss br800 at 24bit to record and do the rest in sonar professional (although just working out how to use the pc bassed DAW... so all the info i can get is helpfull)
in what level do you defined as geting in to the yellow?
What if i have lot of busses in mix, should i reduce that too
Thank's Mixbus Tv! How do you calibrate the "meter" for mixing & mastering? like your other videos, trick on Pro tools example -10 for recording session.
I use PT classic metering for both tracks and master track. But for both mixing and mastering I have my meters on my hardware, AD+ in particular also has a zoom in function for better accuracy so, yeah, hardware metering for me.
Scenario question for you............... Lets say i didnt want to use the whole channel strip for this, but i need to adjust Gain of individual channels. What about using the NLS channels? This would also give you the option to route them into NLS sub groups later too.
Also, can you maybe list a few for just gain adjustment that are really low on CPU usage? Im running NI Komplete Ultimate 10, some Waves and Klanghelm stuff
Thanks for this vid. Can you help me understand something? So the goal is to record everything at a mid level right? Not too hot but not to low as well. Maybe a good db would be -12 or somewhere around there correct? Then from there you may want to lower all your levels for the whole song so that the master fader isn’t clipping and you have room to add plugins. After this, what would you say is the ideal dB level your masterfader should be at before bouncing out to have mastered? And then following this, what db level are mastered tracks at for the final master? I’m trying to wrap my head around this.
MixbusTV ok thanks. So I’ll record everything into the daw at an ideal mid level and keep the faders at unity. But once I start to mix everything I can adjust the faders as needed to taste and also to stop any clipping on the master correct? And then next, what is the ideal master level dB when I have all the faders leveled to taste before bouncing out to go to the master phase? Does is matter or do you want a lot of headroom before sending it off to mastering? Lastly, since I will try to do mastering myself, what is the ideal final dB any given track should be at to be radio ready? Sorry if I’m being a little repetitive.
Would it not be better to record relatively hot (but not near clipping) and then lower the initial level of each track ITB with gain plug-ins? So the recordings themselves each have maximum S/N, but then you lower the gain of that strong signal in post, so you are not affecting the S/N of the recording? Doesn't that make more sense?
I usually lower the master fader to a reasonable level where the signals are mostly in the green area. I have heard it changes "the bit rate"...but everything I read points to the other direction.
I am not sure if it's right or not. do you have any clue? thank you.
After doing this all.....
When I put some eq comp the mid buss start clipping
What should I do please help