43:00 - This unit can perform a 1-hex retreat because they retreated into bocage (also because they retreated onto a friendly unit of equal or greater strength).
1:59:38 - If the glider unit's landing hex is fully stacked, then they land during the Allied player movement phase (you have a chance to make room and they still land in turn 2). They are only delayed to turn 3 if the hex is enemy occupied or if you are unable to move units out to make room.
59:38 - Engineers (and HQs) are free stacking units, so they don't count toward your stacking limit. Also, having an engineer unit in either hex of the beach opens the entire beach. Arriving units can land in either hex.
Super helpful. While I already ordered Dark Summer, it’s nice to see comparisons. So many choices for this particular conflict. I always had my eye on this one until I played Dark Valley. That game was an absolute joy (once my feeble brain absorbed the rules). His designs are cool and if I can follow them, I’ll lean toward choosing his designs for different topics. Great job!!
Just watched this tonight as on my first solo, having received 3rd ed on p500. Bloody heck mate. That invasion turn was like an alt-history horror flick. Brutal! Think I might have flipped the table and rage quit. In solo. Damn dice gods! Great channel though, always good content.
I question the use of Naval Support in the Determined Dense of the 82 Airbourne- wasn't the Support outside of the Naval Bombardment Zone limit (dashed blue line on the map) ? As described in this video at the time of 46:10.
Really appreciate this comparison! Have the 3rd printing of Normandy ’44 on p500 coming. Since there’s around 7000 D-Day games I’ve been very selective, so once this arrives it will complete the want list…for now. 😊
Thanks for the excellent play through and commentary. Now I know what NOT to do!! Suggest you swap out the dice. Getting ready to get the newest version on the table. This video is very helpful Thanks
Seems like you opted for an up-front German defense on GT1. In my experience this can be risky. Very interesting developments. I tend towards building a net of ZOC-bonds around the Allied front. In Bocage, woods, towns, cities, you only have to retreat one hex if combat goes badly. And recovery is automatic. Makes for a slow grind of a game. Of course, I often forget the one-hex retreat rule....:) This might be the fiddliest '4X game.
For each hit should the airborne not get a replacement step put in the replacement table much like Arnhem 44. Also should you not be paying movement for leaving a ZOC?
Maybe you could and should share where the correct hexes should be for the 6AB then rather than just make a comment that the landing areas are incorrect.
TDSN just arrived 3 days ago. Very much enjoyed your first play through of that - and 2nd play through yet to watch. Nor many ‘44 is ordered on P500.... Quite different games from the players’ PT of view. Learned a lot about pace of play for Allies from your TDSN play through. Gams such as these sure need to be played a time or two to both learn the mechanics and the “schedule” to push towards victory!! Thank you for sharing these play-throughs - newly subscribed.
40:09 - You should have only had 5 US airborne replacements instead of 8. You only get 1 replacement per unit, even if they lost 2 steps. Also, your British airborne units only lost 2 steps, not 4.
Are you sure there's a 3rd edition of the rules at the GMT site? I think there's a 2nd edition, but with errata corrections included - not a 3rd edition. GMT N44 [second edition] game is at the printers right now.
Hopefully Mark will have an expansion of this game through COBRA and the Falaise Pocket. I suppose you could also modify this into a chit pull type of game which would be interesting. Also I recently received my hard map of NORMANDY 44. Really nice. I missed out on the hard map for Ardennes 44 and Holland 44. IF YOU SNOOZE YOU LOSE. I hope that GMT will consider printing hard maps for UKRAINE 43 and STALINGRAD 42. Those are tremendous games.
Would you be willing to share how you store the counters? I have a GMT Counter tray and I’m looking for an efficient way to store them so as to minimize the time it takes to set up the board for a play through.
Yeah I use my 3d printed trays shown here: ua-cam.com/video/WEgqm4sUYxg/v-deo.html I then organise by the two sides, then by turn/date of entry [or start/replacement] and that's about it.
wow.... those allied rolls were brutal.. how many 1's did you roll... maybe time for a new dice or something... just extreme losses. That should give the German a little bit of hope then...
the weather seems to dominate the outcome of this game. I Played as the Germans and only once were storms rolled. most of the days were clear. Impossible to stop the allies in clear after clear after clear weather! You said the Germans won once when the allies had horrendous weather. There is an historical weather outcome with some randomization that accounts for at most and at least one storm sequence. Maybe that is the way to go but overall this campaign is not the most interesting of the series. thanks for the vid!
Im pretty new to wargames and im not sure I like the counter density of the Dark Summer vs this... looks like a lot of admin. I think I could grok the more advanced rules in favour of the chit party of the Dark Summer. What are your thoughts on this?
Yeah the additional rules aren't too cumbersome. I'd rank them both as 'mid-weight' games. It really comes down to what 'feel' you want, a tense back and forth game (TDS), or a stronger simulation (N44).
@@WiseGuyHistory Thanks for your thoughts. Ive watched your DS playthroughs now and correct me if im wrong but im not seeing too much action for the German player other than fighting withdrawals. Is that the nature of the beast when it comes to DDay type games?
@@chadvader974 This is a good question. Without going into too much detail, I think once you get to regimental/divisional scale, I don't think there's a lot the Germans can do. To get a sense of those counter attacks, I think you need to drill down, ideally to company level. You could look at the German counter-attack at Carentan, or the 21st Panzer Division's attack on 6 June, or the 'Saga of the 6th Airborne' east of the Orne. All of those are best covered I think at company level where the Germans are very active. On a broad scale like this though, the Germans are mainly playing a delaying/slowing game, waiting for the inevitable push back...
Thanks for your thorough playthrough incl replacement, reinforcement and all. Very helpful for a solo player new to this game.
43:00 - This unit can perform a 1-hex retreat because they retreated into bocage (also because they retreated onto a friendly unit of equal or greater strength).
1:59:38 - If the glider unit's landing hex is fully stacked, then they land during the Allied player movement phase (you have a chance to make room and they still land in turn 2). They are only delayed to turn 3 if the hex is enemy occupied or if you are unable to move units out to make room.
58:28 - For reinforcements coming in, the landing hex counts as the first hex of movement.
1:11:30 - There are Regroup markers to indicate which units came on as reinforcements.
59:38 - Engineers (and HQs) are free stacking units, so they don't count toward your stacking limit. Also, having an engineer unit in either hex of the beach opens the entire beach. Arriving units can land in either hex.
Super helpful. While I already ordered Dark Summer, it’s nice to see comparisons. So many choices for this particular conflict. I always had my eye on this one until I played Dark Valley. That game was an absolute joy (once my feeble brain absorbed the rules). His designs are cool and if I can follow them, I’ll lean toward choosing his designs for different topics. Great job!!
This is a beautiful map and I love the counters. I'm enjoying this let's play.
1:50:58 - It looks like the three strongpoints and the Ost unit near Sword beach are OOS.
Just watched this tonight as on my first solo, having received 3rd ed on p500. Bloody heck mate. That invasion turn was like an alt-history horror flick. Brutal! Think I might have flipped the table and rage quit. In solo. Damn dice gods! Great channel though, always good content.
I question the use of Naval Support in the Determined Dense of the 82 Airbourne- wasn't the Support outside of the Naval Bombardment Zone limit (dashed blue line on the map) ? As described in this video at the time of 46:10.
Yes I suspect you're right, this was one of my earlier playthroughs and may be a bit rough.
Really appreciate this comparison! Have the 3rd printing of Normandy ’44 on p500 coming. Since there’s around 7000 D-Day games I’ve been very selective, so once this arrives it will complete the want list…for now. 😊
Thanks for the excellent play through and commentary. Now I know what NOT to do!! Suggest you swap out the dice.
Getting ready to get the newest version on the table. This video is very helpful
Thanks
Seems like you opted for an up-front German defense on GT1. In my experience this can be risky. Very interesting developments. I tend towards building a net of ZOC-bonds around the Allied front. In Bocage, woods, towns, cities, you only have to retreat one hex if combat goes badly. And recovery is automatic. Makes for a slow grind of a game. Of course, I often forget the one-hex retreat rule....:) This might be the fiddliest '4X game.
For each hit should the airborne not get a replacement step put in the replacement table much like Arnhem 44. Also should you not be paying movement for leaving a ZOC?
None of the Normandy games - except The Greatest Day - model the 6AB area of operations correctly.
Maybe you could and should share where the correct hexes should be for the 6AB then rather than just make a comment that the landing areas are incorrect.
TDSN just arrived 3 days ago. Very much enjoyed your first play through of that - and 2nd play through yet to watch.
Nor many ‘44 is ordered on P500....
Quite different games from the players’ PT of view.
Learned a lot about pace of play for Allies from your TDSN play through. Gams such as these sure need to be played a time or two to both learn the mechanics and the “schedule” to push towards victory!!
Thank you for sharing these play-throughs - newly subscribed.
GMT Normandy '44 is at the printer.
40:09 - You should have only had 5 US airborne replacements instead of 8. You only get 1 replacement per unit, even if they lost 2 steps. Also, your British airborne units only lost 2 steps, not 4.
Are you sure there's a 3rd edition of the rules at the GMT site? I think there's a 2nd edition, but with errata corrections included - not a 3rd edition. GMT N44 [second edition] game is at the printers right now.
Oh, my mistake, it's a '3rd printing' of the 2nd edition. Sorry!
Is there an expansion of this map that goes more inland???
No, you'll have to look at other titles for that. Atlantic Wall has a pretty large footprint.
Hopefully Mark will have an expansion of this game through COBRA and the Falaise Pocket. I suppose you could also modify this into a chit pull type of game which would be interesting. Also I recently received my hard map of NORMANDY 44. Really nice. I missed out on the hard map for Ardennes 44 and Holland 44. IF YOU SNOOZE YOU LOSE. I hope that GMT will consider printing hard maps for UKRAINE 43 and STALINGRAD 42. Those are tremendous games.
Would you be willing to share how you store the counters? I have a GMT Counter tray and I’m looking for an efficient way to store them so as to minimize the time it takes to set up the board for a play through.
Yeah I use my 3d printed trays shown here: ua-cam.com/video/WEgqm4sUYxg/v-deo.html
I then organise by the two sides, then by turn/date of entry [or start/replacement] and that's about it.
wow.... those allied rolls were brutal.. how many 1's did you roll... maybe time for a new dice or something... just extreme losses. That should give the German a little bit of hope then...
the weather seems to dominate the outcome of this game. I Played as the Germans and only once were storms rolled. most of the days were clear. Impossible to stop the allies in clear after clear after clear weather! You said the Germans won once when the allies had horrendous weather. There is an historical weather outcome with some randomization that accounts for at most and at least one storm sequence. Maybe that is the way to go but overall this campaign is not the most interesting of the series. thanks for the vid!
Im pretty new to wargames and im not sure I like the counter density of the Dark Summer vs this... looks like a lot of admin. I think I could grok the more advanced rules in favour of the chit party of the Dark Summer. What are your thoughts on this?
Yeah the additional rules aren't too cumbersome. I'd rank them both as 'mid-weight' games. It really comes down to what 'feel' you want, a tense back and forth game (TDS), or a stronger simulation (N44).
@@WiseGuyHistory Gah, I really cant decide. Does TDS have any rules for the paradrops?
@@chadvader974 Not really, they're just 'placed' in a hex.
@@WiseGuyHistory Thanks for your thoughts. Ive watched your DS playthroughs now and correct me if im wrong but im not seeing too much action for the German player other than fighting withdrawals. Is that the nature of the beast when it comes to DDay type games?
@@chadvader974 This is a good question. Without going into too much detail, I think once you get to regimental/divisional scale, I don't think there's a lot the Germans can do. To get a sense of those counter attacks, I think you need to drill down, ideally to company level. You could look at the German counter-attack at Carentan, or the 21st Panzer Division's attack on 6 June, or the 'Saga of the 6th Airborne' east of the Orne. All of those are best covered I think at company level where the Germans are very active. On a broad scale like this though, the Germans are mainly playing a delaying/slowing game, waiting for the inevitable push back...
no sound?
never mind lol headphones not on
The Commonwealth infantry is Division level
You need a dice roller.