GW thinks their games are like trading card games. Ignoring the fact that their plastic is far more expensive, requires building, painting, and learning to play.
They think their games are like AAA videogames. They essentially do DLC, have seasons, new editions of basically the same games... they would do an edition per year if they could get away with it.
@@christopheraaron1255 exactly. Stakeholders will have the company milk the customer to the point ruining the relationship. Being forced into what becomes an subscription (which tjey recently launched on their own) is just putting me off and I will not get into playing the table top games. I want to get invested.. but not with my whole life benching my family amd the rest of my life.
The game isn't the point anymore. It's all about pushing the franchise and lore. Unfortunately WH is a complex game system that doesn't sell well to masses, and so is kind of relegated to a niche audience. They've already massively altered the game in the few last editions and will probably be super-simplified and Skyrim-ized in the near future.
Yep. Every single time someone talks me into getting into their stuff again, they go and pull stuff like this, repeatedly. I picked up the AoS Darkoath army box set because they looked cool and got me interested in finally trying AoS, only to have GW keep pulling crap like this. Every time I hear about them for the last several months, they've come across as mustache-twirling villains. I'm going to sell off the last of my GW stuff, including that unopened box set, and switch to Mantic Games' lines.
99% of my 40k stuff has been sold off already apart from a few choice models I have kept. I do still have my AoS armies because I still like my Daughters of Khaine. I even have a very good friend that handed his 40k stuff off on me to sell...just waiting for the rest of it before I start putting all of that on ebay.
I don't understand why people are still playing GW rules at all, when there are dozens of other (often similar) games to play the models with. That or just play old editions - with paper, secondary market, look-alike or 3dprinted models - all of which are far cheaper.
Except there arent lot of people who play those older edition games or alternate games compared to the current 40k. Most people want to play the latest version, you are going to have a hard time getting people to play a older version of the game. So people such as yourself love saying this stuff when its not baked into reality. Are there people who would? Yes however good luck finding or making those groups. If you got lucky then fantastic. The average person would have a hard time doing so without considerable effort into basically selling people on the idea and getting people to invest into it. GW always like saying you can always play a older codex... Yeah right good luck on that.
I think for many people it's lore, mostly. And there are some folks have been around since, oh, 2nd edition - back when GW actually took records of who played which game seriously. My army was part of the 2nd battle of Armageddon, which felt super cool. Other games, even with the same miniatures, kinda just don't feel the same. Competitive play, match play, all this stuff since ~7th Ed feels gross to most of the older players I know, who long for the return of true "narrative" play, and remember the days of battles that spanned entire rooms (with people shooting from one table to another - that kind of thing) being promoted and recorded by GW.
Not to mention it's super hard to convince new people to get into the older game modes, at best you are sharing books and such, plus it's easy to say "Well just 3d print everything" Well not everyone wants to spend months printing off models with toxic fumes especially if they don't live alone, and plastic is getting better but it's still not great looking and having computer running day and night just to get an army going is insanity.
Your comment is perfectly reasonable and yes you should be able to define your own games and rule set by this stage. However you are up against a mass brainwashing machine with lots of fanboys who cry foul and shoot down any common sense. Why ? Who knows, you get the same lot defending PC games that do nothing but shit on their fan base.
The Middle Earth SBG ruleset is genuinely good, maybe that's what people play it? There are plenty of free or alternative rulesets out there today, but not everyone of them is satisfying.
- Started up Battlefleet Gothic in 2010, just got a gameable fleet together in 2013 - Started up Wood Elves in 2013, just got a gameable army together in 2014-2015 - Went back to 40k in 2016-2017ish just in time for that one to go away too. I think I might have some inkling of your pain yes.
Had 50k of WFB Dwarfs, AoS hit and wiped us out. Then they make 2 new factions of "Dwarfs" while also killing off most the characters, rules and lore of the OGs. I feel the pain of loss yeah
As a Dark Elf and Sacrosanct chamber player, you may have a seat next to me at the bar. I'll buy a drink of your choice. Then we can have a game of Age of Fantasy with our miniatures :)
I hate to say this as it sucks but unless you are playing in GW tournaments you can still play the current edition. I certainly will be as I'm not a tournament player.
That much is fact they even don't care about the lore, that has been built to be retconed at any point. Nothing is set in stone, it could be all propaganda about the empire fighting off the warp gate instead its some type of star child he found or captured.. The lore possibility is endless
… and Battletech basically have the same rules for 40 years. Unfortunately, I got into the Horus Heresy: Age Of Darkness and I’m not going to talk about them basically feeling like they have giving upon it.
So does The Sword and the Flame. It's still the go -to for colonial games, whether at conventions or in my local historicals group. First came out in 1979, the 2nd/3rd edition has been out since 1999 and barely changed anything except adding a variant for jungle warfare.
yeah, but trying to convince my warhammer playing friends that keeping track of heat dispersal,armour damage, system damage and ammo for a lance of mechs is super fun has yet to work.
Sorry OP I don't get it. I tried HH and loved it honestly, especially because GW is not pushing out things at a 40k rate. There's plenty of rules/missions to try and quite a lot of minis. Yes resin ones are GW-like expensive but you can proxy with 3d printed stuff...
id love to do 3d printing, but unfortunately im probably not gonna be great at sculpting, and finding stl files online is gonna be hard. like i really dont wanna spend 10 hours on one mini trying to get it perfect
@@troffle Yuo can glue a normal space marine together in like 5 mins, or less, depending on if you care about mold lines. Can paint one in an hour(or less if you just do a simple job). Depending on how you paint, you might want to do them in sections, so having a one piece model isn't always a good thing. Printing is essentially a poor mans choice, you swap a shitload of time, to get a small monetary benefit. The only place where printing is effective, if you pay for someone else to print for you.
@@AlexTempest523first point, you don't have to be great at digital sculpting and you learn pretty quickly as you go anyway from making minor tweaks. Second point, type into Google a unit type followed by STL and watch how many you find, it's a lot. Right now I'm rocking some traitor guard along with a commissar (whatever that model is called) and his ogryn who's going to get all nurgled up before I print. A lot of models are the official sculpts that have been 3d scanned too.
GW and Hasbro have taken the fun and spirit out of what they started doing. We all know what they are about nowadays. And it's grim. It's dark. It's probably margins. You won't see Tyranids fucking each other over percentages.
SBG is over 20 years old, and in all that time, GW has supported ALL of their existing models with each rules update - until now. The ridiculous thing is that people like me who own a vast collection have been wishing for updated figures due to the age of many of the plastic models from the first few years, such as Numenor, Rivendel Elves, Mordor Orcs, Moria Goblins, etc. So, rather than do that, they eliminate large swaths of models, most newer than those! The only good thing they are doing is the revision to the Rohan foot troops and Duland Wildmen. Hell, when I saw that they were doing that, I said that I'd buy the new box without question! But somewhere along the line, they decided to eliminate models and rules for models, not to introduce new ones, but just to reduce the overall number of profiles within the game. Since they've demonstrated a frustrating inability to keep up production, they are telling us that if we are proxying models for profiles they no longer make figures for, they won't start producing the models, they'll eliminate the profile instead. The elimination of the new Dunland figures and is probably the lowest blow that comes with this announcement. I bought all of the leader models, but proxied the troops because they were just too stupidly expensive. Guess I made the right decision there. Anyway, huge disappointment. The MESBG community and the GW team used to have a good relationship. Thanks to BIG GW Management, and this announcement, that is dead.
This is exactly why I keep walking towards GW stores and then turning away at the final moment. I just don’t want to get financially and dare I say emotionally invested into something where there is no certainty what I pick will become redundant. I refuse to buy books directly from Black Library anymore after the Heresy book FOMO just got out of hand. Finally, i do so adore your voice. ❤
Bro just to homebrew with the boi ive had a traitor guard army for years ive also never played a real game of 40k because why would i balancing sucks new editions nuked modles homebrew of of 8th has been solid whole custom armor system and all
...................and who is actually surprised? It's GW, you keep up, shut up, take it or move along like the peasant you are perceived as. We are not the customer, the shareholders are. We are merely the resource being mined. And folks have made it very clear to GW that they will take anything, GW has been trying to find the breaking point for nearly a decade now. We aren't there yet, so they will keep pushing till they find it or 3D printing tech truly catches up with therm.
I found out about Marcher from Golden Dragon and backed their Kickstarter. It doesn't have the sheer brand power of Warhammer, but I remember when Warhammer writers were still talking about making tanks out of deoderant bottles, so I have hope this could develop into an honestly viable alternative to Warhammer.
Didn't play 9th and didnt care for 10th either. Been working on a sweet 3rd/4th ed 40k Orks and loving every moment of it. Sadly no one wants to play old school 40k 😢 I will admit i did buy some TOW resin models on the GW store that were crazy high priced on eBay for 10 years....
Right? I'm currently downsizing my collection to the 3rd/4th edition era of 40k but it will just be a passion project. The locals treat every weekend like it's a GT. Not a fan.
Proud 3rd/4th ed Tau player over here! There's more of us around than you might think! I've even managed to build up a faithful 2004hammer group at the local gaming store.
3rd edition was my peak. Fell in love with Salamanders. They were new and different and I bought the Armageddon Salamanders army box and played them up through the 13th Black Crusade campaign. I looked into the current edition WH40K and was not impressed. I took out all my 3rd edition codexes , rule books and armies. It's quite popular at the game stores seeing all these ancient artifacts on the table and everyone seeing how it used to be. The biggest awe I ever got was when I told them at the time 200 bucks got me a 5 man command squad , two 10 man troop units , a 5 man assault squad , a 5 man terminator unit , a rhino with upgraded armour and a predator tank
games workshop doesnt care because their customers will still be there spending huge amounts of money for their overpriced stuff regardless of how poorly they are treated
Anyone else jumping on Trench Crusade? I am impressed with the amount of people that are going to be there to be challenged by my armed forces once we have gotten the rules and regulations so we can begin organising meeting to resolve dice rolls and share our armies so unless I have already missed it why hasn’t Discourse mentioned this game before, yet, at all?
I get why they are upending a chunk of the lord of the rings games, like I imagine the amount of people buying into some of these nicher lord of the rings armies that largely only exist because they wanted to flesh out some guys with a few lines of text from the book, which is a shame because we got some interesting guys that way. And the lord of the rings game was one I wanted to get into largely just to collect and paint but now it's less likely, frankly maybe they could space out giving every game a new edition, this is like the 3rd or 4th new edition this year
Well duh, it's about keeping the movie rights. Looks the usual Strong Female Protagonist, and they have a greek name to boot. It's like a saxon name in a place based of greece
I appreciate they cannot run a model forever(did we really need 13 flavours of landraider?), they don't respect legends though. It'd be ok if they actually supported all their old junk.
If GW ever accepts that 3d printing is a significant part of the future of the hobby, I hope they'd start by providing STLs of their old and discontinued minis. They could 3d scan the copies they have (with a bit of digital clean up) to create the STLs. It's just sad to me from an archiving perspective that we lose these little works of art to history. And history becomes legend. Legend becomes myth. And the minis pass out of knowledge. :(
Surely letting people use all or most old minis (if the unit exists in the rules) and selling the stls while offering 'high quality' models for people not wanting to buy a 3d printer could get more people in to the hobby than the current BS which has kept people like me from buying anything from them for 23 ish years would still produce a viable business model.
Not going to lie I would absolutely love for Games Workshop to go completely and totally out of business let the community take care of balancing the existing games, and left the 3D modeling Community take care of model Productions those asshats in Nottingham need absolutely nothing to do with the games anymore
Or it could all just be a licensing issue. Embracer bought Middle Earth Enterprises just before the release of Battle for Osgiliath. They could be wanting to withhold the rights for the Middle-Earth as a whole for themselves and only be allowing GW for something based on War of the Rohorrim film.
I do think a lot of it is connected to the movies, but not because of licencing. GW traditionally works pretty close with Peter Jackson and WETA and have a lot of inside information about what's going to happen in the movies long before we do. I suspect a lot of what was cut is stuff that conflicts with how they're going to be represented in future movies. For example GW developed Khand all by themselves, if Khand ends up featuring in a movie they'll probably be completely different.
I think you will find many of the removals are figures not seen in the movies and the license with new line is under much more scrutiny. When GW got the license originally they largely could do whatever they wanted but now that embracer owns tolkein enterprises that is no longer the case. This mirrors the golden daemon controversary from Essen where a Gollum mini that was altered was excluded from the contest.
@@pskovca I doubt it, honestly. There's too many other things GW created themselves and added in like Gulavhar and Burdhur that are showing no signs of being removed from the game.
On the legacy side of things, a lot of non-GW tournaments have already said they will most likely allow Legacy armies/miniatures at least for the short term once the changes come in - it's not the first time the community has kept Middle-earth alive on the tabletop for GW. On the removable of miniatures; it obviously sucks for people who own these armies are in the middle of collecting them BUT by their own justification, they are streamlining the range to remove a lot of miniatures/characters that either didn't show up in the movies or were semi-creations of GW themselves - named Ringwraith miniatures etc. It "makes sense" if they're looking to make the game more approachable for someone stepping in for the first time come the new edition. Plus, maybe a rights issue maybe... I don't appreciate losing Balin, Floi and some of the best ways to run my Khazad-dum armies BUT I play primarily with friends and can just use the legacy rules. I've also been collecting the game since it released so I'm not as hard hit by the removal of miniatures as some. However, I can see why they are doing this and I kinda think we're in for some (good) surprises when the new edition lands. For example, whilst Dunland in its current form are being removed, we have new Dunlending Warriors coming with the boxed set and characters from the War Of The Rohirrim era. So, not gone entirely. Additonally, whilst we might be losing certain heroes and troops from other factions, a LOT of them were in Finecast and/or metal and GW are moving away from that so there's that production element to it as well. There's no reason to think we won't get new plastic options for some similar troops etc in the future - especially with them redoing the Rohirrim currently. I also have faith in the design team behind the game because they've been steering the ship right for a good few years now. Will it be misplaced? I suppose we'll have to wait and see. Obviously TLDR but lastly, yes, totally agree on getting 3D printable miniatures to fill gaps in your collection. Medbury Miniatures are superb as well as a host of other 3D printing companies. There's no shortage of 3D printable (and physically printed via merchant) options out there.
"Anime" is really just a word that means... cartoon from Japan. They're cartoons, but because that's all the word means, it covers a wide range. Some of it is Disney stuff fun for the kids, mainly the Ghibli stuff Disney themselves have been translating for years (well until they stopped). Some of it is some serious guy making people's heads explode in gore, or future X-men kids turning into cyber-goo. And... a lot... way too much, is this modern utter garbage with names like "Hey I had This Weird Dream where My Uncle, no not that uncle, turned into a giant spider and ate my friends." Fortunately, the Lord of the Rings one doesn't appear to be falling into ANY of that nonsense that you seem to explicitly fear it becoming. Give it a chance. If they have people suddenly cutting away to do super cutesy emoji faces or go for some annoying oversexualization, well I'll be as disappointed as you, but it really doesn't seem to be going that route. I guess in short, yes most anime is utter trash (including the big three, yes every single one of them), but 90% of everything is trash, and this one looks like it may be a diamond in the rough.
The only people this hurts are people obsessed with war gaming that have loads of plastic and always get new stuff. Casuals will usually get a and be happy with basic factions forever. Obsessive people will continue to buy stuff anyways. So no loss on gw...
Well, I went from 3rd to 10th without ever having used Gravity guns on my space marines. Still after all this time they felt like they weren’t there lore wise and added for gameplay, and left no impact outside of tournaments
I watched you last video about this. Then i went to the guard section and I didn’t see the Valkyrie and then I thought holy cow she’s right their getting rid of it but then I found it 🤣.
I'm in the same camp as a great many commentators below; I've stopped buying GW products, completely. The tragedy for GW is, now I am retired, I have more disposable income for my war gaming. This decision by GW about Lord of the Rings, it's nothing new, of late, but it's another 'own-goal'. I was about to restock my LOTR collection, replace almost everything. Now, not a chance. But the LOTR decision is just one of many now by GW Management. The issue for me is their policy of pursuing uncertainty of supply. FOMO only works IF the supplier will restock within a timeframe people playing need stock. What is happening now with GW is, you aren't guaranteed stock access, EVEN ON the day of release. Worse, too often, even if you did buy that box that day, there is no follow-up and completion of the genre with supplementary/complimentary ranges of new stock supporting the first 'box'. The fact that multi-part figures only go together a certain, limited, way; the fact that boxes that once held a character figure and 40 weapon, equipment and other options no longer exist; the fact that prices are through the roof; these have all killed the GW brand name. Sure, I'm complaining about a company that makes toy soldiers, so my gripes are all First World tantrums, but it is a tragedy to see GW end up this way, especially as I had been buying their product for 30 years. I acknowledge too, it's a business. I respect that. But GW, rightly or wrongly, now projects an image of a money-gouging enterprise these days; it's not customer friendly, nor is it the great game company I once could rely upon.
every company on the market has good and bad years, I have been collecting my collection for over 20 years and I trust GW, of course, sometimes things don't work out as expected for companies, and GW will be able to correct these mistakes in the collection😉
May I suggest that you find local sculpture and crafters to make your own models, keep your former codex's and get with other players to create "garage game" communities. It will support local artists and maybe stores while cutting GW out of the picture.
I know I come here and often say the same things, but this just isn't new for GW. We can be upset and act surprised--but come on. GW has been at things like this since the 90s. They simply do not care (IMO based on following GW since Rogue Trader days) what their customers think or complain about, just as long as the keep selling their minis. So, you can talk until you are blue in the face, and it will change absolutely nothing. The only thing you can do is vote with your wallet, and until enough people do that, it is business as usual.
I walked into a GW shop and asked the guy that greeted me about *Imperial Knights.* He showed me the box and when I saw the price, I blurted out loud *"You're taking the piss!?"* I looked at other factions and their prices to see if it was a one off thing, it was not... I left a minute later, even the staff member looked like he understood my reaction.
At this rate my group's move back to 8th edition (with certain allowances for newer minis) during covid lockdown is not only proving more and more successful with getting new players than any other version of WH but is proving to be downright prescient as models continue to get kyboshed. I run a lot of FW Orks so for me joining this group was mandatory, in fact the only reason I was allowed in was because I played Orks there is a que for my group and you can go months without getting in it and probably never if you're space marines. Best part is GW doesn't get more money to fund further bad choices. Win win.
I just decreased buying warhammer by around 60-70% each month and focused on collecting 1/6th scale figures. I'm waiting for my InArt Aragorn this week ❤
Miniature war gaming out side GW is a niche within a niche. Idk how she is finding people to play like war machine or what ever. I have a hard time finding combat patrol games where I live and I live in a pretty big city.
this, i keep reading people on comment sections suggest to play other games but lets be real who tf play those games?? (or even know they exist) warhammer is already extremely niche, and they are the de-facto monopoly on the hobby, same goes with 3d printing, you're not allowed to enter games stores with that
I personally don't care about MESBG but this is absolutely sad to hear. Especially as an AoS fan with the "old world squatting" of BoC and Bonesplitterz. Oh and to everyone saying "just 3D print!" Or "just play the old edition!" 3D printing is fairly expensive to get into and requires its own dedicated space, which I don't have available. For any wargame, the majority of the community will by default switch to the newest edition. Walk into your local store with 9th edition 40k or 3rd edition AoS rules and try and get a game in. Chances are you're stuck sitting there watching people play the current edition
I looked at getting into Warhammer way back in the 80s. Very expensive, and I never followed. I did buy a couple of models, Eldar Hyper Bike and a couple others, they look more sci fi than fantasy, that was it.
And I still have the classic lotr magazines with a bunch of models still on their sprues. I will try to 3d scan them for everyone! Its not piracy if they don’t make them any more
I'm starting to think I need to stock up on any First Born minis I want NIB. I gotta feeling they will be gone in 11th Edition. Great editing on this video tho, definitely LOLed.
I know the feeling. Was a bretonnian player back when the west fell. I know what it’s like. They will bring them back someday. Love your content. One of the true one of the brave !
i just couldn't jump on board the games workshop thing, even without collecting you can see its a nightmare to get all the minis in the range, and the price is crazy.. compared to other ranges its crazy. its the star bucks of table top lol..
Okay hear me out. Let’s get an independent version of 10th together for all the casual players who might also have lost a lot of their minis due to recent updates. Let’s create an compendium with all units and a rule set which is static. That would mean no stress about constantly adjusting your army. Just pickup and play. Your army is playable today and in 2 years. We just need to freeze the rules and collect all of the datasheets in one place to create a 40K CASUAL 10th Library. Who is in? 🙂
The garbage rules and mass-squatting of datasheets, wargear, and models has killed all my interest in Warhammer. Honestly at this point I'm debating learning 3d modeling and making entire homebrew rulesets just to replace the things that GW has Thanos snapped out of existence.
I stopped playing MTG for this reason but on a different scale. They release a new set almost weekly, it seems like. My LGS does nothing but drafts for the new sets for the month. Then they ban cards quite often forcing you to buy buy buy. Go home from a $20 draft on Friday night with cards I'll never use again. It got extremely old.
This is an unpopular opinion, but one of the brakes on growth is the sheer complexity of their miniatures now. GW used to recruit kids into the hobby and win them over for life, but now it's virtually impossible for those kids to enter. Price is a massive facor obviously, but another big one is that because all their miniatures are sculpted to allow Golden Daemon entrants to shine, they're also so complex that they're all but impossible for a new painter, especially a kid, to do a 'decent' job of. One reason Spess Mehreens used to be so popular was that every new person started with them because they were easy to paint, and so people could get an endorphin rush of painting it and feeling good. Now that every square nanometer of the model is draped in bling new painters can't get a result that looks ok, it always looks really bad even to them. GW needs to save the bling for selected models and ensure that basic ranges are as accessible as they used to be. And yeah, they need to stop retiring models all the time.
That's not only a problem for GW it's a general problem within the system of our economy. It's full of delusional concepts and paradoxes. Worked in "the industry" ( mostly international scm ) for over 20 yrs and it's "impossible" all over. Could tell horror-stories.. unbelieveable stuff .. for hours. But one of my faovurite stories I tell my students is kind of what Discourse is talking about. On ceo/coo levels of a company you don't want ANY warehousing. Warehousing means you have to buy or rent space and have employees taking care of the movements of the product. You don't want full shelves. Because full shelves means every product is "dead capital" because it's not sold yet. Empty shelves on the other hand is something you also don't want. All the empty space means you pay for empty space you don't use. In your perfect corporate-world you'd love to don't have a warehouse. You do only "Just-in-time" -business to cut cost. But if you'd do that you have the problem that you certainly can't supply every customer you might have because we don't have teleportation yet. It's paradox all over and this isn't even the tip of the iceberg. When I start going deeper into territory where in business-calculations the time between your product arriving at the warehouse... and it's arrival on the stock-shelves.. is zero.... than we go into the true madness of international wholeselling.
I mean, what’s stopping people from playing with homebrew/old rules with their gaming circles? If your friends are cool with it, and you don’t plan on going to tournaments who cares what you play with?
No new mini sales means no more revenue. No more revenue means no more company. We can yap all we want, but they HAVE to sell stuff to remain in business, and that means new product for new sales, and sales to existing client base. If existing clients DON'T buy anything new, there's no revenue. And you're back to no company. So, they produce new rules and minis to stimulate sales to new clients and to existing clients. Like it or not, this IS how businesses operate.
Echoing the Ringwraiths sentiment. I was finally able to afford to get into the Nazgul and of course it comes just as they delete it all. Absolutely my platonic ideal of Ringwraith sculpt. I hate it.
GW thinks their games are like trading card games. Ignoring the fact that their plastic is far more expensive, requires building, painting, and learning to play.
They think their games are like AAA videogames. They essentially do DLC, have seasons, new editions of basically the same games... they would do an edition per year if they could get away with it.
As someone who plays mtg and warhammer
Warhammer is more expansive in short term
@@christopheraaron1255 exactly. Stakeholders will have the company milk the customer to the point ruining the relationship. Being forced into what becomes an subscription (which tjey recently launched on their own) is just putting me off and I will not get into playing the table top games. I want to get invested.. but not with my whole life benching my family amd the rest of my life.
The game isn't the point anymore. It's all about pushing the franchise and lore. Unfortunately WH is a complex game system that doesn't sell well to masses, and so is kind of relegated to a niche audience. They've already massively altered the game in the few last editions and will probably be super-simplified and Skyrim-ized in the near future.
@@Noneyo-Bidness it hasn't been the point for a while.
Good thing LOTR is a large brand. 3d prints are everywhere for them. Between that and pdfs, you don't need GW at all.
My #1 hobby goal is to not give GW anymore of my money
dinsey and GW for me.
3d printer go buuuuuuuuur
Thats a BIG YUUUUUUP!@@TheDragonfriday
@@TheDragonfriday YYEEESSSSSSS
Yep. Every single time someone talks me into getting into their stuff again, they go and pull stuff like this, repeatedly. I picked up the AoS Darkoath army box set because they looked cool and got me interested in finally trying AoS, only to have GW keep pulling crap like this. Every time I hear about them for the last several months, they've come across as mustache-twirling villains. I'm going to sell off the last of my GW stuff, including that unopened box set, and switch to Mantic Games' lines.
My Deathwatch, Stormcast, Killteams, and Underworlds, all gone... I'll never touch a GW product again.
Stop lyin
Come to the dark site and play OPR. 😉
@@Johnston-ge6hf I wish.
@Johnston-ge6hf We are not lying man. Enough abuse.
99% of my 40k stuff has been sold off already apart from a few choice models I have kept. I do still have my AoS armies because I still like my Daughters of Khaine. I even have a very good friend that handed his 40k stuff off on me to sell...just waiting for the rest of it before I start putting all of that on ebay.
I don't understand why people are still playing GW rules at all, when there are dozens of other (often similar) games to play the models with. That or just play old editions - with paper, secondary market, look-alike or 3dprinted models - all of which are far cheaper.
Except there arent lot of people who play those older edition games or alternate games compared to the current 40k. Most people want to play the latest version, you are going to have a hard time getting people to play a older version of the game. So people such as yourself love saying this stuff when its not baked into reality. Are there people who would? Yes however good luck finding or making those groups. If you got lucky then fantastic. The average person would have a hard time doing so without considerable effort into basically selling people on the idea and getting people to invest into it. GW always like saying you can always play a older codex... Yeah right good luck on that.
I think for many people it's lore, mostly.
And there are some folks have been around since, oh, 2nd edition - back when GW actually took records of who played which game seriously. My army was part of the 2nd battle of Armageddon, which felt super cool. Other games, even with the same miniatures, kinda just don't feel the same.
Competitive play, match play, all this stuff since ~7th Ed feels gross to most of the older players I know, who long for the return of true "narrative" play, and remember the days of battles that spanned entire rooms (with people shooting from one table to another - that kind of thing) being promoted and recorded by GW.
Not to mention it's super hard to convince new people to get into the older game modes, at best you are sharing books and such, plus it's easy to say "Well just 3d print everything" Well not everyone wants to spend months printing off models with toxic fumes especially if they don't live alone, and plastic is getting better but it's still not great looking and having computer running day and night just to get an army going is insanity.
Your comment is perfectly reasonable and yes you should be able to define your own games and rule set by this stage. However you are up against a mass brainwashing machine with lots of fanboys who cry foul and shoot down any common sense. Why ? Who knows, you get the same lot defending PC games that do nothing but shit on their fan base.
The Middle Earth SBG ruleset is genuinely good, maybe that's what people play it? There are plenty of free or alternative rulesets out there today, but not everyone of them is satisfying.
As a Dark Elf fantasy army collector, can someone feel My pain?
- Started up Battlefleet Gothic in 2010, just got a gameable fleet together in 2013
- Started up Wood Elves in 2013, just got a gameable army together in 2014-2015
- Went back to 40k in 2016-2017ish just in time for that one to go away too.
I think I might have some inkling of your pain yes.
Same. Huge Dark Elf fantasy army just sitting in a box, taken out occasionally for casual play. Lots of "Wow a dark elf player, you guys still exist?"
Had 50k of WFB Dwarfs, AoS hit and wiped us out. Then they make 2 new factions of "Dwarfs" while also killing off most the characters, rules and lore of the OGs. I feel the pain of loss yeah
As a Dark Elf and Sacrosanct chamber player, you may have a seat next to me at the bar. I'll buy a drink of your choice.
Then we can have a game of Age of Fantasy with our miniatures :)
I played Dark Elves and also had a Chaos Dwarfs army so ...yeah
All three factions that I spent a great deal building up are now wasted. At least I can make these as proxies for other non-GW systems
I hate to say this as it sucks but unless you are playing in GW tournaments you can still play the current edition. I certainly will be as I'm not a tournament player.
You can still play either with friends or with people that are having casual play
OPR welcomes you with open arms - you and your miniatures find the place here and lore is (imho) better than that of Warhammer anyway
Remember, GW doesn't care about the customer. They only care about your money. By giving them money, people are encouraging this behavior.
That much is fact they even don't care about the lore, that has been built to be retconed at any point.
Nothing is set in stone, it could be all propaganda about the empire fighting off the warp gate instead its some type of star child he found or captured..
The lore possibility is endless
Wait discourse reads the articles? I thought she just commented on headlines like a normal internet person.
… and Battletech basically have the same rules for 40 years. Unfortunately, I got into the Horus Heresy: Age Of Darkness and I’m not going to talk about them basically feeling like they have giving upon it.
So does The Sword and the Flame. It's still the go -to for colonial games, whether at conventions or in my local historicals group. First came out in 1979, the 2nd/3rd edition has been out since 1999 and barely changed anything except adding a variant for jungle warfare.
Honestly the best games are the ones GW don't touch
@@Buggritt Adeptus Titanicus is a prime example of that.
yeah, but trying to convince my warhammer playing friends that keeping track of heat dispersal,armour damage, system damage and ammo for a lance of mechs is super fun has yet to work.
Sorry OP I don't get it. I tried HH and loved it honestly, especially because GW is not pushing out things at a 40k rate. There's plenty of rules/missions to try and quite a lot of minis. Yes resin ones are GW-like expensive but you can proxy with 3d printed stuff...
Another point in favor of 3D printing. GW hates 3D printing so much and yet they are, ironically, benefiting 3D printed miniature sellers even more.
id love to do 3d printing, but unfortunately im probably not gonna be great at sculpting, and finding stl files online is gonna be hard. like i really dont wanna spend 10 hours on one mini trying to get it perfect
@@AlexTempest523 ... holdup I ain't a Warhammer expert, but how long does it take to assemble and paint a GW mini?
@@troffle Yuo can glue a normal space marine together in like 5 mins, or less, depending on if you care about mold lines. Can paint one in an hour(or less if you just do a simple job). Depending on how you paint, you might want to do them in sections, so having a one piece model isn't always a good thing. Printing is essentially a poor mans choice, you swap a shitload of time, to get a small monetary benefit. The only place where printing is effective, if you pay for someone else to print for you.
@@troffle it doesnt take very long for me, but it really depends on how you paint it. Gluing takes like 5-10 minutes, depending on the model.
@@AlexTempest523first point, you don't have to be great at digital sculpting and you learn pretty quickly as you go anyway from making minor tweaks. Second point, type into Google a unit type followed by STL and watch how many you find, it's a lot. Right now I'm rocking some traitor guard along with a commissar (whatever that model is called) and his ogryn who's going to get all nurgled up before I print. A lot of models are the official sculpts that have been 3d scanned too.
GW and Hasbro have taken the fun and spirit out of what they started doing. We all know what they are about nowadays. And it's grim. It's dark. It's probably margins.
You won't see Tyranids fucking each other over percentages.
There is a substantial dollar value attached to that joke... In adjusted dollars.
Just stop buying GW.
Bonus points for the Hellraiser references!
you got it :D
What’s your pleasure?
@@DiscourseMinis Ah, the suffering. The sweet, sweet suffering.
SBG is over 20 years old, and in all that time, GW has supported ALL of their existing models with each rules update - until now. The ridiculous thing is that people like me who own a vast collection have been wishing for updated figures due to the age of many of the plastic models from the first few years, such as Numenor, Rivendel Elves, Mordor Orcs, Moria Goblins, etc. So, rather than do that, they eliminate large swaths of models, most newer than those! The only good thing they are doing is the revision to the Rohan foot troops and Duland Wildmen. Hell, when I saw that they were doing that, I said that I'd buy the new box without question! But somewhere along the line, they decided to eliminate models and rules for models, not to introduce new ones, but just to reduce the overall number of profiles within the game. Since they've demonstrated a frustrating inability to keep up production, they are telling us that if we are proxying models for profiles they no longer make figures for, they won't start producing the models, they'll eliminate the profile instead. The elimination of the new Dunland figures and is probably the lowest blow that comes with this announcement. I bought all of the leader models, but proxied the troops because they were just too stupidly expensive. Guess I made the right decision there. Anyway, huge disappointment. The MESBG community and the GW team used to have a good relationship. Thanks to BIG GW Management, and this announcement, that is dead.
The pause before launching into the full ad was *perfect* 😂
Who told you about my "vroom vroom" noises! 😲
And now you understand what people starting Warhammer Battle with the End Time feels at the time...
The thing that baffles me most is that LotR has not met the same fate as Warhammer fantasy battle yet.
Sorry, what did you say about GW? I could not hear it over the sound of me shaking another resin bottle.
LMAO
Eventually, enough people will come to see that they do not need GW for their wargaming fix. What will GW do then?
@@crapshot321 Seriously, I've stop caring about GW for long time. Warhammer is a worthful IP, GW is not.
@@leeedward2574 GW hasn't been worthwhile for years.
This is exactly why I keep walking towards GW stores and then turning away at the final moment. I just don’t want to get financially and dare I say emotionally invested into something where there is no certainty what I pick will become redundant. I refuse to buy books directly from Black Library anymore after the Heresy book FOMO just got out of hand.
Finally, i do so adore your voice. ❤
Bro just to homebrew with the boi ive had a traitor guard army for years ive also never played a real game of 40k because why would i balancing sucks new editions nuked modles homebrew of of 8th has been solid whole custom armor system and all
I started to make a huge berth around everything GW and it works out for me !
I stopped buying all products in order to punish GWs attitude
...................and who is actually surprised? It's GW, you keep up, shut up, take it or move along like the peasant you are perceived as.
We are not the customer, the shareholders are. We are merely the resource being mined. And folks have made it very clear to GW that they will take anything, GW has been trying to find the breaking point for nearly a decade now. We aren't there yet, so they will keep pushing till they find it or 3D printing tech truly catches up with therm.
I found out about Marcher from Golden Dragon and backed their Kickstarter. It doesn't have the sheer brand power of Warhammer, but I remember when Warhammer writers were still talking about making tanks out of deoderant bottles, so I have hope this could develop into an honestly viable alternative to Warhammer.
Didn't play 9th and didnt care for 10th either. Been working on a sweet 3rd/4th ed 40k Orks and loving every moment of it. Sadly no one wants to play old school 40k 😢
I will admit i did buy some TOW resin models on the GW store that were crazy high priced on eBay for 10 years....
Right? I'm currently downsizing my collection to the 3rd/4th edition era of 40k but it will just be a passion project. The locals treat every weekend like it's a GT. Not a fan.
Proud 3rd/4th ed Tau player over here! There's more of us around than you might think! I've even managed to build up a faithful 2004hammer group at the local gaming store.
3rd edition was my peak. Fell in love with Salamanders. They were new and different and I bought the Armageddon Salamanders army box and played them up through the 13th Black Crusade campaign. I looked into the current edition WH40K and was not impressed. I took out all my 3rd edition codexes , rule books and armies. It's quite popular at the game stores seeing all these ancient artifacts on the table and everyone seeing how it used to be. The biggest awe I ever got was when I told them at the time 200 bucks got me a 5 man command squad , two 10 man troop units , a 5 man assault squad , a 5 man terminator unit , a rhino with upgraded armour and a predator tank
GW’s new policy. More bland models more often.
Even though I have given up buying miniatures, this hurts my LOTRs miniature lust fueled heart.
If players only had the possibility play older editions like they wouldn't depend on their corpo overlords. Oh wait.
games workshop doesnt care because their customers will still be there spending huge amounts of money for their overpriced stuff regardless of how poorly they are treated
I disagree - I stopped after buying loyal for 36 years.
I just can’t handle the abuse anymore 😢
While I love 40k, it is true that LOTR is a far more balanced game. I've always had fun when I occasionally found someone to play with.
Anyone else jumping on Trench Crusade?
I am impressed with the amount of people that are going to be there to be challenged by my armed forces once we have gotten the rules and regulations so we can begin organising meeting to resolve dice rolls and share our armies so unless I have already missed it why hasn’t Discourse mentioned this game before, yet, at all?
Yeah looks great. Im stoked
A Song of Ice and Fire
defo! backed for all of it
I'm waiting for Wargames Atlantic to release their corruption sprue as a stand-alone.
Or to get around to tuning up my FDM printer to print bits.
Lots of people.
Hellraiser reference is god tier, thank you for that.
I see a high quality resin printer in my near future.
“They like to make new miniatures” .. what a surprise.. this is their business model.. to make and sell new miniatures.
The classic minis being deleted in favor of Fortniteesque slop? Did somebody forget to change the disc or is just the thing that GW does now?
TLDR - lots of LOTR minis discontinued.
I can't stop laughing! I love listening to you. I think you could read the ingredients off of a cereal box and still make it entertaining. 💚👽🛸💚
thanks so much Jeff!
Privateer Press did this to a lot of Warmachine fans when they went to Mark IV. It went so badly they had to cut a deal with Steamforged Games.
For those interested the 'money shot' is at 3:09
This is my stash actually lol
@@stemes2860 Awesome - glad you are sharing the naughty pictures.
I get why they are upending a chunk of the lord of the rings games, like I imagine the amount of people buying into some of these nicher lord of the rings armies that largely only exist because they wanted to flesh out some guys with a few lines of text from the book, which is a shame because we got some interesting guys that way.
And the lord of the rings game was one I wanted to get into largely just to collect and paint but now it's less likely, frankly maybe they could space out giving every game a new edition, this is like the 3rd or 4th new edition this year
That anime will be ass, it's not even about Helm Hammerhand
Well duh, it's about keeping the movie rights. Looks the usual Strong Female Protagonist, and they have a greek name to boot. It's like a saxon name in a place based of greece
Selling expensive models for tournament players.
I appreciate they cannot run a model forever(did we really need 13 flavours of landraider?), they don't respect legends though. It'd be ok if they actually supported all their old junk.
I remember a video when there was a call out for some love to the LotR game. Guess there is some regret in there now.
If GW ever accepts that 3d printing is a significant part of the future of the hobby, I hope they'd start by providing STLs of their old and discontinued minis. They could 3d scan the copies they have (with a bit of digital clean up) to create the STLs. It's just sad to me from an archiving perspective that we lose these little works of art to history. And history becomes legend. Legend becomes myth. And the minis pass out of knowledge. :(
Surely letting people use all or most old minis (if the unit exists in the rules) and selling the stls while offering 'high quality' models for people not wanting to buy a 3d printer could get more people in to the hobby than the current BS which has kept people like me from buying anything from them for 23 ish years would still produce a viable business model.
lol your clickbait still works! i fell for it again and yes, i do not regret. Your videos are wonderful!
I had leprosy, until I watched the new video! Madame Discourse healed me through her videos!
A buddy of mine plays Schaeffer's Last Chancers in Kill Team, they fit almost perfectly into the specialist roles.
The armies of Morgoth wiped out way
more than this range refresh.
I have an easterling army myself
Not going to lie I would absolutely love for Games Workshop to go completely and totally out of business let the community take care of balancing the existing games, and left the 3D modeling Community take care of model Productions those asshats in Nottingham need absolutely nothing to do with the games anymore
Or it could all just be a licensing issue. Embracer bought Middle Earth Enterprises just before the release of Battle for Osgiliath. They could be wanting to withhold the rights for the Middle-Earth as a whole for themselves and only be allowing GW for something based on War of the Rohorrim film.
I do think a lot of it is connected to the movies, but not because of licencing. GW traditionally works pretty close with Peter Jackson and WETA and have a lot of inside information about what's going to happen in the movies long before we do.
I suspect a lot of what was cut is stuff that conflicts with how they're going to be represented in future movies. For example GW developed Khand all by themselves, if Khand ends up featuring in a movie they'll probably be completely different.
The question is: why don't they communicate that? Just say: due to licensing reason we will trim our line. That's all you would have to say.
I think you will find many of the removals are figures not seen in the movies and the license with new line is under much more scrutiny. When GW got the license originally they largely could do whatever they wanted but now that embracer owns tolkein enterprises that is no longer the case. This mirrors the golden daemon controversary from Essen where a Gollum mini that was altered was excluded from the contest.
@@pskovca I doubt it, honestly. There's too many other things GW created themselves and added in like Gulavhar and Burdhur that are showing no signs of being removed from the game.
On the legacy side of things, a lot of non-GW tournaments have already said they will most likely allow Legacy armies/miniatures at least for the short term once the changes come in - it's not the first time the community has kept Middle-earth alive on the tabletop for GW. On the removable of miniatures; it obviously sucks for people who own these armies are in the middle of collecting them BUT by their own justification, they are streamlining the range to remove a lot of miniatures/characters that either didn't show up in the movies or were semi-creations of GW themselves - named Ringwraith miniatures etc. It "makes sense" if they're looking to make the game more approachable for someone stepping in for the first time come the new edition. Plus, maybe a rights issue maybe...
I don't appreciate losing Balin, Floi and some of the best ways to run my Khazad-dum armies BUT I play primarily with friends and can just use the legacy rules. I've also been collecting the game since it released so I'm not as hard hit by the removal of miniatures as some. However, I can see why they are doing this and I kinda think we're in for some (good) surprises when the new edition lands.
For example, whilst Dunland in its current form are being removed, we have new Dunlending Warriors coming with the boxed set and characters from the War Of The Rohirrim era. So, not gone entirely. Additonally, whilst we might be losing certain heroes and troops from other factions, a LOT of them were in Finecast and/or metal and GW are moving away from that so there's that production element to it as well. There's no reason to think we won't get new plastic options for some similar troops etc in the future - especially with them redoing the Rohirrim currently.
I also have faith in the design team behind the game because they've been steering the ship right for a good few years now. Will it be misplaced? I suppose we'll have to wait and see.
Obviously TLDR but lastly, yes, totally agree on getting 3D printable miniatures to fill gaps in your collection. Medbury Miniatures are superb as well as a host of other 3D printing companies. There's no shortage of 3D printable (and physically printed via merchant) options out there.
"Anime" is really just a word that means... cartoon from Japan. They're cartoons, but because that's all the word means, it covers a wide range. Some of it is Disney stuff fun for the kids, mainly the Ghibli stuff Disney themselves have been translating for years (well until they stopped). Some of it is some serious guy making people's heads explode in gore, or future X-men kids turning into cyber-goo. And... a lot... way too much, is this modern utter garbage with names like "Hey I had This Weird Dream where My Uncle, no not that uncle, turned into a giant spider and ate my friends." Fortunately, the Lord of the Rings one doesn't appear to be falling into ANY of that nonsense that you seem to explicitly fear it becoming. Give it a chance. If they have people suddenly cutting away to do super cutesy emoji faces or go for some annoying oversexualization, well I'll be as disappointed as you, but it really doesn't seem to be going that route.
I guess in short, yes most anime is utter trash (including the big three, yes every single one of them), but 90% of everything is trash, and this one looks like it may be a diamond in the rough.
And this is why I'm going full Oldhammer. Just got the 2nd Edition rule book, wargear book, and codex imperialis en route...
The only people this hurts are people obsessed with war gaming that have loads of plastic and always get new stuff. Casuals will usually get a and be happy with basic factions forever. Obsessive people will continue to buy stuff anyways. So no loss on gw...
This is not the Warhammer cancellation scandal 70% of players are effected by. This is some top tier Games Workshop Spin Control!
All I ever wanted was a nice, traditional wood elf army from the days of 3rd edition WHFB but they vanished a long, long time ago.
Well, I went from 3rd to 10th without ever having used Gravity guns on my space marines. Still after all this time they felt like they weren’t there lore wise and added for gameplay, and left no impact outside of tournaments
I watched you last video about this. Then i went to the guard section and I didn’t see the Valkyrie and then I thought holy cow she’s right their getting rid of it but then I found it 🤣.
Sad that GW didn't know a way to sell mini without them taking physical place...even if the have 3dprint mini at Warhammer World...
I spent money on some minis from Vangaurd minis. They have a 3mm range as does Pico armor for proxy warhammer models.
I'm in the same camp as a great many commentators below; I've stopped buying GW products, completely. The tragedy for GW is, now I am retired, I have more disposable income for my war gaming. This decision by GW about Lord of the Rings, it's nothing new, of late, but it's another 'own-goal'. I was about to restock my LOTR collection, replace almost everything. Now, not a chance. But the LOTR decision is just one of many now by GW Management. The issue for me is their policy of pursuing uncertainty of supply. FOMO only works IF the supplier will restock within a timeframe people playing need stock. What is happening now with GW is, you aren't guaranteed stock access, EVEN ON the day of release. Worse, too often, even if you did buy that box that day, there is no follow-up and completion of the genre with supplementary/complimentary ranges of new stock supporting the first 'box'. The fact that multi-part figures only go together a certain, limited, way; the fact that boxes that once held a character figure and 40 weapon, equipment and other options no longer exist; the fact that prices are through the roof; these have all killed the GW brand name. Sure, I'm complaining about a company that makes toy soldiers, so my gripes are all First World tantrums, but it is a tragedy to see GW end up this way, especially as I had been buying their product for 30 years. I acknowledge too, it's a business. I respect that. But GW, rightly or wrongly, now projects an image of a money-gouging enterprise these days; it's not customer friendly, nor is it the great game company I once could rely upon.
every company on the market has good and bad years, I have been collecting my collection for over 20 years and I trust GW, of course, sometimes things don't work out as expected for companies, and GW will be able to correct these mistakes in the collection😉
That Stalin reference was brilliant 😁
Many people- many problems
Few people - few problems
May I suggest that you find local sculpture and crafters to make your own models, keep your former codex's and get with other players to create "garage game" communities. It will support local artists and maybe stores while cutting GW out of the picture.
I know I come here and often say the same things, but this just isn't new for GW. We can be upset and act surprised--but come on. GW has been at things like this since the 90s. They simply do not care (IMO based on following GW since Rogue Trader days) what their customers think or complain about, just as long as the keep selling their minis. So, you can talk until you are blue in the face, and it will change absolutely nothing. The only thing you can do is vote with your wallet, and until enough people do that, it is business as usual.
Sadly, none of this matters as the GW lemmings will continue to simp for their GW daddies.
GW has cut a mini of Brad Dourif? The monsters!
"... a lot of wailing of teeth." Those Ulster odontal techniques must be pretty weird.
I walked into a GW shop and asked the guy that greeted me about *Imperial Knights.*
He showed me the box and when I saw the price, I blurted out loud *"You're taking the piss!?"*
I looked at other factions and their prices to see if it was a one off thing, it was not...
I left a minute later, even the staff member looked like he understood my reaction.
Man ill hust build my army out of lego at this point
At this rate my group's move back to 8th edition (with certain allowances for newer minis) during covid lockdown is not only proving more and more successful with getting new players than any other version of WH but is proving to be downright prescient as models continue to get kyboshed. I run a lot of FW Orks so for me joining this group was mandatory, in fact the only reason I was allowed in was because I played Orks there is a que for my group and you can go months without getting in it and probably never if you're space marines. Best part is GW doesn't get more money to fund further bad choices. Win win.
I just decreased buying warhammer by around 60-70% each month and focused on collecting 1/6th scale figures. I'm waiting for my InArt Aragorn this week ❤
Miniature war gaming out side GW is a niche within a niche. Idk how she is finding people to play like war machine or what ever. I have a hard time finding combat patrol games where I live and I live in a pretty big city.
this, i keep reading people on comment sections suggest to play other games but lets be real who tf play those games?? (or even know they exist) warhammer is already extremely niche, and they are the de-facto monopoly on the hobby, same goes with 3d printing, you're not allowed to enter games stores with that
If you want a real fever dream watch the 1978 Lord of the Rings animated movie, doctors orders.
I personally don't care about MESBG but this is absolutely sad to hear. Especially as an AoS fan with the "old world squatting" of BoC and Bonesplitterz.
Oh and to everyone saying "just 3D print!" Or "just play the old edition!"
3D printing is fairly expensive to get into and requires its own dedicated space, which I don't have available.
For any wargame, the majority of the community will by default switch to the newest edition. Walk into your local store with 9th edition 40k or 3rd edition AoS rules and try and get a game in. Chances are you're stuck sitting there watching people play the current edition
This is hard to watch. So much negativity. Why do you play games workshop if you hate so much. Shit
Fortunately I've only lost my Canoptek Tomb Sentinel to the GW banhammer.. hopefully no other Necron units for a looong time.
I looked at getting into Warhammer way back in the 80s. Very expensive, and I never followed. I did buy a couple of models, Eldar Hyper Bike and a couple others, they look more sci fi than fantasy, that was it.
I'm wondering if the Tolkien estates going to kill GWs license and shop for a new holder.
I can’t stop staring at the dirty mic windscreen. Now neither can you.
And I still have the classic lotr magazines with a bunch of models still on their sprues. I will try to 3d scan them for everyone! Its not piracy if they don’t make them any more
I'm starting to think I need to stock up on any First Born minis I want NIB. I gotta feeling they will be gone in 11th Edition. Great editing on this video tho, definitely LOLed.
I really hope this opens people's eyes to other wargames than what GW offers
5:24 Saruman told me to tell you , go on
I’m going back to wizards of the coast’s Star Wars miniatures 😅 costs a fraction of the price and everything comes already painted
I know the feeling. Was a bretonnian player back when the west fell. I know what it’s like. They will bring them back someday. Love your content. One of the true one of the brave !
i just couldn't jump on board the games workshop thing, even without collecting you can see its a nightmare to get all the minis in the range, and the price is crazy.. compared to other ranges its crazy. its the star bucks of table top lol..
Okay hear me out. Let’s get an independent version of 10th together for all the casual players who might also have lost a lot of their minis due to recent updates. Let’s create an compendium with all units and a rule set which is static. That would mean no stress about constantly adjusting your army. Just pickup and play. Your army is playable today and in 2 years. We just need to freeze the rules and collect all of the datasheets in one place to create a 40K CASUAL 10th Library. Who is in? 🙂
Id buy new mini's every year...if the lore ever updated. We went back to the horus heresy 10yrs ago and its still not done
The garbage rules and mass-squatting of datasheets, wargear, and models has killed all my interest in Warhammer.
Honestly at this point I'm debating learning 3d modeling and making entire homebrew rulesets just to replace the things that GW has Thanos snapped out of existence.
I havent bought anything since 6th ed. I get the kill team book and convert the minis from my old unused stuff... and buy vallejo paints...
I stopped playing MTG for this reason but on a different scale. They release a new set almost weekly, it seems like. My LGS does nothing but drafts for the new sets for the month. Then they ban cards quite often forcing you to buy buy buy. Go home from a $20 draft on Friday night with cards I'll never use again. It got extremely old.
No costume in the ad bit?!? I am sooo disappointed. :,(
This is an unpopular opinion, but one of the brakes on growth is the sheer complexity of their miniatures now. GW used to recruit kids into the hobby and win them over for life, but now it's virtually impossible for those kids to enter. Price is a massive facor obviously, but another big one is that because all their miniatures are sculpted to allow Golden Daemon entrants to shine, they're also so complex that they're all but impossible for a new painter, especially a kid, to do a 'decent' job of. One reason Spess Mehreens used to be so popular was that every new person started with them because they were easy to paint, and so people could get an endorphin rush of painting it and feeling good. Now that every square nanometer of the model is draped in bling new painters can't get a result that looks ok, it always looks really bad even to them. GW needs to save the bling for selected models and ensure that basic ranges are as accessible as they used to be. And yeah, they need to stop retiring models all the time.
That's not only a problem for GW it's a general problem within the system of our economy. It's full of delusional concepts and paradoxes. Worked in "the industry" ( mostly international scm ) for over 20 yrs and it's "impossible" all over. Could tell horror-stories.. unbelieveable stuff .. for hours. But one of my faovurite stories I tell my students is kind of what Discourse is talking about.
On ceo/coo levels of a company you don't want ANY warehousing. Warehousing means you have to buy or rent space and have employees taking care of the movements of the product. You don't want full shelves. Because full shelves means every product is "dead capital" because it's not sold yet. Empty shelves on the other hand is something you also don't want. All the empty space means you pay for empty space you don't use. In your perfect corporate-world you'd love to don't have a warehouse. You do only "Just-in-time" -business to cut cost. But if you'd do that you have the problem that you certainly can't supply every customer you might have because we don't have teleportation yet. It's paradox all over and this isn't even the tip of the iceberg.
When I start going deeper into territory where in business-calculations the time between your product arriving at the warehouse... and it's arrival on the stock-shelves.. is zero.... than we go into the true madness of international wholeselling.
Thank God for OPR.
I mean, what’s stopping people from playing with homebrew/old rules with their gaming circles? If your friends are cool with it, and you don’t plan on going to tournaments who cares what you play with?
No new mini sales means no more revenue. No more revenue means no more company. We can yap all we want, but they HAVE to sell stuff to remain in business, and that means new product for new sales, and sales to existing client base.
If existing clients DON'T buy anything new, there's no revenue. And you're back to no company. So, they produce new rules and minis to stimulate sales to new clients and to existing clients.
Like it or not, this IS how businesses operate.
Echoing the Ringwraiths sentiment. I was finally able to afford to get into the Nazgul and of course it comes just as they delete it all. Absolutely my platonic ideal of Ringwraith sculpt. I hate it.
LOTR Range update < WHFB being binned.