Found it very interesting to see this video A few thoughts to add Getting into disc golf I threw a fully innova bag as many of us do, the Champion/Z/C-line tends to come out more overstable than the numbers imply and I think for discs like a venom or Force this is too OS for the average recreational play Back to innova I’ve had champ sidewinders fly like thundys, Beasts fly like firebirds it’s difficult, I know in the tern innova uses different flight numbers for the star vs champ discs Innova mids never really clicked with me, I ventured into discmania and bag an MD1, MD3 and MD4 MD1 felt better than a Mako3 MD4 was incredible I never knew I needed this slot so would recommend players to try out those Nords and RocX3s! Thanks for the great content hopefully this helps someone 😊
Some random comments: - KT throws Harp. Competes with zone. Deeper than zone and zone is in *ALL* plastics by now. - Nord is fine on BH but FHs bad. - Maverick is fine, have it in my bag on and off. Is a bit slower than 7 imo. Zack Melton throws it.
Interesting video! To start off, what discs are local and where you play might dictate what discs are purchased. Flight numbers are not standardized across brands. My bag is mostly Trilogy due to consistency for me in northern Cali. Austin Turner, PM and PP threw Vultures and Forces for varying periods.
Nice video. I bought a bag at the store recently. I was actually looking for a star beast but you were out lol. I ended up picking one up online and I almost never use it 😂
@ I use a few different stable discs for narrow forehand shots. Mostly the Mystere or Shryke, sometimes a Valkyrie. I’ve really only been throwing the Beast on the current 18 hole at De La.
I throw a metal flake Roc X3 , I use it as a longer zone. I hate the glimmer harp, that disc is way more over stable than the numbers indicate. I also used to throw a Savant but in Halo plastic, I shelved it after I discovered the Latitude 64 Saint. Another great vid.
Long discussion here. Ive been intrigued by the Savant earlier on when I got heavier into disc golf but just happened to pick the Valkyrie. Its now in the running as a new purchase since the Valk is now a little too flippy for my forehand. I love the Big Z Vulture I picked up and was able to throw for 2 rounds before having to shut down for the year. Nice and reliable so far for my forehand compared to my seasoned ESP. I also just picked up a Lucid Justice since it was in the used bin and cheap and I wanted a beef mid. So far its done what I've needed. I also have a used Halo Beast that has been useful for my forehand and has since migrated from fulltime bag to the car reserve. Personally I dont like the Z plastic as its a bit too hard and slippy. I do like the Big Z a bit better and ESP best for Discraft.
I love the Justice and I taught myself how to FH with it, but it’s interesting that you say that. I purchased my 4th one, and it was definitely not as beefy as the other 3.
@ yes, and definitely all beefy, but the red lucid I just got actually glides a little on BH and doesn’t just dump hard left and on FH it definitely glides more. I’d say my justice is my bag is noticeably more stable than my zone, but the odd red one is less stable than my zone. That’s all based on my old man 300 foot (on a good day) arm speed.
I personally don’t like champion or Z line just because of the feel. They always seem harder and less grippy than a star or esp plastic. I also don’t like that those plastics are known to make a disc more stable. There have been times that I’ve used that to my advantage though. When I first started I really liked champion mambas. The champ plastic helped make it just stable enough that I could get max distance out of them.
My 2 cents: Savant, has some flip to my arm but as you said, doesn’t like to fly DD molds: aren’t really popular, what I’ve heard is the naming convention. Personally I like the felon bc they were half off and flat and the slammer is the only other mold I like bc it’s a unique slot Discraft molds: personally hate all the plastics outside the Jawbreaker Z Flx, they just feel horrible so I don’t bother The overstable mid slot: agreed with thoughts, fast ground play and shot shapes don’t call for overstable mids, throwing an envy/approach disc or bumping up to a straight mid/stable fairway most of the time Harp: Zone>
I've had that Ricky glimmer harp for a long time in green hahahaha. Never play without it. Heard it's the same as a toro or zone so I never bothered throwing either of those disc's. 🤷 😅
I play in the rocky desert a lot so champion plastic holds up much better. I threw a beast as an early driver. It handled lower arm speed well. Now that my armspeed is better it's flippy, but that's still useful in my bag.
@TheDiscZone Yeah it holds up, but the champion is holding up slightly better. The Star definitely doesn't, but Halo Star is better. The desert rocks are BRUTAL on discs. If I had a store, I'd have it in the desert LOL, because of how much shorter disc lifespans are there. The champion texture isn't that bad once you get used to it, but it is different at first. I travel and play in trees in the summer, and do get used to tackier plastics then.
Opaque means you cannot see through it. Which would be like Innova Star plastic. I think you mean transparent or translucent plastic which is what that Champion Beast would be considered.
@@TheDiscZone All good, just letting you know if you didn't. I enjoyed the video. It's interesting to see what is or isn't selling because I just live in my little disc golf bubble. lol
The Savant isn’t a bad disc. I agree with you that sometimes it flies indistinguishable from a Thunderbird. Some of the Halo Valkyries mirror the flight also.
The thing with 0/3 and 0/4 mids (like the Nord) not many ppl bag such a disc at all. They are utility discs and FH approach, so not so hugely needed as theur less stable companions like Svea, Stig or Kaxe (to keep it in Kastaplast molds).
Dude I havnt seen you in a while. My buddy gave me a gift credit card and I just bought a back up disc I needed. Next time I will look up your store, I like your vide…
Fuck a Zone, Harps all day. Problem is we live in a non Trilogy area. I'm surprised that only one Westside mold made it onto the list. I pushed the Harp hard out here but Westside just doesn't move. Innova has the grip here and then Discraft, when I started repping Trilogy at DeLa very few folks were interested. I'll come buy all the Harps, well maybe not all of them but.... much love Chris.
a slammer comes to mind for ricky as well, so it might not have quite as strong an association with a top pro as the zone or toro does. also, DD is just isn’t thrown the most out here
What overshadows the Vulture? My first Trail from one of the beefier runs, for one. Can't even blame under-powering it, because they're both 10 | 5's, and the Trail consistently gets the same or more right to left movement than the Vulture.
@@xcfjdyrkdtulkgfilhu Yeah the Trail is significantly more popular than the Vulture. I think it comes down to what professionals throw and I don't know of many that throw the Vulture.
Depending on arm speed I'd imagine a -1,1 disc would have more right to left movement to a 0,2 disc considering the latter should have minimal turn. I just snagged a 174g Big Z Vulture and was able to throw it a couple rounds before surgery. It flies far better for my forehand compared to my other used 172g ESP Vulture I've had since new.
@@TheDiscZone Very big skips on forehand, more so than the Swarm, I bag both, Justice for daytime since I can find a glow Justice and Swarm for glow rounds. Super soft Justice is the option if you want to avoid the flare skip way past the basket.
Bag a Harp and a Maverick, my bro bags a RocX3 and Justice. That particular Harp is a great run, really nice and overstable. Trilogy just doesn't have much of a presence on the pro scene since Discraft sponsors half the field now. But Ricky, Matty O and Kristin Lätt all throw Harps so if you know, you know.
I feel like courses in the 831 require putter and driver tee more than midrange shots for most ppl that i play with! I don’t see a lot of mids getting thrown
😅 I'm crying, the Westside Harp is the one disc I throw on almost EVERY hole. It is generally considered a kind of "cult" disc. I prefer it in BT Hard plastic.
Sexton throws the savant Brodie, Mcbeth, fish all throw the Vulture As for the force.. Doss, ellis, mcbeth, prez, literally every discraft pro throws it. 🤦
@@TheDiscZone I think Innova should discontinue the Savant, and Discraft should discontinue the Vulture (or Anax). They're just so damn similar they don't need both.
Everyone around here throw Buzz’s I’ve had like five of them and I don’t like them. The buzz reminds me of a Rock which I don’t like either. I’d rather just rip a Pig straight at it
Really? People at your store actually bought active line from discmania? I cant imagine the majesty, astronaut, rockstar, magician and maestro selling better than even a pizza box
It’s the cost factor. I worked part time at a disc shop and we definitely moved some of those. I agree with you on the disc but the cost and “new look” is appealing to some new players I guess.
I don’t think you meant opaque. Opaque is not transparent like the Champion plastic. Examples of opaque would be Star plastic, DX plastic, Neutron plastic, etc. Opaque plastic does not let light pass through it. Very informative post. More, please.
At the store I was working at, they never moved. We only sold some when we marked it down by a lot since we wanted to make room. The pizza box was a joke but fr that's what's surprises me haha. Harps did us pretty well since we had a good amount of diehard trilogy throwers haha
You said the Force Ellis is the only one you know of. Doss bags only Forces. Mcbeth all Force, Hammes is Force only. Force for me is my Overstable disc overall Disc. Mcbeth still throws some Vultures. Not as much as he used to. For me 13 speed discs are not my cup of tea. I am not a sponsored player. But Discraft is all i throw. You will never see me bag a INNOVA disc. Thats just my Opinion. Have a good holidays
Makes sense. It's most likely just the area I live in. I used to throw a force for a while as well and loved it. Maybe it's just a plastic preference in the Forces. Do you throw a lot of Z plastic stuff? Happy holidays.
@ mostly ESP. I don’t have no pro power. 300 my norm. Zeus and Force are my go to overstable. The recycled ESP tends to for some reason be a lil less over stable with the force. Thrasher is my main thrower for distance.
I bag a savant and anax over a thunderbird people dont throw dynamic discs anywhere. I personally dont want duscs named after the justice system. As a felon i used one for a bit as a kind of joke but see they recently released "the Jury" so lame
Love the Justice. Everyone should have one at some point. The Savant is good for touch forehand and power backhand. Kind of a two in one disc.
@@trevorwischhusen2869 Yeah, I would agree. Definitely two highly underrated discs.
45-80 meter distance - Justice works really well! Needs anhyzer for longer distances, but has reliable flight path.
Found it very interesting to see this video
A few thoughts to add
Getting into disc golf I threw a fully innova bag as many of us do, the Champion/Z/C-line tends to come out more overstable than the numbers imply and I think for discs like a venom or Force this is too OS for the average recreational play
Back to innova
I’ve had champ sidewinders fly like thundys, Beasts fly like firebirds it’s difficult, I know in the tern innova uses different flight numbers for the star vs champ discs
Innova mids never really clicked with me, I ventured into discmania and bag an MD1, MD3 and MD4
MD1 felt better than a Mako3
MD4 was incredible I never knew I needed this slot so would recommend players to try out those Nords and RocX3s!
Thanks for the great content hopefully this helps someone 😊
I've bagged a Maverick and Beast. An Innova IT and Gorgon are now in those slots.
@@cosmolean Understandable. Seems like most of these molds are replacable by more popular stuff.
Some random comments:
- KT throws Harp. Competes with zone. Deeper than zone and zone is in *ALL* plastics by now.
- Nord is fine on BH but FHs bad.
- Maverick is fine, have it in my bag on and off. Is a bit slower than 7 imo. Zack Melton throws it.
Interesting video! To start off, what discs are local and where you play might dictate what discs are purchased. Flight numbers are not standardized across brands. My bag is mostly Trilogy due to consistency for me in northern Cali.
Austin Turner, PM and PP threw Vultures and Forces for varying periods.
I agree with the maverick on how it's underrated I have 4 mavericks in all the plastics and love all of them
Nice video. I bought a bag at the store recently. I was actually looking for a star beast but you were out lol. I ended up picking one up online and I almost never use it 😂
Thanks for supporting the shop! What do you use instead of the beast?
@ I use a few different stable discs for narrow forehand shots. Mostly the Mystere or Shryke, sometimes a Valkyrie. I’ve really only been throwing the Beast on the current 18 hole at De La.
I throw a metal flake Roc X3 , I use it as a longer zone. I hate the glimmer harp, that disc is way more over stable than the numbers indicate. I also used to throw a Savant but in Halo plastic, I shelved it after I discovered the Latitude 64 Saint.
Another great vid.
Absolutely love the Vulture!
@@HyzerMyzer Definitely a highly underrated mold
Long discussion here.
Ive been intrigued by the Savant earlier on when I got heavier into disc golf but just happened to pick the Valkyrie. Its now in the running as a new purchase since the Valk is now a little too flippy for my forehand.
I love the Big Z Vulture I picked up and was able to throw for 2 rounds before having to shut down for the year. Nice and reliable so far for my forehand compared to my seasoned ESP.
I also just picked up a Lucid Justice since it was in the used bin and cheap and I wanted a beef mid. So far its done what I've needed.
I also have a used Halo Beast that has been useful for my forehand and has since migrated from fulltime bag to the car reserve.
Personally I dont like the Z plastic as its a bit too hard and slippy. I do like the Big Z a bit better and ESP best for Discraft.
I love the Justice and I taught myself how to FH with it, but it’s interesting that you say that. I purchased my 4th one, and it was definitely not as beefy as the other 3.
@@davesage4931 Did you buy each of them in the Lucid plastic? I would expect most of them to be fairly beefy.
@ yes, and definitely all beefy, but the red lucid I just got actually glides a little on BH and doesn’t just dump hard left and on FH it definitely glides more. I’d say my justice is my bag is noticeably more stable than my zone, but the odd red one is less stable than my zone. That’s all based on my old man 300 foot (on a good day) arm speed.
@@davesage4931 Interesting. Thanks for your reply!
Surprised at the Maverick. It was my favorite beginner driver for awhile when I first started. Okay, Harp shocked me.
@@brianc1651 I can't believe either of those made the list either. Do you bag a Harp?
I personally don’t like champion or Z line just because of the feel. They always seem harder and less grippy than a star or esp plastic. I also don’t like that those plastics are known to make a disc more stable. There have been times that I’ve used that to my advantage though. When I first started I really liked champion mambas. The champ plastic helped make it just stable enough that I could get max distance out of them.
Ah that makes sense! I don't know why I forgot that Champion plastic is more stable. I'm sure the Champion Mamba is a bomber. Thanks for your comment!
My 2 cents:
Savant, has some flip to my arm but as you said, doesn’t like to fly
DD molds: aren’t really popular, what I’ve heard is the naming convention. Personally I like the felon bc they were half off and flat and the slammer is the only other mold I like bc it’s a unique slot
Discraft molds: personally hate all the plastics outside the Jawbreaker Z Flx, they just feel horrible so I don’t bother
The overstable mid slot: agreed with thoughts, fast ground play and shot shapes don’t call for overstable mids, throwing an envy/approach disc or bumping up to a straight mid/stable fairway most of the time
Harp: Zone>
@@ryanliu3455 All valid points. I agree with everything.
Good concept!
I've had that Ricky glimmer harp for a long time in green hahahaha. Never play without it. Heard it's the same as a toro or zone so I never bothered throwing either of those disc's. 🤷 😅
I love the harp, have it in VIP ice glimmer. I don't forehand it though, too deep for me.
How does it fly backhand? Is it pretty overstable?
@@TheDiscZone I don't feel it is as overstable as my zone, maybe closer to the tempo. At least for me
I play in the rocky desert a lot so champion plastic holds up much better. I threw a beast as an early driver. It handled lower arm speed well. Now that my armspeed is better it's flippy, but that's still useful in my bag.
@@erickyoung8331 That makes sense. Have you tried Halo Star plastic as well? Definitely just as durable and consistent as Champion plastic.
@TheDiscZone Yeah it holds up, but the champion is holding up slightly better. The Star definitely doesn't, but Halo Star is better. The desert rocks are BRUTAL on discs. If I had a store, I'd have it in the desert LOL, because of how much shorter disc lifespans are there.
The champion texture isn't that bad once you get used to it, but it is different at first. I travel and play in trees in the summer, and do get used to tackier plastics then.
Opaque means you cannot see through it. Which would be like Innova Star plastic. I think you mean transparent or translucent plastic which is what that Champion Beast would be considered.
@@thejasonblackburn Bro, I know I'm sorry 🥲. I had a brain fart while filming lol.
@@TheDiscZone All good, just letting you know if you didn't. I enjoyed the video. It's interesting to see what is or isn't selling because I just live in my little disc golf bubble. lol
I love the flight of the harp but too deep… this list makes sense to me… have to be careful with discs that are too stable bc scary for ams.
@@discbee9107 Thanks for your comment. What approach disc do you use instead? Toro?
The Savant isn’t a bad disc. I agree with you that sometimes it flies indistinguishable from a Thunderbird. Some of the Halo Valkyries mirror the flight also.
@@TherealPapaDogP Yeah I agree. Savant is highly underrated.
Halo adds at least a tick more stability so of course that'd fly more like a Star Savant or slightly more stable.
The thing with 0/3 and 0/4 mids (like the Nord) not many ppl bag such a disc at all. They are utility discs and FH approach, so not so hugely needed as theur less stable companions like Svea, Stig or Kaxe (to keep it in Kastaplast molds).
Dude I havnt seen you in a while. My buddy gave me a gift credit card and I just bought a back up disc I needed. Next time I will look up your store, I like your vide…
Fuck a Zone, Harps all day. Problem is we live in a non Trilogy area. I'm surprised that only one Westside mold made it onto the list. I pushed the Harp hard out here but Westside just doesn't move. Innova has the grip here and then Discraft, when I started repping Trilogy at DeLa very few folks were interested. I'll come buy all the Harps, well maybe not all of them but.... much love Chris.
I throw the rocx3, but mine is in champion plastic for that extra beef. It's my main OS approach disc.
I scramble with a Justice ALL THE TIME, it’s my go to four-hand upshot disc.
a slammer comes to mind for ricky as well, so it might not have quite as strong an association with a top pro as the zone or toro does. also, DD is just isn’t thrown the most out here
I am surprised to see Harp in the list. Probably best approach and putt disc I have played. Both for front- and backhand.
What overshadows the Vulture? My first Trail from one of the beefier runs, for one. Can't even blame under-powering it, because they're both 10 | 5's, and the Trail consistently gets the same or more right to left movement than the Vulture.
@@xcfjdyrkdtulkgfilhu Yeah the Trail is significantly more popular than the Vulture. I think it comes down to what professionals throw and I don't know of many that throw the Vulture.
Depending on arm speed I'd imagine a -1,1 disc would have more right to left movement to a 0,2 disc considering the latter should have minimal turn.
I just snagged a 174g Big Z Vulture and was able to throw it a couple rounds before surgery. It flies far better for my forehand compared to my other used 172g ESP Vulture I've had since new.
I love that there’s no Discmania discs on the lists🔥
I really enjoy the justice for fore hands
@@brandondaniels5634 Is it pretty overstable?
@@TheDiscZone Very big skips on forehand, more so than the Swarm, I bag both, Justice for daytime since I can find a glow Justice and Swarm for glow rounds. Super soft Justice is the option if you want to avoid the flare skip way past the basket.
Bag a Harp and a Maverick, my bro bags a RocX3 and Justice. That particular Harp is a great run, really nice and overstable. Trilogy just doesn't have much of a presence on the pro scene since Discraft sponsors half the field now. But Ricky, Matty O and Kristin Lätt all throw Harps so if you know, you know.
I feel like courses in the 831 require putter and driver tee more than midrange shots for most ppl that i play with! I don’t see a lot of mids getting thrown
😅 I'm crying, the Westside Harp is the one disc I throw on almost EVERY hole. It is generally considered a kind of "cult" disc. I prefer it in BT Hard plastic.
I throw the Beast pretty frequently.
@@mckayandersen5858 Does it serve as your hyzer flip distance driver or something else?
@ Yes distance. I don’t have such a great arm so I don’t throw the faster discs.
Vulture is totally slept on.
Sexton throws the savant
Brodie, Mcbeth, fish all throw the Vulture
As for the force.. Doss, ellis, mcbeth, prez, literally every discraft pro throws it.
🤦
Forgot that Sexton throws the Savant. Anthony Barela, arguably the best and most popular Discraft pro, doesn't throw the Force.
@ but every single other player does when you said "pros dont throw the force"
Vulture works fine, but it overlaps way too much with the Anax. Same with the Savant and Thunderbird.
@@twmccoy100 I'm not sure if they should retool each of those molds or try to market them differently.
@@TheDiscZone I think Innova should discontinue the Savant, and Discraft should discontinue the Vulture (or Anax). They're just so damn similar they don't need both.
I'd rather pay Vulture money vs Anax money 🫥
@@twmccoy100to recoup that McBeth retaining money, probably. Still love my Big Z Vulture.
@@seanzzila8- I think they're so similar you could switch the stamps on the Anax and Vulture and no one would notice.
I love my champion Beast!
I love discraft, but z is my least favorite plastic from them. Feel/stamps are mostly the reason.
I always think of mcbeth throwing a force
Mcbeth and taylor both use the force also
Nate Sexton throws the savant
It's a already beat in thunderbird
Everyone around here throw Buzz’s I’ve had like five of them and I don’t like them. The buzz reminds me of a Rock which I don’t like either. I’d rather just rip a Pig straight at it
No Discmania there...🛡
@@HammerDG Facts. Discmania was pretty middle of the pack for my shop.
doesnt every triology pro throw a harp?!?
@@Fantastik87z Definitely. I think it is just heavily overshadowed by the Zone and Toro.
Really? People at your store actually bought active line from discmania? I cant imagine the majesty, astronaut, rockstar, magician and maestro selling better than even a pizza box
It’s the cost factor. I worked part time at a disc shop and we definitely moved some of those. I agree with you on the disc but the cost and “new look” is appealing to some new players I guess.
@@Kennb19 I don't really have a lot of Active line discs from Discmania. I think I only have the Essence and Instinct, which sell fairly well.
I don’t think you meant opaque. Opaque is not transparent like the Champion plastic. Examples of opaque would be Star plastic, DX plastic, Neutron plastic, etc. Opaque plastic does not let light pass through it. Very informative post. More, please.
At the store I was working at, they never moved. We only sold some when we marked it down by a lot since we wanted to make room. The pizza box was a joke but fr that's what's surprises me haha. Harps did us pretty well since we had a good amount of diehard trilogy throwers haha
@@davesage4931 I can understand that I wish I had that success when I tried hahaha
You said the Force Ellis is the only one you know of. Doss bags only Forces. Mcbeth all Force, Hammes is Force only. Force for me is my Overstable disc overall Disc. Mcbeth still throws some Vultures. Not as much as he used to. For me 13 speed discs are not my cup of tea. I am not a sponsored player. But Discraft is all i throw. You will never see me bag a INNOVA disc. Thats just my Opinion. Have a good holidays
Makes sense. It's most likely just the area I live in. I used to throw a force for a while as well and loved it. Maybe it's just a plastic preference in the Forces. Do you throw a lot of Z plastic stuff? Happy holidays.
@ mostly ESP. I don’t have no pro power. 300 my norm. Zeus and Force are my go to overstable. The recycled ESP tends to for some reason be a lil less over stable with the force. Thrasher is my main thrower for distance.
I bag a savant and anax over a thunderbird people dont throw dynamic discs anywhere. I personally dont want duscs named after the justice system. As a felon i used one for a bit as a kind of joke but see they recently released "the Jury" so lame