Really cool analysis! It's pretty interesting to see how overwhelmed even pros are at the tier 5 timeframes. I think that 11k guy does have a point not to overcomplicate your own game, but it probably also comes out of most games just not going to that point so people don't practice utilizing those items. If more games go to that timeframe, players will probably develop more muscle memory
I play heroes that break high ground with blink, BKB, hex and that often want refresher as a luxury item anyway (and I often have octarine). I'm the type of player that will gladly have 10 buttons, I'm always hyper aware of my cooldowns and know how to abuse them, and so Ex Machina is like a dream item. The game becomes so much easier after finding it. It's an item for a certain type of player.
I recall a superlong clutch game where I was TB, team gave me Ex Machina, and after struggling with it for 2 fights I decided it is impossible to play a fight completely effectively with it and gave it away to a teammate, getting a Falled Sky instead (to have another initiation / escape if needed). On paper, it seems bonkers, but in practice it was the best and we won off of that (turns out a TB with Agi blink and FS that jumps 2 screens onto a Rapier Sniper is stronger than having a bit longer bkb)
if you can swap the neutral item, that means this happens in the old patch. And in the old patch, Ex machina was sick. The cooldown mechanic makes it a worse neutral item that it was before.
Pro's are never used to tier 5 neutral item games, most of their game is under 60 min. Therefore they are not used to it and rarely have a chance to maximize their tier 5 items. Just plain and simple. unles... u playing in SEA
Because at that time, most of them are full slotted, with 2 or 3 at average being spells. Add another spell neutral item(usually tier5) and you can easily be lost.
my winrate with ex machina is 100% (yes im kinda low mmr and that 100% is a handful of matches only cuz who reaches 60 mins every time) and its because i dont try to completely min max and juz ex machina if even 1 of my vital item is on cd like bkb instead of trying to sue the other items and potnetionally dying due to no bkb
that is why i buy arcane blink when i get ex machina idc what you think, it works for me. Try playing drow or pa with arcane blink, its actually fire im ancient 4 btw
Its also really hard to use an Item that you dont play with alot. Think that is alot of the issue with ex machina. I mean sure a 12k mmr gamer god will be better than me at it but you dont use it without thinking.
This is the same dilemma for faceless void like to buy refresher orb which is impossible to pull off double chrono if his item didn't slot with skadi and manta.
If you have enough clips to make a full video of ex machina plays going wrong let's see it! Sounds hilarious. Also please do plug when you're casting and being on panels, i have not seen you do that before but would love to know when and where to tune in
whenever i have ex machina i just poke and bait enemy bkbs and items because i know its basically gona be 100% uptime on my bkb when i can exit and enter fights at will
As 4/5 player, I enjoy ExM and able to use it to its peak potential. Late game supp with bkb, aeon, RO, Windwaker and ExM is pure joy of kiting enemies.
If you manage to not die after the first BH at that game time (60 minutes) then with Ex-machina allows you to use 3 BH, IF you have enough mana. Thats more than 2500 mana, 3 BH with 2 Refresher uses, BKB and Ex Machina.
Very nice video! Earned a sub, even tho im not really looking to get better at dota. On pirate hat, i would like to argue that if the game went on for 60 minutes at 10k mmr, they probably farmed enough trough the game and have enough money, so worrying about using the active vs playing the game is more inportant, we can even see from that 12 minutes that he doesn't really buy anything after the pirate hat pickup other than the divine, which he probably already had the money for, from what i can see. Also they have a clockwork, and this might be a stupid thing to say, but if he stopped to dig the rune out, may get caught out ? Anyways super cool video, and it made think about netruals a little bit more.
it wouldn't make more sense because forcing engagement is a good technique to breed activity and brand awareness. there's a purpose to why the spreadsheet is not readily available to everyone, as to encourage viewers to commit effort. this creates extraneous value of the spreadsheet since you'd "work" in order to receive it, and the "value" is tied to the brand. similarly, this increases the chance for someone to be inclined enough to "return the favor" by donating on Patreon since they've received something of "value" from the creator in return. the replying e-mail will surely contain a plead to make sure they're reminded of that :)
@@mcbenis That sounds stupid tbh, people are more likely to not want to go through that trouble/risk, you want them to share your discord, email, is cellphone next? They already joined the discord, just give them the damn thing... You're being sketchy for no reason at all.
I strongly disagree with the point your coach made. Even though dota is a complex game, you can't simply neglect winning opportunities due to their mechanical complications. Most of the good players won't just prefer Mirror Shield in favor to Ex Machina because it makes you think more, they just pick a defensive stance in the game where you might want to have Linken against instant control. Having linken means occupying slot with a very low-stat item, whereas picking Mirror Shield is only an augmentation to character's power. If Ex Machina is a game winning choice, always go for it. But as you said in this video, people struggle to understand when it is a good choice. Having basically a 20 sec cooldown on any item is insanel, not mentioning double hexes/double abyssals. Your team might also pick multiple Ex Machinas to combine them for even longer combos. The options are just too powerful with this one.
I don't think that WR data matters at all on neutral itens. If one team get ex-machina, is most likely that the other team get one to. So the most picked itens are on both teams, the loser and the winner side.
A rapier in inventory is going to have an absurd win rate, but that's because of causality going in the other direction. Neutral items somewhat alleviate this problem, but it's difficult to make comparisons when we don't know what the alternatives are. It's like a hero not buying a radiance or desolator because the team already has one. Anyone telling you not to pick up neutral items with active abilities is telling you that they think you're facing opponents that are stronger players than you are, full stop. If you are the better player, you want as many decision opportunities as you can get, and you'd prefer your opponent to have fewer. The pirate hat example given highlights a problem with this type of analysis; Satanic was never standing still, he was defending against megas. Every action has an opportunity cost, and he may not have been able to afford it (similarly, no one has experience in a super late game, to say nothing of a 15 year old). Have you tried working with the API? I'd think it would have to be easier. These videos are great.
You missed the point that, yes, you CAN take all of that into effect, but in the end the truth is that 60 minutes into the game a fucking million things are happening in a teamfight, and having one less thing to worry about can be the difference between winning or losing. It's a thing you see casters and pros point out when watching games. Even the tip top greatest players in the world will say "Well this team will win. Why? Their teamfight is simply easier to execute".
@@tdawry You are so wrong about "decision opportunities". You're also weirdly demeaning towards an individual who is rank 10 in the world and the youtuber himself since you've suggested that he should take the easier path to sort his data (it parallels your claim of big number decision opportunities > smaller number)
@@zakra9053 I think what the UA-camr is doing here is quite good, and that the API would scale, if it has the same type of information available. Personally I'd rather he looked at the data more rigorously than using ChatGPT, but he's spending the time getting the data which is probably more valuable, especially since he's making it available to others.
the return and rise of bowie as the best dota channel. Can never get enough of it.
A better game leap.. Since dota bowie focus on theory hahaaha
Yeah like I learnt dota with bowie and jenkins stupid voice 😂
As a solid 3.5k player, neutral actives makes my brain short-circuit...
"Does Jenkins have an onlyfans" - the best question asked in this video...
Really cool analysis! It's pretty interesting to see how overwhelmed even pros are at the tier 5 timeframes. I think that 11k guy does have a point not to overcomplicate your own game, but it probably also comes out of most games just not going to that point so people don't practice utilizing those items. If more games go to that timeframe, players will probably develop more muscle memory
Somewhat true, the more you complicate your plays the more you need to manage things, especially since Dota is already a complex game
True. I was also thinking along same lines. Pros tend to close their games within 40 mins.
I used to watch bowie back in 2017-2018 and his content never changes. It's still QUALITY gold!! Thanks bowie
Can you please not edit those stupid GIFs (you probably call them "memes") into the video thanks
a clear recomendation to get into cooldown managment is playing SC/SC2, in the end it becomes second nature
Pô, cara, esse tempo todo te acompanhando e percebi hoje que tu é brasileiro? kkkkkk abraço, bom trabalho como sempre!
Nas antiga ele tinha dois canais, um em pt e esse em ingles.
Ele tem um sutaque que ele tenta esconder, mas os "to" dele não deixa enganar kkkk percebi na hora, fui caçar e vi um Gustavo no Link do perfil dele
I play heroes that break high ground with blink, BKB, hex and that often want refresher as a luxury item anyway (and I often have octarine). I'm the type of player that will gladly have 10 buttons, I'm always hyper aware of my cooldowns and know how to abuse them, and so Ex Machina is like a dream item. The game becomes so much easier after finding it. It's an item for a certain type of player.
Hey hey hey. I need that skill sooo badly. How did you develop the ability to keep track of cooldowns. I am so bad with cooldowns 😢
what is your region and mmr?
@@grapy83 You just have to play heroes that rely on proper execution a lot, trial by fire.
I recall a superlong clutch game where I was TB, team gave me Ex Machina, and after struggling with it for 2 fights I decided it is impossible to play a fight completely effectively with it and gave it away to a teammate, getting a Falled Sky instead (to have another initiation / escape if needed). On paper, it seems bonkers, but in practice it was the best and we won off of that (turns out a TB with Agi blink and FS that jumps 2 screens onto a Rapier Sniper is stronger than having a bit longer bkb)
if you can swap the neutral item, that means this happens in the old patch. And in the old patch, Ex machina was sick. The cooldown mechanic makes it a worse neutral item that it was before.
@@thinhtran-hq3or Fair, this happened like 3 years ago but it was a very memorable game 😅
Any results on Jenkins dota search?
Bowie please 🥺 guide us on how to track and manage cooldowns on items and abilities. Its so damn hard and anxiety inducing 😮
Pro's are never used to tier 5 neutral item games, most of their game is under 60 min. Therefore they are not used to it and rarely have a chance to maximize their tier 5 items. Just plain and simple. unles... u playing in SEA
Because at that time, most of them are full slotted, with 2 or 3 at average being spells. Add another spell neutral item(usually tier5) and you can easily be lost.
my winrate with ex machina is 100% (yes im kinda low mmr and that 100% is a handful of matches only cuz who reaches 60 mins every time) and its because i dont try to completely min max and juz ex machina if even 1 of my vital item is on cd like bkb instead of trying to sue the other items and potnetionally dying due to no bkb
Pro: *Uses Pirate hat 3 times in 10 minutes.*
Me: *Uses shovel on cooldown hoping for a bounty rune.*
Hey hey you never know, it maybe secret herald art picking telescope on am.
Editor note : ex machina can't refresh a refresh orb
In a 60 min game. Statistics doesn’t matter. Which ever team messes up looses.
that is why i buy arcane blink when i get ex machina idc what you think, it works for me. Try playing drow or pa with arcane blink, its actually fire im ancient 4 btw
My best machina is with BH and vyse. The only problem is the mana but with free TP who cares.
Love mirror shield + linken combo.. its hard enough for single target caster to adapt to linken, let alone mirror shield.
Items via book deso apex has higher WR since u pick em to finish the game that u already dominated and want to finish, i guess u should count that too
Its also really hard to use an Item that you dont play with alot. Think that is alot of the issue with ex machina.
I mean sure a 12k mmr gamer god will be better than me at it but you dont use it without thinking.
before watched comment. i think china , sea asia pros (real pros) really do well in this video.
Sadly Jenkins has no OF... Yet
Hope still
Why does Bowie remind me of Canadian Lad... or is it their voice sounds similiar
0:47 “does Jenkins has Onlyfans” got me😂
I personally think that Pros suck at tier 5s coz their games rarely go to that point.
glad to see that pros also suck at 60+ games and dont know wtf to do
This is the same dilemma for faceless void like to buy refresher orb which is impossible to pull off double chrono if his item didn't slot with skadi and manta.
I only buy Refresher if the enemy pos1 is hard to catch like Slark. If enemy is just range carries then theres no need to.
my boi is now casting againt, thank goodness
I can confirm that Jenkins is indeed gay 😂😂
Nah the 100% win rate on am telescope got me XD
Does Jenkins have an onlyfans xD. I love Bowie
Great content. Glad to have you back. Keep up the good work
Incredible analysis, thanks for the input.
bowie what is your favourite knife in cs
book of shadows is very underrated
Subscribed you for this haha xd
GOAT IS BACK
GOOD LUCK ON PURSUING YOUR PASSION FOR CASTING THE BEAUTIFUL GAME THAT IS DOTA
If you have enough clips to make a full video of ex machina plays going wrong let's see it! Sounds hilarious. Also please do plug when you're casting and being on panels, i have not seen you do that before but would love to know when and where to tune in
Arcanist and book of shadows are lowest win rate???? How? They're insanely good utility
Bowie analysis is next level I love every second of it
still this slark is higher mmr than u
whenever i have ex machina i just poke and bait enemy bkbs and items because i know its basically gona be 100% uptime on my bkb when i can exit and enter fights at will
remember when chicken fighter medusa choose spider legs over old ex machina which didnot even have mana cost? i remember
quality content
Why are you using Chat GPT? Just to visualize your data? Or are you using it to actually gather data
in a hugely complex game such as data, a simpler item to use that is almost equal to a broken one is always gonna be the better choice.
another banger from my boy d2bowie, keep at it bro im expecting to see you in big stages of dota2!!
They should make the neutral item slot more visible. I think that's the problem
As 4/5 player, I enjoy ExM and able to use it to its peak potential.
Late game supp with bkb, aeon, RO, Windwaker and ExM is pure joy of kiting enemies.
When will we get Bowie and Jenkins bubby action? 😊
neutral items are a mistake tbh 2much rng sometimes i get a good neutral item but sometimes u get useless item for ur role
How long until we see Bowie at TI? Come on guys, let's make this happen
bowie basado
fuck yeah bro
Brazilian accent
true . machina is too overrated , some people cant just see that item like force boot could really. change a war
What about black hole + ex machina though
If you manage to not die after the first BH at that game time (60 minutes) then with Ex-machina allows you to use 3 BH, IF you have enough mana. Thats more than 2500 mana, 3 BH with 2 Refresher uses, BKB and Ex Machina.
I always felt Machina was a questionable T5, nice to see that the data validates my gut.
Machina used to be good but the cd change actually did kill it
lol hi
Glad i didn't see ex machina as overrated alone
Very nice video! Earned a sub, even tho im not really looking to get better at dota.
On pirate hat, i would like to argue that if the game went on for 60 minutes at 10k mmr, they probably farmed enough trough the game and have enough money, so worrying about using the active vs playing the game is more inportant, we can even see from that 12 minutes that he doesn't really buy anything after the pirate hat pickup other than the divine, which he probably already had the money for, from what i can see.
Also they have a clockwork, and this might be a stupid thing to say, but if he stopped to dig the rune out, may get caught out ?
Anyways super cool video, and it made think about netruals a little bit more.
his team could have used the gold, supports tend to be poor even after the 60min mark
@@phando3729 riiight, its money for the whole team. I didn't think of that.
0:47
eye opening video actually. Good job.
this is why for me force boots is the best t5 item.
So glad you came back to make videos
Bowie your in depth is sick!
Tumblers toy only valid neutral item
9:53 Wouldn't it make more sense to make a public google sheets and share the link on your discord server?
it wouldn't make more sense because forcing engagement is a good technique to breed activity and brand awareness. there's a purpose to why the spreadsheet is not readily available to everyone, as to encourage viewers to commit effort. this creates extraneous value of the spreadsheet since you'd "work" in order to receive it, and the "value" is tied to the brand. similarly, this increases the chance for someone to be inclined enough to "return the favor" by donating on Patreon since they've received something of "value" from the creator in return. the replying e-mail will surely contain a plead to make sure they're reminded of that :)
@@mcbenis That sounds stupid tbh, people are more likely to not want to go through that trouble/risk, you want them to share your discord, email, is cellphone next? They already joined the discord, just give them the damn thing... You're being sketchy for no reason at all.
Nice data here!
good work
great video
Why don’t you make your own website that’s better than those other sites? You could crowd fund it I’m sure
that would be awesome! maybe one day :)
@@D2BOWIE today is one day! Just go for it :)
very cool background music, the video itself is very quesionable
I strongly disagree with the point your coach made. Even though dota is a complex game, you can't simply neglect winning opportunities due to their mechanical complications. Most of the good players won't just prefer Mirror Shield in favor to Ex Machina because it makes you think more, they just pick a defensive stance in the game where you might want to have Linken against instant control. Having linken means occupying slot with a very low-stat item, whereas picking Mirror Shield is only an augmentation to character's power. If Ex Machina is a game winning choice, always go for it. But as you said in this video, people struggle to understand when it is a good choice. Having basically a 20 sec cooldown on any item is insanel, not mentioning double hexes/double abyssals. Your team might also pick multiple Ex Machinas to combine them for even longer combos.
The options are just too powerful with this one.
Sir, you can't quadruple bkb, refresher won't allow to refresh the ex-machina, feel free to try in demo mode, still awesome video
I don't think that WR data matters at all on neutral itens. If one team get ex-machina, is most likely that the other team get one to. So the most picked itens are on both teams, the loser and the winner side.
"is Jenkins gay " 💀
A rapier in inventory is going to have an absurd win rate, but that's because of causality going in the other direction. Neutral items somewhat alleviate this problem, but it's difficult to make comparisons when we don't know what the alternatives are. It's like a hero not buying a radiance or desolator because the team already has one.
Anyone telling you not to pick up neutral items with active abilities is telling you that they think you're facing opponents that are stronger players than you are, full stop. If you are the better player, you want as many decision opportunities as you can get, and you'd prefer your opponent to have fewer.
The pirate hat example given highlights a problem with this type of analysis; Satanic was never standing still, he was defending against megas. Every action has an opportunity cost, and he may not have been able to afford it (similarly, no one has experience in a super late game, to say nothing of a 15 year old).
Have you tried working with the API? I'd think it would have to be easier. These videos are great.
Thats a really unrealistic standard to hold yourself against. Thats why bowie demonstrated his points with
You missed the point that, yes, you CAN take all of that into effect, but in the end the truth is that 60 minutes into the game a fucking million things are happening in a teamfight, and having one less thing to worry about can be the difference between winning or losing.
It's a thing you see casters and pros point out when watching games. Even the tip top greatest players in the world will say "Well this team will win. Why? Their teamfight is simply easier to execute".
@@redonyellow2468 An analysis of "let's not analyze it, it's too complicated" is not interesting or at all useful.
@@tdawry You are so wrong about "decision opportunities". You're also weirdly demeaning towards an individual who is rank 10 in the world and the youtuber himself since you've suggested that he should take the easier path to sort his data (it parallels your claim of big number decision opportunities > smaller number)
@@zakra9053 I think what the UA-camr is doing here is quite good, and that the API would scale, if it has the same type of information available. Personally I'd rather he looked at the data more rigorously than using ChatGPT, but he's spending the time getting the data which is probably more valuable, especially since he's making it available to others.