They need to be hooked up to a real thd machine and load tested for ohm and distortion and all of it none of those phone apps aren’t accurate at all I’ve found
The new class D amps can reach higher efficiency than a classic solid state because of switching technology. It can go a bit more over 90%. A 55W input amp has maximum 50W usable power. 170W is a marketing gimmick. I was surprised that a company like Seymour Duncan can go for this cheap strategy .
@Joe Paul They're INCREDIBLE. More power than you'll ever need. Clean, crisp, pure power. And the 3 band EQ makes a HUGE difference. Incredible piece of gear. May seem a little spendy for something so simple but, man is it worth every cent.
fark mate, this comment was 5 years old and you're having a crack now? Nice XD and I've altered my tune a little over the years but good on you son @@judaspriestchild
"700 Watts Vs. 170 Watts! Which Is Louder?" Depends on what kind of amp, what kind of signal, what kind of cables connect it to the speakers, the kind of speakers etc etc. My home speakers are recommended to be powered by 150 to 1200 Watts, and they are played at only 60 , maybe 70db if I'm feeling freaky. That could be done by a 20Watt amp, the other 1180Watts are used to keep the speakers in under control. If the bassdrum kicks or the bassplayer slaps a string, the speaker's drivers *will* follow, 1200W make sure of that. It doesn't mean it's loud, it just accurate. of course, in a guitar amp nobody gives a fart about that because you're adding a ton of distortion and the sound guy... well he's deaf anyway... they all are.
have you tried using the 170 for bass together with any darkglass preamp pedals? like you have a bass pedal chain and the 170 is the end of it that connects to a 2x10 or 4x10 cab similar to a guitar pedalboard setup? cheers
I use the 170 with a B7K into a 212 bass cab. I sold my microtubes head for it! It gets plenty loud and as long as you have a DI there wont be any issues. Sounds killer for bass as well
To the people questioning the usefulness of the cab sims; They seem appealing to me since cabinet simulations in modelers take up more DSP, and sometimes my patches have quite a bit happening. Also, for people who use their own in ear monitor rigs, its nice to have more outputs.
Trey, have you compared the Seymour Duncan amps to the Quilter OD 200? The FX Return on the Quilter should be pretty neutral. I use the Quilter ToneBlock 200 and while it's not as small as the Seymour Duncans, it's very loud, very light and rarely gets more than lukewarm. Love your videos, keep up the great work!
How about Harley Benton GPA-400? I want to test it and compare it some day. No one really review Harley Benton GPA-400, but it looks pretty good for a power amp and it is much cheaper then Seymor Duncan power stage. It have controls more like a real amp rather then having preamp controls like the Seymor Duncan amps. It is stereo and 2x200 watt or 1x400 watt in mono.. This should be more then enough for a serious gig but also for practice. Have a look at this thing. I dont see anyone reviewing this amp on any channel, so if you do you will be the first. Harley Benton is already known to build professional equipment for affordable prices. Their speaker cabs have speaker units that cost more then the cab it self. I dont know how they did that, but I belive the Harley Benton GPA-400 is no exception. So far Harley Benton surprised me with everything they released. GPA-400 is a must try.
Can you use the Powerstage 170 w/ HX stomp for bass going through a 4x10 bass cab & a 2x15 bass cab doing the split crossover method you explained on the HX stomp bass video? Trying to figure out the best way we can run a moduler setup with bass but for it to be as small as possible so it doesnt take up a bunch of room in our rack like our axe-fx 2’s are currently taking up hahaha 😂
I have the PS170 that I use with an HX Stomp, into an EVH 5150 lll, G12H 1x12. Freaking AMAZING. And the cab speaker is 16 Ohm @ 30 watts rating lol. Sounds freakn BEAUTIFUL. I do mostly metal about 75% of each song. With the other 25% being effected clean tones. I'm probably only getting 50-75 watts out of it running that cab & it is LOUD with volume at noon. Putting a 150 Watt, 8 Ohm, Swamp Thang in the cab this week, so I'll be using more volume. But the point is, the amp is amazing. Even if you use it with wrong Ohm speaker, ( which is no big deal, if you're going lower Ohm amp, into higher Ohm speaker. ) But also it isn't killing a 30 watt speaker. I honestly though the speaker would blow immediately lol. So that says alot about the newer EVH 5150 lll 30th anniversary, 30 watt G12H speaker too.
The problem I have with playing out and when using house PA or other Bands being the host is that they DO NOT MIC ANYTHING. This is stupid practice and very unprofessional. Expensive PA and speakers and wedges and the only thing mic'd are vocals. So now the singer is cranked, The drummer is pounding away in an uncontrolled room bouncing signals everywhere and the bass is just booming everywhere. I have a beautiful 50 watt Tube amp and it can't keep up. GUESS WHAT IS COMING TO TOWN BOYS?! Try and keep up!
Can it be done again clean? With Both I would like to see (where & if) it breaks up clean and how much at full volume I'm using A Helix... Cleans Are Important To Me At Least My clean tone requires alot headroom because it's more bassy than usual So I "Bind" with the bass player In my group
I am a bit confised. Is the powerstage an amp (pre+power) or "only" a poweramp? Most revies and tests i can find, peaople use is as if it is a complese amp. I need a power amp connect my axefx to a cabinet on stage only for monitoring, but I need/want a preamp coloring the sound unnecessarily. (Hope this makes sence)
ive been using the 170 in place of a dual rectifier.im using a helix running the dual rec model......................holy fucking shit,this thing is amazing,so much headroom and low end available!!!!! I can honestly say if i had to lose my rectifier i wouldnt be bothered. I will say though that i have notched 4k using an eq on the helix,this for the first time gave me no ear fatigue after 4hrs practice for first time in 20 years!!!!!!! I will also start doing this using a real amp to,i always find whatever amp im using after a few hours everything gets a little unfocused,this is ear fatigue,whenever ive tried turning the trble down on the amp it gets too dark and dull,by just notching out 4k with a narrow 'Q' it takes out that horrible spike that is drowning out other nice frequencies. The trouble with just turning the treble don on the amp is that the 'Q' is ver y wide thus taking out lots of frequencies,using a parametric on the helix allows me to choose the freq i want and 4k seems to be good.
Out of a 16 ohm speaker the amp only puts out a quarter of the power so 700 in stereo 360 per side Would put out 87 watts per side out of the stereo out into two 16 ohm speakers but 170 into one 16 ohm speaker would be 42.5 watts
Since when does the impedance of a speaker affect the power output of an amp in that way? Does this range of power amps have magic sprinkles on top? You are confused with how much each speaker will get. Amps affect speakers, not the other way around.
It’s not so much about the loudness to these higher wattage solid state amps. It’s about the bite and punch especially when you’re running digital stuffs like modellers & etc. Though 170 watts seem plenty, you’re not gonna get the full experience when playing through a cab. 700 watts on the other hand is just on another level. I’ve had the 170 and the bite & punch i’m looking for just isn’t there. When I plug in into an 800 watt Matrix however, then shit starts to get real. Don’t believe me? Just look at Kempers and Bias Heads. You dont see them putting a sub-200 watts power amp in their units. 170 watts may be enough if you’re just playing a 1x12.
Most modern guitar 4x12 cabs are rated at around 150-220 watts so 170 is just about right. Most of the guitar 1x12s are only rated between 50-75 watts so thats roughly 100 watts over rated peak. Im interested in seeing how 700 would sound through a ampeg 4x10 bass cab or a mesa boogie 4x10. Even something like a flat markbass 104hr cab
@@Jihadbearzwithgunz except that class D wattage and perceived loudness is a different thing than running a 60W tube amp through the same cab ;) you cna have a class D 700w still sound quieter and not cut through.
So, I have a 90w Mesa boogie cab. Do you think the 700w version would destroy that? Presumably I just don't push it up that high?? I was thinking about getting a second matching cab to run in stereo.
I see that the 170 version has 55 Watt input printed on the back. 55W input, 170W output? On a cheap Chinese amp I wouldn't bother to look, but this is branded Seymour Duncan. Not quite cheap, also.
Class D is still subject to the laws of thermodynamics the last time I checked. You can't have over-unity (not even unity) efficiency, my "engineer" friend.
Okay why did they put the power switch on the back of the 700 if it can be rack mounted. Just no. Looks good till you have a deep rack and have to dig around for the power switch everytime. Poor engineering on that. Plenty of room on the face but for simplicity sake they did this.. What the hell
Those are great. I use the Matrix GT1000FX stereo 1U rack amp. That's super light weight, only takes up one rack space and sounds really good with no breakup at loud volumes. For a rack system I feel like it's the best option. For a super compact floor based system in mono I'd probably go with the Powerstage 170.
When you say stereo, this all makes sense. 700/2 is 350 roughly twice of 170. And 5db is almost dounble in power so yeah this makes sense. It's like two 350w vs 170w.
I'd love to see a comparison between the SD 170, the EH Magnum44 and Quilter Microblock 45. From what I understand, they can push 4x12s to acceptable levels.
If anybody could help me out? What is the purpose of the cab sim on the 700. Like I could totally hear the difference but I'd just like to understand what it does and of one can benefit from it or whatever? Also if anyone could point me in the direction of some solid vintage 30 or greenback cabs that would be awesome. 💜
I think it's mainly so you can just plug a preamp pedal straight into it and go direct to front of house with a cab sim on as well as to a physical cab, something like that.
This is exactly what I would like to know. I've compared 50w and 100w guitar amps side by side, and at the same volume the 100w thumps and resonates more. and just sounds "fuller". The bass stays tight and doesn't get "wooly". It's not all about volume, it's about thickness and thump. We need to know !!
Because the amp is meant to be a 'no color' amp. This amp is for someone who wants the sound of their pedal, preamp or computer sim to be their primary tone. If you ran this thing clean with your guitar you would be VERY disappointed.
I'd be super wary taking this guy's advice on power amps. Decibel level is the secondary concern to amplifier distortion. He doesn't even bother attempting to measure the distortion between this 2 devices. Speakers don't blow when you give them excessive wattage, they blow when an amplifier has excessive distortion, which is more and more likely from cranking an amp unless they are specifically designed for it, which these particular amps are not. So if you plan on diming on the 170w version, be aware of the potential danger you're putting your speakers in, courtesy of Gear Gods.
Speakers are blown by excessive wattage, full stop. You're absolutely correct though that the problem is distortion. If you have a 170W amplifier, it will deliver a clean sine wave up to 170W. As you drive the amplifier into distortion, the amplifier will start to "clip" the output waves until eventually the output signal resembles a square wave. That same 170W amplifier will output higher and higher power as the amplifier is driven into distortion. Eventually, this distorted wave has more RMS power than the speakers' voice coil can handle. Either the voltage causes a penetration in the coating of the voice coil winding (like corroded spark plug wires), or the voice coil builds up enough heat to melt the jacket/coating and "fuse" the voice coil together (this is when you get smoke). The other sort of failure, which is caused by using an amplifier far too powerful, is the speaker cone exceeds the maximum travel distance of the pole piece and shreds the spider, the suspension, or the cone itself. The pole piece can also bang around inside the magnet and chip off enough material that it becomes fused.
Well the powerstage is running Solid state watts, so maybe there’s a conversion of some sort happening somewhere down the line? Not sure. Interesting to look into though.
It's funny (not attacking anyone) how people will fight for the idea that tube is the superior tone... unless you spend just as much on a modeler like the AX FX (solid state) then it's OK. I guess they internally are disturbed that solid state technology has been advancing so much and for much affordable prices, they question having purchased a tube amp that weighs at least 45lbs and cost them over $1,000 at least, and needs yearly expenses for maintenance on top of that... So to feel better, they will push the idea that "no, no, it's not as good as tube" thing. Seriously, even if you are a major band that tours, with today's PA technology, what is the purpose of owning a 100 watt head in this day and age? You're going to be miked, so headroom is not going to be an issue if you own a 50 watt head or a solid state power amp like these 2... I guess tube amp manufactures at this point have to sell you on nostalgia or the idea of, "now you can be like your heroes of the past by buying a 100 watt head" just like they did. I think retailers will not give in to this argument unless they feel assured that their sales will continue if the market changes... Just curious on people's thoughts.
The Driver I think your point is very valid. I have heavily used both modeling and amps and in the end find when I am recording that the sound of a mic and an amp inspire me the most. Most modelers sound like what I would edit my mixed tracks to sound like which is great but not what I like to hear when I’m playing. It’s really preference. When I travel with playing potential or schedule jams I tend to bring a modeling rig because I don’t know what I’m getting into at all times. When I know I need some bone crushing metal I bring my Krank because it sound like “home” to me. Whatever inspires the musician is the right choice but at the same time practicality and circumstances may alter your choice too.
yeah I agree with you. Tube or solid state. whatever inspires you the best is what one should use. Yet 100 watt head is almost overkill it seems. On top of the fact that you then have to spend extra on a hot plate in order to practice at home with it or are playing a small club. Even if you're a big time act like Metallica or whatever, I doubt they have their master set on 10. No, I think they're mic'ed to the PA. I think even Joe from Gojira said in an interview he toured South America using the EVH LBX surprised me but then again maybe proves my point. Unless there's a sound person out here who can better explain how the industry is going live-wise nowadays. Cheers.
The Driver yeah on many modern high gain amps you’re never about 4-5. It’s funny that my 20 watt Rev Jr Pro is actually louder than my Rev + 120 watt at the same volume up to 4/10. The main difference is that head room goes to poo on the JR past 3-3.5/10 and it gets boomy and “warm” beyond what I like. When mic’ing a 4x12 there is definitely a difference too. All that’s to say, you can get a good mini head and make some good tones and record via the right tools if you know what you like and want the “best” sound you can get. However, many other things need to be considered by a musician and frankly, I almost never take my main amps with my elsewhere because I’m always afraid they will be too loud or not meet the demands of where I’m going to play. For that reason I use a PODxt to good success with a powered PA speaker.
They're both fun... Solid State is bloody great, and Tubes are the lactating boobs... I own Diezel Herbert, Ampeg V4, Fender Dual Showman Reverb, VOX AC4, and Seymour Duncan Palladium + Powerstage with a cavalcade of speaker cabinets... And they are all strong in their own rights!
zenmaster not sure if you’d want to, but if it has a cable running from the speaker section to the back panel of the head portion of the combo, and it is plugged into one of the different ohm-age speaker inputs (again, assuming your amp has this, I know my 6505+ combo did, as did a few other combos I have had. Others did not,) you can unplug that cable from your combo’s speaker input and plug it into the powerstage 170, using the powerstage 170 to drive the speaker and completely bypassing the Head portion (aka the preamp and power amp, where the tubes are) and using straight solid-state watts to power what I’m assuming is the single 12-inch speaker in the bottom portion of your Blackstar. Hope this helped. Was a b*tch to try and write that in a manner you may stand a chance at understanding (not for any lack of competence or ability on your end, purely due to my difficulty in making my instructions clear and easy to follow using words that aren’t shorthand or slang or require previous knowledge or further research to understand.. That said, I hope you figure out what you were trying to . Seeing as how this comment is 8 months old, you may have figured it out long long ago. Either way, best of luck to ya!
Hi, could you please advise what kind of cable to use from output of PS 170 to guitar cab ? is the normal instrument cable fine ? cause that cable normally used from tube amp to cab is too short to use it with PS 170 hooked to pedalboard. thanks for reply.
for a pedalboard based amplifier, I really like the Taurus Amplification Stomp-Head 2 High Gain, although it obviously has a preamp too. It would be interesting to see how loud the Taurus gets vs the Seymour Duncan Powerstage 170 by bypassing the preamp and plugging your Fractal Audio AX8 directly into the effects loop return power amp input \m/ The Taurus is obviously more metal \m/ than the BluGuitar Amp1 which shares a similar form factor to the Taurus and is also pretty cool too
Why is the fan on the front of the 170 this would drive me nuts idk why but seeing the fan out front would be a deal killer for me 700 only option. What is the bass centered at as over youtube i hear little to no chage in eq when you adjusted the bass.
I have had the 170 for about 8 months now and I have had no issues with it yet. Great little amp for Bedroom Rockers who are limited on space.
They need to be hooked up to a real thd machine and load tested for ohm and distortion and all of it none of those phone apps aren’t accurate at all I’ve found
The new class D amps can reach higher efficiency than a classic solid state because of switching technology. It can go a bit more over 90%.
A 55W input amp has maximum 50W usable power. 170W is a marketing gimmick.
I was surprised that a company like Seymour Duncan can go for this cheap strategy .
would this work with a bass and a darkglass or sansamp preamp?
Dubious Daydream it would and it's recommended with the sansamp.
sweet
The eq might leave a little to be desired but otherwise yes..
My exact question I got same gear as you bro
the 200 is where it's at imo
These products are a really good idea with a solid conception; although I'm a valve man through and through I can see the possibilities here.
PS170 2 lbs, perfect sound, insane power. Tube amps? Never again for me.
@Joe Paul
They're INCREDIBLE. More power than you'll ever need. Clean, crisp, pure power. And the 3 band EQ makes a HUGE difference. Incredible piece of gear. May seem a little spendy for something so simple but, man is it worth every cent.
Ok TUBE man lol
fark mate, this comment was 5 years old and you're having a crack now? Nice XD and I've altered my tune a little over the years but good on you son @@judaspriestchild
Hi Trey! I was looking for something similar for bass, to run a Darkglass B7K through. Could that poweramp do it? Cheers :)
Actually I haven't tried it on bass, I don't own a bass cab! I'd like to know as well, although it is designed for guitar as far as I know.
We really care about the maximum power that the amp can supply, even if we have to feed it a hotter input signal.
Time to re-record the intro song. The guitar sounds so boxy.
can a power stage 170 push a ampeg 8x10 in a metal band setting??
sure u could .
@matthew jaramillo : YES.
Used it several times live and during band practice, with a SansAmpBDDI as a preamp.
"700 Watts Vs. 170 Watts! Which Is Louder?"
Depends on what kind of amp, what kind of signal, what kind of cables connect it to the speakers, the kind of speakers etc etc.
My home speakers are recommended to be powered by 150 to 1200 Watts, and they are played at only 60 , maybe 70db if I'm feeling freaky. That could be done by a 20Watt amp, the other 1180Watts are used to keep the speakers in under control. If the bassdrum kicks or the bassplayer slaps a string, the speaker's drivers *will* follow, 1200W make sure of that. It doesn't mean it's loud, it just accurate. of course, in a guitar amp nobody gives a fart about that because you're adding a ton of distortion and the sound guy... well he's deaf anyway... they all are.
Well right but that's why I compared them directly under all the same conditions. It's as close to scientific as I can get hahaha
have you tried using the 170 for bass together with any darkglass preamp pedals? like you have a bass pedal chain and the 170 is the end of it that connects to a 2x10 or 4x10 cab similar to a guitar pedalboard setup?
cheers
I use the 170 with a B7K into a 212 bass cab. I sold my microtubes head for it! It gets plenty loud and as long as you have a DI there wont be any issues. Sounds killer for bass as well
To the people questioning the usefulness of the cab sims; They seem appealing to me since cabinet simulations in modelers take up more DSP, and sometimes my patches have quite a bit happening. Also, for people who use their own in ear monitor rigs, its nice to have more outputs.
Trey, have you compared the Seymour Duncan amps to the Quilter OD 200? The FX Return on the Quilter should be pretty neutral. I use the Quilter ToneBlock 200 and while it's not as small as the Seymour Duncans, it's very loud, very light and rarely gets more than lukewarm. Love your videos, keep up the great work!
Quilter 200w is actually 400w to allow headroom.
I love my quilter.
“Lazy” is a very negative word. “Efficiency” is a more salient description of what I think you’re after: lightweight portability.
700 Watts might work better for bass to push the lows.
How about
Harley Benton GPA-400? I want to test it and compare it some day. No one really review Harley Benton GPA-400, but it looks pretty good for a power amp and it is much cheaper then Seymor Duncan power stage. It have controls more like a real amp rather then having preamp controls like the Seymor Duncan amps. It is stereo and 2x200 watt or 1x400 watt in mono.. This should be more then enough for a serious gig but also for practice. Have a look at this thing. I dont see anyone reviewing this amp on any channel, so if you do you will be the first. Harley Benton is already known to build professional equipment for affordable prices. Their speaker cabs have speaker units that cost more then the cab it self. I dont know how they did that, but I belive the Harley Benton GPA-400 is no exception. So far Harley Benton surprised me with everything they released. GPA-400 is a must try.
Can you use the Powerstage 170 w/ HX stomp for bass going through a 4x10 bass cab & a 2x15 bass cab doing the split crossover method you explained on the HX stomp bass video?
Trying to figure out the best way we can run a moduler setup with bass but for it to be as small as possible so it doesnt take up a bunch of room in our rack like our axe-fx 2’s are currently taking up hahaha 😂
I have the PS170 that I use with an HX Stomp, into an EVH 5150 lll, G12H 1x12. Freaking AMAZING. And the cab speaker is 16 Ohm @ 30 watts rating lol. Sounds freakn BEAUTIFUL. I do mostly metal about 75% of each song. With the other 25% being effected clean tones. I'm probably only getting 50-75 watts out of it running that cab & it is LOUD with volume at noon. Putting a 150 Watt, 8 Ohm, Swamp Thang in the cab this week, so I'll be using more volume. But the point is, the amp is amazing. Even if you use it with wrong Ohm speaker, ( which is no big deal, if you're going lower Ohm amp, into higher Ohm speaker. ) But also it isn't killing a 30 watt speaker. I honestly though the speaker would blow immediately lol. So that says alot about the newer EVH 5150 lll 30th anniversary, 30 watt G12H speaker too.
The problem I have with playing out and when using house PA or other Bands being the host is that they DO NOT MIC ANYTHING. This is stupid practice and very unprofessional. Expensive PA and speakers and wedges and the only thing mic'd are vocals. So now the singer is cranked, The drummer is pounding away in an uncontrolled room bouncing signals everywhere and the bass is just booming everywhere. I have a beautiful 50 watt Tube amp and it can't keep up. GUESS WHAT IS COMING TO TOWN BOYS?! Try and keep up!
Very informative video, btw I thought you had a mega boogie in your nose till I noticed the ring.. 🤘🏼
Better than having a Mesa Boogie in your nose
Can it be done again clean? With Both
I would like to see (where & if) it breaks up clean and how much at full volume
I'm using A Helix... Cleans Are Important To Me At Least
My clean tone requires alot headroom because it's more bassy than usual
So I "Bind" with the bass player
In my group
the cab sim seems excessive, sense almost every piece of gear you'd put through that already has one.
So you have a 2 x 700 watt amp hooked up to a single 120 watt capable cab?
Would have been cool to see them against a tube amp. Maybe a 50 or 100 watt all tube amp.
So which one did you get?
I am a bit confised. Is the powerstage an amp (pre+power) or "only" a poweramp? Most revies and tests i can find, peaople use is as if it is a complese amp. I need a power amp connect my axefx to a cabinet on stage only for monitoring, but I need/want a preamp coloring the sound unnecessarily. (Hope this makes sence)
It's just a power amp, so it's perfect for what you need. I use it for the same thing.
I would be curious to see a comparison between the 700 and the Fryette Power Station.
Here you go Jason Leib: ua-cam.com/video/K8kWbcI81l0/v-deo.html
I wish it had universal voltage selector so u can run it anywhere in the world :c
ive been using the 170 in place of a dual rectifier.im using a helix running the dual rec model......................holy fucking shit,this thing is amazing,so much headroom and low end available!!!!!
I can honestly say if i had to lose my rectifier i wouldnt be bothered.
I will say though that i have notched 4k using an eq on the helix,this for the first time gave me no ear fatigue after 4hrs practice for first time in 20 years!!!!!!!
I will also start doing this using a real amp to,i always find whatever amp im using after a few hours everything gets a little unfocused,this is ear fatigue,whenever ive tried turning the trble down on the amp it gets too dark and dull,by just notching out 4k with a narrow 'Q' it takes out that horrible spike that is drowning out other nice frequencies.
The trouble with just turning the treble don on the amp is that the 'Q' is ver y wide thus taking out lots of frequencies,using a parametric on the helix allows me to choose the freq i want and 4k seems to be good.
Out of a 16 ohm speaker the amp only puts out a quarter of the power so 700 in stereo 360 per side Would put out 87 watts per side out of the stereo out into two 16 ohm speakers but 170 into one 16 ohm speaker would be 42.5 watts
do you think this would affect the tone although they have similar loudness?
Since when does the impedance of a speaker affect the power output of an amp in that way?
Does this range of power amps have magic sprinkles on top?
You are confused with how much each speaker will get.
Amps affect speakers, not the other way around.
The power stage 700 is 700 watts per side. Also, I'm pretty sure in this video he's using a 16 ohm cab but I could be wrong about that.
Excellent demo. Thank you for sharing. You helped me make a decision with the purchase of a PS170. Peace be with you always.
Which is louder?
Dumb question.
Both go louder than you would ever turn them up in ANY performance venue.
why are you micing it and not going direct
Why would I go direct for a power amp demo, that doesn’t make any sense
It’s not so much about the loudness to these higher wattage solid state amps. It’s about the bite and punch especially when you’re running digital stuffs like modellers & etc. Though 170 watts seem plenty, you’re not gonna get the full experience when playing through a cab. 700 watts on the other hand is just on another level. I’ve had the 170 and the bite & punch i’m looking for just isn’t there. When I plug in into an 800 watt Matrix however, then shit starts to get real. Don’t believe me? Just look at Kempers and Bias Heads. You dont see them putting a sub-200 watts power amp in their units. 170 watts may be enough if you’re just playing a 1x12.
Most modern guitar 4x12 cabs are rated at around 150-220 watts so 170 is just about right. Most of the guitar 1x12s are only rated between 50-75 watts so thats roughly 100 watts over rated peak. Im interested in seeing how 700 would sound through a ampeg 4x10 bass cab or a mesa boogie 4x10. Even something like a flat markbass 104hr cab
@@Jihadbearzwithgunz except that class D wattage and perceived loudness is a different thing than running a 60W tube amp through the same cab ;) you cna have a class D 700w still sound quieter and not cut through.
So, I have a 90w Mesa boogie cab. Do you think the 700w version would destroy that? Presumably I just don't push it up that high??
I was thinking about getting a second matching cab to run in stereo.
Bought the 170, marry it with the Joyo American preamp and pedals and it's just perfect.
I see that the 170 version has 55 Watt input printed on the back.
55W input, 170W output?
On a cheap Chinese amp I wouldn't bother to look, but this is branded Seymour Duncan.
Not quite cheap, also.
Class D is still subject to the laws of thermodynamics the last time I checked. You can't have over-unity (not even unity) efficiency, my "engineer" friend.
radu3g - I’m guessing 170w at 100% THD
Thanks for this vid man... That's exactly what i needed!
Okay why did they put the power switch on the back of the 700 if it can be rack mounted. Just no. Looks good till you have a deep rack and have to dig around for the power switch everytime. Poor engineering on that. Plenty of room on the face but for simplicity sake they did this.. What the hell
The small one is almost $600 Canadian .. WOW ... that is crazy. I think I will stick with my FRFR or running into the FX Return of my current amp
Those are great. I use the Matrix GT1000FX stereo 1U rack amp. That's super light weight, only takes up one rack space and sounds really good with no breakup at loud volumes. For a rack system I feel like it's the best option. For a super compact floor based system in mono I'd probably go with the Powerstage 170.
Why does the fan stay on the whole time on the power stage 170? Just got it its brand new.
When you say stereo, this all makes sense. 700/2 is 350 roughly twice of 170. And 5db is almost dounble in power so yeah this makes sense. It's like two 350w vs 170w.
"Everyone in the band hates you as well as the sound guy"...very funny.
I'd love to see a comparison between the SD 170, the EH Magnum44 and Quilter Microblock 45. From what I understand, they can push 4x12s to acceptable levels.
I have the powerstage 170
Was this cab 16 ohm?
I want this exact same setup with the 170 version. My rig is going to fit in my backpack
deadasfak take a look into Joyo mini amps. Way more affordable and sound great.
Do they have a poweramp? Because I already use a modeller (Axe ultra), so I'm spoiled, I'm team modeller.
Yeah I'm thinking about getting a board big enough to fit just my AX8 and the 170 and getting a really long speaker cable.
If anybody could help me out? What is the purpose of the cab sim on the 700. Like I could totally hear the difference but I'd just like to understand what it does and of one can benefit from it or whatever?
Also if anyone could point me in the direction of some solid vintage 30 or greenback cabs that would be awesome. 💜
I think it's mainly so you can just plug a preamp pedal straight into it and go direct to front of house with a cab sim on as well as to a physical cab, something like that.
I bet it sounds fine in person but does not translate through the mic
What's the low end/resonance quality like on these compared to a valve amp?
This is exactly what I would like to know. I've compared 50w and 100w guitar amps side by side, and at the same volume the 100w thumps and resonates more. and just sounds "fuller". The bass stays tight and doesn't get "wooly". It's not all about volume, it's about thickness and thump. We need to know !!
Maz Klassa i want to know the same thing... ?!?
@@artvandelay2111 exactly. The headroom isnt for blasting peoples' faces off, its for low end clarity.
But the 700 is stereo ??
170!
you should do the 700 vs the 200, just bought the 200 b/c the extra features. Pairs well with my FM3
I did a video shooting out all 3
THE 700 RUNS STEREO WHY WOULDNT THEY HAVE INDEPENDENT EQ LOW MID HIGH FOR THE LEFT AND RIGHT CHANNEL.
Because the amp is meant to be a 'no color' amp. This amp is for someone who wants the sound of their pedal, preamp or computer sim to be their primary tone. If you ran this thing clean with your guitar you would be VERY disappointed.
I'd be super wary taking this guy's advice on power amps. Decibel level is the secondary concern to amplifier distortion. He doesn't even bother attempting to measure the distortion between this 2 devices. Speakers don't blow when you give them excessive wattage, they blow when an amplifier has excessive distortion, which is more and more likely from cranking an amp unless they are specifically designed for it, which these particular amps are not. So if you plan on diming on the 170w version, be aware of the potential danger you're putting your speakers in, courtesy of Gear Gods.
Speakers are blown by excessive wattage, full stop. You're absolutely correct though that the problem is distortion.
If you have a 170W amplifier, it will deliver a clean sine wave up to 170W. As you drive the amplifier into distortion, the amplifier will start to "clip" the output waves until eventually the output signal resembles a square wave. That same 170W amplifier will output higher and higher power as the amplifier is driven into distortion. Eventually, this distorted wave has more RMS power than the speakers' voice coil can handle. Either the voltage causes a penetration in the coating of the voice coil winding (like corroded spark plug wires), or the voice coil builds up enough heat to melt the jacket/coating and "fuse" the voice coil together (this is when you get smoke).
The other sort of failure, which is caused by using an amplifier far too powerful, is the speaker cone exceeds the maximum travel distance of the pole piece and shreds the spider, the suspension, or the cone itself. The pole piece can also bang around inside the magnet and chip off enough material that it becomes fused.
No it will not blow the speakers it’s a class D amp 2 and 4ohm cabs are uncommon you won’t get the full 170 or 200 watts on an 8 or 16ohm guitar cab.
Any idea how max 50 and 270W powers on those units deliver 170 or 700W to speakers?
Well the powerstage is running Solid state watts, so maybe there’s a conversion of some sort happening somewhere down the line? Not sure. Interesting to look into though.
It's funny (not attacking anyone) how people will fight for the idea that tube is the superior tone... unless you spend just as much on a modeler like the AX FX (solid state) then it's OK. I guess they internally are disturbed that solid state technology has been advancing so much and for much affordable prices, they question having purchased a tube amp that weighs at least 45lbs and cost them over $1,000 at least, and needs yearly expenses for maintenance on top of that... So to feel better, they will push the idea that "no, no, it's not as good as tube" thing. Seriously, even if you are a major band that tours, with today's PA technology, what is the purpose of owning a 100 watt head in this day and age? You're going to be miked, so headroom is not going to be an issue if you own a 50 watt head or a solid state power amp like these 2... I guess tube amp manufactures at this point have to sell you on nostalgia or the idea of, "now you can be like your heroes of the past by buying a 100 watt head" just like they did. I think retailers will not give in to this argument unless they feel assured that their sales will continue if the market changes... Just curious on people's thoughts.
The Driver I think your point is very valid. I have heavily used both modeling and amps and in the end find when I am recording that the sound of a mic and an amp inspire me the most. Most modelers sound like what I would edit my mixed tracks to sound like which is great but not what I like to hear when I’m playing. It’s really preference. When I travel with playing potential or schedule jams I tend to bring a modeling rig because I don’t know what I’m getting into at all times. When I know I need some bone crushing metal I bring my Krank because it sound like “home” to me. Whatever inspires the musician is the right choice but at the same time practicality and circumstances may alter your choice too.
yeah I agree with you. Tube or solid state. whatever inspires you the best is what one should use. Yet 100 watt head is almost overkill it seems. On top of the fact that you then have to spend extra on a hot plate in order to practice at home with it or are playing a small club. Even if you're a big time act like Metallica or whatever, I doubt they have their master set on 10. No, I think they're mic'ed to the PA. I think even Joe from Gojira said in an interview he toured South America using the EVH LBX surprised me but then again maybe proves my point. Unless there's a sound person out here who can better explain how the industry is going live-wise nowadays. Cheers.
The Driver yeah on many modern high gain amps you’re never about 4-5. It’s funny that my 20 watt Rev Jr Pro is actually louder than my Rev + 120 watt at the same volume up to 4/10. The main difference is that head room goes to poo on the JR past 3-3.5/10 and it gets boomy and “warm” beyond what I like. When mic’ing a 4x12 there is definitely a difference too. All that’s to say, you can get a good mini head and make some good tones and record via the right tools if you know what you like and want the “best” sound you can get. However, many other things need to be considered by a musician and frankly, I almost never take my main amps with my elsewhere because I’m always afraid they will be too loud or not meet the demands of where I’m going to play. For that reason I use a PODxt to good success with a powered PA speaker.
metallica uses axe fx
They're both fun... Solid State is bloody great, and Tubes are the lactating boobs... I own Diezel Herbert, Ampeg V4, Fender Dual Showman Reverb, VOX AC4, and Seymour Duncan Palladium + Powerstage with a cavalcade of speaker cabinets... And they are all strong in their own rights!
Prices$$??
the 170 model is 399$ and the 700 is 699$
Hi, can i plug the 170 in my Blackstar HT-5 Combo ?
zenmaster not sure if you’d want to, but if it has a cable running from the speaker section to the back panel of the head portion of the combo, and it is plugged into one of the different ohm-age speaker inputs (again, assuming your amp has this, I know my 6505+ combo did, as did a few other combos I have had. Others did not,) you can unplug that cable from your combo’s speaker input and plug it into the powerstage 170, using the powerstage 170 to drive the speaker and completely bypassing the Head portion (aka the preamp and power amp, where the tubes are) and using straight solid-state watts to power what I’m assuming is the single 12-inch speaker in the bottom portion of your Blackstar.
Hope this helped. Was a b*tch to try and write that in a manner you may stand a chance at understanding (not for any lack of competence or ability on your end, purely due to my difficulty in making my instructions clear and easy to follow using words that aren’t shorthand or slang or require previous knowledge or further research to understand..
That said, I hope you figure out what you were trying to . Seeing as how this comment is 8 months old, you may have figured it out long long ago.
Either way, best of luck to ya!
I like that tone! Tight and crunchy!
Thanks, it's a pretty basic boosted 5150 patch, nothing special!
Are those better than the matrix ?
well the matrix has Keanu Reeves so no
ha ha ha thanks man ... have you tried axe 3 ? is it worth the double price of ax8 ?
I appreciate the super accurate iphone decibel meter.
Steven McLean shut up
@@jeremyc827 Quite the daunting vocabulary you have there, Jeremy.
You probably don't want to velcro these to a pedalboard...
No problem with my Powerstage 170.
This was really helpful. I’ve been on the fence about getting this for a complete Helix rig **decision made**
Brandon White dude me too!!! :D
Hi, could you please advise what kind of cable to use from output of PS 170 to guitar cab ? is the normal instrument cable fine ? cause that cable normally used from tube amp to cab is too short to use it with PS 170 hooked to pedalboard. thanks for reply.
I have yet to see a video where they sound like a real tube amp tho! Sounds like crap so far
Positive Grid Bias Mini Guitar (when it comes out) sounds like much better value personally. Thanks for the demo Trey \m/
for a pedalboard based amplifier, I really like the Taurus Amplification Stomp-Head 2 High Gain, although it obviously has a preamp too. It would be interesting to see how loud the Taurus gets vs the Seymour Duncan Powerstage 170 by bypassing the preamp and plugging your Fractal Audio AX8 directly into the effects loop return power amp input \m/ The Taurus is obviously more metal \m/ than the BluGuitar Amp1 which shares a similar form factor to the Taurus and is also pretty cool too
Why is the fan on the front of the 170 this would drive me nuts idk why but seeing the fan out front would be a deal killer for me 700 only option. What is the bass centered at as over youtube i hear little to no chage in eq when you adjusted the bass.