The LIVE FAILURE of World’s Best Resurrection Scholar (Gary Habermas response)
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- Опубліковано 22 січ 2024
- Scholar Gary Habermas' 1000+ page resurrection magnum opus is out, but can he withstand the push back of Paulogia's "Minimal Witnesses" natural hypothesis that fully explains his minimal facts approach? Has Gary wasted 50 years and 32,000 hours?
"No Resurrection Required" by Paulogia
• "No Resurrection Requi...
On the Resurrection, Volume 1: Evidences by Gary Habermas
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50 Years Studying the Resurrection Magnum Opus by Gary Habermas
• 50 Years Studying the ...
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If you're willing to read Gary's book and cover it for us, the least I can do is pay for the damn thing.
Howie! That's so generous. Thank you.
Wow. Awesome
So now if a thousand people bought you a book, that would be generous to.
Dang! You, my good sir, are a gentleman and a scholar.
@@ronaldlindeman6136If they all donated $75. That would be pretty generous yeah
Gary Habermas - the man whose resurrection book kept getting longer while his list of minimal facts for it kept getting shorter.
Well duh. If you could factually prove Christianity, the book would be like 6 pages long. Since the facts clearly don't speak for themselves, the proportion of his book that is meaningless doublespeak shoots through the roof.
@@JD-wu5pfYep, my post was meant to be humorous pointing out the absurdity of him for years (decades?) claiming he's writing this voluminous tome that'll supposedly finally end all debate on the resurrection while simultaneously conceding facts. I think his minimal fact argument has been reduced from like 15 to now 5 1/2 by his own admission.
@dougt7580 Yeah sorry, I meant to make my comment more humorous but it was early and I hadn't had my coffee yet so it just came out as grumpy haha
@@JD-wu5pfNo worries, I didn't take it to be grumpy or condescending. And besides, no one can be expected to be writing clearly before their 1st cup of coffee! 😊
@@dougt7580that’s some truth! I’ve embarrassed myself a few times writing something “spicy” before coffee
"World's best resurrection scholar" is akin to being the foremost authority on Prometheus's liver condition.
Somebody has to be!
ROFLOL
That's brilliant, wish I'd thought of it.
it ain't good, usually.
Excellent reference. Well done
When people like Gary mire the conversation down in endless semantic detail, I like to take a step back and remember that these tenuous “minimal facts” and the thin lines of reasoning that extend from them are all supposed to be a justification for believing in wild supernatural phenomena. Looking at it that way, you can see how juvenile this all is. Nobody starting from square one would reason to belief in resurrections and gods and miracles because of stuff like this. NOBODY. Grown men just sit there piddling over this stuff to justify what they already came to believe in for non-intellectual reasons.
There’s a minimal fact for you, Gary.
Hey, it's Zod! Love your channel.
To your point: The question I always ask theists is whether they remember consciously transitioning from non belief to theism and, if so, what persuaded them. Guess how many good answers I've gotten! Suffice to say, my findings line up with a recent quip from Alex O'Connor, who said, "When you hear somebody recounting a conversion story, how often does it
really begin with 'premise one?'"
I was thinking, 'This commenter not only lays it out both simply and eloquently.'. Then, I saw it was Zod and thought, 'Of course.'. Kryptonese education at its finest.
Here is a minimal fact.
-In some of the earliest post resurrection stories about Jesus some of his closest followers don’t recognize Jesus.
One fun exercise would be trying to check what other supernatural claims are true based on these standards.
His followers didn't recognize him? Maybe he shaved his beard! 🤔Or grew a beard - or cut his hair into a Mohawk like Travis Bickle in "Taxi Driver"! 🙂@@ramigilneas9274
(worked on his book for 35 hours a week for 14 years)
Truly, impressive. Few people can claim to have devoted so much time and effort to something so completely useless.
reminds of that onion skit about the man who devoted his life to studying anteaters.
At least anteaters are real
If he'd taken a few more seconds to run it through a calculator, he'd realize he'd only spent 25,480 hours on it, just over 20% less than his claim.
That's roughly three or four times longer than it would take a moderately determined person to get a PhD. Call me cynical but I have my doubts.
Hey now, Duke Nukem Forever happened
He's like a professional Bigfoot hunter. At least they get to go camping.
32000 hours of confirmation bias. What a waste.
I believe I've previously supplemented a post with this theme, but I'll reiterate my opinion:
You know Paulogia is a worthy of being a scholar by the fact that he's pilgrimaged from having been an ordinary, run-of-the-mill UA-camr (in terms of notablity) to combating the likes of fundamental Christian scholar Gary Habermass in less than a decade. This fact is profoundly euphoric for a mind teeming with skepticism, such as myself.
So another tv pastor writes a book. How original.🙄
@@hackman669lol U better buy it if U want to make heaven
@hackman669 Thank you immensely for your sarcastic bite! 🥳🤔😕💛If you desire to consume my content, then proceed to The Infographics Show's video on Jesus' resurrection. My comment is categorized under the "newest" portion of that video's comment section.
@@user-kv2xy8rf3g hi 🙂 why Jesus not showing to everyone when he resurrected
Paul :"I won't offer a critique of the book until I've read the entire thing through at least once.
Gary : "I should have made it longer....."
I'm surprised he published it. There is no possible motivation other than it being true. 😊
👏👏👏👏
🤣🤣🤣
@@goldenalt3166 criterion from embarrassment
Well volume 2 still to be released later this year.
We can't get a straight story on the assassination of JFK which happened 60 years ago. How can we possibly think we can know all about an extraordinary claim about something that happened 2000 years ago?
Exactly!!!!!!!!!
Because ....🎶the bible tells us so🎶..............🫠
We apply the concept/theory of UNIFORMITARIANISM.
This was coined by geologists, but has utility in almost any epistimelogical discipline. It basically means that natural processes working today, worked in the same way in the past.
So, all the 'miracles' and things in the bible that require us to suspend rational belief and accept some supernatural explanation run counter to the uniformitarian theory.
Actually, we can get a straight story on the assassination of JFK. He was murdered by Lee Harvey Oswald. The trouble is that people don’t want to believe the boring truth.
The same applies to the resurrection. It didn’t really happen and the stories about it were made up. But that’s boring.
Been screaming this for years!!!
The fact the book uses the word "evidences" in the title is already a huge red flag!
Evidences is a word
Honestly, I think it's a fine word, it's a shorter way to say "pieces of evidence". But yes, it does sound wrong and dumb when you hear it.
TalkOrigins talks about the "evidences" for macroevolution.
@@LuciferAlmighty 'Evidence' is an uncountable noun. Use of the plural is both awkward and inappropriate in ordinary English.
@dougfraser77 evidences is a word in English. Nothing wrong with it, it's a valid word.
I've been studying flat earth for 30 years for 70h every day.
That's why I'm an expert on flat earth and what I say goes.
Wait - what do you mean it doesn't work like that
since the earth is flat, the days are 87 hours long and it works like that. wait...
You could wake up one hour early and make it 71h every day
Damn that's a lot of youtube
The Earth IS flat. And the Sun is a giant Destructo Disk.
That's exactly how it works....lol
35 hours a week for 14 years..... Just to have it masterfully ripped to shreds in less than 22 minutes by Paulogia.
From this day forward, any wasted time in my life will forever be known as having Habermased my time. Sitting around Habermasing instead of working. Roll a blunt and Habermas. All that time I Habermased dealing with my crazy ol baby momma who still ain't changed, still more productive than the time he took writing his book.
😂😂😂 👍
Did he miss this?
1 Corinthians 15:3-8 KJV
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; [4] And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: [5] And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve: [6] After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep. [7] After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles. [8] And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.
I've read the first 6 chapters which covers the intro through Gary's argument for the historical Jesus. I probably won't read the rest for a while. Other than Gary's poor arguments for the historicity of Jesus, this little bit stuck out to me:
```When studying ancient Greco-Roman history, it becomes obvious that virtually all of these ancient authors recorded various miracles and other supernatural occurrences, such as healings, prophecies, omens, portents, and the like.``` (p. 115)
Gary here wants to say that people should trust the gospels as historical because all historians of the time included supernatural occurrences. He includes healings and then three different words for prophecies. The issue is that prophecies have a fairly easy natural explanation. You just have a prophet make a bunch of prophecies then you just record the hits and forget the misses. It's not all that complicated.
Later in the book Gary want's to say that Christians don't have to take these non-Christian supernatural claims seriously because they are not credible and he says this:
```Moreover, the similarity to the earlier New Testament miracle claims of Jesus, as well as the plain fact that healing events can actually occur without any supernatural intervention at all, leave these accounts without any real differentiation from the individual arguments for the New Testament data.``` (p. 124)
Here Gary admits that reports of healings are actually not necessarily supernatural. It's very odd to me how weak his argument was in this section.
Yikes. Great point.
Special pleading
_"You just have a prophet make a bunch of prophecies then you just record the hits and forget the misses. It's not all that complicated."_
Or just have them make their prophecies after-the-fact.
@@fred_derf
Arseophecies - when flatulence is mistaken for words.
The Gospels are historical evidences. Pretending they are not is against actual studies and science for witness testimonies.
Your heart is the reason why you reject them, not science.
Who the heck was paying him for 14 years? That's a big advance.
Evangelical Christian donations, probably. They're quicker to give money, and less likely to do due diligence than most publishing companies. Though paying Trump's legal fees is probably a big draw on this resource right now...
I am guessing his intention was to fill 1000 pages with crappe and then we are just supposed to “take his word for it” since you’re “ unwilling to read the whole thing”
I believe I've previously supplemented a post with this theme, but I'll reiterate my opinion:
You know Paulogia is a worthy of being a scholar by the fact that he's pilgrimaged from having been an ordinary, run-of-the-mill UA-camr (in terms of notablity) to combating the likes of fundamental Christian scholar Gary Habermass in less than a decade. This fact is profoundly euphoric for a mind teeming with skepticism, such as myself.
I think he worked for those years at a christian University as "researcher". Thus also the research assistent staff (young graduates earning their first positions and such).
Wikipedia opines: "He is distinguished research professor and chair of the department of philosophy and theology at Liberty University."
Plenty of money for zero results there.
@@astrinymris9953 I had trouble getting through "to do due diligence". Quite a tongue twister. 😀
Yeah, ive procrastinated on projects when I don't like how the results are coming out. I understand, Gary, i really do.
A thousand pages written on minimal facts ? Gary's work is like the product of those tailors in the story about the Emperor who spent all his money on fabric thot only those of the purest heart could see. And here we have "young Paul" pointing out that this "Doctor" has no clothes/arguments !!
Bravo Paulogia. Bravo !!
To help defray the cost of Gary's book(s). Thanks for doing the heavy lifting, Paul, and I look forward to your first book report.
BTW - I noticed that you've begun releasing podcast episodes again and I couldn't be happier. Happy Year of the Dragon!
Thank you so much for the support! And yeah, sorry for that podcast hiatus.
Hes caught hundreds of snakes, been bitten hundreds of times and stepped on 32,000 nails... this is what professional liars say...
I know you are smarter than me, but I do not understand the relationship between catching snakes and standing on nails.....*shrugs*
@@perfectblindguy bro I'm in the same boat, it's a very weird opening statement... who counts the nails you step on and how stupid are you to do this 32,000 times... and then brag about it...? Lol so many questions...
If he has been doing this every day since he was 10 years old, that means he steps on more than 10 nails per week. Sounds about right.
@@mattf5935 you actually believe hes stepped on 32,000 nails...? Even if it's true, what does that say about him...? Does he work at a nail factory with snakes and just fucks around to find cause hes into that...? Who would even brag about this...? Is so outlandish of a statement that you simply cant believe him...
I believe I've previously supplemented a post with this theme, but I'll reiterate my opinion:
You know Paulogia is a worthy of being a scholar by the fact that he's pilgrimaged from having been an ordinary, run-of-the-mill UA-camr (in terms of notablity) to combating the likes of fundamental Christian scholar Gary Habermass in less than a decade. This fact is profoundly euphoric for a mind teeming with skepticism, such as myself.
It's sad to see someone so proud of having completely wasted their life.
"...I've caught hundreds of snakes and bit hundreds of times..." - - This doesn't speak very highly of his ability to learn from his experiences.
He has stepped on "32,000" nails? I hope he decided to invest in a pair of boots with steel soles.
And both statements show Gary's penchant for hyperbole.
Sounds like more of a lie than hyperbole.
@@robertwarner-ev7wphe probably took a snake hunting tour once in the Everglades
Oh!.... Sorry... I thought he said "snails"! 🤣
Your arrogance will be the reason why those snake bites killed you, but not him. Don’t test God’s patience, because he will allow the venom to destroy you.
@@justice8718 Wow, you mean timberry was killed by a snakebite? I don't understand why you're replying to him.
Gary actually got killed by snakes a few times but he resurrected
What kind of snake handler gets bit THAT OFTEN!? Is that a kink I haven't heard about?
Well one of the minimal facts is that he used to be alive, and that he has recently been seen alive again. I don't know where he is now, but would anyone really hallucinate? There were even group appearances. His resurrection is clearly the only reasonable explanation!
Hey, this apologetics stuff is pretty easy. If only I didn't have this inconvenient atheistic moral compass...
@@noneofyourbusiness7055 See, Atheism is a worldview, with moral pronouncements. Checkmate! /s
I believe I've previously supplemented a post with this theme, but I'll reiterate my opinion:
You know Paulogia is a worthy of being a scholar by the fact that he's pilgrimaged from having been an ordinary, run-of-the-mill UA-camr (in terms of notablity) to combating the likes of fundamental Christian scholar Gary Habermass in less than a decade. This fact is profoundly euphoric for a mind teeming with skepticism, such as myself.
Who knew the "first fruits" of the resurrection would be nuts?
"The big four"
John, Paul, George and Ringo
Yeah, yeah, yeah!
Leatherface, Freddy Krueger, Michael Myers, Chucky.
More like Winter, Summer, Fall and Spring!
@srthomas65 .....huh?
Paul(ogia) was referring to 4 people, 2 of which were John and Paul. I just tweaked it a bit.
@mattCrawley I'm referring to astrotheology
1000 pages seems like a written gish galloping.
I hope your book doesn't detract from the exemplary job you do on these videos. I was indoctrinated into paranoid Christianity and your videos help me find the actual evidence of religion (or lack thereof) and expose the lies.
Thankfully I was always a rebel so I naturally questioned what I was told by authority and didn't stay a believer for long. The damage religion has done on my family has been large and I've seen firsthand what happens to people who don't seek actual treatment and instead 'go to god'.
Keep up the incredible work you do!
Those are kind words. Thank you. Well done for escaping the maze.
Matrix? :) @@Paulogia
@@joe5959 So you're claiming to have evidence? Well, why hide it? Present it if you have it.
Otherwise, the null position.
@@joe5959 Contempt for zealots making a living off of pretending some ancient anthology is "the word of god (tm)" which does NOTHING to make the world a better place and more than talking about Harry Potter or The Lord of the Rings.
What WOULD make the world a better place is simply following the philosophy of that namesake: by loving and forgiving. Not one person's mental or especially physical heath has been improved by the 70 hours of work done by this blathering "Doctor's" work.
@@joe5959 If you don't want to hear evidence against your case, I don't have to listen to yours either (especially since your argument is "do your own research" right before stating you don't want to hear anything else but what you already know). One-sided arguments are not proper discussions.
Well, if you need a Paulogia convert named James to proclaim your truths… At your Service 😊
Sure, I'll call you brother!
You don't happen to have a brother named Jesus, do you?
@@IanM-id8or yes, folks will say I witness... man I didn't see nutt'n unless cash, wire, cheq or money order I'll see whatev you want
@@IanM-id8or Only a gardener, unfortunately.
I'll contribute as well!! You're doing the Flying Spaghetti Monster's work!!🤗
Thank you so much, dude!
R'amen!
There are plenty of people alive right now who make all kinds of eye-witness claims that I don't believe. Why am I expected to believe supposed eye-witness accounts from people who lived (supposedly) 2000 years ago?
And I'm not obligated to provide an alternate explanation. If a claim is outrageous, I simply don't believe it. It's not up me to prove it wrong.
Exactly!!!
32 hours per page might be the record for the slowest writing ever seen. I should be expecting PhD scientific paper level writing on every page, but I'm actually expecting fancy word salad and half-truths. Have I just become too cynical?
He is a scholar, but he is also paid to make people believe. He will of course try to convince people of things that are not actually true.
George R. R. Martin: Hold my beer.
No, you are right.
No. Gary is more or less that way. Can sometimes be too esoteric.
@@raptorcrasherinc.9823 When is the Bible ever wrong about you?
It doesn't bode well when the word "evidences" appears on the cover of a book that supposedly deals with evidence.
Nothing wrong with the word evidences.
@@LuciferAlmightyAs a word, no. But "On the resurrection: Evidences" doesn't make grammatical sense.
@@TheUltrahypnotoad off topic much
@@LuciferAlmighty Nothing wrong with words like "evolutionists" or "auditing" or "clear" either, but if I see them on a cover of a book written by-insiders-for-insiders, I doubt the veracity of every claim made in that book.
@@LuciferAlmighty It's a grammatical mistake, the word is being used incorrectly.
It is not 'off topic', as that particular error is mostly used by liars.
But even setting that aside, a grammatical/spelling error in the title of a book, does not bode well for the quality of the contents.
It makes me smile every time i hear, " for the bible tells me so" jingle!!
I love that Habermas is already on the defensive, he knows every single point he tries to make in the new monster of a book has been shredded already.
It was funny watching him "squirm" just trying to explain his "facts" to another apologist. Imagine what he would sound like trying to defend his claims (which have already been refuted numerous times) to a real historian.
@@ObjectiveEthics He just gets angry and offended that people question him. He's got this idea that his pile of minimal facts arguments is so perfected, purely because of his personal investment in them, that to question them is an insult. If he tolerates it at all it will be from a vastly more credentialed expert than himself, and even then I doubt he would aquiesce on any front.
Of cource, when he started this it was the 12 minimal facts. This was reduced over time until we have what we have now. And the premise is that these are facts that skeptics and believers can agree on, which is not true.
I just don't believe Someone can work 70 hours a week for 14 years.
I did it for 6 months and was so tired I was beginning to think I had brain cancer. Took 2 days good rest to recover and realize I was tired.
Granted it was a more physical job but I was also younger and healthier than Gary
Depends on how he defines work. Remember, he might also be counting interviews, time spent at church to 'review' the material, lunches, travel to the library, getting distracted on an interesting historical story from roughly the same time period... I can see him certainly technically claiming that W.
@@chameon378For tax purposes, it was all about the book. 😊
My father in law is a physician workaholic. His work is a core part of who he is. He worked 60+ hours per week for decades. He “retired” about 7 years ago and now only works “half time” at 40 hours per week at 73 years old.
Hard agree. What he includes in 'work' is probably a bunch of nothing, the way many white-collars do.
Aside from the fact that people tend to exaggerate these things, if he considers "research" (i.e., reading stuff) to be "work" in this regard, then it's totally no big deal.
Paul - never underestimate the contribution you have made (and continue to make) to rational discourse and against superstitious thinking. Over time, many thousands of people will see your content and it will contribute to their decision to leave the faith they inherited and embrace reality.
The self-proclaimed "magnum opus" is actually here
well, volume one of four
I surprised we even got this. I cant say I'll read it. I'll leave it to you paul....I trust ya.
@@Paulogia Really? Ok I heard it now. A bit verbose that boy
A magnum octopus is a many tentacled splendour.
I am in the club of those who have lost a child. I see my son Seth all the time. I see him on the street, in my dreams, on occasion, I can smell his hair and its' been 5 years. My fellow lost child club members all report something similar.
Virtual hugs through the internet.
Several times on Paulogia’s videos I have listed multiple examples of non-Christians dying for their deeply held beliefs; therefore using the same logic to prove that those beliefs must be true, else why would they die for them. And since their numbers were so much greater, perhaps they are even more true.
The outraged responses are as consistent as they are hypocritical. Attacking the individuals involved (“How can we be certain they were dying for that belief at the second of death”). “Their beliefs are automatically false since they don’t agree with my church”. And “only those who die for my church are real martyrs.”
The myopic denialism of others beliefs is sad, but all too common.
“We believe it because a single source tells us.” Paulogia brings this up so often. Keep up the good work.
Got to agree.
It is certainly a form of cowardice when someone turns off comments on their video.
It's also an admission that they know they're full of crap and don't want it pointed out.
Always great to hear a man who spent 14 years looking for the "best" evidence he could find on his published topic admit he doesn't care if he's wrong about his presented topic. Clearly the pinnacle of integrity 🙄
As he was writing this greatly anticipated (at least by fellow apologists) multi-volume tome, I wonder how much time Gary Habermas spent looking at himself in the mirror and saying, "Yeah, that's right bitches, I'm a real bible scholar".
We should be clear and honest and say that the sources avaialble to him have been avaialble to everyone for a very long time and yet still the resurrection remains in doubt. I wonder why 😁
I am admitedly sad that you did not include Gary's claim that Paul was able to verify that he saw the Risen Jesus with Peter and James on the basis of what he looked like, but you made me happy with his snake-hunting and nail-stepping stories.
Given the gospels describe resurrected Jesus as changed or unrecognized, it's pretty dumb to even claim that Paul's Jesus looked like Peter's Jesus.
He looked like DB Cooper but with longer hair and a beard
Paul only asserted that Jesus was a bright light.
None of the Gospel authors witnessed jesus.
@twitherspoon8954 Paul doesn't say what he witnessed. Acts gives two different accounts.
@@goldenalt3166
_"Paul doesn't say what he witnessed."_
Acts 22:6: “About noon as I came near Damascus, suddenly a bright light from heaven flashed around me."
Of course Jesus is a fictional character.
You should make your minimal witness thesis a PhD dissertation!
I believe I've previously supplemented a post with this theme, but I'll reiterate my opinion:
You know Paulogia is a worthy of being a scholar by the fact that he's pilgrimaged from having been an ordinary, run-of-the-mill UA-camr (in terms of notablity) to combating the likes of fundamental Christian scholar Gary Habermass in less than a decade. This fact is profoundly euphoric for a mind teeming with skepticism, such as myself.
Family Guy Habermas is an endless source of comedy. Thank you, Paul, for wading through this aeroplane chock of a book so that we don't have to - not that I ever would have, but I am curious as to just how minimal Gary's facts are.
I would love to see you and Gary have a direct chat! That would give great "closure" on both sides, I feel. It's been a joy watching this all unfold throughout the years.
Thanks & Cheers!
💖
You can watch the conversation between Habermas and PineCreek Doug.
That's probably how a discussion with Paul would look like... Paul asks short little questions and then Habermas rambles along for 10 minutes until he forgets what the question was.
@@ramigilneas9274 Habermas, WLC and Jordan Peterson are one of thos trinities which overlap with other fundamentalist/literalist circles. I always thought of WLC as a deactivated JP. All three tend to grease themselves up then proceed to ramble when faced with the simplest questions.
"Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience." -M. Twain
@@ramigilneas9274 expecting Habermas to be an honest interlocutor is just silly...
I believe I've previously supplemented a post with this theme, but I'll reiterate my opinion:
You know Paulogia is a worthy of being a scholar by the fact that he's pilgrimaged from having been an ordinary, run-of-the-mill UA-camr (in terms of notablity) to combating the likes of fundamental Christian scholar Gary Habermass in less than a decade. This fact is profoundly euphoric for a mind teeming with skepticism, such as myself.
*Exceptionally Verbose ;*
Taking over 1000 pages, to sum up a claim, that could easily be laid out in a short pamphlet.
_A highly polished turd._
I can cover shipping. Lol. Thanks Paul. Excellent work as usual.
Deal! very generous
Paul, you just get better with every passing day.
Can't believe you finally have book in hand!! Wow long time coming
Dear Paul, you could write an article and submit it to a peer-reviewed journal (maybe co-authored with the help of a friend scholar). A short peer-reviewed article in a respectable journal carries more weight than a 5-kg non-peer-reviewed book 😁
He's been bitten hundreds of times. HUNDREDS??? Why am I having trouble believing that. However, if it is true, he must easily be the world's worst snake hunter. My advice to Gary is if you ever visit Australia, do NOT go snake hunting.
Habernas is a hobbyist apologist, NOT a biblical scholar.
Of the hobby lobby ilk even
That's apparently how the biblical scholarship community sees Gary, if they think about him at all.
So, we waited 14 years for that?
I suspect that Peter, Paul and Mary provided us with vastly better evidence for the existence of Puff the Magic Dragon
Marijuana is absolutely real! What are you talking about?
"WE" are a patient people, we are waiting for the last two books of Song of Ice and Fire about that long too.
For someone who has spent 70 hours a week over 14 years, at least half of those on this one book, as well as teaching at 15 graduate schools on top of his main university of employment and other books and articles he’s published in that time it makes you wonder how much time Gary spends with his students.
Given how many students are enrolled at his university compared to staff. Only 700 odd full time staff and 3000 part time for 96,000 students.
The university I attended had over 3000 staff for around 10,000 undergrads and 6000 post grads.
I'm not sure having Gary Habermas turn up to give a lecture would really improve the academic experience of the students or the quality of their education.
You get me so excited about Habermas... it's some kind of talent, for sure.
The strange thing is if a grown adult says he has conversations with an imaginary friend you would be called nuts.
The word 'facts' in this is doing lifting so heavy it's able to resist the pull of a neutron star....
"Evidences". OMG - even the title of the book screams ignorance
That word is such a red flag these days. It's only used in the plural by theists deceiving
Evidences is an actual word.
@@LuciferAlmighty so is fishes. My point remains
@alexmcd378 what point?
@@LuciferAlmighty that the plural form is almost never used by anyone except theists trying to deceive, and is therefore a red flag
How do we even know that Paul and Peter weren't the PT Barnums of their time? What did either actually do to earn our belief?😊
Paul and Peter earned the belief by living people who saw them perform curses and miracles. You are literally using the fact they are dead to claim “oh they had no evidence for it”.
George Washington is a man of God who many wild stories that were true and witnessed by others, who spoke of prophecy, but even though he was the man to found a successful nation that overcame the world, you would refuse to believe no matter how recent he is to only be under 300 years apart from us.
When you die, no one would even know you even exist. And it’s a fitting end you put yourself into.
Every preacher out their thinks they are the Peter Jackman version of the con artist P.T. Barnum. And it was Barnum who is claimed to have said "There is a sucker born every minute.", which is why we see these megachurch and televangelists working to grab every dime from those folks....'cause if they don't ....someone else will.
You’re fun. Thanks for the hard work.
Thanks for watching!
I'm so distracted by Habermas' voice. He sounds like Peter from Family guy.
Look! My cereal spelled out “Oooooooooo”
Dad… those are cheerios.
Oh geez. Now I can’t stop thinking about that.
@@mjjoe76 sorry dude 😂
@@adamredwine774I think Hitchens used that in one of his debates
@@ATOK_ he did
oops, I read the caption as "liver failure" initially
Somehow, Gary's book makes me think of the scene in The Good Place, where Michael says that he could read all of Earth's literature in an hour, 'but this took me two weeks to get through. I mean ... it's so convoluted...' Granted, I haven't read it... but...
Pine creek recently replayed his chat he had with habermas. For someone who is claimed to be one of the most experienced apologists he got smoked
I actually like the minimal fact name. Because there are minimal facts,like none.
Completely unconvincing. Thanks Paul.
Gary has been paid to do nothing for the past 14 years, and so have his research assistants... I'd like to take his role upon his retirement. Anyone want to be my research assistant?
They must suffer from so much cognitive dissonance that it hurts
Why does the phrase “post hoc rationalization” keep coming to mind?
I would love an episode on the politics of how a Pharisee, Paul, was able to obtain the political power to “persecute Christians”, whatever that means. Was he given the power to issue death sentences to Christians, for example? Was there some kind of already established alignment or agreement between the Roman Empire and some elements within the Israelite internal political structure?
Yes, you literally shown yourself to be ignorant of Jewish-Roman history simply revealing your inconfidence in this subject.
@@justice8718 Yep, not that up on Jewish-Roman history. Why do you think I asked the question?
You can always self-publish the book. What matters is how well a theory is defended. Of course, this defence must follow academic principles to be taken seriously, for instance:
- Weigh your hypotheses against contrary hypotheses.
- Construct logical, sound arguments.
- Use the evidence we have, as we have it.
- Mention sources (primary, secondary) and the latest bibliography.
- And, most importantly, use scientific methodology (history, textual criticism) and a multidisciplinary approach.
Some core problems I think Minimal Witnesses hypothesis should deal with:
- Given the fact that the gospels are literary constructs, not historical accounts, how can we know they used oral traditions or previous written materials from the time of Jesus? And, if they used them, how can we tell them apart from the evangelists’ (whoever they were) own inventive?
- How can we know who Jesus’ disciples were if Paul (our first source) doesn’t mention any, only apostles who, according to Paul, only knew about Jesus from hallucinations and scripture?
- In essence, what evidence do we have of any witnesses to Jesus’ life and/or death?
Literature and history are not false dichotomies. Extensive studies of the gospels and letters has shown traditions - this is consensus.
What a surprise that Habermas turns out to be a snakehandler. We already knew he sells their oil.
You’d think, as a person who has studied the resurrection for fourteen years, he’d know that the bit about snakes at the end of Mark was tacked on well after the majority of the book was written.
@@jeremypnet Apostle Paul got bitten by one, didn’t care, and the thrown it into the fire, surprising an entire fleet of poisoned man.
Here is my 1 minimal fact argument to show that the resurrection did not happen ... Jesus ain't nowhere to be found.
He is in the imagination of the folks who gather in tax free clubhouses each Sunday, being told by the P.T. Barnums out there, that "he is your buddy - alleluia !"
*Taking it on faith : **_The gospel of "hearsay"_** ;*
It seems obvious as to why Christianity puts such a high priority on _believing things on faith._
With having nothing more than _hearsay stories about Jesus,_ they have no choice but to _take it on faith._
*Faith in the words & writings of men that **_"claim" to speak for Jesus_** .*
What, no "for Bible tells me so" jingle?
It’s in there. 😂
Outstanding work as always, Paul.
I have to say I think you're well on your way to developing it. You've been researching the topic for years for your videos. Primarily, learning how to write a book will be the hardest part for you if I had to guess.
But if I had to request one thing it would be that I think you should be sure to lay out the goal of the book as not some necessary naturalistic explanation but one of the most reasonable inferences from the strong and available evidence. Good luck.
Good advice.
Por que no las dos? It's not necessary in refutation to offer potential answers, but it's a nice touch.
@@Loki-
I agree. I was noting that since Paulogia is offering a potential answer it would be good to clarify it as one possibility since many may wish to pretend like he is presenting it as the only or a necessary answer of how things must've gone.
It is just an idea of how I thought he could head off refutations that would miss the point. That a naturalistic explanation of the supposed facts can be made. Which many theist wish to say one cannot be made and that as such a supernatural explanation is warranted.
In terms of getting help, maybe lay out the process and what you could use help with?
For example, if you needed transcription of your video replies into coherent paragraphs on the subject.
Then just put up what you need so those of us with a little extra time and the right skillset could help.
@mikehill1114
You replied to me, not to Paulogia.
The desire to be convinced makes me suspect of any claim that you desire to be convinced is true.
I am very late, but i just wanted to tell you how much I love how you do what you do. This was fantastic, as always. Thanks for your precision!
@Paulogia: I’m so glad about the direction your channel has taken in the past few videos. I can’t overstate how happy I am about the quality and type of video you’ve been uploading lately.
They are so desperate to prove it's more than faith and feelings. Spoiler: It's not.
How, how, how... do you spill 32,000 hours of work and dedication into a 1000 page magnum opus and never find out that 'evidence' is a mass noun and 'evidences' is a verb?
Im sorry - whats D O C T O R Gary's ph.d in, again?
-And why didnt he use his honorific in his book _which he needs publicity for??_
Dafuq is this guy doing?
I am so enjoying the comments. Well done everyone 👏👏👏🍀🍀🍀
Happy reading! I do hope it’s well written 😁✌️💚🤘
Gary is wild, he makes me laugh with how confident he is when he speaks.
He's gotten paid to travel and paid off a mortgage with this crap...of course he's going to say this polished turd of arguments smells wonderful, even as folks hold their noses talking about it.
Love your work!
Thank you!
Can't wait for your book.
Thank you for the great videos!
Many more people claim to have seen Elvis alive after his death, than claim to have seen the resurrected Jesus.
I say we have maximal facts for Elvis' resurrection
Something about James (brother of Jesus) I don't get and please correct me if I'm wrong. He was a skeptic or non believer and then decided is brother was in fact the son of god and converted? But growing up didn't Mary and Jman explain to him about his Mums miraculous conception and his brother being a deity? Growing up together James was totally oblivious to the fact that his brother, was not only pretty cool, had nice, wise things to say, but was a fucking god? THE god? Not much communication going on in that household.
_"Not much communication going on in that household."_
Jesus had four brothers and multiple sisters.
You'd think that he would have told them that he is literally god and created the universe by himself.
@davcan18 I think you have an exceptionally strong argument. Along these lines:
• Mary became pregnant while unmarried. Her villagers either believed that this was a virgin birth, or they didn't. If they generally did, then how to explain Jesus's own brother's skepticism? And how to explain (Mark 6:4-13) that Jesus _could not_ perform miracles there? That Mark passage says that her fellow villagers were skeptical of Jesus's divinity, so they must _not_ have believed that Mary's pregnancy was miraculous. But then they must have thought that she was pregnant by a man not yet her husband. Was this not a deeply shameful taboo? How did Mary & Joseph avoid expulsion or even stoning?
• How is it possible that Mary and Joseph, _the two best parents who ever lived,_ forgot their child, the Creator of the Universe, behind in Jerusalem _for an entire day!?_ And he apparently took no notice of their departure either! (Luke 2:41-52)
• We are taught that Mary & Joseph were poor. So what did they do with all that gold, frankincense and myrrh? (Matthew 2:11)
Awesome! I love your passion! I hope this works out for you!
Great video Paul thanks
Edit: it doesn't take away from my commentary below, but is your minimal witness theory basically that it would help if it wasn't just a guy or two claiming the resurrection? Like if a whole town saw him revive and have multiple different diaries, historical books, etc that that would cement this claim better?
5:37 I have family members who believed they saw a family member recently after they had passed away. I even had moments of having to take second glances at people who I thought resembled them.
How is fact 2 a special circumstance for Jesus? Especially considering they worshipped the guy besides just loving him. When a normal phenomena occurs I believe that's less likely to be a miracle.
Maybe fact 2 is summarized and I'm missing conversations they had with Jesus in which case I also have a suspicion on that claim. I've had many dreams with conversations with loved ones who passed away. I also have had incredibly vivid unreal dreams. I believe it's more likely a combination of a consequence of the psychedelic power of the mind and these people aren't here to testify on their account. We get these stories passed down by banana phone, after all.
Of course I get to the end and you clarify hallucination possibility which reminded me of your videos I've watched on this which has been a bit ago. I usually comment as watching because I don't want to forget, but then getting answered by finishing the video is always the risk! Lol
@Loki - We have Greco-Roman literature in which a lot of elements from Homer, Euripides, and Ovid are incorporated. Not to forget that parts from Josephus are copied as well. So the idea that this is anything but Greco-Roman literature is entertaining, but without evidence. So any character in these stories are like Harry Potter and Hermione. By the way, Hermione can't tell us that Harry is a mage as she is a fictional character and this is what we find in the unnamed fan fiction we call gospels.
@@TorianTammas thank you for the information! I've not taken that many history courses nor done much self study.
Honestly, I'd be happy to give Gary all 12 disciples. If you told me "12 religious dudes thought they saw their cult leader after he died!" my reaction wouldn't be "oh wow, that must mean he really came back to life!" it'd be closer to "Wow, what a story Mark... Anyway, how is your--"
The title amuses me. That one can be a scholar for an historical event that never took place is, well, amusing.
I consider myself something of a scholar on Undertale's lore, and that certainly never took place. But at least in my case I know it's not actually real. Just one of those things that only a true scholar would know :P
The latest in Finno-Korean Hyperwar archaeology
Jesus Christ is more real than you will ever be.
@@justice8718Get help
Well covered. Can’t wait for the review of the book.
I think you need to call it the Minimal Witnesses*Hypothesis*.
Just wondering who finishes his book first: Gary Habermas or George R.R. Martin?
Awesome job as usual Paul.
I would argue that the fact the Gospels reference "But some doubted" might speak to fallen away close disciples.
I don't think we will be able to finance your minimal facts magnum opus with superchats but let us know what sort of numbers we will have to post to get you close
The group resurrection appearances are listed here by Paul:
1 Corinthians 15:3-8 KJV
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; [4] And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: [5] And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve: [6] After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep. [7] After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles. [8] And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.
Exactly, there goes his “minimal witnesses” theory.
As far as we know, in all the literature we have, Odysseus travelled through Hades.
Being a resurrection scholar is akin to being a scholar on the contents of the basket Little Red Riding Hood brought to Grandma's house.