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Engine Replaced because of a misfire?
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- Опубліковано 18 сер 2024
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#tuneup #ignitioncoil #misfire #enginefailure #engines
@WrenchingWithKenny @snafuperformance2136 @traditionovertrend2704 #keepwrenching #wesselmotorworks #wrenchingwithkenny #misdiagnosed #fordranger #repeatrepair
"If that is the worst thing that happens today, it's not a bad day." What a quote! I may be using that in the future. A lot!
I guess after changing the wngine, the next logical step would be to change the Ford Ranger.
100% agree with you on not listening to what someone has done before. It can take you down rabbit holes you don't want to go down. It prevents clear thinking which is the one thing we need to troubleshoot.
It's great watching skilled honest people doing their trades
Amen!
Yes good ole plain men doing what they like doing no Drama no murders no stealing just good mostly honest men doing there thing got to Love It
As a dyi guy I learned long ago to, instead of going to the parts store and looking up the part and purchasing, to remove the part( water pump, fuel pump,...), take it to the part store and match it up bolt hole pattern, connector locations and attachments, general shape etc. If it didn't match exactly and the counter guy told me well that's what's in the book, I'd send him back to check the shelves and invariably he come back with the right part.
Its good to compare parts, however sometimes the part in your hand is a known issue, with a track record of early failure, and has been redesigned to correct a specific issue. As a professional, i see redesigned parts that bear little to no resemblance to the original. But install it and it works. Just bear that in mind.Sometimes looking different is a good thing.
One time long ago I changed a motor in a 84 dodge ram 4x4... Original motor was a 318. It had a bad ticking noise. Only 68,000 miles. Just bought the truck like that cheap because the previous owner was fed up. I had a known good 360, so I did the swap. Started it up and it had the exact same ticking noise. Well I went underneath and the source of the ticking, took the splash shield off from the front of the transmission. No noise HUH. It was a warped splash shield. Straightened it out and walla fixed it. Live and learn. Boy I felt dumb. But hey it wasn't my only screw up
Lol back in the day first car was a Plymouth fury 3 with a old 318 engine in it that time would would skip time just by looking at it worse engine ever made
I always keep the old parts off of jobs that I do. They come in handy. I just changed the cam and crank sensors on the 4.6l Ford. Drove it for a while and it started doing the same things that I changed them out for in the first place. Including codes. So I put the original parts back in. Fixed the problem, like forever. I'm suspecting, in hindsight, that corrosion on the contacts was the culprit. The very act of changing and scraping the contacts in the process was the actual cure. And who knows what's going on with the new parts. Yes, I inspected the parts upon removal and all of the seals were intact and nothing was leaking. Like your thoroughness in your work. I'll be watching your videos for future content!
Another good video and I walked away knowing more about troubleshooting misfiring engines!
A tip for using the Snap-on Solus tool and diaging misfires on fords: The drive cycle misfire counter is not a real time counter. What I tend to default to in this case is the cylinder contribution test. It's in the "functional tests" submenu in the engine menu. While it isn't a misfire counter, it does tell you in real time when a cylinder dies, and I tend to find it most useful. Fords that are too old to support Auto-ID on that scanner though will show the test as an option, but they aren't compatible, so the old school methods of testing for misses have to be used.
Mode 6 TID 53 will give you cumulative missfire information as well.
But, Why no check engine light?
@@tonywestvirginia because Ford was real casual about it.
@@jamesgeorge4874 c. C
Good old waste spark spark system Kenny. I have a 2007 Ford Ranger , has happened twice to me. If a spark plug wire opens ie, infinite resistance the spark has to try to find a way to return back to the coil. It will find a way , probably through the coil. The result is a bad coil as well as a bad spark plug wire.In these situations, replace both the coil and the spark plug wires. And you are correct, watch the coil pack replacement. some are 3 nut holddowns and others are 4.Think proper terminology is type 1 and type 2 coil pack. great video as always , Thank You for sharing.
Beautiful verbal explanation of different symptom ignition vs fuel injection..
Firing order and spark plug wire order is the same on both coils. It's the coil plug wiring that's different. Gotta love engineers!
Appreciate your clean language sir. Shows quality.
Once again, thanks for the lesson, and the ride along!
If you ever need to put an engine in one of those 3.0 rangers you buy a Taurus engine and remove heads and put ranger head gaskets on. Junk yard will tell you 1500 for an engine for ranger and 500 for low mile taurus. The head gasket on ranger has extra hole on them that allows coolant flow to heater core.
If I had a nickel for everytime I heard "it's a new part" and then found it was just another used part from something somewhere. "But it's new to the car". That's what he did. It's his version of new.
On the ranger you had 5/6 reversed brother but it's all good
Good job diagnosing however, just so you are aware direct injected chevy truck motors will misfire just like a failing coil when the fuel injectors begin to fail so dont let those fool you should you ever come across one
Great information on recognizing a ignition to fuel event.
Nice work! Yes, never believe a customer or the guy who couldnt fix it, and just work with the understanding you're starting from scratch. I was sold a passat wagon a few years back that had an issue with over heating, shop the owner took it to replaced the thermostat, and still over heated, so they said its going to need a new engine (no idea where they got that from) when I was sold the car, they told me the info, but I just went in blind like normal, pulled the thermostat, it was rated 20-25 degrees higher than the operating temp of that engine, put the correct one in, fixed. My buddy is still driving as a daily to this day.
Just because its new don't mean its GOOD, probably more true now than a few years ago with so many cheep parts out there. I am a new subscriber and still welding the spanners at almost 70 years old. I enjoy your channel very much and am still picking up hints and tips from you and Eric at South Main Auto.
Yeah, DOA is a real issue for me these days.
New=
Never
Ever
Works
Man that’s nuts that a guy replaced an engine for no reason. But as soon as you said it’s missing and it had new plugs and wires i was like its the coil. I have one of these pickups and I’ve learned a lot of their quirks and the coils are common to go cause a problem
Kenny, Great Job, I did the same for OMC Johnson/ Evinrude 25 Years ago, I enjoyed my job, doing the Same in Outboards your approach is great! Tom W
This is one of the best misfire diags i have ever seen! I learned new ways to look at things on this video! Thanks!
Thanks for the hard and soft misfire thinking So hard to track down at times engine management boxes etc I did hear of one proved to be a signal from a front break sensor
you called it and sent it right on .
Nobodys perfect Sir if you were close to where I lived I'd take my car to you.Alot of your shops are cheaper than the Dealerships.Its a roll of the dice if they know what they're doing.I wouldn't hesitate to take it to this Guy.You can tell he knows what he is doing.Keep posting Sir I'll keep watching
Yep. As a coil heats up it will usually misfire more often.
Good info on the hard hit vs soft hit, never thought about it but have experienced it many times. I have a 3800 series 1 Buick and it was doing exactly the same, random hard hits especially at idle in gear. At first thought it was a plug, they were a little old anyway. New plugs helped, got rid of a misfire while accelerating but still had a random bump at idle. Ended up being a bad coil. Had an extra in a box and swapped it in. Luckily it happened to be the first one I changed. Coils right up front, super easy fix.forgot to mention, this bad coil still worked but ohming it showed infinite resistance in the secondary. Must have been a tiny break in the wire toward the end where the spark could jump it internally.
Good stuff you do a great job on giving your explanations you would b a great teacher for the kids wanting to learn mechanics 👍👍
Nice diagnosis! I once changed an engine for a friend at work just because they said it was bad. I didn’t question it. When I tried to start it, it was a crank no start. I called the guy up and got some more info, he said they tried to start it and poured some fuel in it and it backfired and then some family’s members tried to fix it. It turned out to be a bad fuel pump and it did have a few bad sensors. I’m pretty sure the engine is still good. Just wish I new the whole story before I put the new engine in.
Waste spark system diagnosis, here is a new way i figured out 20 years ago. Write the first half of the firing order, then write the second half right underneath it. Those are the complimentary cylinders. The ones that fire at the same time. To track a misfire, you can switch those 2 complimentary wires and see if the misfire stays, or follows the secondary coil. Its essentially switching coils. No haters please, i have used this method for 20+ years. Its proven. A waste spark system has 1 primary coil, with 2 wound secondary outputs.
Also remember, new parts can fail too. Just because someone put a new part on doesn't mean it hadn't failed.
Twice is too much.
Well in airplane school you not only find the failed part, but also the reason it failed. Brother kept having his rockers broken where the push rod sits...twice. the third time it happened I discovered lash in all the rockers and simply tighten them snug to the push rod. Thought was why didn't the mechanic who serviced it didn't bother. Anyway my brother then stated the car never had so much power. Anyway, he must mean parts from Auto Zone or something.
@@brahtrumpwonbigly7309 diagnosedan (who is going to pay for this ?) have a look
Had one of these rangers with a persistent cyl3 misfire. New plugs, new wires, harness ✔️,injector ✔️...
Finally replaced the new autolites with ngk problem solved till now
@@jaws978 YA Plugs can make a HUGE difference. I bought a 1963 charger RT with a 383 mangum. It ran good but when I decided to tune it up I found someone had put autolight plus in it and my mechanic friend told me to switch to Champion. WOW, what a difference, Certain cars need certain plugs for sure.
As an owner of a 98 ranger with the 3.0 and had a misfire issue, my problem was when it was changed to aftermarket wires, they were garbage. Changing to Oem ford wires solved the problem.
The plug boot can also grow a carbon track, the Ford F-150 Eco boosts are notorious for that. Jeep wranglers can have a tiny hole burned through a plug boot that is hard to spot, sometimes watching in the dark works. Good job!
I've heard the hard miss Kenny was describing called a fish bite miss and as mentioned usually it's an ignition problem.
Great video Kenny.
Great, real-world video. Thanks.
I had 7 dead a/c compressors out of the box, right in a row on a Honda van. After 4 the boss thought I was nuts. Stay safe and be blessed
That's the way I am too. I think people take it wrong when I tell them that I don't want to hear what they think is wrong. I've seen vehicles with many new parts and the owner is saying why the fuel pump, the filter, and even the fuel line is new but they still get no gas. You brought it here and I'll fix it and to do that I need to check a thing or two. Turned out the shaft between the cam and the pump was wore away. The hardest to find problem I had was a simple glove box switch that had a broken mount. I knew which circuit but it powered nearly everything within the interior. I found it my second time through on my hard target search. I checked the operation of the button by hand and found that the whole switch as a unit moved. Otherwise how would you know the glove box light is still on with it shut. Shit bird I worked with spent two days working on the car in vain. The third day boss man calls over, 'Hey J, see if you can figure out what's wrong with this car'. I walk up and inspected it seeing everything under the hood is new and replaced. With that I proceeded to try a compression check. Lo and behold, the second cylinder I tested had no compression.
I'm an old-timer, and I once found the fuel pump cam lobe worn flat on a Ford pickup with a flathead V8. The cost to replace the cam was insane. I wired in a $30.00 electric pump and the customer was delighted.
First time nice fix.
When presented with a coil design like this an easy way to dx the coil is swap the wires to opposite sides from coil. It uses a waste spark system. So if misfire moves from 1 to 4 the dx will be complete. And if you have 2 misfiring cylinders on same contributing coil then also pretty concrete. Chrystler products and others also use this design. Hope this helps. Also, grounded test light to visualize missing spark works with wire pulled off, but may have to power brake the engine and not get run over 😆.
The numbering of the cylinders on those coil packs is important.
Make sure.
The OEM part has numbers printed on it.
The cylinders on a Ford are sequential per side.
Check the service manual or look it up online.
The numbers can get cleaned off the coil pack pretty easily.
Find out what you have for your build and calibration.
Ford literature has been helpful in the past and they have updates if you check for that too.
I've seen the new parts for tune and driveability, from an independent repair company returned to the customer and motorcraft parts made it run like brand new.
Assumptions get made by people and their expectations during maintenance and home repair.
Checking what's right for that build and correcting it is half the job.
When those coil packs first came on the V6 distributorless, I wiped some dust off and noticed the printed on numbering sequence.
I've seen a few times where cleaning the engine compartment easily washed off the indicating numbers from the coulpack.
Sweet diagnose..
Great job, I noticed your ear was tool on this job. I have a 97 Ranger 3.0V6 and that random tick was the same deal it was misfiring. But the coil was fine the hood above in the closed position would bounce a spark I replaced the wires and put a plastic shield over THE "AFTERMARKET NON FUNCTIONAL HOOD SCOOP" everything works fine!
Nothing like experience!
Aircraft Quality troubleshooting approach to basic automotive issues . LOL . Another good informative video .😎
Nice job Kenny 👏👏👏👏👍👍👍👍
Perfect advice! go off the complaint that's how I work and I'm just a diy person,, atleast they put a good motor in, nice video!
Awesome channel. Very enjoyable and informative..
I just bought a 2000 Montero sport for $1200 from a "friend" after handing him the cash I discovered that the harmonic balancer bolt was backed out. I had gone 2 miles. I said I wouldn't have bought it knowing that. He said I was trying to rebuild it. It was bound for the junkyard if driven. Luckily the threads on the crankshaft were good. Pulley is scored and galled and probably the timing gear it mates to. I am retired and it took 4 months to save for my buddy deal. I don't want to remove the timing belt but probably have to change the timing gear. Folks saying I am overreacting just tighten it. I was called a perfectionist by the x. I said who else would you rather have working on the aircraft your rear end is riding on. With limited resources I must make it count. Not working on cars for years because I could afford new ones then changing major parts in the yard just reminds me of younger days when I was poor but didn't know it. I will make it run well and will not stop. I have been without a vehicle 2 years and COVID I isolated now I will make it reliable because I have road trips to do. Not too much invested if it dies on a trip to walk away! It's an adventure.
Great job I'm new here and believe me I've seen this a time or two myself as long as I've drove my own cars always repair my self 93 ranger 300,000 miles just replaced transmission in it yep standard shift 2.3 engine
Just came across your channel Kenny you now have a New SUBSCRIBER!! I work in the Automotive field and have worked on cars and trucks that was Miss Diagnosed nothing new or bad New Part.Good job Kenny have a Great Day.
Great Fix!
One word of advice Kenny on high performance cars I tried advance auto it never worked I had to end up buying a original Coil for my 2095 Grand Prix 3800 I enjoy your videos many I down load and listen at work .
I once changed my roofing shingles because I had a leaking pipe
Hahahaha😆
Hell 40 years ago I bought a new house because I had a Bad Wife.
@@williamtaylor628 Probably had to cuz the bad wife took the old one!
Did it fix you pipe?
Right changed my oven cause my wife said she could cook!
Engine replacement for no reason. Sickening.
There's one on here where someone pulled a 4.7 Toyota because it broke a timing belt and bent all the valves. Except a year later the guy tore the motor down and it was perfectly fine; just needed a new timing belt. EXCEPT after sitting outside for a year the cylinder bores were rusted and pitted beyond repair.
I had a 2008 F150 with 6 cylinder and it had the same problem. I'm thinking there was a problem with those coils, but that's just my guess. Keep the good stuff coming.
The good ol fish bite misfire
Good job. I suspect someone did the same thing you did with a new "wrong" coil, then just put the old one back in and still claimed new coil was installed. Maybe.
Great diagnosis
Bought a 100 k mi Corolla from a friend at trade-in value. I had been in the car recently so I thought I knew it. He drove it over, I paid him, then his wife picked him up. Next day I noticed it ran rough at idle. Called him - said his mechanic said it needed a new motor which is why he sold it. Went to replace the plugs and found all of them were loose. Tightened and all was well. I advised him to find another mechanic.
I had a Citroen Berlingo van, which if I missed a service, it would switch the MIL light on, and cough a bit, whilst I am driving.
The Berlingo has a 1.6 HDI 4 cylinder engine. But the diagnostic tools will give the code for a cylinder 6 misfire.
All I would have to do is either get it serviced, or erase the error codes. Then it will run fine.
This made me think that the computer on the vehicle is set to show up problems, that do not exist, just to make me get it serviced, if I had forgotten.
I had this problem before, i had bought some cheap coils off ebay and installed them. They would work for a good 2,000 miles and then out of no where it would be a internment misfire. I ended of going OEM and its been fine every since
Great video! I Learn something everytime!
I had a misfire in my 2008 Ford Ranger (2.3 L 4 cyl.). We were pretty sure it was the ignition module. I changed it with two different after market units and still had a misfire. The plugs and wires were changed within the last year, so I didn't suspect them. When I purchased an OEM module from Ford, the misfire cleared up and I have had any issues since.
Wow, that’s a big parts cannon!
Those coils are notorious for being bad right from the box. My 99 Explorer takes the same coil. Three coils later I finally got one that worked correctly. The original coil was doing pretty much what your faulty one was. Sporadic misfire, sometimes lasting a few seconds, other times lasting much longer.
I had problems on a Windstar with constant misfires! Wound up being cracks in the intake! 3.8L V6 was a plastic intake!
I have had a really hard mis-fire in my 1998 A6 2.8. It initially only happened at very high load (trying to accelerate up a hill, locked in top gear from 13 - 1400 rpm - I know) usually only once or twice but then got worse, similar conditions but less load and more frequent misfires. I thought it would be the coil pack, but I had an exhaust leak in the flexi between the after the 1st o2 sensor but before the cat and 2nd sensor. I stopped the leak and the misfire did not return until the other side started to blow and now is gone again. A leak there seems to upset the fuel calculations so I assume it was trying to too rich or lean.
Yeah, when I get an oxygen sensor slow response error, I now know it is a hole in the exhaust.
@@dennisharvey4499 When I bought it 8 years ago I knew I was finally making the leap to digital motoring after clinging to analogue. Luckily I hit the sweet spot between - it is OBDII so the scanners work but it has no check engine light and doesn't give me any codes when it happens. Took longer to figure it out but I love that my car is like 'Whatever' and keeps rolling..
I'm a chevy guy but I got a mud truck ranger with a 3.0. That is a tough motor. It's seen more Rev limiter than idle. Wish company's made stuff like they used it
Great video as always
Intermentant
Intermittent 🥷
@@peepholepeople4490 Occasional.
i put 2 new coils in my 04 3.0 and both still had a misfire the third coil worked like a charm
Your a badass mechanic 🥰 👍
Replaced engine bcs of a misfire ? Ya why not , when it comes for an oil change I don't deal with it ... I just replace motor 😂😂🤣🤣🙄
It's scarey , isn't it?
Kool, very good VIDEO. nice to know
ran into something similar with a older chevy cavalier. was my bosses mom's. luckily i was the only one who worked on it for many years. anyways, we had a newer hire in the shop who got a turn on it, came in for misfires. he replaced the coil pack with aftermarket and it got no better. he spent a few hours on it and tossed his hands in the air saying the engines gotta be shot. i knew that didn't sound right, especially since i had just overhauled the motor a year prior, went to the nearby scrap yard and ripped out a used oem coil pack and it purred like a kitten.
Good old Ford 19xx ½, 20xx ½. I had an 89½ OJ Simpson Bronco that ALWAYS needed "the other part".
A fish bite miss under load is usually ignition.
You can also watch the 02s when the misfire occurs, if it indicates rich it is typically ignition, lean is typically fuel. Gives a good direction.
Where do pool cleaning companies keep finding these trucks?
I'm not a certified mechanic although I have been working on cars my whole life one thing I have learned is you can't believe everything people tell you about their car. I have heard it all and the best thing you can do is just take it from the beginning
Best advice is at the end of video. He’s legit lol.
Really surprised you didn't mention using OEM parts. It's critical especially on Fords that OEM parts are used on ignition system including plug wires. Cheap chinese after market ignition parts are junk, even when new, and cheap plug wires can ruin ignition coils as it makes the coils run too hot. These coils are not just coils, they have ignition modules built into them which is what generally goes bad in the first place. That first coil you put in there has a different firing arrangement for the firing order, and it's the ignition module that determines that order. Always always use motorcraft ignition parts for Ford, otherwise expect trouble even if it's not right away, odds are cheap parts will NOT last even if they do work right from the start. If those are cheap wires in there good luck them lasting anymore than 10,000 miles if that.
Just based on the shape of that coil pack I assumed it was a waste spark system with three coils. But if that is the case, why would only one cylinder be affected? Is it possible for a waste spark system to affect only one cylinder? Am I wrong, are there six coils in that coil pack?
It is a waste spark system . I've had several waste spark coils in the past loose one leg only . Not sure why though
@@WrenchingWithKenny Ah ha! I get it. There is a short to ground on the secondary side, between the coil and one of the two companion plugs. That means one plug continues working as before, and the other plug gets bypassed by the short to ground. One cylinder fails.
@@WrenchingWithKenny for example, my 6 cylinder has a single pack with three coils on it. On each coil is a primary and secondary winding. Think of the primary and secondary as a transformer, which it is. The secondary is your spark plug wire attached to the spark plug, which ignites the air fuel mixture.12 volts primary- converted to the high voltage on secondary via the transformer action of the coil pack.As@spelunkerd said, if you have no spark at tower testing with a test light, check companion cylinder. If spark on companion cylinder, you have primary control- you need a coil pack. Personally I would change the spark plug wires as well.
Nice job
Here in Memphis this is a norm. The slightest problem that may take a few minutes to diagnose they say it needs an engine
I like wat u do n how u do it. If only i had a guy like u near me..
They probably returned the coil twice to the parts store. Put old one back on.
Thats crazy if a professional mechanic replace all that
Good video love them!
I remember many years ago when I used to detail cars at a Dealership.A lady came in and bought a brand new car.First day she went to go to work it wouldn't start.They went out and got it going.Next day same deal.The Best Mechanic there had it towed to the shop.He plugged the scanner in.I remember him asking the lady how many times she started it since they got it going last time.She said 6 or 7.He says the counter in the Computer is bad.They replaced the Computer and it never happened again.So the Guy that said even new parts can be bad.Hes right and this was a brand new car.It had less than 100 miles on it.I learned a long time ago.You need to take it to a shop if you can.You can spend 1000 dollars or more and not fix anything.You start replacing parts they add up fast.Most places won't let you return electrical parts.Its in your best interest to not put 2 or 3 thousand dollars in a 1200 dollar car.I like this guy he knows what he's doing and I'll bet he's reasonable.The one that sold me was the Dodge Ram that wouldn't go over 2500 rpms.All kinds of other shops couldn't find it.He knew what it was and he was right.
My Mothers '97 Taurus had a constant misfire on #5. We took it to 2 shops, the first shop couldn't figure it out and the second shop (Ford Dealer) wanted to replace the head gaskets. I finally took a look at and figured out it was a bad plug wire. When I switched the plug wire with another cylinder, the misfire went to that cylinder. $5.00 fix. By the way the engine was an FFV like this Ranger had. Aren't the coils set up in pairs and fire 2 at the same time, making the coil pack what I call a wasted fire system? I believe you could switch any 2 plug wires on a coil pair and it wouldn't make any difference?
They did exactly what you did. They got the "common" coil and quickly figured out that didn't work as you did, so they put the original one back and called it replacing the coil twice. Lol
Good video
Yeah. New "junkyard" coil...
Cool video very informative 👍😊
Could you do a review/comparison video with the snapon solus, and that new launch you got? Great show sir.
Thank you. It isn't apples to apples, but im working on a comparison video. Keep Wrenching
New does not mean good. Especially these days. Everything is made as quickly and cheaply as possible. QC is not what it use to be, in fact I’m not sure if it’s even done most of the time.
Changing the motor instead of the coil pack is just insane
I worked for a shop for a short period of time that the lead tech wasn't as good as he believed he was.
He diaged a Chevy Monte Carlo with a misfire. It had come from another shop where some other work had been performed.
He performed all of these tests and determined that the vehicle needed an engine. Customer didn't want to pay that much again - so the owner of the shop bought the car.
They put a new engine in it - fired it up - and had a misfire on the same cylinder. Surprise surprise.
After the real diag occurred it was found that the connector to the coil pack had one bent pin. The straightened out the pin and plugged it in and magically the misfire went away.
About a week later we put the car out front with a for sale sign on it.
The previous owner saw it and confronted the owner - saying he was ripped off.
The owner was sued for this debacle and was out of business less than a year later.
Very crooked. He thrived on literally ripping people off and was proud of it.
Bragged about how he could rip off even a sweet old lady and make her like it.