4 Ways to Retract Brake Piston on a Honda Accord with Electronic Parking Brake
Вставка
- Опубліковано 1 сер 2024
- I have heard some DIYers shy away from replacing their brake pads due to not being sure of how to retract the pistons on Honda Accords with the electronic parking brake. I wanted to show that the piston can actually be turned back just as it was done on previous generation Accords with the manual parking brake. This video shows that being done on a 2018 Accord. It also shows some alternate methods for retracting the brake piston. Finally, it shows a disassembly of the caliper in case you are curious about what is inside.
0:00 - Introduction
1:30 - Parking brake mechanism operation
3:15 - Method 1 - Using Wind-back Tool
7:35 - Method 2 - Using Scan Tool
10:20 - Method 3 - Applying 12V to terminals
12:51 - Method 4 - Removing motor & manually rotating shaft
15:09 - Caliper Teardown
Once you have completed the brake job, be sure to pump the brake pedal several times until the brake pedal becomes nice and firm. If you don't do this, your brakes won't work immediately and it is easy to do something bad like run into your garage wall before you can pump the brake pedal enough to get the piston out and have the brakes engage. Also, you will want to apply and disable the parking brake a few times to get the inner piston recalibrated (positioned correctly).
Also, as noted in the video, do NOT push the inner piston out all the way under any circumstances. If you do, then the ball bearings will come out and I think it will be very difficult, if not impossible, to reassembly.
Full Rear Brake Job Video (2018 Accord):
• Rear Brake Job, 2018 H...
Brake caliper wind-back tool used in the video:
smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B000IB40L6
Brake caliper compressor used in the video:
smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B... - Авто та транспорт
Best video I’ve seen thus far on how to retract the piston. Very professionally done.
Thanks very much for the nice comment! Much appreciated!
I saw one in that he took a needle nose pliers and did it in 2 minutes, way easier
Recommend this video even if you think you know. The bench breakdown and explanation is by far worth watching the entire video
Great job
Thanks Brandon, much appreciated!
Thanks for this very comprehensive video. I used the caliper wind back method with the proper caliper piston adapter. However, prior to that, I put the car in accessory mode but did not start the engine. That took the pressure off the rear brakes and it was then easy to remove the caliper bracket and the pads slid right out.
Then I did the caliper wind back method and got the caliper piston flush with the dust boot. After putting my new pads on and reassembling the caliper bracket, I put my car back in accessory mode and put the E brake on and off a couple of times. That set or reset the E brake and put pressure back on so the new pads could not slide or move. I did one side at a time with that method on my 2018 Honda Civic. Afterwards, I started my car car and pumped the brakes several times until the brake pedal returned to its normal feel.
I did this several months ago and all is fine. Never had any brake light come on which typically happens when this job is done incorrectly.
Also, I would advise removing some brake fluid from the reservoir if it's at the max level before starting the job. Otherwise, brake fluid can overflow from the reservoir and make a big mess.
This worked for me and hopefully may help someone else.
Thanks for the comment! And thanks for sharing your experience approach on the Civic. I definitely agree with removing some brake fluid from the reservoir (or at least monitoring it during the process) - good point!
So many people complicating this and you clarified all methods in detail. Well presented and straight to the point. You have a neck for educational videos like this.
Thanks very much for the nice comment! I really appreciate it!
The only issue I see that you missed was the adapter kit used to rotate and push the piston back into the housing comes with two types of screwing type tools. One is used on the left side of the car while th eother is used on the right side of the car. Presumably one is a left handed thread while the other is a right handed thread, I have no idea which side you are working on, but my assumption from watching numerous video on this subject is the screw direction for retraction on Honda is always clockwise. It would be nice if you discussed how does one view which is the right side of the car and which is the left side of the car? It depends on the point of reference. If one assumes while sitting in the car, the left side is on your left while right side in on your right. If one is facing the car from the front, then the right side is on the drivers side and the left side is on the passenger side. @@JohnsDIY
@@kevindecker9444 Good point! I believe the normal convention is to use left and right relative to sitting in the vehicle. So in the US, the left is driver's side and right is passenger side. I could have messed that up and said the wrong thing in the video though! But you are correct, on these Hondas, the piston screws back in the clockwise direction on both sides of the vehicle. Interesting that some windback tools have left and righthanded threaded tools. My kit only has the single tool which works for clockwise retraction.
This is the most concise and detailed video I've seen on the 10th gen rear brakes. Great job
Thanks for the nice comment! Appreciate that!
Waited 2years for someone to do this video in this exact way, thank you
Thanks much for the nice comment!
Well this shed much more information than I have found,,I like the first way, rotating the pump counter clock wise, push the cylinder in,This is the method we are going to use, thanks so much for taking your time to show us,
Thanks for the nice comment Jolene!
Fantastic demonstration! Everyone making auto maintenance and repair videos should see this as an example of "how to make an excellent presentation".
Thanks so much for the very nice comment! You're too kind, but very much appreciate it!
By far the best video I have seen explaining the EPB. Thank you!
Thanks very much for the nice comment! Really appreciate it!
Well done! Best video demonstration of all methods combined on how to deal with EPB while changing rear brake pads! Thank you, John, on an excellent job illustrating how the EPB motor works!
Thanks much for the nice comment Allen! Appreciate it!
Absolutely the best video on the internet in regards to this subject! Thanks for sharing 👍
Appreciate the nice comment Richard!
Definitely the most comprehensive video out there! Thank you for taking the time to lend your expertise to this subject matter.
Thanks for the nice comment! Appreciate that!
Excellent video! Yes, I watched entire video. RDX pads need changing and I was contemplating best option to retract rear pistons with the electric parking break. I'll be going with the rewind tool and then using a compressor tool the rest of the way. Thanks.
Thanks very much for the nice comment! Hope the brake job on the RDX goes smooth! Let us know if there are any major differences relative to the Accord!
I'm ready for the test! Superb lesson . Thank you very much. Dealer wanted $1000.00. DIY $200
Thanks for the nice comment! Wow, $1000! Hope the brake job goes smoothly - I'm sure it will!
Thanks for sharing this great video. Now I know how to replace the rear brakes on my 17 Acura MDX.
Thanks for the nice comment and good luck on your repair Erick!
Amazing video. Great information . I like how you went through the schematic. 😊
Thanks for the nice comment Lino! Appreciate it!
Great video! Best one I’ve seen. Very professional. Thanks for the good content and great tips!
Thanks for the nice comment Blake!
You make it look so easy, thank you.
Thanks for the comment!
Excellent video! I was really surprised that the turn back tool worked. I guess as long as the pitch of the threads on the turn back tool is greater than that of the ball screw it will work, otherwise perhaps not?
I like the apply 12v method the best as it avoids driving the worm drive geartrain backwards from the end it wasn't supposed to be driven from. But again doing that seems to be no problem in practice.
Thanks for the nice comment James! That's a good point about the relative thread pitch and I agree. With the turn-back tool threads finer than the ball screw, on each turn the ball screw moves in farther than the tool moves out, so you just have to catch the tool up by additionally turning the nut. If it was the other way around, then the turn-back tool would move out further than the piston would move in each revolution and the tool would want to bind up. I guess you might be able to try to manually loosen the nut to continuously keep enough slack, but it would definitely be trickier in that case (since if you didn't turn the nut enough you would bind up rather than just start getting really loose). Good point!
Yep, that makes sense to me. Seems like once you have some test leads at the ready then it might be the quickest/easiest method as well.
Thanks!
Priceless content. thank you so much.
Hi John. I got my HRV done at the weekend. It was straight forward. I did notice that the piston pushed in. I looked for a triangle shaped disk in the brake pushback tool but there was none. I put a small screwdriver in one of the indents and wound it back but found it went straight in. It never need turned so that was a plus. . No lights on the dash so that's good. The diesel fuel filter is a real mare as it's at the rear of the engine, just above the exhaust. Happy days lol
Nice job Paulo! That's fantastic! Yeah, that diesel fuel filter must be a pain on the back of the engine. I have a video on taking out the alternator which is back there too and it is a job! A lot of working by feel! Great job on the brakes!
Perfect! Very well done.
Thanks for the nice comment!
What a great video, thanks!
I did learn from this. Thanks
Thanks for the comment/feedback!
Very detailed. Thank you.
Thanks for the nice comment! Appreciate it!
Excellent info, thank you
Thanks for the nice comment!
You're the man! Thank you your video shows how the mechanism works. Thank you so much!
Thanks very much for the nice comment! Appreciate it!
Excellent video! Thanks...
Thanks for the nice comment Leo!
Thanks for making this. Just wish I watched this one before I started my brake job 😂
Thanks for the nice comment! Hope the brake job went well anyway!
Thank you very much for you video. Is so helpful...
Thank you very much Sir..very helpful information..
And thank you for the nice comment sir!
Awesome video, thank you...👍👍👍
Thanks for the nice comment!
Excellent Video! Thanks!
Thanks for the nice comment Alexander!
Wow 100% the best way to get to what you want is this one, you have saved me from
Garage cheating to get money from us handyman
For stupid shit ...thanks again john for all the time you spend here for us...👍👍👍
Bravo 👏 Thank you for this fantastic video
Thanks much for the nice comment!
Thank You!! God Bless You!!!
Excellent!
Great video
Thanks
Thanks for the nice comment!
Real good video the best I have seen
Thanks much for the nice comment!
thank you for clarifying
Obrigado ...ótima explicação
Большое СПАСИБО!!! Очень грамотное и понятное объяснение.
Thanks for the nice comment! Much appreciated Vasiliy! (Thanks to google translate for the translation)
Best Vid ever.....Made the process wayyyyyyyyy kooler n smooder🎉🎉🎉🤝..... Thanks and much appreciation
Thanks much for the nice comment! Really appreciate that!
John must be a mechanical engineer. Best/Great explanation of how these work.
Thanks much for the nice comment! I'm actually an electrical engineer in my day job but I do like knowing how mechanical stuff works too! Thanks again!
Exactly how it should be done ☑️
Thanks for the nice comment!
Thanks for the video. The easiest / cheapest way is to remove the 2 screws and open the actuator. Literally takes 2 minutes.
Thanks Mark. I agree, that's a good way to go and good point that that method doesn't require any special tools.
in canada, those two little bolts are nightmare. you dont want to touch them in there is any other way out there.
great video thank you
Thanks for the nice comment Phong!
Good video!
Thanks for the nice comment!
Thank you
Great video, thanks! I've been seeing various methods including putting the accessory key on. But seems simpler to use the tool and turn back the piston. I have a scan tool but don't know if it does maintenance mode like you showed. thanks again
Thanks for the comment! Yep, even though I have a scan tool that supports it, I still find it easier to just turn them back in.
👍Great job i like your 📹video.
Thank you share clip
Thanks for the comment!
Nice.
Great information - very well done and worth watching to the very end. I have a question. Using a turn back tool on my 2017 CRV, I rotated the piston clockwise until it was flush. It never reached a point where it would not turn. I used the similar amount of pressure as shown in the video and did not force the piston. I’ve not proceeded any further. Does this sometimes happen or this something I should be concerned about? Thanks.
Thanks for the comment Eric! Assuming the 2017 caliper is the same as the 10th gen Accords, it should eventually reach a point where it won't turn anymore. Although it looks like it is all the way back in (flush with the surface), maybe it is just not quite all the way back? That would be my guess. If you turn a bit further does it stop turning?
Good day John. What a super professional video. Very detailed. I am thinking of changing my brakes and rotors on my 2017 civic but somewhat nervous about the rear changout. I like the 'turn the piston' option much like yourself. Now I have a question for you. What is the procedure to calibrate EPB system? Honda dealer here in Sault Ste. Marie Ontario quoted $650 front same for rear all new parts . Have a great day . Thanks again . Dave
Thanks for the nice comment Dave! Appreciate that! The procedure to calibrate the EPB system is really simple:
1. Turn the vehicle to the ON mode.
2. Apply and release the parking brake 2 times, then make
sure that the brake system indicator (red) goes OFF.
Basically the EPB recalibrates itself by running the motor until the inner nut forces the piston out (as indicated by an increase in motor current). Good luck with the repair!
thank you nice
This video saved me from a huge financial trouble, I went to change the brake pads and the piston wouldn't go back. I tried a bunch of ways even the one connecting the aligator jack to a battery, and for some reason the motor just kept working without retracting the piston. The only method that worked for me was to by the turn back tool on amazon and use it to screw it back. Thank you for that tip man.
Thanks for the nice comment Paulo! That's great that you were able to solve the problem - nice work! Thanks for taking the time to post the comment.
Great video John. I've never been a fan of them. It started with luxury cars and then other manufacturers copied it. How am I supposed to do some sick drifting in the high school parking lot? I feel the need for back brakes only!
Hahaha! Yep, they sure took all our fun away with that change :)
I know... but you are not supposed to drift a FWD car anyway.
Excellent video.... So just to clarify.. If I use a turn back took on the piston, I don't need to do anything to the electronic parking brake except calibrate the parking brake (engage and disengage twice) after it's done?
Thanks for the nice comment Bob! Yes, that is exactly correct. When the parking brake is engaged after the brake job is complete, it will drive the inner nut and piston out until the brake is engaged and then back it off just the right amount to be ready to quickly engage on the next use.
What if it fired out while doing a brake job. Working that one out right now. Piston completely popped out while I was trying to check why I couldn't reset.
Ugh thanks bro. You definitely helped me with the other side until I did something wrong and found brake fluid and and a nice clean piston on the ground.
Really messed up this one and have a happy foot.
@riverboat28 Did just the outer piston pop out? If that is the case then you should just be able to align the outer piston with the inner piston/nut and then carefully force the piston back in past the square cut seal. Then you will have to bleed the brake caliper of course. If the inner piston/nut came out then that is a harder problem as likely the ball bearings came out. I am not sure what to do in that case, aside from getting a new caliper.
What caused the outer piston to pop out? Did someone press the brakes repeatedly with the caliper off the vehicle? In that case, it could be that just the outer piston came out. However, if the piston popped out because the motor was driven fully in that direction, then there is a good likelihood that the inner piston/nut also came out.
I used a large pair of needle nose pliers to rotate the piston on an Accord before. It wasn't as easy as the tool you used, of course. Didn't realize that was still an option. Thanks.
I'd really like to know how to disconnect that electrical connector. I've tried, and I just can't figure out the trick.
Interesting, yep, I could see how you could get needle nose pliers to work for that in a pinch! Gets the job done!!
I am going from memory, but I think there is a latch on the connector that needs to be depressed by squeezing the connector in the right place. However, I find it is usually very hard to undo the connectors this way once they sit there a while and collect some grime in there. Instead, what usually works much better is to get a really fine pick and reach in from the end of the connector and lift up on the clip. Hard to describe in words, but basically you reach in to the end of the connector between the female connector housing and the connector it goes to and gently push outward (toward the outside of the connector). You will feel when you are on the latch because it will feel "springy". Once you pull back on the latch a little bit, the connector will pull off very easily. It does not take a lot of force, it just takes a very small pick and a little fishing around to fine the right place by feel.
I find a really small pick like the right angle one from this set works well:
www.amazon.com/Rotation-Pick-Hook-4-Piece-Tools/dp/B08W3H1SCV
But maybe you could even get in there with a small screwdriver.
15:15 I'm just a huge fan of break calipers haha
Does the first option work for most cars that uses electronic parking brakes ? Also for the first option after your done replacing the brakes, do you just pump the brakes too get the piston too travel back after you have compressed it using the push and compressor tool , or do you have too pump the brakes and apply the emergency brake too get the piston too travel back ?
Good question, but unfortunately, I don't know if the technique works on most other models or not.
Yes, exactly, once you are done with the brake job, you pump the brakes like you would normally do until the pedal gets nice and firm, and then put on and turn off the parking brake two times.
How do you put those bearing back.. ? It happened to me today and i panic that all the bearing came out and i had to run to dismantler and get another one... since I used a battery with some wires and i connect the polority to push the piston out.. finally i removed the motor and unwind by hand
I'm sorry, I do not know how to put the ball bearings back in. That is why I said in the video not to push the piston out all of the way. Sorry!
question here. when using a scanner to retract the EPB after pushing back the piston, should you leave the scanner in the on position or can or should you shut the key off on the vehicle then replace the pads then turn the scanner back on to reset the EPB or does it not matter ?
Yes, you can retract the EPB with the scantool, then turn off the vehicle, change the brakes, then turn the vehicle back on and then reset the EPB with the scantool. In fact, this is the recommended approach in the service data using the HDS (Honda scan tool).
When you do the retract ("ENTER BRAKE PAD MAINTENANCE MODE") all that happens is that the motor in the parking brake is run in reverse until it hits its stop. When you do the reset ("BACK TO NORMAL MODE") operation, all that happens is that the motor turns in the forward direction and pushes the inner piston out until the brake engages and then backs off slightly.
Will this apply to Acura RDX too?
Would this also work?
I was afraid to attempt on my Buick envision.
Ended up my brake pads had enough to pass inspection. We are planning on trading soon.
Ok removed lower caliper bolt/pin. flipping up remove outer pad. Lower caliper back and using 2 mid size screw drivers use the space (from removed pad) to wedge caliper hold bracket and caliper -applying pressure have someone hit the release p brake and it should retract correct?
Hi James, Interesting idea! I am not certain how the parking brake disable algorithm works on the Honda, but it appears that it might just run the motor for a fixed amount of time, enough to ensure the piston is retracted just a bit. It does not retract it all the way, of course, so that it will be faster to engage when the parking brake is turned on again. There are no position sensors or anything, so I suspect it just runs for a fixed time interval. Going in the other direction, to engage the parking brake, I suspect it runs until the motor current increases beyond some threshold, indicating it has sufficient pressure on the pad.
If my understanding of all that is true, then I think your idea might work on the Honda (not sure about the Buick) but I think you would have to repeat the process many times to fully retract it, each time getting it to retract a little further. So you would use your screwdrivers to take up all the slack. Then turn on the parking brake and it the piston would hardly come out at all since you are taking up the slack. Then when you turn of the parking brake it will retract a bit. Then you take up the slack with your screwdrivers. And just keep repeating that process until it is fully retracted. I think that might work, but certainly never tried it! However, it certainly doesn't seem like the easiest or quickest way to me!! Interesting idea though!
will this work in a 21 honda hrv???
Hey if you take off that but on the piston could you add back those bearings and it work?
If you take off the piston, I am sure there is a way to load the ball bearings back in but I don't know the trick and it is definitely going to be a challenge I would say. There are lots of tiny balls and a spring which appears to put tension on them. I think it will be very hard to get back together.
Do you have a link for your scan tool that you used in the video?
The scan tool I used was Autel MS906. I have had it quite a while and think there might be better options out there now. The ability to do things like retract the caliper (and control other functionality via the PCM) is usually referred to as "bidirectional control" in the scan tool literature. Here's a link to the one I used:
www.auteltechshop.com/wholesale/autel-maxisys-ms906-auto-diagnostic-scanner.html
Do i need to get a new caliper if the motor spinned so much that the top piston was wiggly loose. Or can i use a wind tool to push it back in?
Did the motor spin OUTWARD too much or just INWARD? If the inner piston just retracted and left the outer piston wiggly loose, then you should be fine. You should be able to just push the outer piston back in over the inner piston. However, if the inner piston was forced out too far (running the motor in the reverse direction from retracting it so the inner piston was pushed OUT rather than IN) then you will probably need a new caliper if the inner piston was pushed out enough that it lost its ball bearings from the ball screw mechanism.
Great video. One question and hope you can answer. I’ve changed brake pads before and what I’ve always have used has been a C clamp with an old brake pad to retract to caliper back. Would that way work on this type of car?? I have a 2018 Accord Touring edition.
I have used the C-clamp method you describe on some vehicles as well, but unfortunately, that method by itself will not generally work on the rear brakes of the 2018 Accord with the electronic parking brake. The piston will push in some, but only until it hits the inner nut on the ball screw and then will stop pushing in. You will need to either rotate the piston or use one of the other methods described in the video to retract the inner nut inside the piston.
Thank you very much for such a quick response. I just bought the brake pads at my local Honda dealer and now I will get the same clamping system tool at my local auto parts place. I’ve changed the pads in all my cars using the C clamp so I shouldn’t have any problems after watching your video and using the new tool. again thank you very much!
Sure thing! The C-Clamp should work fine in the front, but yes, you'll need some kind of windback tool for the rear. Usually they are called a brake rewind tool or brake wind-back tool. On Ebay/Amazon, they are typically available for about $30. Good luck with the repair!
I actually just did my the other day. I used a needle nose to rotate the piston and the c-clamp to push in the rest. Worked perfectly
@@chriscruz985 That's a clever approach without requiring any special tools!
Great video. I have a 2018 Honda Accord that needs new rear brakes. I'm going to use your first method of using a piston compression tool to turn the piston clockwise, then push it straight back. I have two questions: 1. Does the system have to be put in "maintenance mode", then returned to "normal mode" after the new brakes are installed? If so, how? 2. In other videos on this topic, some say to put the engine in accessory mode to release the pressure on the caliper. Thoughts on this?
Thanks for the comment!
1. No, I have never had to put the brake system in maintenance mode to wind back the piston. The maintenance mode (which can be set with a bidirectional scan tool) retracts the inner piston by running the electric motor so that you don't have to wind back the piston with the windback tool. But if you use the windback tool to screw the piston back in, this action retracts the inner piston and maintenance mode is not necessary.
2. I don't know why accessory mode would release pressure on the caliper. I have never done that on any vehicle. You should make sure that the parking brake is turned off however. If you have the "auto parking brake" feature enabled then you should disable it. With the parking brake off, the inner piston (electronic parking brake) will be retracted enough for you to remove the caliper. Then you can just pull on the caliper a bit to push the hydraulic piston in enough to pull the caliper off.
Once you finish the brake job, you should turn the parking brake on and off twice so that the inner piston gets reset to the correct position (close to making contact with the outper piston).
Here is a video of a rear brake job on a 2018 Honda Accord showing this approach. (System was NOT in maintenance mode and the engine was NOT in accessory mode):
ua-cam.com/video/gG8RWHI712c/v-deo.html
Hope that helps!
@@JohnsDIY Thanks John! One more question, just like in your video, many videos on the topic show people removing the back of the EPB and turning the screw clockwise using a T12 torx bit until it stops, then compressing the piston straight back. Does the alternate method of just using the windback tool achieve the same thing with regards to the internal screw? I prefer just using the windback tool method because I share the same concern of opening the sealed EPB unit.
@@ddisneyman8911 Sure thing! Yes, exactly, both accomplish the same result. I agree, probably better to not remove the EPB unit if you don't need to plus I think it is quicker and easier to just use the windback tool.
By removing the EPB and turning the shaft with the torx bit, you are screwing the screw into the inner piston causing it to be retracted back into the caliper. When you screw the outer piston in with a windback tool, the outer piston is keyed to the inner piston/nut. So as you rotate, the inner piston/nut is screwed back on the shaft/screw and gets retracted back into the caliper. In both cases, the result is the same, just a matter of thether you rotate the "bolt" or the "nut".
@@JohnsDIY Thank you so much! Saved me $$$. Just finished replacing the rear pads and rotors, the windback tool worked great! Didn't have to crack open the EPB unit. I'm not sure why there's such a confusion and fear over the EPB, it was very easy. In accessory mode, I turned on and off the parking brakes a few times. No warning lights! Now I have to do the front brakes, do you happen to know the front caliper bracket and caliper pin torque specs on a 2018 Accord? Can't find it anywhere. Thanks again!!!
@@ddisneyman8911 Sure thing! It is always so nice to be able to get the job done yourself! Good luck with the repair and give a shout if you have any other questions!
can you share link to buy turn back tool for honda accord 2017and civic 2019
Yep, sure thing, this is the tool that I use:
www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000IB40L6
It has different adapters that fit different vehicles so it is pretty universal.
So I used the turn back tool method and after changing the brakes the left side isn’t working now? Is there a way to get it unstuck or what can I do now?
Can you elaborate on what you mean by "isn't working now"? What is not working? Does the parking brake not engage on that side? The brake on that side doesn't engage at all (with the brake pedal)? What are you seeing?
Man. I’m in a pickle. My piston is stuck out after the electronic brake engages. I was able to use the adapter to twist it back in almost half way but it’s still not far enough to get a compress tool on. I disconnected the plug and did the fever polarity trick and although it made noise it didn’t really seem to help. I was able to twist father but still not far enough to get a compress tool on. I now have the actuator off and if go clockwise like you show in this video it just keeps turning and never stops like you mentioned. Any ideas? I think I’m screwed.
Oh, bummer. How did that happen, did you turn on the electronic parking brake when the caliper was off the vehicle or something? If the piston physically stopped rotating (hit a hard stop) then that likely means that the inner piston is fully retracted and you just have to push the outer piston in. Can you get in between the piston and the ears of the caliper with a pry bar and see if you can start the piston moving back in until there is room to fit in a caliper tool? You might be able to use a C-Clamp to press it in if you can ge a c clamp in there but be careful to not damage the plastic casing of the servo motor on the back of the caliper. What kind of press-in tool are you using? There are some really thin ones available - the kind with a flat metal bar and screw knob in the middle:
shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/performance-tool-disc-brake-pad-spreader-compresses-inner-pad-and-resets-piston-for-easy-pad-replacement-w209/11957856-p
Maybe you can get something like that in there?
I think you might still be okay. The real problem would be if the inner piston came all the way off. I think it should still be possible to get the outer piston pushed in. Also, if it came all the way out it might not be aligned perfectly and that could prevent it from sliding in, so make sure it looks well lined-up.
Does the left side rotate in the same direction as the right side? In my Lincoln, one side rotates clockwise to retract, and the other side is counterclockwise
That's interesting - I didn't know that some vehicles did that! On the Honda, both sides screw in clockwise.
Thank you for this video!
Rushing because a storm was starting I forgot to put the car in Aux so I still had about an inch to go before the caliper would go over the breaks. I didn't have that brake caliper tool so I was trying everything to get that piston back. I pressed the brake and set the e brake so I could start over and same outcome?
I even took the back off the caliper and turned the shaft like you show here, it gets to a certain point and stops and still no progress. I ordered that tool which should be here Mon. I'm going to try that but if nothing happens I'm just going to order another caliper being that brake fluid was leaking from the boot maybe because I had the caliper upside down? Any suggestions?
Thanks for the comment. I'm not sure I fully understand, but when you screw the piston back in, it is normal for it to stop turning at some point before the piston is all the way back in. At this point, the INNER piston is fully retracted but that does NOT mean that the outer piston is retracted. But to retract the outer piston from that point, you should be able to just push it straight back in (without rotating it). So from the sounds of it, that should be all you need to do just push the piston straight back in the rest of the way. You could do this with a windback tool or even a C-Clamp (just be careful to not put the other end of the C-Clamp on the plastic motor housing).
Brake fluid should not be leaking from the boot no matter what orientation you had the caliper in. There is a square cut seal around the circumference of the piston which seals it from leaking. If the brake fluid is coming out there it indicates that the piston was forced out too far (entirely out of the caliper) or a problem with that seal.
@@JohnsDIY Thank you for your reply! When I did the Right rear it when smooth using needle nose pliers to wind the piston back in. It was a tight fit but as you stated it needed to be pushed back in further.
The C Clamp I have is to small. I ordered a brake caliper kit which should be here tomorrow.
** the piston was forced out too far (entirely out of the caliper)** Is exactly what happened. I put the E brake on trying to start the whole process over. I was able to turn the piston back in a bit but it stopped with alot of room to go.
Tomorrow I'm going to use the kit and try to push the piston back in.
Would you say the damage is already done because the fluid was leaking out and I just need to order another caliper?
Thank you again for your response!
@@Carloscda40 Just because brake fluid was leaking out doesn't mean the caliper needs to be replaced. It is possible to take the outer piston completely out and put it back in and have it work fine again (after bleeding). HOWEVER, if the inner piston came out too far then that could be a real problem. As I show in the tear-down in the video, if the inner piston/nut comes out too far, you will lose the ball bearings that it rides on and it probably won't be possible to get them back in (at least I don't know how to reinstall them). In your case, turning on the ebrake without having the pads in there likely would have driven that inner piston out. I would be worried that you very well might have lost the ball bearings in this case. In that case, unfortunately, you will probably have to replace the caliper. If that is NOT the case, and you do manage to push the outer piston in, you will at least want to bleed the brake caliper since having the piston out likely introduced air into the brake system.
@@JohnsDIY I didn't notice that piston nut out far enough for the bearings to fall out and I didn't see anything on the ground. Yes I do plan on bleeding the brakes as well.
To be on the safe side I called various Honda dealers to order another caliper, end result they all said theirs a nationwide back order on them and they have no eta when they will be back in stock! I did however track a 2019 caliper down from a salvage yard. Weather permitting I will install it tomorrow. Thank you again!
@@Carloscda40 Geez, what a pain that we still have those supply issues at this point! Good luck with the install!
question
After replacing pads motor isn’t working when I press brake button, any idea what happened? Do i have to hook up computer to reset?
Is this a 10th gen Accord? I believe they shouldn't require any computer reset. They should work immediately and reset to the correct position the first time that the parking brake is applied. Are you sure the parking brake electrical connector is fully plugged in (if it was removed)? Are you getting any codes or lights on the dash?
Do u have to take the cap off the brake reservoir ???
That's a good point Kevin! Yes, I think that is a good idea and it is what I do. I should have mentioned that. I take the cap off the brake reservoir and if the fluid level is high, I also suck a little bit out before rewinding the piston so it doesn't overflow.
Did you try to unplug the electrical connection while the car is running so it will not let the piston come out?
Good question! But unfortunately I do not believe that would work. The issue is that the piston does not retract all the way even when the car is running. It only retracts just enough to take the pressure off the pads. This way when you engage the parking brake it is very quick since the piston only has to travel a short distance. If it retracted all the way each time then there would be a much longer delay when engaging the parking brake. As a result, even if you unplug the brake motor with the engine running, the piston is not fully retracted and generally won't be retracted enough to fit in a new set of pads that are much thicker than the old worn ones. In fact, you don't even have to disconnect the electrical connector when the car is running, you can just turn off the car without engaging the parking brake and the piston will be in the same position as if you unplugged the connector with it running (and the parking brake off). In either case, the parking brake piston will be pushed out just barely shy of pressing on the brake pads.
John, after the piston is turned in clockwise and pushed in flush,do you turn the piston counterclockwise prior to installing new pads and caliper? Thanks for your help on this matter.
Hi Dave, Nope, You just turn the piston in clockwise and then press the piston in the remainder of the way. After that you are all set to put the new brake pads in and reassemble. Once you are done with the brake job, if you put the parking brake on and then off, it will calibrate and drive the inner nut the correct distance outward for the new pads.
@@JohnsDIY Thanks John
You bet, and good luck with the brake job. Let us know if any questions come up! We DIYers need to stick together!
I’m doing the rear pads & rotors on my 17 MDX.
This is by far the most helpful video I found.
Thanks 👍
Thanks for the nice comment Mark!
How did you take the boot off? Mines glued on or something. It’s ripping in pieces
Hi Michael, It is on very tight. I was able to put a screwdriver at the edge of the boot where it mates with the caliper and give it a few whacks with a small hammer which forced it off.
Do you have to remove the rear brake? Can’t you just turn the car battery on so it loosens the grip?
Thanks for the comment. I am not sure what you mean by "just turn the car battery on"? Turning off the parking brake off alone does not retract the inner piston all the way. It pulls the piston back just enough to allow it to spin freely (so that it will be quick to turn on the next time you use it rather than having to travel its full range). Let me know what you mean though as I might not be fully understanding your comment.
If the piston is keyed and turns the motor back in, what keeps the piston from turning when it moves out ?
Great question! Normally there are pegs on the back of the brake pad which mate with indents in the piston and thereby prevent the piston from rotating. However, I say "normally" because at least on my Accord, the piston has indents on it, but to my surprise, there are no mating pegs on the OEM brake pads! The only thing I can think is that the lubricated ball screw mechanism in these calipers produces so little rotational force due to its low friction that just the resistance of the square cut seal is sufficient to keep the piston from rotating. In contrast, the standard ball screw mechanisms on previous generations (with traditional threads, not balls) likely generated more rotational force. But that is just my guess. On the workbench anyway, the squarecut seal does produce enough resistance to keep the piston from rotating - when activated the piston pushes out with no rotation.
@@JohnsDIY thank you, and yes I saw that on the bench , I was one of the two who stayed for the entire video lol
Great job on the video and I can also vouch the turn in method works and in my opinion even though I have sets of wires for jumping pins and a power probe tool I think this is safer and quicker sense you'll have to press the piston in manually anyway. Thanks again good day sir
Haha! Appreciate that Brandon! And thanks for the confirmation that the turn-in method works for you too. I agree seems like a good way to go to me!
👍👍👍
One thing. I've not seen anyone mention. Is the handbrake on or off before you start. Does it make any difference. Got my HRV to do but no one has ever mentioned if handbrake is on if off at the very start of the job
Hi Paulo, In my case, the handbrake (parking/emergency brake) was OFF before I started. Also some models have an automatic parking brake engagement in Park and this was also not enabled in my case. If the parking brake is on then you won't be able to remove the caliper without first winding it back. This means that you wouldn't be able to wind back the piston using a windback tool because you wouldn't be able to get access to the piston without removing the caliper first. However, you could still wind back the piston with a bidirectional scan tool, by taking off the motor and turning the shaft, or by manually running the motor in reverse via test leads. This will effectively disengage the parking brake when you wind it back. After reinstalling the parking brake will automatically self-adjust when you engage it the first time.
So in summary, if you want to use the windback tool, you will need to ensure that the parking brake is off before you start. If you use one of the other methods, you could start either way. It makes the most sense to me just to make sure that the parking brake is off before you start.
@@JohnsDIY hi John. Thanks for the quick reply. I've not seen any mention of this. I think it's kinda important if doing the rear brakes. Mine is a 1.6 diesel ex, 6 speed manual, being in the UK that's the spec. I've not done these electronic type handbrake things before. I don't have the diagnostics but I do have a wind back tool for the brakes. I'm going to have some fun tomorrow doing the disks and pads all round. Hopefully it works and no lights on the dash lol. Good informative video. 👍
@@paulos9304 Yep, I agree, it is a good point! Just to provide some confirmation, on my 2018 Accord, the service manual procedure to remove the rear brake rotor is:
1. Vehicle - Lift.
2. Rear Wheel - Remove.
3. Parking Brake - Release. Note, if the automatic parking brake function is turned on, do the temporary cancel automatic electric parking brake.
Wow, I didn't even know they made a diesel HRV! That's neat! Good luck with the repair - let us know how it goes!
@@JohnsDIYHi John. I've not managed to get it done yet but tomorrow Monday is looking the day to do it as it's a public holiday over here. Yer the 1.6 i-dtec is great on fuel. High 50s low 60s if driven sensibly. European market the diesels I think. Same as the CRV although now Honda have stopped diesel in new models. Petrol or petrol/electric. I'll let you know how it goes tomorrow. Hopefully all goes well lol.
Hello john, after I install the break do I need to pump the break pedal, before I turn on off the parking brakes
Hi there, I don't think the order matters, but I would recommend both pumping the brake pedal until it is firm and turning the parking brake on and off a few times. I prefer to pump the brakes first as this drives out the piston hydraulically, and then when you put the parking brake on it drives out the inner piston mechanically to match. But, I think it is okay in either order.
@@JohnsDIY thank you
Ok thanks Johns DIY you hit it right on the nose. sharing your gift of knowledge with others is a God Send.when you give you shall treceive ,may you stay healthy and safe God Bless you and your family.. To help your brothers with a helpful video for all to help themselves
@@bigred5393 Thanks for the very kind comment! And I wish you all the same in return! Thanks Big Red!
It’s crazy that these cars will work with three of these methods and the 4th is a toss up. My car does not work with the wind back tool at all. It needs to be reset by using the scanner, 12V, or removing the motor and manually turning. My friends car works perfectly fine with the wind back tool.
I have seen some guys using 9v batteries on Toyota or Lexus, I am super curious will 9v battery also work on honda cars?
Interesting question. I still have that spare caliper hanging around. I'll give that a try and let you know!
@@JohnsDIYthat would be cool😄
@@lizhiliao4614 I tried it out and a fresh 9V battery was indeed able to drive the parking brake motor! It definitely turned slower and sounded a little sluggish compared to driving it at 12V (not surprisingly) but it worked just fine. I was able to drive the caliper piston out and then retract it just fine. Thanks for mentioning that as that might be a good option for a lot of folks! A nice side benefit of doing it that way is that you can't really create any problems with that approach (shorting out and melting terminals for example) due to the limited amperage of the 9V battery. Good idea!
@@JohnsDIY Hi John, thank you soooo... much for trying it out with the 9V battery! It is just great to hear that it worked well for you and could be a viable option for others too. Indeed, the limited amperage of the 9V battery provides an added safety benefit. Much appreciate for sharing your valuable experience!
Method 4. After removing the brake caliper motor
Is the socket you tighten before pushing the piston 8 mm torque or 9 mm torque?
I just checked and it is actually a 12mm External Torx socket to turn the shaft after you remove the motor.
@@JohnsDIYi didn’t have that special socket but a regular 9mm hex socket fits snug enough to turn it clockwise by hand.
@@Jdm_fl5 Thanks! That is good to know for folks who don't have the Torx socket! It doesn't take much force so I am sure anything that fits should work fine as there should be no worries about stripping it or anything! Thanks!
Could you share the link to the piston adapter tool?
Yep, this is the one I used in the video:
www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000IB40L6
Thank you!!!🎉
4. Metottaki soket kaç torks ??
8 or 9 torks mu
Dilinizi bilmiyorum
I just checked and it is actually a 12mm External Torx socket for driving the shaft.
Would this procedure work for my 2019 Honda CR-V EX? I have both the wind back tool and compression tool. Thanks! Great explanation.
Would you be able to share the page you used to explain the operation of the Electric Parking Brake?
Thanks for the comment Pat. Unfortunately, I can't say for certain about the 2019 CRV. Usually there is a lot of similarity across Honda models and I think if it were me, I would give it a try using that method, but I don't know for sure.
Here is the image showing the parking brake mechanism:
i.postimg.cc/T1mPnL8h/image.png
@@JohnsDIY Thanks for the information. Can you tell me where you got this information so I could do further research? Your explanation of the many ways to retract the caliber was the best of have seen. I did not know you could thread the piston back in then compress it from there. I assume the piston grooves need to line up with the pins on the back of the pad.
Sure thing, that information is from: techinfo.honda.com/
That is the official source for Honda service information (now that printed service manuals are no longer published for Honda). Unfortunately, it is not free though. It is subscription-based. Until recently it was $10 per day to access, now it looks like it is $25 per day. But still, maybe it is worthwhile if you have a big repair or want to look up a bunch of common maintenance/repair information for your vehicle.
> I assume the piston grooves need to line up with the pins on the back of the pad.
That's a good question! I expected the same thing and that was certainly the case on previous generation Accords with the manual parking brake - the piston had to be oriented so that the grooves in it lined up with the pins/pegs protruding from the brake pad. This kept the piston from turning (which would prevent the parking brake from working). However, to my surprise, the OEM pads on my Honda had NO pins on the back to line up with! I'm not sure why that is the case. I speculate that perhaps the ball screw mechanism exerts such little rotational force on the piston that perhaps having the pegs was unnecessary. On the caliper I took apart, it seemed that even the resistance of the square-cut seal was enough to keep the piston from rotating.
Thanks for the comment!
@@JohnsDIY Thanks again John! I appreciate your prompt response.
So you don’t need to spin it in you can c clamp it with old pads ?
Never mind I kept watching and your legit thank so damn much you have no idea how bad I’ve been needing to do these rear pads and now rotors thanks to you I don’t need to do the calipers
@@mikeneff832 Sorry for the delay! Yep, you do have to rewind the inner screw in some fashion (by rotating the piston, applying 12V to the motor to spin it, removing the motor and spinning the shaft, or via a scan tool). Once the inner piston is retracted then you can just push the outer piston in the rest of the way. Good luck with the brake job!!
So it is only true that the cylinder can be returned back with a tool that pushes and rotates the cylinder. The internet said that this is wrong and that you can destroy the mechanism in the rear brakes. I was wondering why the cylinder has two round grooves, like rear brakes with a normal handbrake. I have a civic 1.5T car and will push them back in this way, the easiest way.
Yes, I have successfully used that method (windback tool which rotates and presses) on my Honda Accord with no issues. I don't know for certain if your Civic uses a similar caliper but would imagine so.
Officially, Honda service data suggests using a scan tool to enter "Maintenance Mode" to retract the piston and then using a tool to push the piston in the remainder of the way. Alternatively, Honda service data says that if you aren't using the HDS (Honda's scan tool) then removing the parking brake actuator and using a TORX socket to turn the spindle back is an alternative method. However, if you look at the teardown and cross-section in the video, I think you can convince yourself that rotating the piston in accomplishes the same goal. The only possible downside of this method that I can see is that you have to be careful to ensure that the dust boot is spinning freely on the piston so that it doesn't bunch up as you rotate the piston. This wouldn't be a concern for methods that don't rotate the piston, so perhaps that is why they are recommended. However, it is not a big deal to ensure that the boot is spinning freely just as was done on all the older style calipers with the manual parking brakes.
Hi John I don't think the piston retracts all the way cuz I replaced the pads and I here a squking when iam driving and the pads are worn out fast like in 4 months. Any advice
As long as the piston was retracted enough to put the caliper back on with a little extra space, then I don't think that is the problem. Do the slide pins slide nice and freely? If not, that can cause such an issue. The other thing that I have seen cause that issue is when the piston gets gunked up on the outside and starts to catch on the square cut seal and not retract a little to provide a little clearance as it is supposed to.
The outer pad closer to the wheel worns out super fast like in 6 weeks the inner pad it's just . Why ? Everyone is telling me I got a bad caliper
@@franciscosotelo1866 In my experience, that is caused when the caliper is not free to "float". If the piston is stuck then usually both pads will wear prematurely. If the piston is okay, but the caliper is not free to slide back and forth then you often get wear on one pad only. This can be caused by the fact that one pad is not free to slide (due to being "rust jacked" - held in place by rust or because the pad is not the right size). For example, if the inner pad is not free to slide and is "locked" in place, then all the braking will happen on the outer pad when the piston pushes out. This issue can also be caused by a problem in the slide pins (gunk or buildup preventing the slide pin from freely sliding). In my experience, both of these are less common with this style of caliper than the kind with the hardware (clips that the pads slide on). Do both pads slide freely back and forth?
@JohnsDIY yes both pads slide back and forth. U know what , when I was replacing the pads I couldn't push the piston back and by accident I press the emergency brake button a couple times and the piston almost came out . And then little by little I started pushing the piston enough to put the pads on. And since the I been having that problem were the outer pads worms out fast. Did I mess up inner piston or the electronics???
@@franciscosotelo1866 I think it is hard to say, but if the inner piston came out too far then that could definitely cause issues with the caliper as it could have caused the ball bearings in the ball screw to have been released and possibly they could be inside restricting movement (retraction) of the caliper. So it is certainly possible that the piston/caliper was damaged if the piston came out nearly the whole way. The only thing I find confusing is that I don't understand why that would lead to wear just on the outer pad. If the piston wasn't retracting, I would have thought both pads would have been pressed against the rotor and both would wear prematurely. Just my thoughts though...
I changed the brake pads yesterday at a local mechanic garage, but he didnt use any scan tool to enter service mode.. after we finished the dashboard shows: "elecric parking brake problem" hold brake problem". the E brakes works but keeps flashing on the dashboard.. will taking it for a scan tool reset fix the issue?
I think it is hard to say without knowing what it thinks the issue is. Any chance you can have the mechanic read the codes? Did you try turning on and off the parking brake several times?
@@JohnsDIY I saw the code yesterday it says Ebrake open circuit rear right side
@@bilalnachabeh Oh, well that's definitely a problem and wouldn't be fixed by any reset (assuming it is a currently occurring code, not just a history code). I assume you probably disconnected the parking brake electrical connectors to do the brake job? If so, I would make sure that the connectors are firmly reconnected. Maybe even unplug them, check that the pins look good, and replug them, making sure they lock when fully connected.
@@JohnsDIY actually i took it back to him yesterday and he unplugged the wire and reconnect it. now its always telling me on the dashboard to release the parking brake even tho its not engaged! I can't drive the car im worried of damaging anything
@@bilalnachabeh Did you try turning the parking brake on and off a few times? Are there any codes now?
Hello! John what if accidently the piston went out all the way?😅
Hi there. Well, it depends on the details. If just the outer piston slid off and the inner piston (which screws on to the rod) is still in place, then you should be fine. You can just push the outer piston back on, wind the piston back in and you should be good. However, if the inner piston unscrewed all the way then you will probably see little ball bearings coming out and it will be very difficult to reassemble because I don't know how you will get the ball bearings back in place. Let me know if that makes sense to me. I could send a picture if you don't see what I mean there.
Okay... soo... I started by taking out the wheels and then the caliper from the right side. I took out the old break pads, then I continued pushing the piston, until I realized I need it a specific tool to twisted like you show on the video, then I saw that you need it the computer to put it on maintenance mode, so I started searching for videos about how to do it manually, then I came across this video, where it said that there's a special way, by pressing the parking button a specific way, I fell for it and the piston went out of the "shell" after that I try twisting it back in with some pliers and it did went back but not like pushing it it was all twist
Sorry for the long text lol, I asked my friend for his computer and I put the car on maintenance mode, the left side was good it just needed the pushing but the right I think still bad, because all the panel lights are on like the (VSA, ABS, Break amber, and Break on red
@@JohnsDIYyeah it makes sense! I watched your video and I'm like... "I still have hope that it'll get fix!"😢
@@luiscolorado4708 I see, if the outer piston went back on and you were able to screw it all the way back in, there is a good chance that everything should be okay. You might try cycling the parking brake on and off several times and see if the panel lights clear. There are very few electrical diagnostics that the PCM performs on the brake so there aren't many problems that it can detect. In fact, the only thing it can sense is the motor current into the parking brake motor.
12v bypassing all day, works every time on most vehicles 👍🏽