Current Sharing 101 w/ Large LiFePO4 Battery Banks

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  • Опубліковано 25 гру 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 835

  • @WillProwse
    @WillProwse  2 роки тому +76

    The server rack bus bar needs to be connected to loads/chargers at opposite or diagonal ends, as shown in the video. You can safely use other wiring configurations, but your crimps need to be perfect, and the size/length of conductor. Using a bus bar has the lowest chance of screwing something up. Highly recommended for beginners!
    Beginners should check out this resource on battery bank wiring configurations: diysolarforum.com/resources/wiring-unlimited.2/
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    • @AIM54A
      @AIM54A 2 роки тому +5

      Great video.. Bus bars also need to be sized appropriately for the current.

    • @OhRonaldo
      @OhRonaldo 2 роки тому +1

      That's sort of the same as connecting the load to the center battery in your pack, but in reverse. The outer battery packs will likely charge first and you still have issues with packs of differing specifications/condition.

    • @WillProwse
      @WillProwse  2 роки тому +6

      @@OhRonaldo no, opposite ends as in diagonal connection. See the pdf resource above or look at the diagrams in the video to see what I mean.

    • @WillProwse
      @WillProwse  2 роки тому +1

      @@AIM54A good point!

    • @OhRonaldo
      @OhRonaldo 2 роки тому +1

      @@WillProwse Oh you mean opposite end of the other polarity not opposite ends of a single bus bar. Gotchya.

  • @immrnoidall
    @immrnoidall 2 роки тому +69

    What would we do without free info like this critical knowledge? A lot of sellers of these products, know and tell nothing, about proper installations. Thanks Will. Lives and property will be saved.

    • @wernerviehhauser94
      @wernerviehhauser94 Місяць тому

      hmmm... I actually teach this in 8th grade physics. But then again, since 9 out of 10 students do not pay attention, when they need it 20 years later, it will seem like magic knowledge to them.

    • @immrnoidall
      @immrnoidall Місяць тому

      @@wernerviehhauser94 You are great for teaching these things . I graduated in 85 and my science and shop knowledge, was all I cared for. I remember all those teachers the most , they made me feel smart as I struggled through other classes that just did not apply to my interest.
      Coming from a time that I would need to spend hours searching the library , to fix or build something, UA-cam today, is still amazing to me.

  • @myhificloud
    @myhificloud 2 роки тому +36

    Answers to your LiFePO4 Battery Bank/System Build Video: This is the video we've all been waiting for. Assembly of all the important questions and answers regarding battery bank scaling, fusing, conductor sizing and conductor length, the gotchas and much more. Well done and very, very much appreciated. Thank you for this @Will

  • @jerrytusch1758
    @jerrytusch1758 2 роки тому +10

    Thanks, Will!
    I have done exactly as you said, paralleling several LiFePo4 batteries of different sizes(capacities) to a common buss. I could not afford to change all batts out each time I wanted to increase storage. Each battery is fused with a 100A Windy Nation fuse, and the bus output to my inverter is also fused at 100A. Solar charges everything nicely, and batteries maintain a fairly equal SOC under a longer discharge cycle at lighter loads. So happy to hear your reasoning on this, I feel less anxious now! Have had bad experience with cheap breakers developing high resistance and heat while operating at well less than ratings, causing inverter shutdown. All fuses now. No problems now.

  • @5400bowen
    @5400bowen 2 роки тому +6

    I have to say also that your comments about using the largest cable that fits safely really hit home with me. I went way way past the recommended conductor gages as soon as I got over 2,000 watts. It also conserves the precious energy you've worked so hard and spent so much on to produce and store. So much in this video is familiar in it's approach, the approach I've learned over the last 60 years.

  • @stevezozuk9622
    @stevezozuk9622 2 роки тому +49

    I absolutely love how safety orientated you are Will It's very clear that you know your way around the box not just outside. That was a great lesson Will and I thank you for doing what you do for all of us. Take care and we'll see you on the next one. Cheers

  • @tannerh3002
    @tannerh3002 2 роки тому +11

    This is the type of video I have been looking for for years and couldn’t ever find it laid out in one place. Thank you!

  • @brian_abroad
    @brian_abroad 2 роки тому +94

    This video effectively combines applied electrical theory with the fundamentals of multi-battery configuration. I am no longer a newbie to electrical and solar technology (thanks to Will), yet I thoroughly enjoyed this video refresher presented using layman’s language.

  • @johnsuggs7828
    @johnsuggs7828 2 роки тому +4

    Subscribed.
    Very easy decision.
    Very refreshing to see videos of someone who actually knows what they're talking about.
    First, Safety
    Second, Safety
    Backup to backups and leave as little open to chance as possible.
    Extremely smart way to do things.

  • @john_in_phoenix
    @john_in_phoenix 2 роки тому +27

    Excellent subject choice Will, very happy to see this!

  • @TK-123
    @TK-123 2 роки тому +17

    Will, you addressed an area that was just had to be covered. 🙏 Thank you!

  • @aldencole1099
    @aldencole1099 2 роки тому +3

    Will, very good explanation of correct wiring of parallel banks, I have been installing off grid systems for over thirty years, primarily in the marine industry but also custom RV systems and residential systems. Correct sizing of the interconnects is key. Size matters. Less voltage drop. Voltage drop=resistance=heat.Heat is not ony inefficient but dangerous. Plenty of info out there to size cableing appropriate to the current demands of a system. The math is straight forward. The equal length of conductors and same batteries in a multi battery setup arranged in a hub and spoke system vs a daisy chain system is codified in Kirschoff's laws which are built off of Ohm's laws.
    Also, the purpose of current limiting by fuses/circuit breakers is to protect the wiring to a device not to protect the device per se. If there is a fault in the device, the device has failed. Devices like inverters generally have their own circuit protection internally. There fore, circuit protection for a system is to be calculated to the demands of the device and the ampacity of the cabling, if mismatched, the cable can overheat sometimes with dire results.
    Keep up the good work. Safety is paramount.

  • @kellyflanagan5264
    @kellyflanagan5264 2 роки тому +15

    Will, thanks for taking the time to make your videos. I’ve watched quite a few and admire your passion for the subject and your continuous reminders to be safe around high energy density, and low internal resistant energy sources, yes batteries. It’s easy to think 12-48 V is safe, but these babies can make great accidental welders in the blink of an eye or the drop of a wrench, or your wrist watch in the wrong place. Thanks for reminding all of us!

  • @om617yota8
    @om617yota8 2 роки тому +57

    Interrupt rating on DC is no joke. Anyone who's arc welded can tell you how much heat 100a at 50v can generate when arcing, and how much distance you can maintain an arc over. I spent $200 on my Class T fuses and holders. Blowing one is $30 down the drain. Completely happy with that though, as it's hugely less expensive than burning up my trailer mounted solar system.

    • @WillProwse
      @WillProwse  2 роки тому +11

      Exactly!! This guy gets it

    • @merkel2750
      @merkel2750 Рік тому +4

      Could you use a circuit break in place of a fuse?

    • @merkel2750
      @merkel2750 Рік тому +4

      Never mind, just watched the video 😂 t class fuse, here I come.

    • @merkel2750
      @merkel2750 Рік тому +3

      Never mind, just watched the video 😂 t class fuse, here I come.

    • @om617yota8
      @om617yota8 Рік тому +2

      @@merkel2750 Sure, an appropriately spec'd circuit breaker would be fine.

  • @centerrightproudamerican5727
    @centerrightproudamerican5727 2 роки тому +7

    Great Video will!!! This has been asked about a lot on the forum lately! Thank You.
    One thing to add: We had a forum member that had on battery with a Fet Based BMS and another battery with a relay BMS. The difference in resistance was enough to make the difference in the current very large even though the cells were about the same size.

    • @WillProwse
      @WillProwse  2 роки тому +4

      Wow no way!!! I did not think of that one. That's wild!

    • @D2O2
      @D2O2 2 роки тому +1

      Voltage drop measurements under load from cells to case output terminals might be a good measurement to compare quality across packs, commercial and DIY.

  • @viktorchu2641
    @viktorchu2641 2 роки тому +1

    I have learnt a lot from you bro you have shared knowledge that I cannot afford to pay for .I am good with solar energy now courtesy of your teachings .I come from a country where people know little or nothing about solar energy and we have up to 7 hrs of sunshine every day so I feel good about myself ever since I grabbed a lot from your teachings God bless you always

  • @swillinil7198
    @swillinil7198 2 роки тому +6

    Will, I've been watching your channel for a while now and your videos keep getting better and better (they were great to start off with!) Thank for sharing your knowledge, skills, expertise and hours and hours of research!

  • @jimmyg6215
    @jimmyg6215 2 роки тому +9

    Thanks Will for spending a good amount of time on T class fuses. I have placed comments over the last few years on people’s sites that are using ANL fuses, recommending they replace with a T class fuse. For the $50 or so for a 150A T fuse and holder it is well worth the money to save a setup from a catastrophic failure. I think those ANL fine for automotive applications, but not with high current LiFePo banks. I run my signature solar 6 bay rack with 4 gauge to the buss bar and 2 gauge from bus bar to inverter. I do have a 150A T fuse on the + side outside the rack and I also diagonal the connections inside the rack. Seems to keep things balanced between the 5 packs in the bank, and 2 of the battery packs are 1 year older than the other 3 packs. I will post in 10 years if they stay balanced 😂. Excellent video as always.

    • @WillProwse
      @WillProwse  2 роки тому +2

      Very nice!!! You get it. And it is very important. Agreed!

    • @jimmyg6215
      @jimmyg6215 2 роки тому +1

      @Carey Gagnon I drilled and tapped one of the bottom hole connection on the negative buss bar to accommodate a 5/16” lug. I put a lock nut, the ones with nylon inside, on the other side where the screw came out the other side of the buss bar just as added security to lock the screw in place. I actually put a lock nut behind every battery screw connection just to ensure nothing loosens up due to any heating and cooling cycle that may occur since it is an off grid cabin. I also put a very fine film of carbon conductive paste between the battery terminal and the buss bar. I was a little concerned since this is off grid that if any moisture found it’s way between the buss bar and terminal it could oxidize. The cabin has spray foamed walls with a 120V mini split heat pump, so it is climate controlled, so maybe it was a moot point to do. Sometimes I way overthink my installations :)

    • @david0alinda
      @david0alinda 2 роки тому

      @@jimmyg6215 Sorry I’m late to this, but I woud highly advice to exchange those nylock nuts for washers with spring washers. The nylon is temperature sensitive and when the nuts heat up from use, which is possible, they loose their grip and can come undone, causing a higher resistance and more heat. Sending the pack into an arc-fest. Regulations in my area prohibit the use of nylock for electrical connections, specifically for that reason.

    • @jimmyg6215
      @jimmyg6215 2 роки тому +1

      @@david0alinda thanks David. I’ll check them while operating. The buss bar is already threaded and tightened before adding the lock nuts, but copper is soft. I just put them on there as a secondary lock just in case the temp of the cabin causes the copper to move, but it’s a good point if they do overheat. I only have them on the small connections from the battery to the buss bar, not the main connection from buss bar to inverter, those have a lock washer and nut behind them as I figured that would have the most chance of temp swings metal to metal since it’s carrying all the current. I have watched the batteries over the past year and they generally top out at around 8A each under full load on my 3000W growatt, it’s just a cabin. Maybe this years project is to swap them out just in case, but the threads on the copper buss bar would have to let go as well before there is a catastrophic anomaly.

    • @alanpetersen4497
      @alanpetersen4497 2 роки тому +1

      @@jimmyg6215 Wow! Jimmy, you certainly took satisfactory precautions to prevent future problems caused by heating expansion and contraction. i for one, enjoyed reading your post, and give you an Attaboy for safety! I have found that many problems occur due to heat, and cooling, plus oxidation. Good job!

  • @Five0Music
    @Five0Music 2 роки тому +5

    Great video, Will, and it answered a lot of questions that have been hard to get manufacturers to answer directly. Your videos inspired my first build in 2020, which has been operative 24/7 since, with no failures at all. You’ve really got me wanting to build a larger EG4 rack system now. Just need the cash!

  • @greenidentity3789
    @greenidentity3789 2 роки тому +13

    Hello Will Prowse,
    I want to say a very big thank you for your special way of impacting knowledge. I've learnt a lot through your videos. Pls keep doing what you're doing.
    You're great!

  • @solargarage
    @solargarage 2 роки тому +5

    Thanks will , for putting this out. We have been running a mix of Eve and Fortune banks, using a central buss bars and each pack having it's own Class T fuse. So far it's working great.

  • @k.kapper2657
    @k.kapper2657 2 роки тому +4

    Hi Will, after starting with lead acid 24V 250Ah batteries (12 cells of 2V), I have later added a parallel LiFePO4 24V 280Ah battery (8cells of 3,2V). I agree to be somewhat limited with max. voltage. Issues with different cell voltages with LiFePO4 cells have settled after half a year. Least voltage ever was 24,01V. Thank You for Your videos!

  • @PandaBeatBrothers
    @PandaBeatBrothers 2 роки тому +6

    Hey Will, thank you for your videos!
    I'm a newbee in this space, am like 4 videos deep, but I'm learning a ton from you!
    I admire your straight-forward, complex, yet easy to understand approach...
    Keep up the great work, brother!

  • @SignatureSolar
    @SignatureSolar 2 роки тому +2

    Holy cow those batteries are BIG! I love seeing these huge babies when we bring them in for testing.

  • @5400bowen
    @5400bowen 2 роки тому +3

    First off, my brother was an electronics technician in the Navy, and that was 1964-68. He then worked for the Naval Electronics Systems Analysis Laboratory in San Diego, We did a lot of working together, I learned a bunch from him and elsewhere later without formal training. So on to my story. I came to the conclusion recently that series connections for solar batteries was no good for running systems near full capacity, with the current running through each battery and cables/connections from the charger and to the inverter. One thing that got me thinking this is a battery I was running (Lossigy 12 volt 200 AH in series with the same) going weak and the need for balancing series connected batteries. I just bought 24 volt batteries for my 24 volt system. So I watched your video on series and parallel configurations, and you said more than 3 batteries in parallel was no good. After scratching my head and doing some thinking and research, I started thinking, why not run equal length cables from a bus bar to the batteries in both directions, in other words, from the charge controller one cable goes to a bus bar and then equal length cables from the bus bar to each battery post, 2 busbars of course, one + and one -. Ditto for the inverter connections. I also found another video on tube where the guy shows a sort of compromise between that and what you say here and what I decided to do. I don't have rack mount units, so I was already shopping for busbars on Amazon before I found this video, and all the pieces came together listening to you explain exactly what I had thought of. After hearing you say in the Series/Parallel video it wasn't good to do more than 3 batteries in parallel, I thought maybe you didn't have a deep enough understanding of it all, or maybe there was something else I was missing. Full circle, you cleared all that up in this video. Only thing I can complain about is that when you said that it isn't good to have more than 3 in parallel as a blank statement in the other video, it threw me off quite a bit, as I have found most all your presentations so accurate and useful. And another useful comment you made was about the difference between running low level usage and charging as opposed to running at or near the capacity of the components. Very helpful to here it set out so clearly by someone I know is knowledgable.

  • @jeffreyhill3960
    @jeffreyhill3960 2 роки тому +2

    Wow. Never thought a few feet of cable would make that big difference. You know I’m a pro electrician and I never thought this out. I deal with 4160 volts regularly and 480 but this is a very different thing. Humbled again by you and I will be watching for ever as I am new to solar and battery ect. Just goes to show you that you can think you are a pretty good electrician and there is always more to learn. I’m humbled next to your expertise. Bought your book. And thanks.

    • @alanpetersen4497
      @alanpetersen4497 2 роки тому +1

      I have worked with 12,460V chillers, but they don't compare to working with DC voltages, and battery systems. I have seen the results of a 480V battery system going to ground, and it was horrifying. The difference with AC, at 60 hz, is that the current will let you go on a reverse cycle, but DC current locks on, and will never let go. I am sure that it is the same with 12V-24V-and 48V battery systems. They are all dangerous.

  • @Eldon_Dice
    @Eldon_Dice 2 роки тому +10

    As an electrical engineer who specializes in battery integration (UPS systems)-- I'm very impressed with your knowledge and hands on skills. Are you self taught? If so, bravo. Batteries can be very tricky to work with and can be very dangerous. One only learns by doing and being hands on.

  • @davidlawlor1583
    @davidlawlor1583 2 роки тому +1

    So happy I stumbled along your channel, I've been bingeing your videos. You're a true subject matter expert and are a wealth of knowledge. This video partially addresses a question I've been pondering. Some background - My RV's House batteries 2x deep cycle 100AH Lead-acid batteries are nearly dead. Since we are so late in the season and I only have a month or so before I winterize it, I decided to make the leap to Lithium in phases.... starting with the batteries now (which means I also have to change out the onboard charger and engine battery isolation manager for the lithium profile), I will add solar and whole house inverter in the spring.
    I just purchased a Weize 12v/100AH LiFeP04 self Heating. (Actually bought 2, but only received 1, the other was "lost" in the mail and now they are out of stock with no ETA). Our RV House batteries are under the steps outside (thus why I need the heater versions). When I add the Solar and Inverter, I will have to install it INSIDE the RV under the dinette table bench. Space should be good. When I do that, I might like to add MORE capacity to support whole RV inverter, and was poking around at the newer CHIN 300AH battery that would also fit under the bench. (again GREAT CHIN breakdown review video!)
    My question I hope you can spare the time to answer has to do with the battery locations and differing AH capacity.
    With the "Smart" BMSs in both Weize and CHIN batteries I can see a scenario with the self-heating function engaging on one outside battery but not on the other? lets assume the external 100AH battery detects low temp, engages heating element and waits to charge, while the internal 300AH battery starts charging? How would the batteries and BMSs react? would any damage occur during that state, how about when the 100AH heats up and starts to charge? can you speculate if either batteries life would be diminished by this?
    I'd love to have a conversation over a beer on this one ;-)

  • @TimeSurfer206
    @TimeSurfer206 4 місяці тому

    I was just thinking about this yesterday.
    And I came to the same conclusion.
    And yes, I oversize my conductors, too, for DC systems.

  • @CountryBoyMoto
    @CountryBoyMoto 2 роки тому +1

    You have no idea how much I appreciate you sharing your knowledge. I wouldn’t be doing the build on my RV if not for you, Thanks!

  • @onyxsolo1
    @onyxsolo1 2 роки тому +3

    Not my major but stuff like this reminds me of how much fun I use to have in school learning about thermal conductivity using a program called labview. This video unexpectedly clarified some things I wanted to know about using bus bars. I was curious why I rarely see them used in videos. Your explanation helped a lot with the benefits I was looking to confirm; Good to know how much more efficient they can make things instead of being the danger I was concerned about due to lack of representation in practically every solar battery bank video I've seen.

  • @Wrenchen-with-Darren
    @Wrenchen-with-Darren 2 роки тому +4

    Thanks for spending a few min. Explaining why, T fuses, are so important. 👍

    • @upnorthandpersonal
      @upnorthandpersonal 2 роки тому +3

      So many people skip them because they're expensive. Don't. If I can manage to find time, I'll record a dead short on a 48V LiFePO4 some time in the future. That should make people understand ;)

  • @herbertvonsauerkrautunterh2513
    @herbertvonsauerkrautunterh2513 2 роки тому

    I've been running 72 AGM 7.2ah batteries in parallel. In parallel banks of four in my 12v off grid system. Special parallel wiring.. Nearly 12 years now 👍👍

  • @marvinsauer8493
    @marvinsauer8493 2 роки тому +2

    Very good advice on Ohms Law. Very simple, AND having an intrinsic understanding of electricity is best way to fully understand what Will is saying. Thank you!

  • @ivanmarden7179
    @ivanmarden7179 Рік тому +1

    Thank you for your expertise and clear and straightforward advice on the subject. I’m going to try to design a system soon for my RV travel trailer using solar. Keep the great information coming

  • @houstonstarbuck
    @houstonstarbuck Рік тому

    Thanks!

  • @SiriusSolar
    @SiriusSolar 2 роки тому

    I like the end of your video where you asked to hear questions, get ready the questions will come by the thousands on this mystic topic.

  • @coffeecoconutstermites8597
    @coffeecoconutstermites8597 2 роки тому +1

    Good Morning Will, Thank you for publishing a highly informative, beginner through expert level, and safety oriented channel.

  • @callummacleod8634
    @callummacleod8634 2 роки тому +1

    Thanks Will, this is just the info I've been looking for. I've got an RV trailer with solar and one 12V 110 AH Lith Ion battery and want to add a second 12V battery. Wasn't able to get an exact match (now out of production) so am adding a 100AH battery Lith Ion by a different maker - both are US made - and now I'm much more confident it will work just fine. So many other sources say don't mix batteries of different age, size, or manufacturer, and here I am doing all three.

  • @fenghuawu7521
    @fenghuawu7521 2 роки тому

    Thanks Will. Am Learning a lot solar system from you. From an old Asian dude living in Ohio.

  • @tonyjohnson1068
    @tonyjohnson1068 2 роки тому +1

    I'm so glad you mentioned parallel run have to be the same length. I've seen other youtuber showing off their systems and have everything looking so perfect , beautiful craftsmanship, then they get to the battery bank and the work is very neat looking , But then they have a bus bar on the wall and the batteries in series parallel and the bank close to the bus bar has the shortest wires then each one gets about 18 inch to 24 inches longer and they have 5 banks. so the outside bank wires are about 7 feet longer than the first one. I very nicely comment on it then they disagree with me. I've been a electrician for 30 years , I don't know everything , I'm still learning every day. But I can tell you the short parallel will be doing most of the work. I've seen many AC parallel runs melt down . and DC works just the same.

    • @jeffreyhill3960
      @jeffreyhill3960 2 роки тому

      Was just telling the same thing to will as I am a pro electrician but the things he says in his classes blows my mind Much respect to will. I was just telling him the other day that his installs were ugly and he should consider using gutters to “ cleanup his work “ as this would not be acceptable in my trade. Boy do I feel a fool. Sorry to Will as he is the journeyman and I am the helper. 👍

    • @tonyjohnson1068
      @tonyjohnson1068 2 роки тому

      @@jeffreyhill3960 My 30 years are in commercial buildings. 4000 amp services at a lowes distribution center , we added 100 battery chargers for their fork lifts 480 volts It was a long time ago , I think we ran 10 parallel runs of 500 MCM . we wired the building when it was built. if you drive around the building it's 2 miles. So I said that just to say this I can wire about any building but solar , I feel like I'm back in school again , Or in training. Will impresses me he looks young but super smart and very experienced. nothing against young people but normally it takes many years to get that much knowledge. I'm retired now and getting ready to do my DIY 10KW array and a wind turbine down the road. and it's easy if you know how to do it but I'm learning so it's not so easy for me yet. back in school. LOL

    • @tonyjohnson1068
      @tonyjohnson1068 2 роки тому

      I like to ask questions but most UA-camrs don't answer or have to many comments. One old guy I watch and he will answer every comment or question. G Bears off grid ways in the desert. He is just a lonely old man living off grid and he helped me and explained somethings. but I'm starting to understand. in our world if its 120 volts we run 120 volts . 480 we run 480 , But not in solar.

  • @10Flat
    @10Flat Рік тому +1

    Class T fuses are definitely best practice. Equipment Peak through voltages and withstand ratings should also be taken into account when designing system over current protection.

  • @commonsense-grs
    @commonsense-grs 2 роки тому

    You are one smart cookie when it comes to battery systems like these. I planning to install lithium battery pack to my roof top solar system. when i get closer. I will be asking heaps of questions.

  • @consco3667
    @consco3667 2 роки тому

    New off grid subscriber! Just wow! This guy knows his stuff!

  • @markgriffith8463
    @markgriffith8463 2 роки тому +2

    Great information, I've been wondering about these things. I have 3 EG4's and 2 Jakery's running in parallel as you do here, except I have the negative and positive wires on opposite sides. There are differences in charged state, but usually within 2-3 % of each other. Glad I bumped everything up to 2 gauge wire also.

  • @roland9367
    @roland9367 2 роки тому +1

    Great video! I will now build a lithium NMC system consisting out of 2 blocks in parallel. One will be wired closer to the boat motor (and charger) then the other. I will put a fuse on each block just above 1C rating. If funny things occur and the balancing current is unexpectedly high, the fuse should go.
    The motor is max around 0.75C of the battery bank, but if one of them disconnects through the fuse, and the master BMS is still letting the motor continue, then it will become a relatively high C rating on the remaining block, at max power.

  • @benmoody2975
    @benmoody2975 2 роки тому +4

    Ah Will, this is one of the best videos you've done for a long time! this is exactly the knowledge that you should be sharing, thank you

  • @kawasakimoto6264
    @kawasakimoto6264 2 роки тому +1

    Best explanation I seen in the subject great work!

  • @patmitskey839
    @patmitskey839 2 роки тому

    OH MY GOD!!!!
    Will...
    You Nailed It To The Wall!!!!

  • @danielardelian2
    @danielardelian2 2 роки тому +1

    I'm also a DIY'er but I did some research on parallel battery strings and I found it very interesting that a lot of commercial and industrial devices that use parallel Lithium-based strings use a bidirectional DC-DC converter *for each string*.

  • @justinharrell9256
    @justinharrell9256 2 роки тому +3

    Great video, thanks for addressing mixing capacities in parallel. Annoying that both SOK and Battleborn say that you cannot mix capacities in parallel, SOK says its due to internal resistance, Battleborn due to voltage imbalance, leads to much confusion about how IR and balance works in parallel. Andy with off-grid garage has great series of videos showing an extreme difference in battery capacity in parallel with no issues and goes over how IR allows that to happen.

  • @cutchinstreeservice
    @cutchinstreeservice 2 роки тому +2

    Great job Will. I have been watching you from your start and must say you are inspiring. Keep the freedom train moving for us all.

  • @rjlinnovations1516
    @rjlinnovations1516 2 роки тому +2

    Excellent tutorial. I always watch your videos and I learned a lot. You are an excellent speaker and you knew very well the topics which you’re talking about. You’re like an instructor and Eletrical Engineer and may be you do 👍

  • @Dennis-mq6or
    @Dennis-mq6or 2 роки тому +22

    A very old (77) engineer's comment:
    There is an old way to solving the equalization problems with those 5 batteries you have connected in parallel, And since it's very easy to do I would like you to try it and report on the results. (If not in a video, then at least to me).
    Ready?
    Disconnect the black feeder lead from the side of the parallel batteries that is on the same side as the red feeder lead, and simply move it to the other end of your group of parallel batteries. The result is all feed and discharge for the red lead comes from one end of the parallel battery bank, and the other feed and discharge for the black lead comes from the other end of your parallel battery pack.
    You can forget your buss bars if you were only adding them for balancing; because the resistances of the wires connecting the cells in parallel will act as balancing resistors during both charge AND discharge.
    You can easily calculate the series path length of any battery in the system to the load and back, and they will all be of equal loop resistance.
    If you still have any questions about why this old 'tried and true' method works so well, contact me and I will try to give you a more detailed explanation....
    Regards,
    Dennis Ostrowski
    Astro Electronics

    • @ARLGD
      @ARLGD 11 місяців тому

      Thank you for sharing your old engineer's method for equalizing batteries in parallel! It's always great to hear different approaches and solutions. The Segway Portable PowerStation Cube Series seems like a reliable option for outdoor enthusiasts and RV lovers. With its massive capacity, powerful output, fast recharging, and comprehensive protections, it definitely seems worth considering. I'll be sure to check it out! Thanks again!

    • @Floyd112007
      @Floyd112007 7 місяців тому +3

      This sounds very interesting, I would really like to see that video or at least a diagram to make sure I understand this properly. I need to add more battery and I want to do it safely.

    • @MHawkeye
      @MHawkeye 6 місяців тому +2

      @@Floyd112007
      if you watch the video, he mentions it @5:50

    • @puffadder1960
      @puffadder1960 4 місяці тому +1

      I have wired my batteries this way and charge and discharge currents on each of the 5 batteries are pretty even.

  • @bzu4113
    @bzu4113 2 роки тому +2

    Very interesting and timely topic! I’m planning to add parallel 48v batteries so that total internal resistance drop and voltage drop will be reduced. Though I was concerned of amps imbalance between strings of 48v batteries. Your video explained this very well.

  • @ronkappa
    @ronkappa 2 роки тому

    Brilliant tutorial. Well done. Explained in simple and straightforward English.

  • @dragasan
    @dragasan 2 роки тому

    Your timing is impeccable. I am very familar with Ohm's Law, etc, but I was just wondering about this. Thanks so much for sharing.

  • @yougotthatright1635
    @yougotthatright1635 2 роки тому +2

    Will, this is your first video causing me to blow split bubbles but I’m gonna watch it 10 more times and study Ohm’s Law. When I can conjure up a question deeper than, why is the second positive cable longer than the rest, I will raise my hand. Thanks for this, I think, but the battery bank needs to be installed this Summer so I better figure it out… Cheers, Dan

  • @traumagas123
    @traumagas123 2 роки тому

    Your a Great Speaker and Clearly Gifted Teacher

  • @CaptainSteve777
    @CaptainSteve777 2 роки тому +1

    Very cool. Love your videos. One small correction, although I barely understand it yet enough to explain it, regarding electron flow, they don't! The latest physics is that even though you have current and voltage, individual electrons aren't going anywhere! Mind blown. Opposite of what I "knew" all my life.

  • @mjrootz
    @mjrootz 8 місяців тому

    THANKS WILL, THIS WAS YOUR BEST VIDEO AND HAD A LOT OF INFO THAT I NEEDED. But i can imagine: if you have a fire.. man.. it'd really go up so yes.. continue to be careful.. thanks again.. great info and video.

  • @mariueg
    @mariueg 2 роки тому

    "I can talk forever". Please do! Love the content

  • @MartinVandepas
    @MartinVandepas 2 роки тому +1

    @5:52 You say you can partially solve the problem by connecting the positive at the other end. Actually, connecting "diagonally" by putting the positive at the far end on the string will *completely* solve the imbalance problem. An easy way to think of it is to add up the total resistance to each battery through both the positive and the negative cables. Jsut trace the route to each battery through both cables. So for the nearest battery to the wall it would be 3ft of negative cable and 9ft of positive cable. The farthest battery would be 9ft of positive and 3ft of negative. The middle battery would see 6ft of positive and 6ft of negative. Each battery would see 12feet total and have equal round trip resistance from the common point at the terminal block. The problem is completely solved. Bus bars are great and nothing wrong with them but they aren't magic. A copper bus bar will behave the same as a copper wire if they have the same cross sectional area. Thanks, I love your videos. Your way of explaining things is excellent.

  • @Shmade0304
    @Shmade0304 2 роки тому

    Wow your system is so sophisticated 🙌🏽🙌🏽🙌🏽🙌🏽🔋🔋🔋

  • @Patrick_Cashman
    @Patrick_Cashman 2 роки тому +1

    Great video, Will. It clears up a question that many people have, and about which there are many misconceptions.

  • @kswis
    @kswis 2 роки тому +2

    Excellent, ive had a rough day and youve now improved it. Always get stoked when i see a new video from you. Keep em coming Will youve got much to teach! I've been experimenting with lith-ion in parallel with grade B lifepo4. Each with its own bms and undersized dc breakers. Only issue I'm having in my experiment is the inverters high voltage cutoff. Pretty fun little side experiment though I must say.

  • @ls-33wraith33
    @ls-33wraith33 2 роки тому

    We have a large led acid battery bank at work they are great for a thin budget but definitely can blow up or smoke!
    We recently installed a cool pool that allegedly helps but wasn’t my choice “upgrade”

  • @emilhwilkins3275
    @emilhwilkins3275 2 роки тому +1

    Nice video Will. You could wire each negative and positive with its own wire to a buss bar, keep wires the same length if possible.

  • @ToIsleOfView
    @ToIsleOfView 2 роки тому

    The inverter connection can be on any battery so to reduce the effect of resistance the inverter could connect to the middle battery. External bus bars are usually not insulated and I think they should be so a wood or plastic cover needs to enclose them. I have never seen a battery rack so it may be insulated.

  • @Sanwizard1
    @Sanwizard1 2 роки тому

    Perfect timing as I am about to connect my DIY EVE 280ah banks in parallel with my new Seplos Mason Rack batteries at 135Ah. I will use a Selpos JASSN busbar to connect everything together with the pair of LV6548's.

  • @parkerottoackley5587
    @parkerottoackley5587 2 роки тому +2

    Your channel is the BEST.. 👍
    THANK YOU SO MUCH

  • @ronaldjean-baptiste6070
    @ronaldjean-baptiste6070 2 роки тому

    Dropping knowledge like rain!!! Thank you for sharing!!

  • @bryduhbikeguy
    @bryduhbikeguy 2 роки тому

    As smart as people say I am,I never fully grasped the fundamentals of connecting batteries in 'series'and 'parallels' for correct use and charging voltages.I've studied solar for a few years but a bit of head injury made me miss the points.(nickname explained there)You explained this so clearly that I got it 1/2-way through.Thank You ! A light clicked on,and I know what to do now.I'm sharing this.

  • @oshavlfarms7239
    @oshavlfarms7239 2 роки тому

    Thanks Will, this video calmed the OCD fires if my EE brain. 😁

  • @abramsonrl
    @abramsonrl 2 роки тому

    This is the greatest video. Thank you. It addresses all my safety questions in one video.

  • @huiponoholoholonapaws-pono1032
    @huiponoholoholonapaws-pono1032 2 роки тому

    Appreciate this, a bit over my head but able to absorb the safety concerns. Mahalo.

  • @redwood1957
    @redwood1957 2 роки тому

    Alls good at start up. It's down the road house keeping on the batteries and connections grows more important each day. High resistive loads have caused some of the worst damage I have seen. All great till the smoldering starts. You can not see under wire insulation.Thank you.

  • @SuperVstech
    @SuperVstech 2 роки тому +1

    Amen Will!
    Make sure people know the dangers of lithium dc arc shorts!

  • @martijnheeroma5492
    @martijnheeroma5492 2 роки тому

    Thanks Will, good story, helping me to think more 'safely', WILL use a cementboard behind my next setup

  • @danyoungs4061
    @danyoungs4061 2 роки тому +1

    Will, great discussion. I would like to see a video about the alarms and notifications the batteries put out during use in a parallel systems. Do you have communication with each battery? What messages are you getting during use? I am getting overcharge and over current messages during normal use. The manufacture says it is normal. The BMS puts out a message as it enters normal over voltage and over current modes. I wish they would delay these messages while normal operation is going on.
    Also could you discuss how the cell balance circuit work along with these messages while charging…. How long before these batteries balance and will the over voltage messages go away after they all reach 100 % SOC . Thanks for all your videos….

  • @ProspectorTripp
    @ProspectorTripp 2 роки тому +1

    Good information Will.. having a 67 kw lfp battery bank that has five 48v 280ah batteries in parallel with slightly different 1/0 cable lengths all with individual bms’s and circuit breakers. I never pull over 40amps on any single battery! So far so good 😊
    Having a working current of 14.2% of C max 280a = 1c is a small enough where all batteries charge and discharge at a very similar rate.
    I’m reconfiguring my battery bank and buying other 80 280ah cells!
    134kw of lfp battery storage should do it!
    I hope 🤞
    Thanks Will, keep up your good and very necessary work!
    ✌️PT

  • @firefightermommy1
    @firefightermommy1 2 роки тому +1

    Would like a video over different types of fuses and circuit breakers and where/when it is appropriate to use them.

  • @rcd5886
    @rcd5886 2 роки тому

    In that parallel configuration if you simply brought your charger/feeder cable to the centre of the pack physically you would immediately halve the cell-pack differential in voltages and minimise any issues. A simple change that reduces the biggest problem by half

  • @terrytytula
    @terrytytula Рік тому

    One of the ways I deal with your batteries in parallel problem, is I run a second wire from the first, and in my case the fourth battery. It's a simple way of compensating for the fourth battery being the end of the line.

  • @dalepatterson1748
    @dalepatterson1748 2 роки тому

    I have my 48 volt rack-mountable lithium iron phosphate battery packs, all using the same length cable, individually connected to a bus.
    Furthermore, I used copper lugs, which are soldered onto the cable with high temp solder, rather than crimping.

  • @carlosaquino8917
    @carlosaquino8917 2 роки тому

    I have learned alot from your videos. Learning so I could build my own system so I could go off grid. Thanks for your knowledge 😊 thanks for what you do

  • @Michael-s2p3p
    @Michael-s2p3p 2 роки тому +1

    Hope this applies to Battleborns mixed with SOC batteries, because I’ve been running them combined in my solar application without problems for the last two months. The BB’s have 100 Ah and the SOC’s 206 Ah. I need to get them onto distribution bus bars and set up T class fuses. Thanks for this video.

  • @victornelson1577
    @victornelson1577 2 роки тому

    Superb video. I have now mended my bad ways! Hey! Hello from Scotland UK!! 🙂

  • @offgridsolaruk843
    @offgridsolaruk843 2 роки тому

    Good will! At last a video about bus bars!! Been using bus bars from my first system, so important 🙌 Great video as always 👌 👏

  • @b25mitchel
    @b25mitchel 2 роки тому +2

    Thanks Will. Time to test and review some server racks with parallel busbars. No way to know the amp carrying capacity of the busbars in these cabinets. One I saw had poorly isolated bare metal busbars. Others are well vented for passive cooling without fans. Ability to anchor the rack for earthquake stability is a positive feature. I was thinking of using a metal mesh storage rack on wheels but that is a short (!) solution that might linger for a long time as I go on to other projects.

    • @jakeandrules7724
      @jakeandrules7724 11 місяців тому

      You can calculate based on cross sectional area of the bussbar. Copper or aluminum can be calculated

  • @Jim14872
    @Jim14872 2 роки тому +1

    Will,
    I recommend proper ul listed load center/battery combiner with equal length larger than you need cables and buss bars inside locked cabinets to reduce voltage drop and accidental touch. As for the high current t class fuses, I prefer using Midnite Solar breakers they can break 50,000 Amps at 150VDC and they also have remote trip capabilities as an option. They have everything you need. Including proper surge/lightning protection for AC and DC to help you get to code compliance.

    • @NeverTakeNoCut-offs
      @NeverTakeNoCut-offs 2 роки тому

      What are some good/recommended battery combiner models? I've seen a few Midnite solar combiner boxes that looked like busbars in boxes for $1000. Am I missing something?

  • @kyba74
    @kyba74 2 роки тому +2

    A great idea for a video you could make:
    - Shorting a 48v 280Ah LiFePO4 bank (like your grade B cell one) without a BMS, through a Class-T fuse, and then through an ANL fuse.
    This will get millions of views, be quite entertaining to watch, and emphasise the safety of different fuse types. There are no videos demonstrating such a thing. I'd imagine you could film it from many angles, maybe try get an amperage reading. The battery would probably be ruined thereafter but I'm sure you'd more than make up for that in video revenue. Also can't ignore the scientific value of such a demonstration! You'd have to devise some idea of disconnecting the battery if there is 10,000A flowing if an arc forms (I'm dubious that it actually will form a plasma arc at only 48v).

  • @ericdelevinquiere9902
    @ericdelevinquiere9902 2 роки тому

    I am glad you still have fuses in your system, those circuits beakers are crap when it comes to large currents! People are lured in a false sense of security with these breakers. I have burned a few on purpose without trying very hard!

  • @issabangura4350
    @issabangura4350 2 роки тому

    I really admire and enjoy the lectures

  • @davidnoack9727
    @davidnoack9727 Рік тому

    Great job. I’ve watched many of your videos and they are always excellent. Thanks, DN

  • @tincankiller6454
    @tincankiller6454 2 роки тому +1

    Very good information, appreciate your knowledge and giving it to us Thank You!!!
    Stay Safe & Good Luck

  • @stans5270
    @stans5270 2 роки тому +1

    At the beginning of each of these videos, I intend to understand Will and his explanations for his solar wiring, but 1/3 of the way through it I always turn into Pinky, and Will is the Brain.

  • @jimhealey6858
    @jimhealey6858 2 роки тому +4

    Will, thank you for your informative videos. Would it make a difference if you were to connect the battery bank at the center battery instead of on the end?

    • @JohnDoe-pv2iu
      @JohnDoe-pv2iu Рік тому

      Without a Buspar it would be like the bank he has on the floor. The only difference is that the center battery would hit 100% then the next battery out, and then finally the end batteries. Better than just at one end but the electricity would still have to overcome the wiring resistance to charge all the batteries. I hope this is helpful. Ya'll Take Care and be safe, John

  • @jeffreyrapkin6177
    @jeffreyrapkin6177 2 роки тому

    Dude you are awesome FINALLY everything is starting to make sense thank you so much for making these videos!!!

  • @marklewus5468
    @marklewus5468 2 роки тому

    Great video. I’m a retired EE who spent some years building power systems. A few comments. Circuit breakers can fail shorted, whereas fuses will only fail open (in this application, anyway). I always put a fuse on V+ for each battery, even if there’s a circuit breaker. With bus bars or wire, you want each conductor to be the same size and length (ie, impedance) from each battery to the inverter/charger. That’s the best way to ensure that each battery charges and discharges fully with no differential voltage between packs. As you noted in the video, connecting diagonally or from opposite ends gets your most of the way there, or you can use a star configuration. this is not as big a problem with lithium as it was with lead acid, but you really want the packs to charge/discharge more or less equally, or you will put more cycles on one battery than the others.