You can also listen to this show on Spotify, Apple, Stitcher, or wherever you get your podcasts! Direct links here: upswingpoker.com/podcast/ep2-three-bet
Mike, my man, you're giving us free content that is incredibly informative. Audio was fine and if anyone complained then they should probably look in the mirror, proper 3bet ranges are the least of their problems. Thanks for these and please keep them coming.
I brought this up in the blind defense video as well but I'm curious to know how to handle people who open much larger (which is common in small stakes live cash games). Say the open is to $15 or $20 in a $1/2 game, playing $300 deep. This is a very common situation. In this case the open is about the size of a normal 3-bet. Does this mean that we flat more in position, and 3-bet with what would usually be a 4-bet range? 3-betting to $60 over a $20 open means that a 4-bet is probably more or less pot-committing and even a call leaves low SPR for postflop play, which minimizes the positional advantage. So, what are reasonable 3-bet ranges in this situation? As I said, it's very common in live small stakes cash, so I think that this is an important topic for people who play a lot of $1/$2 (or whatever the smallest game in your casino is)
Great question, I'm in the same boat as you. My 1/2 games in Portland, OR it's all open raises to 10/12/15/20/25 so re raising to 45-60 leaves room for like a good sized bet on the flop but after that you're pretty committed. I personally call more in these spots as you mentioned and try to out play them post flop. It really depends on how many people are in the hand for me and their play styles. If someone opens to 10 or 12 and folds around, a reraise to 30-35 leaves room to play, but if 5 people are in the pot for 10 or 12 each then you're gonna need to bump it up higher to get worse hands to fold, so like 60/70 in my opinion. Maybe a hair higher. The rule of thumb is 3x the original bet, plus 1 original bet per person in front of you. How you navigate post flop is a different story too, depends on what you have and what you hit. I'm not a pro but I am what I consider a "solid reg" at my local games.
Amazing work ! Got an RFI video ? GTO makes more sense the more we look at this ! 654 played over 789 in final quiz because 789 boards are completed more on the higher end ? Or we are just covering the low boards sometimes .. Anyway I think I get some of this; great work !!🎉
Are we assuming 9max and are these particular ranges developed for online or live or considered a viable default range for both before weighing other factors such as opponents tendencies?
Ranges are for 6-max. Moreso for online but still they're a solid baseline for live -- the live factors of "bigger raise sizes" and "less aggressive players behind" end up roughly cancelling each other out, which allows you to play similarly.
Question.... in small stakes live poker ( 1/2,1/3 n 2/5 games) ... when stacks are shallow or smaller do these concepts still apply or how should they be adjusted??
Generally I prefer 3! or fold strategy out of SB but think there's merit for completing vs multiple flats and a passive BB as immediate pot odds and implied odds (for when you smash the flop) greatly increase. Or am I getting it wrong, especially considering rake? Thanks!
by completing, do you mean limping for the extra 0.5bb? That's clearly fine when you have the opportunity and appropriate hand. Vs a raise and multiple calls, you can make arguments for having some flats with hands that play well multiway (low pocket pairs, maybe some suited connectors) especially if the big blind is weak and won't squeeze very often. Just be careful if the BB is a decent player because they can and will punish you if you flat to often.
100bb stacks? If so, I'd go a bit smaller but quite close to the same 3x/4x. When deeper, def stick with 3x/4x and maybe even increase those sizes if you get over 250bb
Honestly COvMP facing 2.5x open at 100bb effective I'm never 3betting AJo unless I think MP has too many offsuit combos or that he's opening hands like Q7s, T7s, or 86s. JTs is only 3bet 50% as is K9s in this configuration. I'm also pure 3betting A3s and A6s as well as A8s 50%. I would assume these charts are a different rake structure?
You can also listen to this show on Spotify, Apple, Stitcher, or wherever you get your podcasts! Direct links here: upswingpoker.com/podcast/ep2-three-bet
Hope you guys enjoy! Feel free to ask any questions and I'll do my best to answer em all.
Thanks for the free vid
Sorry about my piss poor audio in this one. I improved my mic for episode 3, which will be out next Wednesday (Jan 18th) and covers BB defense.
Mike, my man, you're giving us free content that is incredibly informative. Audio was fine and if anyone complained then they should probably look in the mirror, proper 3bet ranges are the least of their problems. Thanks for these and please keep them coming.
@@MaximusMerideus thanks for the kind words Max!
Thank you, gonna look for those Bluff three bets...
I brought this up in the blind defense video as well but I'm curious to know how to handle people who open much larger (which is common in small stakes live cash games). Say the open is to $15 or $20 in a $1/2 game, playing $300 deep. This is a very common situation. In this case the open is about the size of a normal 3-bet. Does this mean that we flat more in position, and 3-bet with what would usually be a 4-bet range? 3-betting to $60 over a $20 open means that a 4-bet is probably more or less pot-committing and even a call leaves low SPR for postflop play, which minimizes the positional advantage. So, what are reasonable 3-bet ranges in this situation? As I said, it's very common in live small stakes cash, so I think that this is an important topic for people who play a lot of $1/$2 (or whatever the smallest game in your casino is)
Great question, I'm in the same boat as you. My 1/2 games in Portland, OR it's all open raises to 10/12/15/20/25 so re raising to 45-60 leaves room for like a good sized bet on the flop but after that you're pretty committed. I personally call more in these spots as you mentioned and try to out play them post flop. It really depends on how many people are in the hand for me and their play styles. If someone opens to 10 or 12 and folds around, a reraise to 30-35 leaves room to play, but if 5 people are in the pot for 10 or 12 each then you're gonna need to bump it up higher to get worse hands to fold, so like 60/70 in my opinion. Maybe a hair higher. The rule of thumb is 3x the original bet, plus 1 original bet per person in front of you. How you navigate post flop is a different story too, depends on what you have and what you hit. I'm not a pro but I am what I consider a "solid reg" at my local games.
Great content💪🏾💯
Good job guys!
Am I understanding correctly, you are advocating a smaller 3bet size heads up OOP, and a larger 3 bet size OOP in full ring?
Love the podcast! Thanks Guys
Great podcast, please keep it going.
Amazing work !
Got an RFI video ?
GTO makes more sense the more we look at this !
654 played over 789 in final quiz because 789 boards are completed more on the higher end ?
Or we are just covering the low boards sometimes ..
Anyway
I think I get some of this; great work !!🎉
Hi, can you make video on how to play vs cbet / barreling?
love your content guys
great content but gazzyb needs a better mic
Are we assuming 9max and are these particular ranges developed for online or live or considered a viable default range for both before weighing other factors such as opponents tendencies?
Ranges are for 6-max. Moreso for online but still they're a solid baseline for live -- the live factors of "bigger raise sizes" and "less aggressive players behind" end up roughly cancelling each other out, which allows you to play similarly.
When you say r-bet to 3x the open, is that 3x the raise size or 3x the total amount? Ie. open raise to 2bb. Is my 3-bet size 5bb or 6bb?
In 1/2 games with shallow stacks and a $5-7 rake, vs weak players, is it profitable to flat opens in mp and co?
Is there math/logic for 3/4x ?
I hear this so much and want to know the maths/logic there
Thank you so much for the show !
you want to reduce spr when out of position so you raise larger to take away some of their positional advantage, and disincentivize calls
Question.... in small stakes live poker ( 1/2,1/3 n 2/5 games) ... when stacks are shallow or smaller do these concepts still apply or how should they be adjusted??
are those guidelines for MTT or Cash?
What 3! Size do you recommend for a squeeze from btn or BB.
Why is it a disaster to raise a hand like 97s?
we 3b KTs versus EP from SB at which frequency?
Generally I prefer 3! or fold strategy out of SB but think there's merit for completing vs multiple flats and a passive BB as immediate pot odds and implied odds (for when you smash the flop) greatly increase. Or am I getting it wrong, especially considering rake? Thanks!
by completing, do you mean limping for the extra 0.5bb? That's clearly fine when you have the opportunity and appropriate hand.
Vs a raise and multiple calls, you can make arguments for having some flats with hands that play well multiway (low pocket pairs, maybe some suited connectors) especially if the big blind is weak and won't squeeze very often. Just be careful if the BB is a decent player because they can and will punish you if you flat to often.
In playing my normal low stakes home game. “Standard open” is 5BB. Basically $15 in a 1/3 game. Still recommend the 3x/4x three bet sizing? Thanks
100bb stacks? If so, I'd go a bit smaller but quite close to the same 3x/4x. When deeper, def stick with 3x/4x and maybe even increase those sizes if you get over 250bb
Honestly COvMP facing 2.5x open at 100bb effective I'm never 3betting AJo unless I think MP has too many offsuit combos or that he's opening hands like Q7s, T7s, or 86s.
JTs is only 3bet 50% as is K9s in this configuration. I'm also pure 3betting A3s and A6s as well as A8s 50%. I would assume these charts are a different rake structure?
he is reading a script why act like this is a Q and A?
the audio sucks