You touched it, you own it; or why technicians are "ripoffs."
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- Опубліковано 26 вер 2024
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Recently I posted a video about how one might not receive a "pity discount" if they act a certain way, which can be found here. • The cost of being an a...
This spawned a discussion of the word ripoff. What is a ripoff? What are you paying for when you pay for a professional service? Lastly, I introduce the VERY important concept that Alan Glasser teaches that if you TOUCHED it, you OWN it!
You will be held accountable for nearly everything that goes wrong with what you touch. It is human nature.
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At 7:19 woww, we even have a huge sign posted in the store basically saying that we are not responsible for any unrelateds issue during and after repair. Customer logic sure doesn't work as technician's logic, they just scream bloody murder when a component fails on the other side of the board during or after repair, due to existing liquid damage, a drop etc. Now, if something gets damaged right next to a component that we have repaired, of course they get a free fix for that. Fun, fun, fun to explain that in layman's terms (or let's call it "Rossmann's terms" ; )... lol
I think the most important information anyone should learn from this video is at 17:50 soooo true!
Louis Rossmann na mate you wrong phone techs doing for living not for youtube we need to feed our families we deserve what we charge
Regardless, if you can't make enough to feed your family then maybe this is not the business for you.
In this internet age you will not be able to hide information no matter how hard you try... just some food for thought...
Bill A so you saying charge to customer for a charging socket $5 which is cost $3? come on men i had shops i never tryed to been cheap if you need repair you pay it wveeything have a value specially my EYES not for free
Great
"You touch it, you own it."
FINALLY Something that explains why it's my fault that mom's internet explorer stopped loading facebook correctly because I sat down at her computer once in 2004.
Oh God, that's exactly what my mother does. I sit om her laptop to check some Google docs or w/e and whatever happens for the next 5 years is somehow my fault!
@@ihalia and that’s why I am getting an education in IT. For some reason my family feels like a computer is out of this worldly complicated and holy, but also devilish and will corrupt you if not properly managed.
They refuse to properly debate outside of a car without a phone whilst you’re talking, and they know better than you.
And refuse to look at sources you cite, because they are wrong for whatever reason.
@@ihalia Time to move out
@@CES-dh4ut I am living on my own but I do love my parents so I visit often.
HAHAHAH, I use to hear that all the time when I was a kid. Funny thing about that, who do they ask for when shit breaks after I moved out? I tell them the same thing and to call up the company they bought it from because I don't work for them. I paid out of pocket to send myself to college for tech, after the ration of sh-- I got as a kid (and them helping my sister with college but refusing me) it's the least I can do to pay them back for that.
My grandfather had a saying "You aren't paying me to simply press a button, you're paying me to *know* which button to press." and I always remember that when up against the jobs that were simpler than I expected, keeping in mind that it took years of experience and training to *make* it a "simple" job.
A great tailor does little cutting
I love that quote!
Picasso has been once asked by a women if he could draw her something on a nappkin. He did. She was delighted and excited of the outcome and said: You did this in 30sec?! Picasso answerd: No it took me 30 years to do this in 30 secs. ...(i hope that i have recalled the anecdote correcly)
It's much simpler than that.
You have a skill, that skill has a monetary value as people are willing to pay cash money for it. If you are not willing to pay the price I set for my skill then go somewhere else. There is no use in justifying yourself to people who do not understand your industry. In fact, there is no use in justifying yourself to ANYONE.
Go to mcdonalds and try to haggle with them about the price of a big mac and they will show you the door, its time the tech industry do the same. People have been arguing with techies for long enough, so if you dont like our prices go somehwere else.
I used to repair big screen TVs in peoples houses. When I walked in, saw the model and symptom if I could fix it in five minutes, I'd have to hide behind the TV and pretend like I was doing something for 30-45 mins then fix it after sitting there for a half hour. Otherwise, the customer would freak out if I fixed it in 5 mins and I charged them 200 bucks. BTW, I worked for Sears and Circuit City....worst jobs I ever had. Also worked for Sony, that was a great job....only did warranty calls, Sony paid for everything, never had to bill the customer...that was a great gig.
People are just babies, When I used to be a plumber I would get a call at 11:00pm "My Furnace won't fire up help help it's cold" I always start the call with trying to help them "walk through the problem" and 1) is check to see if someone flipped the switch for the power to the furnace so try and save me the drive & them a $110 min servers call fee, and they start to panic " no no come now its cold" so I go to there home and charge them $110 to flip a switch, then I get the gears "rip off rip off your a scam" lol
That sounds about right...
What people forget with things you fix on-site is that sometimes you can fix something quickly or it appears "simple" - but it's taken many years for you to gain the knowledge and experience to make that a quick fix and not have to spend hours working it out. You can't charge only for the actual 15 minutes it took to fix it or you'd go bankrupt.
Truth! The amount of time I'd try to help them over the phone was wasted, I would just go out there. Even if I measure the voltage at unit (ts zero, I know the breaker is flipped) I still tell the customer I have to turn the power off, then I pretend like I've fixed something on their furrnace, then I turn the power back on and "voila"...they're happy they only had to pay the minimum. People are jerks and cheap bastards, you have to frame it to where they're getting a good deal. I got into the repair business because I hated sales. Turns out, I've done more selling as a tech then I ever did as a salesman.
@@glengraham2319 Customers also dont understand the guy who can fix it in 5 mins knows what he's doing vs the hack who tears everything apart not checking the simple problems first and then gives a ridiculous estimate for something that's not broken. Customers are idiots.
Ha, reminded me about one time I had to fly from Europe to Trinidad and Tobago just to verify that a card (rpm monitoring system) needed to be replaced.
One capacitor: $0.10
Knowing exactly where to put it: $499.90
Genius Bar quoting.
Same can be applied to programming: 100 hours analyzing, 10 minutes code change to fix bug. And yes, For inexperienced programmer, he cannot solve it, same as Louis can, but trainee cannot.
@@effexon That's not the same thing. In Alex' case, people pay a lot of money just for specialized knowledge. In the programmer's case his employer pays a lot of money for specialized knowledge AND time spent solving the problem. At the end of the day it's supply and demand.
Had a 300$ motherboard with a ripped of capacitor. Went to the "certified" repair store. They said that the repair would cost 65$, I left. An evening of googling and looking at board's scheme resulted in a 15-minute repair at a cost of 0.00$(I did not lose the capacitor).
99% of work they do does not require any professional knowledge.
@@rinrin4711 You did have to spend an evening googling, time not spent making money or on family/hobbies. Opportunity cost.
That fly is a customer that was pissed you didn't give a free second repair. They returned in their true form
Alienware once sent a horrible tech to replace my laptops keyboard.
I saw him shoving a plier into my keyboard. I heard a snap and I knew he broke it.
He quickly tried to leave telling me its fixed and I said..hold on....
I stopped him from leaving, told him to watch me test the laptop. The replacement keyboard was broken!!!
Now THAT is a ripoff. Tech breaks it then lies saying it's fixed.
I returned it and never got anything except off lease Thinkpads since.
yikes
I had a HP NC6400 that they sent a tech to my home after overnighting 2 boards ram and a set of new ram just because the laptop had full coverage still on it from the company that donated a dead laptop to me. 1500 worth of parts and labor for free.
Legit normal size pliers? Dafuq? I use tweezers (those damn flex cables. Chubby fingers not that great at grabbing them. Though my fingers are sorta not chubby but still) but never have I went hey bob hand me them there bolt cutters somethings up with this keyboard.
iam100eyes warranty service technicians are paid like garbage. On top of it, they have to work in front of customers, which sucks. Most people with skills in this business do not touch warranty repair with a 10 foot pole, so the people doing it aren't exactly the best
iam100eyes it's the same with any type of third party/accidental damage insurance you get at best buy. to make it economical they provide the cheapest service they can
This is such a difficult subject to tackle, and when one of my best friend and I opened "Computer Problems" years ago , we would get those types of people in which we would never make happy.
The irony at times was that that they were more than happy to dump their bank accounts at any price when the issue was, for example:
1. An "emergency" for them....on a Sunday.
2. "Can you get it done in a day" - even though we had a 2-day guaranteed turn around for most laptop/desktop repairs. (that didn't require a part we didn't have in stock)
3. "My (insert family member) died yesterday...need these pictures for the funeral..."
The list was endless.
Like you said Louis, we always treated everyone like family. Your "grandmother" analogy made me smile. So true.
So, after the repair was complete, customer is informed, it would go completely south when they came to pay.
"So this part you charged me for was $10 less on eBay. What can you say to that?"
"My nephew got out of highschool and could have done this for free"
"I knocked on the store door at 6:30am and you were inside and didn't fucking answer! "
(This happened alot actually. Nevermind that the store hours are posted on the door, and on the big ass sign facing the street. Or to the fact that we always let people in early regardless...but not when you used your car keys and bang on the glass door for 30 minutes. Wtf.)
All of what you said in this video resonates to how some people literally flip their shit when it comes to :
THEIR repairable issue + YOUR price/time = THEIR money that should be never MINUS from their hands.
Because, as you stated: WE don't have intrinsic value in their eyes. It makes sense to them.
I've found you can make 1000 customers happy for life, and it takes 1 to post their hatred of your services for whatever reason, and that's the only one you'll remember. As well as every other person in the world reading the review. sigh...
However, not all people are like that, of course.
Some assclowns just steal tip jars from your store instead of arguing about price.
I loved this video bro. You touched on so many good points (in 26 minutes), and you could have talked for an hour just on ripoff's alone.
Thank you for all the work you do.
I am just gonna guess that the fly got the professional rate.
Azivegu you mean the zombie fly? Lol
@@MisterRorschach90
the flying dead ? :-)
Lmao
it was was diluted windex, so he paid the professional rate for a mediocre service
I know so muc Hostility for that fly I want to know did it do to him for him to feel so hurt and so angry
This is why i stopped being the nice friendly guy who helps people with computer problems. I used to install windows for friends and replace their drives all that simple stuff. Until one day a "friend" got pissed off cause his drive failed even after i told him not to buy a used drive and was reluctant to install it for him and install windows on it after he bought it.
I do all this with simple statement - "You pay me nothing, I guarantee you nothing". Luckily so far worst that happened to me was failure in fixing corrupted windows without reinstalation (my grandma absolutely refused to any data backup and also refused to lose her data at the same time... and it is easier to feed ice cream to aligator then to argue with old person who does not understand technology that much.)
Doesn't matter, anyone loves to blame someone else than themselves. Friends/people/stoners/neighborhood ppl you do these fixes for trying to be cool with them, are fucking retards and always drop it, spill on it, plug it directly in the wall with no surge supressor in their ghetto ass house, WHATEVER. You know what happened to it when it breaks again, and it's too technical to tell them in a sense that they can understand it's THEIR BAD. So it's your fault. Again. After like 5 months or something.
hardrives dont like getting in and out of computers - a new hardrive migth dont like it be done 10 times the 11th is then a hardware error so old hardrives must he handles very carefully - you dont do a wipe on them like with eraser eg letting the program write over the hardrive 35 times - Eraser killed 2 only 3 year old hardives for me .
@@jari2018 1 pass wipe is sufficient
@@jari2018 if data privacy is that important "to you"; A) don't resell drives, and B) when discarding drives, remove labels and controller board. A properly secure wipe can take ages. Removing labels and controller board; less than a minute. There's not that many HDD *casing* models out there, but there are tens of thousands of controllers and setups. Meaning unless someone through other means found out _before_ decomission, exactly what model of drive it was, including serial, manufacturing date etc - even most forensic data recovery specialists aren't getting that data out.
"...you're actually getting paid for the years and years and years of time that you spent learning how to do that." -- Thank you. I don't know when people stopped being able to spot value, but this is the best quote out of this video and explains almost everything people have to pay for.
Louis, you possess a lot of wisdom regarding business and life for someone your age! Continued success to you! :)
+flashbak01 Thank you!
+flashbak01 Yes, I am quite taken by the wisdom presented here, top stars!
His age doesn't matter - the wisdom continues. Please open a shop here in Canberra, Australia.
Trust me, this type of niche repair business doesn't work well without the owner being there constantly. It's not like any other business, it takes talent and dedication to run smoothly and profitably. Been there done it, and eventually decided to do only one shop and do it well, rather than a bunch and do it crappy.
The lesson on "doesn't matter how I did it and how long it took, the results are as desired. Pay me." was something my professor drilled into us in school, and it's some of the best advice. glad you said it. he used the analogy of being given a problem, told the details, desired outcome, you listen, consider the problem, then turn one screw a quarter of an inch, and ask for payment. if they complain (and he said they WILL), remember they came to you for your expertise, time was not a factor, and pointed out that we were all sitting in school devoting hundreds of hours of time to study, and a great deal of money, so that eventually people will pay us for our knowledge, and don't rip ourselves off.
lol i just got to the part where you talk about that. 16:36
The "you touched it, you own it" thing actually happened to me last week when I had a shop replace the clutch on my car. After they were done, the engineer (not the mechanic that actually did the work) came to me and said "we're done but now there's a sensor error" (the sensor had to be plugged out of the engine for them to change the clutch). I was obviously annoyed and told him, well that's not my problem, you guys disconnected and reconnected the thing, you figure it out. We agreed that I'll come in a couple of days later and they'll look at it but we didn't agree that it was their fault. They insisted that I purchase a new sensor through their store before they took it out to look at it. It wasn't a big deal (100$) but I was annoyed because I had already spent like more than 1k on the other repairs and my finances were running low. So after I insisted that I'm not satisfied, the engineer agreed to offer me free service on the thing but I would still have to pay for the new sensor.
I asked around what could have happened, why would the thing just kick the bucket like that and what was the chance (statistically) that it was just a coincidence. Everybody ASSURED me that 100% it wasn't the fault of the shop and that it's such a brain dead operation (plugging it out and back in) that there's no point in me losing my temper over it and causing them problems.
The day comes and the same mechanic that did the original work starts pulling it out of the car. This time I was watching him. During the operation he goes "man, this cord that I put on the cable of the sensor isn't coming off easily". After struggling with it for 5 more minutes he finally manages to take the whole thing out and to everyone's surprise, the cable was cut off just enough for one of the wires to get pierced. We all examined the thing carefully and it was clear that the cable had been strangled. Whether it was from the cord that the mechanic put on it or not is obviously debatable, but one thing is sure. If the problem existed prior then that mechanic should have told the engineer about it, so I suspect that everything was just fine before the clutch repair.
Being a sensible man, and having some experience with cables and wires, I agreed to let them patch it up. The engineer did the work, and it looked like he knew what he was doing. After putting it back in the car and resetting the computer, it worked.
I obviously didn't pay for the new sensor, I have no idea what they did with it, but the point is that if I would have been an asshole, I could have made them install the new one and throw away mine, while not paying for anything.
So sometimes even a very simple thing like plugging a cable in and out can go to shit, although everyone assures you that it can't.
+XfStef the issue is when you spent ten hours a day getting blamed for everything. i've skyrocketed my prices since i started my business because i expect to be blamed for everything under the sun.
i still remember this woman two years ago blaming me for her 2011 mbp's gpu dying after I installed libreoffice. you don't forget things like that.
+Louis Rossmann well that woman probably had no freaking idea how a computer works. I'm sure you get lots of nut cases who bust your balls for stuff that is not your fault
I just felt like sharing my story since it was a good example of a time when the repair guy really did screw something up although it was almost impossible to do so. Either that or he failed to observe the damaged cable during the first repair.
+Louis Rossmann PS: I love your videos. Keep up the great work man! You're a real inspiration.
I’m not a technical person, but I still appreciate your videos. I always learn something from watching you perform “surgery” on a circuit board. But this video was even more compelling, because it explains how a professional person sets their client’s expectations. You’ve made me a better customer. Thank you.
Kinda reminds me of the old story about Nicola Tesla fixing a machine for Henry Ford by just hitting it with a hammer and charging him $10,000. Tesla explained that $5 was for using the hammer, $9995 was for knowing WHERE to hit it. This is one of those stories that changes characters and situations, but you get my drift.
+n10cities A bankers tale. Yes Sir, sign here.
+n10cities I heard a similar story about Picaso. He was asked to make a quick portrait in a party and after 10 minutes of drawing he was finished and asked 10 000$. "But it was only 10 minutes! how can you charge 10 000$ for that?" - "but it took me 40 years to do this in 10 minutes."
+Kapteinis Reinis Picaso charged in "dollars"? haha.
I heard a story where Ford told Tesla he's give him a million if he improved his engine, and when Tesla did it, Ford explained that it was a jk lol fuk u
You're confusing Ford with Thomas Edison. Edison bet Tesla $50,000 that he couldn't improve the design of his electric generator. Tesla did it and then Edison basically stated that he was joking and didn't pay.
This is why I won't fix anything for my friends anymore, as they will always blame you if something totally unrelated breaks.
It's much better in the long run just to say no to people.
family is worse in my experience they want the job done for free and then they wont even gift you a dime
"sorry, i do not know how to fix your issue" is what i always say today, cant be bothered wasting days of work and then be blamed for something else not working right
@@Vinni-2K Tell me about it... My sister wanted me to design a product for her that she could sell, monetize and profit... When I asked what was my cut? She said she would take all the risks and pay me for the parts but not for my time. I said: Nope, do it yourself. To this day, she has not done it. She doesn't seem to hold grudge but she really didn't understand how much engineering is needed for product, and time...
And to keep family bonds intact, I haven't designed the product and started selling it myself. I grant it is a good idea and should make money, but terms should be right for both of us.
@@Vinni-2KRude!
@@tegandetermann3299 actually read it just now
I guess it wasnt my day that time idk
I had a boss who explained things in a way many understood because sometimes he would get asked for a discount because we did the job pretty fast and we did it fast becasue we had very good equipment and I was well trained. My boss would refuse it's this rate for this amount of square foot end of the story. He would tell them a story to show it's not a ripoff it goes something like this. Imagine you called me to come and dig a hole and I charge you a flat rate for digging that hole and you see it took me 8 hours to dig that hole then he would say and that would make you feel like you got your money worths of work out of me right of course they would agree then he would say now if you call me back to dig another hole and I show up with a backhoe and dig that same hole in 5 mins and charged you the same flat rate why should that make you feel you got less for your dollar? I worked less but you still got the same ghole I upgraded from digging one hole a day to digging 25 holes a day and either way you still got your money worth of work so don't fret pay up.
Very cool, that whole thing is only 4 sentences long and it bothers me
Your assumption that any price anywhere is fair is unwarranted.
Ive been blamed for a computer virus 5 years after doing a hard drive upgrade. But yes it's true. My IT professor used to always say that regardless of how good you do or what you charge half of the customers will love you and the other half will hate you. And regardless of how much you go out of your way to help them they will still hate you.
+Mike Hawk true
I like the you touched it you own it saying. Sadly it's vary true. My favorite is when you hear "it was working just fine yesterday and so we watched a movie on my bed and it just shut off" lol don't even need to see their laptop with out knowing exactly why it shut off and won't turn back on.
Mike Hawk yeah and it was sunny until I woke up today, I guess I brought the rain too.
"Treat people the way you would be okay with someone treating your grandma."
Preach.
"have you tried turning it off and on again?"
> 200$ pls
If you hit the repair shop before trying turning it off and on, you probably deserve to be hit with 200$ IMO.
Genius! "Do unto others as you would have them do unto your nice gradma." A very sensible update to the golden rule!
Agreed, it is easy to calculate the price of things, but service is a bit hard to calculate fairly
It doesn't matter what you charge if you already lay out all the charges and rates upfront.
Fair is always on the person doing the work, not the person asking for the work to be done
I know a guy who does furniture repair He has a minimum charge of 150. He goes out and wipes some stuff on it and says hows that. Well if you want me to make it better than that I need to charge XXX amount then they pay the 150. All he does most of the time is get paid for wiping stuff. That is a rip off. National company called furniture medic beware.
Call him out again for another job and then just beat his fuckin' ass dude on the spot.
no, thats a con.
That's illegal. You should report him.
He can wipe me ass
@@will9603 professional wiping service now thats something id pay 100s for /s
Dude, louis, you are an inspiration, i've started watching your videos since linus introduced me to your channel but i mean... you are like... you're amazing dude, your channel is an actual tech channel and i absolutely love it. all of your talk videos make it like a philosophy and life lesson channel too. Your channel is quickly becoming my favorite.
+Eric Magaña Tech Thank you for watching!
Normal persons logic: correlation = causation.
+deklor Good luck explaining otherwise to them!
You have to kill evil three times before it's really dead.
I could not agree more with the you touch it, you own it concept. At my job we refer to it as being married to the problem. at my current job as a watchmaker we sometimes we refuse to work on a watch entirely because it is not worth being married to the watch. One simple problem now "marries" us to that watch and if there are further issues we are kinda obligated to fix them because we have already worked on that watch.
"You touched it; you own it; but how much do you want to own?"
I Loved that sentence!
Can't agree with all of the video; because I believe time is the most valuable commodity (let's face it you can't buy more). However, we all have our thing, our focus, our opinion, and yours is clearly okay with you, and the customers.
that is so true, clients do not value our work!
+oldestgamer indeed
car technician.....repairs radio, you touched my car now my seat don't work....
+juggernautxtr YES!!!
o god been there lol install a used motor that customer found
told customer thay should replace water pump and timing belt
customer is like one it has is fine on the 250k motor that got for 500$
timing belt take a dump 3 months down road and thay come back pissed and point finger at me for making belt fail lmao
@@Willam_J Thats' easy. She probably said "My husbands an engineer" (some desk jockey who works on NOTHING related to cars or audio) and because her beta, henpecked, nagged husband wanted to get her out his hair, he blamed you for her transmission going out.
This is why I got out of appliance and consumer electronics repair. Same sheet different bucket.
New subscriber here- I must say, you really take it home with these videos. Mechanic for 3 years and it's all relevant in my work. Especially the "friends" abusing you for your skills. They literally think $1600 worth of work is equivalent to a few beers. Totally done with the "side" jobs for friends/family. 10x out of 10 you'll be let down. Hard. Keep up the quality content.
i work on computers has a part time hobby, (mostly software related issues). on wethet i replace a broken laptop screen or remove viruses, i always say "if "problem" returnes within 30 days let me know and ill fix it for free," unless its viruses, most times i give a small training session on WHAT NOT TO VIEW. so far in 8 years ive only has 2 people come back with problems, the rest have been happy.
I'm in a totally different industry ( I'm a dancer, teacher and choreographer) and this is soo on point in terms of lmost anyone's business model. I can't tell you the number of times I give a low cost trying to be nice and then the project takes far more time, effort, and expense than original agreed because I/ we are asked to do more or make extra changes. This was a great help. Thank you!
FYI
I Love your big box exposures. Thanks for helping us non-tech saavy folks out here 🤪
I feel like this man has the balance all figured out on when to be generous and when to show tough love without being a pushover, and without acting like an asshole.
I really respect the example Louis sets for how to conduct oneself in life.
Thanks for the insights, I do freelance web development and what you say applies 100% in this profession too. I must say, when I started I had it all wrong. But I learn from my mistakes.
Love your videos and the humor too, totally on my wavelength. It's really amazing to watch you do diagnosis, circuit repairs, and soldering. I have recommended your business to my friends who sadly use Apple products. Rock on!
You as a tech have probably seen how people take care of their computers. It's atrocious. I work for a small family owned tech shop (only 2 stores), but my god you wonder how certain things get inside their system. Even the exterior, it looks beat up. Also, they've now seem to wised up and lie about never "touching" it.
So glad you made this video. I know it was more advice for those in the industry but it speaks miles for your character. I knew I liked you for a reason ;) and not just because you cuss as much as I do. Glad you didn't edit you murdering the fly out of the video too lol you're hilarious and have a great ethical backbone, and all around a great person from what I see in your videos, not to mention you do so much to share knowledge for idiots like me to learn from where as I otherwise would never be able to gain that from. I'm even more so appreciative you share that knowledge with those who really are going to put it to good use.
Had an auto shop send me to another shop.. essentially the parts supplier they had did not sell a component of a part that failed - only the whole thing which required more labor to replace. I will still goto the first shop for other matters as they werent trying to rip me off by being upfront. Thats good business. great video Louis. ANd to go with what you're saying, i had an analog vacuum gauge die but with a smell. cost to replace was well over 200$ in the end i found it was a burnt resistor that i replaced for 30cents. However... the 5 hours of opening it, diagnosing, net surfing- part sourcing(thank god for color codes. then repair... sure the cost was only 30cents but that five+ hours lost are an unseen cost.
Yeah, but a tech might have diagnosed and replaced it in 5 minutes. Sounds like they just didn't want the job.
Having said that, one of my irritants is computer geeks who see a computer and compare it to the cost of parts, calling it a rip off because they can build it themselves - of course the never calculate in their time, cost of support, warranty and other business overheads or a legit version of Windows ;-)
dude... forget wanting to learn board repair from Louis, you should be learning business modeling from these videos... this is worth FAR more than board repair
thanks for your time Louis
"You touched it last, it's your fault" I totally got that as a repair tech. Basically the "after this, therefore because of this" fallacy.
Pretty good perspective, and a lot of what my job was in Alaska dealign with $100 repairs to multimillion dollar projects and service for companies like ARCO, BP and Exxon. About touching something and taking responsibility the whole system.
Often I found it more of a liability to try to provide a service honestly for a lower price, than to essentially overcharge as much as possible for even simple low risk services and then provide essentially No-fault service on the problem cases.
When I did that I tripled profits and the customers were happy, because what was most important to the client companies were concerned most not for the cost but not having to justify why what they bought cost more money later or than planned.
Totally agree. If you touch it - you owne it. Had that with my family last 30 Years so many times since im the only guy around that understands how stuff works and can repair almost anything. I'm responsible for it forever. If i refuse or dont do it right away i'm the bad guy. I'm really done with that kinda shit. Same with friends. They just call me when there's something i can do for them. So - let's face it - i have no friends whatsoever. You know what? I dont care. My stuff also breaks every once in a while but i'm able to repair it if i want to and also i can build me whatever i want (Woodworks, electronics, engines) because i know how to do it or learn first how to. So fuck off with the rest of the world. So nice to see that i'm not the only one.
I can feel your pain :(
Started learning hardware and software when i was around 8, then got into networking and coding, now i am 20y old and im the one of those people whose facebook friends are shrinking instead of growing...
I go trough a lot of computers during 1 year, and since its a friend or relative i cant charge much, or even nothing. 1 month ago my backup hdd broke...i dont have freaking 20E to buy used hdd because of this shit and managed to finally buy it today -_-
A friend values you for who you are, not what you can do for him or her. You are not what you know or do. In friendship, it's about treating others with respect and kindness and receiving it in return. I'm sure there are plenty of people you can be friends with on the basis of common interests, objectives, and mutual respect.
It's not so simple. You may be knowledgeable, because you're an introverted geek. But at the same time, because of this, you're severely lacking in the socializing department. You know they owe you and trust me, they know it too. It's not like they don't know it, but still, very few people like to return their debt and do it voluntarily. So here is what you do. You don't ask for money. You make them return their debt, by telling them upfront they are treating you to a meal in that fancy restaurant you love so much. See? They are not paying you directly. And treating someone to a free meal is no different from treating someone to a free repair. So if they refuse, they will be the assholes and not you, for refusing them. What they do to us, can easily be done to them. Call in their debts right fucking away. A friendly gesture for a friendly gesture. You treat them, they treat you. They key is to not ask for money directly. Money is a universal valuable. Physical items that last for a long time and are resellable, like cars, smartphones, TVs, etc, are also valuables. You don't ask a friend, or a family member for a valuable for your services. Ask for something abstract, which involves socializing. Like hosting a barbecue party, or going to see some IMAX movie (they pick you up and drive you there, they pay for the tickets and they pay for the popcorn). That's how it's done, folks.
"you're an introverted geek" and " fancy restaurant you love so much" or "Ask for something abstract, which involves socializing. Like hosting a barbecue party, or going to see some IMAX movie"? Looks to me that you have very limited knowledge about human psyhology and dont get at all what "introverted" is all about. Introverted people dont like to go out and socialize... So with your advise that introverted geek will be working for free so he can later do things he dont care about or even hates... "See?" How retarded sometimes are advises from internet specialists? My advise is just dont make for free work you dont like or do it for free for people that will never "return their debt" voluntarily or not. You will gonna have more time for things you like and people that are real friends that are worth your time and effort! One good friend is worthed more than dozen of crapy ones.
My experience was similar.
This is the greatest video on tech business I have ever seen. All the points make sense, in particular the "you touched it - you own it", which I did not know was so widespread, as I have noticed a lot myself but thought it was my practice that was to blame. Your videos are an eye opener, thank you very much for making them!
You help me so much with these videos, Man. I just wanted to say thank you for what you do.
+Sylvan81 thank you for your comments
That section where you were talking about value of the experience resonates with me. When I was a lot younger someone made a comment to me about service "You're not paying for what I've just done, your paying for what I know" This is so true.
At the morning fly convention Harold drew the short straw and had the crappy job of being the one who had to distract Louis while the others crapped on his lunch.
R.I.P Harold
I Recently just start watching his videos and I have to say though one thing that so unique about the way he talks he even makes everything feel so personal and he is your sympathize and put himself and others people shoes and it's so heart warming and makes you understand Things outside of your comfort zone keep doing what you doing your the best Louis
That applies to parents and their kids too. I have been blamed for every computer related issue that my father encountered =(
Also, you could sell your anticorrosive pee!
Louis, I left your videos playing after the one I commented on earlier today, and this one came up. You make very good points and listening to this again reminds me that the auto repair industry is absolutely a mix of all of these issues. We have some services that are menu priced, we have some services that require pre-service or pre-repair diagnosis or inspection in order to provide a quote, and we have customers who insist on a service or repair on their own terms, with no diag or inspection beforehand.
Menu priced services are most often maintenance, where we can average out the labor and parts costs across the fleet of vehicles we service. This is the most fair way to handle these services because we already know, going into it, what we are doing.
Diag/inspection based services are most often customer concerns, an issue a customer has with their vehicle that requires us to figure out what is wrong and what will be required to repair it, then the actual parts and labor for the repair. This is the bulk of the work in most shops.
Then, there are the "I know what I'm doing" customers who insist on replacing this or that part with no diag (often because "AutoZone told me"). They set the terms of the transaction and they always feel ripped off when their requested (demanded) repair doesn't fix their problem. If it were up to me (it's not, I don't work on that side of the wall) I would refuse service to these customers, as they're always more of a hassle than they're worth and the proper repair does end up costing them more than it should, by their own insistence and their own doing. This is what happens when we try to treat the 2nd category of services the same way we treat the first.
It's BECAUSE I can fix something easily, that you cannot fix, I can charge what I do for my work. You do not pay me for my time, but for my knowledge - that's what I tell people. That knowledge didn't magically appear in my brain, it comes from years and years of experience in my specific field. That's also why I happily pay an electrician to fix cables in my bathroom floor, because they know how to do that, without me getting electrocuted or house burned down.
Thank you for these videos, Louis Rossmann! Learned a lot from you!
Totally agree on the customer mentality where you touched it, you owned it. Been through a lot of these, but this one is the best so far. Went to install a set of TP-Link Deco M5 as access point to solve customer's home wireless coverage problem.
A week later, he complained about the instability of the Decos and what a ripoff it was. Went there checked. No problem were found. His TV connection keeps disconnect from Internet via WiFi.
3 weeks later the customer called several times and told me that the LAN connection to the living room TV is faulty. The LAN works well for years before I install the Decos. *The TV uses LAN for Internet before the Decos*
Went there again, checked on the LAN, and found out that the LAN connection in the patch panel that route to the TV is wrong to begin with. Took pictures in the current state, fixed it, ask customer to confirm the LAN is working, and confronted the customer on his claims that it worked years before the Decos installation. He just shrugged it off like it's nothing. Didn't charge him for this.
A week later, he complained about the instability of the Decos again. Went to his house, pack up all of the Decos, and refund him in full amount on the Decos. Might not be the best move, but hey, I think these wasted time can be used to resolve someone else problems rather than dealing with him.
That wasn't a fly. It was an Apple spy drone. It was just designed to look like a fly.
And of course, some liquid took care of it :D
haahhaahahahah
lmao
Louis I want to thank you for doing this video. From experiences in several unrelated fields I can say that this is not just a problem in tech but a problem in almost every field.
I realy laught a lot while you tryed to kill the fly
Thank you for this video! You really taught me something just now. "You aren't charging for the 5 minutes you spent doing something, your charging for the YEARS it took to learn and craft your skill". I'm going to stop undercharging, and start charging closer to the industry norm. You are extremely insightful Louis, I watch every video that you come out with (that doesn't deal with complicated board repair), and watch a handfull of the board repair vids. I never feel like my time has been wasted on your channel. Keep up the good work!
Lol, so true. I love when customers tell you how to run a business. If you take their advice you would be out of business.
Louis, I am a huge fan of your videos. I am a manager at one of the most successful private auto repair facilities in the US, and we are in Brooklyn. There are a lot of similarities between our businesses, and I loved your justification for charging flat-rate. Also, the "you touch it, you own it" stuff is so true. In the car biz, we call them "Ever since ya's" meaning "ever since ya did my brakes, my AC doesn't work."
Here in the UK a ripoff would be classed as follows: Say most PC repair shops charge £30 for a new battery but this one shop was charging £70 for the same job, thats a rip off to us. Just not doing the job is something else but thats down to the difference in the US and UK and the language we use to descibe things
Or it could be that they are required to offer the service.but they are pricing themselves away from jobs like that. My dad explained it to me because he's a CPA. The majority of his business are long term clients. He CAN offer individual tax returns but he prices himself too high for individual tax returns so he doesn't have people asking him to do that work.
I love your philosophy, character, demeanor, and knowledge. Your actions make the world a better place! Keep it up, and thank you!
I sorted out someone's PC, and just before I was going to phone them to tell them it was ready the HDD died. I couldn't believe it, and I knew they wanted the PC back soon, so I stuck one of my HDD's in, installed Windows etc... and told them they could borrow that HDD until they can buy a new one, and I also gave them back the HDD that was dead.
Two weeks later I get a phone call telling me I'd ripped them off because the HDD in their machine was only half the size of the one that was in before I had touched it. I was like really, your PC is now working, I gave you back the dead HDD, the HDD that is in your machine now is mine, and I've ripped you off ...
No good deeds...
AS IF THEY FUCKING NEEDED MORE SPACE ANYWAY they don't know about torrents and downloading .ISO's or movies or things to fill it up with. Bullshit.
how much did you charge them for this service of giving them an old hard drive?
Uh yes. You gave them an HDD that has half the space of their original one that died like tf? Doesn't matter if it was yours, you didn't deliver and you didn't even replace it
Diego Alvarez This is a joke right?
These videos speaking half an hour on a Bussines topic are really bringing me joy.
I usually add 20% to my fee for all the extra stuff that come after since there is usually small changes extra copies or questions after. And that I learned the hard way.
Absolutely on point. I can't tell you how many times I've had people basically plead for help...and upon resolution of the problem, have them guffaw with a 'Well that was easy.huh I COULD'VE DONE THAT...' I have learned to reply: 'Fine. I'll just UNFIX IT.' THX
When I was in high school, I did screen repairs, and I remember that I had exactly one phone that I wasn't able to repair (and that I actually made worse). I not only did not charge them, but a few weeks later when I had the money to do so, I paid from my own pocket to replace the part I had messed up and finish fixing their phone. A few years later I had decided to stop doing repairs and when people asked me why I simply stated that I didn't have experience with the touch ID sensors on the newer iPhones and did not feel that I could guarantee that I could do the repair. On the flip side, I had one teacher that kept coming to me for repair after repair (on different devices) and on the last one he actually wrote me a check for over DOUBLE what I had quoted him because he was satisfied with my services. I only bring this up because I really enjoy your business philosophy and appreciate the videos that you're making to help educate people on these more advanced repairs.
I would most definitely love to do an apprenticeship with louis
It's very nice to see that people like you are exists on this planet.
You have a wisdom and possibilities to change this World. Good luck, and Do something great that you want to do)
I didn't know Windex is a real thing in the US.
Windex as a fly killer was not mention in "My big fat greek wedding" . LOL
Rainer Spam ?
Windex kills flies? News to me. Windex is probably more electronic/hardware/human safe than fogging the place out spraying a can of RAID everywhere.
Windex is just glass cleaner, but people use it for a lot of stuff
I am in love with your philosophy of customer service and business
Isn't it also a ripoff if the other person has no clue whatsoever what the service rendered is worth and you overcharge them by factor 10 because they'll agree to it because they don't know any better?
no...
Yes.
I know this was a year ago, but I'ma respond anyway. No, because as far as they're concerned your service was worth that much to them, if it wasn't, they wouldn't have agreed to it. That's the entire premise of this video, why people get charged the same amount for a loose connector as a serious board failure, x has to cover y in order to maintain a profitable business model. Value of service is determined entirely on what people are willing to pay. $.25 for the part, $500 to know where and how to put it on there in 10 seconds. Your average person isn't going to have the skill, equipment, ability on any level to do that repair at all, let alone in the 10 seconds it took the skilled tech to do it.
Curbo 34 I disagree. A contract between two parties is only fair if and only if both parties are well informed. If one side has the monopoly on information and expertise and refuses to disclose it before the contract is made, the contract can in some cases be void.
I totally disagree in this case, if he charged $5,000, people would likely deem it unreasonable and not take his service. There's no monopoly on information here, Louis may have no idea what the problem is, and if he does know the issue, it's because he has researched it. Using the videos on this channel, the customer could research and determine the problem to the same general accuracy as Louis in most cases, and know how to solve it for cheap.
It's simply not worth their time to know the issue or attempt repair, it's much more logical for them to pay the bill and move on, because their time is more valuable then the time it would take to learn to repair it.
If we assume they stand to lose say $2,000 in paid work because they had to learn to fix this, it's more cost effective to pay a tech, that remains true for any charge less then the $2,000 they might lose.
Kind of needed to hear this, man. I have some stuff I’ve been working on for friends and family, work that I do freelance and they haven’t offered to pay me for, that I feel guilty about taking a while to do. Some projects, I’m totally cool with where it’s a back and forth: sometimes they need help, sometimes I need help, and we just sort of call it a wash
i think windex is just getting weaker, used to use it to kill wasps and now they hardly even react
R T use rubbing alcohol water and dish soap in a spray bottle
Thats how it is for mechanics as well. Get an oil change and your transmission goes out 3 weeks later and the guy that changed the motor oil is obviously at fault. lol.
Yeah but there are A LOT of shady mechanics that mess with stuff while they have your car. They especially like to prey on women because they generally know less about automobiles.
This is my daily due
@@xabhax It happened to my mother.
@@xabhax I've seen mechanics charge for repairs they never even performed. Franchises are cancer, and lazy workers exist in all positions.
When I first came across this channel I was not a big fan of Louis. I think it had mostly to do with the fact that I didn't understand where he was coming from. 1 year later, I'm still skimming through his videos. Not necessary for repair tips but for his philosophy on how to run a business and what he considers right and wrong when it comes to his employees and customers. I would be damn lucky if I can find an employer/person that I could work for that would put in half the effort he does. Not a lot of people try to do things the right way these days. It might not mean much coming from a random person on the internet but I honestly have a lot of respect for this man.
My mom is like that I bought another router and connected it through walls and first router had some bugs few mounths later and she thinks it is becouse of that in the end I spent over 8 h to explain it to her and she still tinks the same ting
You see this all the time in the computer field. It's like saying, "I filled my car up at your gas station and two days later had a flat. You need to fix it."
man fuck whoever says you're fucking people. they don't know what we have to go through in the it business. keep up the good work
exactly!
For all I've been through in IT my niece who does art/web design gets it the worst. People get venomous as fuck when you expect them to pay for art because "it's your hobby" despite it being a job they hired you to do
Extremely useful information!!!!
I'm lucky not to have a rate table for everything. I've done a similar type of pricing model. But, I called it "getting out of a job professionally."
What I mean by this is that a part of working with a customer is getting to know the type of customer he'll end up being. I've always joked about turning away doctors, lawyers and school teachers. Doctors are obnoxious, lawyers are never wrong, and school teachers think they know more than I do. I can easily say, "Hey, I don't want to do business with you!" and they'll think I'm a complete asshole and they'll start spreading the word. What I could also do is overcharge him a much higher rate. This may sound unethical, but it does two thing: 1. if they say it is too high of a rate, they turned ME down, and not the other way. And 2. If they actually accept the terms, then, as I look at it, that extra money is making up for the stress this customer will put me though.
One other thing I wanted to comment on, and that is the attitude people have over IT service. I have many ideas why this is, but nothing I can do about. People think that IT technicians are the lowest forms of workers. One time, I gave my hourly rate to a potential customer. He choked at it and said he pays his lawyer that amount. I already lost this customer, so I told him that an IT technician and a lawyer provide a similar service. A lawyer keeps your ass out of jail. An IT technician like me keep you in business! I think staying out of jail and staying in business are two similar things. Therefore, that's why I charge a lawyer-like hourly fee.
Why do these people think IT technicians are at the bottom of the food chain? When they're quoted a rate by their doctor, they don't negotiate the fee. They don't negotiate the fee with the lawyer. They don't negotiate the rate with plumbers while their bathroom continues to flood, or the electrician when you're sitting in the dark and missing the Super Bowl. So why do people try to wheel and deal with IT technicians???? I never understood this, other than the possibility that they think the guy at Best Buy earning a minimum wage plus spiffs knows just as much as Louis or myself.
Sorry for the rant!!!!
This is really good general rule of any job. That is added value, to keep those returning customers happy. Other customers are really happy that you thought 2 or 3 steps ahead of customer's issue. It is not easy(mentally keep that higher level of thinking going), but adds value.
I'm a pretty tech savvy person. But I know the insides of alot of laptops can be hell. So I'm always a little anxious about taking one apart.
So I had this laptop that would not turn on anymore. I was 90% I knew exactly what was wrong.(power buttons conection to board had been pulled up as it was attached to the hinge) told them this.
They charged me $25+ to just look at it. Get a call saying it would cost more then it's worth to replace the laptop as it's the motherboard that's dead.
So I went in and picked it up. Went stright home opened it up and fixed it in 10 mins with just a droplet of soder.
It the 10 mins were mostly from taking apart and putting back together.
Called them up and demanded a refund sence they were unable to solve even an easy issue when it was directly pointed out.
You're the man. Spent several years charging this one customer 60 euros to replace damaged components in POS computers.. same fee regardless of the problem.. 6 months warranty on the repaired circuit. The guy said I was ripping him off and tried to replace the components himself for common problems he learned how to fix from me.. a few weeks after he came back with a few boards he completelly fucked up by overheating every single component.. He never complained about the price again. funny part.. I've found later he was charging his own customers 400+ for the repair service he was getting from me.
This reminds me of a time I talked to a return customer. First time I did work for him, it involved an OS reinstall and a logic board inspection. He came back a couple months later and asked me if I could replace one of the touch switches on his AIO machine. I told him what it would entail and said it would be cheaper for him to get a new unit instead of paying me for the labour to do it and to hunt down the parts. It was a seven year old machine.
*_THEY'RE EVOLVING!_*
Thanks. I needed to listen to this when it comes to price your services!
I want a video where it's just louis killing flies now.
I troubleshoot and fix things for a living and what you say is true about people blaming the last person to touch it. When inspecting a piece of equipment, I generally go above and beyond what's expected because I'll have been the last person to touch it before production starts.
Most people are terrible at understanding a system with more than a few mechanical linkages, even worse is their understanding of the electronics and controls that dictate its operation. I'll often hear that so and so was out here earlier doing x, in a manner so as to blame, even if the only thing in common with the assembly currently causing an issue and the thing that was touched earlier is that they share the some enclosure.
On the flip side, a problem is caused all too often by someone touching something they shouldn't.
I see diagnostic fee and paying for the time (to adequate extents) as the most natural business model. In this case people would have to find the best service they can find so that they know that if this guy took away their $50 and didn't fix it, then it's probably unfixable, so $50 is a good price to at leats know that, you didn't pay for nothing. But paying for time that was spent on a complete stranger is a thing that I would never find pleasant. The only reason for the latter model is either to promote a business (because people will be willing to give their stuff to someone who says you can get it back for free if I don't solve your issues), or to adapt to some strange population of ignorant people who never think in advance and just run away from places where diagnostics is not free.
Anyway, pretty educating video.
I love your channel. You teach so much valuable information, not just about computers but about things such as life lessons and personal experiences in the real world. You have taught me a lot about computers and real world life lessons, thank you.
I finally figured out what interesting about these Louis Rossmann videos. . it's like listening to a combination of Adam Carolla (stories) and Dave Ramsey (business, relationship advice).
Good video. One story comes to mind. A guy worked @ the same company as my dad. He was a tech of some kind. And people not seeing the big picture, was sometimes asking him questions how he managed to go around just doing nothing (the reality of those kinda positions is a lot of freedom when it comes to hours, but it comes with a responsibility to drop everything day or night to solve a critical problem when it comes up). He used to answer "I'm not here because of what I do, but because of what I know" - and that is an awesome answer. It's so true. Your knowledge is many times worth more than what you are doing just right there and then :).
I must be lucky, I have used computers for 18 odd years and never had a hardware failure lol. Built 2 of my own easily, still no failure. I buy a ex corporate B- grade x230 and it turns up without a bump on it. The thing that always fails are lcd TV's, toasters, kettles and freeview recorders.
Shock Wave not even a HDD or power supply? I've even had memory slots just up and fail on me lol
Those older IBMs are lifetime machines with awesome keyboards
Super video. This helped me. I repair vintage watches and this makes sense!! No one appreciates labor!!
atleast it's an easy way of spotting a birdbrain
Man, ive been an automotive mecanic for 14 years.....i wish the bosses ive had over the years had your mindset. Might have made the works experiance all that better.
Another great video from Louis. I'm afraid that fly ain't fucked up - but he's the cleanest, shiniest fly 'round and doing very well with the ladies thank you very much.
Ink cartridges are rip off!
You have ethics... many do not. I appreciate that you do. Charging what you're worth is important, being nice (cheaper) seems like a good plan, but you won't be there the next time that customer needs you.
It is so true about you say about customers to repairers. I give free what might be wrong, but tell them worst case. And also tell get a second opinion. And true you can not charge for experience, but give a reasonable price for the job.also you do own what you work on .
This is good advice, this has happened to me doing electrical service. I fixed a 120 volt outlet on one side of a store and the manager called saying that me changing that outlet screwed up their 208 volt refrigerator on the other side of the store 😂 a bit of an extreme example but it does make me consider charging more in my side gigs, because I do honor the "you touch it you own it" kind of situations. I'd rather make a trip out for no charge and have happy customers/future work than to have to charge for every little thing.