Traditional Internal Panel Door Construction
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- Опубліковано 9 лис 2020
- Have a watch of me building this traditional internal panel door using traditional construction methods. Wedged mortice and tenon construction with grooved in panels.
The timber used is tulip wood, AKA Poplar. The panels are made from 18mm Hardwood plywood.
The in depth explanation video to follow this one is here - • Timber Panel Door - A ...
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#Joinery #Woodworking - Навчання та стиль
A perfect door with the perfect tools and perfect techniques. 100% satisfaction and 100% reliable. Made for a life time.
I love traditional workmanship. Thanks for showing
Thankyou Gee!
this whole time I'm watching like: "OK cool I can do that, I have a router, I'm a carpenter" then you pull out the tools for the tenons etc im like: "ok ok i can buy that, not to bad ok thats cool" then you whip out the saw at 7:45 and I completely gave up 😂😂🤣😭😭 NICE WORK BROTHER 🔥🔥🔥✊✊✊
There are many ways to skin a cat!! Im sure there are other methods you could use to do any of the processes. The videos generally are filmed to help with the theory and process of doing it properly. Thanks for the kind words though
The tools he's using are commercial tools just to make the process faster. You can build the same door equally as good with just a hammer, hand saw, hand planer and a couple of chisels... Also you need a pen and tape measure!
Finally a vid that shows how to make the doors correctly
Your wide array of tools is just amazing.
Thankyou! Taken many years and sacrifice to get here!
I have to repair a few doors shortly so it was perfect timing to see a quick run through of how doors go together in the first place. It gives me a good idea of how to get the graving pieces into an existing door, thanks
Nice one, good luck with the repairs
Thanks Ollie, great work. Always looking forward to the next one. Thank you.
Cheers Timothy! Longer version of this to follow!
Nice proportions and very well executed.
Thankyou buddy!
First of yours I’ve seen. Nice work, and the answers to questions are informative. Thanks!
0Cheers Mike, trying my best to help people out tbh! :)
Great to see lovely workmanship.great job sir. 👍👍
Thanks Steven!! :D
Excellent
Lovely work as always. I'm always impressed with how perfectly flat your joints are after glue up. You must take a lot of trouble lining up morticed and tenoner to get them this good. Thanks Ollie. I always look forward to your videos.
Cheers Ian, its pretty simple with this setup, make sure the tenon thickness off the tenoner is the same as the chisel thisness and then just use a tenoned piece to set the morticer up.... dead easy! Really suprised by the reaction to recent videos! thanks for your support Ian
If you dont set the machines properly the panel grooves will not line up,your mortices or tenons will need to be relieved and your sanding of the surfaces will lead to your product being undersize,thickness wise.Basic stuff.
Great work as usual Oliver
Nice one Pete!!! :D
Very nice!
Thank you! Cheers!
PERFECT!!👌
Cheers for that!
Another cool vid. 🤙
Thanks Matey!! :D:D
Thats a nice door
Many thanks Mr Cherry!
Nice door, looking forward to your how to build next
Thanks, Coming soon! :)
Nice video !!
Thanks! Appreciate it Rick
Great vid this style of vid is great short fast but still has plenty of info
Cheers Dan, i think we are going to do a fast and slow version of projects like this. The purpose of the channel was to actually teach people joinery techniques.... these quick videos are great to watch but hopefully explaining the nitty gritty of small problems youll encounter if you actually try to make it will be invaluable.
Nice job👍🏿
Thankyou!
Welcome home, Oliver! Good to see you at it once more. Trust you are keeping well,for me-back in self-isolation during this lockdown.At last-after getting day wrong (by just one in Sept) met my cardio guy last week,had just enough time for him to tell me I will get my pacemaker in 4-6 weeks! Talk about knock me over!! In/out same day too and a month taking life easy.....can do -no prob!
Heres the cheeky part.....do you get enough work in to possibly move to your part of the world and get a start,WAGE free as my pensions should cover rent on a one bed G/F flat??? Guess am a tad rusty but its like riding a bike.....ooooh och.. No rush to answer,just say yes!
Hey Larry, great news on the Pacemaker. you'll be good to go then! You don't need to move to get work matey, always something about! I get a few offers here and there from the videos, but im kinda busy doing my own thing at the minute! maybe one day ill look into working with someone!
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w0w nice work
Thank you so much 😀
Awesome! Thanks for sharing although you have tools most don't have.
Cheers John! Yeah but the videos main purpose is to help you if you do have said machinery and dint know the full use of it
Amazing work and amazing tools, I had never seen a router that can do both sides at once. That looks so useful. I supposed it was a request but painting such beautiful wood should be a crime, I think.
Thankyou buddy, this is quite a commonly painted timber and is often specified for painted jobs. The double sided router is called a tenoning machine (or tenoner) "ten-non-er"
Thanks for watching buddy!
Wow! Could I borrow your machinery once you finish your door! Wow! Magnificent craftsmanship. Thank you.
Haha Thanks Dennis! The Videos are aimed more at helping people who have or want the machinery but may not have been trained in their use properly!
Beautiful work, love the traditional joinery... question, do you round the outer corners of the door or do you leave them true 90? I tend to use a 1/8 round over but was not sure what your process was to ease the edges.
Upon final fitting i would use a sanding block to remove sharp edge with 120g paper, then the paint process with denibbing will create a nice arris. I'd liken it to a 1mm roundover (which you can buy) I use a 3mm roundover on external joinery to satisfy paint warranty terms. Its quite big though!
I love accoya, so expensive in Oz but.
Lovely work as always Oliver👍🏻
On an aside, any idea where I could get an additional scriber head for my tenon machine, it’s on a 30 mm spindle, about 200 diameter from cutter tips. Looking for a quick change over from spay mould (sunken chamfer) to Ovolo.👍🏻
Looks more like popular to me
Thanks Old school Carpentry! Interested to know the m3 price in Aus! We pay around £2600 including taxes. As Jez has commented, this door is made from Poplar (tulipwood)
@@BradshawJoinery wow what section size is that ?!? That’s outrageous a bit over $4700 a cube!
I got it once and it was around $3500 m3 for 150x50 (£1920)
I’ve been using WRC, but you use every mm of accoya!
Yeah I realised it wasn’t when I seen the still picture and you can see the colour, but when you’re putting it through the spindle it looked a lot lighter in that light, I couldn’t be arsed changing comment 😂
@@BradshawJoinery Just milled some poplar (in NZ) and it looks magnificent. Sadly, I'll have to wait a couple of years before I get to use it! Cheers, David
Good to see another video from you - what grit do you use when sanding the panels after they are primed ? , I always find when I use the sander that I sand through around the edges - I’ve only started spraying my own joinery so technique needs improving . Was it MR Mdf you used for panels ? - it comes up so nicely when sprayed😆 no grain or pores to worry about . Keep them coming 👍
320g, got to be dead quick near the edges and double quick on corners as your covering it twice. If I'm going for a flat finish I'll sand through the first coat to fill grain/sanding scratches where necessary. Decent 320g should cut anything back without leaving visible sanding marks. Will clog up of not dry though. I'm using a Chinese ply in this one, I did a really thick primer coat to get rid of the grain. 👍 Don't dry it too quick if it's really thick. Can form a film and crack
Turn sander speed down. I use the slowest setting I can without it grabbing too much
Nice work, as always. I've made a few doors and am please to see I'm broadly doing it the same way, albeit my plug in toys are rather lower down the investment scale. I'd like to hear a bit more about the spraying setup, methods, timings, drying and clean up. Most other places show and magical finish like yours (eg vitten) but I find so much time is given to setup, drying one side, then the other, denibbing and repeat, and then cleaning the sprayer. I've both a Graco Airless and EARLEX HV5000 and the cleanup time seems to delete any spraying advantage. I'd be interested in your appraisal for such one off manufacture of items in your detailed vid. Thank you.
Hi Andrew, i did a video on the airless sprayer, have you watched that? I tend to leave it setup and seal the paint with clingfilm. can be left a week as long as you stir before use... On this job i sprayed the panels then glued door up and sprayed door next day. i used a topcoat the following day so just flushed the primer and ran the topcoat, not really much cleanup, maybe 15mins. id never pain one coat by hand in 15 mins, letalone get a real thick coverage on the panels and door.... its very efficient. Like you when i started, i sprayed something and cleaned up straight away making sure it was pristine... half an hour each coat, was soul destroying. Ill perhaps do an updated video on processes rather than info about pump/setup.
@@BradshawJoinery I've not seen that. I'll check it out tonight. Thank you :)
Such an amazing job of joinery. I can't believe you went to all that work and then painted over it. Oh wait, I just saw the in depth video, apparently it was for a client and you had to match other doors. Still...
Thank you so much! Yeah paint is good too. But i understand what you are saying!!
Same here. All the incredible work is hidden under paint. I am working on scraping my white painted doors, and found a beautiful wood sleeping there for 50 years.
That's a nice and very sturdy looking door. Would you consider making a door with loose tenons? Thanks for the vid. Cheers, David
Loose tenons as in dominos? I do use them on smaller doors and would be fine on something like this but not as good, or traditional, so your moving away from the reason its a quality piece and the justification of charging for proper joinery.
. I wouldnt trust it on an external door.
@@BradshawJoinery haha, yes dominos. Thanks for your reply. Recently, I've seen Manor Wood making his own 'wide' dominos (specifically for doors)
Another great vid. Love the proportion of the doors design. With an internal door would you ever consider using dominos? Just finished my first window frame after looking at your previous casement window vids which were invaluable. Hope to see you do a video on a staircase in the future. Keep up the great work!
I replied to similar earlier, dominoes would be fine, the bigger ones, but your losing the traditional joinery aspect, and the "proper" heritage of the trade, Its not quite the same, your just achieving the same look.
Bloody brilliant to hear on the window! Did it turn out ok? Ive just turned down a staircase job, its not really my bag. But you never know!
@@BradshawJoinery Suprisingly well, just another 4 to make! The level of detail you give is great, it certainly helps to cut out a lot of mistakes, like the butt hinge and capillary groove, you would just not pick this up until you would have made it. Again many thanks.
That's really awesome.to hear Lee! Thanks for the feedback.
Very nice. I have made a couple of interior doors and they have all ended up slightly twisted, no matter how carefully I plane the pieces and cut the joinery. I've always been tempted to blame the wood not being dry (well it can't be me, can it!). Do you dry your timber in your workshop before you use it?
Thankyou, There are many factors to create a twist in a door. it could be a twist in a joint not necessarily the timber, however it is 9 times out of 10 a problem with a piece of timber in the door. they can sometimes move after planing flat . Using well setup machinery will help keep the joints problem free. a dry assembly with the joints tight should show if you have a problem before glue up which may be able to be addressed. i have tweaked the mortice and tenons on a twisted stile before to allow it to glue a flat door and just have the twist along the stile timber. make sure the stools your glueing on are set flat also, and the door is rested flat always. Offset shoulders being clamped too hard will also twist a door, you can run a shaving of wood from a hand plane in shoulders if there are gaps when it sits flat.
It's a poor workman who can't blame his tools! I am due to make another couple soonish so I'll take you advice on board and see what I can do. Thank you.
What thickness material did you use for panels and what material
Sweet! What glue do you use? Would it be good for an exterior door?
PU Glue, and yes, probably the best, great propertiesfor external use, flexible and strong!
Great job. Love the joinery. I had a question about the paint or primer you sprayed what exactly are you spraying
Cheers Jason, This one is a sherwin williams Waterbourne primer, im not sure of the exact product code, but i bought it to try a while back and didnt particularly like it, so it gets used on jobs like this that are to be onsite finished/supplied in primer. Ideally it needs a smaller tip size than the 11 thou im using as it leaves tails from the gun, it doesntsand back particularly nice which is mainly why i dont like it. Solid primer once youve sanded it back though!!!
@@BradshawJoinery thank you very much. Keep up the awesome work and keeping this amazing skill set alive
Really nice work 👍 what’s the reason for stepping the tenons?
Thanks chris, it's so the wedges can work agains material left in the door stile. The haunch helps to strengthen the joint by preventing twist and more glue surface area
Beautiful door. I'm in the midst of building two doors right now.
1. How long does it take you from rough stock to finished door?
2. How thick are the wedges?
3. What do you do about any gaps or high spots around the mortise and tenon joints?
2. Wedges are as thick as the notice cut.
3. A good set up on the mortice and tenons. You wont have any highspots
Hey Alex, Thankyou very much, I could make that door in a single day if i really had no interruptions or problems, Realistically its more like 1.5 to 2 days labor. Wedges are around 12mmx16mm at the thick end and 2mm x 16mm at the thin.
Not really sure on the gaps and high spots, when machined in this fashion it should be pretty flat across both! maybe explain what you mean in a little more detail and ill try my best to explain! :)
TienebuemaTecnicaFelicidades
Thankyou José
Very interesting video, the machine to make tenons is pretty amazing. Couple of questions: Why do the sides of the frame end up longer than needed then get cut down? And why does the large cross pieces of the frame have 2 small tenons instead of just leaving 1 large one? Also what is that square punch/chiseling machine? I've never seen anything like it
Thankyou Alex! Tenoner is th emachine,
The Long stile extensions are called horns. It makes working easier when handling and clamping, you can get a clamp either side of the wedged tenon with room to actually strike the wedges. It also protects the delicate corners, which are only exposed when you cut them off, So if you drop a stile while handling it, it doesnt land on the joint corner, like it would if cut to exact length. There are many reasons but theses are just a few. Why cut it off until you have to basically!
2 tenons, basically tenon should be max 5x long as thickness, so a 10mm tenon should only be 50mm, or it compresses too much and becomes ineffective.
@@BradshawJoinery wow great explanations, thank you 😁👍
Beautiful. Hey what kind of glue was that? I assume you used it because it had a nice long open time for that complex glue up?
Thank Brian, its actually an incredibly fast setting glue and i nearly didnt get the door assembled. haha Its PU glue in a tube for use in a srealant gun. Very Very good.
Awesome stuff. What is the tool used to cut those long tenons?
Cheers Elliot, Its a Tenoner This one is a sedgwick model
Great watch. One question, where’s the dominoes🤷♂️🤣
Ahh Bugger i forgot them
What is the music for, you would let machines roar?
Work taken to the next level. 👏👏👏👏👏 2:20 which machine is that. What we call it?
Thanks matey. It's a morticing machine. Some call it a mortiser /morticer. This one is a Sedgwick
I guess we're all taught differently but I was always taught 2/3 tenon, 1/3 haunch? Yours looked half and half?
Ive seen a lot of that method, probably more suited to modern adhesives, but if you look at an old door with them proportions, the ends of the stile where the wedge works agains is always cracked as there isnt enough material there to support the joint, so i like to have a bit more timber left on the stile, then a big haunch to bulk up the glue surface area
Many fundamental errors in this manufacture. The joint ratios were awry, sanding and wedging not ideal too.
Hi John, I'd be interested to hear your reccomended ratios. I've studied alot of old doors and wider tenons don't do as well as smaller when the stilenis left with too small amount of material to support the wedge.
I'm happy to explain any of the process if you say what the concerns are 👍
@@BradshawJoinery The haunch should be 25% (1/4) of the tenon width. For example, on a door the bottom rail being 8” (200 mm) a 2” haunch with the rest being 6” (150 mm). The centre - the middle - is 2” (50 mm). If you are grooving in panels (flat, raised, raised and fielded for example) let the middle of the tenon in to the bottom of the groove or about 2” (50 mm). I would use these ratios, designs on external doors with 3 3/4” (95 mm) stiles or even 4 3/4” (120 mm) stiles. On the top rail, use the same ratios. Obviously using haunched mortice and tenons. Wedge only after squaring up, but check the wedges - door being square- constantly whilst driving in. Or use fox wedging if the door is in a location where it is open to the elements. Generally, I use fluted dowels on traditional doors, fitted inside the door face. On standard stock doors, I use 1/4” (6 mm) dowels; on heavier stock doors, I use 5/16” (8 mm) dowels. All dowel sizes approximate depending on your suppliers - or make them. Take care.
Hi Oliver
Another masterclass!
Interested that you have used Accoya for an internal (painted) door - I think this is the way to go, Accoya is so much more stable than say red deal and the yield is so good it partly offsets the (stupid) extra costs. Have you done a full cost comparison of Accoya vs ordinary softwood?
You wouldn’t want to record one of my glue-ups, not with the sound on anyway - mind you, you were cranking on those cramps!
Cheers
This one's poplar not accoya but it looks similar!
The cost on internal is fairly big difference but external joinery compared to hardwood is very economical.usong accoya!
Funny you should mention the glue up. I had a massive problem with this one, I ran out of slow runny glue so used PU glue... Like I would with accoya, only it set a lot quicker with the tulipwood.... it's a push for time with accoya but this was ridiculous! was dry nearly before I started putting together... Was a make or break moment but enough clamps I just managed to get it together! Was very relieved!
I can see it’s tulipwood now - got a greenish tinge - it was just that I have seen you use so much Accoya and then seeing the PU glue (which you have explained). Thank you
Oh, and “clamps” is very ‘Merrican - “cramps” is what I was taught by my Dad!
I nearly called it a day on the glue up, it was getting hopeless on the first stile, but thankfully I carried on as the second stile seemed to slip on a little easier than the first!
@@scholarscholar9388 yeah I thought the same, lightning makes it look like accoya.
I’m jealous of the panel saw and bandsaw, but you would love my frame press! All press button stuff 😂
Can’t do photos here but it’s a
superexpo.com/en/exhibitor/5070/mm-maszyny-do-drewna-sp-z-o-o/product/784/prasa-hydrauliczna-veili-model-mh2330
What brand of clamps do you have?
They are T bar clamps from record. 54"
Your work is top class 👍 but what kind of machine is that 0:35 ?
Thankyoui, hat is a Wadkin CC crosscut saw
Subscribed. Nice work. What's first song?
THanks, ua-cam.com/video/8qH43BbshSo/v-deo.html
6:04 What kind of glue are you using?
That one is Sovereign Chemicals PU Rapid. ok for accoya, just about enough time to get it together, no chance on timbers with higher moisture content!
@@BradshawJoinery Thanks.
What are the powertools called
Which ones? gimme a time and ill say
Is this going in an old building? 2m high is very low for a door here.
Its an old house but a new lining. standard door height is 1981mm which is 6'6". where do you live???
@@BradshawJoinery The Netherlands. We're the tallest people on earth, and afaik code is 230cm for new construction since at least 2003
That's amazing! Like I say all doors are 6' 6" here. You can get and also common to have 6' 9" but nothing like 2.3m!
how long do people work in that environment, on average, before they lose a hand or part of their hand in an electric saw going at 2000rpm?
Its relatively common to hear a story of someone local to have had an accident.
Cool . Let's see you do a door that nice with human tools.
What you caling human tools? Hand planes and chisels?
how many price this macine
which machine?
What type tenoning machine do you have please?
It's a Sedgwick TESH 👍
@@BradshawJoinery Am I correct in thinking that you can install profile knives, as needed, for coping rails?
Yes the top and bottom heads are combi heads, so have carbide knives and space for 2x hss profile cutters if you wish, top and bottom
@@BradshawJoinery Ok great I thought so.
@@BradshawJoinery I'm in the US, can you give me an idea of what you figure your hourly labor rate at for doing custom work, if you don''t mind.
Can’t find any doors that will fit my old house. Entrée doors or interior doors z. None
Going to have to get some made Garry!
i want work for you and any county i am frofesonal wood workar
Thanks Sagor! :)
Seems a waste to hide all that great work with paint!
So, $50,000 worth of equipment to build $150 doors. I need to save more money!
Haha You would do well to buy such a door for 150 i tell the!
all that work just for it to be painted. damn shame.
Haha, yes and no, i do like painted traditional woodwork. natural wood finish can be a bit much sometimes!
all you need to make this traditional door is....a workshop full of specialized woodworking machines....
nice work (altho it seems like a waste of effort for a paint grade door) but i dont really see the point in showing this, most people watching / wanting to learn wont have most of the machines your using.
Not really. i have given processes in the past for making tenons using a table saw, and the grooves could be done with a router. Mortices are little more tricky but not impossible by hand. Its an educational video, relevant for thousands i think. EG...Maybe you are a experienced carpenter wanting to further knowledge, or a tradie that didnt get a formal qualification looking for proper techniques, or just interested in how traditional proper joinery is made. I see even experienced joiners making mistakes on doors like this so there is always something to take from this. The long version where i talk through in detail i'm soon to publish probably isn't for everyone and might suit your comment more, but if you did want to make that door, how would you go about finding out how to do it? Id say this is a Good resource!
The most pointless video I have ever seen. Benny Hill making a door with out any commentary on the stages used and the reasoning behind them.
lol thanks Neil, most of my videos i try and do a quick run through version to see how its made then a longer version with all the grubby detail. not everyone wants to sit through a 1.5 hour long video to see how 1 door is made. Ive not done it with all the videos, but more the recent ones.