Oh yeah, any damage resistance buffs would be so effective! Even debuffing items to reduce the enemy's melee attack, anything to help survivability. Warrior Priests/Arch Lectors would be so good for this role since they have that bombardment ability too
I love gunpowder units but recently I've been wondering what is the best place to put my cannons to use grapeshot without absolutely obliterating my own frontline and not leaving it extremely exposed lol.
Setting them up in a kill box would probably work really well, you could use them as direct line of site gunpowder units, just leave the kill zone opening a little wider
There are many solutions, but one is to have some melee infantry right behind your cannon and charge forward when the enemy is about to make contact. Your cannon should stop firing at that point, but hopefully it will have softened the enemy frontline enough. If you want your cannon to keep firing, you could try to intercept whatever is charging at you from the side, but it can be hard to pull off, specially if the enemy has a cohesive frontline, and a human opponent could try to disengage and continue charging towards your cannons. That's why having a unit right behind your cannons can always be useful, just in case.
Yeah it took a couple of tries and making some little adjustments (like adding the second row of infantry at the front and the long range missiles at the back) but then everything just all clicked and I was quite happy with it
my fav gunpowder strat is a chevron formation setup similar to your killbox strat. but its artillery, cannons or organ guns usually setup exposed in the centre. it allows them to fire right down the flank of the enemy balling up around the tips of your chevrons which i make quite angular so the enemy balls up around them more
The Gunpowder Wedge looks beautiful! Makes me want to try it out myself with the Chaos Dwarfs first and foremost, then other factions. Saw this video by accident, but will have a look at your other videos to get some inspirations on formations :)
Man a Chaos Dwarf Gunpowder Wedge would be absolutely brutal! You could replace all the melee infantry with Fireglaive Infernal Guard and pump out sooo much firepower! Cheers bro I appreciate it!
when i played dwarfs recently i kinda made a mix of the road block and wedge. 4 line infantry to hold the line with 3 high damage output units looking through the gabs between the units(used iron drakes for dwarfs), 2-3 rifle units behind this for focused fire on large and mostly single entities with 2-3 artillerty behind that shooting long range and focus high threat units with 1 line infantry on each side of the rifle and artilery grouping to cover the flanks, and 2 skirmish/flanking units(used gyrocopters/bombers). the characters(exept engineer) was placed ahead for road blocking
I have been practicing a lot with the Dwarfs lately. One of my favorite battles recently was attacking the Sister's tree with Grombrindal. They had 3 armies in there and I had just one. I set up 2 squads of sort of a checkerboard cross of 4 units, with Ironbreakers in front center, Grudgerakers on the sides and Torpedo Irondrakes in the rear center. I had the 2 groups set up one of the forward to the right and the other further back to the left. I had Grombrindal and my Runesmith with those groups to support as well. I had my 2 Grudgesettler Irondrakes in reserve to come in when needed. That group was attacking the left entrace to the grove. On the right side I setup my 2 Flame Cannons, Engineer, Thane, and another Ironbreaker unit. The Flamecannons just fired over a short wall of trees and the Ironbreakers and Thane were there for protection but did not end up being needed. Ended up getting nearly 4000 kills and losing less than 10 Dwarfs. Dirty Knife Ears didn't stand a chance. The 2 squads worked really well moving up while the other squad covered them. I had 2 Brimstone Gyrocopters but they were not safe to be used as the enemy had so many archers. This army was all about fire 🔥.
I've found that very tight formations like your last one tend to be vulnerable to fast moving SEMs (particularly flying ones). It's not a big deal if there's only 1 or 2 of them, but the AI tends to have more of them toward the late game, and they can quickly and easily fly in and disrupt the entire formation by tying up multiple ranged units when charging through them. This then leaves the front line unsupported, and your ranged units in the middle have no space to maneuver away from the SEMs in their midst. It's also vulnerable to enemy artillery fire, since iirc Dwarf artillery has no range advantage over most other races, and is in fact outranged by both Empire and Cathay, while being roughly on par with Skaven and slightly ahead of Greenskin artillery. Having the dwarf cannons at the rear means enemy artillery can hit your front line and you will not be able to return fire, unless you have fast movers like gyrobombers to take them out, but that is difficult if the enemy has ranged units near their artillery. Not saying it's a bad idea though, but definitely situational.
Absolutely, it has it's set of weaknesses that will have to be taken into account. With the update I am loving how Gryocopters and Bombers are now, they would really add some much needed flexibility to an army like this. Also boo on the AI and all their flying monkeys haha we're just trying to have a good time here but they do a good job at spoiling our fun. It'll be messy and chaotic but some Giant Slayers should hopefully help deal with any fliers bypassing the lines. Cheers bro!
Thanks for watching bud glad it could be helpful for you! And yeah it still amazes me the depth to this game with how you can get all the different units to interact with each other. Cheers bro!
Love this series since it began! I've modified your older tercio formation adding in the Hochland long rifles and Nuln Ironsides and the results were pretty epic.
That is so awesome thank you bro for your support! And dude I've been so excited to try out the new units with the Tercio glad to hear that they're so effective! Did you have them as one big formation or multiple smaller ones?
I used the larger square formation with the two halberds per side. An engineer with the trait that increases range of all missile units. Fought a battle against Kemmler, he came at me with almost 7000 against my 1400, it was an epic stand, my mortars ran dry from firing. My Reiksguard knights held off an entire flank so my gunners could reposition. There were over 7000 casualties in the battle and it broke Kemmler's power in Bretonnia. 10/10 would recommend the tercio.
Through your adive and my own trial and error I've come from hating and never using gunpowder units to primarily fielding them with great results (on highest difficulty)! :D
Yooo that’s awesome! Glad I could be of service haha I guess that’s the thing with Gunpowder they can be finicky and just not work, but with the proper set up they can be so epic
Skaven and Vampire Coast armies are great for these tactics as they have built-in chaff units you can use to bait the enemy forces. They also have enough firepower to really bring the hurt if the enemy is willing to sit stiff for a few seconds.
Using allied units would be a huge help here. For instance, kislev riflemen behind thunderers would allow both of them to shoot at an oncoming enemy since kislev are tall and dwarfs short.
I like a roadblock formation with my artillery far off to my left or right flank depending on terrain. I keep a cavalry formation that can intercept any that head towards my artillery. As battle progresses I move my main army forward within gun range. The artillery causes some units to aggro towards them. This exposes flanks to my gun powder units. Cavalry can intercept any that get too close. Flying units the only issue with this formation so if enemy army has some fliers I usually leave a unit of spears or swordsman behind my artillery. Been working great so far.
That’s quite cunning, using your artillery as a lure so your infantry can get get some good shots off! And like if they ignore your artillery they’re gonna get absolutely demolished. I love it haha
I’ve seen this unit combo of Ice guard and Strelsi for kisliv in a tournament. The unit combo, worked wonderful VS the other players. For example dwarves.
Man I feel Dwarfs would be punished especially hard with the speed debuffs, they must have been barely moving at all! I really love the synergy within Kislev's roster, it's just good fun
Have you heard of the barcode formation? The idea is while gunners can't shoot through other units but can shoot through their own so you take your units and only give them the narrow area to deploy, making them form into columns 2-3 figures wide. Lets you concentrate massive firepower in one narrow direction
I'm very famliar with the road block strat. Helps out so much for my skaven runs. Trying out the dwarfs again and its goin very well now. But his vid has helped to clarify where my early formations went wrong. I got Thorgrim up to 6 Thanes now all with tankards and they just get stuck in. Gyrocoptors which I was never a fan of in the past are great now. And in quite the turn around have replaced my go to thunderers in some cases.
Ooo 6 Tankard Thanes dang nothings gonna get through those haha and yeah Gyrocopters are sooo much better I hated using them, now they're almost an auto-include
I use a version of killbox with Kislev, where it's two shallow "niches" filled with Streltsi, staggered so one in a bit in front of the other, and surrounded by a wall of armored kossars. Instead of aiming straight, the Streltsi aim diagonally, so that right flank streltsi cover left flank kossars, and left flank streltsi cover right flink kossars. kossars with spears cover the back so they can shoot their bows, and if cav comes calling they go melee stance with spears. I suppose one could use the "kislev warriors" for that too, but I can't even look at them. I have 2 units of heavy cav at the ready, and horse archers or light sleds lead the enemy into the niches. Once the enemy is close, use a hag with and an ice witch to stack slow spells to pretty much get the enemy army stuck in firing range or armored kossars and streltsy crossfirre. from up close, streltsi bullets just go through enemy line instead of hitting the "one dude on the right" as missiles usually do, causing an absolute massacre. Meanwhile, winged hussars counter enemy cav, and hunt down stragglers. If the enemy ranged gets away from the infantry I use my skirmishers to melee them. Once the line is joined, my hussars immediately go for side charges, usually ending the battle in one or two cycles. Very effective tactics, the two shallow niches instead of one big one like you did splits enemy army in two once the lines are joined, so your missile units aren't so vulnerable.. Also, Kislev.
You have seriously helped me take my Empire Games to a whole new level, I was a Skaven main until recently so the idea of complex formations to allow unobstructed firing mid-combat was kinda a non-idea... I had right at the end of my Skavenship stumbled upon a poorly optimised checkerboard pattern where I'd use Ratling-Gunners and Storm Vermin side by side and skaven slaves as a roadblock to gun down along with whatever they were attacking but that was as far as it had gone.
Bro that's awesome to hear! I'm so glad that this has been so helpful for you! I still gotta laugh at how Skaven do things though, gunning down hundreds of their own is just another day for them haha cheers bud!
My favourite roadblock is using skaven armies, A combination of packmasters on brood horrors (fear and regen with wolfrat summons) supported by weapons teams. Works a treat 👌
Those Packmasters are way tougher than I gave them credit for haha I need to do more with Skaven, I absolutely hate fighting them in campaign so it’ll be nice to flip things around haha
Watching your series on gunpowder tactics has certainly done a bit to update my own from my previous checker-board. I tend to prefer multiple, flexible units acting in support of one another, and mostly field something inbetween your Dutch Reform and Swedish Brigade set-ups(Two units of two melee and three range being my current set-up). I like to field a strong cavalry arm as well, to properly sieze the initiative, and maybe even deal with any enemy artillery before it becomes too much of a nuissance. Flying mages comes in handy for that last part. Cheers.
Awesome I'm so glad these have been helpful for you bro! I will say I'm pretty partial to the Dutch Reform style formation, I like your set up with the strong Cavalry contingents too, they compliment rigid formations so well with their maneuverability. Cheers bro!
The only "gunpowder" factions I play are Dwarfs and Skaven. however, I'd imagine this also works with the others. I've started using what I call the funnel formation. I setup in the underway or using the corner of the map chokepoints or between impassable terrain to protect the flanks. I set up 4 to 6 melee infantry In a V shape, but I leave a large gap in the middle. Heroes and lords stand in the wide area at the top of the V. Thunderers or ratlings in that open gap at the bottom. They can shoot along both sides of the V, hitting any units that engage the line, and anything foolish enough to come straight down the middle gets stuck on the heroes and gets deleted. This also allows for canons to be behind the guns and still get line of sight to fire. If you want to mix in units that fire on an arc, quarellers and grudge throwers or globadeers and mortars and plagueclaws in the case of the skaven. The can easily be set up behind the melee units on either side of the V and not obstruct anything. If on the off chance anything manages to go all the way around the tip of the V and try to come at the guns, you will have plenty of time to react even with fast units it is as simple as turning and firing. Or run through the gap to the other side of the V if it's an overwhelming amount of Cav, for instance.
I reckon a good addition to the roadblock is cavalry that attacks the charging enemy from the flanks. Cavalry should be better at bogging down the enemy than single entity units because cavalry obviously contains a lot more units and also the enemy can't disengage and continue the charge towards ranged units without getting overrun by the cavalry. Due to their mobility, the cavalry will also be able to disengage without too much hassle when they start taking too many losses.
That would be good yeah, especially with more Melee cavalry like Knights of the Black Rose since they can hang in the combat for a while. Cheers bro that's good advice!
The Road Block is called "tanking" and is like the most gamer strategy ever. Effective in every scenario applicable. The only problem tanking (as it was shown) has in WH is the lack of options to get enemy units aggro on the "tanks".
My favorite tactic now right now is using a Dwarf Thane with the 75% fire resist skill standing right in front of some Iron Drakes. Super easy combo and very effective.
2:12 The simple road block is the best, but to reach its maximum benefit you have to look at and know the terrain: Instead of heroes, place regular melee unit at the exact start base of a hill, and the range units up that hill. If you do it right you can have two lines of gun rifles shooting at blobs of enemies that are not even in combat. It was my basic tactic with the Vampire coast against the Lizardmen. The only available efficient tactic, since Lizardmen are a rush faction and the vampire coast is a defense one.
Oh definitely having access to a hill is so beneficial and you can bypass the need for a lot of complex formations. The only thing is that you can't rely upon always having a convenient hill to use
@@MalleusGaming57 To bypass that issue, make melee columns instead of melee lines. It works wonders against the AI. Since the enemy AI decides to surround the cheap front fighters instead of pushing through to catch the gunners; so the gunners have free way to shoot between the columns.
Interestingly, I've been experimenting this week with gunpowder formations for my Karl Franz campaign. The roadblock tactic with 4 steam tanks in front of a gunnery line works really well against Chaos (that is not N'Kari) and greenskins. The defensive wedge style don't work that well with the Empire faction though, as they lack a sturdy enough frontline. Pikemen can only do so much when they get charged by chaos warriors and forsaken.
Yeah Empire lacking a tough frontline unit makes things a bit difficult. I haven't tried it yet but I'm wondering if Knights of the Black Rose may be able to work as a Line unit? They've got really good armour and defensive stats
Thanks bud! I have and do plan on covering sieges, I just need to really get to grips with them since they’re kind of in a weird spot. I’ll see what I can come up with though
For Dwarfs with grapeshot cannons, I have a modified kill box formation that has never lost. I have the cannons in the center, with irondrakes behind to fire over. Melee infantry are spaced wide in a reverse chevron, with two grudge rakers firing inward toward the chevron. Finally, I’ve found having a goblin heart either side internally to be a great monster stopper. Switch to grapeshot once enemy is within range and watch them get shredded trying to rush the cannons
Thanks bro! Yeah Mounted Heroes for the flanks probably, my only concern with using them against infantry is that they have a bigger hit box, but I guess that’s the trade off
The Gunpowder Wedge feels so wonderfully Dwarfy. Inflexible, impenetrable, only to be used by the most experienced of generals due to complexity? Aye, I'll drink to that! ;P
My favorite formation is as the vampire coast using the bomb throwing infantry and mortars to absolutely decimate both my own melee infanty and the enemies. Don't need to worry about friendly fire when your units cost 100g to recruit and can be mass recruited after a battle.
Love your videos. Could you do one on Vampire Counts formations? I want to feel more like a Dark Lord mastermind, and I am also very tired of constantly blobbing up. Love me some Corpse Carts and Mortis engines, don't get me wrong, I just think there has to be more to the strategy than lumping everything around them. I ask because the Counts don't have any ranged units and feel like they want to be a rush faction, but their frontline is just so slow, meaning very few of the formations displayed so far seem to have any success. I also struggle a bit with larger units and ranged armies, so some counter-play strategies for that would be greatly appreciated as well. Thanks in advance.
Thanks so much bro I'll see what I can do, I find that's an issue with the Vamps they can be a little one note at times. I have had success with using a Refused Flank with them, as well as a Central Wedge of my best troops to break through the enemy line and then surround their units. I think being able to use your flying troops and cavalry to surround the enemy and hit them from all sides is key for VC
Hey i love your content, i think ive seen all your formation videos and it makes me want to play every time. Could you possibly do a video on archer formations for factions like the wood elves who rely on skirmishing, cav, and specialist infantry?
Thanks so much bro that really means a lot I appreciate it! And yeah I’ll definitely look into some Archery focused tactics, Wood Elves are one of my favourite factions it’ll be good to get back to them!
"Road Block"? I like that name. I've always called it rubber necking, less of the tactic but the phenomena of units getting stuck or fixating on another. "Why is my cav not cycling?" "Rubber Necking" "Three groups of heavy infantry are stacking up there, why?" "Rubber Necking"
Haha reminds me of rubber banding due to lag back in my Halo days 😂 I was thinking of going with Sacrifice at first but I figured we’re trying to avoid that really haha cheers bro
The way i learned was to send my 3 dwarf lords to the frontline to lure in enemies, each with a unit of whatever infantry to help them retreat if they need. next step is to bombard everything with all the range you have. its pretty fun to watch
My favorite gunpowder formations are the ones I easily crush with my cavalries. That's almost any empire army since they know nothing about charge defence.
I find it really hard to micromanage everything thats going on so recently I made my armies just have Sootson Mortar, War Wagons and a whole mass of Spearmen with Shields. The spearmen with Shield are there to bait aggro and tie up opponents, my Mortars target enemy Missiles and the War Wagons are the actual DPS because they can shoot over the Spearmen and they deal armor piercing damage. Once I have budget I get a landship and thats what I micromanage primarily since it can run over infantry.
Sometimes, I miss when CA did the disastrous patch that allowed stacked units to not friendly fire each other. Didn't have to worry about formation for few days.
Road block works wonders with the Empire. Use tanks as a road block, support them with handgunners/ironsides, have a couple units of crossbows/huntsmen for indirect fire support, use Empire General/Franz/Boris/Elspeth on dragon if needed to close gaps, artillery amount to your taste. Borrow a couple of royal pegasus/hippogryffs from Bretonia ally or dawi gyrocopters to achieve air supperiority.... Profit.
Oh wow I never thought about adding in allied units, yeah Bretonnian Hippogryphs would be so good!! You could totally use them to hunt down enemy Mages and Artillery, letting your own artillery have an opportunity to blast the enemy infantry, I love it good call
With kislev I've had a lot of success with a simple __ /*\ __ formation. Where the __ is ice guard, streltsi or kossars and the /\ are armoured kossars. For large Armies, you can make things like. _ /*\ _ ^_^ _ /*\ _ Where the ^^ is artillery and * is heroes.
Speaking of combined arms units, I’m curious if you have any advice for armies that combine gunpowder and monster units, both monstrous infantry and single-entity, like vampire coast and clan moulder. Do you have any insights as to how to properly leverage the unique strengths of both.
Could you make more specific army videos? I really liked the Belegar one. Maybe one for Tyrion fighting Malekith or a White Lions based army for Alastar?
Oh definitely that sounds like it’d be fun, I did a Grimgor Black Orc focussed one but that was also mod based, a White Lion army sounds epic to do as well I’ll look into it
@@MalleusGaming57 I usually play with SFO but waiting for it to be updated. I play Asur and Dawi the most. Grimgor was kinda cool when he dueled Archaon.
@@MalleusGaming57 Shredded most of their front line with artillery but the Daemon Prince and their sorcerer nearly fractured the formation. The cavalry had to fight against those annoying warhounds but they also managed to win with enough manpower to save my line after a halberdier unit broke.
Man with all the upgrades Nuln gets you could probably make an entire formation out of gunpowder units and they'd just obliterate the enemy army and whatever land they're standing on too haha
I am Franz . they will obey. They will obey even more while I rekt enemies air units with my Griffon . Which is the only counter to these kinds of formations
Aren't both variants especially vulnerably to spells? You should incorporate them for two reasons: counter enemy ones + disrupt enemy front line. Also fast moving units are needed to bait bots out of their winds of magic (this won't work on human player imho).
Yeah spells are a problem, I kinda consider them another form of enemy artillery. Having some fast assassination units to take them out is definitely a priority
I think on your last formation video someone mentioned using dwarf frontline (was playing as nuln). The Ironsides could ussually shoot right over longbeard heads
I think my only issue with these is how static they are, when I would rather find ways to be aggressive and maneuver on the enemy. That being said, some interesting stuff I can hopefully adapt to my own purposes, I have a bad habit of just doing straight lines
The thing with these is that things like cannons are an anchor and so its difficult to move around a lot leaving them unguarded. Switch them out for something like Gyrobombers or Mortar War Wagons and you can easily be more aggressive
I know you've done the chevron but what about 1 big chevron? Splitting your army in 2 with any units approaching each army in the crossfire? Local superiority may mean less when you're getting absolutely showered in missiles.
2:00 "Sword and shield", as the old dogma from the bronze age: the phalanx was the shield, cavalry was the sword. superseded by the granddaddy of Combined Arms, "Cohort command" by the Roman legions, where all individual sections of a larger army were both sword and shield at every turn. superseded centuries later by the closest comparison of CA: "Fire and maneuver" warfare is as old as humanity... so, DO look to ancient history when teaching warfare! I won games of Age Of Empires by using trebuchets and archers as a unit of mechanized infantry!
I like these especially the wedge, but i do worry about factions that have more ranged than you, since we dont have overwhelming firepower with these formations something like tzeentch cathay dwarfs or elves would be a nightmare to fight.
Yeah for sure, heavy enemy range is a weakness but in that case you'd probably want to go more aggressive rather than turtling up in a formation. They're great for when you're on the defensive but you gotta adapt to different battles
Hello, first time i met your videos. I like your ideas, but this ideas don't work against people with certain strenght in multiplayer. 1. In the first video you can simply ignore charachters and give orders to advance. 2. In the second video i can simply avoid the center attacking directly flanks and rears. 3. In the third one the same as 2. Other things that it depends on what faction you've met, like you're against Vampire Counts in the 3rd scenario, they will spawn zombie and engage with bats and vargheist all your range units. Said this, I liked your video and your ideas are originally, I wait one day when I will use one of your tactic to win a tournament. Great video!
Amazing video. But how do you change the direction of fire of a square deployed unit? I've seen your gunpowder units in a square formation facing one of the angles rather than one of the sides. Whenever I change direction of fire (usually by giving a new attack order), they often rotate the whole formation, rather than just rotating the single soldiers in place.
So I typically have them on Guard Mode, keep the formation Square shaped and when I turn them around I tend to just quickly drag the formation into shape manually, I think it’s probably some combo of those factors doing it, tbh I dunno if Guard Mode affects that at all out of combat
It's cheesy but I like to put all my ranged units compact against an edge o fthe map with Melee to the side. Guns slaughter one flank then reposition to shoot the enemies in melee
Omg! A Picket Line! Dude thank you haha I knew there must have been something for this. Well I can't undo calling it a roadblock now haha but I can definitely differentiate between a proper Picket Line where the units Skirmish to distract/slow down I suppose, rather than how this has the units charge into hold the enemy up. Cheers bud!
Sounds like you have them set to skirmish mode, when you have them selected you there’ll be a button under the unit cards you can toggle skirmish on and off with, it’ll be around the guard mode button. Also check in your game settings if it has auto skirmish on
It does but it’s still a bit temperamental. You’ll want your melee troops at the very base of the hill and then your gunpowder units should be behind them on the slope of the hill. If you put them at the top of the hill they may not fire properly when the enemy gets close
So, how do i use this in the normal campaign maps? 90% are full of giant hills and forests. Can't even use any artillery that shoots in a straight line.
You’ll have to maneuver to a better position, or just use your troops in a different way. Much like in real life the terrain isn’t always suitable for what you’d want to do. Just ask the Macedonians who fought against the Romans
My favourite roadblock is Robert the Damned Paladin, Cylostrias unique hero. Why a cav hero? Because he starts out immortal. Hes already dead so what if i kill him with friendly fire?
I would say depending on the enemy you're fighting, Iron Drakes with the flamethrowers would be better against lightly armoured enemies, while the Thunderers with Shotguns are better against heavy armour. Rifles will have more range and so may be good for a middle ground generalist option
The Road block seems very effective, and the Killzone seems even doable for the empire with the new Nuln-Ironsides. The last one, the Gunpowder Wedge- I really, really like that one! Of course as Empire, we need dwarfs on the front -so we can shoot over them- because only Dwarfs can hold it long enough! And i think it is crucial for this position to kill enemy mages fast. Wind Magic killing 4 front Units compleetly destroys this formation 🤔 So may better only use it, if the enemy has no damage-mage.
Haha Dwarfs make everything better! And yeah depending on the spells they have an enemy wizard is target priority one, as Empire maybe some Outriders to try and assassinate them
I think your formations are too static. Utilize cavalry or chariots with "Fire whilst moving" to lure enemies from engaging your front line, giving your ranged units more time to shoot them down.
Its just too bad that the AI doesnt give a flying F about your formations and can infinitely thread its melee units into any gap while engaged and stop your units from shooting effectively, regardless of how small that gap is. This stuff only works if you make the AI prioritize something other than your ranged units.
I'd love to see your gunpowder tactics in an Otomo clan run in shogun 2. I'll be trying it out myself. Especially the tercio since shogun doesn't have dragons
Yooooo! Ma! I'm on Malleus gaming!
Total whiplash from hearing my name lol. Cheers for another great vid!
There he is! The man the myth the legend! Haha cheers buddy hope you enjoyed the little surprise!
Do you think empire handgunners and dwarf thunderers could be used to do carolean ga pa tactics?@@MalleusGaming57
Everyone has a plan until a dragon lands in the middle of your formation
Lmfao ain't that the truth of it!
Lol
Just be skaven so it’s shredded to pieces before it gets close enough
Mannfred von Carstien wrote this
Skaven players: Collateral damage? You mean happy accidents.
Quick-fast! Send in meat-soldiers! All part of genius plan yes-yes!
Yes yes 🐀
No,no…that was not accident, but yes ,yes, happy anyway
No accidents! Only happy!
Isn't that just skaven lunch?
Equipping an item on your Road Block character that gives a temporary damage resistance buff would be a nice addition to that first strategy of yours.
Oh yeah, any damage resistance buffs would be so effective! Even debuffing items to reduce the enemy's melee attack, anything to help survivability. Warrior Priests/Arch Lectors would be so good for this role since they have that bombardment ability too
I love gunpowder units but recently I've been wondering what is the best place to put my cannons to use grapeshot without absolutely obliterating my own frontline and not leaving it extremely exposed lol.
If you have enough of them, there is not gonna be an enemy frontline to impact yours.
I wouldn't plan my gameplay around a unit that's currently bugged and will be getting a heavy nerf
Setting them up in a kill box would probably work really well, you could use them as direct line of site gunpowder units, just leave the kill zone opening a little wider
There are many solutions, but one is to have some melee infantry right behind your cannon and charge forward when the enemy is about to make contact. Your cannon should stop firing at that point, but hopefully it will have softened the enemy frontline enough. If you want your cannon to keep firing, you could try to intercept whatever is charging at you from the side, but it can be hard to pull off, specially if the enemy has a cohesive frontline, and a human opponent could try to disengage and continue charging towards your cannons. That's why having a unit right behind your cannons can always be useful, just in case.
@@theengine If it gets nerfed I will simply make a mod to revert the nerf. I like them how they are and will continue to use them in this state.
The gunpowder wedge looks really nice
Yeah it took a couple of tries and making some little adjustments (like adding the second row of infantry at the front and the long range missiles at the back) but then everything just all clicked and I was quite happy with it
"SHORT!?" 6:46
Lmfao oh no I’ve become a wazzock! I’m going in the book!!!
Time for more Empire formations as Gelt!
The Nation Calls!
Try Elsbeth! ;D She does this very well too and has a cool mechanic for it!
I second Philips statement, Eslpeth is fantastic for Gun Powder stuff!
my fav gunpowder strat is a chevron formation setup similar to your killbox strat. but its artillery, cannons or organ guns usually setup exposed in the centre. it allows them to fire right down the flank of the enemy balling up around the tips of your chevrons which i make quite angular so the enemy balls up around them more
The Gunpowder Wedge looks beautiful! Makes me want to try it out myself with the Chaos Dwarfs first and foremost, then other factions. Saw this video by accident, but will have a look at your other videos to get some inspirations on formations :)
Man a Chaos Dwarf Gunpowder Wedge would be absolutely brutal! You could replace all the melee infantry with Fireglaive Infernal Guard and pump out sooo much firepower! Cheers bro I appreciate it!
So much help your videos. I was so frustrated with missle troops but your videos have helped alot.
Awesome that’s great to hear, glad my videos could help you out buddy!
when i played dwarfs recently i kinda made a mix of the road block and wedge. 4 line infantry to hold the line with 3 high damage output units looking through the gabs between the units(used iron drakes for dwarfs), 2-3 rifle units behind this for focused fire on large and mostly single entities with 2-3 artillerty behind that shooting long range and focus high threat units with 1 line infantry on each side of the rifle and artilery grouping to cover the flanks, and 2 skirmish/flanking units(used gyrocopters/bombers). the characters(exept engineer) was placed ahead for road blocking
I have been practicing a lot with the Dwarfs lately. One of my favorite battles recently was attacking the Sister's tree with Grombrindal. They had 3 armies in there and I had just one. I set up 2 squads of sort of a checkerboard cross of 4 units, with Ironbreakers in front center, Grudgerakers on the sides and Torpedo Irondrakes in the rear center. I had the 2 groups set up one of the forward to the right and the other further back to the left. I had Grombrindal and my Runesmith with those groups to support as well. I had my 2 Grudgesettler Irondrakes in reserve to come in when needed. That group was attacking the left entrace to the grove. On the right side I setup my 2 Flame Cannons, Engineer, Thane, and another Ironbreaker unit. The Flamecannons just fired over a short wall of trees and the Ironbreakers and Thane were there for protection but did not end up being needed. Ended up getting nearly 4000 kills and losing less than 10 Dwarfs. Dirty Knife Ears didn't stand a chance. The 2 squads worked really well moving up while the other squad covered them. I had 2 Brimstone Gyrocopters but they were not safe to be used as the enemy had so many archers. This army was all about fire 🔥.
Great vid; this is some of the best Total war warhammer content Ive seen!
Thank you so much bro! That is really nice of you to say I appreciate it so much! Cheer bud!
I've found that very tight formations like your last one tend to be vulnerable to fast moving SEMs (particularly flying ones). It's not a big deal if there's only 1 or 2 of them, but the AI tends to have more of them toward the late game, and they can quickly and easily fly in and disrupt the entire formation by tying up multiple ranged units when charging through them. This then leaves the front line unsupported, and your ranged units in the middle have no space to maneuver away from the SEMs in their midst.
It's also vulnerable to enemy artillery fire, since iirc Dwarf artillery has no range advantage over most other races, and is in fact outranged by both Empire and Cathay, while being roughly on par with Skaven and slightly ahead of Greenskin artillery. Having the dwarf cannons at the rear means enemy artillery can hit your front line and you will not be able to return fire, unless you have fast movers like gyrobombers to take them out, but that is difficult if the enemy has ranged units near their artillery.
Not saying it's a bad idea though, but definitely situational.
Absolutely, it has it's set of weaknesses that will have to be taken into account. With the update I am loving how Gryocopters and Bombers are now, they would really add some much needed flexibility to an army like this. Also boo on the AI and all their flying monkeys haha we're just trying to have a good time here but they do a good job at spoiling our fun. It'll be messy and chaotic but some Giant Slayers should hopefully help deal with any fliers bypassing the lines. Cheers bro!
Very useful! Thx for sharing! I always love the gun unit in this game, so many cool formations we can try
Thanks for watching bud glad it could be helpful for you! And yeah it still amazes me the depth to this game with how you can get all the different units to interact with each other. Cheers bro!
Love this series since it began! I've modified your older tercio formation adding in the Hochland long rifles and Nuln Ironsides and the results were pretty epic.
That is so awesome thank you bro for your support! And dude I've been so excited to try out the new units with the Tercio glad to hear that they're so effective! Did you have them as one big formation or multiple smaller ones?
I used the larger square formation with the two halberds per side. An engineer with the trait that increases range of all missile units. Fought a battle against Kemmler, he came at me with almost 7000 against my 1400, it was an epic stand, my mortars ran dry from firing. My Reiksguard knights held off an entire flank so my gunners could reposition. There were over 7000 casualties in the battle and it broke Kemmler's power in Bretonnia. 10/10 would recommend the tercio.
Through your adive and my own trial and error I've come from hating and never using gunpowder units to primarily fielding them with great results (on highest difficulty)! :D
Yooo that’s awesome! Glad I could be of service haha I guess that’s the thing with Gunpowder they can be finicky and just not work, but with the proper set up they can be so epic
@@MalleusGaming57 Yeah and if nothing else, they are very epic to look (and hear) at :D
Skaven and Vampire Coast armies are great for these tactics as they have built-in chaff units you can use to bait the enemy forces. They also have enough firepower to really bring the hurt if the enemy is willing to sit stiff for a few seconds.
Oh absolutely, I was having so much fun using these ideas with the Vamp Coast
I’ve seen your videos quite a bit recently and love them. Your voice is very pleasant and descriptive
Thanks so much bro I’m glad you’ve been enjoying them! I appreciate the kind words bud cheers!
Using allied units would be a huge help here. For instance, kislev riflemen behind thunderers would allow both of them to shoot at an oncoming enemy since kislev are tall and dwarfs short.
I like a roadblock formation with my artillery far off to my left or right flank depending on terrain. I keep a cavalry formation that can intercept any that head towards my artillery. As battle progresses I move my main army forward within gun range. The artillery causes some units to aggro towards them. This exposes flanks to my gun powder units. Cavalry can intercept any that get too close. Flying units the only issue with this formation so if enemy army has some fliers I usually leave a unit of spears or swordsman behind my artillery.
Been working great so far.
That’s quite cunning, using your artillery as a lure so your infantry can get get some good shots off! And like if they ignore your artillery they’re gonna get absolutely demolished. I love it haha
I’ve seen this unit combo of Ice guard and Strelsi for kisliv in a tournament. The unit combo, worked wonderful VS the other players. For example dwarves.
Man I feel Dwarfs would be punished especially hard with the speed debuffs, they must have been barely moving at all! I really love the synergy within Kislev's roster, it's just good fun
Have you heard of the barcode formation? The idea is while gunners can't shoot through other units but can shoot through their own so you take your units and only give them the narrow area to deploy, making them form into columns 2-3 figures wide. Lets you concentrate massive firepower in one narrow direction
Love these videos - they give me so much inspiration
Cheers bro glad you enjoyed it! That's a big part of why I love making these, inspiring people to shake things up a bit with their battles!
I'm very famliar with the road block strat.
Helps out so much for my skaven runs.
Trying out the dwarfs again and its goin very well now.
But his vid has helped to clarify where my early formations went wrong.
I got Thorgrim up to 6 Thanes now all with tankards and they just get stuck in.
Gyrocoptors which I was never a fan of in the past are great now.
And in quite the turn around have replaced my go to thunderers in some cases.
Ooo 6 Tankard Thanes dang nothings gonna get through those haha and yeah Gyrocopters are sooo much better I hated using them, now they're almost an auto-include
I use a version of killbox with Kislev, where it's two shallow "niches" filled with Streltsi, staggered so one in a bit in front of the other, and surrounded by a wall of armored kossars. Instead of aiming straight, the Streltsi aim diagonally, so that right flank streltsi cover left flank kossars, and left flank streltsi cover right flink kossars. kossars with spears cover the back so they can shoot their bows, and if cav comes calling they go melee stance with spears. I suppose one could use the "kislev warriors" for that too, but I can't even look at them. I have 2 units of heavy cav at the ready, and horse archers or light sleds lead the enemy into the niches. Once the enemy is close, use a hag with and an ice witch to stack slow spells to pretty much get the enemy army stuck in firing range or armored kossars and streltsy crossfirre. from up close, streltsi bullets just go through enemy line instead of hitting the "one dude on the right" as missiles usually do, causing an absolute massacre. Meanwhile, winged hussars counter enemy cav, and hunt down stragglers. If the enemy ranged gets away from the infantry I use my skirmishers to melee them. Once the line is joined, my hussars immediately go for side charges, usually ending the battle in one or two cycles. Very effective tactics, the two shallow niches instead of one big one like you did splits enemy army in two once the lines are joined, so your missile units aren't so vulnerable.. Also, Kislev.
You have seriously helped me take my Empire Games to a whole new level, I was a Skaven main until recently so the idea of complex formations to allow unobstructed firing mid-combat was kinda a non-idea... I had right at the end of my Skavenship stumbled upon a poorly optimised checkerboard pattern where I'd use Ratling-Gunners and Storm Vermin side by side and skaven slaves as a roadblock to gun down along with whatever they were attacking but that was as far as it had gone.
Bro that's awesome to hear! I'm so glad that this has been so helpful for you! I still gotta laugh at how Skaven do things though, gunning down hundreds of their own is just another day for them haha cheers bud!
they're certainly a hoot to play, still one one of my all time favourite fantasy factions. cheers.
Glorious friendly fire at 7.28 for the DAWI. Must be borrowing Skaven tactics
Haha some Beardlings are gonna be getting a stern talking to that’s for sure!
My favourite roadblock is using skaven armies,
A combination of packmasters on brood horrors (fear and regen with wolfrat summons) supported by weapons teams. Works a treat 👌
Those Packmasters are way tougher than I gave them credit for haha I need to do more with Skaven, I absolutely hate fighting them in campaign so it’ll be nice to flip things around haha
Watching your series on gunpowder tactics has certainly done a bit to update my own from my previous checker-board. I tend to prefer multiple, flexible units acting in support of one another, and mostly field something inbetween your Dutch Reform and Swedish Brigade set-ups(Two units of two melee and three range being my current set-up). I like to field a strong cavalry arm as well, to properly sieze the initiative, and maybe even deal with any enemy artillery before it becomes too much of a nuissance. Flying mages comes in handy for that last part.
Cheers.
Awesome I'm so glad these have been helpful for you bro! I will say I'm pretty partial to the Dutch Reform style formation, I like your set up with the strong Cavalry contingents too, they compliment rigid formations so well with their maneuverability. Cheers bro!
Hey malleus, love the formation videos. Would be interesting to see more infantry or cav focused formations and tactics. Keep up the great content! :)
Thanks so much bro glad you like them! I’m definitely looking into more of those, gathering ideas and plotting some schemes right now so stay tuned!
The only "gunpowder" factions I play are Dwarfs and Skaven. however, I'd imagine this also works with the others. I've started using what I call the funnel formation. I setup in the underway or using the corner of the map chokepoints or between impassable terrain to protect the flanks. I set up 4 to 6 melee infantry In a V shape, but I leave a large gap in the middle. Heroes and lords stand in the wide area at the top of the V. Thunderers or ratlings in that open gap at the bottom. They can shoot along both sides of the V, hitting any units that engage the line, and anything foolish enough to come straight down the middle gets stuck on the heroes and gets deleted. This also allows for canons to be behind the guns and still get line of sight to fire. If you want to mix in units that fire on an arc, quarellers and grudge throwers or globadeers and mortars and plagueclaws in the case of the skaven. The can easily be set up behind the melee units on either side of the V and not obstruct anything. If on the off chance anything manages to go all the way around the tip of the V and try to come at the guns, you will have plenty of time to react even with fast units it is as simple as turning and firing. Or run through the gap to the other side of the V if it's an overwhelming amount of Cav, for instance.
Great video. Thanks for the pro tips.
Glad it was helpful! Thanks bro!
I reckon a good addition to the roadblock is cavalry that attacks the charging enemy from the flanks. Cavalry should be better at bogging down the enemy than single entity units because cavalry obviously contains a lot more units and also the enemy can't disengage and continue the charge towards ranged units without getting overrun by the cavalry. Due to their mobility, the cavalry will also be able to disengage without too much hassle when they start taking too many losses.
That would be good yeah, especially with more Melee cavalry like Knights of the Black Rose since they can hang in the combat for a while. Cheers bro that's good advice!
The Road Block is called "tanking" and is like the most gamer strategy ever. Effective in every scenario applicable. The only problem tanking (as it was shown) has in WH is the lack of options to get enemy units aggro on the "tanks".
My favorite tactic now right now is using a Dwarf Thane with the 75% fire resist skill standing right in front of some Iron Drakes. Super easy combo and very effective.
Yo that's a great idea! He won't care at all about any stray friendly fire hits!
Awesome stuff, thanks man.
Thanks so much bro I really appreciate it!
2:12 The simple road block is the best, but to reach its maximum benefit you have to look at and know the terrain: Instead of heroes, place regular melee unit at the exact start base of a hill, and the range units up that hill. If you do it right you can have two lines of gun rifles shooting at blobs of enemies that are not even in combat.
It was my basic tactic with the Vampire coast against the Lizardmen. The only available efficient tactic, since Lizardmen are a rush faction and the vampire coast is a defense one.
Oh definitely having access to a hill is so beneficial and you can bypass the need for a lot of complex formations. The only thing is that you can't rely upon always having a convenient hill to use
@@MalleusGaming57 To bypass that issue, make melee columns instead of melee lines. It works wonders against the AI. Since the enemy AI decides to surround the cheap front fighters instead of pushing through to catch the gunners; so the gunners have free way to shoot between the columns.
I love vampire coasts, so I'll try this and more :) thanks
Awesome yeah Vampire Coast is great with missile formations, they put out such an intense amount of firepower! Let me know how it goes bud!
Interestingly, I've been experimenting this week with gunpowder formations for my Karl Franz campaign. The roadblock tactic with 4 steam tanks in front of a gunnery line works really well against Chaos (that is not N'Kari) and greenskins. The defensive wedge style don't work that well with the Empire faction though, as they lack a sturdy enough frontline. Pikemen can only do so much when they get charged by chaos warriors and forsaken.
Yeah Empire lacking a tough frontline unit makes things a bit difficult. I haven't tried it yet but I'm wondering if Knights of the Black Rose may be able to work as a Line unit? They've got really good armour and defensive stats
Nice! Have you thought about doing a video on siege formations/tactics?
Thanks bud! I have and do plan on covering sieges, I just need to really get to grips with them since they’re kind of in a weird spot. I’ll see what I can come up with though
Your formation is not as rigid as my tactical mind. Thank you for expanding it :-D
Haha cheers bud! Glad this could be helpful for you
For Dwarfs with grapeshot cannons, I have a modified kill box formation that has never lost.
I have the cannons in the center, with irondrakes behind to fire over. Melee infantry are spaced wide in a reverse chevron, with two grudge rakers firing inward toward the chevron. Finally, I’ve found having a goblin heart either side internally to be a great monster stopper. Switch to grapeshot once enemy is within range and watch them get shredded trying to rush the cannons
Can you email me a picture of it? I have a hard time imagining it . Thanks!
Love the video, for the roadblock you can use mointed heroes or lords to cover fast units attacking from the flanks.
Thanks bro! Yeah Mounted Heroes for the flanks probably, my only concern with using them against infantry is that they have a bigger hit box, but I guess that’s the trade off
The Gunpowder Wedge feels so wonderfully Dwarfy. Inflexible, impenetrable, only to be used by the most experienced of generals due to complexity? Aye, I'll drink to that! ;P
Haha I never looked at it that way but by Grungni you’re right!
My favorite formation is as the vampire coast using the bomb throwing infantry and mortars to absolutely decimate both my own melee infanty and the enemies. Don't need to worry about friendly fire when your units cost 100g to recruit and can be mass recruited after a battle.
When I read "decimate both my own infantry and the enemy's" I had a legit good chuckle at that haha cheers bro!
Love your videos. Could you do one on Vampire Counts formations? I want to feel more like a Dark Lord mastermind, and I am also very tired of constantly blobbing up. Love me some Corpse Carts and Mortis engines, don't get me wrong, I just think there has to be more to the strategy than lumping everything around them. I ask because the Counts don't have any ranged units and feel like they want to be a rush faction, but their frontline is just so slow, meaning very few of the formations displayed so far seem to have any success. I also struggle a bit with larger units and ranged armies, so some counter-play strategies for that would be greatly appreciated as well. Thanks in advance.
Thanks so much bro I'll see what I can do, I find that's an issue with the Vamps they can be a little one note at times. I have had success with using a Refused Flank with them, as well as a Central Wedge of my best troops to break through the enemy line and then surround their units. I think being able to use your flying troops and cavalry to surround the enemy and hit them from all sides is key for VC
Most gunpowder formations have a huge blind spot when it comes to range heavy enemy armies such as Wood Elves.
That's what your sniper units are there for
Gotta love that crazy 260 (255?) range on the Hochland Long Rifles!
Use artillery to focus down any ranged threats
One volley from a hell storm should be able to obliterate any ranged unit in the game !
Hey i love your content, i think ive seen all your formation videos and it makes me want to play every time.
Could you possibly do a video on archer formations for factions like the wood elves who rely on skirmishing, cav, and specialist infantry?
Thanks so much bro that really means a lot I appreciate it! And yeah I’ll definitely look into some Archery focused tactics, Wood Elves are one of my favourite factions it’ll be good to get back to them!
Right on time as I got home
Haha perfect timing!
The kill box is a beautiful thing
Yeah it looks so cool and any units that get in the middle get absolutely shredded I love it haha
"Road Block"? I like that name. I've always called it rubber necking, less of the tactic but the phenomena of units getting stuck or fixating on another.
"Why is my cav not cycling?" "Rubber Necking"
"Three groups of heavy infantry are stacking up there, why?" "Rubber Necking"
Haha reminds me of rubber banding due to lag back in my Halo days 😂 I was thinking of going with Sacrifice at first but I figured we’re trying to avoid that really haha cheers bro
The way i learned was to send my 3 dwarf lords to the frontline to lure in enemies, each with a unit of whatever infantry to help them retreat if they need. next step is to bombard everything with all the range you have. its pretty fun to watch
That does sound fun, I like sending in the bodyguards with the characters that’s very thematic!
Ikit claw would love all of this formation
My favorite gunpowder formations are the ones I easily crush with my cavalries. That's almost any empire army since they know nothing about charge defence.
I find it really hard to micromanage everything thats going on so recently I made my armies just have Sootson Mortar, War Wagons and a whole mass of Spearmen with Shields.
The spearmen with Shield are there to bait aggro and tie up opponents, my Mortars target enemy Missiles and the War Wagons are the actual DPS because they can shoot over the Spearmen and they deal armor piercing damage. Once I have budget I get a landship and thats what I micromanage primarily since it can run over infantry.
Sometimes, I miss when CA did the disastrous patch that allowed stacked units to not friendly fire each other. Didn't have to worry about formation for few days.
Road block works wonders with the Empire. Use tanks as a road block, support them with handgunners/ironsides, have a couple units of crossbows/huntsmen for indirect fire support, use Empire General/Franz/Boris/Elspeth on dragon if needed to close gaps, artillery amount to your taste. Borrow a couple of royal pegasus/hippogryffs from Bretonia ally or dawi gyrocopters to achieve air supperiority.... Profit.
Oh wow I never thought about adding in allied units, yeah Bretonnian Hippogryphs would be so good!! You could totally use them to hunt down enemy Mages and Artillery, letting your own artillery have an opportunity to blast the enemy infantry, I love it good call
With kislev I've had a lot of success with a simple __ /*\ __ formation. Where the __ is ice guard, streltsi or kossars and the /\ are armoured kossars.
For large Armies, you can make things like. _ /*\ _ ^_^ _ /*\ _ Where the ^^ is artillery and * is heroes.
I would love to see you come up with an army based around Net of Amyntok.
That’d work so well with a kill box, stopping the enemy units right in front of all your guns!
Great video!
Thanks so much!
Speaking of combined arms units, I’m curious if you have any advice for armies that combine gunpowder and monster units, both monstrous infantry and single-entity, like vampire coast and clan moulder. Do you have any insights as to how to properly leverage the unique strengths of both.
Could you make more specific army videos? I really liked the Belegar one. Maybe one for Tyrion fighting Malekith or a White Lions based army for Alastar?
Oh definitely that sounds like it’d be fun, I did a Grimgor Black Orc focussed one but that was also mod based, a White Lion army sounds epic to do as well I’ll look into it
@@MalleusGaming57 I usually play with SFO but waiting for it to be updated. I play Asur and Dawi the most. Grimgor was kinda cool when he dueled Archaon.
Loved these, and all the vids I've been able to enjoy since discovering your channel. I call the first one 'Hero tanking".
Yo that is so nice to hear glad you've been enjoying the channel bro! Hero Tanking is a good term for it too I like it!
Yo the Gunpowder Wedge actually won me a big one against the Legion of Chaos, only thing that nearly lost me was the Daemon Prince tearing shit up.
That's awesome! Glad to hear it bud how'd the battle go?
@@MalleusGaming57
Shredded most of their front line with artillery but the Daemon Prince and their sorcerer nearly fractured the formation.
The cavalry had to fight against those annoying warhounds but they also managed to win with enough manpower to save my line after a halberdier unit broke.
Can't wait to implement this idea to my 18 hailstorms
I've used the roadbloak a lot in my games
him: "advanced gunpowder formations"
also him: "ROADBLOCK"
BRING OUT THE STOP SIGNS!!!
Thank you ❤
Thank you for watching bro!
I keep seeing the use of heroes to roadblock units but when I try it my heroes/melee units just get ran by and mostly ignored.
surprised you didnt cover the Stink Box formation
Just in time for my Nuln run
Man with all the upgrades Nuln gets you could probably make an entire formation out of gunpowder units and they'd just obliterate the enemy army and whatever land they're standing on too haha
I am Franz . they will obey. They will obey even more while I rekt enemies air units with my Griffon . Which is the only counter to these kinds of formations
Aren't both variants especially vulnerably to spells? You should incorporate them for two reasons: counter enemy ones + disrupt enemy front line. Also fast moving units are needed to bait bots out of their winds of magic (this won't work on human player imho).
Yeah spells are a problem, I kinda consider them another form of enemy artillery. Having some fast assassination units to take them out is definitely a priority
I think on your last formation video someone mentioned using dwarf frontline (was playing as nuln). The Ironsides could ussually shoot right over longbeard heads
That’d be really effective, you could probably even get a third line of shooters with Outriders behind the Ironsides
@@MalleusGaming57 I wish the outriders didn’t knock over their targets. It makes everything miss
I think my only issue with these is how static they are, when I would rather find ways to be aggressive and maneuver on the enemy. That being said, some interesting stuff I can hopefully adapt to my own purposes, I have a bad habit of just doing straight lines
The thing with these is that things like cannons are an anchor and so its difficult to move around a lot leaving them unguarded. Switch them out for something like Gyrobombers or Mortar War Wagons and you can easily be more aggressive
I know you've done the chevron but what about 1 big chevron? Splitting your army in 2 with any units approaching each army in the crossfire?
Local superiority may mean less when you're getting absolutely showered in missiles.
2:00
"Sword and shield", as the old dogma from the bronze age: the phalanx was the shield, cavalry was the sword.
superseded by the granddaddy of Combined Arms, "Cohort command" by the Roman legions, where all individual sections of a larger army were both sword and shield at every turn.
superseded centuries later by the closest comparison of CA: "Fire and maneuver"
warfare is as old as humanity... so, DO look to ancient history when teaching warfare!
I won games of Age Of Empires by using trebuchets and archers as a unit of mechanized infantry!
I like these especially the wedge, but i do worry about factions that have more ranged than you, since we dont have overwhelming firepower with these formations something like tzeentch cathay dwarfs or elves would be a nightmare to fight.
Yeah for sure, heavy enemy range is a weakness but in that case you'd probably want to go more aggressive rather than turtling up in a formation. They're great for when you're on the defensive but you gotta adapt to different battles
Hello, first time i met your videos. I like your ideas, but this ideas don't work against people with certain strenght in multiplayer.
1. In the first video you can simply ignore charachters and give orders to advance.
2. In the second video i can simply avoid the center attacking directly flanks and rears.
3. In the third one the same as 2.
Other things that it depends on what faction you've met, like you're against Vampire Counts in the 3rd scenario, they will spawn zombie and engage with bats and vargheist all your range units.
Said this, I liked your video and your ideas are originally, I wait one day when I will use one of your tactic to win a tournament.
Great video!
This is meant for Campaign, not for multiplayer
@@samueldisturbing761 Sure, I understand this.
Amazing video. But how do you change the direction of fire of a square deployed unit? I've seen your gunpowder units in a square formation facing one of the angles rather than one of the sides.
Whenever I change direction of fire (usually by giving a new attack order), they often rotate the whole formation, rather than just rotating the single soldiers in place.
So I typically have them on Guard Mode, keep the formation Square shaped and when I turn them around I tend to just quickly drag the formation into shape manually, I think it’s probably some combo of those factors doing it, tbh I dunno if Guard Mode affects that at all out of combat
I'll always use checker formation
It really is the formation I use the most, it’s quick to set up and effective. Sometimes I do get a bit bored with it though
It's cheesy but I like to put all my ranged units compact against an edge o fthe map with Melee to the side. Guns slaughter one flank then reposition to shoot the enemies in melee
he hath risen! behold!
Lissan al-Ghaib!!! (Lmao just finished watching Dune 2)
or play high elves and get 18 shielded lothern seaguard in a 3x6 rows formation.
Well well, look at that, right when I started a new campaign that wasn't empire... Empire it is then
SUMMON THE ELECTOR COUNTS!!!
The roadblock formation is a picket. Specifically the term for soldiers sent ahead to slow down or warn against an encroaching army
Omg! A Picket Line! Dude thank you haha I knew there must have been something for this. Well I can't undo calling it a roadblock now haha but I can definitely differentiate between a proper Picket Line where the units Skirmish to distract/slow down I suppose, rather than how this has the units charge into hold the enemy up. Cheers bud!
How do you make your range units stay and shoot while enemy is nearby? My are running away in every direction and I can't stop them
Sounds like you have them set to skirmish mode, when you have them selected you there’ll be a button under the unit cards you can toggle skirmish on and off with, it’ll be around the guard mode button. Also check in your game settings if it has auto skirmish on
does high grounds allow for gunpowder missile troops to shoot over melee infantry?
It does but it’s still a bit temperamental. You’ll want your melee troops at the very base of the hill and then your gunpowder units should be behind them on the slope of the hill. If you put them at the top of the hill they may not fire properly when the enemy gets close
So, how do i use this in the normal campaign maps? 90% are full of giant hills and forests. Can't even use any artillery that shoots in a straight line.
You’ll have to maneuver to a better position, or just use your troops in a different way. Much like in real life the terrain isn’t always suitable for what you’d want to do. Just ask the Macedonians who fought against the Romans
My favourite roadblock is Robert the Damned Paladin, Cylostrias unique hero. Why a cav hero? Because he starts out immortal. Hes already dead so what if i kill him with friendly fire?
That is a very fair point! I've never played as Cylostra but those ghostly Bretonnians she has access to seem really really useful
the roadblock has no name, because that probably hasn't been used in real life much...
Yeah I meant if the game tactic had a name given to it by Total War players
Its called the LegendsTW
I’m trying to decide if dwarf rifles, iron drakes, or shotguns would be a better Frontline
I would say depending on the enemy you're fighting, Iron Drakes with the flamethrowers would be better against lightly armoured enemies, while the Thunderers with Shotguns are better against heavy armour. Rifles will have more range and so may be good for a middle ground generalist option
Shotguns are better on the flanks that can stop/ knock enemies over as for as dps goes shotguns are the best frfr there fire rate insane
@@trevorbanks4136 my idea is to replace melee infantry with straight shooters with archers, rangers, & artillery behind them
Can you use the same tactics in Warhammer 2?
Absolutely, the same basic principles will apply
The Road block seems very effective, and the Killzone seems even doable for the empire with the new Nuln-Ironsides.
The last one, the Gunpowder Wedge-
I really, really like that one!
Of course as Empire, we need dwarfs on the front -so we can shoot over them- because only Dwarfs can hold it long enough!
And i think it is crucial for this position to kill enemy mages fast. Wind Magic killing 4 front Units compleetly destroys this formation 🤔
So may better only use it, if the enemy has no damage-mage.
Haha Dwarfs make everything better! And yeah depending on the spells they have an enemy wizard is target priority one, as Empire maybe some Outriders to try and assassinate them
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I think your formations are too static. Utilize cavalry or chariots with "Fire whilst moving" to lure enemies from engaging your front line, giving your ranged units more time to shoot them down.
Yup you can always add in whatever you like, these are just basic examples
Its just too bad that the AI doesnt give a flying F about your formations and can infinitely thread its melee units into any gap while engaged and stop your units from shooting effectively, regardless of how small that gap is. This stuff only works if you make the AI prioritize something other than your ranged units.
I'd love to see your gunpowder tactics in an Otomo clan run in shogun 2. I'll be trying it out myself. Especially the tercio since shogun doesn't have dragons
I've never played Shogun 2 but heard amazing things about it, I'll have to check it out