The constant use of holding Mayas family hostage just for the same result every time was super frustrating . This shows ending was just so unsatisfying and everything felt super rushed and messy. Definitely one of the better Disney+ shows(ep1-4)but that isn’t really saying much
I disagree. The ending was more than satisfying cause it fucking ended lmfaooo this show honestly was one of the worst put together shows I’ve seen in a long time
Certainly one way to look at it. I couldn’t agree more about how awful this show was put together. For a show that felt like it had cut episodes, it sure is filled with alot of unnecessary and repetitive bs
What makes kingpin in Netflix better was the fact that he could just snap at any moment with rage, and you felt he was an extremely unstable man under his calm controlled facade. In dplus they try to make him like that, but he feels softer, like in he doesn’t put you on edge, and the scene where maya gets in his head and almost gives him a moment to let go and redeem his past acts, feels a little to sympathetic for me, the sympathetic side outweighs the more aggressive and emotionally unstable side, he doesn’t feel as evil, like he’s hiding all this pain and when he lets it out he lets it out, by the end of s3 of daredevil you want this guy to be taken away or stopped as he just won’t quit, with disneys kingpin although he’s most likely the same version, he comes across as much less ferocious and it sucks hopefully in daredevil born again they can rectify this and truly expand and make him the threat he should be to our heroes
Haven’t watched the show, gonna do it like tn I think. but based off the info we’ve gotten, I think that’s bc, he basically raised Maya, like that girl, is basically his child. And that’s why we’re getting to see that soft, sympathetic, sweeter side, before he most likely goes back to that, sadistic, unstable, unhinged man. Also, it gives him more depth as a character, and more we get to connect with, (and to) I’ve liked the characterization of him up to this point, will update after I finish the show.
@@00pium_kingvampstanI finished the show and without spoiling ofc it will be interesting to see peoples reactions to what they have done with kingpins character 😂.
@@00pium_kingvampstanAnd we saw in the Netflix show that he had a softer side with Vanessa, and he’d only known her for a short while. He’s known Maya since she was a kid, like you said.
@@handlebarsmustachehonestly bro, they should save norman for spidey or something spidey related, as much as I want the sentry bodyguard gimmick, it’s too soon for Norman
Not alien race - that first scene was a rendition of the Choctaw creation story. They were ancestral clay people coming from underground and when emerged on the surface they changed into human form. Many indigenous creation stories are similar in the way that they say we came from the Earth. This was confirmed by the Choctaw cultural consultants who worked on the film.
As a Native American who watched these episodes, I appreciated it for what it was. The way you felt about Blue Beetle is the way I felt about this show. There were some things when she goes home that were funny because I understood the language & references which probably didn’t reach to others. I agree with another comment, they didn’t clearly explain what the beginning means as the legend of the beginning of our people but we “Natives” got it. I’m just glad we finally got some representation in the MCU.
Amen to that, sister me as a Puerto rican of the Indigenous Taino tribe and of mexican descent the Mexican my father I was so glad that Marvel gave us representation in both blue beetle and this amazing show
One thing in this show I found odd was that kingpin is simply not threatening. In Daredevil every time he stepped on screen I was scared, fearing at any moment he would lash out and someone would just get brutally murdered. In here he just didn’t feel that menacing
I mean he's trying to get his daughter back so I think it's understandable how he was trying to be more nice. They could have killed one of the side characters but maya would barley have any good tike to process it since it was a 5 episode long show. He killed the ice cream dude.
@@cngotham4111 that is not a justification. this side of him was explored well in Daredevil without making him a total pussy. this is why writing is an actual job and not a side hustle
@@mlag8858 it was kinda explored but not really he acted like a big baby at times in daredevil as well. I don't see him as a pussy I see him as an emotional unstable mess
Normally, editing doesn't bother me. Sure, I can recognize when editing is bad and it hinders my enjoyment, but this show REALLY stood out with it's terrible editing. Especially during the roller-rink
@@juggernogdc123 exactly. there was a medium wide shot of echo fighting someone against lockers, and with every hit, the cuts jolted us to the next hit 3 feet down the row of lockers. it was bizarre
So I am Choctaw native. And I'm a little disappointed in you seeing that I believe you have Mesoamerican Heritage which is indigenous itself. A lot of different native tribes have a lot of Mythology with connection to their ancestors and that's what these people represented in the flashbacks. The power statement come from nowhere it came from literally the spirits of her ancestors.
The director said her powers were lame so she wanted them to change, also the anscestors that looked like aliens are acrtually supposed to be the original choctaw people rising from the Earth, it a really old story passed down by song, dance, and verbally.
The way I see the mind scene at the end and why it didn't really have any bearings on Fisk, it wasn't for him. It was for Maya. She had to let go of all that anger and hurt. Yes, she said for him to do that, but I feel like it was her letting go. She realised that hating him and wanting to kill him was only hurting her, and that letting that go was the only way past this.
I feel it’s a baby step in the right direction for what’s to come with marvel tv-ma revival. I won’t personally won’t lose hope until Daredevil Born Again. I feel this one has success to it and some small learning curves that could go a long way
Technically Disney plus was made for secondary characters that didn’t needed or couldn’t have a movie made for them so Echo fits that way. The parts I didn’t like was the grandma and the cousin getting powers because like in Secret Inventions as soon as you get powers you know how to use them which makes no sense. I did appreciate that it was 5 episodes and I did one full binge instead of going week to week.
I’m Navajo and I understand the traditions and my heritage as well as other tribes. First of all, I love the representation in the show and how accurate the language and culture is represented. However, it is confusing because they did not explain the story of her ancestors very well. It’s understandable from a Native American’s perspective but not other ethnicities. I wish they explained it better and told the story more in depth. The ending was rushed and I wished they made a fight scene between Maya and Kingpin then show off her supernatural powers. That’s the other issue with the character. They never really explained her powers and abilities. They hinted at super strength but they never really showed it. Of course she has healing and spiritual powers but it wasn’t used to its full potential. It would’ve been a great ending if there was a fight scene and she used both her super strength and abilities then eventually her spiritual powers. It was rushed and I felt like they avoided the OP controversy that Secret Invasion delt with. It was a good show but I do agree that there was some elements that did not fit in very well. Shoutout the familiar Indigenous actors. I’m very glad to see them on a big show like this 🙌🏽 Alaqua Cox is phenomenal. I want to see more of her in future shows/movies but with her full powers and a better costume. I liked it at first but seeing it on her just didn’t seem right. Something about it was off.. idk but it needed to be better. Great review though 👏🏽
I thought they would have revealed that Kingpin knew sign language the whole time like how he could always speak Mandarin and Japanese in Daredevil showing there is more to him than the audience originally thought. Hope they redeem Kingpin in Daredevil Born Again or Spider Man 4 but I can't say I have high hopes. Either use him right or don't use him.
Sorry guys, i also enjoyed the fight scenes. It was never going to match Daredevil series fight-wise so i don't understand the comparison. Maya's character arc is she re-connected to her spiritual and ancestral lineage ancestors which gave her the inspiration to change what she wants to become... This is why she changed and choose to become a hero and not a queenpin.
Man, I've had such a rough year and a half. Your videos help with this depression I've been going through. Thank you for the positive videos and for helping me get by. You the man Chris!
I thoroughly enjoyed Echo as a show, but I do think it had a lot of problems, but thankfully, a lot of those problems are strictly tied to the amount of time they had and going into Daredevil Born Again I really don't think they're going to have that problem anymore because they're bumping up the episode count from 5 to 18 episodes!
It is. It being TV-MA was one of the first things they announced for it along with it being 18 episodes long. And with a character named Muse being a villain or at least the main villain it's gotta be TV-MA
As a female member of the deaf community, I'd like to thank Disney for completely annihilating what could have been a badass character, and only alienating the deaf community even more with this pure horse shit show.
I love the stuff with her family but I agree with you the finale needed to be bigger bigger fight more action at least have kingpin getting knocked out by her I just needed more at the end
Yk they’re gonna change echo’s powers soon in the comics so she matches her mcu counterpart. This is most likely their plan from the beginning they just want to boost comic sales ig.
I give a 6.5. Some interesting stuff there with the native mysticism. But it didn’t really mesh well with the grittiness I was expecting. Excited about Fisk returning!
@@jonathansoko1085 i’m pretty sure they were well aware of the issues that Echo had months ago, and made the necessary re-shoots. In my opinion, it wasn’t enough. I hope that we get a really great story for daredevil, plus bringing back the street level vibe we liked in the Netflix shows.
I just wrapped up the whole show, and while I think it does have a lot of flaws, especially with its pacing and editing, I really did end up enjoying my time with it and especially a lot more and then a lot of other stuff Marvel has put out. I think they handled the legacy characters very well in this for the little screen time they had, and although it was short, I thought it was really well done and crafted with a lot of heart and passion. Comparing this to Thor 4 or Ant-Man 3 is like night and day because those movies that like corporate products well this one while very flawed felt like it was crafted with love and passion from day one especially everything with the Choctaw nation was awesome! 7.5/10!
It was good I enjoyed it. Nothing too crazy tho. Post credit scene got me pumped for born again. My main issue is the pacing of it but overall I thought it was pretty good but nothing crazy 👍🏽
It doesn't have all the glitz and glamour we usually get with the usual superheroes but as a Native American watching a show about a Native American character I got to say I enjoyed it!
Hey Chris! Love your videos, been watching since the beginning days. I was wondering if you could do an MCU streaming ranking? TV shows, and spotlight shows/movies?? I’m curious how you rank them from worst to best! Keep up the great content. It makes my work days go by much quicker! 😂
Just finished the Echo series. I have to admit, I really liked it. It wasn’t your normal MARVEL material, but it worked beautifully. It was a Modern myth. I liked that it was rated MA. They didn’t abuse it. And I thought all the performances were stellar. Just a really nice job. I will probably take a few days, and then watch it again.
Aww man i really enjoyed this show but agree with most of the points your making. I liked the family echo part though and th9ught even thiugh its the same marvel thing to do the costume reveal at the end, i thiught this was a good one. I also was caught off guard by the sudden end to the kingpin fight of him just getting in his car and leaving but im hoping daredevil will immediately pick right off from there with kingpins character, like maybe this was kind of a prequel story to Daredevil
I'm caught up enough as is right now, thank you Chris! This does give me hope though that Deadpool could actually be good, because with Marvel at the helm, I did not really have much faith in that. Now that I hear about the violence in this show, it does give me hope.
Echo hits EVERY diversity hire: Amputee. Deaf. Native American. Honestly, who cares about a Z character in the comics who shows up in 1 comic issue and isn't shown for another 5 years and was randomly in a Hawkeye tv show no one watched? Marvel execs must have been in heaven when she limped in.
this was one of my favorite shows marvel has done in a while... im usually not into female lead roles but this was actually fun to watch it had alot of emotion built into it .... maybe im bias cause of the native influence.
I think everything worked fine for me until the finale. It wasn’t bad… on its own it was okay (at least it didn’t do the CGI battle) but it didn’t really do a good job of tying everything together. Fisk’s character in the episode was weird, like different from himself in the others and the credits scene. My other gripe with the show is why Chula made the suit for Maya. It’s not like she was a superhero or anything
Everything worked fine? What? I dont mean this to offend you, but thats a cope. I wanted to love this show, i own mayas first appearence as echo, i read DD echo, im a fan. This show was a mistake and had some of the worst fights in history. I cant believe this came out
@@jonathansoko1085 - I expected to hate it... it worked fine for me... just as they said, not amazing. Better than She-hulk, Ms Marvel and Secret Invasion but not nearly as good as Loki.
@@jonathansoko1085 It had good fights though. Not the best, but watch agents of shield and come back, pls. Thats a cope. And yeah, everything worked fine. It could be better, but all was clear and there were no loose ends. Everything was done in character for all. It wasnt anything groundbreaking for any of the characters, but we learned a lot about Echo and Kingpin. I call that a win. Fine entry and nice addition to marvel lore
@@mike2687i would state it as much better than ms marvel and secret invasion, much much better than she hulk and then not nearly as good as loki due to the 5 episode length, if given maybe atleast 2 more episodes to flesh things out and delve further into the story it would have been atleast near to the loki season 1 for me personally because i think the writing, cinematography and editing of the show in the 5 episodes was really well done and it only suffers from the pacing issues and genric ending because of it only being 5 episodes, I dont really blame the writers for once, i blame marvel not putting enough trust/money into the show to give the creative team 7 episodes to work with instead
I completely agree with what Chris said 100%. Being a marvel fan and fan of the MCU, I can think of a number of characters that could have been pulled from phase 4 and lower phases and other shows we've watched in the past that could and would have helped build a future story alot better. The Echo series had some interesting points and scenes, but in a way, it felt like it was a rushed show with no real build, that Marvel/MCU execs thought could be interesting. This was definitely proven by how all 5 episodes were brought out at once for streaming where as all previous Marvel Shows were brought out 1 each week. I do think, if Marvel wanted to show more of Echos origin to the audience, they should have waited and added her in the upcoming Dare👹 show and Spiderman 4. A solo Echo show was, and i hate to say it, feeling like a way for Marvel to make a quick buck. The biggest take away I took from Echo, unfortunately, wasn't her origin or her tribe or how she got her powers, which Chris is correct in pointing out what her true powers in the comics are. The sad takeaway from this show was about Kingpin/Fisk and how they told his story and portrayed him, especially towards the end. With Thanos, as much disdain as you have for him, you can feel his pain for having to sacrifice his "daughter" Gamora. You don't get that same emotional feeling when watching Echo and Wilson fisk/Kingpin towards the end. It didn't help his character at all going forward with Marvel in shows and movies. Even the post credit scene was lackluster at best. I can see why it was done to have a bridge from this show to the upcoming Daredevil and Spiderman 4, but it, like the show, overall, left a bad taste in my mouth, so to speak. Very disappointed that I didn't like this show more. I wanted to, and felt it had potential upon hearing about its creation. The delivery, however, was honestly lackluster, and did anything but deliver. This is starting to feel like the case since Endgame came out with most shows and movies since, aside from a few. It's almost like the passion is gone now and Kevin Feige and other execs don't know what to do, even though I'm sure they planned for Phase 5 months and even years in advance.
This was not bad at all. I binged the whole thing tonight and enjoyed it a lot. There were some strange creative decisions that had me scratching my head a bit, and some scenes seemed very out of place and honestly low budget, but overall, I was entertained and even impressed with how much I ended up actually caring about a character I barely even remembered from Hawkeye
Chris should do a tier list of the different Disney plus shows (or just marvel projects in general) and every time a new one comes out, add it to the list and see where he ranks it
This felt like a show that could’ve been like a 15 minute section or an episode of daredevil where maya is kingpins second in command and she is conflicted about kingpin and she has to go home to figure it out. Not a character u give a whole series to
I really enjoyed the show. I like how they showed her heritage. And she gets her strength from a long line of powerful women. But I also get what you are saying. Digging into everyone's background is getting quite tedious. Now, if they had Kahhori be a part of that heritage, it would have made sense of where her powers came from, and they wouldn't have had to dig that deep into the storyline. I feel that they are doing most of this mainly for non-comic book readers. So everyone feels included. They should make a show where each eps digged into one person's background, only showing where or how they became the way they are.
I liked the show overall but yeah, this show needed a main bad guy other than kingpin. A ronan the accuser to kingpin's thanos if you will. Someone sent by fisk to get maya with instructions not to harm her but that he ends up going rogue and effing her up a bit. Maybe by the end maya can still choose not to kill but still wins, and then fisk shows up and just goes medieval on his ass. The problem with fisk is that he can't win, he can't die, people would get mad if he loses a fight to echo, like kang losing to ant man... so there's no good way to go with him, unless he's just pulling the strings. Honestly, eventhough the final fight was a bit of a let down, it wasn't a bad idea to defeat him in a psychological way.
I was good for the first couple of episodes, even tho that first shot of the ancestral aliens did let me know that this was going to go into cornball territory. Strike one was the roller skate MacGuyver nailgun, strike two was grandma glow punch. Strike three was the totally forced nonsense, no stakes, no repercussions conclusion to the show. They also could have kept the THEME of generational love/wisdom echoing in our protagonist without tying that idea to totally corny glowy vague superpowers of whatever is convenient in the moment. Oof. Also not enough Billy Jack. 🐶
Ok, did anybody else notice the news broadcast in the post-credits was basically talking directly to Fisk?! Broadcaster: 'Yeah, New York is ready for a dark horse, an outsider, a real bare-knuckle brawler...who's really tall and scary...and bald and hates people in devil costumes!'
Tbh I liked it. I feel like the show gets held back by the KingPin henchmen, like just have Fisk instead & that would be fine. I think they could have delved more into her ancestors & history but that's just me. The fight scenes were decent I think the best fights happen near the first half of the season. The final episode didn't feel complete to me like I felt like there was more substance but it was left on the cutting floor. Overall it's decent but it could be better.
Yeah i can agree on alot of what you say, if anything i also would have liked them to explore the ancestral stuff more, have atleast a larger final episode aswell. Although i think those issues mainly stem from the fact the creative team were only given 5 episodes to work with, i believe the final ep was better executed than most of the other mcu shows though even if it did feel a bit flat. I also enjoyed the powers as it makes her unique when compared to other street level heroes. The pacing is the biggest problem with the show and the people that worked on it did an ffing great job with creating a story that was more compelling and interesting than i think people expected in such a short amount of time, the side charcaters were actually fun and enjoyable to watch. Kingpin i personally think was really awesome and i think he was on par with his daredevil moments. Echo/maya was much better and interesting than expected also and ide love for her to return in daredevil as a possible love interest or cameo appearance. I think it can still be better but i only see it being better if it had more episodes, for me the team who worked on it did the best they could with the 5 episode budget. If given more episodes and a higher budget im sure we would have seen more history on her ancestors and herself aswell as probably just an overall more impactful ending. Ide like to see Marion Dayre and Sydney Freeland work on a season 2 for echo and give them atleast 1 more episode this time, i think a season 2 would work really well, they could introduce new charcaters and build upon both maya/kingpin and other areas of america maybe idk. When ranking within marvel ide give it a 7.5/10 then ide give its a 6/10 when comparing to shows in general which i think isnt too harsh as i still really enjoyed what was given
As a fellow Native American, I appreciate the representation, but I have to agree that this particular show is not up to par. It's important for them to prioritize investing in strong writing and storytelling. I dislike when obvious identity politics overshadow the true purpose of a movie or show, which is to entertain the audience. Unfortunately, many of these shows and movies end up being forgettable as a result.
Absolutely loved the show! Glad my indigenous culture finally got some representation in superhero media. Long overdue considering so much of it stems from our land. I feel the last episode was rushed, and was a bit underwhelmed with the powers. Completely satisfied with the outcome
It ain't connecting that much to the MCU cause it's under the Marvel Spotlight banner which is mainly for shows and Movies believe mainly shows that aren't 100% connected to the broughter side of the MCU and are more so grounded shows
The main problem I saw with the show was that the writers seemed too focused on drawing attention to her native American heritage and disabilities then focusing on the story. For example, when she had her old leg smashed and got a superhero suit. With the leg, I thought dude was going to put a gun or grenade launcher in it that would pay off later on in the story given the massive focus on it's reconstruction. Instead it gets a retro makeover, goes right back under her pant leg, never to be seen or brought up again. Then her super hero suit was extremely cluttered. It was so authentic Native American that it didn't look like anything someone who was born after 1875 would wear. That and they didn't establish the superhuman powers in Hawkeye so it feels odd that a character who has already been through so much would suddenly be able to tap into them. She's not a high school girl she's an enforcer for the mob! She's been through all kinds of traumatic events! That and I didn't feel they did a good job setting up these radically different from the source material powers. I kept asking myself why she was called Echo and not something like Ancestoria. Also, the massive focus on her being deaf made the dialog a chore to endure. All the reading you have to do because characters refuse to use their mouths to speak and instead rely on subtitles and ASL made me feel like I was reading a book instead of watching a show. I've met deaf people before and they preferred if you spoke while they signed because they could read your lips and focus on facial expressions to judge emotion better than can be displayed in sign.
Thankyou for just reviewing the show instead of milking it like the rest of these channels and going episodes by episode. You pretty much summed up how I felt about the show but I think that the thing that pissed me off the most is that they had to show the only scene with daredevil even before the show came out just to gain attention and make people think like he’s really in it.
You look like the kind of person that's going to spend their life having epiphany after epiphany, always thinking you've finally worked out how to be a productive person, always thinking you've figured out how to attain your dreams. But you won't. This cycle of mediocrity isn't due to some obstacle. It's who you are. The problem with your dreams is the person that's having them is you
I feel bad because i actually really enjoyed the show. I do agree with some of the problems mentioned but that didn’t completely take me out of the show and I did actually stay invested in the main story and Maya and Wilson’s relationship.
I would’ve preferred they gave her the task master abilities tbh because with how bad task is in the mcu having a character even remotely as better than them as maya with those abilities would’ve been so refreshing
Lol so we all just finished binging it huh? Overall pretty easy going and fun and I really like king pins arc that being said it definitely isn’t perfect.
This was not a tvma show its a disney plus show with some blood. The show should've taken place in new york and focus on the criminal world. The fight scenes feel like im watching a turn based rpg. Marvel needs to embrace the dark and mature tone of these characters instead of watering them down the characters.
Very few buzzwords have me tuning out more than "stunning" "brave" "first" etc. Heard too many of these exact words leading up to this release, not watching. Thanks for the vid!
i mean i get having this mentality of wanting to be better by no longer killing but the fact that she just lets him go is so ridiculous; i mean why not at least have him arrested or something? he did attack her family & the powwow so there's definitely probably cause but apparently, franchise has got to franchise
Marvels What If is exactly how all the marvel disney+ shows should've been done. A self contained story that has no impact or influence on the MCU and is just a fun show to sit back relax and enjoy.
Really liked the show, better than most Disney plus shows we have had (I'm probably the only person who likes all of them) it no dare devil and it definitely more grounded, which i think is to its benefit, but its better than season 1 of iorn fist so thats good. I like how marvel has been incorporating disabilities and cultures in their shows and games lately, i hope to see more of that in born again (specifically the disability stuff).
WandaVision and Hawkeye have been the only Marvel week to week shows I’ve enjoyed. Haven’t gotten around to Echo yet, but probably will check it out as I much prefer being able to binge a whole show over the week to week format. Also on board for more adult oriented Disney content
I think Disney+ should release the content in the way that serves the story. I like that Echo was a binge drop EP 1 was essentially Issue #0 and was the weakest for me, but I like that it means you don't have to do the "homework." Episode 3 and 5 were my favorite The action was top tier
Honestly, I'm not that baffled with how Kingpin acted as much as others have been. I mean up to this point, Kingpin's only come against those that were just as grounded as he has been, and mostly in the same city too. He's never come up against something like what he was dealt with with Maya here. So I'm not too bothered seeing him act the way he did.
What’s wrong her in show? She literally same but more brutal, we saw how simlar she was to Fisk, her character was really fleshed out & grounded in this show
I say this with no hate or disrespect towards native Americans and what they believe in but in a TVMA street crime thriller as Chris calls it which has ‘The Kingpin’ in it, the whole ancestor power thing just doesn’t work at all. I wanted to see maya on the run from Fisk’s empire after her shooting him and at the end see her either team up with daredevil or it be more of a free for all between the 3 or something. A comic accurate suit as well would’ve been good and they made kingpin look like a pussy at the end of the show it took one traumatic memory and he’s running off. Such a letdown barely any gore or real interesting plot. Episode 1 had me hooked I really enjoyed that episode it was amazing but as time went on things just got confusing and boring. She blew up a train for no reason? She continuously cuts her sister off for no real reason, she argues every episode with that ice rink owner guy for no reason, she has superpowers for no reason. So many just strange plot holes and the pacing was rushed and all over the place reading the script would make my head turn upside down. However the no comedy in this only subtle jokes between family or friends in this is a step in the right direction. It needs a daredevil tone and daredevil writers they would’ve done kingpin and maya justice
It didn’t make sense for them to fight 😂, it breaks their character bc Fisk loves her & did a lot things bc of her, so did echo even they’re relationship wasn’t the best they love each other, they would never fight like in comics she could barely fight him bc every time they see father or daughter “not enemy” 😂
@@suhin74 wel then in that case why did they tease it with kingpins double fisted smash then, or they could have substituted it for another big fight scene
@@melonmanic bruh really wants an big fight 💀 even tho we got bunch in 1st 3 eps lol & king pin wasn’t even tease once he was gonna have big fight lmao, your just expecting way too much like bruh it’s your own fault at this point
Most of the shows should have been movies like Hawkeye, moon knight, and falcon and the winter soldier, fatws genuinely makes me mad that it was a show instead of a movie, it would have been a great movie, but it was ruined. Moon Knight I really liked and I was ok with it being a show, but he needs a movie, he’s too cool to be left on Disney plus
didn't Kingpin run for mayor in one of the Daredevil seasons already? Thanks for ur review! I was excited after the trailers but Im gonna lower my expectations now...
Kingpin hunts all the mystical street level villains and heroes, defenders versus sinister six? Vincent D’Onofrio‘s kingpin is now lusting over the power that Maya used on him to go back in his memories… Spider-Man iron fist Shang Chi maybe daredevil Luke Cage Mýa The new Kraven the Hunter Mysterio that’s a iffy one though. Y’all get what I’m putting down though. They’ve laid the groundwork a tad just been through some rough shows
It It could honestly have a John Wick type vibe where the mayor is sending out a bounty on these peoples heads and they have to go Captain America two splice with John Wick vibes on it
I don’t care what anyone says... Hawkeye, Shang-Chi, Ms.Marvel, Guardians3, WerewolfByNight, Spider-Man, Black Panther2 & Falcon were aaaall pure gold...Suck it haters 🤨...And people forget. With the exception of CaptainAmerica2 & Guardians, everyone thought Phase2 was Meh
i may be biased to say this, but i loved the series! down to the characters and finally seeing my native american culture being represented in the mcu. i don't care about anyone's opinions on the pacing or whatever. this show was for me to enjoy and it definitely did the job. so 100/10 for me 🪶 p.s. echo is a badass and that suit was beautifully made.
I think Marvel's finally starting to realize that they've been neglecting an entire portion of their fanbase that want mature Marvel content. The great thing about the comics were that while you had the darker adult storylines you also had the more lighthearted and comedic stuff. Now obviously making something mature doesn't necessarily guarantee that it's good, but it's a step in the right direction
I’m fairly certain if kingpin could learn Chinese and Japanese he could certainly learn how to sign He probably does, and he’s just hiding the fact like he did in season one of daredevil
The constant use of holding Mayas family hostage just for the same result every time was super frustrating . This shows ending was just so unsatisfying and everything felt super rushed and messy. Definitely one of the better Disney+ shows(ep1-4)but that isn’t really saying much
I disagree. The ending was more than satisfying cause it fucking ended lmfaooo this show honestly was one of the worst put together shows I’ve seen in a long time
Certainly one way to look at it. I couldn’t agree more about how awful this show was put together. For a show that felt like it had cut episodes, it sure is filled with alot of unnecessary and repetitive bs
It was (ep1-4) but I do think a 6th ep would help a lot
Word I thought one of them was going to die
Glowing strong arms… you obviously didn’t pay any attention to this show
What makes kingpin in Netflix better was the fact that he could just snap at any moment with rage, and you felt he was an extremely unstable man under his calm controlled facade. In dplus they try to make him like that, but he feels softer, like in he doesn’t put you on edge, and the scene where maya gets in his head and almost gives him a moment to let go and redeem his past acts, feels a little to sympathetic for me, the sympathetic side outweighs the more aggressive and emotionally unstable side, he doesn’t feel as evil, like he’s hiding all this pain and when he lets it out he lets it out, by the end of s3 of daredevil you want this guy to be taken away or stopped as he just won’t quit, with disneys kingpin although he’s most likely the same version, he comes across as much less ferocious and it sucks hopefully in daredevil born again they can rectify this and truly expand and make him the threat he should be to our heroes
Haven’t watched the show, gonna do it like tn I think. but based off the info we’ve gotten, I think that’s bc, he basically raised Maya, like that girl, is basically his child. And that’s why we’re getting to see that soft, sympathetic, sweeter side, before he most likely goes back to that, sadistic, unstable, unhinged man. Also, it gives him more depth as a character, and more we get to connect with, (and to) I’ve liked the characterization of him up to this point, will update after I finish the show.
@@00pium_kingvampstanI finished the show and without spoiling ofc it will be interesting to see peoples reactions to what they have done with kingpins character 😂.
@@00pium_kingvampstanAnd we saw in the Netflix show that he had a softer side with Vanessa, and he’d only known her for a short while. He’s known Maya since she was a kid, like you said.
He’s a good guy now basically
I was only watching 4 the Kingpin Character 😢 Thank U 4 Saving Me from a Let Down 😂😂😂😂😂@lilbubblegumleaks8104
Man if we get Devil’s Reign that could honestly be the focal point of Thunderbolts
What about Dark Avenger/Thunderbolts but with Kingpin instead of Norman Osborn🤔
@@handlebarsmustachehonestly bro, they should save norman for spidey or something spidey related, as much as I want the sentry bodyguard gimmick, it’s too soon for Norman
I mean he did say instead of norman @@ashwilliams4253
Not alien race - that first scene was a rendition of the Choctaw creation story. They were ancestral clay people coming from underground and when emerged on the surface they changed into human form. Many indigenous creation stories are similar in the way that they say we came from the Earth. This was confirmed by the Choctaw cultural consultants who worked on the film.
Thank you!
That actually makes me enjoy that aspect alot more now.
The last episode felt like it was written by an entirely different group of people
Did you watch episode 3?
@@burna21bitglazing 😂
As a Native American who watched these episodes, I appreciated it for what it was. The way you felt about Blue Beetle is the way I felt about this show. There were some things when she goes home that were funny because I understood the language & references which probably didn’t reach to others. I agree with another comment, they didn’t clearly explain what the beginning means as the legend of the beginning of our people but we “Natives” got it. I’m just glad we finally got some representation in the MCU.
Amen to that, sister me as a Puerto rican of the Indigenous Taino tribe and of mexican descent the Mexican my father I was so glad that Marvel gave us representation in both blue beetle and this amazing show
wtf lol....bro you're Puerto Rican, not Taino. relax.@@skylervalentinetoglia
In we go dear friend. In we go. To death. Together.
Heavy spoilers?!
One thing in this show I found odd was that kingpin is simply not threatening. In Daredevil every time he stepped on screen I was scared, fearing at any moment he would lash out and someone would just get brutally murdered. In here he just didn’t feel that menacing
I mean he's trying to get his daughter back so I think it's understandable how he was trying to be more nice. They could have killed one of the side characters but maya would barley have any good tike to process it since it was a 5 episode long show. He killed the ice cream dude.
@@cngotham4111 that is not a justification. this side of him was explored well in Daredevil without making him a total pussy. this is why writing is an actual job and not a side hustle
@@mlag8858 it was kinda explored but not really he acted like a big baby at times in daredevil as well. I don't see him as a pussy I see him as an emotional unstable mess
@@mlag8858He was literally simping for Vanessa what are you talking about 😂
@@MichaelWalker345 yeah and still threatening. good writing
that Kingpin impression was actually pretty good man.
Normally, editing doesn't bother me. Sure, I can recognize when editing is bad and it hinders my enjoyment, but this show REALLY stood out with it's terrible editing. Especially during the roller-rink
Agreed
Dude seriously...unnecessary cutting that just ruined the action scenes and so many continuity errors from scene to scene.
@@juggernogdc123 exactly. there was a medium wide shot of echo fighting someone against lockers, and with every hit, the cuts jolted us to the next hit 3 feet down the row of lockers. it was bizarre
So I am Choctaw native. And I'm a little disappointed in you seeing that I believe you have Mesoamerican Heritage which is indigenous itself. A lot of different native tribes have a lot of Mythology with connection to their ancestors and that's what these people represented in the flashbacks. The power statement come from nowhere it came from literally the spirits of her ancestors.
Happy New Year to u Chris brother and I'm glad u been still dropping fire content
I hope they bring back bullseye for Daredevil Born Again.
A guy gets blasted under the chin and there's zero blood. They can't even fully commit to a TV-MA show.
The director said her powers were lame so she wanted them to change, also the anscestors that looked like aliens are acrtually supposed to be the original choctaw people rising from the Earth, it a really old story passed down by song, dance, and verbally.
your kingpin impression actually made me think you played a scene from the series
😂😂😂 stop
@@3CFilms thats a quick reply, wasn't expecting a heart and reply but I'm serious you did well. love from singapore
@@3CFilmsIt was actually pretty good💀
Now I wanna see a fisk3c
Grandma gone be in secret wars 😭
The way I see the mind scene at the end and why it didn't really have any bearings on Fisk, it wasn't for him. It was for Maya. She had to let go of all that anger and hurt. Yes, she said for him to do that, but I feel like it was her letting go. She realised that hating him and wanting to kill him was only hurting her, and that letting that go was the only way past this.
I like how they reunited Graham Greene and Tantoo Cardinal, they played Sioux husband and wife way back in Dances With Wolves.
I feel it’s a baby step in the right direction for what’s to come with marvel tv-ma revival. I won’t personally won’t lose hope until Daredevil Born Again. I feel this one has success to it and some small learning curves that could go a long way
Technically Disney plus was made for secondary characters that didn’t needed or couldn’t have a movie made for them so Echo fits that way. The parts I didn’t like was the grandma and the cousin getting powers because like in Secret Inventions as soon as you get powers you know how to use them which makes no sense. I did appreciate that it was 5 episodes and I did one full binge instead of going week to week.
I wouldn’t even class echo as a secondary character🤷🏻♂️🤣
I’m Navajo and I understand the traditions and my heritage as well as other tribes. First of all, I love the representation in the show and how accurate the language and culture is represented.
However, it is confusing because they did not explain the story of her ancestors very well. It’s understandable from a Native American’s perspective but not other ethnicities. I wish they explained it better and told the story more in depth.
The ending was rushed and I wished they made a fight scene between Maya and Kingpin then show off her supernatural powers.
That’s the other issue with the character. They never really explained her powers and abilities. They hinted at super strength but they never really showed it. Of course she has healing and spiritual powers but it wasn’t used to its full potential.
It would’ve been a great ending if there was a fight scene and she used both her super strength and abilities then eventually her spiritual powers. It was rushed and I felt like they avoided the OP controversy that Secret Invasion delt with.
It was a good show but I do agree that there was some elements that did not fit in very well.
Shoutout the familiar Indigenous actors. I’m very glad to see them on a big show like this 🙌🏽
Alaqua Cox is phenomenal. I want to see more of her in future shows/movies but with her full powers and a better costume. I liked it at first but seeing it on her just didn’t seem right. Something about it was off.. idk but it needed to be better.
Great review though 👏🏽
I thought they would have revealed that Kingpin knew sign language the whole time like how he could always speak Mandarin and Japanese in Daredevil showing there is more to him than the audience originally thought. Hope they redeem Kingpin in Daredevil Born Again or Spider Man 4 but I can't say I have high hopes. Either use him right or don't use him.
I think him not bothering to learn it shows how he's manulative and narcissistic.
Sorry guys, i also enjoyed the fight scenes. It was never going to match Daredevil series fight-wise so i don't understand the comparison.
Maya's character arc is she re-connected to her spiritual and ancestral lineage ancestors which gave her the inspiration to change what she wants to become... This is why she changed and choose to become a hero and not a queenpin.
WHY couldn’t it compare to the DD fights? They couldn’t get a thirteen year old to tell them whiffing air does not need a punch sound?
MCU phase 4 and 5 trash
@@申月営無営月無営有申Detailed opinion man
Man, I've had such a rough year and a half. Your videos help with this depression I've been going through. Thank you for the positive videos and for helping me get by. You the man Chris!
I hope they make daredevil born again TV-MA because this show is soooo goood
I thoroughly enjoyed Echo as a show, but I do think it had a lot of problems, but thankfully, a lot of those problems are strictly tied to the amount of time they had and going into Daredevil Born Again I really don't think they're going to have that problem anymore because they're bumping up the episode count from 5 to 18 episodes!
It is. It being TV-MA was one of the first things they announced for it along with it being 18 episodes long. And with a character named Muse being a villain or at least the main villain it's gotta be TV-MA
I mean there’s almost nothing about this show that earns the TV MA rating
@@btafbmDD will need an R18 rating.
Facts 💯
As a female member of the deaf community, I'd like to thank Disney for completely annihilating what could have been a badass character, and only alienating the deaf community even more with this pure horse shit show.
After seeing Echo last night... I'm very concerned about what they'll do with Daredevil.
I love the stuff with her family but I agree with you the finale needed to be bigger bigger fight more action at least have kingpin getting knocked out by her I just needed more at the end
Yk they’re gonna change echo’s powers soon in the comics so she matches her mcu counterpart. This is most likely their plan from the beginning they just want to boost comic sales ig.
I give a 6.5. Some interesting stuff there with the native mysticism. But it didn’t really mesh well with the grittiness I was expecting. Excited about Fisk returning!
6.5 out of a hundred.
There was no grittyness to be had here
@@jonathansoko1085 i’m pretty sure they were well aware of the issues that Echo had months ago, and made the necessary re-shoots. In my opinion, it wasn’t enough. I hope that we get a really great story for daredevil, plus bringing back the street level vibe we liked in the Netflix shows.
@@jonathansoko1085what the hell were you watching? It was gritty and there was a lot of violence.
@@murk4552 Did you watch it with your eyes closed? Serious question. Is the bar that low
Warner Bros. Pulls Bong Joon-ho’s ‘Mickey 17’ From Release Schedule, Moves Up ‘Godzilla x Kong: The New Empire😮😮😮😮
I just wrapped up the whole show, and while I think it does have a lot of flaws, especially with its pacing and editing, I really did end up enjoying my time with it and especially a lot more and then a lot of other stuff Marvel has put out. I think they handled the legacy characters very well in this for the little screen time they had, and although it was short, I thought it was really well done and crafted with a lot of heart and passion. Comparing this to Thor 4 or Ant-Man 3 is like night and day because those movies that like corporate products well this one while very flawed felt like it was crafted with love and passion from day one especially everything with the Choctaw nation was awesome!
7.5/10!
I wholeheartedly agree
It was good I enjoyed it. Nothing too crazy tho. Post credit scene got me pumped for born again. My main issue is the pacing of it but overall I thought it was pretty good but nothing crazy 👍🏽
So mid
It doesn't have all the glitz and glamour we usually get with the usual superheroes but as a Native American watching a show about a Native American character I got to say I enjoyed it!
Hey Chris! Love your videos, been watching since the beginning days. I was wondering if you could do an MCU streaming ranking? TV shows, and spotlight shows/movies?? I’m curious how you rank them from worst to best! Keep up the great content. It makes my work days go by much quicker! 😂
Just finished the Echo series. I have to admit, I really liked it. It wasn’t your normal MARVEL material, but it worked beautifully. It was a Modern myth. I liked that it was rated MA. They didn’t abuse it. And I thought all the performances were stellar. Just a really nice job. I will probably take a few days, and then watch it again.
Wish it was more grounded. I personally didn't like the super natural elements. At least link kahhori (from what if) in
Agree, I would of preferred something more grounded
Disagree
Aww man i really enjoyed this show but agree with most of the points your making. I liked the family echo part though and th9ught even thiugh its the same marvel thing to do the costume reveal at the end, i thiught this was a good one. I also was caught off guard by the sudden end to the kingpin fight of him just getting in his car and leaving but im hoping daredevil will immediately pick right off from there with kingpins character, like maybe this was kind of a prequel story to Daredevil
I'm caught up enough as is right now, thank you Chris! This does give me hope though that Deadpool could actually be good, because with Marvel at the helm, I did not really have much faith in that. Now that I hear about the violence in this show, it does give me hope.
Echo hits EVERY diversity hire: Amputee. Deaf. Native American. Honestly, who cares about a Z character in the comics who shows up in 1 comic issue and isn't shown for another 5 years and was randomly in a Hawkeye tv show no one watched?
Marvel execs must have been in heaven when she limped in.
I watch everything marvel fake one
that finale scene with her and Fisk was awkward af😂
Agreed
What happened
It was god damn horrible
My eyes are still bleeding 👀
@@LSDJ4YYou're completely delusional
this was one of my favorite shows marvel has done in a while... im usually not into female lead roles but this was actually fun to watch it had alot of emotion built into it .... maybe im bias cause of the native influence.
I think everything worked fine for me until the finale. It wasn’t bad… on its own it was okay (at least it didn’t do the CGI battle) but it didn’t really do a good job of tying everything together. Fisk’s character in the episode was weird, like different from himself in the others and the credits scene. My other gripe with the show is why Chula made the suit for Maya. It’s not like she was a superhero or anything
Everything worked fine? What? I dont mean this to offend you, but thats a cope. I wanted to love this show, i own mayas first appearence as echo, i read DD echo, im a fan. This show was a mistake and had some of the worst fights in history. I cant believe this came out
@@jonathansoko1085 For me man. It’s a subjective opinion. And I don’t mean everything was amazing, it was okay
@@jonathansoko1085 - I expected to hate it... it worked fine for me... just as they said, not amazing. Better than She-hulk, Ms Marvel and Secret Invasion but not nearly as good as Loki.
@@jonathansoko1085 It had good fights though. Not the best, but watch agents of shield and come back, pls. Thats a cope. And yeah, everything worked fine. It could be better, but all was clear and there were no loose ends. Everything was done in character for all. It wasnt anything groundbreaking for any of the characters, but we learned a lot about Echo and Kingpin. I call that a win. Fine entry and nice addition to marvel lore
@@mike2687i would state it as much better than ms marvel and secret invasion, much much better than she hulk and then not nearly as good as loki due to the 5 episode length, if given maybe atleast 2 more episodes to flesh things out and delve further into the story it would have been atleast near to the loki season 1 for me personally because i think the writing, cinematography and editing of the show in the 5 episodes was really well done and it only suffers from the pacing issues and genric ending because of it only being 5 episodes, I dont really blame the writers for once, i blame marvel not putting enough trust/money into the show to give the creative team 7 episodes to work with instead
I completely agree with what Chris said 100%. Being a marvel fan and fan of the MCU, I can think of a number of characters that could have been pulled from phase 4 and lower phases and other shows we've watched in the past that could and would have helped build a future story alot better. The Echo series had some interesting points and scenes, but in a way, it felt like it was a rushed show with no real build, that Marvel/MCU execs thought could be interesting. This was definitely proven by how all 5 episodes were brought out at once for streaming where as all previous Marvel Shows were brought out 1 each week. I do think, if Marvel wanted to show more of Echos origin to the audience, they should have waited and added her in the upcoming Dare👹 show and Spiderman 4. A solo Echo show was, and i hate to say it, feeling like a way for Marvel to make a quick buck. The biggest take away I took from Echo, unfortunately, wasn't her origin or her tribe or how she got her powers, which Chris is correct in pointing out what her true powers in the comics are. The sad takeaway from this show was about Kingpin/Fisk and how they told his story and portrayed him, especially towards the end. With Thanos, as much disdain as you have for him, you can feel his pain for having to sacrifice his "daughter" Gamora. You don't get that same emotional feeling when watching Echo and Wilson fisk/Kingpin towards the end. It didn't help his character at all going forward with Marvel in shows and movies. Even the post credit scene was lackluster at best. I can see why it was done to have a bridge from this show to the upcoming Daredevil and Spiderman 4, but it, like the show, overall, left a bad taste in my mouth, so to speak. Very disappointed that I didn't like this show more. I wanted to, and felt it had potential upon hearing about its creation. The delivery, however, was honestly lackluster, and did anything but deliver. This is starting to feel like the case since Endgame came out with most shows and movies since, aside from a few. It's almost like the passion is gone now and Kevin Feige and other execs don't know what to do, even though I'm sure they planned for Phase 5 months and even years in advance.
This was not bad at all. I binged the whole thing tonight and enjoyed it a lot. There were some strange creative decisions that had me scratching my head a bit, and some scenes seemed very out of place and honestly low budget, but overall, I was entertained and even impressed with how much I ended up actually caring about a character I barely even remembered from Hawkeye
Chris should do a tier list of the different Disney plus shows (or just marvel projects in general) and every time a new one comes out, add it to the list and see where he ranks it
I loved it just wish there was more dare devil and kingpin also before I didn’t care for maya but now I do she’s pretty cool
This felt like a show that could’ve been like a 15 minute section or an episode of daredevil where maya is kingpins second in command and she is conflicted about kingpin and she has to go home to figure it out. Not a character u give a whole series to
I liked this alot and somehow it didn’t seem rushed like other shows. Definitely picking up her solo series Comic
Facts 💯
I loved episodes 1-4 5 fell off for me
I really enjoyed the show. I like how they showed her heritage. And she gets her strength from a long line of powerful women. But I also get what you are saying. Digging into everyone's background is getting quite tedious. Now, if they had Kahhori be a part of that heritage, it would have made sense of where her powers came from, and they wouldn't have had to dig that deep into the storyline. I feel that they are doing most of this mainly for non-comic book readers. So everyone feels included.
They should make a show where each eps digged into one person's background, only showing where or how they became the way they are.
I hope they explain why he’s not in prison, which is where he was headed again at the end of daredevil
The part when lil Maya kicks the downed ice-cream Vendor was kind of funny
I liked the show overall but yeah, this show needed a main bad guy other than kingpin. A ronan the accuser to kingpin's thanos if you will. Someone sent by fisk to get maya with instructions not to harm her but that he ends up going rogue and effing her up a bit. Maybe by the end maya can still choose not to kill but still wins, and then fisk shows up and just goes medieval on his ass.
The problem with fisk is that he can't win, he can't die, people would get mad if he loses a fight to echo, like kang losing to ant man... so there's no good way to go with him, unless he's just pulling the strings. Honestly, eventhough the final fight was a bit of a let down, it wasn't a bad idea to defeat him in a psychological way.
Great points
I was good for the first couple of episodes, even tho that first shot of the ancestral aliens did let me know that this was going to go into cornball territory. Strike one was the roller skate MacGuyver nailgun, strike two was grandma glow punch. Strike three was the totally forced nonsense, no stakes, no repercussions conclusion to the show. They also could have kept the THEME of generational love/wisdom echoing in our protagonist without tying that idea to totally corny glowy vague superpowers of whatever is convenient in the moment. Oof. Also not enough Billy Jack. 🐶
Ok, did anybody else notice the news broadcast in the post-credits was basically talking directly to Fisk?! Broadcaster: 'Yeah, New York is ready for a dark horse, an outsider, a real bare-knuckle brawler...who's really tall and scary...and bald and hates people in devil costumes!'
I really like Echo as a character... If they go to more street level shows I think she should pop up more.... Really dope character...
Tbh I liked it. I feel like the show gets held back by the KingPin henchmen, like just have Fisk instead & that would be fine. I think they could have delved more into her ancestors & history but that's just me.
The fight scenes were decent I think the best fights happen near the first half of the season. The final episode didn't feel complete to me like I felt like there was more substance but it was left on the cutting floor. Overall it's decent but it could be better.
It’s ok not decent.
@@jingleballs9935 - both of those words are subjective just as the opinion that lead to them... for many, ok/decent carry the same weight.
Yeah i can agree on alot of what you say, if anything i also would have liked them to explore the ancestral stuff more, have atleast a larger final episode aswell. Although i think those issues mainly stem from the fact the creative team were only given 5 episodes to work with, i believe the final ep was better executed than most of the other mcu shows though even if it did feel a bit flat. I also enjoyed the powers as it makes her unique when compared to other street level heroes. The pacing is the biggest problem with the show and the people that worked on it did an ffing great job with creating a story that was more compelling and interesting than i think people expected in such a short amount of time, the side charcaters were actually fun and enjoyable to watch. Kingpin i personally think was really awesome and i think he was on par with his daredevil moments. Echo/maya was much better and interesting than expected also and ide love for her to return in daredevil as a possible love interest or cameo appearance. I think it can still be better but i only see it being better if it had more episodes, for me the team who worked on it did the best they could with the 5 episode budget. If given more episodes and a higher budget im sure we would have seen more history on her ancestors and herself aswell as probably just an overall more impactful ending. Ide like to see Marion Dayre and Sydney Freeland work on a season 2 for echo and give them atleast 1 more episode this time, i think a season 2 would work really well, they could introduce new charcaters and build upon both maya/kingpin and other areas of america maybe idk. When ranking within marvel ide give it a 7.5/10 then ide give its a 6/10 when comparing to shows in general which i think isnt too harsh as i still really enjoyed what was given
As a fellow Native American, I appreciate the representation, but I have to agree that this particular show is not up to par. It's important for them to prioritize investing in strong writing and storytelling. I dislike when obvious identity politics overshadow the true purpose of a movie or show, which is to entertain the audience. Unfortunately, many of these shows and movies end up being forgettable as a result.
Absolutely loved the show! Glad my indigenous culture finally got some representation in superhero media. Long overdue considering so much of it stems from our land. I feel the last episode was rushed, and was a bit underwhelmed with the powers. Completely satisfied with the outcome
what?? lol. "stems from our land?"
Your voice makes these reactions sound funny no disrespect chris you the man bro 👍🙏🔥🍿🎥🎬
How is this show not connecting...when they bait kingpin and daredevil and recap Hawkeye?? How is this not connecting
It ain't connecting that much to the MCU cause it's under the Marvel Spotlight banner which is mainly for shows and Movies believe mainly shows that aren't 100% connected to the broughter side of the MCU and are more so grounded shows
Not connecting as in it's unrelated to main theme. Right now Multiverse is the theme but Echo has nothing to do with it.
If they keep Daredevil this good, I'll be happy.
The main problem I saw with the show was that the writers seemed too focused on drawing attention to her native American heritage and disabilities then focusing on the story. For example, when she had her old leg smashed and got a superhero suit. With the leg, I thought dude was going to put a gun or grenade launcher in it that would pay off later on in the story given the massive focus on it's reconstruction. Instead it gets a retro makeover, goes right back under her pant leg, never to be seen or brought up again. Then her super hero suit was extremely cluttered. It was so authentic Native American that it didn't look like anything someone who was born after 1875 would wear. That and they didn't establish the superhuman powers in Hawkeye so it feels odd that a character who has already been through so much would suddenly be able to tap into them. She's not a high school girl she's an enforcer for the mob! She's been through all kinds of traumatic events! That and I didn't feel they did a good job setting up these radically different from the source material powers. I kept asking myself why she was called Echo and not something like Ancestoria. Also, the massive focus on her being deaf made the dialog a chore to endure. All the reading you have to do because characters refuse to use their mouths to speak and instead rely on subtitles and ASL made me feel like I was reading a book instead of watching a show. I've met deaf people before and they preferred if you spoke while they signed because they could read your lips and focus on facial expressions to judge emotion better than can be displayed in sign.
Thankyou for just reviewing the show instead of milking it like the rest of these channels and going episodes by episode. You pretty much summed up how I felt about the show but I think that the thing that pissed me off the most is that they had to show the only scene with daredevil even before the show came out just to gain attention and make people think like he’s really in it.
You look like the kind of person that's going to spend their life having epiphany after epiphany, always thinking you've finally worked out how to be a productive person, always thinking you've figured out how to attain your dreams.
But you won't. This cycle of mediocrity isn't due to some obstacle. It's who you are.
The problem with your dreams is the person that's having them is you
@@kiwiangeldust6912 all right -don't ask questions, consume the product and get excited for the next product-NPC
I feel bad because i actually really enjoyed the show. I do agree with some of the problems mentioned but that didn’t completely take me out of the show and I did actually stay invested in the main story and Maya and Wilson’s relationship.
defiantly more rated R content. and ALL streaming services needs to release episode all at once(like Netflix), we are paying for it
I would’ve preferred they gave her the task master abilities tbh because with how bad task is in the mcu having a character even remotely as better than them as maya with those abilities would’ve been so refreshing
Lol so we all just finished binging it huh? Overall pretty easy going and fun and I really like king pins arc that being said it definitely isn’t perfect.
This was not a tvma show its a disney plus show with some blood. The show should've taken place in new york and focus on the criminal world.
The fight scenes feel like im watching a turn based rpg.
Marvel needs to embrace the dark and mature tone of these characters instead of watering them down the characters.
Very few buzzwords have me tuning out more than "stunning" "brave" "first" etc. Heard too many of these exact words leading up to this release, not watching. Thanks for the vid!
i mean i get having this mentality of wanting to be better by no longer killing but the fact that she just lets him go is so ridiculous; i mean why not at least have him arrested or something? he did attack her family & the powwow so there's definitely probably cause but apparently, franchise has got to franchise
Marvels What If is exactly how all the marvel disney+ shows should've been done. A self contained story that has no impact or influence on the MCU and is just a fun show to sit back relax and enjoy.
Grandma getting powers was the final nail in the coffin for me… lolololol hahahahaha 🤣🤣🤣🤣 ECHO SUCKS! DEAL WITH IT 🤷🏻♂️
Really liked the show, better than most Disney plus shows we have had (I'm probably the only person who likes all of them) it no dare devil and it definitely more grounded, which i think is to its benefit, but its better than season 1 of iorn fist so thats good. I like how marvel has been incorporating disabilities and cultures in their shows and games lately, i hope to see more of that in born again (specifically the disability stuff).
I think its positive that it does weirdly connect to the MCU more than any show they've made. Having watched just the first episode, mind you.
I'm with you. bruh. If Disney stops making shows, I will be more than satisfied.
Your kingpin voice was great. Very on point. 😂 Should use it more bro 👍
WandaVision and Hawkeye have been the only Marvel week to week shows I’ve enjoyed. Haven’t gotten around to Echo yet, but probably will check it out as I much prefer being able to binge a whole show over the week to week format. Also on board for more adult oriented Disney content
Hardly adult oriented, really don't know why they have to give viewer discretion for this
And Loki
@@Comicedits39 what?
@@Comicedits39and Loki what? I didn’t care for it personally
@@Dyl-275Fair. I guess I could have worded it better
Here comes “That crowd” when they see her get superpowers lmfaoooo
I honestly loved echo season 1 I loved the whole Native American stuff
I think Disney+ should release the content in the way that serves the story. I like that Echo was a binge drop
EP 1 was essentially Issue #0 and was the weakest for me, but I like that it means you don't have to do the "homework." Episode 3 and 5 were my favorite
The action was top tier
L take 3C
Honestly, I'm not that baffled with how Kingpin acted as much as others have been. I mean up to this point, Kingpin's only come against those that were just as grounded as he has been, and mostly in the same city too. He's never come up against something like what he was dealt with with Maya here. So I'm not too bothered seeing him act the way he did.
without daredevil and fisk i would have 0 interest in this show. i thought her character was dope in hawkeye idk what went wrong.
What’s wrong her in show? She literally same but more brutal, we saw how simlar she was to Fisk, her character was really fleshed out & grounded in this show
Awesome video 3c films
I say this with no hate or disrespect towards native Americans and what they believe in but in a TVMA street crime thriller as Chris calls it which has ‘The Kingpin’ in it, the whole ancestor power thing just doesn’t work at all. I wanted to see maya on the run from Fisk’s empire after her shooting him and at the end see her either team up with daredevil or it be more of a free for all between the 3 or something. A comic accurate suit as well would’ve been good and they made kingpin look like a pussy at the end of the show it took one traumatic memory and he’s running off. Such a letdown barely any gore or real interesting plot. Episode 1 had me hooked I really enjoyed that episode it was amazing but as time went on things just got confusing and boring. She blew up a train for no reason? She continuously cuts her sister off for no real reason, she argues every episode with that ice rink owner guy for no reason, she has superpowers for no reason. So many just strange plot holes and the pacing was rushed and all over the place reading the script would make my head turn upside down. However the no comedy in this only subtle jokes between family or friends in this is a step in the right direction. It needs a daredevil tone and daredevil writers they would’ve done kingpin and maya justice
David Bruckner will next write and direct a new version of The Blob for Warner Bros. Motion Picture Group.😊😊😊😊
I got cheated out of a kingpin vs echo fight and now I'm upset, 7 out of 10
It didn’t make sense for them to fight 😂, it breaks their character bc Fisk loves her & did a lot things bc of her, so did echo even they’re relationship wasn’t the best they love each other, they would never fight like in comics she could barely fight him bc every time they see father or daughter “not enemy” 😂
@@suhin74 wel then in that case why did they tease it with kingpins double fisted smash then, or they could have substituted it for another big fight scene
@@melonmanic bruh really wants an big fight 💀 even tho we got bunch in 1st 3 eps lol & king pin wasn’t even tease once he was gonna have big fight lmao, your just expecting way too much like bruh it’s your own fault at this point
@@suhin74 I suppose it to much to expect for a show with tons of action to end with a big fight scene, my bad
@@melonmanic the show was never advertised to have a lot fights tho????
Most of the shows should have been movies like Hawkeye, moon knight, and falcon and the winter soldier, fatws genuinely makes me mad that it was a show instead of a movie, it would have been a great movie, but it was ruined. Moon Knight I really liked and I was ok with it being a show, but he needs a movie, he’s too cool to be left on Disney plus
I was hoping they'd show him manipulate his way to becoming mayor but instead he just watches the news and is like "Okay Ill do it"
wtaf was the ending
kingpin did literally nothing and wasn’t threatening in any way, and why tf does maya get powers??
didn't Kingpin run for mayor in one of the Daredevil seasons already? Thanks for ur review! I was excited after the trailers but Im gonna lower my expectations now...
No he didn't . When we last saw him in the DD series he ended up back in prison.
@@DragonInfraXtremeRGT ah ok.
She didn't take him back to his childhood... she was trying to heal his trauma.
9:50 3C pin is the new threat of the mcu street universe
Her superpower seems to be running around with a gun out and not shooting it.
“Outlaw vigilantes in New York”… dude it’s outlaw everywhere already lol
Kingpin hunts all the mystical street level villains and heroes, defenders versus sinister six? Vincent D’Onofrio‘s kingpin is now lusting over the power that Maya used on him to go back in his memories… Spider-Man iron fist Shang Chi maybe daredevil Luke Cage Mýa The new Kraven the Hunter Mysterio that’s a iffy one though. Y’all get what I’m putting down though. They’ve laid the groundwork a tad just been through some rough shows
It It could honestly have a John Wick type vibe where the mayor is sending out a bounty on these peoples heads and they have to go Captain America two splice with John Wick vibes on it
I don’t care what anyone says...
Hawkeye, Shang-Chi, Ms.Marvel, Guardians3, WerewolfByNight, Spider-Man, Black Panther2 & Falcon were aaaall pure gold...Suck it haters 🤨...And people forget. With the exception of CaptainAmerica2 & Guardians, everyone thought Phase2 was Meh
i may be biased to say this, but i loved the series! down to the characters and finally seeing my native american culture being represented in the mcu. i don't care about anyone's opinions on the pacing or whatever. this show was for me to enjoy and it definitely did the job. so 100/10 for me 🪶 p.s. echo is a badass and that suit was beautifully made.
No shame in it! The representation was awesome 🙌🏻
@@3CFilms yes it sure was! i even shed a tear just seeing my people dressed traditionally during the finale (powwow sequence) 🥲❤️
Ay no lie that suit is doo doo. Should have been comic one instead.
Well at least you were honest . But I don't care about representation . Representation doesn't make a show good.
You only “loved” the show because it represented your people that’s it. This show is trash
I think Marvel's finally starting to realize that they've been neglecting an entire portion of their fanbase that want mature Marvel content. The great thing about the comics were that while you had the darker adult storylines you also had the more lighthearted and comedic stuff. Now obviously making something mature doesn't necessarily guarantee that it's good, but it's a step in the right direction
I’m fairly certain if kingpin could learn Chinese and Japanese he could certainly learn how to sign
He probably does, and he’s just hiding the fact like he did in season one of daredevil