The traditional way is eldest male heir. Rhanerya was named heir because Viserys didn't have a male heir and didn't think he ever would. Traditionally, the Hightowers are correct. But they are committing Treason by going against the Kings wishes.
no nga. traditionally they are still wrong, alicents father was plotting against viserys the whole time by planning to take nyra out regardless. treason. kings word is absolute. greens have 0 claimed to the throne. its as simple as that.
@@Splicing_Darwinist uh uh stop nga. dont bring up other ish. The KING named nyra as his heir it's as simple as that. point blank period. and his and otto had been planing treason for a while about it.
To make a fair point for Alicent in episode three Viserys tells Alicent about his dream of Aegon being put on the thron with the Conquerors crown, he said the dream was so vivid it was like it was real so that probably stuck with Alicent all this time as well up until she misunderstood Viserys.
I think there’s multiple character that can be manipulative: - Otto manipulates Viserys and his daughter to place Aegon on the throne - Daemon manipulates Rhaenyra the entire first half of season 1 - Rhaenyra manipulates her court to shield the fact that her sons are bastards
How did Daemon manipulate Rhaenyra? And how did Rhaenyra manipulate the court when everyone threw it to her face that her children are bastards?? The only manipulative and the real player is Otto. Otto convinced Viserys to name Rhaenyra instead of Daemon even tho the whole council disagreed that a woman shouldn't be named, and once it was done he started telling people Rhaenyra shouldn't ascend the throne because she is a woman like dude bffr you did this and now he is gaslighting his daughter into thinking that the blacks reaction is evil and bad after they stole their right and killed a prince.
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c 1) Grooming is manipulation 2) Claiming that people telling the truth about your sons’s paternity are committing treason and getting your father the King to threaten to have the tongues of anyone who speaks the truth is manipulating a situation.
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c 1) Grooming is manipulation 2) Claiming that anyone who tells the truth about your children’s paternity is committing treason and getting your father, the King, to threaten to have the tongue of anyone who tells the truth is manipulating a situation.
I wish they had cast the people in the show to look like they did in the book. In the book it wouldn't have been easy to see any differences because Laenor and Corly's weren't black, also Raenys had black hair because of her parentage, it would have been more mysterious, more unknown.
@@user-sx6eu4rg2x tbf even in the book it’s quite clear. rhaenys has black hair because of her baratheon blood (and we know that this is unaltered all the way to the events of GoT). rhaenyra’s kids however have brown hair so it couldn’t have been from baratheon blood.
One thing Sophie got wrong is that the traditional line of succession is the oldest MALE, not the oldest child. If Viserys never named Rhaenyra heir, then the moment Aegon was born he would have automatically been the heir. She is only heir because he didn't think he'd have a son when he named her, and then when he did have a son, he CHOSE not to go the traditional way. Mair was actually right for once. That's the reason why most of the kingdom is backing the Greens at the moment, and it's hard for Rhaenyra to get more houses to back her.
It is tradition but the belief “no woman should rule” is not a thing for Targaryens. Misogyny is rampant in Westeros like the real world, it is the main driving force on why Westorosi men can not bring themselves to support Rhaenyra who was claimed heir by the King himself. Along with tradition also. This is why Aegon the Conqueror was King instead of Visenya who was both the brains and swords. They don’t know how to handle “change.” I know Rhaenyra is not the feminist icon we like to think she is, but whether she likes it or not, her ruling as Queen can definitely change things in Westeros and they don’t like that.
@@aztre "“no woman should rule” is not a thing for Targaryens." That doesn't matter. The Targs rule over Westeros and abide by their laws. Dont you know how hard it was for Aegon the Conquerer to marry his sisters? He went through hell to legalise incest and he could only accomplish that for his family and no one else. There is the andal law and there is the kings word. Viserys should've gone through all the measures (and more) so women could legally get inheritance. He did NONE of that and hoped his words would be enough. Clearly we see he was wrong.
@@rexibhazoboa7097 I'm not denying all that??? My point was that it's not just tradition, but also misogyny. I just wanted op to consider the misogynist aspect. I'm well aware Viserys was at fault. I believe his greatest mistake was marrying someone after announcing Rhaenyra as heir.
@@aztrethat’s not a fact women can rule when there no longer a true born son or a brother of the king or lord even bastards can rule as long a true born son or a lord brother is dead the law doesn’t say a woman can’t rule a son comes before the daughter do I agree with this nope it should be the first born child
@@aztre misogyny is hatred of women that’s the definition a lot of people just say it majority of cultures the line is past through the father to son line and that doesn’t make this culture misogynistic or they hate women I know plenty of cultures line is passed to the mother to daughters that’s the culture it doesn’t make this culture’s also bad I know plenty of patriarchal and matriarchal culture or society 99% of people wouldn’t even tell the difference between this two cultures you have to come from matriarchal society to know what to look for
Also worth noting that the issue with Rhaenyra siring bastards is not because she’s a woman, it’s because she’s made one the heir to the throne which is treason. Even in a patriarchal society like this a man making his bastards heir to the throne is a crime.
Well no because Kings could legitimise their bastards, BUT she can’t even admit she has bastards. Those times sexism was at its best and while a man could “father however many bastards he’d want” she would have to be disinherited (by the realm bc Viserys wouldn’t be able to change their option even as King this is why he never openly admitted it) and she’d be ruined, just because she’s a woman. So this bastards part is actually exploring sexism and how they treat men and women differently. I’m more with Rhenerya, it’s not these poor children’s fault and they shouldn’t be called bastards. This is why we left the term “bastards” in the medieval.
@@Nattiie Well, Rheanyra fucked her self hard with that beautiful decision. But Viserys could've been smart about it. Just like Aegon the Conquerer, He should have made an official change to the law of women inheriting the throne - or just inheriting their parents things. If successful (since incest was allowed, women ruling would have been allowed as well), the only thing left to do was to publicise that Rheanyra's first 3 children were bastards and her throne would go to the first of her and Daemon's child. The Velaryons would be pissed but they will be pissed at Laenor - so he can deal with that himself. Plus, they have another chance at the throne with Laena's children with Daemon. Now, you see way how Viserys could've prevented this if he was actually a decent king?
after viserys crawled crippled to the throne room to defend his daughter it is wild to think he would switch up that same night. lol. he had been saying she was the heir and standing on it for years and years and years and had ample time to change it but didn't.
This frustrating thing about Alicent thinking that Viserys named Aegon heir is show's innovation😐 ( no spoilers here, don't worry) In the book, the greens don't use it all, they know Viserys named Rhaenyra heir but they just think that his words don't matter, since Viserys didn't bother to change the law. I really dislike this change because it makes people ignore really great and complex reasons for the conflict. Now, all people watching this trailers scream " not your Aegon" or "you are wrong, you base your usurpation on lies!". It's so sad, dude. The greens actually have great reasons ( for their universe), like Aegon being the firstborn son, Rhaenyra having bastards, Daemon being bloodthirsty&dangerous. And also people often forget the fact that Viserys became king ONLY because he was a male.The previous king Jaehaerys got the throne for similar reason - male line over female .So Aegon bases his claim on precedent that was set by two previous kings. Also, Viserys named Rhaenyra heir before Aegon's birth. He did it because it wasn't clear whether she or Daemon was his heir. But Viserys didn't take away Aegon's birth right. The thing is,Aegon doesn't need to be named heir. He was born heir by default. All the first born sons are heirs till their right is taken away from them ( even Sam Tarly in GOT was forced to join Night Watch, because he was the heir his father didn't want). But at least this argument Otto mentions in episode 10.
As far as Alicent's inconsistency as a character goes I think part of the blame has to go on the writers. Also you are right about viserys being a horrible king but he's a horrible father too. He neglected all of his kids except rhaenyra because he felt guilty for killing his first wife. The king before Viserys had sons as well as daughters. He was a good father to his sons but not his daughters.
People have this false sense that viserys is a good person but a bad king, the truth of the matter is that viserys was a bad person but he was a coward and he had no cunning or wisdom.
He had sons! His oldest son Aemon (Caraxes rider) was Rhaenys father and his heir but he died. Baelon - Visery’s and Daemon’s dad was his next heir but he also died thus he had no heir. The old king had the choice to have Rhaeny’s his oldest grandchild be his heir but knew it will cause war so he let the great council decide who ended up picking Visery’s as his heir. Another fun fact, the old king had one daughter who was exiled to Exoss
Whether the King ever said that to Alicent on his death bed or not, it didn’t change anything at the end of the day. Otto already had a plan to take the throne as soon as the King past away. And Alicent wasn’t privy to that. I’m with Mair for sure, I lean towards team black but I’m not anywhere near completely on one side. I feel like when u do that it keeps u from watching with an open mind to seeing both sides.
Alicent told her child he will be the king when he was beating his meat at the window. In Laena's funeral, Aemond told Aegon to respect their sister because she is to be his QUEEN. How is that privy again?? Alicent would've put her son on the throne anyway, what she misunderstood in ep8 only made her not feel guilty for usurping the throne and give it to her rapist child after she decided to disown him the day before.
Alycent (A) has always been jealous of Rhaynera's (R) position from S1, revealed when she asked R, "aren't you concerned about your position?" (A)felt she deserved nobility, where as (R), to (A), took it for granted. She wanted the white hair and dragons, just like (R) said the other houses wanted. Calling (R) kids "plain featured. Shooting a dig at (R) saying "you Targaryens have peculiar habits." Then she marry her daughter to her son. It's funny that when (V) was talking to (R), she corrected him, in who he was speaking to; but (A) didn't. If (V) had said nothing to her, she would have went along with her father's plot after (V) died. She would have let her father talk her into it. Her father suggested she go to (V), but her intent is revealed when (V) asked if she had told (R) about their talks. She hadn't. She's a snake. What else could Otto spawn? That's why she keeps Criston Cole alive, that's why she's whoring her feet out, as if dude isn't reaching the same end if she just slept with him. Making herself feel innocent of the act. She's always hated (R).
" Aren't you concerned about your position " means that Alicent feels that she deserves nobility? How ? Wasn't Alicent 14 and already a noble girl, from a power house ?
@@SuperARCANGEL0 Allicent was the servent of Rhaynera and Alicent's father, a servent to the crown. The Targaryens was the crown. Her resentment of Rhaynera is revealed in her own words just before she cut Rhaynera, "I have done what was expected of me. Forever upholding the family, the kingdom, the Law. While you flaunt yours and do as you please..."
@@leliamiller1609 Servant, but she's still a noble lady. Every noble and folk in the land are theoretically servants of the crown She said that 15 years later, after Rhaenyra gets way with no reprimand from Viserys after her sons eye gets cut. Wasn't she also ignoring her father and favoring Rhaenyra in front of Viserys, around the time of your 1st example?
@@SuperARCANGEL0 Viserys tried to tell Allicent to shut up about Rhaynera's kids when he told her the story about the white horse. The kids were Targaryens and that is what mattered to Viserys. The Veleryons had the white hair, but they only obtained the dragons when they married into the Targaryen line. You mean when Alicent was prostituting her bedtime stories to Viserys and helping fix his toys?
The biggest finnesser in this series is Daemon, cuz he somehow has a mostly positive reputation in the fan base. Despite him murdering his wife, grooming his niece, dismembering criminals in the city watch, sleeping with Rhaenyra the night of his wife’s funeral, choking the heir to the throne, etc. This dude is trash!
Well you can thank matt smith charisma and acting for that dude stole the show in s1 n im pretty sure people like daemon not because he's a good person but an interesting character for sure.
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c they sure care about being good when it comes to Allicent and the greens lol. She’s a bit self interested and jealous cuz her life is shit, and that’s somehow made her more despised than an actual piece of crap like Daemon, whose only redeeming quality was being a decent brother.
Mair and Sophie- It's NOT going to go fast anymore. Each season from now on can only cover like a year. The whole Dance of Dragons saga is only about 3 years. So, it's about to go really slow. But A LOT happens in these next 3 years.
Sophie put yourself in Alicents position for a minute. If you were Alicent on Viserys deathbed and you`d hear Viserys words about Aegon. You would not think that he was talking about Aegon the Conquerer. You would think that he was talking about your son, too. Yeah it would be weired that Viserys changed his mind about the succesion. But is it possible? Yes it is. All what will happen next is based on misunderstanding because multiple Aegons exsist, and you have forces that belive in the traditional way versus against the will of the King. Mair is totally right
King Jaehaerys had sons but they all died before him. 24:39 The tradition of westeros is the eldest male inherits the throne. It wasn’t a law though. Alicent used the same system that she fell victim to onto others. Both Rhaenerya and Haelena. If Viserys had married Laena, the show would have went in another direction given laena and rhaenerya were close friends (basically best friends) Also Alicent claiming that viserys wanted aegon to inherit the throne is stupid bc he had ample time to change the succession and he didn’t. not to mention the fact that he further reaffirmed rhaenerya’s claim THAT DAY!
Whoever busted up Sophie and made her cry during her birthday .... That girl's name was Alicent and Mair has been sooo broken, upset, enraged ever since she cried on her birthday....she's determined to make sure she gonna have a bad birthday, everyday for the rest of her life. Mair is the most patient for trying to guide her through this without the handicap of believing that a modern GenZ female could survive 1 day at any other time/place in history. This show will prove it in real time. Sophie gonna be that fan who not gonna see it coming despite alllll the signs and all the reasoning. This whole convo seemed hashed out along ZERO of the factors that will determine who wins this war. Being a good or bad person isnt a determination in winning wars. What a strange value to focus on...whether if being some arbitrary label of good or bad has anything to do with waging war for a crown. Folks determined not to win do so by planning to be good rofl
Andal tradition practices male primogeniture which is the oldest male first not primogeniture which is eldest child first. Now I am team BLACK. But the reason why Allicent could believe that Rhaenyra would kill her children is because she lied to her about losing her virginity. King Jaharys had 2 sons who lived to adulthood and had children Aemon and Baelon. They both died before he did. Aemon was Rhaenys father and Baelon was Viserys and Daemon’s father.
@@ahilesahilesov2112there's a thing called succession. and nope, there are no rights to the iron throne, whomever sit there is the winner whomever he is, you win or die and there's no middle ground or did you forgot?
@@jamien368 it’s true ) but we are talking about John and deny and it’s fact that there is no dragon around only her dragons so logically she is the rightful heir bc 1 it’s fact that she got magic blood she got dragons her blood is pure ) John doesn’t have any of this things only dick
I’m sorry Mair but alicent & TG are 100% wrong. Just bc SHE believes she’s right bc she’s delusional, doesn’t mean that TG has any leg to stand on. Alicent KNOWS Viserys named Rhaenyra his heir & was never gonna budge on that. She tried (for at least a decade) to get him to name her son heir, she was planted by her father SO that the Hightowers can have their blood on the throne. That automatically makes everything they’re doing about POWER. PLUS if the the Hightowers just accepted Rhaenyra as queen, there would be no bloodshed. THEY are the ones that incited violence from the start by plotting against the crown for their own benefit. What other family would oppose Rhaenyra ??? Who would try to dethrone them? They would be the only house w dragons. The only reason there’s an issue is bc of the Hightowers. Otto created a self fulfilling prophecy. And no other houses or lords could “use alicents sons to start a war” bc they wouldn’t have the power to do so in the first place like be fr. Esp if alicent didn’t teach her kids to hate Rhaenyra & her family……
Also Rhaenys would not let Corlys try to usurp the throne. She would put the petty shit to the side & corlys would most likely not even want to since his daughter would be queen. He’d probably just still ask for Rhaenyra & Laenor to marry or marry Laena’s kids to Rhaenyra’s. Either way, they’d make sum shake for the good of the realm bc they’re reasonable & have proved to be able to put BS to the side for the sake of a goal.
But you forget the scene before viserys' last breath when he tells aliment about a so called prophecy and mentions aegons prophecy and so alicent not knowing that viserys was talking to rhaenyra thought that meant he wanted aegon to be king in the end. You literally cannot blame her for believing so. You can't. 😂
@@user-xr3ul2xc1l Actually I can and I will bc after that convo he re-affirmed that Rhaenyra is heir. And continued to do so for another decade, and even on the day he died. He chose to go defend his daughter w/ a SOBER MIND. Her choosing to believe that he changed his mind just like that? Mind you this is a man that’s CLEARLY on his deathbed, mind outta there, talmbout all kinds of random shit…..that she JUST gave a concentrated dose of an opioid to. So yes, I do blame her. She is 100% wrong and 200% stupid.
@@user-xr3ul2xc1l I think my comment got deleted so I’ll re-phrase. Alicent is still wrong bc after that convo he re-affirmed Rhaenyra as his heir & made it clear for more than a decade. Then she has him drugged up & he sobers up to re-affirm his position AGAIN, on his deathbed at that. So her taking the incoherent ramblings of a drugged up dying man is a reach, even for her. She’s trying so hard to make her point valid that she’s grasping at straws.
@nellysaidso He wasn't drugged up, he had milk of the poppy so he wouldn't be absolutely crumbled by the INCOMPREHENSIBLE pain he would feel without it. Daemon insisted about the drugged up part because he wants a reason to burn everything down. In reality for aliment it was to ease the unbearable pain for viserys.
24:16 it was said that the previous king ruled for 60 years vut his daughters nearly drove him to madness. He had sons, but they all died in one way or a other which is why they held a council to choose a successor in the first place e. NO SONS to inherit the throne!
The great king you are talking about is Jaehaerys I. He was definitely a great king but not the best father. He had several daughters. He also had sons. His son Baelon and his daughter Alyssa were married and they were Viserys' and Daemon's parents. Having said that, yes he was a pretty bad father especially to his daughters. He pushed one of his daugther's Daella (Who happens to be Rhaenyra's grandma) to wed too early and she ended up dying giving birth to Rhaenyra's mom Aemma. His son Aemon was Rhaenys father and he died during a battle plan. After Aemon's death, Baelon was supposed to succeed the old king but he also died (Due to illness). This was part of the reason for the Great Council of 101 as Rhaenys was the eldest descendant of him and the only child of King Jae's eldest son Aemon. However, King Jae wanted to Viserys, Baelon's eldest son to succeed him on the sole basis that he was a man. This drew the ire of his queen Alysanne who spent nearly half a year apart from him because she was very offended at the fact that her husband thought so little of women that they couldn't rule. The King also had a third son Vaegon who was an introverted asshole that nobody liked and flat out refused the throne as he was happy being an arch maester at the Citadel. Also, it was Vaegon's advice to his parents that instead of allowing King Jae to choose, he should hold a great council and have all the great lords vote on the matter in which they ended up choosing Viserys.
If nothing else, Alicient knows why her father sent her to the King's chambers in her mother's dress the night the Queen died. She knew this was always Otto's end game. She said it, "you have no idea the sacrifices made to put you on the throne"
IMO, Viserys was not necessarily an awful king but he definitely wasn't a good king either. He made some crucial errors that led the near demise of his house towards the end of his life. Obviously, he wasn't Joffrey bad but still less than par when you consider the fact that he nearly destroyed his own house due to his poor decision making and obliviousness.
Ironically Cersei and Rhaenyra have more narrative parallels than Alicent and Cersei do. Alicent is not power-hungry, she’s driven by the need to protect her children.
Her perception is completely wrong because just like her Rhaenyra also wanted to protect her children and obviously assume what was rightfully hers, but Alicent lied, deceived, killed and manipulated everything so her Hightower lineage could prevail
@@staryxt0 Rhaenyra herself said in episode 8 that Viserys divided the realm by naming her his heir - she was initially driven solely by her desire to be Queen as Viserys wanted her to be. After the death of Luke she wanted revenge because even after Aegon took the throne she considered letting it go. Alicent in contrast was solely driven by the need to protect her children because as told to her since she was a child, her sons were threats to Rhaenyra’s claim and would suffer for it should Rhaenyra ascend the throne. This idea was reinforced when Rhaenyra and Viserys broke her trust in ep5, again after the Driftmark incident, and further validated by Rhaenyra marrying perhaps the most volatile person in the Kingdoms. Alicent never deceived or killed anyone, she was the only one on the Green Council pushing for peace. Edit: also don’t get what the Hightower bloodline would mean to Alicent? She has Hightower brothers, her father is a second son, and her children are as Targaryen as they come - silver haired dragon riders and dreamers
@@hali_55 Only idiots and fools believe that Rhaenyra would do something against her half brothers LOL That was a narrative that Alicent always made to poison her half brothers against her older sister and you too. You believed in this Litany, right? Oh my God, Alicent was never a victim in this story. She never wanted to protect her children so that she sent them all to war in a lie and manipulation that she and their father invented
@@staryxt0 Alicent knows that Rhaenyra would never intentionally harm her or her children, even Otto knows that. But it’s not just about Rhaenyra, it’s also about the people around her. There’s no saying that her advisors or her supporters wouldn’t kill Alicent’s children to secure Rhaenyra’s claim. Both episodes 9 & 10 illustrate what it’s like to be a “woman with power” in Westeros which is that when you’re surrounded by men, you only ever have the illusion of it. A fact that will be further reinforced in season 2 episode 1.
@@hali_55 If Alicent left Rhaenyra took the throne without carrying out a coup d'état this would never happen because she as queen would never allow supporters to go against her word, especially if there is Daemon there on her side, but she preferred to lie and manipulate the children, he even did this to her granddaughter. The only living person she had at the moment, that is, she is not a victim... everything she did was with the intention of ending Rhaenyra's lineage
nahhh alicent know viserys want rhaenyra to be the queen, he even stand up to fight for rhaenyra at the episode 8 despite being so weak when vaemond question rhaenyra's son being heir of the dragonstone. She just greedy and entitled cause she felt like she sacrifice her life comitted to the king when in the first place she caould just refuse to but she wanted to please her father so bad so she go about accompanying the king when he was greving and she enven went behind rhaenyra's back knowing they are bestfriend and rhaenyra wont like it yet she see the king without even saying a word to her. she a big hypocrite. She knew her Son wonr even be a good king and if she is really looking out for the realm she knew rhaenyra's has the best interest for the throne.
Your wrong about Alicent she believes what Viserys said on his death bed was that he wanted Aegon to rule, she completely misunderstood that he was talking about Rhaneyra's son. She is wrong in her belief that he wanted her Aegon to rule but it was because she didn't understand what he said.
I agree that Visarys wasn’t a great King and made plenty of questionable decisions. But he did keep peace which should count for something bc the second he died, war began. So maybe he was a better King then we think
10:40 you are 100% on the money, in your analysis of Alicent. The bad faith arguments from the team black fans regarding Alicent is ridiculous. Team black fans automatically assume everything Alicent does is evil. Just because you don't like Alicent, doesn't mean everything she does is always tor the wrong reasons, they allow their hatred of Alicent to cloud their view of her actions.
The show is heavily Black leaning, they spoiled all the fun by making the Greens cartoonish villains (except for Alicent and her daughter but they got some grace because they are women and the show is written by feminists)...
I feel like they rushed season 1bc they weren't sure how many seasons they would get. The entire first season could've been 2 or 3 seasons; we would've gotten the know the characters a lot better. GOT especially the older seasons are miles better than this. The show is heavy Black leaning and I'm thinking it should've been a bit more neutral especially with how it ends. Alicent was basically manipulated by her father and given to an old man as a teenager. While I am more Black leaning, I understand her point.
9:57 "Rhaenerya is fighting because she knows she is the rightful heir" 😂😂😂 Aegon's supporters are also fighting because they know he is the rightful heir by tradition too. And yes, your man was right, you can't blame Alicent for what she heard or what she wasn't supposed to hear. King Viserys talked about his dream of his son born wearing the conqueror's crown during Aegon's 2nd name day and again on his death bed when he shared the song of ice and fire. Granted in the later he was clearly misunderstood, you cannot blame Alicient for putting 2 and 2 together. Afterall, her son's name is Aegon. As far as she is concerned, Viserys changed his mind, and that is good enough for me and the green supporters, no matter how inconsequential the information is.
They're fighting because they can't see a woman on the throne. Everyone knows who the king chose. And whoever the king says is the heir, that's how a feudal system works.
My thing is, also, that Alicent knows Aegon is not a good person. He is a rapist, as she knows from paying that servant girl to keep quiet about it. He has many kids out of wedlock, one of which he left to be forced to take part in the fighting pits in flea bottom; he enjoys watching children fight to the death in said fighting pits. Aegon would never be a good king, which is why he’s so eager to participate in the war to come, and Alicent knows this but she chooses to be blind to it, making her the biggest hypocrite of all time.
Kings are not chosen by their qualities. In the show, she thought Viserys named her son heir, since Viserys previously had conversations with her about it, so she listened to him.
@@yasmina3999 She also knew that Viserys had officially named Rhaenyra heir. They may have had conversations about it but not once did he ever change his decision, and he had ample time to do so, and thinking he did on his death bed is just a desperate reach.
@@yasmina3999 Those have been excellent points made by the original author of the string, @nasharafoster3766. Alicent is two faced and has always held Rhaenyra to a higher standard than she does herself. Plus, keep it real, do you believe if the situation was reverse Alicent would have excepted Rhaenyra’s version of a deathbed change of heart by Viserys that would have made Rhaenyra queen at the expense of her son being named king? You know the answer is no. Alicient would have said he was confused and had too much milk of the poppy and spoke about how he would confuse her with his former wife. But all of that logic goes out the window when her children come out on top I guess, lol. She’s shady as hell. And besides covering up her son’s rape let’s not forget her cheating on Viserys. Queens get beheaded for that. Those footies sex acts with Larys is the equivalent of cheating. Alicent is wrong on facts nor does she hold the moral high ground. Team Black all the way.
@@steelpookie7597 cheating? Dude, this scene is a sexual assult, even the actor who plays Larys spoke about that. He uses crucial information to make her do that. Yes, Alicent could have been punished for it, but don't make it look like she's a cheater. Covering rape? Do you know what could have been done to Dyana in reality? You know that Alicent, the queen, could have been punished but you think that Alicent had power to protect Dyana even more and punish Aegon ? Abd I don't know why would you start speaking about hypocrisy. I know that it's her flaw. She was put in severe situations and didn't act properly but was harsh on Rhaenyra for it. But again, why would you tell me this? I said that kings are not chosen. I'm going to surprise you, but Alicent was okay with letting Rhaenyra be a queen. She sincerely said it herself during the dinner scene and the actress confirmed it.
Same im kinda both i love black and green but to me im more green , but not all the way just in the middle + im seeing both sides and that’s better way to watch the show + if you’re all the way black or green you always see the other side is the wrong in everything they do and not see what’s wrong with your own team
Don't waist your time explaining yourself Samir. The people who r team black can't be persuaded twice. They're already in the cult. Already drank the cool aid.
Also, I think in Game of Thrones Season 8, it was a Team Jon or Team Dany for the claim to the throne. And tbh. I was Team Jon. He is Aegon Targaryen, The Prince that was Promised. The Heir to the Iron Throne.
But Alincet understood that he wanted her to put Aegon on throne she always was dutiful wife even Rhaenyra says so and Alincent is not Cersei and Rhaenyra is definitely not Dany completely opposite i would say
I agree that alicent is not cersei but instead comparing her to dany is absolutely insane💀 alicent believes having rhaenyra as queen would bring harm to her kids so she wants to protect them, call this a stretch but shes more comparable to catelyn in that sense. If you believe her to be like dany i really believe you understood neither character. Dany wanted the throne because it was her birthright which aligns more with rhaenyra in this sense, alicent wants aegon to have it because she believes thats the way to keep her children safe.
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c “shes more comparable to catelyn in that sence” my exact words with “in that sence” referring to both of them wanting to protect their children from someone or something they see as ‘evil’
Ok, well, we know that Rhaenyra will never be queen, and all the Targaryens will be killed off under Bran (Jon doesn’t count)? For some reason, this knowledge helps you relax and just enjoy watching it, rather than participating in useless fandom wars.
Targaryens from Rhaenyra's line ruled the 7 kingdoms for 200 years after her death and not all of them are dead. You know who's dead? Otto's non-existent ancestors
What’s the point of such a government if none of them left any legacy? The war between Rhaenyra and Aegon led to the death of the only thing that distinguished the Targaryens from others - dragons. And then the Lannisters, Baratheons and other noble houses danced on the bones of these “brave descendants”. The moral of this story is sad, unfortunately, and the war ended with only poor children without parents with a broken psyche surviving, and the council included representatives of both factions, who then took all power. Forever)))
Boo fn hoo. The blacks and the greens are both bad so you defending the blacks is also 🤢... people have their opinions. I'm fine eith people defending team black just let me defend my team. Team black is more toxic than team green and it's so obvious.
No, you're not the best HoTD reactor. That'd be Sophie from Sophie Reacts. Understands each character and is very good with lore. And just for reaction part, it'd be Blind Wave, Reel Rejects and so on.
The traditional way is eldest male heir. Rhanerya was named heir because Viserys didn't have a male heir and didn't think he ever would.
Traditionally, the Hightowers are correct. But they are committing Treason by going against the Kings wishes.
the eldest male heir would be Daemon
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c the eldest male heir/son of the king. Which is Aegon II.
no nga. traditionally they are still wrong, alicents father was plotting against viserys the whole time by planning to take nyra out regardless. treason. kings word is absolute. greens have 0 claimed to the throne. its as simple as that.
@@Yoxhio_ ever heard of the council of harrenhal? The Lords of Westeros as a whole are more powerfull then their King, as the mad King found out.
@@Splicing_Darwinist uh uh stop nga. dont bring up other ish. The KING named nyra as his heir it's as simple as that. point blank period. and his and otto had been planing treason for a while about it.
Like = Team Black
Comment = Team Green
Do the other way around liking is easier just like Taem Black is easier
💚💚
💚💚💚
@@queenxx1690 exactly. Team Black is all about easy emotion. Long live the greens.
Hi
To make a fair point for Alicent in episode three Viserys tells Alicent about his dream of Aegon being put on the thron with the Conquerors crown, he said the dream was so vivid it was like it was real so that probably stuck with Alicent all this time as well up until she misunderstood Viserys.
I think there’s multiple character that can be manipulative:
- Otto manipulates Viserys and his daughter to place Aegon on the throne
- Daemon manipulates Rhaenyra the entire first half of season 1
- Rhaenyra manipulates her court to shield the fact that her sons are bastards
How did Daemon manipulate Rhaenyra? And how did Rhaenyra manipulate the court when everyone threw it to her face that her children are bastards??
The only manipulative and the real player is Otto. Otto convinced Viserys to name Rhaenyra instead of Daemon even tho the whole council disagreed that a woman shouldn't be named, and once it was done he started telling people Rhaenyra shouldn't ascend the throne because she is a woman like dude bffr you did this and now he is gaslighting his daughter into thinking that the blacks reaction is evil and bad after they stole their right and killed a prince.
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c 1) Grooming is manipulation
2) Claiming that people telling the truth about your sons’s paternity are committing treason and getting your father the King to threaten to have the tongues of anyone who speaks the truth is manipulating a situation.
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c 1) Grooming is manipulation
2) Claiming that anyone who tells the truth about your children’s paternity is committing treason and getting your father, the King, to threaten to have the tongue of anyone who tells the truth is manipulating a situation.
I wish they had cast the people in the show to look like they did in the book. In the book it wouldn't have been easy to see any differences because Laenor and Corly's weren't black, also Raenys had black hair because of her parentage, it would have been more mysterious, more unknown.
@@user-sx6eu4rg2x tbf even in the book it’s quite clear. rhaenys has black hair because of her baratheon blood (and we know that this is unaltered all the way to the events of GoT). rhaenyra’s kids however have brown hair so it couldn’t have been from baratheon blood.
One thing Sophie got wrong is that the traditional line of succession is the oldest MALE, not the oldest child. If Viserys never named Rhaenyra heir, then the moment Aegon was born he would have automatically been the heir. She is only heir because he didn't think he'd have a son when he named her, and then when he did have a son, he CHOSE not to go the traditional way. Mair was actually right for once. That's the reason why most of the kingdom is backing the Greens at the moment, and it's hard for Rhaenyra to get more houses to back her.
It is tradition but the belief “no woman should rule” is not a thing for Targaryens. Misogyny is rampant in Westeros like the real world, it is the main driving force on why Westorosi men can not bring themselves to support Rhaenyra who was claimed heir by the King himself. Along with tradition also. This is why Aegon the Conqueror was King instead of Visenya who was both the brains and swords. They don’t know how to handle “change.” I know Rhaenyra is not the feminist icon we like to think she is, but whether she likes it or not, her ruling as Queen can definitely change things in Westeros and they don’t like that.
@@aztre "“no woman should rule” is not a thing for Targaryens."
That doesn't matter. The Targs rule over Westeros and abide by their laws. Dont you know how hard it was for Aegon the Conquerer to marry his sisters? He went through hell to legalise incest and he could only accomplish that for his family and no one else. There is the andal law and there is the kings word. Viserys should've gone through all the measures (and more) so women could legally get inheritance. He did NONE of that and hoped his words would be enough. Clearly we see he was wrong.
@@rexibhazoboa7097 I'm not denying all that??? My point was that it's not just tradition, but also misogyny. I just wanted op to consider the misogynist aspect. I'm well aware Viserys was at fault. I believe his greatest mistake was marrying someone after announcing Rhaenyra as heir.
@@aztrethat’s not a fact women can rule when there no longer a true born son or a brother of the king or lord even bastards can rule as long a true born son or a lord brother is dead the law doesn’t say a woman can’t rule a son comes before the daughter do I agree with this nope it should be the first born child
@@aztre misogyny is hatred of women that’s the definition a lot of people just say it majority of cultures the line is past through the father to son line and that doesn’t make this culture misogynistic or they hate women I know plenty of cultures line is passed to the mother to daughters that’s the culture it doesn’t make this culture’s also bad I know plenty of patriarchal and matriarchal culture or society 99% of people wouldn’t even tell the difference between this two cultures you have to come from matriarchal society to know what to look for
Also worth noting that the issue with Rhaenyra siring bastards is not because she’s a woman, it’s because she’s made one the heir to the throne which is treason. Even in a patriarchal society like this a man making his bastards heir to the throne is a crime.
good point
Well no because Kings could legitimise their bastards, BUT she can’t even admit she has bastards. Those times sexism was at its best and while a man could “father however many bastards he’d want” she would have to be disinherited (by the realm bc Viserys wouldn’t be able to change their option even as King this is why he never openly admitted it) and she’d be ruined, just because she’s a woman. So this bastards part is actually exploring sexism and how they treat men and women differently. I’m more with Rhenerya, it’s not these poor children’s fault and they shouldn’t be called bastards. This is why we left the term “bastards” in the medieval.
@@Nattiie Rhaenyra can admit she sired bastards. Her father was a King and he loved her, all they’d have to do was legitimise them as Strongs.
@@Nattiie Well, Rheanyra fucked her self hard with that beautiful decision. But Viserys could've been smart about it. Just like Aegon the Conquerer, He should have made an official change to the law of women inheriting the throne - or just inheriting their parents things. If successful (since incest was allowed, women ruling would have been allowed as well), the only thing left to do was to publicise that Rheanyra's first 3 children were bastards and her throne would go to the first of her and Daemon's child. The Velaryons would be pissed but they will be pissed at Laenor - so he can deal with that himself. Plus, they have another chance at the throne with Laena's children with Daemon.
Now, you see way how Viserys could've prevented this if he was actually a decent king?
Aaand people still fight for the bastard anyway
These guys are so team black 😭 they wore blank expressions throughout the green trailer
At least they didnt insult them throughout.
Team Green is more fun to watch 💚🟢
after viserys crawled crippled to the throne room to defend his daughter it is wild to think he would switch up that same night. lol. he had been saying she was the heir and standing on it for years and years and years and had ample time to change it but didn't.
This frustrating thing about Alicent thinking that Viserys named Aegon heir is show's innovation😐 ( no spoilers here, don't worry)
In the book, the greens don't use it all, they know Viserys named Rhaenyra heir but they just think that his words don't matter, since Viserys didn't bother to change the law.
I really dislike this change because it makes people ignore really great and complex reasons for the conflict. Now, all people watching this trailers scream " not your Aegon" or "you are wrong, you base your usurpation on lies!". It's so sad, dude.
The greens actually have great reasons ( for their universe), like Aegon being the firstborn son, Rhaenyra having bastards, Daemon being bloodthirsty&dangerous.
And also people often forget the fact that Viserys became king ONLY because he was a male.The previous king Jaehaerys got the throne for similar reason - male line over female .So Aegon bases his claim on precedent that was set by two previous kings.
Also, Viserys named Rhaenyra heir before Aegon's birth. He did it because it wasn't clear whether she or Daemon was his heir. But Viserys didn't take away Aegon's birth right. The thing is,Aegon doesn't need to be named heir. He was born heir by default. All the first born sons are heirs till their right is taken away from them ( even Sam Tarly in GOT was forced to join Night Watch, because he was the heir his father didn't want). But at least this argument Otto mentions in episode 10.
As far as Alicent's inconsistency as a character goes I think part of the blame has to go on the writers. Also you are right about viserys being a horrible king but he's a horrible father too. He neglected all of his kids except rhaenyra because he felt guilty for killing his first wife.
The king before Viserys had sons as well as daughters. He was a good father to his sons but not his daughters.
People have this false sense that viserys is a good person but a bad king, the truth of the matter is that viserys was a bad person but he was a coward and he had no cunning or wisdom.
Absolutely love yalls discussions!
He had sons! His oldest son Aemon (Caraxes rider) was Rhaenys father and his heir but he died. Baelon - Visery’s and Daemon’s dad was his next heir but he also died thus he had no heir. The old king had the choice to have Rhaeny’s his oldest grandchild be his heir but knew it will cause war so he let the great council decide who ended up picking Visery’s as his heir. Another fun fact, the old king had one daughter who was exiled to Exoss
Whether the King ever said that to Alicent on his death bed or not, it didn’t change anything at the end of the day. Otto already had a plan to take the throne as soon as the King past away. And Alicent wasn’t privy to that. I’m with Mair for sure, I lean towards team black but I’m not anywhere near completely on one side. I feel like when u do that it keeps u from watching with an open mind to seeing both sides.
Alicent told her child he will be the king when he was beating his meat at the window. In Laena's funeral, Aemond told Aegon to respect their sister because she is to be his QUEEN. How is that privy again??
Alicent would've put her son on the throne anyway, what she misunderstood in ep8 only made her not feel guilty for usurping the throne and give it to her rapist child after she decided to disown him the day before.
THANK YOU!!!!!
Can’t wait to watch the new season with yall!! 😃❤️
The greatest king you were talking about (Jahaerys) also had sons.
Alycent (A) has always been jealous of Rhaynera's (R) position from S1, revealed when she asked R, "aren't you concerned about your position?" (A)felt she deserved nobility, where as (R), to (A), took it for granted. She wanted the white hair and dragons, just like (R) said the other houses wanted. Calling (R) kids "plain featured. Shooting a dig at (R) saying "you Targaryens have peculiar habits." Then she marry her daughter to her son.
It's funny that when (V) was talking to (R), she corrected him, in who he was speaking to; but (A) didn't. If (V) had said nothing to her, she would have went along with her father's plot after (V) died. She would have let her father talk her into it. Her father suggested she go to (V), but her intent is revealed when (V) asked if she had told (R) about their talks. She hadn't.
She's a snake. What else could Otto spawn? That's why she keeps Criston Cole alive, that's why she's whoring her feet out, as if dude isn't reaching the same end if she just slept with him. Making herself feel innocent of the act. She's always hated (R).
" Aren't you concerned about your position " means that Alicent feels that she deserves nobility? How ?
Wasn't Alicent 14 and already a noble girl, from a power house ?
@@SuperARCANGEL0 Allicent was the servent of Rhaynera and Alicent's father, a servent to the crown. The Targaryens was the crown. Her resentment of Rhaynera is revealed in her own words just before she cut Rhaynera, "I have done what was expected of me. Forever upholding the family, the kingdom, the Law. While you flaunt yours and do as you please..."
@@leliamiller1609
Servant, but she's still a noble lady. Every noble and folk in the land are theoretically servants of the crown
She said that 15 years later, after Rhaenyra gets way with no reprimand from Viserys after her sons eye gets cut.
Wasn't she also ignoring her father and favoring Rhaenyra in front of Viserys, around the time of your 1st example?
@@SuperARCANGEL0Team Green obviously, so be that. I'm Team black, enough said?
@@SuperARCANGEL0 Viserys tried to tell Allicent to shut up about Rhaynera's kids when he told her the story about the white horse. The kids were Targaryens and that is what mattered to Viserys. The Veleryons had the white hair, but they only obtained the dragons when they married into the Targaryen line.
You mean when Alicent was prostituting her bedtime stories to Viserys and helping fix his toys?
I can't wait for ya'll reactions for this new season!! Team BLACK!!!
If you recall, team green long was planning to usurp the throne from Rheanyra regardless of Alicent's misunderstanding of her husband's last words.
so excited
The biggest finnesser in this series is Daemon, cuz he somehow has a mostly positive reputation in the fan base. Despite him murdering his wife, grooming his niece, dismembering criminals in the city watch, sleeping with Rhaenyra the night of his wife’s funeral, choking the heir to the throne, etc. This dude is trash!
Well you can thank matt smith charisma and acting for that dude stole the show in s1 n im pretty sure people like daemon not because he's a good person but an interesting character for sure.
You think people watch series and movies to watch good people??
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c they sure care about being good when it comes to Allicent and the greens lol. She’s a bit self interested and jealous cuz her life is shit, and that’s somehow made her more despised than an actual piece of crap like Daemon, whose only redeeming quality was being a decent brother.
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c The blacks try to use morality as a shield and sword more than anything.
@@user-mt2fp9zx6capparently yes since u people think the greens are so awful
Mair and Sophie- It's NOT going to go fast anymore. Each season from now on can only cover like a year. The whole Dance of Dragons saga is only about 3 years. So, it's about to go really slow. But A LOT happens in these next 3 years.
Yes alot, hence why they cut the season from 10 to 8 episodes.
Awesome reaction of my favorite trailer of House Of The Dragon!!!!!!!😊😊😊😊😊😊😊
Sophie put yourself in Alicents position for a minute. If you were Alicent on Viserys deathbed and you`d hear Viserys words about Aegon. You would not think that he was talking about Aegon the Conquerer. You would think that he was talking about your son, too. Yeah it would be weired that Viserys changed his mind about the succesion. But is it possible? Yes it is. All what will happen next is based on misunderstanding because multiple Aegons exsist, and you have forces that belive in the traditional way versus against the will of the King. Mair is totally right
Wow I’m lucky I stumbled across your channel! Subscribed!! Awesome videos guys, can’t wait to watch your future house of the dragon reactions!
Mair always the leveled head 🧠
King Jaehaerys had sons but they all died before him. 24:39
The tradition of westeros is the eldest male inherits the throne. It wasn’t a law though.
Alicent used the same system that she fell victim to onto others. Both Rhaenerya and Haelena.
If Viserys had married Laena, the show would have went in another direction given laena and rhaenerya were close friends (basically best friends)
Also Alicent claiming that viserys wanted aegon to inherit the throne is stupid bc he had ample time to change the succession and he didn’t. not to mention the fact that he further reaffirmed rhaenerya’s claim THAT DAY!
Whoever busted up Sophie and made her cry during her birthday .... That girl's name was Alicent and Mair has been sooo broken, upset, enraged ever since she cried on her birthday....she's determined to make sure she gonna have a bad birthday, everyday for the rest of her life. Mair is the most patient for trying to guide her through this without the handicap of believing that a modern GenZ female could survive 1 day at any other time/place in history. This show will prove it in real time. Sophie gonna be that fan who not gonna see it coming despite alllll the signs and all the reasoning. This whole convo seemed hashed out along ZERO of the factors that will determine who wins this war. Being a good or bad person isnt a determination in winning wars. What a strange value to focus on...whether if being some arbitrary label of good or bad has anything to do with waging war for a crown. Folks determined not to win do so by planning to be good rofl
Andal tradition practices male primogeniture which is the oldest male first not primogeniture which is eldest child first. Now I am team BLACK. But the reason why Allicent could believe that Rhaenyra would kill her children is because she lied to her about losing her virginity. King Jaharys had 2 sons who lived to adulthood and had children Aemon and Baelon. They both died before he did. Aemon was Rhaenys father and Baelon was Viserys and Daemon’s father.
jon snow was the rightful heir not daenerys
Actually no… and the main reason is Dragons… Targaryen with dragons have more rights to the throne then Targaryen without dragons )
@@ahilesahilesov2112there's a thing called succession.
and nope, there are no rights to the iron throne, whomever sit there is the winner whomever he is, you win or die and there's no middle ground or did you forgot?
@@jamien368 it’s true ) but we are talking about John and deny and it’s fact that there is no dragon around only her dragons so logically she is the rightful heir bc 1 it’s fact that she got magic blood she got dragons her blood is pure ) John doesn’t have any of this things only dick
I’m sorry Mair but alicent & TG are 100% wrong. Just bc SHE believes she’s right bc she’s delusional, doesn’t mean that TG has any leg to stand on. Alicent KNOWS Viserys named Rhaenyra his heir & was never gonna budge on that. She tried (for at least a decade) to get him to name her son heir, she was planted by her father SO that the Hightowers can have their blood on the throne. That automatically makes everything they’re doing about POWER. PLUS if the the Hightowers just accepted Rhaenyra as queen, there would be no bloodshed. THEY are the ones that incited violence from the start by plotting against the crown for their own benefit. What other family would oppose Rhaenyra ??? Who would try to dethrone them? They would be the only house w dragons. The only reason there’s an issue is bc of the Hightowers. Otto created a self fulfilling prophecy. And no other houses or lords could “use alicents sons to start a war” bc they wouldn’t have the power to do so in the first place like be fr. Esp if alicent didn’t teach her kids to hate Rhaenyra & her family……
Also Rhaenys would not let Corlys try to usurp the throne. She would put the petty shit to the side & corlys would most likely not even want to since his daughter would be queen. He’d probably just still ask for Rhaenyra & Laenor to marry or marry Laena’s kids to Rhaenyra’s. Either way, they’d make sum shake for the good of the realm bc they’re reasonable & have proved to be able to put BS to the side for the sake of a goal.
But you forget the scene before viserys' last breath when he tells aliment about a so called prophecy and mentions aegons prophecy and so alicent not knowing that viserys was talking to rhaenyra thought that meant he wanted aegon to be king in the end. You literally cannot blame her for believing so. You can't. 😂
@@user-xr3ul2xc1l Actually I can and I will bc after that convo he re-affirmed that Rhaenyra is heir. And continued to do so for another decade, and even on the day he died. He chose to go defend his daughter w/ a SOBER MIND. Her choosing to believe that he changed his mind just like that? Mind you this is a man that’s CLEARLY on his deathbed, mind outta there, talmbout all kinds of random shit…..that she JUST gave a concentrated dose of an opioid to. So yes, I do blame her. She is 100% wrong and 200% stupid.
@@user-xr3ul2xc1l I think my comment got deleted so I’ll re-phrase. Alicent is still wrong bc after that convo he re-affirmed Rhaenyra as his heir & made it clear for more than a decade. Then she has him drugged up & he sobers up to re-affirm his position AGAIN, on his deathbed at that. So her taking the incoherent ramblings of a drugged up dying man is a reach, even for her. She’s trying so hard to make her point valid that she’s grasping at straws.
@nellysaidso He wasn't drugged up, he had milk of the poppy so he wouldn't be absolutely crumbled by the INCOMPREHENSIBLE pain he would feel without it. Daemon insisted about the drugged up part because he wants a reason to burn everything down. In reality for aliment it was to ease the unbearable pain for viserys.
OTTO ALREADY HAD IN HIS LIND TO OVERTHROW RHAENYRA AND HER CLAIM TO THE THROWN!
24:16 it was said that the previous king ruled for 60 years vut his daughters nearly drove him to madness. He had sons, but they all died in one way or a other which is why they held a council to choose a successor in the first place e. NO SONS to inherit the throne!
Team black and that’s a fact. This season gonna be lit. Literal fire. 🔥
hi Mair , Mair here from Wales , live in Oz now . love your reaction . #tteamblack
8:51 lmao took me out 🗣😭🤣💀
The great king you are talking about is Jaehaerys I. He was definitely a great king but not the best father. He had several daughters. He also had sons. His son Baelon and his daughter Alyssa were married and they were Viserys' and Daemon's parents. Having said that, yes he was a pretty bad father especially to his daughters. He pushed one of his daugther's Daella (Who happens to be Rhaenyra's grandma) to wed too early and she ended up dying giving birth to Rhaenyra's mom Aemma.
His son Aemon was Rhaenys father and he died during a battle plan. After Aemon's death, Baelon was supposed to succeed the old king but he also died (Due to illness). This was part of the reason for the Great Council of 101 as Rhaenys was the eldest descendant of him and the only child of King Jae's eldest son Aemon. However, King Jae wanted to Viserys, Baelon's eldest son to succeed him on the sole basis that he was a man. This drew the ire of his queen Alysanne who spent nearly half a year apart from him because she was very offended at the fact that her husband thought so little of women that they couldn't rule.
The King also had a third son Vaegon who was an introverted asshole that nobody liked and flat out refused the throne as he was happy being an arch maester at the Citadel. Also, it was Vaegon's advice to his parents that instead of allowing King Jae to choose, he should hold a great council and have all the great lords vote on the matter in which they ended up choosing Viserys.
If nothing else, Alicient knows why her father sent her to the King's chambers in her mother's dress the night the Queen died. She knew this was always Otto's end game. She said it, "you have no idea the sacrifices made to put you on the throne"
Team Black!!
I honestly hope we see Dhaemon ride Cannibal at the end vs Aemon n Vaghar!!
Team Black pour toujours 🖤❤️🔥
But they’re not pure she has Multiple bastards.
IMO, Viserys was not necessarily an awful king but he definitely wasn't a good king either. He made some crucial errors that led the near demise of his house towards the end of his life. Obviously, he wasn't Joffrey bad but still less than par when you consider the fact that he nearly destroyed his own house due to his poor decision making and obliviousness.
Ironically Cersei and Rhaenyra have more narrative parallels than Alicent and Cersei do. Alicent is not power-hungry, she’s driven by the need to protect her children.
Her perception is completely wrong because just like her Rhaenyra also wanted to protect her children and obviously assume what was rightfully hers, but Alicent lied, deceived, killed and manipulated everything so her Hightower lineage could prevail
@@staryxt0 Rhaenyra herself said in episode 8 that Viserys divided the realm by naming her his heir - she was initially driven solely by her desire to be Queen as Viserys wanted her to be. After the death of Luke she wanted revenge because even after Aegon took the throne she considered letting it go.
Alicent in contrast was solely driven by the need to protect her children because as told to her since she was a child, her sons were threats to Rhaenyra’s claim and would suffer for it should Rhaenyra ascend the throne. This idea was reinforced when Rhaenyra and Viserys broke her trust in ep5, again after the Driftmark incident, and further validated by Rhaenyra marrying perhaps the most volatile person in the Kingdoms. Alicent never deceived or killed anyone, she was the only one on the Green Council pushing for peace.
Edit: also don’t get what the Hightower bloodline would mean to Alicent? She has Hightower brothers, her father is a second son, and her children are as Targaryen as they come - silver haired dragon riders and dreamers
@@hali_55 Only idiots and fools believe that Rhaenyra would do something against her half brothers LOL That was a narrative that Alicent always made to poison her half brothers against her older sister and you too. You believed in this Litany, right? Oh my God, Alicent was never a victim in this story. She never wanted to protect her children so that she sent them all to war in a lie and manipulation that she and their father invented
@@staryxt0 Alicent knows that Rhaenyra would never intentionally harm her or her children, even Otto knows that. But it’s not just about Rhaenyra, it’s also about the people around her. There’s no saying that her advisors or her supporters wouldn’t kill Alicent’s children to secure Rhaenyra’s claim.
Both episodes 9 & 10 illustrate what it’s like to be a “woman with power” in Westeros which is that when you’re surrounded by men, you only ever have the illusion of it. A fact that will be further reinforced in season 2 episode 1.
@@hali_55 If Alicent left Rhaenyra took the throne without carrying out a coup d'état this would never happen because she as queen would never allow supporters to go against her word, especially if there is Daemon there on her side, but she preferred to lie and manipulate the children, he even did this to her granddaughter. The only living person she had at the moment, that is, she is not a victim... everything she did was with the intention of ending Rhaenyra's lineage
nahhh alicent know viserys want rhaenyra to be the queen, he even stand up to fight for rhaenyra at the episode 8 despite being so weak when vaemond question rhaenyra's son being heir of the dragonstone. She just greedy and entitled cause she felt like she sacrifice her life comitted to the king when in the first place she caould just refuse to but she wanted to please her father so bad so she go about accompanying the king when he was greving and she enven went behind rhaenyra's back knowing they are bestfriend and rhaenyra wont like it yet she see the king without even saying a word to her. she a big hypocrite. She knew her Son wonr even be a good king and if she is really looking out for the realm she knew rhaenyra's has the best interest for the throne.
Team black all the way
Your wrong about Alicent she believes what Viserys said on his death bed was that he wanted Aegon to rule, she completely misunderstood that he was talking about Rhaneyra's son. She is wrong in her belief that he wanted her Aegon to rule but it was because she didn't understand what he said.
sophie is hilarious
I agree that Visarys wasn’t a great King and made plenty of questionable decisions. But he did keep peace which should count for something bc the second he died, war began. So maybe he was a better King then we think
So wrong about Alicent, Sophie.
Team Black
10:40 you are 100% on the money, in your analysis of Alicent. The
bad faith arguments from the team black fans regarding Alicent is ridiculous. Team black fans automatically assume everything Alicent does is evil. Just because you don't like Alicent, doesn't mean everything she does is always tor the wrong reasons, they allow their hatred of Alicent to cloud their view of her actions.
Beat reactors to HOTD? Lol nah
The show is heavily Black leaning, they spoiled all the fun by making the Greens cartoonish villains (except for Alicent and her daughter but they got some grace because they are women and the show is written by feminists)...
Team green💚💚
It’s House of THE Dragon not House of Dragon
Episode 2 is called blood and cheese y’all not ready for that😢
Blood and Cheese will happen in Ep.1 in "A son for a Son". Episode 2 will be a Dance of Dragons. (Rhaenys against Aegon II. and Aemond.)
@@LucerysOwner episode 4 is actually rook’s rest not ep2
@@LucerysOwnerNo that battle is ep.4
@@rahimg6842 alright, take it back 😅
team🖤🖤🖤
Idk , and idgf ! Black team from start to the end.
Team Black 🖤
Raynera does stay consistent to who she is, lying to your father about who his grandkids real father is
11:03 Your are approaching the argument in bad faith, you are automatically assuming that Alicent is doing things for all the wrong reasons.
Alicent talks about the sacrifices they made… letting a guy look at her feet lol
💀💀😂
@@anapaulavukovic1320 lol like for real..her husband rotted from the inside out for 20 years and turned into the crypt keeper lol
I feel like they rushed season 1bc they weren't sure how many seasons they would get. The entire first season could've been 2 or 3 seasons; we would've gotten the know the characters a lot better. GOT especially the older seasons are miles better than this. The show is heavy Black leaning and I'm thinking it should've been a bit more neutral especially with how it ends. Alicent was basically manipulated by her father and given to an old man as a teenager. While I am more Black leaning, I understand her point.
I´m pretty sure, that when it all ends, we will discover that there was no good or bad team
11:00 Youre approaching the topic in bad faith, you are automatically assuming that Alicent is doing things for the wrong reasons.
9:57 "Rhaenerya is fighting because she knows she is the rightful heir" 😂😂😂
Aegon's supporters are also fighting because they know he is the rightful heir by tradition too.
And yes, your man was right, you can't blame Alicent for what she heard or what she wasn't supposed to hear. King Viserys talked about his dream of his son born wearing the conqueror's crown during Aegon's 2nd name day and again on his death bed when he shared the song of ice and fire. Granted in the later he was clearly misunderstood, you cannot blame Alicient for putting 2 and 2 together. Afterall, her son's name is Aegon. As far as she is concerned, Viserys changed his mind, and that is good enough for me and the green supporters, no matter how inconsequential the information is.
They're fighting because they can't see a woman on the throne. Everyone knows who the king chose. And whoever the king says is the heir, that's how a feudal system works.
My thing is, also, that Alicent knows Aegon is not a good person. He is a rapist, as she knows from paying that servant girl to keep quiet about it. He has many kids out of wedlock, one of which he left to be forced to take part in the fighting pits in flea bottom; he enjoys watching children fight to the death in said fighting pits. Aegon would never be a good king, which is why he’s so eager to participate in the war to come, and Alicent knows this but she chooses to be blind to it, making her the biggest hypocrite of all time.
Kings are not chosen by their qualities. In the show, she thought Viserys named her son heir, since Viserys previously had conversations with her about it, so she listened to him.
@@yasmina3999 She also knew that Viserys had officially named Rhaenyra heir. They may have had conversations about it but not once did he ever change his decision, and he had ample time to do so, and thinking he did on his death bed is just a desperate reach.
@@yasmina3999 Those have been excellent points made by the original author of the string, @nasharafoster3766. Alicent is two faced and has always held Rhaenyra to a higher standard than she does herself. Plus, keep it real, do you believe if the situation was reverse Alicent would have excepted Rhaenyra’s version of a deathbed change of heart by Viserys that would have made Rhaenyra queen at the expense of her son being named king? You know the answer is no. Alicient would have said he was confused and had too much milk of the poppy and spoke about how he would confuse her with his former wife. But all of that logic goes out the window when her children come out on top I guess, lol. She’s shady as hell. And besides covering up her son’s rape let’s not forget her cheating on Viserys. Queens get beheaded for that. Those footies sex acts with Larys is the equivalent of cheating. Alicent is wrong on facts nor does she hold the moral high ground. Team Black all the way.
@@nasharafoster3766 the writers confirmed that Alicent sincerely thought that he named Aegon heir. She isn't as evil as you want her to be 🤦🏻♀️
@@steelpookie7597
cheating? Dude, this scene is a sexual assult, even the actor who plays Larys spoke about that. He uses crucial information to make her do that. Yes, Alicent could have been punished for it, but don't make it look like she's a cheater.
Covering rape? Do you know what could have been done to Dyana in reality? You know that Alicent, the queen, could have been punished but you think that Alicent had power to protect Dyana even more and punish Aegon ?
Abd I don't know why would you start speaking about hypocrisy. I know that it's her flaw. She was put in severe situations and didn't act properly but was harsh on Rhaenyra for it. But again, why would you tell me this? I said that kings are not chosen.
I'm going to surprise you, but Alicent was okay with letting Rhaenyra be a queen. She sincerely said it herself during the dinner scene and the actress confirmed it.
Same im kinda both i love black and green but to me im more green , but not all the way just in the middle + im seeing both sides and that’s better way to watch the show + if you’re all the way black or green you always see the other side is the wrong in everything they do and not see what’s wrong with your own team
Don't waist your time explaining yourself Samir. The people who r team black can't be persuaded twice. They're already in the cult. Already drank the cool aid.
Also, I think in Game of Thrones Season 8, it was a Team Jon or Team Dany for the claim to the throne. And tbh. I was Team Jon. He is Aegon Targaryen, The Prince that was Promised. The Heir to the Iron Throne.
you can’t like Dany and say you’re team green ! team black🖤
But Alincet understood that he wanted her to put Aegon on throne she always was dutiful wife even Rhaenyra says so and Alincent is not Cersei and Rhaenyra is definitely not Dany completely opposite i would say
I agree that alicent is not cersei but instead comparing her to dany is absolutely insane💀 alicent believes having rhaenyra as queen would bring harm to her kids so she wants to protect them, call this a stretch but shes more comparable to catelyn in that sense. If you believe her to be like dany i really believe you understood neither character. Dany wanted the throne because it was her birthright which aligns more with rhaenyra in this sense, alicent wants aegon to have it because she believes thats the way to keep her children safe.
How does Alicent compare to Catelyn? because last time I checked Catelyn didn't usurp any throne from their rightful heir @@Eytaa_
@@user-mt2fp9zx6c “shes more comparable to catelyn in that sence” my exact words with “in that sence” referring to both of them wanting to protect their children from someone or something they see as ‘evil’
Ok, well, we know that Rhaenyra will never be queen, and all the Targaryens will be killed off under Bran (Jon doesn’t count)? For some reason, this knowledge helps you relax and just enjoy watching it, rather than participating in useless fandom wars.
Targaryens from Rhaenyra's line ruled the 7 kingdoms for 200 years after her death and not all of them are dead. You know who's dead? Otto's non-existent ancestors
What’s the point of such a government if none of them left any legacy? The war between Rhaenyra and Aegon led to the death of the only thing that distinguished the Targaryens from others - dragons. And then the Lannisters, Baratheons and other noble houses danced on the bones of these “brave descendants”. The moral of this story is sad, unfortunately, and the war ended with only poor children without parents with a broken psyche surviving, and the council included representatives of both factions, who then took all power. Forever)))
Not you defending the greens 🤢
Not you supporting the blacks 🤢🤮🤮
Boo fn hoo. The blacks and the greens are both bad so you defending the blacks is also 🤢... people have their opinions. I'm fine eith people defending team black just let me defend my team. Team black is more toxic than team green and it's so obvious.
😊 what wrong with that
why not?
go find another reaction then
Then get away💚
No, you're not the best HoTD reactor. That'd be Sophie from Sophie Reacts. Understands each character and is very good with lore. And just for reaction part, it'd be Blind Wave, Reel Rejects and so on.