The 4 male torx bolts that are by the timing chain area can be removed and installed using a 3/8" socket. The two inside the chain area aren't in Chilton's book.
Yes, unfortunately they all seem to be made like this now :( That 1973 Valiant 4 door on the rock pile in Arizona is looking better all the time! Kick the Rattlesnakes out, load it onto a trailer, and 6 months later voila a real car is on the rad again! One you can actually repair.
thank you for your response sir.I commute 80miles a day to work.I just heard poeple getting up to 500,000 miles on there little toyota echoes with original timing chains, thats wild! think ill look for one,they are very basic with roll up windows ect..what I really dislike is how tough its getting to find a standard shift transmission 😣
Yes, i just got an old Focus on the road, I hope I can find a spare 5 speed stick for it. that is one reason why i had to fix up another car, and semi retire the old corolla, I didn't have any more 5 speed trannys for it, and couldn't find one. Danged built in absolecents, it REALLY bites!
I hope you still pay attention to this video because I have almost an exact same situation when a 2005 2.2 Ecotec that I'm working on for a friend. None of the exhaust valves have hit the Pistons but all eight intake have hit and are bent. I'm either going to redo the head or put a good use head on it but before I go that far my question to you is this, were you able to salvage that engine without redoing the bottom in with new Pistons? I hate to go through all this work and put this back together and only to find out we should have put an engine in it. The problem is she can't afford a new engine or even a rebuilt and I'm having a hard time locating a decent used one.
Sorry for the long delay, I have been taking a little youtube holiday! I did salvage that engine I never touched the pistons at all, just prepared the block surface by cleaning it well for the new head gasket. i have driven it for 1-1/2 years now, so it was fine. I did use a different head on mine, as my son was concerned about it maybe dropping a valve seat down the road. Not sure what to tell you on that, but it may be OK to just put in new intake valves as long as you check the exhaust valves with gasoline to make sure they don't leak, just dump a little bit into the ports to make certain none leak around the valves. That is the best method I know of to see if any of the valves are bent. I know what it is like to have to repair things on a shoe string budget!
That head is toast! Better get used parts. Not sure if I'd bother fixing it. My Escort Grenaded and I bought another engine for $250. Your list will grow and you'll keep saying " as long as I'm here I should replace this" $$$.
You make a good point, I was a few minutes away from placing about a $400 order to Rockauto, but I nay just hold off on that. We pulled the head apart last night, and other than 10 seriously bent valves, it looks OK. My son is concerned that it might drop a valve seat later, and grenade the engine, in spite of my repairs, it is a serious dilema for sure. I do know that I can't take too long to decide, because nasty weather is gonna arrive fairly soon :(
Oh yes, I fixed it. I have a bunch more vids here showing most of the repair process. It cost me about $400 Canadian with the scrapyard head, gaskets, and new timing and balance shaft chains. i also put all new sprockets on the timing chain. the car is working fine again, thank goodness!
Even though the valves hit the pistons is the block and pistons salvageable or would it need to be rebuilt. I wonder if you can get away with just putting in new valves or do you think the guides are bent as well??
From what I could tell the guides seem to be OK, my son is most concerned about dropping a valve seat in the future, so I am leaning towards a used head.
Thanks for this video. Do you have an idea of what the estimated cost would be for repairing the engine after replacing a timing chain and water pump? What exactly gets damaged and needs to be repaired on the engine when the chain breaks. It broke while the car was sitting idle, FWIW. The person that's going to do the work mentioned valve rings and pistons if I'm remembering correctly. It's a 07 Saturn Ion 2.2L After he replaced the chain and water pump the engine wouldn't turn over. It was an unusual sound, not like normally when the starter is bad or something typical like that keeping the engine from turning. I was wondering if the timing was wrong on the chain or something. I wish I had knowledge enough to open it up and check. Anyways, he said it would cost $1100 to repair what was damaged by the chain breaking. Hopefully, he doesn't just repair or replace one thing knowing other things should be checked and repaired also and try to charge me more for another job. Maybe you could give me a clue on what ask him next time I talk to him. Like, is it the valve, the pistons or whatever. Maybe multiple things? Sorry for the long post lol. He does pretty good work and seems to have fair pricing. He fixed my trans that was slipping for about $380 when everyone else wanted thousands! Charged me a flat rate for the water pump and timing chain.. $650 Thanks for any help you can give... EDIT* You posted a video of you finally getting it started again in this video ua-cam.com/video/zVWu6xKXK5w/v-deo.html That is kinda what mine sounds like, minus it actually starting, unfortunately. Think the engine needs repairing?
To be truthful with you, I have no idea what it would cost to have it repaired, as I do all of my own work. I got a scrapyard cylinder head, in case mine was damaged. Other than replacing all of the timing chains, gaskets etc. the job was fairly straight forward.
all 16 of mine got bent, chain went doin 60mph. dont be scared, valves are 30$ , seat new ones put it back together ittl be fine..clean the tops of those pistons and dont over think it.been there done that. while head is off remove casting burs with cone, runs better than new.
Your left chain guide broke because it is bolted to the head and the block! There is a torx stopper bolt in the head that comes out to remove the 10mm bolt that secures the guide.....
Yes, i finally found my proper tool for it, and got the job done, but not without some cursing. Now the water pump is leaking oil, and of course it is driven by the balance shaft chain. I have purchased the special tool to hold the chain sprocket in place. More fun with GM
at about 200,000 miles it broke, though I have heard of them going long before that. Personally I would change it at 120,000 miles to hopefully be safe. One thing is for sure, it won't last forever!
this due to poor oiling system in these engines. if you can catch it before breaking, you can replace the oiler nozzle with one that has better design and larger holes... also replace the the Shaft Balance tensioner. Synthetic oil helps prevent sludge from builing and clogging the tiny oiling holes in the nozzle and the tensioner.
Thanks for the info, I don't think I replaced the oiler nozzle, unless it came with the timing chain parts. Guess I will have to keep my fingers crossed!
Where do you find the better oiler nozzle? Mine just grenaded so I need to rebuild or replace the motor. I want to upgrade all the garbage parts though
I think the guides are OK, my son talked me into putting on a different head, in case the seats were damaged in the collision with the valves. I wouldn't want to fix it then drop a valve seat 2 months later!!!
I would bet that the valves took all the damage, the cam followers and all should be fine. The valve stems in those 4 valve OHC engines are tiny. You're probably better off trying to find a low mileage used head though. Around here at least, you can get them for $50 a piece if you pull it yourself. You'd likely need to at least regrind the seats on yours, and check the guides plus the cost of new valves. Pistons don't look too bad luckily.
I decided to get a used head, it cost $100, must be Canadian pricing, as one place wanted $350 for a whole engine, I pulled one for $200, it has 30,000 miles less than my engine that blew its mind. I decided it was easier to put the different head onto my block, that way I have a new head gasket, timing and balance shaft chains etc, so it should be good for a long time. I am NOT a fan of timing chains on OHC engines now.
THANKS FOR THE VIDEO HOPE THAT WORK AND THE CAR I BEEN FIXING I JUST PUT NEW CHAIN AND DONT STARE BECAUSE THAT I AM DONT MECANIC BUT I LIKE NEW CHALENGES
I hope you are able to get the car running properly again. Doing this job was definitely a challenge. I highly recommend the video by Cloyes, it will help a lot!
I don't understand why none of the manufacturers put a jackshaft to drive the cam like you see on the Crosley Cobra!! As soon as I get my mill up, i think it'll be time for some conversion experiments!!
How did you get the head out? There are two bolts by the chain. One towards the back of the car and one towards the front kinda under the chain. This is where I’m stuck at. Please any help.
They are the smaller 10 mm star shaped. I removed all head bolts inside(big black ones) and the two outer head bolts( small star shaped) and one star shaped inside by the chain. But the one closest to alternator is under the chain...
Hmmm, I don't recall having that problem, although, my chain was broken in two. I do recall that there are 4 of the star shaped bolts to be removed. So I went out and looked at an engine block, and the bolt at the front does sit closer to the chain sprocket. Reading the Haynes manual, it sounds like you will have to possibly remove the camshafts to gain access to the head bolts. i can't locate my old cylinder head to verify this, but normally that is the case on these 4 valve engines. Best of luck with the repair.
I have a ? my 01 Chevy cavalier the motor shakes real bad when I hooked it up to a diagnostic tool it tells me misfire but I don't think the motor shaking with a knock is a miss fire
I would do a compression test on it, a compression guage is pretty cheap at some place like Harbor frieght. In the process, you will have to take the spark plugs out, so examine them, I usually wire brush them clean, smack the ground electrode to close the gap up a bit (if it is too wide), apply some anti-seize to the threads, and put them back in. If they are severely worn I will replace the spark plugs. To do the compression test I would take all of the spark plugs out, disconnect the ignition module, and pull out the fuse or relay for the fuel pump. This should tell you if the engine is OK, or if you have a dead cylinder on your hands. Though if everything checks out, it could be a dead fuel injector also.
Yes, that is true, however, they won't allow me to build a Briggs powered vehicle that I could drive to work in the winter. Well, not that I am aware of. Perhaps I need to build up another Briggs 4 for use in this car, though I would have to put it on a SERIOUS diet to reduce weight. You know, no interior except 2 seats, hollowed out trunk with tissue paper thick lid, super skinny tire etc. :)
Damn, mine bent every single intake valve super hard and bent most of the exhaust a little. I'd never own another one of those, even though the car was free to me.
I hear you, if I didn't already have too much money AND time invested in this car, it would be headed to the crusher. If this thing screws up like this again, I will cancel the insurance on it, and burn it ass! :)
I put like $600 into mine and like 40 hours and it wound up running good but had a miss on cylinder 4 that was valve related so I dumped that shit for $1000 cash. Oh well. Gave me something to do I guess - beat my own ass LOL!
I am starting to think so, I have a phone call into a wrecker already. My son is worried I will spend my money on new valves etc., and it will drop a valve seat pouching the engine!
Many U-pull places won't sell part of an assembly. Want a window regulator? Buy the whole door. Need a cylinder head? Buy the whole motor. This keeps them from throwing away half their inventory with unsellable or incomplete items. It kinda makes sense but even this head can be fixed by a reputable machinist. Years ago the head on a Focus and 8 valves only cost ~$325 and looked NEW when we got it back.
Question hopefully someone can help just replaced the timing chain and guides noticed that my rockers were loose so I replaced both the rockers and valve lifter but I can literally pull the rockers out by hand anyone know what may be the cause thanks.
What engine are you talking about, is it a GM 2.2 like this? To be able to pull the rockers out by hand is pretty strange, on any engine where things are adjusted properly!
@@rodneyadkins7709 Ouch, that is NOT good! 10 of the valves in my engine were bent in an S shape, but the pistons were not damaged, and the car is still running.
It has been a few years, so my memory is a bit foggy, but the used head was 100, then there was the head gasket set, and the timing chain with tensioner etc. I bought the Cloyes set and and it has worked fine. Sorry I can't be more precise. Oh, I also bought the water pump sprocket holder tool. All in all a pain in the butt job, but the car is still operating today.
I never heard of chains breaking that often.I guess the s10 and silverado poeple are going a few hundred thousand miles on them.my tundra of course has a belt i change every 100k.if you have to change a chain every 120k theres really no benefit over a belt.
In my opinion a chain should be good for somewhere between 200 and 250,000 km before needing a change. Mine snapped at around 325,000 km, so apparently that was too long. I totally agree about changing a timing belt at the recommended interval of 100,000 km (or whatever the manufacturer recommends) I have always done that, and never had a failure, even on the old VW diesels from the 80s. I changed many a VW timing belt and head gasket, as those blew also. That is one of the things that frustrated me about this chain breaking, I couldn't find a recommended change interval.
Have a machine shop replace the valves, pull pistons top dead buff the high spots off we’re the valves hit. So nothing flacks come off later, reinstating everything. It will be fine I own a shop, and stand behind my work never had one come back. A flew marks in the pistons isn’t going hurt a thing. And head we’ll be fine once machine shop checks it over and replaces valves.
I did as you said to the pistons, as they were not damaged. I decided to put on a different head, since 10 of the 16 valves were bent. the car has indeed ran fine for 2 years now.
Yes, that would indeed work! Why didn't I think of that! Actually I did about 15 years ago, but the expense and all of the machine work required made me have to leave it at the preliminary drawing stage :( This engine needs more power, supercharged 2 stroke full speed camshaft, here I come!!!! :) I am sure it would pass everything but an emissions test!
Yes, it really had a bad day! Luckily I was able to repair it, and the car only went to the scrapyard in 2023 after I discovered the front frame was rotting away.
I guess, I think it kicked in way off kilter !!! :( I am putting on a different head soon, pulled all the valves out, will lap them and put on new oil seals. I have to get moving, as winter could happen in a few weeks! Though luckily it has been close to 60F some days still.
Yes, it probably bent some valves, since this one did it just above idle. I suspect the chain lets go at lower rpms, as it would be flung out more at higher rpm, so it would in effect be tighter. But at low rpms it probably flops around more and can try to jump a tooth easier, just my guess as to the events.
@@ChargerMiles007 you're right I'm trying to decide if I want to spend the money I'm a mechanic so t's just parts but do I want to spend $600 to fix a $500 car.
Yes, I considered it lucky that it only bent valves. The car is still running, but has a weird problem where it won't rev over about 4200 rpm in any gear. I replaced the throttle position sensor, the whole ignition system with no luck. It is now an around town car only. When spring finally arrives I will pull the catalytic convertor off to see if it is plugged. Been bit of a head scratcher.
I personally would recommend you change the chain! My wife just pilled up to a stop sign, and BLAM 10 bent valves when she tried to drive away from stopping, right out of the blue. Sorry that I bitch and moan a bit during the vids about the broken timing chain, but it came as a big shock at the time. I think I was a bit hard on GM at the time, as the car has driven the last year just fine. changing the timing chain won't be free, but if you plan to keep the car another year or two, getting it done should take away one big headache.
I feel for you! I am going to make a vid where I strongly recommend changing the chain at 150,000 miles, or 240,000 kilometers, at the most! One thing is for sure, these danged chains don't last forever. The strange thing is that it seems to be hard to find a recommended replacement interval for them. I disagree with that policy, since timing belts have a must change interval spelled out in black and white!
ok mine has lasted till 300000km but the only reason I brought up this video is that my transmission bearing is starting to go and if from what i hear of you folks this is just the start. thanks for the post coroner analysis of what can happen!
this would of not happened if you don't change your oil 3-4k mile oil change and its tune up my saturn have 200k and running like new and its not burning oil
I hate to tell you, but I do change the oil, and I use Mobil 1 synthetic. You might as well face it, timing chains won't last forever, I found out the hard way!
ChargerMiles007 Indeed, I've been lucky though. My Ion has 227,000 miles and still going strong, the chain does rattle when starting but I have a new tensioner I haven't put on yet. These 2.2 ecotec are great engines, timing components are a weak point though.
The 4 male torx bolts that are by the timing chain area can be removed and installed using a 3/8" socket. The two inside the chain area aren't in Chilton's book.
GM's throwaway vehicles.
Yes, unfortunately they all seem to be made like this now :( That 1973 Valiant 4 door on the rock pile in Arizona is looking better all the time! Kick the Rattlesnakes out, load it onto a trailer, and 6 months later voila a real car is on the rad again! One you can actually repair.
thank you for your response sir.I commute 80miles a day to work.I just heard poeple getting up to 500,000 miles on there little toyota echoes with original timing chains, thats wild! think ill look for one,they are very basic with roll up windows ect..what I really dislike is how tough its getting to find a standard shift transmission 😣
Yes, i just got an old Focus on the road, I hope I can find a spare 5 speed stick for it. that is one reason why i had to fix up another car, and semi retire the old corolla, I didn't have any more 5 speed trannys for it, and couldn't find one. Danged built in absolecents, it REALLY bites!
I hope you still pay attention to this video because I have almost an exact same situation when a 2005 2.2 Ecotec that I'm working on for a friend. None of the exhaust valves have hit the Pistons but all eight intake have hit and are bent. I'm either going to redo the head or put a good use head on it but before I go that far my question to you is this, were you able to salvage that engine without redoing the bottom in with new Pistons? I hate to go through all this work and put this back together and only to find out we should have put an engine in it. The problem is she can't afford a new engine or even a rebuilt and I'm having a hard time locating a decent used one.
Sorry for the long delay, I have been taking a little youtube holiday! I did salvage that engine I never touched the pistons at all, just prepared the block surface by cleaning it well for the new head gasket. i have driven it for 1-1/2 years now, so it was fine. I did use a different head on mine, as my son was concerned about it maybe dropping a valve seat down the road. Not sure what to tell you on that, but it may be OK to just put in new intake valves as long as you check the exhaust valves with gasoline to make sure they don't leak, just dump a little bit into the ports to make certain none leak around the valves. That is the best method I know of to see if any of the valves are bent. I know what it is like to have to repair things on a shoe string budget!
Love the saying "Drive Em until they drop then turn Em into a Low Rider"
LOL, I have been saying that for years :) I have yet to make a Low Rider though, the Enforcement here are pretty strict about such matters!
That head is toast! Better get used parts. Not sure if I'd bother fixing it. My Escort Grenaded and I bought another engine for $250. Your list will grow and you'll keep saying " as long as I'm here I should replace this" $$$.
You make a good point, I was a few minutes away from placing about a $400 order to Rockauto, but I nay just hold off on that. We pulled the head apart last night, and other than 10 seriously bent valves, it looks OK. My son is concerned that it might drop a valve seat later, and grenade the engine, in spite of my repairs, it is a serious dilema for sure. I do know that I can't take too long to decide, because nasty weather is gonna arrive fairly soon :(
Did you fix it? I have the same problem and trying to decide what to do before I even take it apart
Oh yes, I fixed it. I have a bunch more vids here showing most of the repair process. It cost me about $400 Canadian with the scrapyard head, gaskets, and new timing and balance shaft chains. i also put all new sprockets on the timing chain. the car is working fine again, thank goodness!
Even though the valves hit the pistons is the block and pistons salvageable or would it need to be rebuilt.
I wonder if you can get away with just putting in new valves or do you think the guides are bent as well??
From what I could tell the guides seem to be OK, my son is most concerned about dropping a valve seat in the future, so I am leaning towards a used head.
Thanks for this video. Do you have an idea of what the estimated cost would be for repairing the engine after replacing a timing chain and water pump? What exactly gets damaged and needs to be repaired on the engine when the chain breaks. It broke while the car was sitting idle, FWIW. The person that's going to do the work mentioned valve rings and pistons if I'm remembering correctly. It's a 07 Saturn Ion 2.2L
After he replaced the chain and water pump the engine wouldn't turn over. It was an unusual sound, not like normally when the starter is bad or something typical like that keeping the engine from turning. I was wondering if the timing was wrong on the chain or something. I wish I had knowledge enough to open it up and check.
Anyways, he said it would cost $1100 to repair what was damaged by the chain breaking. Hopefully, he doesn't just repair or replace one thing knowing other things should be checked and repaired also and try to charge me more for another job. Maybe you could give me a clue on what ask him next time I talk to him. Like, is it the valve, the pistons or whatever. Maybe multiple things? Sorry for the long post lol. He does pretty good work and seems to have fair pricing. He fixed my trans that was slipping for about $380 when everyone else wanted thousands! Charged me a flat rate for the water pump and timing chain.. $650
Thanks for any help you can give...
EDIT*
You posted a video of you finally getting it started again in this video
ua-cam.com/video/zVWu6xKXK5w/v-deo.html
That is kinda what mine sounds like, minus it actually starting, unfortunately. Think the engine needs repairing?
To be truthful with you, I have no idea what it would cost to have it repaired, as I do all of my own work. I got a scrapyard cylinder head, in case mine was damaged. Other than replacing all of the timing chains, gaskets etc. the job was fairly straight forward.
all 16 of mine got bent, chain went doin 60mph. dont be scared, valves are 30$ , seat new ones put it back together ittl be fine..clean the tops of those pistons and dont over think it.been there done that. while head is off remove casting burs with cone, runs better than new.
Your left chain guide broke because it is bolted to the head and the block! There is a torx stopper bolt in the head that comes out to remove the 10mm bolt that secures the guide.....
Yes, i finally found my proper tool for it, and got the job done, but not without some cursing. Now the water pump is leaking oil, and of course it is driven by the balance shaft chain. I have purchased the special tool to hold the chain sprocket in place. More fun with GM
please tell me,at how many miles did it break the chain???
at about 200,000 miles it broke, though I have heard of them going long before that. Personally I would change it at 120,000 miles to hopefully be safe. One thing is for sure, it won't last forever!
Same thing happened to mine (one of the “rollers” was even popped out) but they were all fine, even the one that popped out.
I found part of the busted chain link in the oil pan (I stuck a little rare earth magnet onto the oil plug, and the broken steel parts found it! :)
this due to poor oiling system in these engines. if you can catch it before breaking, you can replace the oiler nozzle with one that has better design and larger holes... also replace the the Shaft Balance tensioner. Synthetic oil helps prevent sludge from builing and clogging the tiny oiling holes in the nozzle and the tensioner.
Thanks for the info, I don't think I replaced the oiler nozzle, unless it came with the timing chain parts. Guess I will have to keep my fingers crossed!
Where do you find the better oiler nozzle? Mine just grenaded so I need to rebuild or replace the motor. I want to upgrade all the garbage parts though
Do you have to replace the whole head? Are the valve guides salvage able.
I think the guides are OK, my son talked me into putting on a different head, in case the seats were damaged in the collision with the valves. I wouldn't want to fix it then drop a valve seat 2 months later!!!
ChargerMiles007 Good point
I would bet that the valves took all the damage, the cam followers and all should be fine. The valve stems in those 4 valve OHC engines are tiny. You're probably better off trying to find a low mileage used head though. Around here at least, you can get them for $50 a piece if you pull it yourself. You'd likely need to at least regrind the seats on yours, and check the guides plus the cost of new valves. Pistons don't look too bad luckily.
I decided to get a used head, it cost $100, must be Canadian pricing, as one place wanted $350 for a whole engine, I pulled one for $200, it has 30,000 miles less than my engine that blew its mind. I decided it was easier to put the different head onto my block, that way I have a new head gasket, timing and balance shaft chains etc, so it should be good for a long time. I am NOT a fan of timing chains on OHC engines now.
THANKS FOR THE VIDEO HOPE THAT WORK AND THE CAR I BEEN FIXING I JUST PUT NEW CHAIN AND DONT STARE BECAUSE THAT I AM DONT MECANIC BUT I LIKE NEW CHALENGES
I hope you are able to get the car running properly again. Doing this job was definitely a challenge. I highly recommend the video by Cloyes, it will help a lot!
It's a good thing that timing chain breakages don't happen too often.
I don't understand why none of the manufacturers put a jackshaft to drive the cam like you see on the Crosley Cobra!! As soon as I get my mill up, i think it'll be time for some conversion experiments!!
Slappy Fistwad planned obsolescence
How did you get the head out? There are two bolts by the chain. One towards the back of the car and one towards the front kinda under the chain. This is where I’m stuck at. Please any help.
They are the smaller 10 mm star shaped. I removed all head bolts inside(big black ones) and the two outer head bolts( small star shaped) and one star shaped inside by the chain. But the one closest to alternator is under the chain...
Hmmm, I don't recall having that problem, although, my chain was broken in two. I do recall that there are 4 of the star shaped bolts to be removed. So I went out and looked at an engine block, and the bolt at the front does sit closer to the chain sprocket. Reading the Haynes manual, it sounds like you will have to possibly remove the camshafts to gain access to the head bolts. i can't locate my old cylinder head to verify this, but normally that is the case on these 4 valve engines. Best of luck with the repair.
Thank you. That’s what i gathered. Just want to make sure I keep it in time
You are welcome, hope it works well for you. There is a great vid on the Cloyes channel showing how to set the timing.
Do you need to replace cylinder head or just valve's and piston's ?
I am replacing the head, in case the valve seats were damaged, the pistons should be okay.
You can save the head but probably cheaper to get a new one
I have a ? my 01 Chevy cavalier the motor shakes real bad when I hooked it up to a diagnostic tool it tells me misfire but I don't think the motor shaking with a knock is a miss fire
I would do a compression test on it, a compression guage is pretty cheap at some place like Harbor frieght. In the process, you will have to take the spark plugs out, so examine them, I usually wire brush them clean, smack the ground electrode to close the gap up a bit (if it is too wide), apply some anti-seize to the threads, and put them back in. If they are severely worn I will replace the spark plugs. To do the compression test I would take all of the spark plugs out, disconnect the ignition module, and pull out the fuse or relay for the fuel pump. This should tell you if the engine is OK, or if you have a dead cylinder on your hands. Though if everything checks out, it could be a dead fuel injector also.
bad injector?
Just think of all the Briggs that can be had for trade at the scrapyard!!!
Yes, that is true, however, they won't allow me to build a Briggs powered vehicle that I could drive to work in the winter. Well, not that I am aware of. Perhaps I need to build up another Briggs 4 for use in this car, though I would have to put it on a SERIOUS diet to reduce weight. You know, no interior except 2 seats, hollowed out trunk with tissue paper thick lid, super skinny tire etc. :)
Damn, mine bent every single intake valve super hard and bent most of the exhaust a little. I'd never own another one of those, even though the car was free to me.
I hear you, if I didn't already have too much money AND time invested in this car, it would be headed to the crusher. If this thing screws up like this again, I will cancel the insurance on it, and burn it ass! :)
I put like $600 into mine and like 40 hours and it wound up running good but had a miss on cylinder 4 that was valve related so I dumped that shit for $1000 cash. Oh well. Gave me something to do I guess - beat my own ass LOL!
Would it be cheaper to buy a good used head from a auto wrecker?
I am starting to think so, I have a phone call into a wrecker already. My son is worried I will spend my money on new valves etc., and it will drop a valve seat pouching the engine!
Many U-pull places won't sell part of an assembly. Want a window regulator? Buy the whole door. Need a cylinder head? Buy the whole motor. This keeps them from throwing away half their inventory with unsellable or incomplete items. It kinda makes sense but even this head can be fixed by a reputable machinist. Years ago the head on a Focus and 8 valves only cost ~$325 and looked NEW when we got it back.
Kenny C with the cost of some new valves on this thing and even a head gasket kit, it’s looking like I can fix mine for about $150.
@@_BAD_MERC_ Ken did you finish the job on it
I know here ,In woodstock Ont,I can get a whole running engine from the Wreckers for 200.00 bucks..
Really, that sounds like a good price to me!
Not an ecotec motor because they are shit
well i am sorry to see that happen to you, but we will just have to send a mopar small block up there as a replacement.
Right on!!!! :)
Question hopefully someone can help just replaced the timing chain and guides noticed that my rockers were loose so I replaced both the rockers and valve lifter but I can literally pull the rockers out by hand anyone know what may be the cause thanks.
What engine are you talking about, is it a GM 2.2 like this? To be able to pull the rockers out by hand is pretty strange, on any engine where things are adjusted properly!
@@ChargerMiles007 yes I think the values are bent causing the head springs to compress
@@rodneyadkins7709 Ouch, that is NOT good! 10 of the valves in my engine were bent in an S shape, but the pistons were not damaged, and the car is still running.
How much did it cost to fix all that
It has been a few years, so my memory is a bit foggy, but the used head was 100, then there was the head gasket set, and the timing chain with tensioner etc. I bought the Cloyes set and and it has worked fine. Sorry I can't be more precise. Oh, I also bought the water pump sprocket holder tool. All in all a pain in the butt job, but the car is still operating today.
I never heard of chains breaking that often.I guess the s10 and silverado poeple are going a few hundred thousand miles on them.my tundra of course has a belt i change every 100k.if you have to change a chain every 120k theres really no benefit over a belt.
In my opinion a chain should be good for somewhere between 200 and 250,000 km before needing a change. Mine snapped at around 325,000 km, so apparently that was too long. I totally agree about changing a timing belt at the recommended interval of 100,000 km (or whatever the manufacturer recommends) I have always done that, and never had a failure, even on the old VW diesels from the 80s. I changed many a VW timing belt and head gasket, as those blew also. That is one of the things that frustrated me about this chain breaking, I couldn't find a recommended change interval.
ChargerMiles007 80k because they are stretched and the tensioner is weak from vibration and heat cycles
Have a machine shop replace the valves, pull pistons top dead buff the high spots off we’re the valves hit. So nothing flacks come off later, reinstating everything. It will be fine I own a shop, and stand behind my work never had one come back. A flew marks in the pistons isn’t going hurt a thing. And head we’ll be fine once machine shop checks it over and replaces valves.
I did as you said to the pistons, as they were not damaged. I decided to put on a different head, since 10 of the 16 valves were bent. the car has indeed ran fine for 2 years now.
@@ChargerMiles007 have a 2003 Ecotec 2.2 with 200,000 miles on it. Anything I can do to prevent This disaster.
Convert to sleeve valve. Never worry about this problem again!
Yes, that would indeed work! Why didn't I think of that!
Actually I did about 15 years ago, but the expense and all of the machine work required made me have to leave it at the preliminary drawing stage :(
This engine needs more power, supercharged 2 stroke full speed camshaft, here I come!!!! :)
I am sure it would pass everything but an emissions test!
ok how about this: www.kfz-tech.de/Bilder/Kfz-Technik/Motorsteuerung/Koenigswellen01.gif
:-)
Engine in a bad mood, cranky no cranky😂
Yes, it really had a bad day! Luckily I was able to repair it, and the car only went to the scrapyard in 2023 after I discovered the front frame was rotting away.
Got it . ths
Looks like VVT kicked in lol
I guess, I think it kicked in way off kilter !!! :(
I am putting on a different head soon, pulled all the valves out, will lap them and put on new oil seals.
I have to get moving, as winter could happen in a few weeks! Though luckily it has been close to 60F some days still.
Mine did this last weekend I was hoping it survived now I don't think it did.
Yes, it probably bent some valves, since this one did it just above idle. I suspect the chain lets go at lower rpms, as it would be flung out more at higher rpm, so it would in effect be tighter. But at low rpms it probably flops around more and can try to jump a tooth easier, just my guess as to the events.
@@ChargerMiles007 you're right I'm trying to decide if I want to spend the money I'm a mechanic so t's just parts but do I want to spend $600 to fix a $500 car.
Yeah its toast
NOT BAD,, BETTER THAN HOLES IN PISTONS!!
Yes, I considered it lucky that it only bent valves. The car is still running, but has a weird problem where it won't rev over about 4200 rpm in any gear. I replaced the throttle position sensor, the whole ignition system with no luck. It is now an around town car only. When spring finally arrives I will pull the catalytic convertor off to see if it is plugged. Been bit of a head scratcher.
I'm at 320 thousand on my original chain
I personally would recommend you change the chain! My wife just pilled up to a stop sign, and BLAM 10 bent valves when she tried to drive away from stopping, right out of the blue. Sorry that I bitch and moan a bit during the vids about the broken timing chain, but it came as a big shock at the time. I think I was a bit hard on GM at the time, as the car has driven the last year just fine. changing the timing chain won't be free, but if you plan to keep the car another year or two, getting it done should take away one big headache.
man i just spent 1600 my chain went too new chain and cam chain tensioners guides luckily my head was fine
I feel for you! I am going to make a vid where I strongly recommend changing the chain at 150,000 miles, or 240,000 kilometers, at the most! One thing is for sure, these danged chains don't last forever. The strange thing is that it seems to be hard to find a recommended replacement interval for them. I disagree with that policy, since timing belts have a must change interval spelled out in black and white!
Chevy says 90000
i read 50-75k im at 76k im getting worried im gonna have to start doing this haha! what do you think 2009 chevy cobalt 2.2 ecotec
fukz nerdsd if u dont change it use full synthetic oil until u can do not change the tensioner unless u do the chain also that was my mistake
ok mine has lasted till 300000km but the only reason I brought up this video is that my transmission bearing is starting to go and if from what i hear of you folks this is just the start. thanks for the post coroner analysis of what can happen!
this would of not happened if you don't change your oil 3-4k mile oil change and its tune up my saturn have 200k and running like new and its not burning oil
I hate to tell you, but I do change the oil, and I use Mobil 1 synthetic. You might as well face it, timing chains won't last forever, I found out the hard way!
ChargerMiles007 Indeed, I've been lucky though. My Ion has 227,000 miles and still going strong, the chain does rattle when starting but I have a new tensioner I haven't put on yet. These 2.2 ecotec are great engines, timing components are a weak point though.
T Turner the motor is junk if they bash timing parts is worthless