Your wife was spot on when she said that "ordinary people will think they are doing something wrong", because this happens a lot, people save money to dinner in a special restaurant like this and they leave feeling like they don't belong to this kind of place
Yeah, it does a huge sector of the Industry and all his Team Mates a massive disservice too. If I were that Waiter, who handled the situation very modestly, I’d have asked the Somm what the fuck he was playing at. It’s so silly. I have only ever objectionable service in high end restaurants from the person in charge of the wine. It’s such a tired cliche.
@@adamg.manning6088 Unfortunately, the waiter could never criticize the sommelier because he is on the lower end of the restaurant's hierarchy. The waiter can only supervise the bus boys, no way he can tell the sommelier how to do his job properly. It's the customer right to complaint to the restaurant manager about a bad service.
@@WillOneZeroZeroTwoFour Hierarchy be damned: You turn around to your colleague after the shift and get to the bottom of the customer’s bad experience. That’s how good teams operate.
There's always one saleswoman at Chanel who thinks she is a Coco, one salesman at Porsche who thinks he is a Ferdinand. They have little idea who puts the bread on their tables for what.
Wow I absolutely love your expressions, because it is so true. I'm not saying the customer is always right, but who is the one holding the money in this transaction.
@@th3b4rd75 It’s not just about the money. If the sommelier indeed is an arrogant person, just knowing he got 0% tip while his other colleagues (better if their positions are lower than his) received 30% tip, he would feel angry and offended so badly 😈
There is only one michelin star (*) Italian restaurant in LA - Osteria Mozza. It is commendable not mentioning it by name directly, however, I believe a healthy dose of accountability is good for any business to make the necessary improvements. In this case, it would mean getting rid of the Wine Tyranny.
Nathaniel Munoz was the sommelier’s name. Dudes a snob, he even tweeted about wine king that evening, although indirectly and very passive aggressively.
I’ve watched 3 of your videos now and I love the dynamic between you and your wife bringing Asian culture and sentiments to the western world. And I straight up love the South African guy in this video. He’s so brash and straight forward which is the opposite of what we’re taught in Asian culture. So it’s nice to see a good balance and good conversation ❤
@@SéaFid and? Wtf is this ruzzian china proganda m8? South Korea is much more civilize and smart then china thats for sure..... We europeans love japanese and south Koreans. And guess what? everyone hates chinese turists...
I too as an Asian American went to Dine At this OSTERIA MOZZA restaurant in the Melrose/Hollywood district... Unfortunately, I too received horrible rude service....If most of the staff are struggling actors the least they can do is apply that expertise to be gracious towards the guests .... It was as if it was more of an anoyance for us to be there.... I wold never ever go back and steer everyone away from that place.... Btw, I've owned and managed restaurants for nearly 30 years and even was a corporate trainer for restaurant guest service... Sorry but Osteria Mozza failed big time here
Go east if you want a good time. Eastward has everything you want in the utopian pipe dream USA has to offer. I wish you 'Asian Americans' would go eastward rather than settling for the bumbling babylon California that it is.
@@theexcelproject6973 way too big of an Asian population that have money for a high end restaurant to be racist. C’mon give it a rest. U can’t please everyone in the hospitality industry & sometimes there’s bad sec, min , hours & days w/ staff-public interaction !
@@jkl6791 ...good assumption. would be the intelligent decision to look for people who take their job seriously instead taking his personal feeling against innocent customer. Rude people are liability to society as a whole. Don’t like to work with good manners, stay home.
Wow, good guess. Do you go to the restaurant recently? It must not be the first time for him because it's about his attitude to customers. Most people feel the same way about basic emotions. It's like saking your head for 'NO' is universal.
Thanks for this very educational video! I didn't know i can split the check for wines only. Here's my story - I ordered a bottle of 2016 Chianti at a restaurant. When we realized it was actually 2019 vintage, we already emptied 1/3 of the bottle, but I still pointed it out. The wine guy sincerely apologized to us and offered half off or he would bring the new bottle with the vintage I ordered. So I took half off and gave him very generous tip because I think anyone can make a mistake but I appreciated his afford to make it right. Hopefully the sommelier in you video learned a lesson.
유명세와 본인 커리어에 취해서 다른사람을 우습게 본다는게 얼마나 위험한지 저분에게 처음으로 제대로 알려주신분이 와인킹님 같네요 ㅎㅎ 저 소믈리에분이 다른 분들이 오셔도 겸손한 자세로 다른분들에게 좋은 서비스를 해주셨으면 좋겠네요 😊 영상 2년이 지난 지금에서야 보게 되었지만 너무 멋진영상입니다 👍🏻🙏🏻
You actually handled the situation very well. I would have lost it, if I were spending that amount of money and gets shit from someone that was suppose to serve me.
Peter is saying something I totally agree with - most people (not just Americans) avoid confrontation. This leads to a situation in which often people who behave poorly do not get the feedback they should receive (and neither do the people surrounding them). In my view, you did very well by rewarding the type of behaviour you appreciate while at the same time making it clear that as a customer, the kind of treatment you received from the sommelier was unacceptable and should not be rewarded in any way. Both from your order and from the way you approached the wines (and how you formulated your request) it was clear that you are knowledgeable enough about wine to explain how you perceived the Barolo and that you'd prefer to drink it differently. No amount of knowledge of a sommelier can change that if you don't enjoy the tannic structure, as it's a subjective thing. Peter was right to call him out as arrogant.
@@kcts007 If you think it is mostly Americans I don't think you have even been out enough. I have had absolutely horrible experiences in both France and Italy. Worst of my life was in France where we had horrible service because they thought we were all from the US. Even though about 2/3 of the group was from Canada, and multiple spoke French. Second worst of my life was in Cali though, so I'm not trying to say it isn't in the US. I am saying it is hilarious and embarrassing that you think it is mostly anyone other than assholes.
@Spacey Funny enough, in my job and personal life, i always found the east-asians (japanese, koreans and slighlty less the chinese) to be the least confrontational people i ever met, turning always the possible complaints into some sort of passive-aggressive attitudes or "angry" silence. It's curious to see that there are different experiences.
@@kcts007 I have heard Europe has the most terrible service ( not all of Europe of course). There are snobby chefs who can be super rude, if you are a bit clueless about their food.
@Spacey👺 i am singaporean, can agree. we love to complain and we expect people to do their jobs. this is why singaporeans are spoiled by the service standards in singapore airlines and changi airport for example, and when we go overseas we get appalled by horrible service standards especially when they’re so brazen about it
This was a well justified critique. I took the waiter's suggestion and google'd him and see the restaurant now has an opening for a new somm. Nothing like the power of social media!
I don't understand why the channel owners are censoring my replies. I did not mention any names. I only pointed out how the info is freely available to anyone on google.
I am a sommelier in a small hotel in near my home town and I would never think about treating any customer like this. I have met many different people at all levels of the hospitality industry and I do think there is a snobbiness with some whom work in michelin restaurants. Many are good down to earth guys though
Was worried at the start of the video when you said that you didn't tip, but separating the wine and food was 100% the right move. Only punishing the somme but still looking after the rest of the staff, and showing that the $0 tip wasn't because you're cheap, but completely due to the service. If I was you I'd send this video to the GM of the restaurant. Make it clear you don't want anything in return, you aren't asking for a free meal or a refund or anything, you just want them to be aware of your experience so they can correct it moving forward.
I would be curious about the reaction. Some restaurants that offer Haut Cuisine are snobby, arrogant and ignorant. Not all of course. But in some you get asked to not come again even if you ask for salt and pepper as it is an insult to the chef...
That’s why I love you guys channel a lot! You guys did what you have to do. Some people thought they know everything until they find out somebody know things better than them. But they still think they are god like Peter said. Thanks a again for sharing this Jay!
Highjacking this comment to say that 4 seconds of research allowed me to find out that the restaurtan in question is Osteria Mozza and they are currently hiring for Sommeliers
"I'm always so intimidated in this kind of places" -> spot on! I have enjoyed great food and service on various plaes in the US. But the few times we paid more than usual, it was just because of the 'name' of the place. We should be honoured to eat there, or something like that. Well shown here!
I love how you were classy and didn't show off your credentials but I totally wish you schooled that sommelier. Having his face drop when he realises you are a more knowledgeable and bigger wine professional than him would have been hilarious. Love the videos and would love more wine tastings with Peter! More content please!
I don't know how I stumbled on this video but what an interesting find! The cuts with your friend are awesome little bits of storytelling, your wife describing how customers get "overwhelmed" by fine restaurants. I know nothing about fine dining and even less about wine but this was so interesting.
와인킹님 영상 상당히 오랜만에 보는데 대박이네요. 아내분과 침착하게 말씀 나누시는거 보고 엄청 서로 위해주는 것 같아서 멋있어요! 기념적이고 좋은 날을 한사람 때문에 망칠 수는 없다는 말이 엄청 와닿네요. 저였으면 괜히 웨이터한테도 퉁명스러울텐데 웨이터한테 감사표시하는 것도 진짜 멋있네요 영상 감사합니다^^7
This video made me thing quite a bit about what distinguishes good or excelent service from 'normal' or bad service. And how to react to the latter - you aimed not to ruin the mood on the table, you articulated your concerns, you tipped separately (great idea) and you showed your appreciation to the other server. Seems to me very much the right thing to do - thanks for sharing!
Peter was so right about how fine dining in the US is so different than the rest of the world. I find this holds to be true in most North American major city centers (e.g., LA, New York, Chicago, etc.) where they get so many people coming, they lose focus on the customer experience. People also tend to have much lower expectations and feel they need to accommodate the restaurant instead of the other way around in North America. There are exceptions of course, such as Montreal, which is a food mecca of great dining and customer service. Michelin star ratings have become a farce over the years, and I no longer prescribe to them. Much better is trusting the experience of friends whose opinion you trust.
@@xyz-pg3zd LA culture is parasitic. Everyone thinks they are important and it’s so vain. No humility at all. SF is no different. People realized and they’re now leaving.
in my own, admittedly limited, experience staff at fancy restaurants get offended a lot more easily if you have a complaint than in normal restaurants. One time I ordered tea with milk after a meal in a more fancy restaurant and as I started drinking, I realized immediately that the milk had gone sour. I told the staff and he almost started arguing with me over it. As if I couldn't tell the difference 🤨Needless to say, nothing remotely similar ever happened to me in any "ordinary" restaurant. They'd always apologize immediately and fix it without complaining.
Great video! Loved the way you and your wife handled the situation at hand. It’s unfortunate that this happened at a so called Michelin star restaurant.
I live in LA and experiences like this are why I generally do not do fine dining in LA and why Michelin means nothing here. In New York many Michelin starred restaurants are easily on par with others in the world, not all, but many. In LA service as a whole in Michelin starred restaurants is not up to standard. LA has a culture of super casual restaurants and the service standards frankly are in-line with that. Diners here in LA also, in general, are not used to proper fine dining service and as a result don't demand it. It all starts with the service standards from management.
LA is full of examples of what shouldn't be done. It's where all the black sheep from the Midwest move to. Another way to think of it is as "a streetlight that attracts all the bugs."
I'm from LA but lived all over the states, long trips in Europe, Asia, Africa. Gotta say that NY, Paris and Milan had the douchiest service. Like they were looking as if I slighted them in some way. Felt their discomfort when I didn't do anything to cause them to feel that way. Might be biased but LA mostly had chill service. Def had to throw that douchiness back a few times. Didn't do it on vacation because I didn't want to ruin the trip for us. But at mfing home, I'm going to let them know.
@@rks5457 NYCer here who lived in LA for four years. The problem with SoCal is the low quality service for just about everything. Granted, I don't care for the douchebag attitudes in NYC, but the quality is there. Paris is horrid.
Man I thought you held yourself very well. You encouraged your wife to enjoy the time and experience with you despite the circumstances. That shows immense wisdom. Splitting the bill was a master stroke. I am super impressed with your character.
Putting the wine on a separate table is normal practice at fine dining, mainly because they want to keep your table free for the food and be able to see your guests without issue. However, a good somm should be keeping an eye on your glasses and without ever asking, refill it, anticipating your needs. This somm chose to ignore your needs, let alone anticipate them.
Manager is extremely at fault for not dealing with this, just because they have 1 Michelin doesn’t mean they aren’t lazy and don’t have their faults lmao. Handled it well great job.
You are an amazing customer. Any restaurant should be pleased to have you. Found your channel recently and really enjoy how you handle bad experiences and appreciate good experiences.
That's also an incredibly busy restaurant to be Michelin-starred, with a lot of tables and a lot of buzz. Not sure if it's normal for LA, but here in Italy Michelin-starred restaurants (even non-Michelin-starred fine dining restaurants) usually have just a fraction of tables than cheaper venues, even before with got covid restrictions (my local 1-star restaurant, San Domenico, can only serve 37 people total and it's not a small venue, that kind of noise and sheer amount of people would not be tolerated here). I'm sorry you had to experience that kind of service by the sommelier, feel free to hit me up if you plan to come to Italy for fine dining (Michelin-starred or otherwise), I can suggest nice places I've personally been to in most bigger cities! Keep up the great content!
Yeah I was thinking that too you can tell how pack it is because you can hear all the ppl talking background rather than music to enjoy your wine and meal
Michelin uses differing inspectors accross the entire globe. Flying the same team of reviewers around everywhere would be too expensive and time consuming, so the inspections tend to be regional. This means the guide will tend to favor different environments accross different regions. They basically hire people who've been working in a region's high end cullinary/hopsitality segment, so w/e is favored in that region will typically score well. This type of place is super common in LA, so it wouldn't pull off anything from the rating for a 1/2 star.
Yeah, what the hell. When I think Michelin star restaurant, I am thinking peace and quiet dining experience. Even our local McDonald's doesn't have this much noise and is better lit.
As always, great video. The bottle should stay at the customer's table, period. Michelin-star restaurants should always give elevated service..that's what you're paying for. If you wanted the wine decanted...it should've happened without the Somm having an issue. They are there to serve you and treat you to a first-class bottle service experience.
I am confused...why are the wine bottles not at the customer's table? They are afraid that the customers will glug it down like a soda? Or sabotage the bottle and ask for a new one?
@@Razorwindsg Restaurants that merit the Michelin guide, especially fine dining ones (Michelin has...broadened....their scope in recent years) should be a full dining experience. Waiters should be attentive and your glass shouldn't run dry without staff noticing. When you're paying for high-end dining, the small details are what complete the experience, things such as not having a cluttered table where you even need to consider the possibility of knocking over a bottle or spilling as you pour. Tidbits like this seem a tad ridiculous, but when enough things are done well, they add up into making your night as perfect as possible, which is the ultimate goal of these restaurants.
I love this video so much. Despite paying so much for a meal and getting terrible wine service, you found the best way to deal with it. So glad that waiter got a nice tip while the sommelier got no tip for his lack of service. Just what we can hear from the table waiter, he sounds great, I'm glad he got his. To be fair to the sommelier, if he'd simply recognized he was dealing with someone who knew more (or at least as much) about wine as he did, he could have done a much better job. Unfortunately he didn't, and your mentor is correct, he screwed up royally.
마인드 너무 좋으세요, 새삼 다시한번 놀랍니다. 예전에 비슷한 경험이 있었는데 같이간 일행의 기분이 풀리지 많아 끝내 즐거운 자리로 마무리 되지 못했습니다. 같은 상황에서 더 유쾌하게 풀어내시는 제이님과 와이프 분의 반응을 보니 두분이 좋은 단짝인것 같아 부럽기도 하고 보기 좋습니다. :)
The funniest part about the sommelier, is that in somm school they explicitly tell you to never be snobby or pretentious about wine because it only turns people away from wine. I have been in the business forever and I can't stand snobby service. There is no room in the industry for it. Treat everyone like there special. For a lot of people this is a big deal for them, they don't get out to a fancy place that often. Show them a good time and make them feel comfortable , they in turn will treat you accordingly. Who cares if they want to pour their own wine or put ice in it, I am just happy they are getting wine and enjoying themselves.
Splitting the bill is a great solution. Thankfully I've never had that situation, partly because I don't know enough about wine and partly because I've never paid for myself outside the UK...where I think service is decent, but not being a wine expert, I wouldn't know anyway! I can just about tell a Shiraz from a Pinot Noir ☺
Thanks for sharing! Looks like Osteria Mozza. Can't let one staffer/big money maker risk ruining their hard earned Michelin star. Maybe share this with Michelin directly if they take feedback?
Sure because in a micheline restaurant everything has to work. Ofc its "just one staffer", but in a michelin restaurant its just not acceptable. They have to know who they hire. Service and atmosphere are also a reason for a michelin star.
So, I've worked in restaurants and I'd suggest the following... 1) You should contact the restaurant and find out who is running the service. This could be the head waiter, it could be the chef. Tell them about yourself. 2) Talk about what the somm. did, specifically the service you didn't get. About how he made a face when you asked him to decant the wine. 3) Talk about how it made you feel, how it made your wife feel. Say something like "We came here for a good experience and it was spoiled for because he was offended that I didn't think the wine was what he thought it was." (or something) on your trip to America. 4) And send the video. Generally speaking, they'll try to make it right by offering you to come in for another service. I suspect you won't be flying out again. Given that they may actually send you off to a place near you, or refund your money (as they should). But it's important that you do this because this guy may be running rough-shod over people and/or not providing the service with the expertise required for regular people. And that's not fair.
I can't believe the sommelier wouldn't recommend decanting a 2016 Barolo himself! The vintage is drinking well but still very young. I would not drink a '16 Barolo without decanting, period. I think Peter is right. Some somms do not like informed customers because they prefer to present themselves as all-knowing oracles.
100. Those very same sommes likely hate channels like this because the average consumer is now much more educated about their experience, especially with the rise of interest in food and beverage in the past 10 years. Shows on the Food Network, and amazing UA-cam channels like Wine King educate us, and I'm so glad they do, because it only allows us to appreciate the culinary arts more, and also change our expectations of our experience for the better. Higher quality is driven by the demand for innovation by the masses, and that threatens the likes of insecure food and beverage professionals. The same could be said just about any industry.
I would not have paid if it wasn’t done to my specification…. My wine my choice, even if I want to mixed the barolo with Coca Cola. There is no right or wrong way… as long as it is legal.
Sorry to hear about this experience! We don't have michelin star here in Australia but the restaurants considered to be 'the best' always have at their foundation - top tier service! If you don't leave the customer feeling like their every want and need is being taken care of (even some of those that they have not even thought of yet), why would they spend many hundreds if not thousands of their dollars in your restaurant!? Absolutely appalling. He didn't even make an effort to ask about your background in respect of wine. What a shame, but thank you for sharing your experiences!
I work in a small one Michelin star restaurant in California and my boss stresses to me that the most important part of service is humility. That you are no better than the man next to you and that guests in our restaurant deserve respect.
Almost 80K views in just 5 days seems like this is a popular video on this channel. Personally, it really resonates because I've also felt the utter disappointment of terrible service for dining experiences that we had very high hopes for. Luckily, the pleasant experiences outnumber the bad ones. Jay, a follow up video or commentary in a video would be great if there are new developments in this.
Mozza osteria is what I think it based on what it looks like inside, and I got treated horribly and I am asian. Sometimes Asians don't like jumping to conclusions but the truth is if u feel it intuitively it's prob racism. My Japanese coworker also got por treatment but my white Mexican friend went and got treated bc he is blonde.
there have been a few times where i've forgotten to do table maintenance and never really recovered the issue, but never have i done so on purpose. i want to think that somm had more sense than to inhibit someone from drinking their wine. always love your videos senior wineking & peter! this inspires me to revisit the basics of service and shed more ego.
We’ve all been there, but pretty ridiculous to see in 2021! Send the head chef/General manager the video - he’ll provide some choice words for this upstart sommelier whose arrogance is risking his Michelin star. Would be so nice having such a nice mentor to debrief with over a lovely glass after though 👌 thanks for sharing
Mozza sucks. Anyone questioning why you’d decant a 2016 Barolo is nuts and bad at their job. Wan me if you think decanting a 1966 Barolo might cause it to fade too quickly? Sure. But you got LA Michelin starred.
Can't even imagine such a noisy place for a Michelin starred restaurant. I feel here in Belgium the fine dining experience is on a whole other level. Should you ever visit my country I could recommend you some restaurants for an unforgettable experience. Also, the sommeliers there would be happy to serve you and would respect and acknowledge your skills.
USA is not on the same planet as Europe for service, Jay/Peter even said so. Americans like their a$$ kissed and then throw money around to feel important, in Europe you just get a bill, I so love that.
@@bigv7267 idk about that. I lived in Italy for 3 years and in many places i would go to that was slightly higher end than your average restaurant the waiters would always give me and my buddy so much crap for looking young and therefore unable to actually afford food at their place. And i would get some terrible service along with judgemental looks. Then after we start ordering the seafood and wine and dessert suddenly they want to do a 180 and start frantically kissing our asses. It's obviously not everywhere. But i think it's always gonna be a thing, where someone will judge a book by its cover. You learn pretty fast that you'll never know who will be ordering 1000 dollars worth of food and 15 dollars lol. Of course in a Michelin rated place in Italy, the service was impeccable. So this i just don't get, i feel sorry for Jay. He's such a chill and friendly guy.
Michelin starred restaurants just mean you should visit them if you are in the area. It doesn't mean that they all have the same environment/vibes. Some people do prefer a more vibrant setting where you can have very good food and not have to whisper in hushed tones and handle all 18 sets of cutleries with poise. If there was a Michelin starred Irish pub, I would consider going definitely.
I love how you responded to the situation. Although the man put his ego before his stewardship, you didn't name names, stayed respectful, and gave credit to where credit was due. There are so many people nowadays that think that they have some power because they got a Yelp account. People want to cancel a person for such trivial things. Ego is king, especially in LA. Hopefully, the sommelier will have some humble pie in the near future and allow his patrons to have their own opinions without getting offended.
I dont drink nor plan on every drinking, but this video was oddly entertaining and very relaxing. Completely agree on how you handled the situation, loved the video thank you!
You are 100% right, Jay. The sommelier has a twitter so he thinks he is famous, he's probably on the younger side and has some knowledge but more ego than anything else. And being L.A. where most don't know as much as you do about wine he thinks he knows better than all. I have found sommeliers in Las Vegas to be incredibly helpful and offer great service. LA has a lot of great restaurants but the service is a hit or a miss. The server was great and he deserved his generous tip.
This is embarrassing. I’m really sorry for you to experience this. Also, the idea of decanting young Barolo shouldn’t be alien to any Somm. So sad he took it personally.
I think there's many decanting myths out there, even by sommes. Unless it's a super old red, almost all medium to full bodied reds can benefit from gentle decanting. The younger the wine, the earlier (~1 hour) and more aggressive decanting. The older the wine, even 15 minutes of gentle decanting can round out the edges and let it off-gas, making for a more well rounded, softened experience without losing any of the aroma compounds.
Jeepers tonight, I've recently discovered this channel (being an absolute wine novice) and am absolutely in love with the pair of you. The dynamic between you is delightful, and you both seem to be thoroughly enjoying life. I find this content so much more inspiring than some über athlete espousing the merits of ultramarathons, Iron Mans, billion $ businesses, etc. I shall enthusiastically continue to imbibe this life affirming juice!
So I am from Vienna and I am rather fascinated/ shocked how loud both restaurants were. If you go to Steirereck, Konstantin Filippou or Silvio Nickol (all three with at least one Michelin Star!) in Vienna it is much more quiet and not so crowded. The other week I went to Labstelle (another great restaurant) I felt like a mass ware during the whole time (because a lot of tables for the restaurant space) though we consumed a lot of good bottles and we ended up paying >1000 €. The Sommelier did great work but the service was so bad. It is such a pity when this happens...
I thought the same about the noise level at both places. Maybe it has something to do with the microphone, but the places looked stacked. The acoustics may not be convenient for a 'private dinner'. The few times I went to a Michelin Star- restaurant, there were like 10 tables max and a lot of space. And quiet conversation, which may be more 'European' 😊
@@seb_yt6695 valid point and maybe some people don‘t care but if I am paying such an amount of money (which is quite a lot for me) I simply don‘t want to be treated like that. Idk anything about the rents in LA und Houston though :)
Fully agreed!! I found that so strange too!! They were SO loud for fine dining, which again, speaks to the sheer volume of tables they want to get in and out, and lack of concern for the customer service experience. This restaurant doesn't deserve that Michelin star.
언제나 와인킹님과 스승님과의 캐미를 즐겁게 시청하고있습니다. 아이러니하게도 한국에서도 이런상황이 자주 일어나고 아니 오히려 더 많이 일어난다는것이 생각나는 영상이었습니다. 저도 와인은아니지만 '너가 뭘아냐?' 이런 느낌을 받은 서비스를 받은적이 많다보니. 다른영상보다 더 공감되었던거 같습니다. 식사비와 와인비를 따로 나누어서 계산하신것은 저는 생각도 못했던 방법이내요 저도 나중에 한번 사용 해봐야할거같습니다. 항상 잘보고있습니다. 건승하십쇼!
After some Google Map searching, found out that the restaurant was "Osteria Mozza" on Melrose Avenue, LA, California. I won't be visiting that place :)
We literally started to look up each bottle in the restaraunt online ourselves and read reviews/prices rather than trusting the "sommelier". Most of them know nothing about wine or have a completely different taste/pallet from us. At least in the US. Sommeliers in Europe are generally knowledgeable.
Thanks for sharing. I often get disappointed with Somms at fine dining restaurants. I think a lot of people forget to be a Somm is to 'serve' the customer. Don't even get me started on the planned wine pairing... I get so turned off when Somms try to push the pairing option to me. Let me drink what I WANT please... Also, Peter dropping F-bombs again... Classic
You handled the situation so much better than I would have.. I’m from New York City and I’m in the wine business. I’ve met many sommeliers, some with the actual vintner and you’d be surprised to see some of the reaction that wine makers make when the somm tries to describe the wine. In a nut shell, these so called snobby restaurant somms give actual knowledgeable sommeliers a bad rap.
After watching your series, I decided to further pursue my interest in wine. I just finished the WSET 3 exam on october, and hopefully I can push it even further in the future. I'm 22 right now and looking to finish diploma by 24 so Thank you so much!
As an American, I was initially offended by the “fine dining in America is sh*t. It’s all about [the waiter’s] ego.” But then I thought about it…and I completely agree. It is horrific here. The waiters here are rude, entitled, tip-hungry, and dismissive. The more expensive the restaurant, the more they feel superior. I can’t tell you how many expensive restaurants I’ve been to where the waiters treated me like I was lesser than them. They make you feel like you need to impress them…even though you’re the one dropping an inordinate amount of money. Sorry you had this experience, but I’m afraid it isn’t unique.
I’ve eaten at plenty of fine dining in America and I’ve always received great service. It’s usually at more mid restaurants that I’ve received poor service. I did have a long wait at one restaurant for the food but the waiter personally apologized and gave us some free desserts and told us to personally ask for him next time. It’s just about whether people take their job seriously or not.
@@cajeb5396 Looking back at this, it likely has a lot to do with location. When I have been to places where the service staff is there for their career and have decent wages (NYC, Chicago, Denver, etc.), the service is top tier. When I go to prime restaurants in other places where the staff is transient (college students) and makes most of their salary on tips, the service is entitled and pushy.
its always a shame when the ego stands in the way of an enjoyable time. I am really enjoying your content! I am coming from the whisky tasting experience, having less experience in wine but i am all interested in different experiences, for example wine. I sometimes wish that whisky would be just a little more prominant in restaurants. For the most part here, whisky is just a product you order as shot or cocktail after the meal, but never as a full bodied flavourfull experience on its own.
I also went to a two-starred Michelin Restaurant in NYC. We opened a bottle of 2016 Shiraz from the restaurant and about 3/4 of the way through, we started seeing some sediments in our wine glasses after the somm topped off our glasses. I made a note to the somm and he said "are you sure it isn't pieces of food that you were just eating?" and then walked away. I then made sure by opening my flashlight and shining it into the bottle with the remainder of the wine left to see that there is actual sediment. The somm returns later to pour us the remainder of the wine to finish the bottle and I state to him "we're good. there is sediment inside the last pour of the bottle. we don't want to drink that" and he blurts out at my face "there is no way, this is a 2016 bottle." and proceeds to pour it out even though I was the one that was paying for the wine, in which i then took out my flashlight on my phone and showed the somm all the sediment inside my glass that he had just poured out. I don't understand why they can't just understand the customers and always think they're correct.
@@xyz-pg3zd the sommelier position is dying fast. My goal is for a takeover of well trained beverage managers who are deep into WSET or deep in Master Somm to thoroughly teach the waitstaff. They will make gobs of more money and be much more proficient
@@MichaelLee-yh7ss it was Jean-Georges. Food is always amazing and I'll always want to go back, but the wine experience was appalling the last time I went. However, all other times were good. Maybe an off-day but really wasn't nice to always think you're correct, especially in the service industry.
![[EN] Nothing like a wine date with my bestie! (feat. The Wine King) [Musinsa Life Update 2 Ep.11]](/img/n.gif)
Your wife was spot on when she said that "ordinary people will think they are doing something wrong", because this happens a lot, people save money to dinner in a special restaurant like this and they leave feeling like they don't belong to this kind of place
Yeah, it does a huge sector of the Industry and all his Team Mates a massive disservice too.
If I were that Waiter, who handled the situation very modestly, I’d have asked the Somm what the fuck he was playing at.
It’s so silly. I have only ever objectionable service in high end restaurants from the person in charge of the wine. It’s such a tired cliche.
@@adamg.manning6088 Unfortunately, the waiter could never criticize the sommelier because he is on the lower end of the restaurant's hierarchy. The waiter can only supervise the bus boys, no way he can tell the sommelier how to do his job properly. It's the customer right to complaint to the restaurant manager about a bad service.
@@WillOneZeroZeroTwoFour
Hierarchy be damned:
You turn around to your colleague after the shift and get to the bottom of the customer’s bad experience.
That’s how good teams operate.
i cook this level of food for a living and i dont even feel like i belong dining in fine dining restaurants....
@@BboyShinnny may i ask why? Im a line cook but not your tier. What makes u feel like that im curious
There's always one saleswoman at Chanel who thinks she is a Coco, one salesman at Porsche who thinks he is a Ferdinand. They have little idea who puts the bread on their tables for what.
All their behaviour does is reveal their inner insecurity and inflated ego. Pity them instead.
haha so true! Coco and Ferdinand.
They confuse themselves with the customer
Wow I absolutely love your expressions, because it is so true. I'm not saying the customer is always right, but who is the one holding the money in this transaction.
I don't understand why you need a Somm. They are like the bathroom attendant. Useless
와.. 진짜 사람간의 문제에서 기분 상하고 얼굴 찌뿌릴 수 있고 충분히 화낼 만한 상황인데 항상 유연하고 온화하게 대하는 태도가 정말 대단하십니다..
스승님이 제자의 마음에 공감해주면서 기분을 캐치하고,
제자의 마음에 쌓인 감정도 대신 표출해주시면서 풀어주시는게
이 시대의 진정한 어르신이시네요.
저도 저런 부분을 많이 닮고싶어지는 영상입니다.
두분다 좋은 분 같아요
Separating the wine and food into two different bills was a very smart way to handle the two very different services you received.
second that
Straight baller of him.. taking his tips to hear now
Unfortunately, they probably do tip share. Especially if they do gratuity charges.
100% to straight baller and perfectly handled. I'm much older and I am going to remember this video if I need to know how to handle such a situation.
@@th3b4rd75 It’s not just about the money. If the sommelier indeed is an arrogant person, just knowing he got 0% tip while his other colleagues (better if their positions are lower than his) received 30% tip, he would feel angry and offended so badly 😈
The waiter was so polite and handled the situation well also. Good service makes food taste better
There is only one michelin star (*) Italian restaurant in LA - Osteria Mozza. It is commendable not mentioning it by name directly, however, I believe a healthy dose of accountability is good for any business to make the necessary improvements. In this case, it would mean getting rid of the Wine Tyranny.
to add onto this, the steakhouse in houston he referred to was Vic & Anthony's, great food and staff
Nathaniel Munoz was the sommelier’s name. Dudes a snob, he even tweeted about wine king that evening, although indirectly and very passive aggressively.
@@Section.9 Has the tweet been taken down? Can't seem to find it.
@@protoleia I wouldn’t be surprised - a few people were already smearing him in the comments on it. 😂😬
@@Section.9 Is he still working there? I don't know the guy but maybe he should be fired?
I’ve watched 3 of your videos now and I love the dynamic between you and your wife bringing Asian culture and sentiments to the western world. And I straight up love the South African guy in this video. He’s so brash and straight forward which is the opposite of what we’re taught in Asian culture. So it’s nice to see a good balance and good conversation ❤
South Korea is a western ally. Try again: or get a dose of Chinese tourists, they are sooo chill 😂😂
@@SéaFidSouth Korea is an Asian country.
Yes, and its great to watch them interact with each others opposite personality.
@@SéaFid and? Wtf is this ruzzian china proganda m8? South Korea is much more civilize and smart then china thats for sure..... We europeans love japanese and south Koreans. And guess what? everyone hates chinese turists...
@@SéaFidas if crackers can tell the difference 🙄
웬만하면 직원 한 명이 잘못 했을 때 다른 직원들한테 까지 좋은 말이 나가기 쉽지 않은데 대단하시네요 기분이 태도가 되지 않는것에 감탄했습니다.
소믈리에만 잘했다면 완벽한 밤이 되었을텐데 아쉽네요 그래도 음식은 맛있었다니 다행이고 팁도 몰아준게 정말 멋지네요ㅋㅋㅋㅋ
I too as an Asian American went to Dine At this OSTERIA MOZZA restaurant in the Melrose/Hollywood district... Unfortunately, I too received horrible rude service....If most of the staff are struggling actors the least they can do is apply that expertise to be gracious towards the guests .... It was as if it was more of an anoyance for us to be there.... I wold never ever go back and steer everyone away from that place.... Btw, I've owned and managed restaurants for nearly 30 years and even was a corporate trainer for restaurant guest service... Sorry but Osteria Mozza failed big time here
I had good service when I ate there a few months ago. Just offering a contrary perspective.
Go east if you want a good time. Eastward has everything you want in the utopian pipe dream USA has to offer. I wish you 'Asian Americans' would go eastward rather than settling for the bumbling babylon California that it is.
@@ericmanget4280 You're not Asian though.
@@theexcelproject6973 So you're assuming it was racism with no basis in LA of all places?
@@theexcelproject6973 way too big of an Asian population that have money for a high end restaurant to be racist. C’mon give it a rest. U can’t please everyone in the hospitality industry & sometimes there’s bad sec, min , hours & days w/ staff-public interaction !
I think this sommelier lost his job after this incident. The restaurant posted a job posting for the somm position on December 17th.
How do yo even know that?
@@jkl6791 ...good assumption. would be the intelligent decision to look for people who take their job seriously instead taking his personal feeling against innocent customer. Rude people are liability to society as a whole. Don’t like to work with good manners, stay home.
Wow, good guess.
Do you go to the restaurant recently?
It must not be the first time for him because it's about his attitude to customers.
Most people feel the same way about basic emotions.
It's like saking your head for 'NO' is universal.
It might be just hiring another one :)
Karma.
진짜 현명하게 대처하셨네요 저였으면 이게 맞는 건가 싶고 기분이 찜찜하지만 뭐라고 하지도 못하고 식사 망쳤을거 같아요
Thanks for this very educational video! I didn't know i can split the check for wines only. Here's my story - I ordered a bottle of 2016 Chianti at a restaurant. When we realized it was actually 2019 vintage, we already emptied 1/3 of the bottle, but I still pointed it out. The wine guy sincerely apologized to us and offered half off or he would bring the new bottle with the vintage I ordered. So I took half off and gave him very generous tip because I think anyone can make a mistake but I appreciated his afford to make it right. Hopefully the sommelier in you video learned a lesson.
유명세와 본인 커리어에 취해서
다른사람을 우습게 본다는게 얼마나 위험한지
저분에게 처음으로 제대로 알려주신분이
와인킹님 같네요 ㅎㅎ
저 소믈리에분이 다른 분들이 오셔도 겸손한 자세로 다른분들에게 좋은 서비스를 해주셨으면 좋겠네요 😊
영상 2년이 지난 지금에서야 보게 되었지만 너무 멋진영상입니다 👍🏻🙏🏻
You actually handled the situation very well. I would have lost it, if I were spending that amount of money and gets shit from someone that was suppose to serve me.
I cant believe they censored "..he better give you a full body massage with wild truffle oil... "
There's so much to learn here about how to handle a bad situation that you should really be given credit for. Pure class.
This guy is such a class act, I agree. Whatever the situation he finds himself in, he finds his way out. I try to learn from his videos.
completely agree. his emotional intelligence is something I can strive for
Peter is saying something I totally agree with - most people (not just Americans) avoid confrontation. This leads to a situation in which often people who behave poorly do not get the feedback they should receive (and neither do the people surrounding them). In my view, you did very well by rewarding the type of behaviour you appreciate while at the same time making it clear that as a customer, the kind of treatment you received from the sommelier was unacceptable and should not be rewarded in any way. Both from your order and from the way you approached the wines (and how you formulated your request) it was clear that you are knowledgeable enough about wine to explain how you perceived the Barolo and that you'd prefer to drink it differently. No amount of knowledge of a sommelier can change that if you don't enjoy the tannic structure, as it's a subjective thing. Peter was right to call him out as arrogant.
Come to europe buddy. You’ll notice it is mostly americans
@@kcts007 If you think it is mostly Americans I don't think you have even been out enough. I have had absolutely horrible experiences in both France and Italy. Worst of my life was in France where we had horrible service because they thought we were all from the US. Even though about 2/3 of the group was from Canada, and multiple spoke French.
Second worst of my life was in Cali though, so I'm not trying to say it isn't in the US. I am saying it is hilarious and embarrassing that you think it is mostly anyone other than assholes.
@Spacey Funny enough, in my job and personal life, i always found the east-asians (japanese, koreans and slighlty less the chinese) to be the least confrontational people i ever met, turning always the possible complaints into some sort of passive-aggressive attitudes or "angry" silence.
It's curious to see that there are different experiences.
@@kcts007 I have heard Europe has the most terrible service ( not all of Europe of course). There are snobby chefs who can be super rude, if you are a bit clueless about their food.
@Spacey👺 i am singaporean, can agree. we love to complain and we expect people to do their jobs. this is why singaporeans are spoiled by the service standards in singapore airlines and changi airport for example, and when we go overseas we get appalled by horrible service standards especially when they’re so brazen about it
This was a well justified critique. I took the waiter's suggestion and google'd him and see the restaurant now has an opening for a new somm. Nothing like the power of social media!
Whats the name of the Somm and restaurant?
I don't understand why the channel owners are censoring my replies. I did not mention any names. I only pointed out how the info is freely available to anyone on google.
@@kahuna2 they are not?
@@MichaelLee-yh7ss Osteria mozza and the “somm” is Nathaniel Munoz
Nope, he stills works there
I am a sommelier in a small hotel in near my home town and I would never think about treating any customer like this. I have met many different people at all levels of the hospitality industry and I do think there is a snobbiness with some whom work in michelin restaurants. Many are good down to earth guys though
맙소사... 그냥 고개만 끄덕이고 눈만 깜빡여야하나요? 소믈리에 태도에 문제가 있군요... 하지만 멋진 저녁을 망치지 않게 노력하는 모습에 더 큰 충격?을 받았습니다. 만약 제가 저 자리에 있었다면 이렇게 아름답게 끝내지는 못했을 거 같아요...
조용히 나와서 해당 가게 직원 관리 실태의 관하여 동영상을 공개하는 것이 제대로된 골탕을 먹이는 방법ㅋㅋ
피터의 말에 100%동의합니다. 그런 값을 지불하고 먹는데, 그들은 그만큼의 값어치를 해줘야해죠. 미국은 팁으로 조용히 표현할 수 있는 것도 괜찮은거 같아요. 한국에서라면 메니져 불러서 컴플레인 했을 거 같아요.
Was worried at the start of the video when you said that you didn't tip, but separating the wine and food was 100% the right move. Only punishing the somme but still looking after the rest of the staff, and showing that the $0 tip wasn't because you're cheap, but completely due to the service.
If I was you I'd send this video to the GM of the restaurant. Make it clear you don't want anything in return, you aren't asking for a free meal or a refund or anything, you just want them to be aware of your experience so they can correct it moving forward.
Actually a smart idea. The owner probably is interested in good publicity and customer experience.
I would be curious about the reaction.
Some restaurants that offer Haut Cuisine are snobby, arrogant and ignorant. Not all of course. But in some you get asked to not come again even if you ask for salt and pepper as it is an insult to the chef...
Facts
Name of the restaurant is Osteria Mozza, the SOMM is probably Nathaniel Muñoz.
@@JanPatatoes you’re weak bro. If it is true then so be it. However, an individual puts themselves out to the world every time they walk into work.
That’s why I love you guys channel a lot! You guys did what you have to do. Some people thought they know everything until they find out somebody know things better than them. But they still think they are god like Peter said. Thanks a again for sharing this Jay!
Highjacking this comment to say that 4 seconds of research allowed me to find out that the restaurtan in question is Osteria Mozza and they are currently hiring for Sommeliers
Hi Jay….missing you guys. Hope you will have new content soon!:-)
Yeah really missing your videos. Please take as long as you need to start drinking wine on video again :D
.... Hope he's ok..
What happened?
he got covid
@@mamimumemo2470 How do you know?
그 유명한 소믈리에는 "감히 내게 토를 단 손님"의 저녁을 훼손하는걸로 분풀이하고 싶었을텐데
그 악의에 당하지않으셨네요! 진정한 고수십니다.
"I'm always so intimidated in this kind of places" -> spot on! I have enjoyed great food and service on various plaes in the US. But the few times we paid more than usual, it was just because of the 'name' of the place. We should be honoured to eat there, or something like that. Well shown here!
I love how you were classy and didn't show off your credentials but I totally wish you schooled that sommelier. Having his face drop when he realises you are a more knowledgeable and bigger wine professional than him would have been hilarious. Love the videos and would love more wine tastings with Peter! More content please!
현명하지 못한 사람에게 현명하게 대처하는 법이네요. 피터옹이 같은 곳에 가서 같은 행동을 하고 소믈리에의 행동을 보고 싶네요. 그리고 피터옹의 찰진 피드백까지 곁들이면 좋은 컨텐츠가 될거 같습니다.
손님으로서 경력이라는 말씀 넘 멋집니다. 무례하지 않으면서 품위 있고 결코 흥분하지 않으면서 혼내는 법도 멋지시네요. 요즘같은 때에 손님의 품격이 무엇인지 보여주시는 것 같습니다👍👍👍
I don't know how I stumbled on this video but what an interesting find! The cuts with your friend are awesome little bits of storytelling, your wife describing how customers get "overwhelmed" by fine restaurants. I know nothing about fine dining and even less about wine but this was so interesting.
와인킹님 영상 상당히 오랜만에 보는데 대박이네요. 아내분과 침착하게 말씀 나누시는거 보고 엄청 서로 위해주는 것 같아서 멋있어요! 기념적이고 좋은 날을 한사람 때문에 망칠 수는 없다는 말이 엄청 와닿네요. 저였으면 괜히 웨이터한테도 퉁명스러울텐데 웨이터한테 감사표시하는 것도 진짜 멋있네요 영상 감사합니다^^7
선생님의 돌직구 말씀 진짜 대단하구요,
와인킹님, 사모님(아내 분) 정말 대처 잘 하셨어요
보는 제가 기분이 좋습니다
감히 북두칠권 마스터에게…
ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ
ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ
ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ
ㅋㅋㄲㅋ
ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ
정말 멋지고 젠틀한 부부네요. 문제해결까지 현명하고 알맞게 잘하셨습니다.
정말 최고세요:) 타이틀에 압도 되지않고 오히려 차분하고 현명하게 대처하는 그 여유와 깊이:) 영상보면서 에티듀드가 정말 중요하다고 다시 한번 또 느낍니다:)
This video made me thing quite a bit about what distinguishes good or excelent service from 'normal' or bad service. And how to react to the latter - you aimed not to ruin the mood on the table, you articulated your concerns, you tipped separately (great idea) and you showed your appreciation to the other server. Seems to me very much the right thing to do - thanks for sharing!
Glad to see you split the bill and didn't let the bad somm affect the tips for the server and chefs
Smart
Peter was so right about how fine dining in the US is so different than the rest of the world. I find this holds to be true in most North American major city centers (e.g., LA, New York, Chicago, etc.) where they get so many people coming, they lose focus on the customer experience. People also tend to have much lower expectations and feel they need to accommodate the restaurant instead of the other way around in North America. There are exceptions of course, such as Montreal, which is a food mecca of great dining and customer service. Michelin star ratings have become a farce over the years, and I no longer prescribe to them. Much better is trusting the experience of friends whose opinion you trust.
It's not only fine dining. Service in US sucks. From McDonald's to Michelin star to taxi drivers to flight attendants to anything.
Let’s be honest it’s more a California thing. SF and LA
@@peterk814 Nah, all major cities as mentioned.
What is a country with some of the best hospitality you've experienced?
@@xyz-pg3zd LA culture is parasitic. Everyone thinks they are important and it’s so vain. No humility at all. SF is no different. People realized and they’re now leaving.
in my own, admittedly limited, experience staff at fancy restaurants get offended a lot more easily if you have a complaint than in normal restaurants. One time I ordered tea with milk after a meal in a more fancy restaurant and as I started drinking, I realized immediately that the milk had gone sour. I told the staff and he almost started arguing with me over it. As if I couldn't tell the difference 🤨Needless to say, nothing remotely similar ever happened to me in any "ordinary" restaurant. They'd always apologize immediately and fix it without complaining.
Presumably have a reputation to keep and want to talk you down into not giving anyone the idea their food sucks.
Tea with sour milk? I would be outraged.
日本人でも楽しめる本当に面白いワイン動画チャンネルです。続けて頂きたい。
Great video! Loved the way you and your wife handled the situation at hand. It’s unfortunate that this happened at a so called Michelin star restaurant.
그래도 두분다 현명하게 대처하셨네요. 분위기도 망치지않고 팁으로 응징까지 ㅎㅎ
I live in LA and experiences like this are why I generally do not do fine dining in LA and why Michelin means nothing here. In New York many Michelin starred restaurants are easily on par with others in the world, not all, but many. In LA service as a whole in Michelin starred restaurants is not up to standard. LA has a culture of super casual restaurants and the service standards frankly are in-line with that. Diners here in LA also, in general, are not used to proper fine dining service and as a result don't demand it. It all starts with the service standards from management.
do u own a private island in the caribbean?
LA is full of examples of what shouldn't be done. It's where all the black sheep from the Midwest move to. Another way to think of it is as "a streetlight that attracts all the bugs."
I'm from LA but lived all over the states, long trips in Europe, Asia, Africa. Gotta say that NY, Paris and Milan had the douchiest service. Like they were looking as if I slighted them in some way. Felt their discomfort when I didn't do anything to cause them to feel that way. Might be biased but LA mostly had chill service. Def had to throw that douchiness back a few times. Didn't do it on vacation because I didn't want to ruin the trip for us. But at mfing home, I'm going to let them know.
@@rks5457 NYCer here who lived in LA for four years. The problem with SoCal is the low quality service for just about everything. Granted, I don't care for the douchebag attitudes in NYC, but the quality is there. Paris is horrid.
Man I thought you held yourself very well. You encouraged your wife to enjoy the time and experience with you despite the circumstances. That shows immense wisdom. Splitting the bill was a master stroke. I am super impressed with your character.
형님 진짜 멋있어요..! 저는 엘에이에서 매번 어디 갈때마다 부당한 대우도 가끔 받고 기분 상하는 일들도 생각보다 많아서 언젠ㄱ가부터 비싼데 가서 돈 쓴는게 너무 아깝게 느껴지더라구요.. 와인킹님의 지혜와 너그러움이 정말 멋지네요
Putting the wine on a separate table is normal practice at fine dining, mainly because they want to keep your table free for the food and be able to see your guests without issue. However, a good somm should be keeping an eye on your glasses and without ever asking, refill it, anticipating your needs. This somm chose to ignore your needs, let alone anticipate them.
Manager is extremely at fault for not dealing with this, just because they have 1 Michelin doesn’t mean they aren’t lazy and don’t have their faults lmao. Handled it well great job.
파리에 있는 카페 콩스탕에서 미슐랭 원스타라고 하기에는 부족한(인종차별로도 느껴지는) 서비스 때문에 불편했던 기억이 하나 있네요.
저도 와인킹님처럼 여행의 좋은 분위기를 깨지 않기 위해 괜찮았던 부분을 열심히 찾으며 노력했었죠.
You are an amazing customer. Any restaurant should be pleased to have you. Found your channel recently and really enjoy how you handle bad experiences and appreciate good experiences.
That's also an incredibly busy restaurant to be Michelin-starred, with a lot of tables and a lot of buzz. Not sure if it's normal for LA, but here in Italy Michelin-starred restaurants (even non-Michelin-starred fine dining restaurants) usually have just a fraction of tables than cheaper venues, even before with got covid restrictions (my local 1-star restaurant, San Domenico, can only serve 37 people total and it's not a small venue, that kind of noise and sheer amount of people would not be tolerated here).
I'm sorry you had to experience that kind of service by the sommelier, feel free to hit me up if you plan to come to Italy for fine dining (Michelin-starred or otherwise), I can suggest nice places I've personally been to in most bigger cities!
Keep up the great content!
Yeah I was thinking that too you can tell how pack it is because you can hear all the ppl talking background rather than music to enjoy your wine and meal
Michelin uses differing inspectors accross the entire globe. Flying the same team of reviewers around everywhere would be too expensive and time consuming, so the inspections tend to be regional. This means the guide will tend to favor different environments accross different regions. They basically hire people who've been working in a region's high end cullinary/hopsitality segment, so w/e is favored in that region will typically score well. This type of place is super common in LA, so it wouldn't pull off anything from the rating for a 1/2 star.
It’s not what French laundry is like and even the Michelin star in hing Kong that was in the mall, was small
wow that's interesting. I've never been to one.
Yeah, what the hell. When I think Michelin star restaurant, I am thinking peace and quiet dining experience. Even our local McDonald's doesn't have this much noise and is better lit.
As always, great video. The bottle should stay at the customer's table, period. Michelin-star restaurants should always give elevated service..that's what you're paying for. If you wanted the wine decanted...it should've happened without the Somm having an issue. They are there to serve you and treat you to a first-class bottle service experience.
I am confused...why are the wine bottles not at the customer's table?
They are afraid that the customers will glug it down like a soda? Or sabotage the bottle and ask for a new one?
@@Razorwindsg Restaurants that merit the Michelin guide, especially fine dining ones (Michelin has...broadened....their scope in recent years) should be a full dining experience. Waiters should be attentive and your glass shouldn't run dry without staff noticing.
When you're paying for high-end dining, the small details are what complete the experience, things such as not having a cluttered table where you even need to consider the possibility of knocking over a bottle or spilling as you pour.
Tidbits like this seem a tad ridiculous, but when enough things are done well, they add up into making your night as perfect as possible, which is the ultimate goal of these restaurants.
I really enjoyed this style of video with the casual talk with Peter sliced with video footage from the experience. Hope to see more like this!
I love this video so much. Despite paying so much for a meal and getting terrible wine service, you found the best way to deal with it. So glad that waiter got a nice tip while the sommelier got no tip for his lack of service. Just what we can hear from the table waiter, he sounds great, I'm glad he got his. To be fair to the sommelier, if he'd simply recognized he was dealing with someone who knew more (or at least as much) about wine as he did, he could have done a much better job. Unfortunately he didn't, and your mentor is correct, he screwed up royally.
마인드 너무 좋으세요, 새삼 다시한번 놀랍니다. 예전에 비슷한 경험이 있었는데 같이간 일행의 기분이 풀리지 많아 끝내 즐거운 자리로 마무리 되지 못했습니다. 같은 상황에서 더 유쾌하게 풀어내시는 제이님과 와이프 분의 반응을 보니 두분이 좋은 단짝인것 같아 부럽기도 하고 보기 좋습니다. :)
The funniest part about the sommelier, is that in somm school they explicitly tell you to never be snobby or pretentious about wine because it only turns people away from wine. I have been in the business forever and I can't stand snobby service. There is no room in the industry for it. Treat everyone like there special. For a lot of people this is a big deal for them, they don't get out to a fancy place that often. Show them a good time and make them feel comfortable , they in turn will treat you accordingly. Who cares if they want to pour their own wine or put ice in it, I am just happy they are getting wine and enjoying themselves.
Agreed. Prob that Somm was racist
와인킹님 예전부터 영상 보고 있는데요
스스로도 대단하다 생각하여 남들에게 엄청 뽐내거나 하실 수 있음에도 불구하고 항상 겸손한 모습이 멋지다고 생각합니다!
The restaurant is Osteria Mozza and the "Dumbmmelier" is Nathaniel Muñoz
😱😱
Everyone message the restaurant and somm. They must be held responsible.
Do you work there? Lmao
Thank you. Good to know.
Neither should the Som be telling anyone what flavour profile they should expect. Unprofessional and not very bright.
Splitting the bill is a great solution. Thankfully I've never had that situation, partly because I don't know enough about wine and partly because I've never paid for myself outside the UK...where I think service is decent, but not being a wine expert, I wouldn't know anyway! I can just about tell a Shiraz from a Pinot Noir ☺
Thanks for sharing! Looks like Osteria Mozza. Can't let one staffer/big money maker risk ruining their hard earned Michelin star. Maybe share this with Michelin directly if they take feedback?
Sure because in a micheline restaurant everything has to work. Ofc its "just one staffer", but in a michelin restaurant its just not acceptable. They have to know who they hire. Service and atmosphere are also a reason for a michelin star.
@@fritzschnitzmueller3768 Actually those are pretty high on the list of things Michelin takes into account.
Shit restaurant, served me cold food a few months ago. Osteria Angelini is 10x better and cheaper.
It is. The facade is the same. the Ms on the doors give it away.
So, I've worked in restaurants and I'd suggest the following...
1) You should contact the restaurant and find out who is running the service. This could be the head waiter, it could be the chef. Tell them about yourself.
2) Talk about what the somm. did, specifically the service you didn't get. About how he made a face when you asked him to decant the wine.
3) Talk about how it made you feel, how it made your wife feel. Say something like "We came here for a good experience and it was spoiled for because he was offended that I didn't think the wine was what he thought it was." (or something) on your trip to America.
4) And send the video.
Generally speaking, they'll try to make it right by offering you to come in for another service. I suspect you won't be flying out again. Given that they may actually send you off to a place near you, or refund your money (as they should).
But it's important that you do this because this guy may be running rough-shod over people and/or not providing the service with the expertise required for regular people. And that's not fair.
isnt that the job of the restaurant?
I can't believe the sommelier wouldn't recommend decanting a 2016 Barolo himself! The vintage is drinking well but still very young. I would not drink a '16 Barolo without decanting, period. I think Peter is right. Some somms do not like informed customers because they prefer to present themselves as all-knowing oracles.
100. Those very same sommes likely hate channels like this because the average consumer is now much more educated about their experience, especially with the rise of interest in food and beverage in the past 10 years. Shows on the Food Network, and amazing UA-cam channels like Wine King educate us, and I'm so glad they do, because it only allows us to appreciate the culinary arts more, and also change our expectations of our experience for the better. Higher quality is driven by the demand for innovation by the masses, and that threatens the likes of insecure food and beverage professionals. The same could be said just about any industry.
I would not have paid if it wasn’t done to my specification…. My wine my choice, even if I want to mixed the barolo with Coca Cola. There is no right or wrong way… as long as it is legal.
@@DK-yj1ez It SHOULD be illegal to mix barolo with coca cola 😂
@@DK-yj1ezman… I imagined it!! You’re guilty!! :)
Sorry to hear about this experience! We don't have michelin star here in Australia but the restaurants considered to be 'the best' always have at their foundation - top tier service! If you don't leave the customer feeling like their every want and need is being taken care of (even some of those that they have not even thought of yet), why would they spend many hundreds if not thousands of their dollars in your restaurant!? Absolutely appalling. He didn't even make an effort to ask about your background in respect of wine. What a shame, but thank you for sharing your experiences!
Clever and classy solution separating food and the wine bill. I’m a fan now
I work in a small one Michelin star restaurant in California and my boss stresses to me that the most important part of service is humility. That you are no better than the man next to you and that guests in our restaurant deserve respect.
Great video, the cuts between you and Peter, and you at the restaurant made for some great story-telling. Good work :)
Almost 80K views in just 5 days seems like this is a popular video on this channel. Personally, it really resonates because I've also felt the utter disappointment of terrible service for dining experiences that we had very high hopes for. Luckily, the pleasant experiences outnumber the bad ones. Jay, a follow up video or commentary in a video would be great if there are new developments in this.
Mozza osteria is what I think it based on what it looks like inside, and I got treated horribly and I am asian. Sometimes Asians don't like jumping to conclusions but the truth is if u feel it intuitively it's prob racism. My Japanese coworker also got por treatment but my white Mexican friend went and got treated bc he is blonde.
there have been a few times where i've forgotten to do table maintenance and never really recovered the issue, but never have i done so on purpose. i want to think that somm had more sense than to inhibit someone from drinking their wine.
always love your videos senior wineking & peter! this inspires me to revisit the basics of service and shed more ego.
I love seeing the way you and your wife carry yourselves. With such respect to yourself, and to others. Beautiful to see and inspiring.
와 .. 진짜 정신력 갑이시네요 ..
우연히 알고리즘으로 보게 되어서 더 봤는데
해외살면서 저런경험이 정말 많은데
감정소비한 제가 아직 많이 하수구나 하는 생각이 들었습니다
저는 항상 저런 경우면 넌 서비스가 왜그런식이니? 하고 따지는 편이였거든여
많이 배우고 갑니다
We’ve all been there, but pretty ridiculous to see in 2021! Send the head chef/General manager the video - he’ll provide some choice words for this upstart sommelier whose arrogance is risking his Michelin star. Would be so nice having such a nice mentor to debrief with over a lovely glass after though 👌 thanks for sharing
Mozza sucks. Anyone questioning why you’d decant a 2016 Barolo is nuts and bad at their job. Wan me if you think decanting a 1966 Barolo might cause it to fade too quickly? Sure. But you got LA Michelin starred.
silverton is a pretentious lady. pizzaria mozza is disappointing as well. though chi spacca is pretty good.
Can't even imagine such a noisy place for a Michelin starred restaurant. I feel here in Belgium the fine dining experience is on a whole other level. Should you ever visit my country I could recommend you some restaurants for an unforgettable experience. Also, the sommeliers there would be happy to serve you and would respect and acknowledge your skills.
You’re right, same for Germany. On the other hand, filming stuff in the restaurant like jay does would also be a no-go behavior.
USA is not on the same planet as Europe for service, Jay/Peter even said so. Americans like their a$$ kissed and then throw money around to feel important, in Europe you just get a bill, I so love that.
@@bigv7267 idk about that. I lived in Italy for 3 years and in many places i would go to that was slightly higher end than your average restaurant the waiters would always give me and my buddy so much crap for looking young and therefore unable to actually afford food at their place. And i would get some terrible service along with judgemental looks. Then after we start ordering the seafood and wine and dessert suddenly they want to do a 180 and start frantically kissing our asses. It's obviously not everywhere. But i think it's always gonna be a thing, where someone will judge a book by its cover. You learn pretty fast that you'll never know who will be ordering 1000 dollars worth of food and 15 dollars lol. Of course in a Michelin rated place in Italy, the service was impeccable. So this i just don't get, i feel sorry for Jay. He's such a chill and friendly guy.
Therefore in their eyes, since we looked young, suddenly means we are poor**^
Michelin starred restaurants just mean you should visit them if you are in the area.
It doesn't mean that they all have the same environment/vibes.
Some people do prefer a more vibrant setting where you can have very good food and not have to whisper in hushed tones and handle all 18 sets of cutleries with poise.
If there was a Michelin starred Irish pub, I would consider going definitely.
I love how you responded to the situation. Although the man put his ego before his stewardship, you didn't name names, stayed respectful, and gave credit to where credit was due.
There are so many people nowadays that think that they have some power because they got a Yelp account. People want to cancel a person for such trivial things. Ego is king, especially in LA. Hopefully, the sommelier will have some humble pie in the near future and allow his patrons to have their own opinions without getting offended.
I dont drink nor plan on every drinking, but this video was oddly entertaining and very relaxing. Completely agree on how you handled the situation, loved the video thank you!
Why the heck do you watch wine videos if you dont drink lol
@@troublezks no idea
@@troublezks cuz youtube’s naughty algorithm
what do you mean you don't plan on drinking? like you never drank a sip of alcohol? either you have a weed plantation at home or you are insane!
You are 100% right, Jay. The sommelier has a twitter so he thinks he is famous, he's probably on the younger side and has some knowledge but more ego than anything else. And being L.A. where most don't know as much as you do about wine he thinks he knows better than all.
I have found sommeliers in Las Vegas to be incredibly helpful and offer great service. LA has a lot of great restaurants but the service is a hit or a miss. The server was great and he deserved his generous tip.
누구나 자기의 취향이 있을 수 있는 건데 ...
그 자체를 거부해버리면 와인을 잘 아는 전문가 정도는 될수 있지만
손님에게 무언가를 서비스하는 소믈리에는 될 수가 없겠죠
사실 저건 소믈리에가 개오바떤거죠..
손님이 마시고 아직 타닌이 덜산화되서 디켄팅부탁한건데 지말에 태클건다고 저따구로 한거니 저 소믈리에는 실력도 서비스도 개판인거죠.
This is embarrassing.
I’m really sorry for you to experience this.
Also, the idea of decanting young Barolo shouldn’t be alien to any Somm.
So sad he took it personally.
I think there's many decanting myths out there, even by sommes. Unless it's a super old red, almost all medium to full bodied reds can benefit from gentle decanting. The younger the wine, the earlier (~1 hour) and more aggressive decanting. The older the wine, even 15 minutes of gentle decanting can round out the edges and let it off-gas, making for a more well rounded, softened experience without losing any of the aroma compounds.
@@charliep9066 💯
@@charliep9066 exactly what I think and do
Perfect way to handle the situation. Well done sir. Our job as a somm is to create an experience, NOT to celebrate that we past a test.
Jeepers tonight, I've recently discovered this channel (being an absolute wine novice) and am absolutely in love with the pair of you. The dynamic between you is delightful, and you both seem to be thoroughly enjoying life. I find this content so much more inspiring than some über athlete espousing the merits of ultramarathons, Iron Mans, billion $ businesses, etc. I shall enthusiastically continue to imbibe this life affirming juice!
정말 현명하게 대처 하셨네요
So I am from Vienna and I am rather fascinated/ shocked how loud both restaurants were. If you go to Steirereck, Konstantin Filippou or Silvio Nickol (all three with at least one Michelin Star!) in Vienna it is much more quiet and not so crowded. The other week I went to Labstelle (another great restaurant) I felt like a mass ware during the whole time (because a lot of tables for the restaurant space) though we consumed a lot of good bottles and we ended up paying >1000 €. The Sommelier did great work but the service was so bad. It is such a pity when this happens...
I thought the same about the noise level at both places. Maybe it has something to do with the microphone, but the places looked stacked. The acoustics may not be convenient for a 'private dinner'. The few times I went to a Michelin Star- restaurant, there were like 10 tables max and a lot of space. And quiet conversation, which may be more 'European' 😊
Maybe they need to have so many customers at once because the rent is so expensive in LA?
@@seb_yt6695 valid point and maybe some people don‘t care but if I am paying such an amount of money (which is quite a lot for me) I simply don‘t want to be treated like that.
Idk anything about the rents in LA und Houston though :)
Fully agreed!! I found that so strange too!! They were SO loud for fine dining, which again, speaks to the sheer volume of tables they want to get in and out, and lack of concern for the customer service experience. This restaurant doesn't deserve that Michelin star.
@@seb_yt6695 Exactly, you hit it on the nail.
언제나 와인킹님과 스승님과의 캐미를 즐겁게 시청하고있습니다.
아이러니하게도 한국에서도 이런상황이 자주 일어나고 아니 오히려 더 많이 일어난다는것이 생각나는 영상이었습니다.
저도 와인은아니지만 '너가 뭘아냐?' 이런 느낌을 받은 서비스를 받은적이 많다보니. 다른영상보다 더 공감되었던거 같습니다.
식사비와 와인비를 따로 나누어서 계산하신것은 저는 생각도 못했던 방법이내요 저도 나중에 한번 사용 해봐야할거같습니다.
항상 잘보고있습니다. 건승하십쇼!
After some Google Map searching, found out that the restaurant was "Osteria Mozza" on Melrose Avenue, LA, California.
I won't be visiting that place :)
We literally started to look up each bottle in the restaraunt online ourselves and read reviews/prices rather than trusting the "sommelier". Most of them know nothing about wine or have a completely different taste/pallet from us. At least in the US. Sommeliers in Europe are generally knowledgeable.
We need you back Jay and Peter. I’m getting thirsty but don’t know what to drink ;)
Thanks for sharing. I often get disappointed with Somms at fine dining restaurants. I think a lot of people forget to be a Somm is to 'serve' the customer. Don't even get me started on the planned wine pairing... I get so turned off when Somms try to push the pairing option to me. Let me drink what I WANT please...
Also, Peter dropping F-bombs again... Classic
was able to figure out the restaurant -- they have a job posting for a sommelier as of 2 weeks ago. when was this visit?...
Lol amazing
And the name is...?
@@mattroller781 Osteria Mozza
My visit was about 2 weeks ago
많이 보고 배웁니다.
상황에 연연하지 않고 유연하게 대처하시시는 모습 멋있습니다👍👍👍
That's crazy. If you said you wanted your wine mixed with Dr. Pepper he should have said "Yes, Sir".
You handled the situation so much better than I would have.. I’m from New York City and I’m in the wine business. I’ve met many sommeliers, some with the actual vintner and you’d be surprised to see some of the reaction that wine makers make when the somm tries to describe the wine. In a nut shell, these so called snobby restaurant somms give actual knowledgeable sommeliers a bad rap.
후반부 영상은 소믈리에분의 열정이 화면 밖으로까지 느껴지네요. 어쩜 저리 대조적일 수 있는지.
After watching your series, I decided to further pursue my interest in wine. I just finished the WSET 3 exam on october, and hopefully I can push it even further in the future. I'm 22 right now and looking to finish diploma by 24 so Thank you so much!
Congrats. I’m still studying for my level 3 exam. I’m not sure I want to go for diploma.
They make diplomas for wine? 🤣
@@joelmiller6849 Yes. It's an industry. Credentials help.
The customer is not always right but in this case, the customer was right.
As an American, I was initially offended by the “fine dining in America is sh*t. It’s all about [the waiter’s] ego.” But then I thought about it…and I completely agree. It is horrific here. The waiters here are rude, entitled, tip-hungry, and dismissive. The more expensive the restaurant, the more they feel superior. I can’t tell you how many expensive restaurants I’ve been to where the waiters treated me like I was lesser than them. They make you feel like you need to impress them…even though you’re the one dropping an inordinate amount of money. Sorry you had this experience, but I’m afraid it isn’t unique.
I’ve eaten at plenty of fine dining in America and I’ve always received great service. It’s usually at more mid restaurants that I’ve received poor service. I did have a long wait at one restaurant for the food but the waiter personally apologized and gave us some free desserts and told us to personally ask for him next time. It’s just about whether people take their job seriously or not.
@@cajeb5396 Looking back at this, it likely has a lot to do with location. When I have been to places where the service staff is there for their career and have decent wages (NYC, Chicago, Denver, etc.), the service is top tier. When I go to prime restaurants in other places where the staff is transient (college students) and makes most of their salary on tips, the service is entitled and pushy.
Unbelievable and unacceptable. You have been far too kind and polite. You are a gentleman Jay 👏👏
its always a shame when the ego stands in the way of an enjoyable time. I am really enjoying your content! I am coming from the whisky tasting experience, having less experience in wine but i am all interested in different experiences, for example wine. I sometimes wish that whisky would be just a little more prominant in restaurants. For the most part here, whisky is just a product you order as shot or cocktail after the meal, but never as a full bodied flavourfull experience on its own.
I also went to a two-starred Michelin Restaurant in NYC. We opened a bottle of 2016 Shiraz from the restaurant and about 3/4 of the way through, we started seeing some sediments in our wine glasses after the somm topped off our glasses. I made a note to the somm and he said "are you sure it isn't pieces of food that you were just eating?" and then walked away. I then made sure by opening my flashlight and shining it into the bottle with the remainder of the wine left to see that there is actual sediment. The somm returns later to pour us the remainder of the wine to finish the bottle and I state to him "we're good. there is sediment inside the last pour of the bottle. we don't want to drink that" and he blurts out at my face "there is no way, this is a 2016 bottle." and proceeds to pour it out even though I was the one that was paying for the wine, in which i then took out my flashlight on my phone and showed the somm all the sediment inside my glass that he had just poured out. I don't understand why they can't just understand the customers and always think they're correct.
jeez. good thing robots are taking over in the restaurant industry. people should stay humble that they even have a job.
@@xyz-pg3zd the sommelier position is dying fast. My goal is for a takeover of well trained beverage managers who are deep into WSET or deep in Master Somm to thoroughly teach the waitstaff. They will make gobs of more money and be much more proficient
Tell us the name of the restaurant
who is somm?
@@MichaelLee-yh7ss it was Jean-Georges. Food is always amazing and I'll always want to go back, but the wine experience was appalling the last time I went. However, all other times were good. Maybe an off-day but really wasn't nice to always think you're correct, especially in the service industry.
Wow, that is so unfortunate to have a Sommelier like that! I love watching your videos and I think you handled the situation so well.
i've been in the restaurant business for a long time and i think, as a guest, wineking did the right thing.
소믈리에 팁 안주신거 사이다네요.
본인도 느끼는바가 있겠지요.
"그게 지 일인데 그걸 안하냐 쉑햐?"
ㅎㅎㅎㅎ 자막 정말 웃겨용!